Thomas Hirschhorn: "Gramsci Monument" | Art21 "Extended Play"

[Thomas Hirschhorn: "Gramsci Monument"]

[Forest Houses, Bronx, New York]

["Gramsci Monument" (2013)]

[Opening of the "Gramsci Monument"]

[HARRY DRAKE] Alright, sorry to interrupt.

This is the man of the hour.

This is the man, besides Erik, that brought
everything to us.

[YASMIL RAYMOND] Thomas believes that "more
is more."

You know, it's a pun on Mies van der Rohe,
who said, "less is more."

And in this "more and more" philosophy of
Thomas Hirschhorn,

it means an enormous amount of activities
all the time,

almost confusing what is happening.

[HARRY DRAKE] What you are doing for this
community and everything...

[HIRSCHHORN] No I don't...

I don't do something for the community.

I do something, I hope, for art...

[HARRY DRAKE] Okay.

[HIRSCHHORN] And the understanding of art.
That is my...

My goal is this.

[LEX BROWN] Something Thomas always says is
that

he did not come here to, like, help people--

he came here to Forest Houses and asked people
who lived here

to help him make the artwork.

And there's a really big difference.

There's a huge difference between those two
things.

[FREDDY VELEZ] Thomas asked me to translate
the Gramsci prison notes to Spanish.

That was a great opportunity for me,

and I just put retirement to the side and
just began working with his art.

And here I am today, two months later, enjoying
myself every day--

and I feel a lot better.

[JANET BETHEA] I was more stronger than half
of the men over there.

I built them buildings.

I did the dollies underneath there, on the
floor.

I did all that with the guys.

Except for the roof. I'm scared of heights.
[LAUGHS]

[STANLEY SCOTT] My name is "Stan the Man".

[WOMAN] "Stan the Man"?

[STANLEY SCOTT] "Stan the Man".

[WOMAN] Oh, I saw your sign.

[STANLEY SCOTT] Yes indeed.

And I work for love.

[WOMAN] We know!

[STANLEY SCOTT] It's not about the bills.

I don't deal with the...

It's not about the money.

Anything I make, I make from my heart.

Because I ain't...

You know, once your love is in it

the money's going to come.

That's why I joined the monument, because
it's like art.

Food is like art.

You know, cooking.

Making something out of nothing.

You know, making those dishes look good.

Like, oh, that shit's pretty.

Let's see if it tastes pretty.

[INTERVIEWER, OFF SCREEN] When people ask
you "What is this project?" what do you say?

[DANNION JORDAN] Well I walk them over to
the brochures...

[JANET BETHEA] It's a monument of something...

[FREDDY VELEZ] A positive place for art and
study.

[DANNION JORDAN] You know, they had a smoothie
bar...

[JANET BETHEA] They can go in the library,
read books.

[DANNION JORDAN] ...a WiFi station up here...

[ERIK FARMER] You know, a monument usually
is something that,

you know, is stable. It doesn’t move.

This is a temporary monument--something I
never heard of--

but Thomas explained to me, you know, what
he wanted to do

and how he wanted to integrate the residents
into the monument,

as in giving them jobs

and wanting to teach the kids about art.

[DANNION JORDAN] He doesn't want anything
to interfere with his monument,

Whether it's rain, Dia:,

NYCHA...

he doesn't want anything to interfere with
his project.

If you're not interfering with his project,
everything is good.

[INTERVIEWER, OFF SCREEN] What happens when
you interfere?

[DANNION JORDAN] [LAUGHS]

Yeah, he just...you know, he gets crazy.

He starts screaming--uses his fingers and
everything...

[HIRSCHHORN] Sunday... Sunday even...

[YASMIL RAYMOND] Yes, but I'm here Saturday
and Sunday, all...

[HIRSCHHORN] I am the artist!

[MAN] I look and see there's no one sitting
in there first...

[HIRSCHHORN] I am the artist.

[HARRY DRAKE] He'll be like, "No."

[MARCELLA PARADISE] And if you can't stay
to three o’clock or four--

which we stay till four all the time--

you get put out the class.

[HIRSCHHORN] Okay? We are not observant.

There is no observer.

[HARRY DRAKE] Thomas is not white. He's not
European.

He's black.

[MARCUS GREEN] I was very inspired by Thomas's
poster.

And on the poster it says, "All humans are
intellectuals."

And so, the quote that I want to begin with--which
is quote number one--

is taken from that notion.

[LEX BROWN] Gramsci's idea that every person
is an intellectual

is an incredibly important idea.

It's a huge part of the project

and it is touched upon in every part of it.

[ADAM GUESSONGO] My name is Adam.

I do graffiti, I draw,

and I make sculpture.

Or like, this--I'm not done with it yet...

I'm not done with this, but I was trying to
make a character from a game.

[DANNION JORDAN] You're learning--you're teaching--

but it's more like people just...you know,
you got Thomas here.

It's more about people gathering just still
getting to learn one another.

Because I don't really know all these guys
that I work with,

I just know them through other people.

You all get to know each other, you learn
from each other,

and, you know, that's basically it.

[Destruction is difficult; it is as difficult
as creation. (Antonio Gramsci Prison Notebook 6)]

[ERIK FARMER] This is history right here.

And it's history just because it's never been
done.

So when someone speaks about it--someone may
try to do it--

but, at the end of the day, it was done at
Forest Houses first.

Big. Huge.

[Quality should be attributed to human beings, not to things. (Antonio Gramsci Prison Notebook 1)]

[LEX BROWN] People have to come here, to the
monument, to see the monument.

This project is site-specific in the most
true sense of that phrase.

It's as important that this monument will
be here for two and a half months

as it is that it will not be here after two
and a half months.

There's an urgency to it.

And without that urgency, it would not be
the same thing.