1
00:00:16,119 --> 00:00:18,520
MIKE KELLEY: Right now I'm working
on about the 30th tape

2
00:00:18,520 --> 00:00:21,595
in a projected series of 365.

3
00:00:22,480 --> 00:00:26,242
And so it's supposed to be one
tape for every day of the year.

4
00:00:26,242 --> 00:00:44,093
[ rhythmic drumming and clapping ]

5
00:00:44,093 --> 00:00:50,315
[ women squeal ]

6
00:00:50,315 --> 00:00:58,635
[ rhythmic drumming and clapping ]

7
00:00:58,635 --> 00:01:01,120
I... I knew by the time
I was a teenager

8
00:01:01,120 --> 00:01:03,047
that I was going
to be an artist.

9
00:01:03,460 --> 00:01:04,880
There was no doubt about that.

10
00:01:04,880 --> 00:01:06,771
There was nothing else
for me to be.

11
00:01:07,440 --> 00:01:10,591
I think coming out
of Catholicism,

12
00:01:11,339 --> 00:01:13,520
I have a real interest
in ritual.

13
00:01:13,520 --> 00:01:15,406
I mean, ritual is beautiful,

14
00:01:15,623 --> 00:01:18,759
but I never was a believer.

15
00:01:25,900 --> 00:01:26,932
Yet...

16
00:01:26,932 --> 00:01:30,000
I think my interest in art
all along has been

17
00:01:30,000 --> 00:01:33,130
in trying to develop a kind
of materialist ritual.

18
00:01:33,640 --> 00:01:37,018
And I see all art as being
a kind of materialist ritual.

19
00:01:45,320 --> 00:01:47,640
When I first started working
with stuffed animals,

20
00:01:47,640 --> 00:01:50,480
I was responding to the... a lot
of the dialogue in the '80s

21
00:01:50,480 --> 00:01:52,562
about commodity culture.

22
00:01:55,120 --> 00:01:56,880
But I was really surprised

23
00:01:56,880 --> 00:01:59,280
that when everybody looked
at these works I made,

24
00:01:59,280 --> 00:02:01,786
they all thought
it was about child abuse.

25
00:02:02,120 --> 00:02:04,485
Now, that wasn't anything
I expected

26
00:02:04,760 --> 00:02:06,920
and not only did they think
it was about child abuse,

27
00:02:06,920 --> 00:02:09,150
they thought it was
about my abuse.

28
00:02:10,960 --> 00:02:12,800
So I said, well,
that's really interesting.

29
00:02:12,800 --> 00:02:14,473
I have to go with that.

30
00:02:15,240 --> 00:02:18,584
I have to make all my work
about my abuse,

31
00:02:20,040 --> 00:02:23,520
and not only that--
about everybody's abuse,

32
00:02:23,520 --> 00:02:26,279
like that this
is our shared culture.

33
00:02:30,520 --> 00:02:32,174
This is the presumption

34
00:02:32,430 --> 00:02:37,584
that all motivation is based on some kind
of repressed trauma.

35
00:02:39,000 --> 00:02:40,880
My work is very reactive.

36
00:02:40,880 --> 00:02:42,186
I'd make something,

37
00:02:42,560 --> 00:02:44,520
I get a response
that I'm not...

38
00:02:44,520 --> 00:02:46,760
I... I had no idea
I was going to get--

39
00:02:46,760 --> 00:02:49,360
I don't reject it; I embrace it.

40
00:02:49,360 --> 00:02:50,909
I run with it,

41
00:02:51,184 --> 00:02:53,689
you know. That tells me what to do.

42
00:02:54,220 --> 00:02:57,440
I decided to go back
to my originating trauma,

43
00:02:57,440 --> 00:02:59,080
which was my student training,

44
00:02:59,080 --> 00:03:01,703
and so I took all these drawings

45
00:03:01,959 --> 00:03:05,744
that I did in college
as an undergraduate

46
00:03:05,960 --> 00:03:07,520
which are perversions

47
00:03:07,520 --> 00:03:10,868
of Hoffmanesque
compositional principles,

48
00:03:11,320 --> 00:03:14,119
and I relearned
to paint that way.

49
00:03:20,080 --> 00:03:21,120
And I did this series.

50
00:03:21,120 --> 00:03:23,160
This is the first series
of paintings I did

51
00:03:23,160 --> 00:03:25,260
in this regressive manner.

52
00:03:26,480 --> 00:03:28,646
They're called
"The Thirteen Seasons."

53
00:03:29,000 --> 00:03:31,120
They're oval-- I broke
from the rectangular form

54
00:03:31,120 --> 00:03:33,707
because the oval, again,
has no end.

55
00:03:34,159 --> 00:03:35,720
And so it's eternal.

56
00:03:35,720 --> 00:03:38,694
It's eternally recurring abuse.

57
00:03:43,160 --> 00:03:45,280
In this kind
of trauma literature,

58
00:03:45,280 --> 00:03:48,360
the parts you can't remember
is called "missing time"

59
00:03:48,360 --> 00:03:49,882
and then you recover it.

60
00:03:53,600 --> 00:03:58,236
Because I work so much
with various kinds of tropes--

61
00:03:58,236 --> 00:04:00,040
and they're image tropes
or music tropes

62
00:04:00,040 --> 00:04:01,860
or performative tropes--

63
00:04:03,080 --> 00:04:04,600
it interests me to try

64
00:04:04,600 --> 00:04:07,196
to bring them into my system

65
00:04:07,511 --> 00:04:11,222
in certain ways, you know, 
incorporate them.

66
00:04:12,520 --> 00:04:16,121
It's part of this whole process
of working through things.

67
00:04:21,000 --> 00:04:24,140
Things start simple
and get more complex.

68
00:04:26,560 --> 00:04:29,799
Sense always comes
after the fact in my work--

69
00:04:31,000 --> 00:04:33,600
to make it, at first glance,
acceptable,

70
00:04:33,600 --> 00:04:36,598
like I've seen some of that
before or I understand that.

71
00:04:37,582 --> 00:04:40,320
So it has to operate
on multiple levels.

72
00:04:40,320 --> 00:04:42,520
It has to be available

73
00:04:42,520 --> 00:04:45,829
to the laziest viewer
on a certain level...

74
00:04:48,327 --> 00:04:52,420
and then on a more sophisticated
viewer as well.

75
00:05:00,081 --> 00:05:02,491
I think what I make
is beautiful.

76
00:05:03,121 --> 00:05:06,080
I think it's beautiful,
because terms are confused

77
00:05:06,080 --> 00:05:08,997
and divisions between categories
start to slip.

78
00:05:10,040 --> 00:05:13,680
And that produces, um... what
I think is a sublime effect,

79
00:05:13,680 --> 00:05:15,618
or it produces humor,

80
00:05:16,051 --> 00:05:18,262
and both things interest me.

81
00:05:19,226 --> 00:05:21,707
And I... I...

82
00:05:21,707 --> 00:05:26,026
I guess I'm interested in a kind of 
sublime play or sublime humor.

83
00:05:26,026 --> 00:05:30,280
—Well, behind... behind...
behind the mule is a man

84
00:05:30,280 --> 00:05:32,662
and then the fake horse.

85
00:05:32,662 --> 00:05:34,045
—Oh, that's better.

86
00:05:34,320 --> 00:05:35,520
That's even better.
—Yeah.

87
00:05:35,520 --> 00:05:37,960
You got a man in there to fill
up the gap-- that's better.

88
00:05:37,960 --> 00:05:39,908
—The man is
the pitchfork demon?

89
00:05:39,908 --> 00:05:40,878
KELLEY: 
It's the pitchfork guy.

90
00:05:40,878 --> 00:05:42,464
—Stan? It's Stan,
if you could get him.

91
00:05:42,464 --> 00:05:43,040
—Yeah.

92
00:05:43,040 --> 00:05:45,440
—And tell him not to swing
his pitchfork around.

93
00:05:45,440 --> 00:05:46,600
—Yeah, do something
like that.

94
00:05:46,600 --> 00:05:48,668
Stomp, stomp, stomp.
—Come on in.

95
00:05:48,668 --> 00:05:50,740
[ whinnies ]
And then go.

96
00:05:51,133 --> 00:05:52,160
KELLEY:
"Day is Done"-- the project

97
00:05:52,160 --> 00:05:53,734
I'm working on right now--

98
00:05:53,960 --> 00:05:55,520
is kind of built around a mythos

99
00:05:55,520 --> 00:05:57,560
that relates to
an earlier sculpture I did

100
00:05:57,560 --> 00:05:59,790
called "The Educational Complex," which is

101
00:06:00,597 --> 00:06:03,520
a model of every school
I ever went to

102
00:06:03,520 --> 00:06:05,296
plus the home I grew up in,

103
00:06:06,280 --> 00:06:09,037
with all the parts
I can't remember left blank.

104
00:06:13,680 --> 00:06:14,880
—I think I want to try it

105
00:06:14,880 --> 00:06:17,240
when these cheerleaders
get to about here,

106
00:06:17,240 --> 00:06:21,760
to give me a big scream,
you know like, "Whoa!"

107
00:06:21,760 --> 00:06:24,480
Like that's the most wonderful
thing you've ever seen.

108
00:06:24,480 --> 00:06:26,129
—The audience should do a big scream?
—Yeah.

109
00:06:26,129 --> 00:06:27,520
—Should they raise
their arms like that?

110
00:06:27,520 --> 00:06:29,160
—No, no, just... just...
well, let me...

111
00:06:29,160 --> 00:06:29,960
I don't know, let me see it.

112
00:06:29,960 --> 00:06:31,429
Let's hear a big "Wha!"

113
00:06:31,429 --> 00:06:33,844
ALL:
Whoo!

114
00:06:33,844 --> 00:06:34,600
—Yeah, arms is good.

115
00:06:34,600 --> 00:06:36,202
Lift the arms up. Whoa!

116
00:06:36,202 --> 00:06:38,493
ALL:
Whoa!

117
00:06:38,493 --> 00:06:40,545
[ drum cadence playing ]

118
00:06:40,545 --> 00:06:41,544
—Action.
—Action.

119
00:06:41,544 --> 00:06:44,633
[ drum cadence playing ]

120
00:06:44,633 --> 00:06:45,560
KELLEY:
All these

121
00:06:45,560 --> 00:06:48,662
videos are based
on high school yearbooks.

122
00:06:48,918 --> 00:06:50,440
It's not because
I have any interest

123
00:06:50,440 --> 00:06:52,440
in high school
or high school culture,

124
00:06:52,440 --> 00:06:53,760
but it's one of the few places

125
00:06:53,760 --> 00:06:57,120
where you can find photographs
of these kinds of rituals.

126
00:06:57,710 --> 00:06:58,234
—WOMAN:Cut.

127
00:06:58,234 --> 00:06:59,714
Stand this way
a little bit.

128
00:07:00,302 --> 00:07:02,560
Yeah, let's go for it.

129
00:07:02,560 --> 00:07:03,200
MAN:
Okay.

130
00:07:03,200 --> 00:07:04,723
It's really close.

131
00:07:04,723 --> 00:07:05,843
It won't be the same.

132
00:07:05,942 --> 00:07:06,980
Okay, it's fine.

133
00:07:06,980 --> 00:07:08,360
The... the image is the same.

134
00:07:08,360 --> 00:07:09,420
MAN:
The image is...

135
00:07:09,833 --> 00:07:10,640
KELLEY:
The relationships

136
00:07:10,640 --> 00:07:11,800
are the same.

137
00:07:13,000 --> 00:07:15,104
Almost all of this comes
from writing,

138
00:07:15,360 --> 00:07:16,391
and...

139
00:07:16,391 --> 00:07:18,831
and then later
I tried to say, well,

140
00:07:18,831 --> 00:07:21,598
how can it be
visually interesting?

141
00:07:21,598 --> 00:07:25,625
It has narrative elements, but it's... it's not
straight narrative.

142
00:07:29,697 --> 00:07:30,268
KELLEY:Cut.

143
00:07:30,268 --> 00:07:32,182
[ laughs ]

144
00:07:33,855 --> 00:07:34,983
WOMAN:
Good job, Stan.

145
00:07:37,560 --> 00:07:39,680
All the writing is...
is associative,

146
00:07:39,680 --> 00:07:42,094
and it comes
from my own experience, but

147
00:07:42,842 --> 00:07:45,480
it's very hard to,
say, to disentangle memories

148
00:07:45,480 --> 00:07:52,758
of films or books or cartoons
or plays from "real experience."

149
00:07:52,758 --> 00:07:54,880
It all gets mixed up.

150
00:07:54,880 --> 00:07:57,960
So in a way I don't make
such distinctions.

151
00:07:57,960 --> 00:08:00,287
And I see it all
as a kind of fiction.

152
00:08:00,680 --> 00:08:03,120
—I can't walk by myself.

153
00:08:03,120 --> 00:08:04,780
I'm not responsible.

154
00:08:05,685 --> 00:08:06,800
KELLEY:
When I was younger,

155
00:08:06,800 --> 00:08:10,302
all my writing was generated
for performance work.

156
00:08:10,302 --> 00:08:17,840
—I'm the sailor, but I don't have
sea legs, sea legs.

157
00:08:17,840 --> 00:08:22,598
But I don't walk
and I don't talk.

158
00:08:24,073 --> 00:08:26,935
[ whistles ]

159
00:08:26,935 --> 00:08:29,760
So this project is
very much a way for me

160
00:08:29,760 --> 00:08:32,480
to get back into writing and--

161
00:08:32,480 --> 00:08:33,840
because I don't have the time
just to do it.

162
00:08:33,840 --> 00:08:36,440
I have to work it
into my work somehow.

163
00:08:36,440 --> 00:08:37,760
It's like music.

164
00:08:37,760 --> 00:08:39,280
I didn't have time
to play music anymore,

165
00:08:39,280 --> 00:08:41,040
so I had to make a project
where I had...

166
00:08:41,040 --> 00:08:45,101
that had to have music in it, so
I forced myself to make music.

167
00:08:45,101 --> 00:08:54,453
[ Kelley playing eerie melody
on electric organ ]

168
00:08:54,453 --> 00:08:56,221
KELLEY:
Never had any musical training.

169
00:08:57,382 --> 00:08:59,765
I grew up in a household where there was really

170
00:09:00,709 --> 00:09:02,830
very little interest in music, and

171
00:09:03,007 --> 00:09:05,568
they didn't teach music
in school.

172
00:09:05,962 --> 00:09:08,399
And, uh... I

173
00:09:08,399 --> 00:09:10,610
grew up on rock and 
roll music, and all

174
00:09:10,905 --> 00:09:12,673
the musicians I knew
were self-taught.

175
00:09:14,160 --> 00:09:17,107
I've been playing noise music
for many, many years.

176
00:09:17,737 --> 00:09:19,280
But this project's
really different

177
00:09:19,280 --> 00:09:21,440
because this is like
no other music I've ever done,

178
00:09:21,440 --> 00:09:23,321
because it's all based
on really,

179
00:09:23,321 --> 00:09:25,591
uh... typical forms, but

180
00:09:26,201 --> 00:09:29,469
I know enough about that
where I can fake it.

181
00:09:29,685 --> 00:09:32,880
And, I mean, I don't know what I'm doing. 
Say, I can't say, oh, that's this chord

182
00:09:32,880 --> 00:09:35,683
or that's this note,
but I know what it sounds like.

183
00:09:35,683 --> 00:09:38,280
And so we can piece it
all together

184
00:09:38,280 --> 00:09:39,745
and it's believable.

185
00:09:41,279 --> 00:09:43,128
—Am I going to hear
the, uh...

186
00:09:43,738 --> 00:09:44,764
the...

187
00:09:44,764 --> 00:09:46,832
orchestra sample too?

188
00:09:46,832 --> 00:09:47,560
—MAN: Uh, yeah, you'll hear,

189
00:09:47,560 --> 00:09:48,702
you'll hear
what you just did.

190
00:09:48,702 --> 00:09:49,357
—Okay.

191
00:09:49,357 --> 00:09:50,000
—Here we go.

192
00:09:51,919 --> 00:09:53,367
KELLEY:
With the computer,

193
00:09:53,760 --> 00:09:55,440
we can do everything ourself.

194
00:09:55,440 --> 00:09:57,440
We don't need to get
an orchestra;

195
00:09:57,440 --> 00:09:58,392
we can...

196
00:09:58,884 --> 00:10:03,988
do all the editing here. 
We can make films by ourselves.

197
00:10:10,200 --> 00:10:14,723
[ cymbals resonating ]

198
00:10:14,723 --> 00:10:19,778
[ drum cadence playing ]

199
00:10:19,778 --> 00:10:22,236
ALL:
Whoo!

200
00:10:22,236 --> 00:10:27,902
[ drum cadence playing ]

201
00:10:27,902 --> 00:10:30,487
KELLEY:
My dream is to perform it live.

202
00:10:32,138 --> 00:10:35,160
MAN:
Let the final procession begin.

203
00:10:35,927 --> 00:10:36,680
KELLEY:
So that

204
00:10:36,680 --> 00:10:37,840
the whole thing
is performed

205
00:10:37,840 --> 00:10:40,246
like, say, in a 24-hour period,

206
00:10:40,246 --> 00:10:43,218
so the day stands for the year.

207
00:10:43,218 --> 00:10:48,502
[ drum cadence continues ]

208
00:10:48,502 --> 00:10:51,015
It's very much
like a passion play.

209
00:10:51,015 --> 00:10:55,682
Though a somewhat formalized
and ridiculous passion play, though its

210
00:10:55,682 --> 00:10:57,978
its ridiculousness
is purposeful.

211
00:11:00,163 --> 00:11:04,593
CAST ( harmonizing ):
♪ Mary...♪ ♪ Mary...♪

212
00:11:04,593 --> 00:11:10,339
♪ Mary...♪

213
00:11:10,339 --> 00:11:14,812
♪ Mary...♪

214
00:11:14,812 --> 00:11:20,479
♪ Mary...♪

215
00:11:20,479 --> 00:11:25,118
♪ Mary...♪

216
00:11:25,118 --> 00:11:30,403
♪ Mary...♪

217
00:11:30,529 --> 00:11:32,680
KELLEY:
I think that's

218
00:11:32,680 --> 00:11:34,841
the joyfulness of it.

219
00:11:37,320 --> 00:11:40,760
But then it's a black humor;
it's a mean humor,

220
00:11:40,760 --> 00:11:42,875
so it's a critical joy.

221
00:11:43,702 --> 00:11:45,207
It's, you know...

222
00:11:45,207 --> 00:11:46,886
it's negative joy.

223
00:11:46,886 --> 00:11:49,640
[ laughs ]

224
00:11:49,640 --> 00:11:53,120
But that's art, I think,
you know, for me at least.

225
00:11:53,120 --> 00:11:54,240
That's what separates it

226
00:11:54,240 --> 00:11:56,714
from the folk art
that I'm going to--that

227
00:11:57,088 --> 00:11:59,240
I still think
the social function of art

228
00:11:59,240 --> 00:12:00,300
is that kind of...

229
00:12:01,303 --> 00:12:02,749
negative aesthetic.

230
00:12:03,497 --> 00:12:06,578
Otherwise there's
no social function for it.

231
00:12:06,578 --> 00:12:10,392
[ women squealing ]

232
00:12:21,448 --> 00:12:26,939
[ upbeat jazzy music playing ]