Jonathan Safran Foer: Novels can learn from poetry
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0:03 - 0:07Well, people often talk about the death of literature.
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0:07 - 0:09People have been speaking about it since shortly
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0:09 - 0:12after the first work of literature was ever made
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0:12 - 0:15but there's more and more talk about it.
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0:15 - 0:19It's been propelled by diminishing readership,
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0:19 - 0:23by what feels like an increasing apathy,
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0:23 - 0:34or even anxiety or even mistrust of literature
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0:34 - 0:36and the movement towards screens, everything being
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0:36 - 0:40on a screen and what would that mean for books which
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0:40 - 0:42aren't very well served on a screen.
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0:42 - 0:43It's not that you can't read a book on a screen
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0:43 - 0:45perfectly well but you can't read a book on a screen
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0:45 - 0:50that also has email and your calendar and texting.
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0:50 - 0:53Books can't compete with those kinds of media.
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0:53 - 0:56So we wonder will people read books?
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0:56 - 1:02There are still things and there will always be things that
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1:02 - 1:06only literature can do, only literature can communicate.
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1:06 - 1:11I don't think that literature is necessarily any better,
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1:11 - 1:11whatever than means, than film or dance or music.
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1:11 - 1:17In fact, I'm often drawn personally more
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1:17 - 1:19to film and dance than I am to literature
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1:19 - 1:21but I know that there are moments in my life
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1:21 - 1:25when I feel the need for literature and only for literature.
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1:25 - 1:28So for example, the mother of my oldest friend
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1:28 - 1:31passed away about week ago.
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1:31 - 1:32And I went down to visit her in Washington DC.
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1:32 - 1:38I live in New York. I was quite worried about what to say
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1:38 - 1:41and how to fill what I thought might be very awkward,
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1:41 - 1:46or even painful silences. And I brought poems,
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1:46 - 1:49about 20 poems. I read them to her and we talked
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1:49 - 1:51about them. And in that moment when we, together,
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1:51 - 1:58mostly just her, of course, but together, were confronting
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1:58 - 2:06this, the biggest moment of life which is death.
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2:06 - 2:08We relied on poetry.
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2:08 - 2:13Poems and stories and novels are very helpful
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2:13 - 2:18exactly when we most need language the most,
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2:18 - 2:26sort of dire, or urgent or existential moments of life.
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2:26 - 2:27Novels are meant to be read over the course of many
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2:27 -hours or many days. And even a story takes half an hour
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Not Syncedto read. And I just wasn't sure, in this case, what her
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Not Syncedenergy level would be, so I wanted them to be quite
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Not Syncedsmall, but even though that's the case, it's also true
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Not Syncedthat poetry is the most condensed form of literature
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Not Syncedand in certain ways, it's the most pure form.
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Not SyncedI don't think that novels are any less good than poetry
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Not Syncedbut novels has a lot to learn from poetry
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Not Syncedin terms of what's possible, how direct one can be,
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Not Syncedhow concentrated language can be,
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Not Syncedand how evocative and resonant.
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Not SyncedSometimes I think novels make the mistake
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Not Syncedof being too much like their own description.
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Not SyncedSomebody says, ''What is this book about?''
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Not SyncedMy dream is to write a novel where somebody would
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Not Syncedhave to say, "I could tell you, I suppose,
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Not Syncedbut that would really miss the point.
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Not SyncedYou'd just have to read it."
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Not SyncedThat, to my mind, is a good novel.
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Not SyncedA novel that is its own synopsis,
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Not Syncedjust an expanded version of its synopsis,
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Not Syncedcomes awfully close to television actually.
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Not SyncedNovels can still do something that poetry
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Not Synceddoes in terms of being kind of ineffable or mysterious
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Not Syncedor not quite graspeable, just on a much larger scale.
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Not SyncedAll of my life, I have been more drawn to the visual arts
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Not Syncedthan to literature. And even still, when I'm feeling like
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Not SyncedI can't remember why I wanted to be a writer,
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Not SyncedI don't go to books, I actually go to paintings
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Not Syncedor to sculpture. To me, the distinctions have been drawn
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Not Syncedtoo sharply. The difference between a musician, a writer,
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Not Syncedan artist, a dancer. We've categorized them,
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Not Syncedsegregated them, so that there's very , very little overlap
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Not Syncedbut in fact they're all just people who want to make
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Not Syncedthings that you could say have no use.
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Not SyncedEverything in life has a use. The person who made
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Not Syncedthe camera that this is being shot with, made it
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Not Syncedso that it could record something like this.
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Not SyncedAnd a television or a computer that someone's watching
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Not Syncedit on was made with specific functions in mind. A bridge
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Not Syncedis made so that people can get from one land mass to
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Not Syncedanother. But novels and paintings and songs really ...
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Not SyncedThey might have effects in the world --
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Not Syncedthey might be political, they might be entertaining,
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Not Syncedthey might be objects of commerce, but they're not really
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Not Syncedreally made for any of those reasons. They're just made
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Not Syncedfor their own sake. Anyone who makes something
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Not Syncedfor its own sake, whether you try to have it published
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Not Syncedor whether you're just rearranging twigs
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Not Syncedon the ground because it pleases you,
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Not Syncedpeople who do that are artists. And because we live
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Not Syncedin a world in which you have to have a job and in which
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Not Syncedit's expected that you will grow within your job
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Not Syncedand because we like to have an answer to the question
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Not Synced'What is it that you do?'
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Not SyncedYou meet someone at a party.
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Not SyncedThey say ''What do you do?''
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Not SyncedIt makes us uncomfortable not to have an answer.
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Not SyncedBut the truth is, the different art forms are much, much
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Not Syncedmore similar than they are different.
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Not SyncedWhen I'm not working on a book, I am somebody
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Not Syncedwho just moves through the world and sees nice things
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Not Syncedand tries to remember them, but usually doesn't,
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Not Syncedand hears jokes and tries to remember them but usually
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Not Synceddoesn't and so on and has ideas that disappear,
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Not SyncedBut when I'm writing, I save those things
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Not Syncedso that I can use them, rearrange them.
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Not SyncedNothing comes from nothing. I think that there's an
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Not Syncedimpression that books or art, making art is a much more
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Not Syncedromantically creative act than it is, as if inspiration
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Not Syncedstrikes and suddenly, something appears
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Not Syncedbut that hasn't been my experience at all. It's much more
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Not Syncedabout being attentive to what's around and starting to
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Not Syncedget to know what you like and what you find useful
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Not Syncedand then collecting those things instead of everything.
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Not SyncedCollecting those things and then figuring out what
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Not Syncedwhat the most pleasing arrangement of them is for you.
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Not SyncedThere's nothing objective about it. It's not the case that
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Not Syncedsomeone else will necessarily like it
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Not Syncedbut it really does feel like making collages with the
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Not Syncedwhole world as your cupboard of things to arrange.
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Not SyncedCertainly in art, the most important things happen
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Not Syncedon a subconscious level. When I approach a writing
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Not Syncedproject, I don't think of it like that. In fact, and I say this
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Not Syncednot as a joke or to disparage myself, I really don't think about much at all.
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Not Syncedabout much at all. I'm just very open to what do I feel like
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Not Syncedworking on, what's interesting to me right now,
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Not Syncedwhat am I curious about? But I never think about
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Not Syncedwhat the potential use of something would be.
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Not SyncedLike I was saying before, there's a quality of art
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Not Syncedthat is useless in the very, very best way.
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Not SyncedThat is the very highest compliment I can pay.
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Not SyncedAnd if I started thinking about what I would achieve
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Not Syncedfor myself psychologically or in search of meaning
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Not Syncedor in search of meaning or catharsis,
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Not Syncedthat's just another kind of use. Just in almost the same
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Not Syncedway that trying to make something you could sell
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Not Syncedfor money is a kind of use. It's not to say that those two
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Not Syncedthing might wouldn't be good in your life but I don't think
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Not Syncedthat they make a good work of art. They're not a good
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Not Syncedstarting point.
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Not SyncedJohn [Delulo?] once said,"Nobody writes his first book.
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Not SyncedIt just happens. At a certain point, you find
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Not Syncedthat a printer is ... all these pages are coming out.
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Not SyncedOh my God, I can't believe I did this! I believe that.
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Not SyncedMaybe it's a little different if you start late in life
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Not Syncedincubating an idea for a long time but most people
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Not Syncedwhen they write their first book, at a certain point,
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Not Syncedthey realize they have a book on their hands.
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Not SyncedAnd the second book is different because then,
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Not Syncedyou have something that you're responding to,
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Not Syncedyou have your own expectations -- 'if you published
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Not Syncedyour first book, you have the world' expectations.
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Not SyncedSo I found the second book somewhat more difficult
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Not Syncedbecause of that but I started the second book
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Not Syncedbefore my first book was published so in a way,
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Not SyncedI was able to escape some of those traps. But
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Not Syncedthen after I have written two novels, I wrote a work
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Not Syncedof non-fiction about eating animals,about animal
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Not Syncedfarming. I think this is not a coincidence
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Not Syncedthat I decided to move in a different direction
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Not Syncedbecause I was starting to feel the weight
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Not Syncedof momentum. I didn't want to do a third thing
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Not Syncedbecause I've done two previous things. I didn't want
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Not Syncedto make a choice about tomorrow because of what
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Not SyncedI did yesterday. So maybe even to a fault,
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Not SyncedI resisted that and decided to move off
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Not Syncedand try something else.
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Not SyncedThere are a lot of ways of talking about
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Not Syncedchoices in art. It's a mistake to think that
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Not Syncedthe way we talk about it retrospectively
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Not Syncedas critics, which is very useful and interesting
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Not Syncedbut it's a mistake that that's the same language
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Not Syncedof creation. Somebody once said, I can't remember
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Not Syncedwho, maybe it was Oscar Wilde, I can't remember.
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Not SyncedHe said, "There are only two kinds of objects
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Not Syncedin the world: those that charm us and those that don't
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Not Syncedcharm us." Something can be charming in the most
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Not Syncedcompletely simple way and for whatever reason,
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Not Syncedit speaks to us. We like it. It is for us.
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Not SyncedIf it isn't charming, it's mundane. It's not that
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Not Syncedwe hate it, it's just that it has no great effect on us.
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Not SyncedAnd each person, of course, has his own or her own
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Not Syncedsense of what is charming. In a way, writing just
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Not Syncedboils down to asking that question again and again
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Not Syncedbecause it's charming or not. Something charming
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Not Syncedcan mean that it's very painful. It doesn't mean
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Not Syncedthat it's happy and beautiful. It can mean it's very
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Not Syncedugly, that it is funny. It can mean that it is serious.
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Not SyncedIt can be tragic. It can be comic.
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Not SyncedCharming just means in a certain way,
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Not Syncedthat it's authentic and exceptional to you.
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Not SyncedPeople often ask me, why don't I write about family
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Not Syncedso often. I find that such a weird question.
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Not SyncedI don't even know how to answer because the answer
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Not Syncedfeels so obvious to me. Nobody asks J.K. Rowling
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Not Syncedwhy she writes about wizards so much.
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Not SyncedThat, to me, is weird. That's a weird choice she made
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Not Syncedthat requires some explanation because nobody
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Not Syncedknows wizards. Nobody interacts with wizards.
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Not SyncedNobody can't fall asleep at night because of their
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Not Syncedrelationship to wizards but everyone has a family.
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Not SyncedEven people whose families are absent.
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Not SyncedMaybe especially people whose families are absent.
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Not SyncedThese are the main themes of life
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Not Syncedand the main themes of literature since Genesis
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Not Syncedso I assume I will always write about family.
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Not SyncedFamilies is also especially important to me but
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Not Syncedwhatever will take the form of fathers
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Not Syncedand sons-in-laws. Or it will take the form of
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Not Synceda married couple in a comedy. That I don't know.
- Title:
- Jonathan Safran Foer: Novels can learn from poetry
- Description:
-
Interview with American writer Jonathan Safran Foer, in which he reflects on the power of literature in general and poetry in particular. Foer also argues that art always has a personal point of departure, where the artist confronts the world and rearranges it.
In this interview Jonathan Safran Foer (born 1977) reflects on various media and cultural activities. Personally, he is fascinated by film, but at all the critical moments of life Foer has been drawn to the unique power of literature, and especially poetry. However, all true art and culture has a common ground, Foer says. Unlike most other activities in society, art and culture are produced without a direct function and solely for their own sake. Foer argues that every work of art -- whether it is a painting, a book, a film or a piece of music -- is highly subjective at heart. Foer further explains why his novels often revolve around the theme of the family. "How can you not write about it," he asks, "since everybody is confronted with the subject, even those who have lost their family or grew up without it?" It would be much more relevant, he claims, to ask J.K. Rowling why she writes about wizards.
Jonathan Safran Foer was interviewed by Synne Rifbjerg.
Camera: Troels Kahl and Martin Kogi
Produced by: Kamilla Bruus and Synne Rifbjerg, 2012
Copyright: Louisiana Channel, Louisiana Museum of Modern Art.
Meet more artists at http://channel.louisiana.dk
Louisiana Channel is a non-profit video channel for the Internet launched by the Louisiana Museum of Modern Art in November 2012. Each week Louisiana Channel will publish videos about and with artists in visual art, literature, architecture, design etc.
Read more:
http://channel.louisiana.dk/aboutSupported by Nordea-fonden.
- Video Language:
- English
- Team:
Louisiana Channel
- Duration:
- 12:08
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