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Our main story tonight

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is government surveillance.

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And I realize most people

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would rather have a conversation

0:00:10.478,0:00:12.758
about literally any other topic.

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Including: 'Is my smartphone

0:00:14.268,0:00:15.203
giving me cancer?'

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To which the answer is: Probably.

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Or: 'Do goldfish suffer from depression?'

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To which the answer is:

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Yes, but very briefly.

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But the fact is:

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It is vital

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that we have a discussion about this now.

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Because an important date

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is just around the corner.

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One big day to circle on the calendar

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when it comes to

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a very controversial subject.

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The re-authorization of the Patriot Act

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and all of the

0:00:37.404,0:00:38.974
controversial provisions therein.

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June 1 they've got to come to an agreement

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to re-authorize

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or curtail those programs.

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Yes. Some controversial provisions

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within the Patriot Act

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are set to expire on June 1.

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So circle that date

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on your calendars, everyone.

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And while you're at it:

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Circle June 2 as well.

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Because that's Justin Long's birthday.

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You all forgot last year...

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and he f*cking noticed.

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Now, over the last couple of years

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you've probably heard a lot about

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strange-sounding programs. Such as:

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X-Keyscore, Muscular, Prism, and Mystic.

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Which are, coincidentally, also the names

0:01:12.656,0:01:13.691
of some of Florida's

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least popular stripclubs.

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"Welcome to X-Keyscore!

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Our dancers are fully un-redacted

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and Tuesday is wing-night!"

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But if you don't mind, I would like

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to refresh your memory over some of this.

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And let's start our focussing on the most

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controversial portion of the Patriot Act

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that is up for renewal:

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Section 215.

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Which, I'm aware, sounds like the name

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of an Eastern European boy-band.

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"We are Section 215."

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"Prepare to have your hearts...

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throbbed."

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There's the cute one, the bad-boy,

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the one who strangled a potato-farmer,

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and the one without an iron-deficiency.

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They're incredible.

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But the content of the real Section 215

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is actually even more sinister.

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It's called Section 215.

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Nicknamed: the library records provision.

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Which allows the government to require

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businesses to hand over records of any

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"any tangible things"

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including: books, records, papers,

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documents, and other items.

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If that sounds broad, it's because

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it was very much written that way.

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Section 215 says the government can ask

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for "any tangible things" so long as it's

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"for an investigation to protect

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against international terrorism".

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Which is basically a blank cheque.

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It's letting a teenager borrow the car

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under the strict condition that they

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only use it for 'car-related activities'.

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"Okay, mom and dad, I'm gonna use this

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for a hand-job in a Wendy's parking lot

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but that is car-related,

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so I think I'm covered."

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Section 215 is overseen

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by a secret intelligence-court

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known as the FISA-court.

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And they've interpreted it to mean

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the government could basically collect and

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store phone-records for every American.

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The vast majority of whom, of course

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have no connection to terrorism.

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Unless, Aunt Cheryl has been gravely

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mis-characterizing the activities

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of her needle-point club.

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"It's a sleeper-cell,

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isn't is, Aunt Cheryl?"

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"You will hang for this, Aunt Cheryl."

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"You're a traitor and a terrible aunt."

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"Not in that order."

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Now, the government will point out

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that under 215, they hold phone-records

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and not the calls themselves.

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What the intelligence-community is doing

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is looking at phone-numbers

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and durations of calls

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they are not looking at people's names

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and they are not looking at content.

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Yes, but that's not entirely reassuring.

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Because you can extrapolate a lot

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from that information.

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If they knew that you'd called your ex

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12 times last night, between 1 and 4 AM

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for a duration of 15 minutes each time

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they can be fairly sure that you left

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some pretty pathetic voice-mails.

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"I don't care whose monitoring

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this call, Vicky."

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"We should be together!"

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Pick up the phone, dammit!

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I'm a human being, not an animal!"

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Now, the Patriot-act was written

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just after 9-11.

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And for years it was extended

0:04:08.444,0:04:09.591
and re-authorized

0:04:09.591,0:04:11.444
with barely a passing thought.

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In fact, it became so routine

0:04:13.189,0:04:16.005
that when it was extended in 2011

0:04:16.005,0:04:17.722
one newscast just tacked it

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onto the end of a report

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about a Presidential trip abroad.

0:04:20.963,0:04:22.276
Chip Reid. CBS-news.

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Travelling with the President

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in Deauville, France.

0:04:25.079,0:04:26.650
Also in France, by the way

0:04:26.650,0:04:28.249
President Obama signed in a law

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4-year extension

0:04:29.626,0:04:31.913
of the terrorism fighting Patriot-Act.

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Also in France, by the way?

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By the way?

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He threw that in

0:04:36.560,0:04:38.479
like a mother telling her grown daughter

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that her childhood pet just died.

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"Oh, nice talking to you, sweety.

0:04:42.113,0:04:44.114
Also, by the way, Mr. Peppers is dead.

0:04:44.114,0:04:45.934
See you at Christmas." BANG

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But all of that was before the public

0:04:49.286,0:04:51.341
was made aware of what the government's

0:04:51.341,0:04:53.521
capabilities actually were.

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'Cause that all ended in June of 2013.

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Edward Snowden has just taken

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responsibility for one of the

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biggest government leaks in US history.

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We learned that the government has

0:05:03.741,0:05:04.750
the capacity to track

0:05:04.750,0:05:06.590
virtually every American phone-call

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and to scoop up impossibly vast

0:05:08.448,0:05:10.490
quantities of data across the internet.

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Revelations that the NSA eavesdropped

0:05:12.709,0:05:13.699
on world leaders.

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If you've ever been to the Bahamas

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the NSA could've recorded your phone-calls

0:05:17.367,0:05:19.496
and stored them for up to a month.

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All that information was exposed

0:05:21.674,0:05:22.766
by Edward Snowden.

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And it is still kind of incredible

0:05:24.557,0:05:26.211
that a 29-year-old contractor

0:05:26.211,0:05:28.189
was able to steal top-secret documents

0:05:28.189,0:05:29.579
from an organization

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that LITERALLY has the word 'security'

0:05:31.991,0:05:33.411
in it's name.

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Clearly, that was not great for them.

0:05:35.562,0:05:37.369
The only place where it should be THAT

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easy for employees in their 20ies to steal

0:05:39.391,0:05:40.721
is a Lid store.

0:05:41.511,0:05:43.241
"Dude, you sure I should take this?"

0:05:43.241,0:05:45.206
"Relax, dude, it's a Miami Marlins-cap,

0:05:45.206,0:05:46.458
we're not exactly selling

0:05:46.458,0:05:47.998
Fabergé eggs here."

0:05:49.261,0:05:51.221
It is still unclear

0:05:51.221,0:05:52.774
exactly how many documents

0:05:52.774,0:05:54.001
Edward Snowden stole.

0:05:54.001,0:05:55.534
Although he's consistently tried

0:05:55.534,0:05:56.936
to re-assure people

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that he put them in good hands.

0:05:58.656,0:06:01.217
Honestly, I don't want to be the person

0:06:01.217,0:06:03.079
making the decisions on what should

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be public and what shouldn't.

0:06:04.585,0:06:05.481
Which is why

0:06:05.481,0:06:08.067
rather than publishing these on my own

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or putting them out openly

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I'm running them through journalists.

0:06:12.276,0:06:13.938
Well, that sounds great.

0:06:13.938,0:06:15.892
But of course it's not a fail-safe plan.

0:06:15.892,0:06:17.435
As was proven when the New York Times

0:06:17.435,0:06:19.085
published this slide

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but did such a sloppy job

0:06:20.347,0:06:22.148
of blocking out redacted information

0:06:22.148,0:06:23.799
that some people were able to read

0:06:23.799,0:06:25.736
the information behind that black bar

0:06:25.736,0:06:27.691
which concerned how the US was monitoring

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Al Qaida in Mosul.

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A group now known as ISIS.

0:06:31.260,0:06:33.423
So essentially a national security secret

0:06:33.423,0:06:35.265
was leaked because no-one at the Times

0:06:35.265,0:06:37.825
knows how to use Microsoft Paint.

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And look, you can think

0:06:41.286,0:06:43.001
that Snowden did the wrong thing.

0:06:43.001,0:06:44.765
Or did it in the wrong way.

0:06:44.765,0:06:46.066
But the fact is:

0:06:46.066,0:06:47.442
we have this information now

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and we no longer get the luxury

0:06:49.198,0:06:50.898
of pleading ignorance.

0:06:50.898,0:06:52.677
It's like you can't go to Sea World

0:06:52.677,0:06:54.768
and pretend that Shamu's happy, anymore.

0:06:54.768,0:06:56.275
When we now know

0:06:56.275,0:06:58.006
at least half the water in her tank

0:06:58.006,0:06:59.486
is whale-tears.

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We know that now.

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You can't un-know that information.

0:07:04.051,0:07:06.326
So you have to bear that in mind.

0:07:06.326,0:07:07.757
But here's the thing:

0:07:07.757,0:07:09.006
It's now 2 years later

0:07:09.006,0:07:10.966
and it seems like we've kind of forgotten

0:07:10.966,0:07:12.124
to have a debate

0:07:12.124,0:07:14.104
over the content of what Snowden leaked.

0:07:14.104,0:07:15.969
A recent Pew-report found that nearly

0:07:15.969,0:07:17.858
half of Americans say that they're

0:07:17.858,0:07:19.095
'not very concerned'

0:07:19.095,0:07:20.870
or 'not at all concerned'

0:07:20.870,0:07:22.462
about government surveillance.

0:07:22.462,0:07:23.530
Which is fine.

0:07:23.530,0:07:25.320
If that's an informed opinion.

0:07:25.320,0:07:27.084
But I'm not sure that it is.

0:07:27.084,0:07:29.066
Because we actually sent a camera-crew to

0:07:29.066,0:07:31.732
Times Square to ask some random passers by

0:07:31.732,0:07:34.565
who Edward Snowden was and what he did.

0:07:34.565,0:07:36.676
And there are the responses that we got.

0:07:36.676,0:07:38.821
I have no idea who Edward Snowden is.

0:07:38.821,0:07:41.801
Have no idea who Edward Snowden is.

0:07:41.808,0:07:44.334
I've heard the name, I just can't picture

0:07:44.334,0:07:46.626
think... right now exactly what it is.

0:07:46.626,0:07:48.558
Edward Snowden...

0:07:48.558,0:07:50.446
No. I do not.

0:07:50.446,0:07:51.903
Just for the record:

0:07:51.903,0:07:53.475
that wasn't cherry picking.

0:07:53.475,0:07:55.245
That was entirely reflective

0:07:55.245,0:07:56.401
of everyone we spoke to.

0:07:56.401,0:07:57.420
Although, to be fair:

0:07:57.420,0:07:59.261
some people did remember his name

0:07:59.261,0:08:01.320
they just couldn't remember why.

0:08:01.320,0:08:03.904
He sold some information to people.

0:08:03.904,0:08:06.270
He revealed some information

0:08:06.270,0:08:08.974
that shouldn't have been revealed.

0:08:08.974,0:08:10.474
I think from what I remember is

0:08:10.474,0:08:12.103
the information that he shared was

0:08:12.103,0:08:14.273
detrimental to our military secrets?

0:08:14.273,0:08:16.206
And keeping our soldiers and our country

0:08:16.206,0:08:16.956
safe?

0:08:16.956,0:08:19.340
He leaked documents what the US Army's

0:08:19.340,0:08:20.803
operations in Iraq.

0:08:20.803,0:08:22.828
Edward Snowden revealed a bunch of

0:08:22.828,0:08:24.868
of secrets, I guess, or information

0:08:24.868,0:08:26.384
into Wiki... Wikileaks?

0:08:26.384,0:08:27.768
Edward Snowden leaked...

0:08:27.768,0:08:29.305
Ah, he's in charge of Wikileaks?

0:08:29.305,0:08:30.939
Edward Snowden revealed a lot of

0:08:30.939,0:08:32.969
documents through Wikileaks...?

0:08:34.991,0:08:36.291
Okay, so here's the thing:

0:08:36.291,0:08:38.704
Edward Snowden is NOT the Wikileaks guy.

0:08:38.704,0:08:41.195
The Wikileaks guy is Julian Assange.

0:08:41.195,0:08:42.674
And you do not want

0:08:42.674,0:08:43.820
to be confused with him.

0:08:43.820,0:08:45.648
Partly because he was far less careful

0:08:45.648,0:08:48.209
than Snowden in what he released and how.

0:08:48.209,0:08:49.725
And partly because he resembles

0:08:49.725,0:08:51.430
a sandwich-bag full of biscuit-dough

0:08:51.430,0:08:53.209
wearing a Stevie Nicks-wig.

0:08:54.139,0:08:56.553
And that is, that is ciritical.

0:08:56.553,0:08:58.965
Julian Assange is not a like-able man.

0:08:58.965,0:09:01.556
Even Benedict Cumberbatch could not

0:09:01.556,0:09:03.312
make him like-able.

0:09:03.312,0:09:05.422
He's un-Cumberbatch-able.

0:09:06.114,0:09:07.271
That was supposed to be

0:09:07.271,0:09:08.881
physically impossible.

0:09:09.442,0:09:10.640
But I don't blame people

0:09:10.640,0:09:11.848
for being confused.

0:09:11.848,0:09:13.122
We've been looking at this story

0:09:13.122,0:09:14.556
for the last 2 weeks

0:09:14.556,0:09:17.192
and it is hard to get your head around.

0:09:17.192,0:09:18.807
Not just because there are so many

0:09:18.807,0:09:20.769
complicated programs to keep track of

0:09:20.769,0:09:21.963
but also because

0:09:21.963,0:09:23.787
there are no easy answers here.

0:09:23.787,0:09:26.316
We all naturally want perfect privacy

0:09:26.316,0:09:28.536
and perfect safety.

0:09:28.536,0:09:31.170
But those 2 things cannot coexist.

0:09:31.170,0:09:32.565
It's like how you can't have

0:09:32.565,0:09:34.545
a badass pet falcon...

0:09:34.545,0:09:37.485
and an adorable pet vole named Herbert.

0:09:39.140,0:09:41.327
Either you have to lose one of them

0:09:41.327,0:09:43.170
-which obviously you don't want to do-

0:09:43.170,0:09:44.469
or you have to accept some

0:09:44.469,0:09:46.899
reasonable restrictions on both of them.

0:09:47.432,0:09:49.925
Now to be fair, the NSA will argue

0:09:49.925,0:09:52.092
that just because they CAN do something

0:09:52.092,0:09:53.612
doesn't mean they DO do it.

0:09:53.612,0:09:55.424
And, that there are restrictions

0:09:55.424,0:09:57.039
on their operations

0:09:57.039,0:09:58.088
such as the FISA-court

0:09:58.088,0:10:00.087
which must approve requests

0:10:00.087,0:10:01.332
for foreign surveillance.

0:10:01.332,0:10:02.118
But.

0:10:02.118,0:10:04.775
In 34 years, that court has approved

0:10:04.775,0:10:07.116
over 35000 applications

0:10:07.116,0:10:09.146
and only rejected 12.

0:10:09.981,0:10:12.677
Yes. Much like Robert Durst's second wife.

0:10:12.677,0:10:16.156
The FISA-court is alarmingly accepting.

0:10:16.156,0:10:18.263
"Listen, Robert, I'm not

0:10:18.263,0:10:20.049
gonna ask you too many questions."

0:10:20.049,0:10:22.306
I'm just gonna give you the benefit of

0:10:22.306,0:10:24.302
a doubt that you clearly don't deserve."

0:10:24.302,0:10:27.522
At least tell him to blink and burp less.

0:10:29.366,0:10:31.980
The burping might be the most troubling

0:10:31.980,0:10:33.740
thing about that show.

0:10:35.403,0:10:38.052
So maybe it's time for us to talk.

0:10:38.052,0:10:39.961
About where the limits should be.

0:10:39.961,0:10:41.971
And the best place to start would be

0:10:41.984,0:10:43.590
Section 215.

0:10:43.590,0:10:45.171
Not just because it's the easiest

0:10:45.171,0:10:45.874
to understand

0:10:45.874,0:10:47.968
but there is wide-spread agreement

0:10:47.968,0:10:49.634
it needs to be reformed.

0:10:49.634,0:10:51.595
From the President, to Ted Cruz,

0:10:51.595,0:10:54.469
to both the ACLU and the NRA,

0:10:54.469,0:10:55.400
to even the guy

0:10:55.400,0:10:57.420
who wrote the thing in the first place.

0:10:57.420,0:10:58.634
I was the principal author

0:10:58.634,0:10:59.832
of the Patriot Act.

0:10:59.832,0:11:03.461
I can say, that without qualification

0:11:03.461,0:11:05.967
Congress never did intend to allow

0:11:05.967,0:11:07.161
bulk-collections

0:11:07.161,0:11:09.273
when it passed Section 215.

0:11:09.273,0:11:11.650
And no fair reading of the text

0:11:11.650,0:11:13.887
would allow for this program.

0:11:13.887,0:11:15.148
Think about that.

0:11:15.148,0:11:16.515
He was the author.

0:11:16.515,0:11:18.213
That's the legislative equivalent

0:11:18.213,0:11:19.121
of Lewis Carroll

0:11:19.121,0:11:20.983
seeing the tea-cups ride at Disney Land

0:11:20.983,0:11:21.785
and saying:

0:11:21.785,0:11:23.607
"This has got to be reined in."

0:11:23.607,0:11:25.177
"No fair reading of my text

0:11:25.177,0:11:26.877
would allow for this ride."

0:11:27.085,0:11:28.850
"You've turned my perfectly nice tale

0:11:28.850,0:11:30.238
of psychedelic paedofilia

0:11:30.238,0:11:32.368
into a garish vomitorium."

0:11:34.112,0:11:35.792
"This is not what I wanted!"

0:11:37.280,0:11:39.057
And even the NSA has said

0:11:39.057,0:11:41.384
that the number of terror-plots in the US

0:11:41.384,0:11:42.437
that the Section 215

0:11:42.437,0:11:44.669
telephone-records program has disrupted...

0:11:44.669,0:11:46.051
...is 1.

0:11:46.051,0:11:47.384
And it's worth noting:

0:11:47.384,0:11:49.046
that one particular plot

0:11:49.046,0:11:51.420
involved a cabdriver in San Diego

0:11:51.420,0:11:54.170
who gave $8500 to a terror-group.

0:11:54.170,0:11:56.858
And that is the shittiest terrorist-plot

0:11:56.858,0:11:57.917
I've ever seen.

0:11:57.917,0:11:59.223
Other than the plot of

0:11:59.223,0:12:01.433
A Good Day To Die Hard.

0:12:02.183,0:12:04.378
But here's the big problem here:

0:12:04.378,0:12:06.626
If we let Section 215 get renewed

0:12:06.626,0:12:07.949
in it's current form

0:12:07.949,0:12:09.421
without serious public debate

0:12:09.421,0:12:10.581
we're in trouble.

0:12:10.581,0:12:11.672
Because Section 215

0:12:11.672,0:12:13.183
is the canary in the coal-mine.

0:12:13.183,0:12:14.342
If we cannot fix that

0:12:14.342,0:12:16.354
we're not gonna fix any of them.

0:12:16.354,0:12:18.563
And the public debate so far

0:12:18.563,0:12:20.886
has been absolutely pathetic.

0:12:20.886,0:12:21.668
A year ago

0:12:21.668,0:12:22.910
a former congresswoman was

0:12:22.910,0:12:25.823
discussing the 215 program on the news.

0:12:25.823,0:12:27.405
Watch wat happened.

0:12:27.405,0:12:29.147
This vast collection of data

0:12:29.147,0:12:31.533
is not that useful

0:12:31.533,0:12:34.414
and infringes substantially

0:12:34.414,0:12:35.496
on personal privacy.

0:12:35.496,0:12:37.601
I think at this point we should

0:12:37.601,0:12:41.916
seriously consider not continuing...

0:12:41.916,0:12:44.721
Congress woman Harman, let me interrupt..

0:12:44.721,0:12:46.601
Let me interrupt you just for a moment.

0:12:46.601,0:12:48.611
We've got some breaking news out of Miami.

0:12:48.611,0:12:50.411
Stand by if you will.

0:12:50.411,0:12:51.301
Right now in Miami

0:12:51.301,0:12:52.487
Justin Bieber

0:12:52.487,0:12:54.596
has been arrested on a number of charges.

0:12:54.596,0:12:57.097
The judge is reading the charges

0:12:57.097,0:12:58.764
including resisting arrest

0:12:58.764,0:13:00.303
and driving under the influence.

0:13:00.303,0:13:02.195
He's appearing now before the judge for

0:13:02.195,0:13:04.177
his bond-hearing. Let's watch.

0:13:07.683,0:13:09.017
Actually, you know what?

0:13:09.017,0:13:11.014
Bad news, we're gonna have to interrupt

0:13:11.014,0:13:12.719
your interruption of the Bieber news

0:13:12.719,0:13:14.109
for a new interruption.

0:13:14.109,0:13:16.184
This time featuring a YouTube video of

0:13:16.184,0:13:17.986
a tortoise having sex with a plastic clog.

0:13:17.986,0:13:19.353
Let's watch.

0:13:19.353,0:13:20.308
<i>HEEH</i>

0:13:21.938,0:13:23.213
<i>HEEH</i>

0:13:26.963,0:13:27.968
<i>HEH</i>

0:13:30.098,0:13:33.075
That. Is essentially the current tone

0:13:33.075,0:13:35.156
of this vitally important debate.

0:13:35.456,0:13:37.007
<i>HEEEH</i>

0:13:38.377,0:13:39.319
And again:

0:13:39.319,0:13:40.507
I'm not saying

0:13:40.507,0:13:42.305
this is an easy conversation.

0:13:42.305,0:13:43.913
But we have to have it.

0:13:43.913,0:13:45.185
I know this is confusing.

0:13:45.185,0:13:46.463
And unfortunately the most

0:13:46.463,0:13:47.893
obvious person to talk to

0:13:47.893,0:13:49.838
about this is Edward Snowden.

0:13:49.838,0:13:51.887
But he currently lives in Russia. Meaning:

0:13:51.887,0:13:53.519
If you wanted to ask him about any

0:13:53.519,0:13:55.184
of these issues, you'd have to fly

0:13:55.184,0:13:56.650
all the way there to do it.

0:13:56.650,0:13:58.624
And it is not a pleasant flight.

0:13:59.624,0:14:01.440
And the reason I know that...

0:14:01.920,0:14:03.955
...is that last week, I went to Russia

0:14:03.955,0:14:05.645
to speak to Edward Snowden.

0:14:06.190,0:14:07.810
And this is what happened.

0:14:09.928,0:14:13.161
Yes, last week I spent 48 paranoid hours

0:14:13.161,0:14:14.370
in Moscow.

0:14:14.370,0:14:15.913
Arguably the last place on earth

0:14:15.913,0:14:16.816
where you can find

0:14:16.816,0:14:19.211
an overweight Josef Stalin impersonator

0:14:19.211,0:14:21.941
arguing with an unconvincing fake Lenin.

0:14:22.396,0:14:23.481
And after experiencing

0:14:23.481,0:14:25.945
Russia's famously warm hospitality

0:14:25.945,0:14:27.924
I went to meet Edward Snowden.

0:14:27.924,0:14:30.024
Who is supposed to show up in this room

0:14:30.024,0:14:31.097
at noon.

0:14:31.097,0:14:32.658
However, after 5 minutes after

0:14:32.658,0:14:34.556
the interview was scheduled to begin

0:14:34.556,0:14:36.697
I had a troubling thought.

0:14:37.237,0:14:38.127
I don't know.

0:14:39.026,0:14:40.426
Do you think he's coming?

0:14:42.444,0:14:44.139
'Cause my argument is:

0:14:40.426,0:14:41.734
Yeah, he's coming.

0:14:44.139,0:14:45.769
Why would he?

0:14:45.769,0:14:47.729
When you think about it.

0:14:49.040,0:14:50.922
I got 2000 roebels

0:14:50.922,0:14:53.159
that says he doesn't make it.

0:14:53.159,0:14:55.469
Without understanding how much that is.

0:15:00.365,0:15:01.817
All I'm saying is...

0:15:01.817,0:15:04.650
...a 10-hour flight for an empty chair?

0:15:04.650,0:15:06.800
I'm gonna lose my shit.

0:15:10.338,0:15:12.392
It turns out it may be a bit of a problem

0:15:12.392,0:15:14.647
because our Russian producer

0:15:14.647,0:15:18.582
booked us in a room directly overlooking

0:15:18.582,0:15:21.302
the old KGB-building.

0:15:21.302,0:15:22.146
And the home

0:15:22.146,0:15:25.170
of the current Federal Security Bureau.

0:15:25.170,0:15:26.716
And we've just been told...

0:15:26.716,0:15:28.345
...they know we're here.

0:15:28.345,0:15:30.035
So uhm...

0:15:30.035,0:15:32.212
So that happened.

0:15:37.543,0:15:40.645
Uhm, just if the Russian...

0:15:40.645,0:15:42.019
...Russian KGB is listening:

0:15:42.019,0:15:43.224
We'll ring the fire-alarm

0:15:43.224,0:15:44.654
if he's not coming.

0:15:47.570,0:15:48.910
Oh shit.

0:15:49.695,0:15:51.405
Oh God.

0:15:57.732,0:15:58.902
So sorry for the delay.

0:15:58.902,0:16:00.455
It's fine, don't worry about it.

0:16:00.455,0:16:02.378
HOLY SHIT.

0:16:02.378,0:16:04.454
He actually came.

0:16:04.454,0:16:06.685
Edward f*cking Snowden.

0:16:06.685,0:16:09.660
The most famous hero and/or traitor

0:16:09.660,0:16:11.719
in recent American history!

0:16:11.719,0:16:13.321
And I've started with a question

0:16:13.321,0:16:15.423
designed to test his loyalties.

0:16:16.093,0:16:18.193
How much do you miss America?

0:16:18.193,0:16:21.656
You know, my country is something

0:16:21.656,0:16:24.815
that travels with me, you know.

0:16:24.815,0:16:26.498
It's not just a geogra...

0:16:26.498,0:16:28.312
That's a way too complicated answer.

0:16:28.312,0:16:29.822
The answer is: I miss it a lot.

0:16:29.822,0:16:31.702
it's the greatest country in the world.

0:16:31.702,0:16:32.701
I do miss my country.

0:16:32.701,0:16:33.570
I do miss my home.

0:16:33.570,0:16:34.551
I do miss my family.

0:16:34.551,0:16:37.222
Do you miss hot pockets?

0:16:37.222,0:16:39.125
Yes.

0:16:39.125,0:16:41.093
I miss hot pockets. Very much.

0:16:41.093,0:16:43.633
Okay. The entire state of Florida?

0:16:51.945,0:16:53.249
Let's just let that silence

0:16:53.249,0:16:54.719
hang in the air.

0:16:55.398,0:16:57.245
Truck Nuts?

0:16:57.245,0:16:58.391
Do you miss Truck Nuts?

0:16:58.391,0:16:59.681
I don't know what they are.

0:16:59.681,0:17:01.411
Lucky for you, Edward...

0:17:05.121,0:17:07.018
Not just Truck Nuts.

0:17:07.018,0:17:09.494
Stars and stripes Truck Nuts.

0:17:09.494,0:17:11.714
That is 2 balls of liberty

0:17:11.715,0:17:13.141
in a freedom sack.

0:17:13.141,0:17:14.606
You really thought ahead.

0:17:14.606,0:17:17.083
Well, at least one of us did.

0:17:17.083,0:17:20.084
You know, 'cause of the... uhm...

0:17:20.084,0:17:22.226
the quandary... the...

0:17:22.226,0:17:25.417
...Kafka-esque nightmare that you're in.

0:17:25.417,0:17:28.037
Okay. Let's dive in.

0:17:28.037,0:17:30.157
Why did you do this?

0:17:30.157,0:17:31.580
The NSA has

0:17:31.580,0:17:33.901
the greatest surveillance capabilities

0:17:33.901,0:17:36.469
that we've ever seen in history.

0:17:36.469,0:17:38.643
Now, what they will argue

0:17:38.643,0:17:40.746
is that they don't use this

0:17:40.746,0:17:43.225
for nefarious purposes

0:17:43.225,0:17:45.376
against American citizens.

0:17:45.376,0:17:47.757
In some ways that's true.

0:17:47.757,0:17:50.428
But the real problem is that

0:17:50.428,0:17:52.691
they're using these capabilities

0:17:52.691,0:17:54.619
to make us vulnerable to them

0:17:54.619,0:17:56.605
and then saying:

0:17:56.605,0:17:58.667
"While I have a gun pointed at your head

0:17:58.667,0:18:00.279
I'm not gonna pull the trigger."

0:18:00.279,0:18:01.522
"Trust me."

0:18:01.522,0:18:04.467
So, what does the NSA you want look like?

0:18:04.467,0:18:07.844
Because you applied for a job at the NSA.

0:18:07.844,0:18:09.864
So you clearly see an inherent value

0:18:09.864,0:18:11.972
in that shadowy organization.

0:18:11.972,0:18:15.000
I worked with mass-surveillance systems

0:18:15.000,0:18:17.754
against Chinese hackers.

0:18:17.754,0:18:19.045
I saw that, you know

0:18:19.045,0:18:20.338
these things do have some purpose.

0:18:20.338,0:18:21.502
And you want your spies

0:18:21.502,0:18:22.984
to be good at spying.

0:18:22.984,0:18:23.806
To be fair.

0:18:23.806,0:18:24.529
Right.

0:18:24.529,0:18:26.173
What you don't want is

0:18:26.173,0:18:28.086
you don't want them spying inside

0:18:28.086,0:18:29.253
their own country.

0:18:29.253,0:18:32.684
Spies are great when they're on our side.

0:18:32.684,0:18:33.784
But we can never forget

0:18:33.784,0:18:35.312
that they're incredibly powerful

0:18:35.312,0:18:36.517
and incredibly dangerous.

0:18:36.517,0:18:37.993
And if they're off the leash...

0:18:37.993,0:18:39.658
...they can end up coming after us.

0:18:39.658,0:18:41.520
We're talking about 2 different things

0:18:41.520,0:18:42.780
Domestic surveillance

0:18:42.780,0:18:44.139
and foreign surveillance.

0:18:44.139,0:18:45.529
'Cause domestic surveillance

0:18:45.529,0:18:48.475
Americans give some of a shit about.

0:18:48.475,0:18:50.093
Foreign surveillance...

0:18:50.093,0:18:52.418
...they don't give any remote shit about.

0:18:52.418,0:18:53.752
Well the second question is:

0:18:53.752,0:18:56.080
When we talk about foreign surveillance

0:18:56.080,0:18:57.899
are we applying it in ways that are

0:18:57.899,0:18:59.134
beneficial...

0:18:59.134,0:19:00.184
No-one cares.

0:19:00.184,0:19:00.922
In terms...

0:19:00.922,0:19:02.113
They don't give a shit.

0:19:02.113,0:19:04.805
We spied on UNICEF, the children's fund.

0:19:04.805,0:19:06.094
Sure.

0:19:06.094,0:19:09.564
We spied on lawyers negotiating...

0:19:09.569,0:19:12.758
What was UNICEF doing?

0:19:12.758,0:19:13.488
I mean:

0:19:13.488,0:19:15.503
That's the question there, isn't it?

0:19:15.503,0:19:16.283
The question is:

0:19:16.283,0:19:17.950
Are these projects valuable?

0:19:17.950,0:19:21.044
Are we going to be safer when we're spying

0:19:21.044,0:19:23.355
on UNICEF and lawyers who are talking about

0:19:23.355,0:19:25.641
the price of shrimp and clove cigarettes.

0:19:25.641,0:19:27.412
I don't think people say that's good.

0:19:27.412,0:19:28.379
I think they'll say:

0:19:28.379,0:19:30.530
I definitely don't care.

0:19:30.530,0:19:31.962
Americans do not give a shit.

0:19:31.962,0:19:32.993
I think you're right.

0:19:32.993,0:19:35.220
About foreign surveillance.

0:19:35.220,0:19:37.036
What some people do care about

0:19:37.036,0:19:38.476
is whether Snowden considered

0:19:38.482,0:19:40.485
the adverse consequences of leaking

0:19:40.485,0:19:42.760
so much information at once.

0:19:42.760,0:19:44.691
How many of those documents

0:19:44.691,0:19:46.815
have you actually read?

0:19:46.815,0:19:48.894
I've evaluated all the documents

0:19:48.894,0:19:50.060
that are in the archive.

0:19:50.060,0:19:51.491
You've read every single one?

0:19:51.491,0:19:54.188
I do understand what I've turned over.

0:19:54.188,0:19:55.748
But there's a difference between

0:19:55.748,0:19:58.522
understanding what's in the documents

0:19:58.522,0:20:00.342
and reading what's in the documents.

0:20:00.342,0:20:02.456
I recognized the concern.

0:20:02.456,0:20:04.329
'Cause when you're handing over

0:20:04.329,0:20:06.360
thousands of NSA documents the last

0:20:06.360,0:20:09.514
thing you want to do is read them.

0:20:09.514,0:20:11.949
I think it's fair to be concerned about

0:20:11.949,0:20:13.344
'did this person do enough?'

0:20:13.344,0:20:14.497
'were they careful enough?'

0:20:14.497,0:20:16.616
Especially when you're handling material

0:20:16.616,0:20:18.819
like we know you are handling.

0:20:18.819,0:20:19.910
Well, in my defense:

0:20:19.910,0:20:21.538
I'm not handling anything anymore.

0:20:21.548,0:20:23.317
That's been passed to the journalists

0:20:23.317,0:20:24.813
and they're using extraordinary

0:20:24.813,0:20:26.749
security measures to make sure that this

0:20:26.749,0:20:28.880
is reported in the most responsible way.

0:20:28.880,0:20:30.739
But, those are journalists

0:20:30.739,0:20:33.240
with a lower technical skill-set than you.

0:20:33.240,0:20:35.089
That's true. But they DO understand

0:20:35.089,0:20:36.288
-just like you and I do-

0:20:36.288,0:20:37.571
just HOW important it is

0:20:37.571,0:20:38.775
to get this right.

0:20:38.775,0:20:41.015
So the New York Times took a slide

0:20:41.015,0:20:42.931
didn't redact it properly...

0:20:42.931,0:20:44.474
...and

0:20:44.474,0:20:45.767
In the end it was possible

0:20:45.767,0:20:47.683
for people to see that something

0:20:47.683,0:20:49.828
was being used in Mosul.

0:20:49.828,0:20:51.128
On Al Qaida.

0:20:51.128,0:20:52.762
That is a problem.

0:20:52.762,0:20:53.937
Well, that's a f*ck-up.

0:20:53.937,0:20:55.324
It is a f*ck-up.

0:20:55.324,0:20:57.339
And these things do happen in reporting.

0:20:57.339,0:20:58.956
In journalism we have to accept

0:20:58.956,0:21:00.698
that some mistakes will be made.

0:21:00.698,0:21:03.711
This is a fundamental concept of liberty.

0:21:03.711,0:21:04.486
Right.

0:21:04.486,0:21:06.749
But you have to own that then.

0:21:08.059,0:21:09.909
You're giving documents with information

0:21:09.909,0:21:11.746
you know could be harmful

0:21:11.746,0:21:13.714
which could get out there.

0:21:13.714,0:21:15.641
Yes.

0:21:15.641,0:21:19.179
If people act in bad faith.

0:21:19.179,0:21:21.646
Not even bad faith, but incompetence.

0:21:21.646,0:21:22.569
We are.

0:21:22.569,0:21:24.558
But you will never be

0:21:24.558,0:21:28.275
completely free from risk, if you're free.

0:21:28.275,0:21:29.479
The only time you can be

0:21:29.479,0:21:31.952
free from risk is when you're in prison.

0:21:31.952,0:21:34.025
While the risks were significant

0:21:34.025,0:21:36.189
Snowden himself has made it clear

0:21:36.189,0:21:38.243
he feels the rewards have been worth it.

0:21:38.243,0:21:39.940
You've said in you letters to Brasil:

0:21:39.940,0:21:41.573
"I was motivated by a believe that

0:21:41.573,0:21:43.196
citizens deserve to understand

0:21:43.196,0:21:44.720
the system in which they live."

0:21:44.720,0:21:45.963
"My greatest fear was that

0:21:45.963,0:21:47.741
no-one would listen to my warning."

0:21:47.741,0:21:49.901
"Never have I been so glad

0:21:49.901,0:21:51.694
to have been so wrong."

0:21:51.694,0:21:53.176
How did that feel?

0:21:53.176,0:21:55.568
I was initially terrified that this

0:21:55.568,0:21:57.003
was going to be a 3-day story.

0:21:57.003,0:21:59.316
Everybody was going to forget about it.

0:21:59.316,0:22:01.163
But when I saw that

0:22:01.163,0:22:03.235
everybody around the world said:

0:22:03.235,0:22:05.609
"Wow, this is a problem."

0:22:05.609,0:22:09.044
"We have to do something about this."

0:22:09.044,0:22:10.558
It felt like vindication.

0:22:10.558,0:22:11.856
Even in America?

0:22:11.856,0:22:12.912
Even in America.

0:22:12.912,0:22:15.033
And I think we're seeing something amazing

0:22:15.033,0:22:19.039
which is if you ask... the American people

0:22:19.039,0:22:20.996
to make tough decisions

0:22:20.996,0:22:23.409
to confront tough issues

0:22:23.409,0:22:25.428
to think about hard problems...

0:22:25.428,0:22:28.971
...they'll actually surprise you.

0:22:28.971,0:22:29.767
Okay.

0:22:29.767,0:22:30.782
Here's the problem:

0:22:30.782,0:22:32.451
I did ask some Americans.

0:22:32.451,0:22:35.221
And, boy did it surprise me.

0:22:37.783,0:22:39.869
I have no idea who Edward Snowden is.

0:22:39.869,0:22:41.626
You've never heard of Edward Snowden?

0:22:41.626,0:22:42.544
No.

0:22:42.544,0:22:45.069
I have no idea who Edward Snowden is.

0:22:45.069,0:22:46.500
I've heard the name

0:22:46.500,0:22:48.541
I just can't picture... think right now

0:22:48.541,0:22:49.872
exactly what it is.

0:22:49.872,0:22:51.695
Well, he's... uhm...

0:22:51.695,0:22:53.725
He sold some information to people.

0:22:53.725,0:22:55.624
He revealed some information

0:22:55.624,0:22:58.980
that shouldn't have been revealed.

0:22:58.980,0:23:01.482
Edward Snowden revealed a lot of documents

0:23:01.482,0:23:03.551
through Wikileaks.

0:23:03.551,0:23:05.063
Edward Snowden revealed a bunch of

0:23:05.063,0:23:07.015
secrets, I guess...

0:23:07.015,0:23:08.969
or information into Wikileaks.

0:23:08.969,0:23:10.916
Edward Snowden leaked... uhm...

0:23:10.916,0:23:12.726
he's in charge of Wikileaks.

0:23:13.596,0:23:16.128
I'm in charge of Wikileaks.

0:23:16.128,0:23:17.582
Not ideal.

0:23:17.582,0:23:18.829
I guess, on the plus side:

0:23:18.829,0:23:20.232
You might be able to go home.

0:23:20.232,0:23:21.811
'Cause it seems like no-one knows

0:23:21.811,0:23:24.089
who the f*ck you are or what you did

0:23:24.089,0:23:26.695
We can't expect everybody to be uniformly

0:23:26.695,0:23:28.847
informed.

0:23:28.847,0:23:31.339
So, did you do this to solve a problem?

0:23:31.339,0:23:34.599
I did this to give the American people

0:23:34.599,0:23:36.848
a chance to decide for themselves

0:23:36.848,0:23:39.284
the kind of government they want to have.

0:23:39.284,0:23:41.625
That is a conversation that I think that

0:23:41.625,0:23:44.254
the American people deserve to decide.

0:23:44.254,0:23:45.585
There is no doubt that it is

0:23:45.585,0:23:47.319
a critical conversation.

0:23:47.319,0:23:49.677
But is it a conversation that we have

0:23:49.677,0:23:52.377
the capacity to have?

0:23:52.377,0:23:54.505
Because it's so complicated.

0:23:54.505,0:23:57.226
We don't fundamentally understand it.

0:23:57.226,0:23:58.989
It is a challenging conversation.

0:23:58.989,0:24:00.812
It's difficult for most people

0:24:00.812,0:24:02.893
to even conceptualize.

0:24:02.893,0:24:04.126
The problem is

0:24:04.126,0:24:05.942
the internet is massively complex

0:24:05.942,0:24:08.034
and so much of it is invisible.

0:24:08.034,0:24:11.179
Service providers, technicians, engineers,

0:24:11.179,0:24:12.153
the phonenumber....

0:24:12.153,0:24:13.874
Let me stop you right there, Edward.

0:24:13.874,0:24:15.571
'Cause this is the whole problem.

0:24:15.571,0:24:16.277
Right.

0:24:16.277,0:24:17.540
This is the whole problem.

0:24:17.540,0:24:18.347
I glaze over.

0:24:18.347,0:24:20.324
It's like the IT-guy comes to your office

0:24:20.324,0:24:23.251
and you go: "Oooh shit".

0:24:23.251,0:24:24.475
In fairness...

0:24:24.475,0:24:26.923
"Ooh shit, don't teach me anything."

0:24:26.923,0:24:28.597
"I don't want to learn."

0:24:28.597,0:24:30.839
"You smell like canned soup."

0:24:30.839,0:24:32.601
It's a real challenge to figure out

0:24:32.601,0:24:35.113
how do we communicate

0:24:35.113,0:24:37.917
things that require sort of years and years

0:24:37.917,0:24:39.474
of technical understanding.

0:24:39.474,0:24:42.677
And compress that into seconds of speech.

0:24:42.677,0:24:45.954
So, I'm sympathetic to the problem there.

0:24:45.954,0:24:47.327
But the thing is

0:24:47.327,0:24:49.463
everything you did only matters

0:24:49.463,0:24:52.757
if we have this conversation properly.

0:24:52.757,0:24:54.430
So let me help you out there.

0:24:54.430,0:24:56.186
You mentioned in an interview

0:24:56.186,0:24:57.811
that the NSA was passing around

0:24:57.811,0:24:59.267
naked photo's of people.

0:24:59.267,0:25:02.277
Yeah. This is something where it's...

0:25:02.277,0:25:05.529
it's not actually seen as a big deal.

0:25:05.529,0:25:07.378
In the culture of NSA.

0:25:07.378,0:25:09.227
Because you see naked pictures

0:25:09.227,0:25:10.590
all of the time.

0:25:10.590,0:25:11.694
That.

0:25:11.694,0:25:13.234
Terrifies people.

0:25:13.234,0:25:15.518
'Cause when we asked people about THAT...

0:25:15.518,0:25:17.284
...this is the response you get.

0:25:17.284,0:25:18.867
The government should not be able

0:25:18.867,0:25:20.081
to look at dick-pictures.

0:25:20.081,0:25:21.955
If the government was looking at

0:25:21.955,0:25:23.765
a picture of Gordon's penis

0:25:23.765,0:25:25.955
I definitely feel it would be an invasion

0:25:25.955,0:25:27.277
of my privacy.

0:25:27.277,0:25:29.312
Ah, yeah, if the government was looking at

0:25:29.312,0:25:31.332
pictures of my penis, that would upset me.

0:25:31.332,0:25:32.915
They should never, ever

0:25:32.915,0:25:34.258
the US government have a picture

0:25:34.258,0:25:35.607
of my dick.

0:25:35.607,0:25:37.020
If my husband sent me

0:25:37.020,0:25:38.474
a picture of his penis

0:25:38.474,0:25:40.365
and the government could access it

0:25:40.365,0:25:43.821
I would want that program to be shut down.

0:25:43.821,0:25:47.024
I would want the Dick-pic Program changed.

0:25:47.974,0:25:49.795
I would also want the Dick-pic program

0:25:49.795,0:25:50.706
changed.

0:25:50.706,0:25:52.418
It would be terrific if the program

0:25:52.418,0:25:53.167
could change.

0:25:53.167,0:25:54.832
I would want it to be tweeked

0:25:54.832,0:25:56.981
I would want it to have clear and

0:25:56.981,0:25:59.375
transparent laws that we knew about.

0:25:59.375,0:26:01.390
And that were communicated to us.

0:26:01.390,0:26:03.860
To understand what they're being used for.

0:26:03.860,0:26:05.284
Or why the were being kept.

0:26:05.284,0:26:06.881
Do you think that program exists?

0:26:06.881,0:26:09.217
I don't think that program exists at all.

0:26:09.217,0:26:13.242
No.

0:26:13.242,0:26:16.863
If I had knowledge that the US government

0:26:16.863,0:26:19.026
had a picture of my dick...

0:26:19.026,0:26:21.780
...I would be very pissed off.

0:26:24.010,0:26:25.773
Well...

0:26:25.773,0:26:27.495
The good news is that there's no

0:26:27.495,0:26:30.335
program named 'the Dick-pic Program'.

0:26:30.335,0:26:32.020
The bad news is that they are still

0:26:32.020,0:26:33.746
collecting everybody's information.

0:26:33.746,0:26:35.596
Including your dick-pics.

0:26:35.596,0:26:36.986
What's the over/under on that last guy

0:26:36.990,0:26:39.970
having sent a dick-pic recently?

0:26:39.970,0:26:42.412
You don't need to guess, I'll show you.

0:26:42.412,0:26:44.262
I did.

0:26:44.262,0:26:47.518
I did take a picture of my... dick.

0:26:47.518,0:26:49.698
And I sent it to a girl. Recently.

0:26:51.723,0:26:53.252
This is the most visible

0:26:53.252,0:26:55.352
line in the sand for people.

0:26:55.352,0:26:59.151
"Can they see my dick?"

0:26:59.151,0:27:01.309
So, with that in mind...

0:27:01.309,0:27:03.399
look inside that folder.

0:27:07.285,0:27:09.232
That.

0:27:09.232,0:27:10.809
Is a picture of my dick.

0:27:10.809,0:27:13.071
So let's go through each NSA program

0:27:13.071,0:27:15.179
and explain to me it's capabilities

0:27:15.179,0:27:18.212
in regards to that photograph...

0:27:18.212,0:27:20.812
...of my penis.

0:27:20.812,0:27:24.240
702 Surveillance: can they see my dick?

0:27:24.240,0:27:25.692
Yes.

0:27:25.692,0:27:28.306
The FISA-amendment act of 2008

0:27:28.306,0:27:30.181
which Section 702 falls under

0:27:30.181,0:27:33.228
allows the bulk-collection

0:27:33.228,0:27:34.899
of internet communications that are

0:27:34.899,0:27:35.746
one-end foreign.

0:27:35.746,0:27:36.556
Bulk-collection:

0:27:36.556,0:27:38.343
Now we're talking about my dick.

0:27:38.343,0:27:39.060
You get it.

0:27:39.060,0:27:39.877
It's not what...

0:27:39.877,0:27:41.111
You get it though, right?

0:27:41.111,0:27:41.977
I do.

0:27:41.977,0:27:43.826
Because it's... it's... yeah, anyway.

0:27:43.826,0:27:46.217
So, if you have you're email somewhere

0:27:46.217,0:27:48.725
like G-mail, hosted on a server overseas

0:27:48.725,0:27:50.280
or transferred over seas

0:27:50.280,0:27:52.718
or it any time crosses outside the borders

0:27:52.718,0:27:54.949
of the United States...

0:27:54.949,0:27:57.419
...you're junk ends up in the database.

0:27:57.419,0:27:58.811
So it doesn't have to be

0:27:58.811,0:28:00.438
sending your dick to a German?

0:28:00.438,0:28:01.146
No.

0:28:01.146,0:28:02.680
Even if you sent it to somebody

0:28:02.680,0:28:04.382
within the United States

0:28:04.382,0:28:07.722
your wholly domestic communication

0:28:07.722,0:28:09.348
between you and your wife

0:28:09.348,0:28:10.510
can go from New York...

0:28:10.510,0:28:11.792
to London and back.

0:28:11.792,0:28:13.474
And get caught up in the database.

0:28:13.474,0:28:16.637
Executive Order 12-333: Dick or no dick?

0:28:16.637,0:28:17.617
Yes.

0:28:17.617,0:28:21.402
EO 12-333 is what the NSA uses when the

0:28:21.402,0:28:23.650
other authorities aren't aggressive enough

0:28:23.650,0:28:26.076
or not catching as much as they'd like.

0:28:26.076,0:28:27.481
For example:

0:28:27.481,0:28:29.225
How are they gonna see my dick?

0:28:29.225,0:28:32.029
I'm only concerned about my penis.

0:28:33.039,0:28:35.885
When you send your junk

0:28:35.885,0:28:37.764
through G-mail, for example.

0:28:37.764,0:28:40.609
That's stored on Google's servers.

0:28:40.609,0:28:43.369
Google moves data.

0:28:43.369,0:28:45.073
from datacenter to datacenter.

0:28:45.073,0:28:45.942
Invisibly to you.

0:28:45.942,0:28:47.331
Without your knowledge...

0:28:47.331,0:28:49.221
your data could be moved outside

0:28:49.221,0:28:50.820
the borders of the United States.

0:28:50.820,0:28:51.581
Oh no.

0:28:51.581,0:28:52.764
Temporarily.

0:28:52.764,0:28:56.799
When your junk was passed by G-mail

0:28:56.799,0:28:58.560
the NSA caught a copy of that.

0:28:58.560,0:28:59.918
Prism.

0:28:59.918,0:29:02.602
Prism is how they pull your junk

0:29:02.602,0:29:05.372
out of Google, with Google's involvement.

0:29:05.372,0:29:07.568
All of the different Prism partners

0:29:07.568,0:29:10.595
people like Yahoo, Facebook, Google.

0:29:10.595,0:29:13.658
The government deputizes them, to be...

0:29:13.658,0:29:16.895
sort of their little surveillance sheriff.

0:29:16.895,0:29:18.167
They're a dick-sheriff.

0:29:18.167,0:29:19.061
Correct.

0:29:19.061,0:29:20.630
Uhm, Upstream?

0:29:20.630,0:29:23.119
Upstream is how they snatch your junk

0:29:23.119,0:29:25.451
as it transits the internet.

0:29:25.451,0:29:26.389
Okay. Mystic.

0:29:26.389,0:29:27.862
If you're describing your junk

0:29:27.862,0:29:28.937
on the phone?

0:29:28.937,0:29:29.735
Yes.

0:29:29.735,0:29:31.079
But do they have the content

0:29:31.079,0:29:32.081
of that junk-call

0:29:32.081,0:29:33.740
or just the duration of it?

0:29:33.740,0:29:35.551
They have the content as well

0:29:35.551,0:29:37.136
but only for a few countries.

0:29:37.136,0:29:38.852
If you are on vacation in the Bahamas?

0:29:38.852,0:29:40.047
Yes.

0:29:40.047,0:29:42.519
Finally. And you need to remind yourself...

0:29:42.519,0:29:44.634
No, I'm just not sure...

0:29:44.634,0:29:46.358
what to do with this.

0:29:46.358,0:29:47.979
Just hold on to it.

0:29:47.979,0:29:49.414
It's a lot of responsibility.

0:29:49.414,0:29:51.281
Yeah. It is a lot of responsibility.

0:29:51.281,0:29:52.574
That's the whole point.

0:29:52.574,0:29:53.427
Should I...?

0:29:53.427,0:29:54.800
No, you should absolutely not.

0:29:54.800,0:29:55.954
And it's unbelievable

0:29:55.954,0:29:57.774
that you would do that.

0:29:57.774,0:29:59.225
Actually, it's entirely believable.

0:29:59.225,0:30:01.197
215 Meta-data?

0:30:01.197,0:30:02.266
No.

0:30:02.266,0:30:03.038
Good.

0:30:03.038,0:30:04.126
But...

0:30:04.126,0:30:05.623
Come on, Ed.

0:30:05.623,0:30:07.110
They can probably tell who you're sharing

0:30:07.110,0:30:08.820
your junk pictures with.

0:30:08.820,0:30:09.763
Because they're seeing

0:30:09.763,0:30:11.271
who you're texting with

0:30:11.271,0:30:12.308
who you're calling.

0:30:12.308,0:30:13.300
If you call

0:30:13.300,0:30:15.246
the penis enlargement centre at 3 AM

0:30:15.246,0:30:16.302
and that call lasted 90 minutes?

0:30:16.302,0:30:17.336
They would have a record

0:30:17.336,0:30:18.857
of YOUR phone-number

0:30:18.857,0:30:21.176
calling THAT phone-number.

0:30:21.176,0:30:23.601
(Which is a penis enlargement center).

0:30:23.601,0:30:25.391
They would say they don't know

0:30:25.391,0:30:26.307
it's penis enlargement center

0:30:26.307,0:30:27.232
but of course they can look it up.

0:30:27.232,0:30:29.498
Edward, if the American people

0:30:29.498,0:30:32.506
understood this...

0:30:32.506,0:30:34.541
...they would be absolutely horrified.

0:30:34.541,0:30:36.474
I guess I never thought about putting it

0:30:36.474,0:30:38.674
in the...

0:30:38.674,0:30:40.611
...in the context of your junk.

0:30:40.611,0:30:43.695
Would a good take-away from this be:

0:30:43.695,0:30:45.717
'Until such time as we've sorted

0:30:45.717,0:30:47.116
all of this out...

0:30:47.116,0:30:50.025
...don't take pictures of your dick'.

0:30:50.025,0:30:51.876
Just don't do it anymore.

0:30:51.876,0:30:54.159
No. If we do that.

0:30:54.159,0:30:56.714
Wait, hold on, you're saying 'no'?

0:30:56.714,0:30:57.104
Yeah.

0:30:57.104,0:30:58.096
You should keep

0:30:58.096,0:30:59.093
taking pictures of your dick?

0:30:59.093,0:31:01.213
Yes. You shouldn't change your behavior

0:31:01.213,0:31:02.581
because of a government agency somehwere

0:31:02.581,0:31:04.128
is doing the wrong thing.

0:31:04.128,0:31:06.513
If we sacrifice our values

0:31:06.513,0:31:08.393
because we're afraid, we don't care

0:31:08.393,0:31:09.803
about those values very much.

0:31:09.803,0:31:12.070
That is a pretty inspiring answer

0:31:12.070,0:31:13.279
to the question:

0:31:13.279,0:31:14.753
"Hey, why did you just send me

0:31:14.753,0:31:16.260
a picture of your dick?"

0:31:17.670,0:31:20.020
"Because I love America, that's why."

0:31:21.460,0:31:23.290
So there you have it, America.

0:31:23.290,0:31:24.810
All of us should now be equipped

0:31:24.810,0:31:26.767
to have this vital debate.

0:31:26.767,0:31:28.151
Because by June 1

0:31:28.151,0:31:30.192
it is imperative we have a rational

0:31:30.192,0:31:31.524
adult conversation

0:31:31.524,0:31:33.391
about whether our safety is worth

0:31:33.391,0:31:35.874
living in a country of barely regulated

0:31:35.874,0:31:38.954
government-sanctioned dick-sheriffs.

0:31:40.985,0:31:42.436
And with my work here done

0:31:42.436,0:31:44.264
there was just time to take care of

0:31:44.264,0:31:45.576
one more thing.

0:31:45.576,0:31:47.419
Finally, congratulations on Citizenfour

0:31:47.419,0:31:48.567
winning the Oscar.

0:31:48.567,0:31:50.403
I know you couldn't be at the ceremony

0:31:50.403,0:31:52.583
for obvious reasons, so...

0:31:53.844,0:31:56.314
I thought we'd celebrate ourselves.

0:31:56.314,0:31:57.314
Cheers.

0:31:57.314,0:31:59.088
Wow, that's...

0:31:59.088,0:32:00.794
...that's really, really something.

0:32:00.794,0:32:01.531
Thank you.

0:32:01.531,0:32:02.406
You're welcome.

0:32:02.406,0:32:03.809
What's the over/under on me

0:32:03.809,0:32:05.590
getting home safely?

0:32:05.590,0:32:07.013
Well, if you weren't on the list before

0:32:07.013,0:32:08.963
you are now.

0:32:11.501,0:32:13.018
Is that like, uhm...

0:32:14.148,0:32:16.086
Is that like a f... is that like a...

0:32:16.086,0:32:17.910
...joke? Or is that actually possible?

0:32:17.910,0:32:19.568
No, it's... it's a real thing.

0:32:19.568,0:32:21.790
You're associated now.

0:32:22.830,0:32:23.530
Okay.

0:32:23.530,0:32:24.916
Just to be clear, NSA:

0:32:24.916,0:32:26.397
I never met this guy

0:32:26.397,0:32:28.812
so take me off you're f*cking list.

0:32:28.812,0:32:31.554
I DO NOT want to get stuck in Russia.

0:32:31.554,0:32:34.425
I want to go home I want to go home

0:32:37.654,0:32:40.044
Now, just for the record.

0:32:40.044,0:32:41.745
Just so you know.

0:32:41.745,0:32:44.142
We got in touch with the NSA,

0:32:44.142,0:32:45.623
the National Security Council,

0:32:45.623,0:32:46.605
and the White House.

0:32:46.605,0:32:47.974
And we asked them to comment

0:32:47.974,0:32:50.080
on the dick-pick capabilities

0:32:50.080,0:32:51.954
of each of the programs Edward Snowden

0:32:51.954,0:32:52.755
just discussed.

0:32:52.755,0:32:54.623
Which -incidentally- were some very fun

0:32:54.623,0:32:57.304
emails to write to government agencies.

0:32:57.304,0:32:59.870
They didn't wish to comment on the record.

0:32:59.870,0:33:00.696
And I can see why

0:33:00.696,0:33:02.786
for every possible reason.