2.5 Discussion with Marten and Inge: sounds and language change (11:07)
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0:06 - 0:07Hi.
-
0:07 - 0:12In the previous video we have seen
that these phonetic things like place -
0:12 - 0:16of articulation, or
manner of articulation are not -
0:16 - 0:21just nice ways to describe the way
in which people produce consonants. -
0:21 - 0:24But they actually really
play a role in language, -
0:29 - 0:33they play a role when children
acquire their language, -
0:33 - 0:34they play a role when people
make speech errors, and -
0:34 - 0:38they play a role in organizing the set
of consonants in an individual language. -
0:38 - 0:43Such a set of consonants can typically be
organized in a nice rectangular table. -
0:43 - 0:47And that's the rows and
columns corresponding to our place and -
0:47 - 0:49manner of articulation.
-
0:49 - 0:56And I'm going to discuss these issues
more with my students Inge and Marten. -
0:56 - 0:59>> So
my first question is about this table but -
0:59 - 1:02then from the perspective
of language change. -
1:02 - 1:06So we saw in the last module
that all languages change and -
1:06 - 1:09that maybe we spoke something
very different 10,000 years ago. -
1:09 - 1:12So if we spoke differently
10,000 years ago, -
1:12 - 1:17did we also use different
sounds in a certain language? -
1:17 - 1:19>> Yes, we can be quite sure about that.
-
1:19 - 1:22We can,
it's absolutely sure that we did because -
1:22 - 1:27many aspects of language
change all the time. -
1:27 - 1:30And consonants and actually also
vowels are definitely among them. -
1:30 - 1:34So the particular way in which
consonants are produced or -
1:34 - 1:38which consonants a language has
definitely changes over time. -
1:38 - 1:40So 10,000 years ago,
-
1:40 - 1:45our forefathers definitely had
a different set of consonants. -
1:45 - 1:49>> Okay, now that's something
that's strange, because you've -
1:49 - 1:54also said earlier that there's no way that
we know how people spoke 10,000 years ago, -
1:54 - 1:56because there's no record.
-
1:56 - 2:01Because language is fleeting so how do we
know that the consonants have changed? -
2:01 - 2:06>> Yeah right, well, okay, so
here I admit we don't really know -
2:06 - 2:10in a sense that of course
we don't have recordings of -
2:10 - 2:15people speaking 10,000 years or
even 300 years ago. -
2:15 - 2:20So we don't know how people spoke,
we just know that they must have spoken -
2:20 - 2:25differently because languages
change all the time. -
2:25 - 2:29And that cannot have been
different 10,000 years ago either. -
2:29 - 2:31>> So what sort of evidence do we have for
that? -
2:33 - 2:39>> So, we can figure out certain
things about how languages sounded. -
2:39 - 2:42At that time, at some point,
10,000 years ago was too long ago. -
2:42 - 2:44>> Mm-hm.
>> But some point in the past, -
2:44 - 2:45we can figure it out.
-
2:45 - 2:49And there are several methodologies for
that. -
2:49 - 2:53One is by language comparison,
so if you have other languages -
2:53 - 2:57which are related to our language,
we can see what consonants they have. -
2:59 - 3:01English is related to German and Dutch,
-
3:01 - 3:06English has a word night,
which has two consonants, an N and a T. -
3:08 - 3:09But German and
-
3:09 - 3:13Dutch have a third consonant,
they say nacht, both of them say nacht. -
3:13 - 3:15So there is this consonant chuh, there.
-
3:16 - 3:22Because it's two other languages, which
have that sound, that is an indication that -
3:22 - 3:27maybe English had that sound as well,
at some point in its inventory. -
3:29 - 3:32And fortunately in English we have
another kind of dimension for -
3:32 - 3:37that, other kind of evidence for
that I should say, and it's spelling. -
3:37 - 3:38The wonderful,
-
3:38 - 3:43beautiful thing about English is that
it has this very conservative spelling. -
3:43 - 3:45Spelling didn't change or
-
3:45 - 3:50at least didn't change all that much in
the course of the past few centuries. -
3:50 - 3:53But the sounds probably did.
-
3:53 - 3:55So how do we spell the English word,
night? -
3:55 - 3:57Well, we spell it with G-H.
-
3:57 - 3:58There's G-H in the middle.
-
3:58 - 4:03A G-H in the middle exactly at
the point where these other -
4:03 - 4:05languages have a chuh sound.
-
4:05 - 4:10And it's not very strange to
think that maybe G-H was a way to -
4:10 - 4:13write a chuh kind of
sound in English as well. -
4:13 - 4:18So by looking at the spelling, and
by comparing to other languages, -
4:18 - 4:23we can discover that probably English
had at least one more consonant -
4:23 - 4:25a few hundred years ago.
-
4:25 - 4:29>> Okay, so then we've established
that there is change, in fact? -
4:31 - 4:33And we established how
we can investigate that, -
4:33 - 4:37but what I still don't really
understand is why would that change? -
4:39 - 4:43>> Yeah, right, yeah, it's,
that's an interesting question. -
4:43 - 4:47It is a difficult question but
we do have an answer or -
4:47 - 4:51at least a big part of
an answer to that question. -
4:51 - 4:57And, it's important here to distinguish
between two kinds of factors. -
4:57 - 5:01The first factor is an internal factor,
internal to the language. -
5:01 - 5:04It's something which just
happens to a language -
5:04 - 5:06if you leave it alone long enough.
-
5:07 - 5:09Certain things start changing,
-
5:09 - 5:12in particular also
pronunciation starts changing. -
5:12 - 5:17We're going to talk much more
about this later on in this MOOC, -
5:17 - 5:23in the fifth module I'm going to
explain more about how this happens and -
5:23 - 5:26even why this happens,
but for now I can say -
5:26 - 5:30one factor which probably plays
a role there is language acquisition. -
5:30 - 5:34The fact the children have to learn
the language of their parents, and -
5:34 - 5:37when they do so they don't typically make
-
5:37 - 5:40a completely perfect copy of
the language of their parents. -
5:40 - 5:42They change it a little bit.
-
5:42 - 5:46But again, we're going to talk much
more about this in the fifth module -
5:46 - 5:47of this MOOC.
-
5:47 - 5:50>> Okay, so
this was internal change, right? -
5:50 - 5:52But what about the external change then?
-
5:52 - 5:55>> Yeah, right, so
what do you think external means? -
5:55 - 6:00>> Yeah, it reminds me of the fact that
languages sometimes borrow words so -
6:00 - 6:02they come from other languages.
-
6:02 - 6:04>> Exactly.
That's exactly what it means, -
6:04 - 6:08is that's exactly another, the,
the other important factor. -
6:08 - 6:12Languages are in contact with each other.
-
6:12 - 6:16I said if we leave a language alone
long enough that sometimes happens. -
6:16 - 6:19So language might be
spoken on an island and -
6:19 - 6:22not, there might not be a lot
of contact with other languages. -
6:22 - 6:25But through the history of mankind
-
6:25 - 6:30people typically have known other people
speaking other kinds of languages. -
6:30 - 6:32And they might have borrowed words.
-
6:32 - 6:36And integrated them into their language.
-
6:37 - 6:42And interesting thing here is that this
has happened to English as well and -
6:42 - 6:48actually it has involved the same chuh
sound we were talking about just before. -
6:48 - 6:52Because sometimes English
speakers want to speak German or -
6:52 - 6:55at least they want to say
certain German words or -
6:55 - 7:01they want to say certain German names,
like you might be a music lover, and -
7:01 - 7:07you might want to speak about the famous
German composer Johann Sebastian Ba-. -
7:07 - 7:11And then there is something there
which you have to pronounce. -
7:11 - 7:13A German would say Bach.
-
7:13 - 7:17But English doesn't have
this chuh sound anymore. -
7:17 - 7:22>> So I guess an English person would then
use the consonant from the consonant table -
7:22 - 7:24that is closest to this sound?
-
7:24 - 7:25So this, that would be.
-
7:27 - 7:29>> That would be a K, right, yeah.
-
7:29 - 7:33So and actually that's, notice that this
is actually a new piece of evidence, -
7:33 - 7:36an interesting new piece of evidence for
-
7:36 - 7:41exactly the existence of these features,
for the fact that these dimensions, -
7:41 - 7:44phonetic dimensions,
play a role in the language system. -
7:45 - 7:49People have to say a sound and
they take the one which is closest. -
7:49 - 7:50What does closest mean?
-
7:50 - 7:52Well, it means closest in the table.
-
7:52 - 7:53What does that mean?
-
7:53 - 7:58Well, it means it's the sound where
you have to change the fewest of these -
7:58 - 8:02parameters, in this particular case,
you have to say chuh, but -
8:02 - 8:05you don't have it,
you don't have it in your system. -
8:05 - 8:07You take something which is really close.
-
8:07 - 8:11Well, a chuh you'll make at
the velar place of articulation, -
8:11 - 8:13you'll make it in the back of your mouth.
-
8:13 - 8:18Just like the kuh,
the only difference between a chuh and -
8:18 - 8:23a kuh is the manner of articulation,
the particular way which -
8:23 - 8:29the airstream is modified so kuh is
an explosion chuh is like frication. -
8:29 - 8:33You make a little bit of noise by making
some obstruction in the same place of -
8:33 - 8:34your mouth.
-
8:34 - 8:37So what people do is they,
they somehow they can -
8:37 - 8:42calculate what is the closest what is
the most similar sound, and they do so -
8:42 - 8:47according to our
phonetically-defined features. -
8:47 - 8:50>> Okay so, this reminds me of Hawaiian,
-
8:50 - 8:52which we talked about
in the previous video. -
8:52 - 8:56Because Hawaiian has only a very
small set of consonants, right? -
8:56 - 8:58>> Right.
>> So that would be very interesting, -
8:58 - 9:00if they borrow words.
-
9:00 - 9:01They would have to be adjusted.
-
9:01 - 9:03>> Yeah, that's, that's, that's right.
-
9:03 - 9:07So they, they, they have to take
the consonant which is closest, but -
9:07 - 9:11actually they have very few consonants,
so the thing -
9:11 - 9:16which is closest might be actually
quite far away sometimes for them. -
9:16 - 9:18There's a famous example.
-
9:19 - 9:23Hawaii obviously is a part
of the United States. -
9:23 - 9:25So they borrow a lot in Hawaii.
-
9:25 - 9:31And they borrow a lot of English words
with their little consonant set. -
9:31 - 9:35Well they don't have a T,
we have seen they don't have a separate T. -
9:35 - 9:37Their T is actually pronounced like a K.
-
9:37 - 9:41Actually, also their S is
sometimes pronounced like a K. -
9:41 - 9:46So, it's, it's quite well known that
Hawaiian word for Christmas is Kalikimaka. -
9:46 - 9:50Well, that is almost unrecognizable for
-
9:50 - 9:55us as Christmas but
Kaliki is Chri- right? -
9:55 - 10:00So, the K is there, the R of Christmas
is changed into an L, Kali. -
10:00 - 10:05And then ki, so this ki,
that's the st of Chri-st-mas, right? -
10:05 - 10:08So st all together is turned into a k.
-
10:08 - 10:12So these changes might
be actually quite big -
10:12 - 10:15in an individual language if
they don't have a lot of choice. -
10:15 - 10:20But still, you can calculate
that this is still the closest -
10:20 - 10:23sound in their particular system.
-
10:23 - 10:24>> Mm-hm, okay.
-
10:28 - 10:32>> I'm quite sure that your language
has borrowed words from some other -
10:32 - 10:33language as well.
-
10:33 - 10:36If you don't speak English it definitely
has borrowed words from English. -
10:36 - 10:41If you do speak English, well English has
borrowed words all over the place for -
10:41 - 10:43instance from French, or from German.
-
10:45 - 10:48What do you do with sounds
in those other languages -
10:48 - 10:51in your language when
you borrow those words? -
10:51 - 10:55This is something I invite you
to discuss on our forum, and -
10:55 - 11:00in the next video we're going to
do some field work, we're going to -
11:00 - 11:05look into the consonant systems of
the languages of our informants.
- Title:
- 2.5 Discussion with Marten and Inge: sounds and language change (11:07)
- Description:
-
From Marc van Oostendorp's "Miracles of Human Language" course - https://www.coursera.org/course/humanlanguage
- Video Language:
- English
- Team:
- Captions Requested
Claude Almansi
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