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Gloria Steinem: Yes, hello, hello.
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Pat Mitchel: Hello, hello.
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What a thrill to have this opportunity.
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When we ask all of our
TED community, many of them,
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"Who would you like to hear from
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if we're going to look forward and onward,
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when it comes to women in the world?"
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Unanimously, the answer
was Gloria Steinem.
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Now I know you're way too modest
to accept that easily,
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so before we move onward,
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may I go back a bit,
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since we have known each other
for a long time,
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and talk about those early days
when you were building a movement,
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challenging stereotypes,
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moving beyond cultural norms.
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You must have had some manifestation
of fearless in your life.
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What were your fears
and how did you overcome them?
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GS: No, I certainly had a lot of fears,
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and chief among them
was speaking in public,
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just like I am now.
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Because, you know, we choose
to express ourselves
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in the way that is most natural,
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and I became a writer
because I didn't want to talk.
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So the first thing I had to overcome
was the fear of public speaking
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and because I was afraid
to do it by myself,
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I asked a friend to do it with me --
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Dorothy Pitman Hughes,
and then Flo Kennedy --
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anyway, so we became,
in that way, somewhat accidentally
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one white woman, one Black woman
speaking together,
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which, you know,
was very helpful to express
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that the movement was for everyone.
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PM: And in those early days,
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when you were becoming,
not only a really powerful public speaker
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in spite of your fears,
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you were also normalizing and creating
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response to a word that became the anthem
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for so many of us,
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literally changing lives,
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standing in front of crowds and saying,
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feminism is for every woman.
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And I see now as you do
that there are still ways
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in which feminism
is not understood as a concept.
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Misunderstood, criticized,
sometimes ridiculed.
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How do you describe feminism?
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GS: Well, it's just the radical idea
that human beings are all equal
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and we can dispense with the labels
of gender and class and race
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and begin to realize
our unique individuality.
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Of course feminism
was misunderstood in the beginning,
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as if it were about female superiority
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or it was movement for lesbians only,
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not for all women,
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I mean, you know, there were all kinds
of misunderstandings,
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not to mention ridicule.
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But I hope that that's past.
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I used to just send people
to the dictionary
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to look up feminism, very helpful.
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PM: How do you feel the new generation
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and the next generation of young women,
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what is their relationship with the word
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and the concept of, there's still
a lot to be done to reach that equal step?
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GS: Yeah, well I don't think that --
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I mean, the word is still there,
womanism, women's liberation,
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there are all kinds of words,
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but I think it's much more about content
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and not worrying too much about form.
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So Black Lives Matter was started
by three young Black feminists.
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You know, that was their creation
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that is beginning to change much
that needs to be changed.
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And they just assumed
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that of course they were there
as three young Black feminists.
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PM: And in the early days
of the women's movement
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and continuing all the way through,
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one of the ways that we have learned
to talk to each other
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about difficult issues
in which we may have disagreements,
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were sort of the talking circles
or the consciousness raising,
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but do you see -- is this
something we could do
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to begin to build back
the bridges between us?
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GS: You know, I regret
the emphasis on divisions
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because we are more unified
than any other movement in history.
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So I think we ought
to celebrate that fact.
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And it comes out of talking circles
as you point out,
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which used to be called
consciousness raising groups.
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And it just means
that you sit in a circle,
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as Native Americans taught us long ago,
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and you each get to speak in turn --
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Native Americans passed
around a talking stick --
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and everybody has to listen
while each person --
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and in that way,
you say unsayable things
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and somebody on the other
side of the circle says,
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"Oh, I've experienced that too."
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And you discover what is shared
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and also you discover
how you can help each other.
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There's no substitute
for those kinds of talking circles.
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PM: I want to be the first
to volunteer with you, Gloria,
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to start the talking circles
and passing the talking sticks again.
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One of the surprising things
that people who come into your presence
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are always surprised to find out
what a great sense of humor you have.
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And one of my favorite books
of the many you have written
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sits by my bedside
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and the title of it, forgive me
those who might not like bad language,
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the title is "The Truth Will Set You Free,
But First It Will Piss You Off!"
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So I'm wondering now what truth
is setting you free
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and what continues to piss you off?
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GS: Well actually, right at this moment
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I mean, the truth is COVID --
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you know, and we understand
that it's a universal experience
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and danger we're all dealing with,
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and what pisses me off is
that we don't use that experience
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in the positive sense.
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In the sense that we learn from dangers
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as well as from accomplishments.
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It pisses me off that this is not
used in a positive way
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to overcome the idea
of categories of human beings
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or of national boundaries or of countries.
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I mean, we're all here on spaceship Earth.
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We're all citizens of spaceship Earth
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and COVID knows that,
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so it should help to teach us that.
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PM: And as we're looking
at out current reality,
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we've seen yet another
great milestone for women,
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in this country for sure,
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with the newly elected
vice president Kamala Harris,
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who said in her speech, you know,
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"I may be the first,
but I won't be the last,"
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and I think of the many times
that you and I and others have said that.
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What difference will it make,
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in our country and around the world,
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when there are more women
in all leadership positions,
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what are our differences as leaders?
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GS: Well, I mean for one thing,
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we will have the advantage of using
all of human intelligence
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instead of only a small portion of it;
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this would be a good thing.
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And we will also allow children
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to see themselves as leaders universally,
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instead of just one small group.
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Because right now,
when kids look at leaders,
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they don't necessarily see themselves.
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PM: When we look at you,
we see a leader, Gloria,
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and there are so many things
that you could point to with pride,
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although I know you don't.
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But what is it that motivates you
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or keeps you on the path onward
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in those moments of doubt
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or the times when things look bleak
or there are fears,
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or do you ever fear,
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ever feel those feels?
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GS: No, of course I fear,
I mean, definitely.
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But as the slogan goes,
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"follow the fear and do it anyway"
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"fear is a sign of growth."
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(Laughs)
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It's a good thing, right?
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PM: Right.
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GS: I'm so inspired by young women,
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I mean, I keep feeling
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as if I just had to wait
for some of my friends to be born.
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And to see that this is profoundly
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a global movement, as it always has been.
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I mean, you know, even the response
to the march right after the inauguration
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of the current president, in every --
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Latin America, Africa, you know,
were marching together.
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It really has become a global movement,
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thanks in large part to technology
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because we can see each other
as we are now,
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and also just to the contagion
of the idea of freedom, you know.
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If women spend nine months
being pregnant and caring for a child,
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why isn't it that men are responsible
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for spending that much more
than half the time
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taking care of the child, hello?
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(Laughs)
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Logic is in the eye
of the logician, right?
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(Laughs)
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So you know, wherever you look,
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there's just a discovery of freedom,
of common sense, of companionship.
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PM: Is there,
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of all the things in your life,
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what has been the greatest source
of confidence building and inspiration?
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Is it the global sisterhood
that you've built around the world?
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GS: Well it's just other women.
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I mean, I would not
have been able to ever conquer
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my fear of public speaking,
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which is where we started out,
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if it hadn't been for my fearless friend,
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Dorothy Pitman Hughes,
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you know, for doing it together.
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So you know, it's just,
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it's learning from each other,
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and just remembering to ask, really,
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because the help is there,
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the inspiration is there,
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the sense of community is there,
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and I hope that technology
can help us in this way,
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especially because for women,
that's important,
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because we can communicate in safety.
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But I do regret and worry
about the COVID emergency,
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because we do also need to be together
with all five senses
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in order to truly emphatize.
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So I look forward to the day
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when you and I can once again
be in the same room.
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PM: Well, you and I have been
in a lot of the same rooms
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and even when you're not
in the same room with women everywhere,
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you have inspired them, Gloria.
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And to see the full and total story,
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well, at least part
of the full and total story,
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the movie has been made
about Gloria's life.
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It's called "The Glorias"
based on her book "My Life on the Road,"
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which is certainly the way
you spent your life,
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and it's available for streaming
on Amazon Prime
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and I do highly recommend it.
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Gloria, thank you for your work,
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for your life,
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for the fearless way in which
you have led us all forward,
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and one last next step
for moving onward from you?
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What advice or counsel?
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GS: Ah.
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Just do it.
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(Laughs) You know, I think we kind of wait
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for instructions from up there
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or we worry or something
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and you know, if we just
get up in the morning and say,
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"OK, I'm going to do this,
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and I'm going to get in touch
with three or four other people,"
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and just think of change
as a tree, you know,
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it doesn't grow from the top down,
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so we shouldn't be waiting
for somebody to tell us what to do.
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It grows from the bottom up,
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and we are the roots of change.
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PM: We are bearing the roots
of your work, Gloria, with gratitude.
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Thank you very much
for joining us for TEDWomen 2020.
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GS: No, and thank you
for bringing women together,
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which is the magic.
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Thank you.