9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 Khuda se Mutaliq Sawalat aur Ilm [br]al Kalam ka Jawab - PART 2 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 by Jawed Ahmad Ghamidi 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 [Hassan Ilyas] Yesterday, I asked you a [br]question related to hypothetical statements 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 that we use in relation to Allah, [br]nauzubillah (I seek refuge with Allah) 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 That Allah can lie, or he can make a rock[br]which even he can lift. 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 You detailed out your views on these [br]kind of discussions. 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 There is a relative aspect and doubt, I [br]want you to explain us in detail. 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 When you are in a discussion related to[br]the existence of God, 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 the argument behind confirmation for [br]God's being, 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 or the various aspects of atheism or [br]agnosticism that are put forward. 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 It is said that you logically conclude [br]the arguments with intellectual evidence. 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 And the other party to the discussion is[br]puzzled with your style. 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 My question to you today is that,[br]Even you include these 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 intellectual evidences and arguments in [br]your discussions, 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 People often say that a conversation [br]with Ghamidi Sahib is very rational, 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 logical, enlightened and intellectual. 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 So, even your paradigm answers [br]these modern suspicion or doubt 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 by way of intellectual and logical [br]arguments. 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 Then what about simple and inherent [br]arguments given by the Quran 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 as you often say? 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 [Javed Ahmad Ghamidi] Don't you consider [br]the inherent arguments given 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 by the Quran as logical? 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 What I had earlier mentioned was that,[br]things that evolve from a specific 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 philosophical or logical background and [br]people present these questions just to 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 ?? of the religion. 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 These are the things that clearly convey [br]that your addressee does not have that 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 perceptive attitude to understand or dive[br]into something of this imperative nature. 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 In that case you should follow ?? 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 Arguments will be have there significance. 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 The Quran itself is an example of [br]reasoning, 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 But what sort of argumentation? 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 I had explained that reasoning only. 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 I often present this reasoning, infact[br]I have penned it down in my book Meezan. 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 If you read the topic of [br]"Believe in Allah" in my book, 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 I have explained in detail that how[br]Allah himself has presented arguments 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 on his own essence. 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 That is the argumentation that I term [br]as Fitri "simple" reasoning. 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 The argumentation that is based on the[br]intellect of common people. 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 Its evident that when we focus our [br]attention towards God, and say that 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 look around the world, try to comprehend [br]what is around you, 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 try to look at your own existence, try[br]to understand how God has bestowed 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 different abilities and wisdom to [br]different creatures in the world. 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 So, are they only trying to find reasons? 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 I was actually trying to explain the way [br]of reasoning. 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 I have never said that you should[br]accept the religious cases 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 without proper reasoning. 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 Rather, I was trying to throw light on [br]how the Quran educates us 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 to find logic in the religion and [br]religious affairs. 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 There are two types of things: the [br]first one is the knowledge that is 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 limited to our own understanding, and [br]the discussion of argument is either 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 based on observation or experience. 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 In fact this is also the way of [br]argumentation 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 which is employed in the religion. 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 For instance, there are few things that [br]have been prohibited in the religion. 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 Those things that have been prohibited in [br]the religion and 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 why they have been prohibited in the [br]religion. 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 If you want to base your argument on [br]why certain things are prohibited 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 in the religion on experience or observation [br]then you can do that. 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 Certain things are related to the world [br]that is hidden from us and 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 we cannot see that, We cannot observe [br]or experience it. 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 Similarly, same is the case with the being[br]of God. 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 Because it is not possible the God can [br]be shown to you or else you can 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 be called up into the heavens to observe [br]God or his being. 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 So here in this case we can make [br]logical conclusions. 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 How does the Quran educate us as [br]to how we can make a 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 logical inference in relation to God. 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 The methods employed by our eminent [br]Scholars and the experts of logic 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 do not relate to what has been [br]mentioned in the Quran. 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 Of course I was not having a detailed [br]discussion at that point in time you 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 had asked me a question and I was [br]answering that. 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 In reality, ancient philosophy paved the[br]way for discussions and 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 assumptions in this matter. 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 If you pay attention, modern [br]science has rejected all of these. 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 These things were neither based[br]on experience nor observation, 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 then what was the basis of [br]these things. 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 For instance, look at the philosophy of[br]idealism by Plato, 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 even Aristotle denied it immediately[br]after him. 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 And he clarified that in the philosophy [br]of idealism, 9:59:59.000,9:59:59.000 ideas or mental images are considered at[br]par with reality.