1 00:00:09,563 --> 00:00:11,500 In Atalanta, Georgia, 2 00:00:11,500 --> 00:00:15,250 one particular case was about to astonish experts 3 00:00:15,250 --> 00:00:16,632 and doctors. 4 00:00:19,417 --> 00:00:21,545 Dr. Michael Sabom, cardiologist, 5 00:00:21,545 --> 00:00:24,329 was also studying near death experiences 6 00:00:24,329 --> 00:00:27,916 when he came across one extraordinary account. 7 00:00:27,916 --> 00:00:30,328 8 00:00:30,328 --> 00:00:32,960 >> Pam's case is unique in the fact 9 00:00:32,960 --> 00:00:35,191 that she had her near death experience at a time 10 00:00:35,191 --> 00:00:37,853 she was fully instrumented and under 11 00:00:37,853 --> 00:00:39,545 medical observation. 12 00:00:39,545 --> 00:00:42,449 And I think if you wanted to construct 13 00:00:42,449 --> 00:00:44,639 a laboratory experiment 14 00:00:44,639 --> 00:00:46,899 where you had someone and took them 15 00:00:46,899 --> 00:00:50,797 as close to death or perhaps even into death 16 00:00:50,797 --> 00:00:53,159 as possible and then bring them back 17 00:00:53,159 --> 00:00:55,781 and ask them what they could recall, 18 00:00:55,781 --> 00:00:57,985 Pam's case probably comes closest to that 19 00:00:57,985 --> 00:01:00,568 than any other so far that we know of. 20 00:01:00,568 --> 00:01:05,199 21 00:01:05,199 --> 00:01:06,814 >> Pam Reynolds was an established 22 00:01:06,814 --> 00:01:10,312 songwriter/singer and a busy working mother. 23 00:01:10,928 --> 00:01:14,322 In 1991, she became seriously ill. 24 00:01:16,553 --> 00:01:19,532 >> I began to experience extreme dizziness, 25 00:01:19,532 --> 00:01:21,376 loss of speech, 26 00:01:21,376 --> 00:01:24,391 some difficulty in moving the body 27 00:01:24,391 --> 00:01:26,911 and it was at that point that my physician 28 00:01:26,911 --> 00:01:29,245 recommended that I have a CT scan. 29 00:01:29,968 --> 00:01:33,518 And a CT scan of course showed the aneurysm 30 00:01:33,518 --> 00:01:34,908 and it was a big one. 31 00:01:34,908 --> 00:01:36,771 It was a giant aneurysm. 32 00:01:37,310 --> 00:01:39,447 I was referred to a neurologist 33 00:01:39,447 --> 00:01:41,214 and the neurologist gave me little or 34 00:01:41,214 --> 00:01:43,950 no chance of survival at all. 35 00:01:46,412 --> 00:01:48,878 >> But for Pam, there was one last hope. 36 00:01:49,632 --> 00:01:51,353 She made what she assumed would be 37 00:01:51,353 --> 00:01:52,743 her last journey, 38 00:01:52,743 --> 00:01:55,491 2000 miles to the Barrow Neurological Institute 39 00:01:55,491 --> 00:01:57,258 in Phoenix, Arizona. 40 00:01:57,258 --> 00:02:00,217 41 00:02:00,217 --> 00:02:02,246 >> I remember the bright sunshine. 42 00:02:02,799 --> 00:02:05,866 The light in Phoenix, Arizona is piercing, 43 00:02:05,866 --> 00:02:07,761 from sun up on. 44 00:02:08,361 --> 00:02:11,212 And I remember getting into the shower. 45 00:02:11,212 --> 00:02:13,134 I had been given a scrub kit 46 00:02:13,134 --> 00:02:16,675 with a hard bristle brush and antibacterial solution 47 00:02:16,675 --> 00:02:20,521 to reduce the chances of infection, I'm sure. 48 00:02:20,521 --> 00:02:23,660 To this day I can remember the stinging 49 00:02:23,660 --> 00:02:27,803 of that brush and that solution on my skin. 50 00:02:27,803 --> 00:02:30,708 I can remember being placed on a gurney. 51 00:02:30,708 --> 00:02:32,941 I remember the squeaking of the wheels. 52 00:02:32,941 --> 00:02:36,197 53 00:02:36,197 --> 00:02:38,826 >> Neurosurgeon, Dr. Robert Spetzler, 54 00:02:38,826 --> 00:02:42,622 decided to take on Pam's case against all odds. 55 00:02:42,622 --> 00:02:47,599 56 00:02:47,599 --> 00:02:49,438 >> What we're looking at is the aneurysm 57 00:02:49,438 --> 00:02:52,300 that she had which is at the very base of the brain. 58 00:02:52,300 --> 00:02:54,408 This is the balloon that can burst 59 00:02:54,408 --> 00:02:57,085 and cause this incredible catastrophe 60 00:02:57,085 --> 00:02:59,242 in the patient's brain. 61 00:02:59,242 --> 00:03:01,915 Why is this so difficult in this particular case? 62 00:03:02,085 --> 00:03:05,534 I think probably easiest to see here by, 63 00:03:05,534 --> 00:03:09,329 when you look at this plastic model of the head, 64 00:03:10,299 --> 00:03:13,800 and we turn it around and we take out the top 65 00:03:13,800 --> 00:03:15,106 of the brain. 66 00:03:15,106 --> 00:03:16,033 67 00:03:16,033 --> 00:03:19,067 What we're really talking about is that aneurysm 68 00:03:19,067 --> 00:03:22,172 is all the way at the very base of the brain 69 00:03:22,172 --> 00:03:24,617 and that is why it is so incredibly difficult 70 00:03:24,617 --> 00:03:25,825 to get there. 71 00:03:25,825 --> 00:03:27,943 So, you have to go somehow through the skull, 72 00:03:27,943 --> 00:03:29,402 because remember the face is here 73 00:03:29,402 --> 00:03:30,785 and the neck is down here, 74 00:03:30,785 --> 00:03:33,375 to get down to this very difficult spot. 75 00:03:33,375 --> 00:03:36,665 When we look at it on an actual brain, 76 00:03:37,403 --> 00:03:41,428 we can actually see where that is. 77 00:03:41,997 --> 00:03:43,801 That's the bottom of brain. 78 00:03:43,801 --> 00:03:47,721 If that fit in here, it would be like this. 79 00:03:47,721 --> 00:03:49,920 So, we're going to turn both of them around. 80 00:03:49,920 --> 00:03:51,454 And now we're looking at what's called, 81 00:03:51,454 --> 00:03:53,773 the brain stem which is this function. 82 00:03:53,773 --> 00:03:56,218 All the function of the brain passes through 83 00:03:56,218 --> 00:03:57,584 the brain stem. 84 00:03:57,584 --> 00:04:00,229 And where this particular aneurysm was 85 00:04:00,229 --> 00:04:03,467 is sitting right smack dab at the very middle 86 00:04:03,467 --> 00:04:05,020 at the base of the brain. 87 00:04:05,020 --> 00:04:07,381 And that's why it's so difficult to access, 88 00:04:07,381 --> 00:04:09,216 that's why it's so difficult to treat, 89 00:04:09,216 --> 00:04:12,339 and that's why it's so catastrophic when it bleeds. 90 00:04:12,339 --> 00:04:15,470 91 00:04:15,470 --> 00:04:17,889 >> The operation Pam was about to undergo 92 00:04:17,889 --> 00:04:20,505 was known as, Operation Stand Still. 93 00:04:20,505 --> 00:04:22,742 94 00:04:22,742 --> 00:04:24,804 Pam's body temperature would be lowered 95 00:04:24,804 --> 00:04:28,520 to between ten and fifteen degrees centigrade, 96 00:04:28,520 --> 00:04:30,379 her heart and breathing stopped, 97 00:04:30,379 --> 00:04:32,191 her brainwaves flattened, 98 00:04:32,191 --> 00:04:35,166 and the blood drained from her head. 99 00:04:35,166 --> 00:04:37,120 She would be clinically dead for a whole hour 100 00:04:37,120 --> 00:04:38,321 of the operation. 101 00:04:38,321 --> 00:04:40,300 102 00:04:40,300 --> 00:04:43,053 >> What we want to do is we want to bring that brain 103 00:04:43,053 --> 00:04:44,269 to a halt. 104 00:04:44,269 --> 00:04:46,550 We don't just want the brain to be asleep, 105 00:04:46,550 --> 00:04:49,644 we want the metabolic activity of the brain to stop. 106 00:04:49,644 --> 00:04:54,830 Every measurable output that the body puts out, 107 00:04:54,830 --> 00:04:57,340 really disappears completely. 108 00:04:57,340 --> 00:04:59,709 So, that you have no measurable 109 00:04:59,709 --> 00:05:02,217 neuronal activity whatsoever. 110 00:05:02,985 --> 00:05:05,669 Prior to the operation starting, 111 00:05:05,669 --> 00:05:07,217 a lot of activity goes on. 112 00:05:07,217 --> 00:05:09,586 The patient is put to sleep. 113 00:05:10,293 --> 00:05:11,950 The eyes are taped shut. 114 00:05:11,950 --> 00:05:15,364 there are little clicking devices put in each ear 115 00:05:15,364 --> 00:05:17,943 in order to monitor the brain. 116 00:05:18,296 --> 00:05:19,996 The patient is then completely covered. 117 00:05:19,996 --> 00:05:21,766 The only thing that's really exposed 118 00:05:21,766 --> 00:05:24,777 is the area of the head where we work. 119 00:05:25,839 --> 00:05:28,569 >> I don't remember an operating room. 120 00:05:28,569 --> 00:05:31,955 I don't remember seeing Dr. Spetzler at all. 121 00:05:31,955 --> 00:05:33,920 I was with a fellow, 122 00:05:33,920 --> 00:05:38,171 one of his fellows was with me at that time. 123 00:05:40,339 --> 00:05:42,523 After that, nothing. 124 00:05:43,477 --> 00:05:45,159 Absolutely nothing. 125 00:05:46,483 --> 00:05:47,830 Until the sound. 126 00:05:48,691 --> 00:05:50,785 [bone saw whirring] 127 00:05:50,785 --> 00:05:53,076 128 00:05:53,076 --> 00:05:57,227 And the sound was unpleasant. 129 00:05:57,903 --> 00:05:59,600 It was guttural. 130 00:05:59,600 --> 00:06:03,501 It was reminiscent of being in a dentist office. 131 00:06:05,762 --> 00:06:09,419 And I remember the top of my head tingling 132 00:06:10,296 --> 00:06:15,181 and I just sort of popped out of the top of my head. 133 00:06:17,150 --> 00:06:18,979 And I was then looking down at the body. 134 00:06:18,979 --> 00:06:21,100 I knew it was my body, 135 00:06:21,100 --> 00:06:23,188 but I didn't care. 136 00:06:23,864 --> 00:06:26,502 My vantage point was sort of sitting 137 00:06:26,502 --> 00:06:28,250 on the doctor's shoulder. 138 00:06:28,250 --> 00:06:32,132 I remember the instrument in his hand. 139 00:06:32,132 --> 00:06:36,424 It looked like the handle to my electric toothbrush. 140 00:06:37,516 --> 00:06:40,866 I had assumed they were going to open the skull 141 00:06:40,866 --> 00:06:42,110 with a saw. 142 00:06:42,633 --> 00:06:45,424 I had heard the term, saw, 143 00:06:45,424 --> 00:06:48,092 but what I saw looked a lot more like a drill 144 00:06:48,092 --> 00:06:49,568 than a saw. 145 00:06:49,568 --> 00:06:53,528 It even had little bits that were kept in this case 146 00:06:53,528 --> 00:06:56,212 that looked like a case that my father stored his 147 00:06:56,212 --> 00:06:59,520 socket wrenches in when I was a child. 148 00:06:59,520 --> 00:07:01,549 And I remember distinctly hearing a female 149 00:07:01,549 --> 00:07:03,107 voice saying, 150 00:07:03,707 --> 00:07:05,439 >> We have a problem. 151 00:07:05,439 --> 00:07:07,074 Her arteries are too small. 152 00:07:07,336 --> 00:07:09,330 >> Try the other side. 153 00:07:11,253 --> 00:07:13,723 >> It seemed to come from further 154 00:07:13,723 --> 00:07:14,870 down on the table. 155 00:07:14,870 --> 00:07:18,442 I do remember wondering, what are they doing? 156 00:07:18,442 --> 00:07:21,476 Because this is brain surgery. 157 00:07:21,476 --> 00:07:23,489 And what had happened was they accessed 158 00:07:23,489 --> 00:07:27,035 the femoral arteries in order to drain the blood. 159 00:07:27,035 --> 00:07:30,216 And I did not understand that. 160 00:07:33,215 --> 00:07:34,664 >> In the process of my study, 161 00:07:34,664 --> 00:07:37,901 I went and interviewed Dr. Spetzler and looked at 162 00:07:37,901 --> 00:07:41,325 his operative report and I found that what she saw 163 00:07:41,325 --> 00:07:42,833 from her out of body experience, 164 00:07:42,833 --> 00:07:46,086 seemingly corresponded very accurately 165 00:07:46,086 --> 00:07:48,574 to what had actually occurred. 166 00:07:48,574 --> 00:07:52,031 She looked at the bone saw that was being used 167 00:07:52,031 --> 00:07:54,976 to cut open her skull. 168 00:07:54,976 --> 00:07:58,151 I didn't have any idea what this thing looked like. 169 00:07:58,151 --> 00:08:00,648 She described it as an electric toothbrush 170 00:08:00,648 --> 00:08:02,565 which I thought was ridiculous. 171 00:08:02,565 --> 00:08:05,148 I had to send off for a picture of this saw 172 00:08:05,148 --> 00:08:08,282 to Fort Worth, Texas to confirm whether or not 173 00:08:08,282 --> 00:08:11,601 what she said it looked like actually was accurate. 174 00:08:11,601 --> 00:08:14,046 And I was astounded when I saw the picture. 175 00:08:14,046 --> 00:08:17,917 It indeed does resemble an electric toothbrush. 176 00:08:18,317 --> 00:08:23,385 >> I don't think that the observations she made 177 00:08:24,461 --> 00:08:28,707 were based on what she experienced as she went 178 00:08:28,707 --> 00:08:30,528 into the operating room theater. 179 00:08:30,528 --> 00:08:33,687 They were just not available to her. 180 00:08:33,687 --> 00:08:35,143 For example, the drill and so on, 181 00:08:35,143 --> 00:08:36,801 those things are all covered up. 182 00:08:36,801 --> 00:08:38,027 They're not visible. 183 00:08:38,027 --> 00:08:39,628 They were inside their packages. 184 00:08:39,628 --> 00:08:42,327 You really don't begin to open until the patient 185 00:08:42,327 --> 00:08:45,023 iIs completely asleep so that you maintain 186 00:08:45,023 --> 00:08:46,778 a sterile environment. 187 00:08:46,778 --> 00:08:49,278 >> She also heard a conversation 188 00:08:49,278 --> 00:08:52,265 during the operation between Dr. Spetzler 189 00:08:52,265 --> 00:08:54,627 and the cardiovascular surgeons who were cutting 190 00:08:54,627 --> 00:08:56,967 into her legs to hook her up to 191 00:08:56,967 --> 00:08:59,179 the heart-lung machine 192 00:08:59,179 --> 00:09:02,909 When the cardiac surgeon incised her right groin, 193 00:09:02,909 --> 00:09:05,383 she found that her veins and arteries were too small 194 00:09:05,383 --> 00:09:07,780 and she had to go over to the left side. 195 00:09:07,780 --> 00:09:09,587 And there was some conversation at the time 196 00:09:09,587 --> 00:09:11,265 between the doctors. 197 00:09:11,265 --> 00:09:16,165 Pam accurately recalled hearing that conversation. 198 00:09:16,165 --> 00:09:18,412 >> At that stage in the operation, 199 00:09:18,412 --> 00:09:22,509 nobody can observe, hear, 200 00:09:22,509 --> 00:09:24,250 in that state. 201 00:09:24,250 --> 00:09:29,598 And I find it inconceivable that your normal senses 202 00:09:29,598 --> 00:09:31,733 such as hearing, let alone the fact that she 203 00:09:31,733 --> 00:09:34,293 had clicking modules in each ear, 204 00:09:34,293 --> 00:09:36,913 that there was any way for her to hear those 205 00:09:36,913 --> 00:09:40,137 through normal auditory pathways. 206 00:09:40,599 --> 00:09:43,906 >> So, again, this is very suggestive of the fact 207 00:09:43,906 --> 00:09:47,397 that there was some sort of extrasensory perception 208 00:09:47,397 --> 00:09:48,865 or out of body experience 209 00:09:48,865 --> 00:09:52,001 or whatever occurring at the time that was allowing 210 00:09:52,001 --> 00:09:56,353 Pam to hear accurately and seemingly see 211 00:09:56,353 --> 00:09:59,345 accurately what was going on in the operating room 212 00:09:59,345 --> 00:10:00,639 at the time. 213 00:10:00,639 --> 00:10:05,136 214 00:10:05,136 --> 00:10:07,071 >> I felt a presence. 215 00:10:07,918 --> 00:10:10,469 I sort of turned around to look at it. 216 00:10:11,161 --> 00:10:16,158 And that's when I saw the very tiny pinpoint of light. 217 00:10:18,742 --> 00:10:21,074 And the light started to pull me. 218 00:10:21,597 --> 00:10:24,509 And there was a physical sensation to the pulling 219 00:10:24,509 --> 00:10:27,917 and I know how that must sound. 220 00:10:28,410 --> 00:10:30,053 Nonetheless, it's true. 221 00:10:30,053 --> 00:10:31,906 There was a physical sensation, 222 00:10:31,906 --> 00:10:36,025 rather like going over a hill real fast, 223 00:10:36,025 --> 00:10:37,351 in your tummy. 224 00:10:38,444 --> 00:10:41,691 And I went toward the light. 225 00:10:43,583 --> 00:10:46,809 The closer I got to the light, I began to discern 226 00:10:46,809 --> 00:10:48,985 different figures, 227 00:10:48,985 --> 00:10:49,686 different people. 228 00:10:49,686 --> 00:10:53,250 And I distinctly heard my grandmother call me. 229 00:10:53,250 --> 00:10:55,610 She has a very distinct voice. 230 00:10:56,549 --> 00:10:58,914 And I immediately went to her. 231 00:10:59,868 --> 00:11:02,244 And it felt great. 232 00:11:04,937 --> 00:11:08,582 And I saw an uncle who passed away 233 00:11:08,582 --> 00:11:11,287 when he was only thirty-nine years old. 234 00:11:11,856 --> 00:11:13,013 He taught me a lot. 235 00:11:13,013 --> 00:11:16,062 He taught me to play my first guitar. 236 00:11:17,154 --> 00:11:19,301 And I saw many, many people I knew 237 00:11:19,301 --> 00:11:21,881 and many, many I didn't know 238 00:11:21,881 --> 00:11:23,878 but I knew I was somehow in someway 239 00:11:23,878 --> 00:11:25,476 connected to them. 240 00:11:25,999 --> 00:11:29,397 I asked if God was the light. 241 00:11:30,274 --> 00:11:31,423 And the answer was, 242 00:11:31,423 --> 00:11:34,728 no, God is not the light, 243 00:11:34,728 --> 00:11:39,426 the light is what happens when God breathes. 244 00:11:40,565 --> 00:11:42,586 And I stood there thinking, 245 00:11:42,586 --> 00:11:46,106 I'm standing in the breath of God. 246 00:11:46,106 --> 00:11:51,371 247 00:11:51,371 --> 00:11:54,845 At some point in time, 248 00:11:54,845 --> 00:11:58,012 I was reminded that it was time to go back. 249 00:11:58,796 --> 00:12:01,345 Of course, I had made my decision to go back 250 00:12:01,345 --> 00:12:03,931 before I ever laid down on that table 251 00:12:03,931 --> 00:12:05,997 but you know, the more I was there, 252 00:12:05,997 --> 00:12:07,155 the better I liked it. 253 00:12:08,031 --> 00:12:11,956 And my uncle was the one who brought me 254 00:12:11,956 --> 00:12:13,797 back down to the body. 255 00:12:15,444 --> 00:12:18,308 But then I got to where the body was and I looked 256 00:12:18,308 --> 00:12:22,042 at the thing, and I for sure did not want 257 00:12:22,042 --> 00:12:24,027 to get in it because it looked pretty much 258 00:12:24,027 --> 00:12:25,816 like what it was, 259 00:12:26,769 --> 00:12:28,999 as in void of life. 260 00:12:29,352 --> 00:12:31,208 And I knew it would hurt 261 00:12:31,208 --> 00:12:33,078 so, I didn't want to get in. 262 00:12:33,617 --> 00:12:35,967 He kept reasoning with me. 263 00:12:35,967 --> 00:12:37,898 He said it's like diving into a swimming pool, 264 00:12:37,898 --> 00:12:39,440 just jump in. 265 00:12:40,455 --> 00:12:41,355 No. 266 00:12:41,355 --> 00:12:43,134 [laughing] 267 00:12:43,365 --> 00:12:44,652 What about the children? 268 00:12:44,652 --> 00:12:45,335 You know what? 269 00:12:45,335 --> 00:12:47,042 I think the children will be fine. 270 00:12:47,042 --> 00:12:49,338 [Laughing] 271 00:12:49,922 --> 00:12:51,284 Honey, you gotta go. 272 00:12:52,269 --> 00:12:53,600 No. 273 00:12:53,600 --> 00:12:55,359 He pushed me. 274 00:12:55,867 --> 00:12:57,875 He gave me a little help there. 275 00:12:59,352 --> 00:13:01,079 It's taken a long time, but I think I'm ready 276 00:13:01,079 --> 00:13:02,552 to forgive him for that. 277 00:13:02,552 --> 00:13:04,231 [Laughing] 278 00:13:04,231 --> 00:13:09,924 But - I landed - I saw the body jump. 279 00:13:10,478 --> 00:13:12,991 I saw it do this number. 280 00:13:13,622 --> 00:13:16,595 And then he pushed me and I felt it 281 00:13:16,595 --> 00:13:18,130 do this number. 282 00:13:18,130 --> 00:13:25,382 283 00:13:25,382 --> 00:13:28,266 >> This is a classic near death experience 284 00:13:28,266 --> 00:13:31,536 occurring under extremely monitored 285 00:13:31,536 --> 00:13:35,227 medical conditions where every known vial sign 286 00:13:35,227 --> 00:13:35,627 287 00:13:35,627 --> 00:13:39,365 and basically every clinical sign of life 288 00:13:39,365 --> 00:13:41,265 and death was being monitored at the time. 289 00:13:41,265 --> 00:13:45,138 And that's what makes her case so remarkable 290 00:13:45,138 --> 00:13:47,064 and so valuable to us. 291 00:13:47,526 --> 00:13:49,700 >> I don't have an explanation for it. 292 00:13:49,700 --> 00:13:54,226 I don't know how it's possible for it to happen 293 00:13:54,226 --> 00:13:57,628 considering the physiological state she's in. 294 00:13:57,628 --> 00:14:00,295 At the same time, I have seen so many things 295 00:14:00,295 --> 00:14:02,736 that I can't explain that I don't want to be 296 00:14:02,736 --> 00:14:05,356 so arrogant as to be able to say, 297 00:14:05,356 --> 00:14:07,693 that there's no way it can happen. 298 00:14:09,093 --> 00:14:11,761 >> Pam's case points to the fact that somehow 299 00:14:11,761 --> 00:14:14,199 she was able to retain coherent perception 300 00:14:14,199 --> 00:14:16,422 and memory whilst clinically dead.