WEBVTT 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 Khuda se Mutaliq Sawalat aur Ilm al Kalam ka Jawab - PART 2 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 by Jawed Ahmad Ghamidi 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 [Hassan Ilyas] Yesterday, I asked you a question related to hypothetical statements 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 that we use in relation to Allah, nauzubillah (I seek refuge with Allah) 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 That Allah can lie, or he can make a rock which even he can lift. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 You detailed out your views on these kind of discussions. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 There is a relative aspect and doubt, I want you to explain us in detail. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 When you are in a discussion related to the existence of God, 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 the argument behind confirmation for God's being, 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 or the various aspects of atheism or agnosticism that are put forward. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 It is said that you logically conclude the arguments with intellectual evidence. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 And the other party to the discussion is puzzled with your style. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 My question to you today is that, Even you include these 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 intellectual evidences and arguments in your discussions, 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 People often say that a conversation with Ghamidi Sahib is very rational, 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 logical, enlightened and intellectual. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 So, even your paradigm answers these modern suspicion or doubt 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 by way of intellectual and logical arguments. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 Then what about simple and inherent arguments given by the Quran 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 as you often say? 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 [Javed Ahmad Ghamidi] Don't you consider the inherent arguments given 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 by the Quran as logical? 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 What I had earlier mentioned was that, things that evolve from a specific 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 philosophical or logical background and people present these questions just to 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 ?? of the religion. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 These are the things that clearly convey that your addressee does not have that 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 perceptive attitude to understand or dive into something of this imperative nature. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 In that case you should follow ?? 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 Arguments will be have there significance. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 The Quran itself is an example of reasoning, 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 But what sort of argumentation? 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 I had explained that reasoning only. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 I often present this reasoning, infact I have penned it down in my book Meezan. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 If you read the topic of "Believe in Allah" in my book, 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 I have explained in detail that how Allah himself has presented arguments 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 on his own essence. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 That is the argumentation that I term as Fitri "simple" reasoning. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 The argumentation that is based on the intellect of common people. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 Its evident that when we focus our attention towards God, and say that 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 look around the world, try to comprehend what is around you, 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 try to look at your own existence, try to understand how God has bestowed 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 different abilities and wisdom to different creatures in the world. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 So, are they only trying to find reasons? 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 I was actually trying to explain the way of reasoning. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 I have never said that you should accept the religious cases 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 without proper reasoning. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 Rather, I was trying to throw light on how the Quran educates us 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 to find logic in the religion and religious affairs. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 There are two types of things: the first one is the knowledge that is 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 limited to our own understanding, and the discussion of argument is either 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 based on observation or experience. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 In fact this is also the way of argumentation 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 which is employed in the religion. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 For instance, there are few things that have been prohibited in the religion. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 Those things that have been prohibited in the religion and 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 why they have been prohibited in the religion. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 If you want to base your argument on why certain things are prohibited 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 in the religion on experience or observation then you can do that. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 Certain things are related to the world that is hidden from us and 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 we cannot see that, We cannot observe or experience it. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 Similarly, same is the case with the being of God. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 Because it is not possible the God can be shown to you or else you can 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 be called up into the heavens to observe God or his being. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 So here in this case we can make logical conclusions. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 How does the Quran educate us as to how we can make a 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 logical inference in relation to God. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 The methods employed by our eminent Scholars and the experts of logic 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 do not relate to what has been mentioned in the Quran. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 Of course I was not having a detailed discussion at that point in time you 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 had asked me a question and I was answering that. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 In reality, ancient philosophy paved the way for discussions and 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 assumptions in this matter. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 If you pay attention, modern science has rejected all of these. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 These things were neither based on experience nor observation, 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 then what was the basis of these things. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 For instance, look at the philosophy of idealism by Plato, 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 even Aristotle denied it immediately after him. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 And he clarified that in the philosophy of idealism, 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 ideas or mental images are considered at par with reality. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 If we try to culminate all the philosophies of metaphysics in one word, 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 then this is it (((?))). 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 In the philosophy of idealism, majorly mental state or circumstances are 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 considered as real. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 And there has been such a logical connection among the mental state 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 and the reality which corresponds to that of a fictional author. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 What does he do? 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 He creates the plot, circumstances out of his own intellectual imagination and 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 also tries to visualize the characters from his mental images and creates 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 such a mutual relationship that while we read a novel or a story we feel 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 like we are living a real world and all the characters in it are real. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 Therefore, the philosophy of metaphysics which was even adopted by the masters 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 of Sufism was based on these fancy imaginative interpretations. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 [Ilyas] Imaginative?