WEBVTT 00:00:02.849 --> 00:00:05.420 Riitta Ikonen: Meet our friend Bob. 00:00:05.444 --> 00:00:07.728 We met on a wintery night 00:00:07.752 --> 00:00:12.973 in the company of the members of the New York Indoor Gardening Society. 00:00:12.997 --> 00:00:17.157 And one of the regulars was this charismatic gentleman 00:00:17.181 --> 00:00:20.066 studying the wonders of carnivorous plants. 00:00:21.030 --> 00:00:22.251 We were there 00:00:22.275 --> 00:00:25.494 looking for collaborators for an art project 00:00:25.518 --> 00:00:29.009 looking at modern humans' belonging to nature. NOTE Paragraph 00:00:29.772 --> 00:00:33.483 Karoline Hjorth: We couldn't resist slipping a little note in Bob's pocket 00:00:33.507 --> 00:00:35.134 to say we'd love to hear from him. 00:00:35.158 --> 00:00:39.070 And the next day, he called us and excitedly proclaimed how, 00:00:39.094 --> 00:00:42.315 "This is not a time in my life when I want to lay around in bed." 00:00:42.633 --> 00:00:43.792 And the next week, 00:00:43.816 --> 00:00:47.212 we were all sitting on a J train to Forest Park in Queens. NOTE Paragraph 00:00:49.220 --> 00:00:51.149 RI: Bob has worked for decades 00:00:51.173 --> 00:00:54.228 in New York's fashion photography industry, 00:00:54.252 --> 00:00:56.776 and he had to be replaced by three people 00:00:56.800 --> 00:01:00.429 when he eventually chose to move on to new adventures. 00:01:01.350 --> 00:01:03.707 Bob agreed to collaborate with us 00:01:03.731 --> 00:01:06.934 on the condition that we wouldn't mess with the style 00:01:06.958 --> 00:01:10.316 that he had taken many decades to perfect. 00:01:10.674 --> 00:01:12.504 So we promised to do just that, 00:01:12.528 --> 00:01:15.622 and only added a few pine needles. 00:01:16.325 --> 00:01:17.951 You might be wondering 00:01:17.975 --> 00:01:22.155 why the two of us were trimming Bob's pine needle beret in the park 00:01:22.179 --> 00:01:23.699 in the first place. 00:01:24.491 --> 00:01:26.672 We met a few years prior, 00:01:26.696 --> 00:01:29.601 when I was investigating on the internet, 00:01:29.625 --> 00:01:34.712 looking for a collaborator for an art project 00:01:34.736 --> 00:01:38.767 looking at modern humans' relationship to nature. 00:01:39.093 --> 00:01:40.307 So I do what people do, 00:01:40.331 --> 00:01:43.569 I go to Google and I type in three words: 00:01:43.593 --> 00:01:44.887 "Norway," 00:01:44.911 --> 00:01:47.139 "grannies" and "photographer." 00:01:47.854 --> 00:01:50.251 And I click on the number one search result, 00:01:50.275 --> 00:01:52.180 which was Karoline Hjorth here. NOTE Paragraph 00:01:52.204 --> 00:01:53.205 (Laughter) NOTE Paragraph 00:01:53.229 --> 00:01:56.480 KH: I had just put out a book about Norwegian grandmothers. 00:01:56.946 --> 00:01:58.509 And initially, we teamed up 00:01:58.533 --> 00:02:02.314 to look at how natural phenomena were explained through human form. 00:02:02.644 --> 00:02:04.899 And we started investigating folktales 00:02:04.923 --> 00:02:07.116 in a small coastal city in Norway. NOTE Paragraph 00:02:08.538 --> 00:02:13.028 RI: We reasoned that the older the local interviewee, 00:02:13.052 --> 00:02:17.607 the closer we would be to these talking rocks of these stories. NOTE Paragraph 00:02:18.814 --> 00:02:22.831 KH: Agnes, for example, is Norway's oldest parachuting granny. 00:02:23.609 --> 00:02:25.974 Her latest jump was at 91. 00:02:26.609 --> 00:02:30.451 And this portrait is an homage to the fabled north wind 00:02:30.475 --> 00:02:33.026 often featured in Nordic folk tales. 00:02:34.141 --> 00:02:37.156 We met another fabled character called Lyktemann, 00:02:37.180 --> 00:02:39.545 on a bog just outside of Oslo. 00:02:39.927 --> 00:02:45.656 Lyktemann's presence as mysterious lights has been recorded for centuries 00:02:45.680 --> 00:02:48.910 in many different cultures under as many different names, 00:02:48.934 --> 00:02:51.236 like Joan the wad, will-o'-the-wisp, 00:02:51.260 --> 00:02:52.993 or the man of the lantern. 00:02:53.633 --> 00:02:55.333 The contemporary view 00:02:55.357 --> 00:02:57.688 or the contemporary explanation to these lights 00:02:57.712 --> 00:03:00.696 is that they are the product of ignited marsh gas. 00:03:01.650 --> 00:03:03.372 The more adventurous view 00:03:03.396 --> 00:03:06.650 is that a character appears when the fog hangs low, 00:03:06.674 --> 00:03:09.937 and there are unwary travelers about who have lost their path. NOTE Paragraph 00:03:10.675 --> 00:03:13.897 RI: He is known for being quite a mischievous character, 00:03:13.921 --> 00:03:18.048 never quite revealing the true nature of his intentions. NOTE Paragraph 00:03:18.425 --> 00:03:21.942 KH: And as Bengt is an expert in astronavigation, 00:03:21.966 --> 00:03:23.647 an ex-submarine captain, 00:03:23.671 --> 00:03:27.577 and the previous chief mate on board the tall ship Christian Radich, 00:03:27.601 --> 00:03:30.588 Bengt was the perfect personification of Lyktemann. NOTE Paragraph 00:03:31.001 --> 00:03:32.668 RI: In our initial quest 00:03:32.692 --> 00:03:36.303 of looking into the contemporary role of folklore, 00:03:36.327 --> 00:03:38.037 we were quickly pooh-poohed 00:03:38.061 --> 00:03:42.767 for looking into something seen as childish children's bedtime stories. 00:03:43.284 --> 00:03:48.234 Even saying the word "folklore" got people looking really puzzled. NOTE Paragraph 00:03:48.258 --> 00:03:50.328 KH: And it wasn't just the accent. NOTE Paragraph 00:03:50.948 --> 00:03:52.249 (Laughter) NOTE Paragraph 00:03:52.273 --> 00:03:56.498 RI: We even had an eighth-generation local potter state 00:03:56.522 --> 00:03:58.712 that people from this region 00:03:58.736 --> 00:04:02.082 have come up with some of this nation's best inventions, 00:04:02.106 --> 00:04:06.392 and they don't have time to turn rocks and wonder what is under. 00:04:07.543 --> 00:04:10.749 This rejection was exactly what we needed 00:04:10.773 --> 00:04:13.074 to keep poking further into this subject. NOTE Paragraph 00:04:13.098 --> 00:04:14.916 (Laughter) NOTE Paragraph 00:04:14.940 --> 00:04:16.765 KH: We continued to interview people 00:04:16.789 --> 00:04:19.117 about their relationship with their surroundings, 00:04:19.141 --> 00:04:20.537 and started wondering 00:04:20.561 --> 00:04:23.005 what's happening with people's imagination. 00:04:23.339 --> 00:04:28.208 Can our relationship to nature really be explained so pragmatically, 00:04:28.232 --> 00:04:29.921 so entirely boringly, 00:04:29.945 --> 00:04:33.351 so that a rock is just a good old straightforward rock, 00:04:33.375 --> 00:04:36.170 and a lake is just a basic wet place, 00:04:36.194 --> 00:04:37.927 entirely separate from us? 00:04:38.559 --> 00:04:43.598 Can our surroundings really be explained to such a dull degree of rationality? NOTE Paragraph 00:04:46.167 --> 00:04:50.437 RI: The name of our project, "Eyes as Big as Plates," 00:04:50.461 --> 00:04:52.522 is borrowed from a folk tale. 00:04:52.546 --> 00:04:55.990 And there's one with a dog that's living beneath a bridge 00:04:56.014 --> 00:04:57.187 and another version, 00:04:57.211 --> 00:04:59.413 where there is a troll doing the same thing. 00:04:59.760 --> 00:05:03.385 And this open-eyed and potentially risky approach 00:05:03.409 --> 00:05:05.647 to seeing the world around you 00:05:05.671 --> 00:05:10.306 has become an emblem of the curiosity that guides our interactions. NOTE Paragraph 00:05:11.903 --> 00:05:14.656 KH: Serendipity is our project manager. 00:05:14.680 --> 00:05:18.299 And ideally, we meet our collaborators through random chance. 00:05:18.688 --> 00:05:20.811 In the opposite lane in the swimming pool, 00:05:20.835 --> 00:05:22.426 at the choir practice, 00:05:22.450 --> 00:05:23.791 in a noodle bar, 00:05:23.815 --> 00:05:27.093 or in a Senegalese fishing harbor, 00:05:27.117 --> 00:05:28.267 as you do. 00:05:28.792 --> 00:05:31.163 Each image starts with a conversation, 00:05:31.187 --> 00:05:32.910 much like a casual interview. NOTE Paragraph 00:05:33.869 --> 00:05:36.885 RI: And we never call these collaborators "models," 00:05:36.909 --> 00:05:39.767 as there are three authors to each image, 00:05:39.791 --> 00:05:44.002 all equally crucial to the realization of their portrait. 00:05:45.799 --> 00:05:47.895 There is no age limit, 00:05:47.919 --> 00:05:51.490 absolutely anybody with an interesting lived life 00:05:51.514 --> 00:05:53.708 is more than qualified to join. NOTE Paragraph 00:05:54.292 --> 00:05:55.832 KH: This is Boubou. 00:05:55.856 --> 00:05:58.206 His son-in-law happened to be in this harbor 00:05:58.230 --> 00:06:00.680 when we came looking for locations. 00:06:00.704 --> 00:06:05.553 And one impromptu house visit and fish market shopping spree later, 00:06:05.577 --> 00:06:09.442 Boubou and his family all waded in a low tide with us. NOTE Paragraph 00:06:09.466 --> 00:06:12.783 RI: A wearable sculpture is born from the conversation 00:06:12.807 --> 00:06:14.268 with each collaborator 00:06:14.292 --> 00:06:18.156 and is made from materials found in the surroundings. 00:06:18.546 --> 00:06:23.903 About one third of Senegal's arable land is devoted to millet, 00:06:23.927 --> 00:06:26.688 an incredibly itchy to wear, 00:06:26.712 --> 00:06:31.141 nutritious and hardy staple with deep cultural roots. 00:06:31.626 --> 00:06:33.324 This is Mane, 00:06:33.348 --> 00:06:37.029 one of the grand grandmothers of the Ndos village, 00:06:37.053 --> 00:06:39.942 a tornado of vigor and energy. 00:06:39.966 --> 00:06:42.252 And she applauded to our invitation 00:06:42.276 --> 00:06:45.466 to portray her in her personal favorite crop, 00:06:45.490 --> 00:06:47.799 with which she works every day. NOTE Paragraph 00:06:49.769 --> 00:06:52.969 KH: It's important that participation is voluntary. NOTE Paragraph 00:06:53.523 --> 00:06:55.831 (Laughter) NOTE Paragraph 00:06:55.855 --> 00:06:57.776 If you have doubts in the beginning, 00:06:57.800 --> 00:06:59.602 you will definitely regret it 00:06:59.626 --> 00:07:03.577 by the time Riitta is stuffing cold, wet bull kelp up your nose. NOTE Paragraph 00:07:03.601 --> 00:07:06.604 (Laughter) NOTE Paragraph 00:07:07.063 --> 00:07:10.253 Working with an analog camera means the process can be slow 00:07:10.277 --> 00:07:11.785 and physically challenging. 00:07:12.086 --> 00:07:13.696 The person in front of the camera 00:07:13.720 --> 00:07:17.117 might be kneeling for three hours in a freezing sleet, 00:07:17.141 --> 00:07:19.177 be bombarded by mosquitoes, 00:07:19.201 --> 00:07:21.025 or actually, they can also be allergic 00:07:21.049 --> 00:07:23.247 to the local flora they've just been coated in. NOTE Paragraph 00:07:23.271 --> 00:07:24.715 RI: And many other things. NOTE Paragraph 00:07:24.739 --> 00:07:26.522 (Laughter) NOTE Paragraph 00:07:26.546 --> 00:07:29.291 And then, there's, of course, the elements. 00:07:29.315 --> 00:07:33.006 Unpredictability is one of the main drivers 00:07:33.030 --> 00:07:35.430 that keeps this process interesting. 00:07:36.268 --> 00:07:39.058 For example, in Iceland, 00:07:39.082 --> 00:07:42.717 we were in operation mode, shooting for two weeks, 00:07:42.741 --> 00:07:46.498 without knowing that the camera was not functioning properly. 00:07:46.522 --> 00:07:47.672 Ooh, right? NOTE Paragraph 00:07:48.022 --> 00:07:50.059 KH: And because we work with analog cameras 00:07:50.083 --> 00:07:51.373 with actual film rolls, 00:07:51.397 --> 00:07:53.713 the excitement from the shoots keeps giving 00:07:53.737 --> 00:07:56.019 until we pick up the negatives from the lab. NOTE Paragraph 00:07:57.662 --> 00:08:00.324 RI: Luckily, Edda, pictured here, 00:08:00.348 --> 00:08:04.278 was one of the few that was captured on film in Iceland. 00:08:04.302 --> 00:08:07.945 Pictured here amid bubbling, steaming hot springs 00:08:07.969 --> 00:08:10.521 between two tectonic plates. 00:08:11.092 --> 00:08:14.163 Supposedly, there are these little hot spring birds 00:08:14.187 --> 00:08:16.203 that dive into these bubbles, 00:08:16.227 --> 00:08:18.084 and according to the legend, 00:08:18.108 --> 00:08:21.194 these little birds represent the souls of the dead. 00:08:24.361 --> 00:08:26.131 We have the honor 00:08:26.155 --> 00:08:28.609 of working with some of the toughest 00:08:28.633 --> 00:08:31.467 and bravest and coolest people around, 00:08:31.491 --> 00:08:33.252 and thoroughly enjoy 00:08:33.276 --> 00:08:38.299 how some of our works and portraits stomp on stereotypes about age, 00:08:38.323 --> 00:08:40.003 gender and nationality. NOTE Paragraph 00:08:41.601 --> 00:08:45.275 KH: To us, much of Western society is unnecessarily confused 00:08:45.299 --> 00:08:46.919 when it comes to the usefulness 00:08:46.943 --> 00:08:49.732 of this absolutely rock-and-roll demographic. NOTE Paragraph 00:08:49.756 --> 00:08:50.906 (Laughter) NOTE Paragraph 00:08:51.966 --> 00:08:56.768 RI: Attitude, life experience and stamina are some of the main traits 00:08:56.792 --> 00:08:59.333 we have found amongst all our collaborators, 00:08:59.357 --> 00:09:04.016 as well as a formidable curiosity for new experiences. NOTE Paragraph 00:09:05.548 --> 00:09:09.807 KH: We have noticed how the solitary figures in our images 00:09:09.831 --> 00:09:14.045 are increasingly viewed as representations of the age of loneliness, 00:09:14.069 --> 00:09:15.749 known as the Eremocene. NOTE Paragraph 00:09:17.442 --> 00:09:19.981 RI: We are trying to encourage 00:09:20.005 --> 00:09:25.877 a new way of participating in and communicating with our surroundings. NOTE Paragraph 00:09:26.482 --> 00:09:27.791 KH: There is the assumption 00:09:27.815 --> 00:09:30.736 that humans have created a new geological epoch, 00:09:30.760 --> 00:09:34.150 and we need to learn how to see what our role is in it. NOTE Paragraph 00:09:36.214 --> 00:09:39.855 RI: We'll be working with farmers, 00:09:39.879 --> 00:09:44.005 cosmologists, geo-ecologists, 00:09:44.029 --> 00:09:47.688 ethnomusicologists and marine biologists 00:09:47.712 --> 00:09:53.077 to see how art can change the way we think, act and live. NOTE Paragraph 00:09:55.104 --> 00:09:58.803 KH: It's not clear who or what is the protagonist in our work, 00:09:58.827 --> 00:10:02.326 whether it's the human figure or the nature around them, 00:10:02.350 --> 00:10:03.891 and we like it that way. 00:10:06.091 --> 00:10:09.091 Ten years and 15 countries into the project, 00:10:09.115 --> 00:10:12.384 we are not sure how, if, or when this project will end. NOTE Paragraph 00:10:13.072 --> 00:10:16.556 RI: We have vowed to continue as long as it's fun, 00:10:16.580 --> 00:10:21.069 and we'll keep making new images and more books that explore -- NOTE Paragraph 00:10:21.093 --> 00:10:24.787 KH: How to balance life amongst the effects of the climate crisis. 00:10:26.386 --> 00:10:29.065 The writer Roy Scranton beautifully summarized 00:10:29.089 --> 00:10:31.155 how our project can be approached. 00:10:32.069 --> 00:10:33.642 "We need to learn to see, 00:10:33.666 --> 00:10:35.688 not just with Western eyes, 00:10:35.712 --> 00:10:39.466 but with Islamic eyes and Inuit eyes, 00:10:39.490 --> 00:10:44.065 not just with human eyes but with golden-cheeked warbler eyes, 00:10:44.089 --> 00:10:45.831 coho salmon eyes 00:10:45.855 --> 00:10:47.839 and polar bear eyes, 00:10:47.863 --> 00:10:50.260 and not even just with eyes at all, 00:10:50.284 --> 00:10:54.236 but with the wild, barely articulate being of clouds and seas 00:10:54.260 --> 00:10:57.648 and seas and rocks and trees and stars." NOTE Paragraph 00:10:59.728 --> 00:11:05.158 RI: Perhaps if we start seeing ourselves through coho salmon eyes, 00:11:05.182 --> 00:11:11.238 we might begin to synchronize better with our fellow flora, fauna and funga. 00:11:11.720 --> 00:11:16.798 To do this requires both imagination and empathy. 00:11:17.124 --> 00:11:19.846 And curiosity is at the root of both. NOTE Paragraph 00:11:20.434 --> 00:11:24.910 KH: As Halvar, one of our first collaborators, said nearly 10 years ago, 00:11:24.934 --> 00:11:26.871 "If you stop being curious, 00:11:26.895 --> 00:11:29.013 you might as well be dead." NOTE Paragraph 00:11:29.760 --> 00:11:30.929 (Both) Thank you. NOTE Paragraph 00:11:30.953 --> 00:11:32.134 (Laughter) NOTE Paragraph 00:11:32.158 --> 00:11:37.269 (Applause)