WEBVTT 00:00:00.558 --> 00:00:04.139 Chris Anderson: So our first speaker gave a TED Talk at TEDGlobal 00:00:04.163 --> 00:00:06.388 I think seven years ago. 00:00:06.412 --> 00:00:09.353 His name is Professor Uri Alon, 00:00:09.377 --> 00:00:12.034 at the Weizmann Institute of Science. 00:00:12.058 --> 00:00:16.397 Now, he and his colleagues there have come up with a powerful idea 00:00:16.421 --> 00:00:18.415 that addresses this key question: 00:00:18.439 --> 00:00:21.641 How on earth do we get back to work 00:00:21.665 --> 00:00:25.458 without creating a second surge of the infection? 00:00:26.658 --> 00:00:29.353 Uri Alon, welcome to TED. NOTE Paragraph 00:00:30.179 --> 00:00:33.652 Uri Alon: Thank you. Nice to be here again. NOTE Paragraph 00:00:33.676 --> 00:00:35.866 CA: It's great to see you again. 00:00:35.890 --> 00:00:39.596 So, I guess the key to your idea 00:00:39.620 --> 00:00:43.755 is this obsession with the reproduction number R, R-naught. 00:00:43.779 --> 00:00:46.288 If that number is less than one, 00:00:46.312 --> 00:00:49.870 then fewer than one person is infected by a typical person, 00:00:49.894 --> 00:00:53.633 and eventually, the epidemic fades away. 00:00:53.657 --> 00:00:55.928 People are worried that as we come back to work, 00:00:55.952 --> 00:00:58.885 R will shoot up above one again. 00:00:58.909 --> 00:01:01.330 You have a suggestion for how we might avoid that. 00:01:01.354 --> 00:01:03.249 What is that suggestion? NOTE Paragraph 00:01:05.115 --> 00:01:06.267 UA: Exactly. 00:01:06.291 --> 00:01:08.088 So, we are suggesting a strategy 00:01:08.112 --> 00:01:12.550 that's based on a weak spot based on the biology of the virus, 00:01:12.574 --> 00:01:15.504 which is a cycle of work and lockdown. 00:01:15.926 --> 00:01:21.026 It exploits the vulnerability of the virus in that, when a person gets infected, 00:01:21.050 --> 00:01:24.111 they're not infectious for about three days. 00:01:24.135 --> 00:01:26.592 So you don't infect others for the first three days, 00:01:26.616 --> 00:01:29.316 and after another two days, on average, you get symptoms. 00:01:30.297 --> 00:01:33.815 So we're proposing a strategy which is four days of work 00:01:33.839 --> 00:01:36.056 and then 10 days of lockdown, 00:01:36.080 --> 00:01:39.374 and the next two weeks, again: four days of work, 10 days of lockdown. 00:01:39.398 --> 00:01:42.731 And that way, if a person gets infected at work, 00:01:42.755 --> 00:01:46.409 they reach their peak infectiousness during lockdown, and that way, 00:01:46.433 --> 00:01:48.737 they avoid infecting many others. 00:01:49.374 --> 00:01:52.488 This restricts the viral transmission. 00:01:52.512 --> 00:01:55.066 Also, just working four days out of two weeks 00:01:55.090 --> 00:01:58.399 restricts the amount of time the virus gets to see many other people, 00:01:58.423 --> 00:02:00.066 and that's a very powerful effect. 00:02:00.090 --> 00:02:02.128 So everybody works on the same four days, 00:02:02.152 --> 00:02:04.336 kids go to school on the same four days, 00:02:04.360 --> 00:02:09.047 with all the measures of social distancing and masks, etc, 00:02:09.071 --> 00:02:11.115 and then there's a lockdown period. NOTE Paragraph 00:02:12.401 --> 00:02:14.893 CA: So if you take the worst-case scenario, 00:02:14.917 --> 00:02:18.479 where you come to work on a Monday morning at the start of your four days, 00:02:18.503 --> 00:02:22.155 and you're infected on the subway, say, on the way to work, 00:02:22.179 --> 00:02:25.645 the theory here is that even by the end of that four days, 00:02:25.669 --> 00:02:29.174 you're not really starting to infect your coworkers? NOTE Paragraph 00:02:30.339 --> 00:02:31.493 UA: That's correct. 00:02:31.517 --> 00:02:33.105 So you're infected on the subway, 00:02:33.129 --> 00:02:36.369 and so for the first three days or so, you're in your latent period, 00:02:36.393 --> 00:02:37.948 you don't infect your coworkers, 00:02:37.972 --> 00:02:40.733 you reach your peak infectiousness at home, 00:02:40.757 --> 00:02:43.086 there will be secondary infections at home, 00:02:43.110 --> 00:02:46.686 and people with symptoms can self-quarantine, 00:02:46.710 --> 00:02:50.383 and over the long run, you have a reproduction number less than one, 00:02:50.407 --> 00:02:53.121 so the epidemic, if you continue these cycles, 00:02:53.145 --> 00:02:55.304 will go away. NOTE Paragraph 00:02:57.420 --> 00:03:01.174 CA: I mean, is it frustrating 00:03:01.198 --> 00:03:03.298 at the thought that people are going to say, 00:03:03.322 --> 00:03:05.539 "Wait -- I don't want to infect people at home, 00:03:05.563 --> 00:03:07.779 I'd rather infect people at work than at home." 00:03:07.803 --> 00:03:09.987 What's the response to that? NOTE Paragraph 00:03:10.011 --> 00:03:11.189 UA: Yes, absolutely. 00:03:11.213 --> 00:03:13.134 So we have to consider the alternatives. 00:03:13.158 --> 00:03:15.654 If you open up the economy and there's a second wave, 00:03:15.678 --> 00:03:19.271 you'll get all those infections anyway during the lockdown that happens, 00:03:19.295 --> 00:03:22.466 along with the devastating effects on the economy, etc. 00:03:22.490 --> 00:03:24.484 And so, in the long run, 00:03:24.508 --> 00:03:26.313 if you do a cyclic strategy like this 00:03:26.337 --> 00:03:29.655 but with a reproduction number that's less than one, 00:03:29.679 --> 00:03:34.100 you avoid, at least with these mathematical models and considerations, 00:03:34.124 --> 00:03:38.087 the much larger number of infections you'd get if there's a second wave. NOTE Paragraph 00:03:38.989 --> 00:03:43.874 CA: Right. You're serving the needs of your family by -- sorry, go on. NOTE Paragraph 00:03:44.429 --> 00:03:47.800 UA: Even people who are infected don't infect everyone at home. 00:03:47.824 --> 00:03:51.743 The attack rates are 10 to 30 percent, according to several studies. NOTE Paragraph 00:03:52.869 --> 00:03:54.024 CA: Right. 00:03:54.048 --> 00:03:56.899 But the hope is that you're serving the needs of your family 00:03:56.923 --> 00:03:59.937 by engaging in a strategy where very few of your fellow workers 00:03:59.961 --> 00:04:01.847 are going to be infectious anyway, 00:04:01.871 --> 00:04:04.217 so that's the plan, but um -- NOTE Paragraph 00:04:04.241 --> 00:04:06.189 UA: That's right. NOTE Paragraph 00:04:06.832 --> 00:04:09.537 CA: Tell me this, though -- because four days out of 14, 00:04:09.561 --> 00:04:11.646 someone's going to say, "Well, great idea, 00:04:11.670 --> 00:04:15.023 but that implies, like, a 70 percent loss of productivity 00:04:15.047 --> 00:04:16.238 in the economy, 00:04:16.262 --> 00:04:18.091 so that can't possibly work." 00:04:18.115 --> 00:04:20.194 I think you think that the productivity loss 00:04:20.218 --> 00:04:22.268 need not be anything like that much. NOTE Paragraph 00:04:23.059 --> 00:04:24.313 UA: That's right, 00:04:24.337 --> 00:04:26.582 and of course, most people don't work weekends, 00:04:26.606 --> 00:04:29.396 so it's four days out of the 10 work days in the two weeks, 00:04:29.420 --> 00:04:32.516 and once you have a predictable schedule 00:04:32.540 --> 00:04:33.696 of four days at work, 00:04:33.720 --> 00:04:35.431 you can work longer hours, 00:04:35.455 --> 00:04:37.936 you can design shifts and get higher productivity 00:04:37.960 --> 00:04:39.636 by prioritizing in those four days 00:04:39.660 --> 00:04:42.482 much more than 40 percent of the workdays. NOTE Paragraph 00:04:44.119 --> 00:04:46.239 CA: Yes, so talk through how that could work. 00:04:46.263 --> 00:04:49.984 I mean, let's imagine, first of all, manufacturing, 00:04:50.008 --> 00:04:52.018 which is currently shut down. 00:04:52.042 --> 00:04:56.721 Is the implication here that a manufacturer could set up 00:04:56.745 --> 00:04:59.918 two, possibly even three, shifts of four days, 00:04:59.942 --> 00:05:04.601 maybe 35 hours or something of work over those four days 00:05:04.625 --> 00:05:09.054 and still get a lot of productivity, 00:05:09.078 --> 00:05:12.607 basically, having the lines almost running continuously that way? NOTE Paragraph 00:05:13.418 --> 00:05:14.569 UA: Exactly. 00:05:14.593 --> 00:05:18.041 So this is a staggered version of this idea, 00:05:18.065 --> 00:05:22.099 where you take the population, divide it into two groups or three groups. 00:05:22.123 --> 00:05:26.267 Let's say one group works four days and then 10 days of lockdown. 00:05:26.291 --> 00:05:28.568 Then the other group kicks in. 00:05:28.592 --> 00:05:32.173 This idea was proposed by colleagues at Bar-Ilan University. 00:05:32.197 --> 00:05:36.395 Then you get an added benefit that during workdays there's less density. 00:05:36.419 --> 00:05:37.583 If there's two groups, 00:05:37.607 --> 00:05:39.810 there's half the density and less transmission. 00:05:39.834 --> 00:05:44.611 And you can keep production lines working almost continuously like that 00:05:44.635 --> 00:05:46.477 using this staggered idea. NOTE Paragraph 00:05:49.199 --> 00:05:53.789 CA: And applying it to thinking about offices coming back -- 00:05:53.813 --> 00:05:56.523 I mean, it seems to me that, as we've already seen, 00:05:56.547 --> 00:06:00.359 there's a lot of productivity that can happen when you're at home, 00:06:00.383 --> 00:06:03.917 so you could picture on this idea of people doing one set of things 00:06:03.941 --> 00:06:06.738 during the four days when they're, say, back at the office, 00:06:06.762 --> 00:06:11.337 doing the exposure to each other, sparking off each other, 00:06:11.361 --> 00:06:14.944 the discussions, the brainstorming, all that good stuff, 00:06:14.968 --> 00:06:18.134 while at home, they're then doing all the things 00:06:18.158 --> 00:06:20.077 that we've been doing the last few weeks, 00:06:20.101 --> 00:06:22.130 kind of working solo. 00:06:22.154 --> 00:06:24.288 How much have you thought about how that, 00:06:24.312 --> 00:06:28.701 whether it's possible, effectively, to divide work into different types 00:06:28.725 --> 00:06:30.978 and actually use a strategy like this 00:06:31.002 --> 00:06:34.247 to maintain almost full or even better productivity? NOTE Paragraph 00:06:34.898 --> 00:06:38.274 UA: I agree -- for many sectors, people work at home very effectively, 00:06:38.298 --> 00:06:40.194 and we've heard from several industries 00:06:40.218 --> 00:06:43.192 that productivity actually went up during lockdown 00:06:43.216 --> 00:06:44.604 and people working at home. 00:06:44.628 --> 00:06:47.253 So if you have a schedule, a [cyclic exit strategy] 00:06:47.277 --> 00:06:48.945 you can restrict the amount, 00:06:48.969 --> 00:06:52.200 or you can plan the work where you need to be together 00:06:52.224 --> 00:06:54.235 in a very effective way 00:06:54.259 --> 00:06:56.971 with avoiding a lot of time lost, 00:06:56.995 --> 00:06:59.404 if the person's work can be more effective at home 00:06:59.428 --> 00:07:01.951 and more effective at work and get high productivity. 00:07:01.975 --> 00:07:04.593 I should say that some sectors really need to adjust, 00:07:04.617 --> 00:07:06.419 like hotels, tourism, dining. 00:07:06.443 --> 00:07:10.156 In several industries, this will require more thought and adjusting. 00:07:10.180 --> 00:07:12.951 But other industries are almost built for ideas like this. 00:07:12.975 --> 00:07:16.922 Maybe it's even something you can consider after the epidemic, 00:07:16.946 --> 00:07:19.550 because productivity can be at least as high. NOTE Paragraph 00:07:20.785 --> 00:07:25.411 CA: I mean, I read this and I started thinking about our own organization, TED, 00:07:25.435 --> 00:07:29.890 and how, in many ways, you could argue that could work really well. 00:07:29.914 --> 00:07:31.084 I mean, for one thing, 00:07:31.108 --> 00:07:33.667 there's this question about extroverts and introverts. 00:07:33.691 --> 00:07:35.497 Some introverts, if they were honest, 00:07:35.521 --> 00:07:38.865 might say that this pandemic has been manna from heaven for them. 00:07:38.889 --> 00:07:41.800 They've found work less stressful. 00:07:41.824 --> 00:07:44.483 They've been able to focus and so forth. 00:07:44.507 --> 00:07:48.617 With this sort of four days on, four days off type strategy, 00:07:48.641 --> 00:07:51.095 perhaps you can imagine a work world 00:07:51.119 --> 00:07:54.898 that's optimized for both introverts and extroverts? NOTE Paragraph 00:07:56.451 --> 00:07:57.609 UA: Absolutely. 00:07:57.633 --> 00:07:58.900 I mean, I feel it also. 00:07:58.924 --> 00:08:01.433 Me and my partner, with different personalities, 00:08:01.457 --> 00:08:02.939 we both teach in universities, 00:08:02.963 --> 00:08:04.604 and teaching through this 00:08:04.628 --> 00:08:07.460 has [helped me] become productive in certain ways. 00:08:07.986 --> 00:08:09.376 So I agree completely, 00:08:09.400 --> 00:08:13.340 and I think harnessing the creativity of people at workplaces, 00:08:13.364 --> 00:08:17.295 we're only at the beginning of what these kinds of mixtures can offer. NOTE Paragraph 00:08:18.758 --> 00:08:21.386 CA: But for people who are on the front line, 00:08:21.410 --> 00:08:26.824 again, if you're delivering goods and so forth 00:08:26.848 --> 00:08:29.007 and you can't do that virtually, 00:08:29.031 --> 00:08:30.457 is there any thought about 00:08:30.481 --> 00:08:34.166 how a four days on and then isolation strategy, 00:08:34.190 --> 00:08:36.758 how that off time could be used 00:08:36.782 --> 00:08:39.013 to nonetheless contribute to that person's work 00:08:39.037 --> 00:08:41.702 through some form of training? 00:08:41.726 --> 00:08:48.385 Or is it more just that people would work very intensely during four days, 00:08:48.409 --> 00:08:54.096 and maybe people still aren't quite earning their full pay in this scenario, 00:08:54.120 --> 00:08:56.032 but it's better than complete lockdown, 00:08:56.056 --> 00:08:59.425 and it's better than going back to work and seeing another surge? NOTE Paragraph 00:09:01.013 --> 00:09:02.164 UA: That's right. 00:09:02.188 --> 00:09:03.386 So on a society level, 00:09:03.410 --> 00:09:05.957 it's better than opening up and seeing another surge, 00:09:05.981 --> 00:09:07.825 which would require complete lockdown. 00:09:07.849 --> 00:09:09.399 For people like hospital shifts, 00:09:09.423 --> 00:09:12.817 some hospitals adopted this kind of program 00:09:12.841 --> 00:09:16.112 so we can protect shifts and avoid mixing. 00:09:16.136 --> 00:09:18.456 It also creates a lot of simplicity and clarity. 00:09:18.480 --> 00:09:20.347 So you understand when you're working, 00:09:20.371 --> 00:09:25.095 and you have some confidence because this is based on scientific modeling 00:09:25.119 --> 00:09:28.420 about the effectiveness of this plan. 00:09:28.444 --> 00:09:31.852 It's also equitable in the sense that everybody gets to go to work, 00:09:31.876 --> 00:09:34.046 not only certain sectors, 00:09:34.070 --> 00:09:35.531 it's transparent, etc. NOTE Paragraph 00:09:35.555 --> 00:09:38.463 [Cross talk] NOTE Paragraph 00:09:40.452 --> 00:09:42.948 CA: And this is something that is best implemented 00:09:42.972 --> 00:09:45.317 by individual companies? 00:09:45.341 --> 00:09:48.417 Or is it actually much better implemented a city at a time 00:09:48.441 --> 00:09:50.500 or even a nation at a time? NOTE Paragraph 00:09:51.857 --> 00:09:54.298 UA: We think it can work [in levels]. 00:09:54.322 --> 00:09:58.015 So at certain companies, it's very natural to adopt, 00:09:58.039 --> 00:09:59.914 or at hospitals, schools, etc. 00:09:59.938 --> 00:10:02.792 It can also work at the level of a town or a region, 00:10:02.816 --> 00:10:07.295 and then we would advise trying it out for something like a month, 00:10:07.319 --> 00:10:09.233 seeing whether cases rise. 00:10:09.257 --> 00:10:12.994 In that case, you can dial down the number of workdays. 00:10:13.018 --> 00:10:15.931 Or, if cases are declining quickly, you can add workdays 00:10:15.955 --> 00:10:21.046 and therefore adapt to the climate and the location where a person is. 00:10:21.070 --> 00:10:22.820 So it's quite adaptable. NOTE Paragraph 00:10:24.161 --> 00:10:27.047 CA: But by aligning work schedules with schools, for example, 00:10:27.071 --> 00:10:29.812 that suddenly allows parents to go back to work 00:10:29.836 --> 00:10:34.417 on the days that their kids are at school, and you'd have to try -- NOTE Paragraph 00:10:34.441 --> 00:10:35.603 UA: Absolutely. NOTE Paragraph 00:10:35.627 --> 00:10:38.227 CA: I mean, is the best instantiation of this 00:10:38.251 --> 00:10:41.114 that countries literally divide households 00:10:41.138 --> 00:10:45.283 into different A and B categories, or something like that, 00:10:45.307 --> 00:10:48.196 so that that kind of alignment could happen? NOTE Paragraph 00:10:49.173 --> 00:10:50.334 UA: Exactly. 00:10:50.358 --> 00:10:53.509 So you can align different households, Group A and Group B, 00:10:53.533 --> 00:10:56.328 and then the children go to school, the parents go to work 00:10:56.352 --> 00:10:57.739 in a synchronized way, 00:10:57.763 --> 00:11:01.153 and the other group, let's say, the alternating weeks. 00:11:01.177 --> 00:11:03.676 A certain amount of people need to work all the time. 00:11:03.700 --> 00:11:07.782 Maybe teachers are, like, essential workers and need to work throughout. 00:11:07.806 --> 00:11:09.627 Just like during lockdown situations, 00:11:09.651 --> 00:11:12.490 a certain fraction of the population still works throughout. 00:11:12.514 --> 00:11:15.943 But a region that does this should be protected, in a sense, 00:11:15.967 --> 00:11:18.480 because it has a replication number of less than one, 00:11:18.504 --> 00:11:22.151 so imported infections also can't spread very much. NOTE Paragraph 00:11:23.359 --> 00:11:26.645 CA: And here is the aforementioned David Biello. David. NOTE Paragraph 00:11:26.669 --> 00:11:28.533 David Biello: Yes. Hello, everybody. 00:11:28.557 --> 00:11:31.303 Uri, as you can imagine, there are lot of questions 00:11:31.327 --> 00:11:33.213 from the audience, 00:11:33.237 --> 00:11:35.058 and we have a first one 00:11:35.082 --> 00:11:39.999 kind of about those workers who have been marked as essential. 00:11:40.023 --> 00:11:45.429 Can you comment on how this would impact the health care professionals and others 00:11:45.453 --> 00:11:51.049 who may not have time or the flexibility to quarantine 00:11:51.073 --> 00:11:52.388 in the way you suggest. NOTE Paragraph 00:11:52.850 --> 00:11:54.001 UA: That's great. 00:11:54.025 --> 00:11:56.981 I want to say that there's essential workers, 00:11:57.005 --> 00:12:01.352 there's people with low income, that just can't adhere to lockdown 00:12:01.376 --> 00:12:03.053 because they have to make a living. 00:12:03.077 --> 00:12:08.722 And studies show that mobility [among] people in the low-income sectors 00:12:08.746 --> 00:12:10.254 is larger during lockdown. 00:12:10.278 --> 00:12:14.024 And also, in developing countries, people just have to go out of the house. 00:12:14.048 --> 00:12:15.567 You can't enforce lockdown. 00:12:15.591 --> 00:12:21.280 So this four-10 kind of strategy can actually make lockdown easier to bear 00:12:21.304 --> 00:12:24.668 for people who can still make a living during those days, 00:12:24.692 --> 00:12:26.884 or at least make their own choices 00:12:26.908 --> 00:12:30.337 about what fraction to work and what fraction to stay in lockdown. 00:12:30.361 --> 00:12:33.208 Some countries can't get R less than one even with lockdown, 00:12:33.232 --> 00:12:36.534 because of this adherence problem, because of informal sectors, etc. 00:12:36.558 --> 00:12:40.908 We believe that a four-10 cycle might make it easier to do lockdown 00:12:40.932 --> 00:12:44.092 and maybe get our infection level less than one. 00:12:44.116 --> 00:12:47.897 That affects billions of people in the world. 00:12:48.463 --> 00:12:50.249 I hope I answered your question. NOTE Paragraph 00:12:50.702 --> 00:12:52.109 DB: I think so, 00:12:52.133 --> 00:12:55.181 and we have another question, I believe, 00:12:55.205 --> 00:12:58.197 if that can be queued up, 00:12:58.221 --> 00:12:59.505 which is: 00:13:00.403 --> 00:13:02.281 Any chance you can do the math 00:13:02.305 --> 00:13:07.428 and quantify the increased risk of this four-10 cycle? NOTE Paragraph 00:13:08.503 --> 00:13:11.894 UA: So the increased risk, we're saying in our scientific paper, 00:13:11.918 --> 00:13:14.908 we did all the sensitivity analyses, etc, 00:13:14.932 --> 00:13:18.852 and the question is, it's comparing increased risk comparing to what? 00:13:18.876 --> 00:13:20.691 So, to the economy ... 00:13:21.202 --> 00:13:23.400 It's possible there will be a second wave. 00:13:23.424 --> 00:13:26.273 I mean, I hope there won't be, but it certainly is possible, 00:13:26.297 --> 00:13:30.832 and in that case, it's clear that a second wave and another lockdown 00:13:30.856 --> 00:13:35.492 will have worse consequences on health 00:13:35.516 --> 00:13:38.867 than a cycle of four-10. 00:13:38.891 --> 00:13:44.268 And so it's really a question of what you're comparing to. NOTE Paragraph 00:13:45.858 --> 00:13:47.542 DB: Sure. 00:13:47.566 --> 00:13:51.199 Well, thank you so much for sharing this idea, Uri. NOTE Paragraph 00:13:53.170 --> 00:13:55.505 CA: Indeed. 00:13:55.529 --> 00:13:56.680 David, stay on. 00:13:56.704 --> 00:13:58.235 But just before you go: 00:13:58.259 --> 00:14:03.128 Have any governments expressed interest in exploring this? 00:14:03.152 --> 00:14:06.052 Do you see people considering actually implementing this 00:14:06.076 --> 00:14:07.910 as national policy? NOTE Paragraph 00:14:08.963 --> 00:14:12.994 UA: Yes, we're in touch with several European countries 00:14:13.018 --> 00:14:16.703 and countries in South America and Israel, of course. 00:14:16.727 --> 00:14:20.812 Austria has adopted a similar program for their school system, 00:14:21.875 --> 00:14:26.560 which is five school days every two weeks. 00:14:26.584 --> 00:14:32.193 And several companies and hospitals, etc. 00:14:32.217 --> 00:14:36.664 And so we're very interested to see how this will play out. NOTE Paragraph 00:14:38.229 --> 00:14:40.792 CA: Well, I love the basic start point 00:14:40.816 --> 00:14:44.209 of starting by looking at the enemy's weakness. 00:14:44.233 --> 00:14:47.300 And you've got this four-day period 00:14:47.324 --> 00:14:53.069 where it's not necessarily that dangerous after an infection, 00:14:53.093 --> 00:14:55.811 if you could figure out a way to work then. 00:14:55.835 --> 00:15:00.270 I assume that testing would actually enhance this idea as well a lot, right? 00:15:00.294 --> 00:15:02.168 To test people before they come back -- NOTE Paragraph 00:15:02.192 --> 00:15:03.899 UA: It's not predicated on testing. 00:15:03.923 --> 00:15:06.091 You don't have to have testing for this idea, 00:15:06.115 --> 00:15:08.647 so that can apply to regions without a lot of testing. 00:15:08.671 --> 00:15:12.317 If you do have testing, it could help you use testing in a more effective way 00:15:12.341 --> 00:15:15.753 by concentrating testing on people at the end of their 10 lockdown days, 00:15:15.777 --> 00:15:17.503 just as they're about to go to work; 00:15:17.527 --> 00:15:19.396 that could make each test more impactful 00:15:19.420 --> 00:15:21.646 in terms of reducing their reproduction number. NOTE Paragraph 00:15:21.670 --> 00:15:24.542 CA: Indeed, instead of having to test the whole population 00:15:24.566 --> 00:15:25.883 every three or four days, 00:15:25.907 --> 00:15:27.435 it's just once every two weeks. 00:15:27.459 --> 00:15:30.283 That's a much more imaginable goal. NOTE Paragraph 00:15:31.218 --> 00:15:32.643 UA: Sure. NOTE Paragraph 00:15:32.667 --> 00:15:33.913 CA: Yeah. 00:15:33.937 --> 00:15:37.015 Well, Uri Alon, thank you so much for spending this time.