-
This is from:
"anonymous - just humiliated."
-
"Can I get a divorce?
-
I am still raw with pain
-
with every desire..."
-
Now hear this: "Can I get a divorce?
-
I am still raw with pain..."
-
but she has every desire and prays
-
to forgive her husband
-
of twenty-plus years
-
for his adulterous affair
-
with a young, beautiful woman,
-
who he spent over $8,000 on
-
with traveling to at least five states
-
including six cities,
-
jewelry from Tiffany's, jackets,
-
a new iWatch when it first was introduced
-
to the market.
-
It has been a little over two years ago
-
since this young woman,
-
angered by their breakup..."
-
Her husband and this young lady broke up,
-
so the young lady called the wife
-
and introduced herself....
-
"...to me as his girlfriend."
-
And revealed all this information,
-
which her husband didn't deny.
-
He confirmed it as true
-
when she confronted him.
-
"Reconciliation has been
harder than anything,
-
testing my faith as I go to God regularly
-
to forgive him continually."
-
She says, "I face triggers."
-
What does she mean?
-
There are these triggers that set off
-
anger and bitterness.
-
What? New discoveries.
-
Things that her husband
didn't fully disclose.
-
She's finding out as time goes on
-
new information, new discoveries.
-
Inconsistencies in the things
-
that he has told her that reveal lies.
-
"And the discovery that
he referred to this girl
-
as his ex-girlfriend,
-
upgrading their foul,
adulterous relationship
-
as one as common as a courtship
-
instead of referring to
her as what she was,
-
a mistress.
-
I'm hurting badly
-
with feelings of not feeling good enough."
-
So she feels like a failure as a wife.
-
"Anger that I wrestle in the flesh
-
because I cherish my
relationship with Jesus Christ.
-
My journey actually has been smoother
-
since I've discovered
this two-plus years ago.
-
But we still argue.
-
He says he's repented, but I don't see how
-
because I still feel disrespected
-
in the way he views her.
-
Like how he mentioned her to someone
-
as his ex-girlfriend,
-
and how he tells me I'm crazy
-
for still wrestling with the problem.
-
And like how he says
he lives a sinless life
-
now that he's repented.
-
Like when he uses profanity
-
in response to me badgering him
-
about the past adulterous affair
-
as if it's my fault.
-
His lies he's told in the aftermath
-
to cover up things she told me
-
aren't recognized as sin by him
-
because now that he's
not committing adultery,
-
he claims he's sinless."
-
She says, "I'm born again,
-
and I'm always repenting,
-
always seeking the Lord to purge me
-
as He said He would.
-
'Every branch that abides in Him...'
-
I'm never so satisfied with where I am
-
that I call myself sinless.
-
Am I set free? Yes.
-
But now more than ever, I'm wrestling
-
with anger and unforgiveness
-
as they are triggered.
-
I have really great days.
-
I have good days, moderate days,
-
and really, really bad days.
-
I'm seeking the Lord
-
and pouring out to Him through all this."
-
Now she also sent a follow-up
-
where she said this:
-
"I'm so sorry
-
concerning the message I just sent.
-
Be it far from me to leave
out my own fault too.
-
I've been wrestling with both anger
-
and horrible profanity.
-
I'm repenting constantly
for my angry outbursts
-
about the affair
-
and the marital neglect I experienced.
-
And to be honest," she says,
-
"he has many times sat quietly
-
and listened to me.
-
He has not been a monster toward me
-
since about two months after the discovery
-
of his adulterous affair.
-
And I'm sorry I left those points out."
-
She felt convicted.
-
So her first question is
-
can I get a divorce?
-
Now you recognize, she follows it up
-
by saying "every desire in her prayer
-
is to forgive her husband."
-
So this is a woman that's torn.
-
This is a woman who's trying to heal,
-
but she says there's triggers.
-
Like she finds some new information
-
that he wasn't honest about.
-
Or he seems to downplay it -
-
say it's her sin, it's her fault.
-
Why does she keep carrying on with this?
-
What do you tell her?
-
She says, "he tells me I'm crazy
-
for still wrestling with the problem."
-
I would say to her you're not crazy.
-
I mean, clearly if you're a woman
-
and your husband has been unfaithful
-
and then in the aftermath of it,
-
new information keeps coming out,
-
lies get uncovered,
-
your husband basically acts like
-
now that he's repented it's over
-
and you ought to just get over it.
-
No, I would say that all those things
-
are exactly going to keep the wound
-
opening up afresh.
-
What do you tell her?
-
Let's start right there.
Can I get a divorce?
-
What do you tell her?
-
I don't even think that
she really wants one.
-
But she's asking the question.
-
(from the room)
-
I don't think that's
something that you give
-
strong response to right away
-
because of the nature of it.
-
She doesn't seem like she wants a divorce.
-
The guy has been unfaithful.
-
She's not going to just get over it.
-
She seems to want to get over it.
-
You don't have a quick
answer for something like that.
-
I can't think - even though I know
-
what Scripture says about divorce
-
and the grounds for divorce -
-
she doesn't seem that she really wants to.
-
What quick response can you give to that?
-
Tim: Well, she may want to know
-
that she biblically can
-
even though she doesn't want to
-
so that it's kind of a
weapon in her arsenal
-
to leverage over the guy.
-
I'm just saying that could be.
-
But I mean, just from a
purely biblical standpoint,
-
(incomplete thought)
-
Let me ask you this.
-
If she divorced her husband,
-
if she was in our church
-
and she divorced her husband,
-
should we say,
-
well, she had biblical grounds?
-
Would we say, well, we
counseled her against it,
-
but she did actually
have biblical grounds?
-
Would we say no? She can't?
-
And there would be
consequences if she did?
-
Maybe some kind of
disciplinary consequences.
-
Well, let me ask you this.
-
If a woman has a husband who's unfaithful,
-
he says he's repented.
-
He doesn't go on in his sin.
-
And she seems to really
desire to forgive him,
-
is there a cutoff point?
-
Would you say that she has a right
-
25 years down the road to say
-
you know what?
-
My husband was unfaithful 25 years ago
-
and I want out.
-
I just got sick of this relationship
-
and I've got a biblical out
-
and I'm going to take it and use it now.
-
Is that like a get out of jail free card?
-
Seriously, the exception points
-
that are made there in Matthew 5 and 19,
-
if there's sexual immorality -
-
except in the case of sexual immorality.
-
Is there, whether we put a distinct
-
amount of time on it or not,
-
is there a time?
-
When Jesus says except
for sexual immorality,
-
does He mean that well,
if you have a spouse
-
who's been sexually immoral,
-
and once they've done that,
-
you basically have a right
to divorce them at anytime?
-
Or is there a timeline?
-
Would we say there is a time
-
that if enough time goes by,
-
that it would be inappropriate?
-
What say you?
-
Scripture.
-
What Scripture has
to do with what's right?
-
What's loving? What's appropiate?
-
What's God-like? What's Christ-like?
-
(from the room)
-
Would 1 Corinthians 7:3-14
-
be applicable to this situation?
-
(unintelligible)
-
Tim: Which verse specifically
-
are you thinking is applicable?
-
(from the room)
-
It's 1 Corinthians 7:13.
-
"If any woman has a husband
-
who is an unbeliever
-
and consents to live with her,
-
she should not divorce him.
-
For the unbelieving husband
-
is made holy because of his wife."
-
Tim: But that situation
doesn't necessarily
-
bring in the sexual immorality.
-
Whereas the Matthew texts
-
do bring in that specific reality.
-
Let me ask you this.
-
Do you think that it's possible
-
to forgive the husband
and still divorce him?
-
I hear no. I hear yes.
-
Could you imagine a situation
-
where forgiving him - which is good,
-
appropriate,
-
letting go of the
bitterness that you feel,
-
where it still would be
necessary to divorce him?
-
(unintelligible)
-
I mean, what if your husband
-
actually was involved in
pedophilia or something
-
and you've got kids.
-
Is it possible to forgive him
-
and yet recognize I've
got to get out of this
-
perhaps for my own safety
-
or for the safety of the children?
-
Perhaps that could be.
-
That doesn't seem like this situation.
-
And clearly it's a different situation
-
when you have a spouse who's continuing
-
in their sexual immorality.
-
But when you have
somebody that's committed it
-
and then they're repentant...
-
Now, I recognize, we could wrestle with
-
well, is he sincere? Is he not sincere?
-
But do you think that a Christian
-
has an obligation to
remain in the marriage
-
if the spouse repents?
-
Is it an obligation?
-
Open your Bibles to Matthew 19.
-
You're already there.
-
Look at 19:1,
-
"Now when Jesus had finished these sayings
-
He went away from Galilee
-
and entered the region of
Judea beyond the Jordan.
-
Large crowds followed Him
-
and He healed them there.
-
And Pharisees came up
to Him and tested Him
-
by asking 'is it lawful to divorce
-
one's wife for any cause?'
-
He answered, 'have you not read
-
that He Who created them
from the beginning
-
made them male and female?'
-
And said, 'therefore a man shall
-
leave his father and his mother
-
and hold fast to his wife,
-
and the two shall become one flesh.
-
So they're no longer two, but one flesh.
-
What therefore God has joined together,
-
let not man separate.'
-
They said to Him, 'Why then did Moses
-
command one to give
a certificate of divorce
-
and to send her away?'
-
He said to them, 'Because
of your hardness of heart
-
Moses allowed you to divorce your wives.
-
But from the beginning, it was not so.
-
And I say to you,
whoever divorces his wife
-
except for sexual immorality
-
and marries another, commits adultery.'"
-
So there is an exception there.
-
So okay, with the exception -
-
now this is speaking of a man.
-
It was a very man-dominated society then.
-
But nevertheless, a woman
-
divorces a husband
because of sexual immorality.
-
It seems like there's an exception there.
-
There's an exception,
-
but there certainly isn't a mandate.
-
It's not commanded.
-
Do we not feel that a Christian
-
who forgives sin against themselves -
-
that's very Christ-like.
-
For her to forgive her husband -
-
very Christ-like.
-
Would we not agree with that?
-
He's claiming to have repented.
-
She says for the last two years -
-
that's 24 months - she says for 22 months,
-
things have actually gone fairly well.
-
Now there's these triggers
that keep opening it up,
-
but once he came clean, she says,
-
that things were pretty good.
-
What do you tell her?
-
She's got these triggers.
-
She's got these difficulties.
-
What could you tell her
that would really help her?
-
(from the room)
-
Do you think that telling her that love
-
does not keep a record of wrongdoing,
-
if she truly has forgiven him...
-
for example, like you said, if we tell her
-
that biblically she can divorce,
-
is there a time limit?
-
Well, let's say 25 years from now
-
she wants to divorce.
-
Tim: Here's the thing.
-
You can say that,
-
but here's the problem.
-
If you were married and your husband
-
was the one who was unfaithful,
-
and then as you're moving forward,
-
you keep finding
inconsistencies with his stories,
-
and instead of calling
the woman a "mistress,"
-
he's referring to her as an ex-girlfriend.
-
And his lies keep coming back
-
so that the wound keeps getting re-opened.
-
You wouldn't be impervious to that.
-
Your trust is destroyed.
-
And the thing is
inconsistencies in his stories
-
keep coming up.
-
And he keeps referring to the woman
-
in terms (incomplete thought).
-
What's that?
-
(from the room)
-
What keeps bringing that issue up though?
-
Tim: Well, it's going to come up.
-
I mean, it sounds like he's speaking
-
to other people about it
-
and it gets back to her ears
-
that he's referring to her in terms
-
that seem to lessen
the severity of his sin.
-
And then, can you imagine
-
if you're wanting to talk,
-
especially when there's inconsistencies
-
and you've got questions,
-
and when you ask about them
-
and you get upset,
-
he's telling you that you're
the one who's wrong.
-
You're just holding on to it.
-
You're crazy.
-
You're still wrestling with these things.
-
Get over it.
-
Listen, those things would be
-
incredibly hurtful and
wound opening events.
-
(from the room)
-
It kind of reminds me
of David in Psalm 55,
-
some of the things he said there,
-
that my companion stretched out his hand;
-
he violated his covenant.
-
And here this lady's
marriage has been violated.
-
And David felt like flying away
-
from the situation,
-
but ultimately cast his
burden on the Lord.
-
And I guess if she's determined
-
to love her husband,
-
all those reminders are a reminder
-
ultimately to go back to Christ,
-
to cast her burden on Him,
-
and just plead for mercy
-
and help from the Lord.
-
And He's going to give that.
-
And if it's getting better
-
in these last two years,
-
I would assume in five years,
-
it's even going to be more bearable,
-
better hopefully.
-
Hopefully God would save her husband.
-
If she's going to stay with him,
-
what other option does she have
-
but to rely on the Lord?
-
Tim: Yeah, one of the things I wrote down
-
is to encourage her to not forget
-
the power of prayer
-
and laying hold on the Lord
-
and asking for supernatural grace.
-
But here's the thing,
-
there are women who navigate
-
these kinds of situations
-
and they navigate it to the
honor and glory of the Lord.
-
But I think one of the things
-
that you need to navigate it
-
is you have to think right.
-
And you have to think truth.
-
And one of the things
-
is to surround yourself with people
-
who are going to bring
you back to the truth
-
all the time.
-
And I think that's being in a good church,
-
surrounding yourself with people
-
that truly help you.
-
There are people who don't help.
-
There are people who -
even professing Christians
-
and perhaps genuine Christians
-
who give wrong advice, bad advice,
-
and it's not helpful.
-
It's not healing.
-
You need to surround yourself with people
-
who really are going
to guide you into truth
-
that is helpful,
-
that will help you get
across these hurdles.
-
And they don't always
need to be living people.
-
One of the reasons I grabbed
-
"The Sympathy of Christ,"
by Octavius Winslow
-
off my shelf is the sympathy of Christ.
-
The reality is we have a
sympathetic High Priest.
-
This is one of the greatest books
-
that I have on my shelf
for suffering people.
-
Because what it does is
it takes you close to Christ.
-
And it shows you His
suffering and His sympathy
-
for the suffering.
-
Because the truth is that Jesus
-
has been in a place where
He suffered the rejection,
-
He suffered the hurt,
-
He's been there.
-
And I think that's critical,
-
but think right. Think right.
-
What we need to be called back to
-
especially when we're suffering -
-
(incomplete thought)
-
I especially think about the Apostle Paul
-
or the Apostle Peter.
-
When they're dealing with people
-
who are suffering, what did they do?
-
They didn't say just
get over it. You're crazy.
-
They brought truth to appeal to the mind.
-
That's what they did.
-
They came in and they said look,
-
we're not going to say
-
your suffering isn't suffering.
-
But, your suffering - it feels long,
-
it feels hard - it's momentary.
-
Fifty years from now,
-
this sister will be with the Lord.
-
She'll be in Paradise.
-
Every tear will be wiped away.
-
So we need to keep it in perspective.
-
Momentary, light affliction is all
-
that our suffering in this life is called.
-
And it's going to give way,
-
give place to an eternal weight of glory.
-
But you think - you think.
-
What truths does this woman [need?]
-
Obviously, the truths of the cross.
-
The truths of God's forgiveness of her.
-
That's got to be the foundation.
-
I'm forgiven.
-
After what I've done, I'm forgiven.
-
After what I've done to Him, I'm forgiven.
-
Another thing that is essential
-
is coming back to the truth,
-
God has promised
-
to never leave us or forsake us.
-
Because you know what the temptation
-
in trial is.
-
The devil's right there to say,
-
"Look, God's vacated.
-
You're on your own.
-
He's not helping you. He's silent.
-
You're praying to Him?
-
This isn't going away.
-
He's not hearing you."
-
And I know Charles Leiter has said
-
that the Gardener is never so close
-
as when He's pruning.
-
And I've come across it somewhere else,
-
maybe Matthew Henry,
-
that the Refiner is never
so close to the gold...
-
You could speak to that.
-
I mean, you put the silver and gold
-
in the kiln.
-
You're not far away
-
when the gold's cooking in the kiln,
-
and you're getting the impurities out.
-
And that's the reality.
-
What we have to be
brought back to is this,
-
that God is specifically
ordering my suffering.
-
We have to be confident in that.
-
Otherwise, we have no
foundation to stand on.
-
We have to be able to say
-
all things are indeed working
together for my good.
-
I have to believe in a God
-
that is entirely in control
-
of every nuance of my life,
-
and that He's guiding.
-
And that He is the God Who says
-
He does not willingly
afflict the sons of men.
-
What does that mean? It's the idea
-
that He doesn't from the heart.
-
He doesn't because He's cruel.
-
Now look, He's a God Who's just.
-
But there's sensitivity with God.
-
I mean, you definitely
get the idea in Scripture,
-
God does not need to have His arm twisted
-
to show mercy.
-
It seems more difficult for
Him to mete out justice.
-
But entirely consistent
with His character,
-
He must.
-
But just the idea that He's not willing
-
to afflict the sons of men.
-
It's this idea that God is going to bring
-
the suffering that's for our good.
-
I'd tell her you don't want to
use your mouth like that
-
with your husband.
-
You don't want any profanity to come out.
-
That's wrong.
-
No matter what he's done, that's wrong.
-
And she talks about the
repenting that she does,
-
but it really needs to be
the kind of repenting
-
where she eliminates
that from her life totally.
-
She needs that.
-
There needs to be a real holiness
-
being worked out there
-
in the fear of God.
-
There needs to be a cleansing.
-
The tongue needs to be set in order.
-
And she needs the grace.
-
Just because her husband may be
-
reopening the wound and triggers may come,
-
that is no excuse for her to do that.
-
I mean, we understand the circumstances
-
and that it's really difficult.
-
We're not saying it isn't difficult.
-
It is.
-
She's in an incredibly
difficult situation.
-
I mean, do you ladies have anything
-
that you would add
that you would tell her?
-
(from the room)
-
I was just going to ask
-
on a practical level.
-
Is there a time when godly counsel
-
is to go seek help from elders,
-
from people in your church,
-
to counsel the two of them together
-
if he saying that he has repented
-
and has turned from that,
-
but there are signs that
maybe that is not true.
-
Is there a time when it's not just dealt
-
with the two of them, they need to go out?
-
Like within their body?
-
Tim: Yes, I mean, definitely counseling.
-
Definitely whether that's
pastoral counseling
-
with the pastors
-
or whether there's some kind of counseling
-
with a counselor,
-
if both of them can be involved,
-
that's definitely a good place.
-
My assumption in this
-
is that you have a husband
-
that's professing to have repented
-
and he feels like now he's actually
-
even reached some state
of perfection or something.
-
The feeling I get is he probably
-
isn't a genuine Christian.
-
Now, that still doesn't mean
-
that there couldn't be some good things
-
achieved if you can get
them both into counseling.
-
But that would be good if
he's willing to do that.
-
But sometimes I guess we just
-
have to recognize
-
that a guy like this might not be willing.
-
Without knowing the real details there,
-
he might not be willing,
-
or even if he was
willing for a time to go,
-
if he's not genuinely converted,
-
difficult to know how
much fruit there may be.
-
Sometimes in these situations
-
if you've got one that's converted
-
and the other one it's
pretty obvious they're not,
-
you really have to focus
in on the one that's saved
-
to do the right thing.
-
Because if the lost member,
-
even if they're going to counseling,
-
they just lack the equipment
-
to handle this thing in a godly fashion.
-
And perhaps they even need to be
-
dealt with about their false profession.
-
And the thing is if the Lord's in it,
-
then yeah, you'll get wonderful fruit,
-
because if God saves him,
-
then the thing will really heal.
-
But if the Lord isn't in it,
-
dealing with him like that is probably
-
going to chase him away
from the counseling.
-
And he will all the more quickly
-
not want to be involved.
-
Somebody had a hand up just now.
-
(from the room)
-
I was just thinking that she might also
-
still be dwelling on it because
-
he did not confess - he got caught.
-
So that could be something
-
that she's still thinking about.
-
Tim: Yeah, she's going to play
it over and over in her mind.
-
And I'll guarantee, we view things
-
as elders in the church like that.
-
We take very much into consideration
-
when sin is exposed -
-
did they get caught?
-
Or did they come and confess?
-
So often when people get caught,
-
then they say, "Oh, I repent."
-
Well, now it's very questionable.
-
Now you got caught.
-
You were forced to now play the part.
-
So yes, I think any woman,
-
that would be a big issue.
-
That yeah, he didn't come
and confess this to me.
-
He got caught.
-
And then the thing that it seems like
-
she's bringing out -
-
because we've seen this.
-
We see this with sin.
-
A person gets caught.
-
Now they confess, but later
-
it becomes discovered
-
that they didn't confess everything.
-
And now you confront them with the more.
-
Well, now they confess it.
-
And now they apparently repent of that.
-
But you can understand if you're a wife,
-
and it seems like he's repented,
-
but new things keep coming up
-
that it's very convenient
he never mentioned.
-
The thing you're looking
for when somebody repents
-
is you just lay it all out on the table
-
so that there's nothing hidden,
-
nothing more that's going to come out.
-
It's just there it all is.
-
I'm not hiding anything.
-
Because yes, as soon
as you've got the idea,
-
he got caught and he's only
-
admitting what he got caught for
-
and we keep finding out
-
there's more stuff that's hidden.
-
That's one of the greatest indications
-
that there is no genuine aspect
-
to the repentance.
-
It's all a put on.
-
(from the room)
-
I also have a thought,
-
in the first letter she talked a lot about
-
his response and that at times
-
still referring to her as ex-girlfriend
-
and/or not disclosing everything,
-
but in the next letter, she was like,
-
it hasn't all been bad.
-
There have been times where I have had
-
him listen to my concerns.
-
So it just made me think of when
-
in 1 Peter it's talking about suffering
-
and her desire to actually walk
-
pleasing to the Lord in that manner.
-
And in knowing her weaknesses,
-
knowing that there's triggers,
-
knowing that the devil's
going to be right there
-
to tempt her in those weaknesses,
-
just what it says in 1 Peter 5:6,
-
"Humble yourselves therefore
-
under the mighty hand of God
-
so that at the proper time
-
He may exalt you,
-
casting all your anxieties on Him
-
because He cares for you."
-
And then this part where it says,
-
"be sober-minded,
-
be watchful.
-
Your adversary, the devil, prowls around
-
like a roaring lion
-
seeking someone to devour.
-
Resist him, firm in your faith,
-
knowing that the same kinds of sufferings
-
are being experienced
-
by your brotherhood throughout the world
-
and after you have
suffered a little while,
-
the God of all grace Who has called you
-
to His eternal glory in Christ
-
will Himself restore, confirm,
-
strengthen, and establish you.
-
To Him be the dominion
forever and ever, amen."
-
So it seems like she
wants to fight against it
-
and just trusting in those things
-
and God's enabled her to fight against it
-
and to humble herself before Him
-
and to cast her anxieties on Him
-
in this season.
-
It seems like she recognizes
-
that things are getting
a little bit better.
-
She's enduring and trusting more.
-
Tim: I'll tell you two
other aspects of this
-
that if she's rightly communicating it
-
that are pretty good indicators
-
that his repentance is
-
not a godly repentance.
-
He may have stepped away from this
-
and he wants to preserve his marriage,
-
but a good indication
it's not godly repentance -
-
two aspects that jump out at me
-
is one, if a man sins
against his wife that way,
-
and he knows that calling that girl
-
an ex-girlfriend just does not
-
sit well with her,
-
he should never do it again.
-
Another thing that jumps out
-
is that he would ever fault her
-
for not getting over it.
-
After what he's done,
-
his approach should be one of shame,
-
not fault-finding with her.
-
So you can understand
-
that those things would definitely
-
reopen the wounds and be hurtful.
-
But the thing is, you have to trust,
-
yes, the wound keeps getting reopened,
-
but the Lord's only
going to let that wound
-
be reopened as many times as is necessary.
-
Never so often that it's cruel.
-
Never so often as that it's harmful.
-
He's going to let it happen
-
as many times as it's useful.
-
And clearly, she's indicating
-
that there are some things that do need
-
to be dredged up out of her own life.
-
But it's very difficult.
-
(from the room)
-
If he continued to refer to the woman
-
as an ex-girlfriend
-
and continued in that disrespect to her
-
as his wife,
-
would we call her to continue
-
to endure the struggle?
-
Or do you think at that point,
-
like it's an intentional harm towards her
-
by her husband?
-
Tim: Well, I don't think it's grounds
-
to try to get out of the marriage.
-
I think she needs to
fight for this marriage.
-
And like I say, I think
all the more she's able
-
even with him reopening wounds,
-
all the more she's able to forgive him,
-
is all the more Christlike
she comes across.
-
And you know, the truth is
-
that 1 Peter 3 reality
of seeking to win him
-
by her conduct.
-
And I guarantee,
-
her throwing a blast of profanity at him
-
does not help.
-
It doesn't help anything.
-
It doesn't help her.
-
It doesn't help heal it.
-
It doesn't help him.
-
In no way does it help anything.
-
But if she navigates this thing
-
with the help of God,
-
with the grace of God -
-
and that's like, after what James said,
-
I have it here -
-
don't underestimate the power of prayer.
-
Don't underestimate the thing that seems
-
so impossible to let go of or to forgive
-
or to get over,
-
the Lord has helped His people
-
to get over and past every one
of those kinds of situations.
-
And there is grace sufficient.
-
And people who have experienced it
-
can say at times, there is a
supernatural help from God
-
to forgive or to be able to cover over
-
or to love.
-
I was just recently talking about
-
the Wurmbrand book that
was selling for a dollar,
-
"Tortured for Christ."
-
You know, when they were in
-
those Romanian prisons,
-
the more their captors beat them,
-
the more love they felt for the jailers.
-
It's the guy whipping them,
-
with every stroke of the whip,
-
they're feeling greater love
-
for the guy whipping them.
-
How is that?
-
It's just plain supernatural.
-
But God's in the business
of helping His people,
-
so you cast your cares on Him.
-
There's a place to come:
-
Lord, please, he keeps
reopening the wound.
-
You know that he is.
-
You know this hurts, Lord.
-
You don't expect it not to hurt.
-
I need help. Lord, I need help.
-
In my own strength, I cannot do this.
-
You just cast yourself on Him.
-
And the thing is He helps His people.
-
He really does.
-
There's help for her.
-
And I think she's experiencing
some of that help.
-
But I think there's areas
-
where there's still defilement
-
in her own life that needs to be cleansed.
-
She needs to control her tongue.
-
And that doesn't seem like it's in place,
-
not if she's letting loose
-
with a flurry of profanity.
-
Well, anything else?
-
(from the room)
-
I would say to her
-
to just exhaust every avenue
-
of overcoming it with love
-
and persistence in prayer with the Lord.
-
Because the Lord will give you peace
-
to left or right if you're
in prayer about it.
-
The fear of the Lord overcomes you
-
and will convict you of the things
-
spoken out of turn
-
or if you made a frown
when you're offended.
-
The Lord will convict them right there.
-
The sanctifying even in that suffering
-
is good for the offended or the spouse.
-
And also, in the care of the Lord,
-
He will direct when
the time is to move on.
-
Because it won't be the
Christian's desire to move on.
-
But it will be the Lord's will.
-
Tim: Yeah, on that note.
-
This is from the chapter,
-
"The Emotion of Love in Christ."
-
"How little do we know experimentally
-
of the love of Christ in our souls
-
dislodging slavish fear,
-
a bondage spirit, unbelieving doubt,
-
and so enlarging our hearts that we may
-
run the way of the Lord's commandments.
-
And the chiefest is to love.
-
Bring your heart with its
profoundest emptiness,
-
its most startling discovery of sin,
-
its lowest frame, its deepest sorrow,
-
and sink it into the depths
-
of the Savior's love.
-
That infinite sea will flow over all,
-
erase all, absorb all,
-
and your soul shall swim and sport
-
amid its gentle waves,
-
exclaiming in your joy and transport,
-
'O the depths...'
-
The Lord direct your heart
-
into the love of God.
-
Just as it is hard, cold, fickle,
-
sinful, sad, and sorrowful,
-
Christ's love touching your hard heart
-
will dissolve it.
-
Touching your cold heart will warm it.
-
Touching your sinful heart will purify it.
-
Touching your sorrowful
heart will soothe it.
-
Touching your wandering heart
-
will draw it back to Jesus.
-
Only bring your heart to Christ's love.
-
Believe in its existence, its reality,
-
its fullness, its freeness.
-
Believe that He loves you
-
and just as love begets love,
-
so the simple belief in the love of Jesus
-
will inspire you with a reflected
-
responsive affection
-
and your soul like the chrysalis
-
will burst from its captivity and gloom
-
and soaring in life, liberty, and beauty
-
will float in the sunbeams of God's full,
-
free, and eternal love.
-
And in a little while, will find itself
-
in Heaven where all is love."
-
And she should buy this book.
-
Seriously.
-
For people who are deeply suffering,
-
like I say, Octavius Winslow.
-
One of the greatest books -
-
balm for the suffering soul.
-
Well, let's pray.
-
Father, we pray that there might be help
-
for some folks in the things
-
that were said tonight.
-
Lord, we pray that You'd use this
-
in some people's lives for good,
-
for Your glory, for healing,
-
for salvation, for help.
-
Lord, we pray that Your kindness,
-
that this love that
Octavius Winslow speaks about,
-
oh, Lord, may we know more about it.
-
Help us to know it
-
and to swim in the depths of it.
-
Help this sister, who, Lord,
-
You've put her in the furnace.
-
We pray that she would know
-
the cleansing, purifying grace of God
-
in the midst of those flames.
-
Help her to endure.
-
Help her to persevere.
-
Help her to love her husband
-
with the love that only You can give.