WEBVTT

00:00:17.090 --> 00:00:26.530
(upbeat electronic music)

00:00:40.800 --> 00:00:43.200
Turrell: Generally, we use light.

00:00:43.200 --> 00:00:45.942
We don't really pay much 
attention to the light itself.

00:00:46.241 --> 00:00:49.751
(quiet electronic music continues)

00:00:52.560 --> 00:00:54.320
That's my interest.

00:00:54.320 --> 00:00:57.614
This fascination with light 
and how we come to light.

00:01:01.608 --> 00:01:02.986
Woman: When you really start to look,

00:01:02.986 --> 00:01:04.592
then you sort of lose yourself.

00:01:04.592 --> 00:01:05.233
Man: Yeah.

00:01:05.233 --> 00:01:07.713
Woman: And that's when it 
becomes sort of disorienting.

00:01:07.713 --> 00:01:09.456
Man: Um-hmm. Ah.
Woman: Whoa.

00:01:11.176 --> 00:01:12.640
Woman: It's sort of an escape.
Man: Yeah.

00:01:12.640 --> 00:01:15.040
Woman: From everything that's above

00:01:15.040 --> 00:01:16.880
with the bustling of the streets

00:01:16.880 --> 00:01:18.720
and 'cause it's right under the street

00:01:18.720 --> 00:01:22.110
and you wouldn't think it'd be so nice down here.

00:01:27.715 --> 00:01:32.920
Turrell: I had this thought to just 
bring the cosmos closer down

00:01:32.920 --> 00:01:35.090
to the space where we occupy.

00:01:35.639 --> 00:01:40.419
(peaceful guitar music)

00:01:41.509 --> 00:01:44.358
It's always something to work 
with light in the outdoors.

00:01:48.120 --> 00:01:50.480
I had spent seven months 
flying in the western states.

00:01:50.480 --> 00:01:52.560
And that was how I found Roden Crater,

00:01:52.560 --> 00:01:55.758
which is on the western 
edge of the painted desert.

00:01:58.400 --> 00:02:00.200
You know, it had to sort of 
meet this criteria

00:02:00.200 --> 00:02:02.080
of a certain height and it's nice

00:02:02.080 --> 00:02:03.431
that it was away from other ones.

00:02:05.760 --> 00:02:09.920
But I think the important thing 
is just this kind of sense

00:02:09.920 --> 00:02:12.334
of power that each space 
or each place has.

00:02:12.880 --> 00:02:14.506
So, the place felt right.

00:02:18.200 --> 00:02:21.400
And I wanted a bowl shape that 
was raised above the plain.

00:02:21.400 --> 00:02:23.600
That was important, 
so that you come up the space

00:02:23.600 --> 00:02:27.120
and then you go through this 
and you see the shaping of sky.

00:02:27.120 --> 00:02:30.210
And then when you come out, 
there's actually a shaping of Earth.

00:02:31.090 --> 00:02:34.610
(peaceful electronic music)

00:02:35.000 --> 00:02:37.600
(plane motor running)

00:02:37.600 --> 00:02:40.793
The crater is a wonderful example

00:02:40.793 --> 00:02:47.233
of blending hard science, of physical 
science, with art and vice versa.

00:02:48.800 --> 00:02:52.880
Celestial events will be 
apparent at the crater site

00:02:52.880 --> 00:02:55.020
that you won't be able to see

00:02:55.020 --> 00:02:58.261
and only be able to see 
in a few other spots on the earth.

00:03:06.400 --> 00:03:09.360
To have a sort of new, 
eight-and-half-minute old,

00:03:09.360 --> 00:03:10.750
light from the sun,

00:03:10.750 --> 00:03:13.231
to feel it physically,
almost as we taste things,

00:03:13.710 --> 00:03:16.069
this is where you can 
work with light like that.

00:03:27.587 --> 00:03:30.269
Also, I wanted to use the 
very fine qualities of light.

00:03:31.040 --> 00:03:32.480
I wanted to gather starlight

00:03:32.480 --> 00:03:34.960
that was from outside 
the planetary system,

00:03:34.960 --> 00:03:38.463
which would be older 
than our solar system.

00:03:39.560 --> 00:03:41.230
And you can gather that light

00:03:41.640 --> 00:03:43.280
and physically have that in place.

00:03:43.280 --> 00:03:46.874
So, it's physically present 
to feel this old light.

00:03:50.680 --> 00:03:53.040
This is the opening to the crater.

00:03:53.040 --> 00:03:55.154
So, it's an elliptical sky space.

00:03:57.080 --> 00:03:59.720
The space is really 
'take you up into the sky',

00:04:00.880 --> 00:04:04.400
and, certainly, the events 
from the sky come through them

00:04:04.400 --> 00:04:05.812
down into the crater.

00:04:08.320 --> 00:04:11.430
So, this opening up into the 
sky is something I really like.

00:04:16.813 --> 00:04:20.863
(ladder clanging)

00:04:20.863 --> 00:04:23.940
I met Jim Turrell about 15 years ago.

00:04:26.000 --> 00:04:28.936
Jim is a big thinker, thinks big.

00:04:30.880 --> 00:04:36.960
He had an idea to point a tunnel 
through the crater wall

00:04:36.960 --> 00:04:40.640
to face the southwestern part of the sky

00:04:40.640 --> 00:04:44.640
where the moon would appear 
every 18.6 years,

00:04:44.640 --> 00:04:49.200
a cycle called the sorrows 
or a lower lunar standstill.

00:04:49.200 --> 00:04:51.960
The cycle of the moon has been known

00:04:51.960 --> 00:04:54.720
since the days of the Babylonian records.

00:04:54.720 --> 00:04:57.428
So it goes back eight, 10,000 years.

00:04:59.040 --> 00:05:01.080
And you can actually see this,

00:05:01.080 --> 00:05:04.720
the image of this down inside 
the sun and moon space,

00:05:04.720 --> 00:05:07.080
but then you'd have about 20 
minutes to walk up to the top

00:05:07.080 --> 00:05:09.104
and actually see it set on the horizon.

00:05:10.224 --> 00:05:14.485
(ethereal music)

00:05:19.784 --> 00:05:22.717
But the strangest thing is 
that we have made real

00:05:24.240 --> 00:05:27.000
an actual illusion. 
That is, when we camp out,

00:05:27.000 --> 00:05:29.047
we think that the sun 
rises in the east,

00:05:29.920 --> 00:05:31.080
or if we're at night,

00:05:31.080 --> 00:05:33.600
it looks as though 
the stars come up in the east

00:05:33.600 --> 00:05:36.240
and move over us 
and go down in the west.

00:05:36.240 --> 00:05:38.160
Actually, we are turning the opposite.

00:05:38.160 --> 00:05:40.280
We're on the earth that's 
turning the opposite way,

00:05:40.280 --> 00:05:41.818
but we don't feel that.

00:05:42.960 --> 00:05:44.320
So in the north space,

00:05:44.320 --> 00:05:47.080
I've removed all reference to horizon

00:05:47.080 --> 00:05:50.320
so your field of reference 
are the stars.

00:05:50.320 --> 00:05:52.320
And so what happens is 
you feel yourself

00:05:52.320 --> 00:05:54.308
to be moving, almost tipping.

00:05:55.360 --> 00:05:58.800
So if you're sitting back 
in here, in this seat here,

00:05:58.800 --> 00:06:01.800
you actually will see 
the rotation of the earth

00:06:01.800 --> 00:06:03.781
and you can feel that.

00:06:08.230 --> 00:06:10.960
(peaceful music)

00:06:25.320 --> 00:06:29.240
James had a lifetime goal 
of building a meeting house

00:06:29.240 --> 00:06:31.355
that was really used 
as a meeting house.

00:06:31.960 --> 00:06:33.680
So, when he heard 
that Houston wanted

00:06:33.680 --> 00:06:36.160
to build a meeting house 
and was in the process

00:06:36.160 --> 00:06:38.240
of doing that and raising money,

00:06:38.240 --> 00:06:40.360
he offered to donate his art.

00:06:43.280 --> 00:06:46.843
Well, for me, that was kind of 
the meeting house I always 
wanted to see.

00:06:47.290 --> 00:06:50.252
I mean, it's a very traditional form 
except it's convertible.

00:06:51.080 --> 00:06:54.600
The top opens and 
it makes the sky space,

00:06:54.600 --> 00:06:56.560
where sky is really 
brought down to you

00:06:56.560 --> 00:06:57.931
in the space where you sit.

00:07:08.080 --> 00:07:12.040
You're never quite prepared 
for what the light

00:07:12.040 --> 00:07:14.960
is going to do to you 
and what the interaction

00:07:14.960 --> 00:07:19.320
with nature and 
the sublime quiet will do

00:07:19.320 --> 00:07:21.400
when you come into a place like this

00:07:21.400 --> 00:07:24.281
and just simply slow down.

00:07:24.572 --> 00:07:31.812
(ethereal music)

00:07:36.760 --> 00:07:38.480
Being a lifetime Quaker,

00:07:38.480 --> 00:07:41.600
we felt strongly that James 
would not design anything

00:07:41.600 --> 00:07:43.981
that was not appropriate 
for our worship.

00:07:45.884 --> 00:07:50.320
We are hoping that our meeting 
house becomes an ecumenical place

00:07:50.320 --> 00:07:53.081
where people could find inner peace.

00:08:02.080 --> 00:08:05.507
I think I was maybe five or six, 
and my grandmother would 


00:08:05.507 --> 00:08:08.294
begin taking me in and sitting me 
in the Quaker meeting house,

00:08:08.294 --> 00:08:09.858
and we would just sit in there together.

00:08:10.440 --> 00:08:13.720
There's this time when you 
no longer are in first day of school,

00:08:13.880 --> 00:08:16.009
but you actually come 
and join the meeting.

00:08:17.930 --> 00:08:21.380
And I remember I tried to, you know, 
ask you my grandmother, you know,

00:08:21.380 --> 00:08:25.240
"What, what are we doing? 
What are, what am I supposed to do?"

00:08:25.240 --> 00:08:29.440
And she said, "Just wait. 
We're going inside to greet the light."

00:08:29.440 --> 00:08:31.234
And I like that.

00:08:35.520 --> 00:08:39.280
This idea to go inside, 
to find that light within,

00:08:39.280 --> 00:08:43.080
literally as well as figuratively,

00:08:43.080 --> 00:08:45.513
and so I was very interested 
in this sort of literal look at it.

00:08:48.080 --> 00:08:51.270
Of course, I'm still trying to figure 
out exactly what she meant.

00:08:51.270 --> 00:08:52.134
(laughs)

00:08:57.560 --> 00:09:01.040
My daughter was born when I first 
had the idea for the crater.

00:09:01.040 --> 00:09:04.920
Went to college and university, 
got her medical degree and

00:09:04.920 --> 00:09:06.546
now is a doctor, and is married.

00:09:07.270 --> 00:09:09.145
And I'm still not finished 
with the crater.

00:09:09.830 --> 00:09:12.228
So, I've gotta get along 
here and get this thing done.

00:09:22.248 --> 00:09:23.920
(footsteps)

00:09:23.920 --> 00:09:24.840
To keep the crater,

00:09:24.840 --> 00:09:28.240
I had to go get a loan 
from farm credit

00:09:28.240 --> 00:09:30.440
and really get involved in ranching

00:09:30.440 --> 00:09:33.880
'cause they wouldn't loan money 
on vacant land.

00:09:33.880 --> 00:09:36.520
So suddenly, I have a 
one-million-dollar mortgage

00:09:36.520 --> 00:09:38.640
and this is not interesting to my wife.

00:09:38.640 --> 00:09:41.580
And she felt I was mortgaging 
our children's future.

00:09:42.767 --> 00:09:44.723
(horse neighing)
Did you hear that buddy?

00:09:45.099 --> 00:09:47.099
(galloping)

00:09:47.182 --> 00:09:49.613
Turrell: We run 
almost separate operations.

00:09:50.240 --> 00:09:52.480
The cattle are my department

00:09:52.480 --> 00:09:55.400
and the new art is his department.

00:09:55.400 --> 00:09:58.278
Payday's once a year. It's in 
the fall, when you sell the calves.

00:09:58.278 --> 00:09:59.440
Good boys. Good boys.

00:09:59.440 --> 00:10:02.840
And things can go pretty well 
or they can go pretty sour

00:10:02.840 --> 00:10:06.354
depending on the price of cattle 
at that time.

00:10:09.160 --> 00:10:12.320
Jim doesn't stay real happy 
when the price of cattle's low.

00:10:12.320 --> 00:10:13.709
Well, imagine that. (laughs)

00:10:17.515 --> 00:10:20.520
Turrell: People often ask me 
how much this crater costs

00:10:20.520 --> 00:10:23.750
and you know, it costs me 
two marriages and a relationship.

00:10:27.400 --> 00:10:31.170
Those are the places where you feel 
the greatest discouragement,

00:10:31.170 --> 00:10:34.280
as you see it's sometimes 
hard for others to follow

00:10:34.280 --> 00:10:37.280
what you think is 
the natural course of things

00:10:37.280 --> 00:10:38.977
and how to get something done.

00:10:50.880 --> 00:10:52.040
If you look at the horizon,

00:10:52.040 --> 00:10:55.520
it's a milky, cloudy type of view,

00:10:55.520 --> 00:10:57.520
but as you go higher in the sky,

00:10:57.520 --> 00:11:02.640
the sky becomes a uniform blue, maybe with clouds.

00:11:02.640 --> 00:11:05.440
But if you can be in a well so to speak,

00:11:05.440 --> 00:11:07.400
or in a crater like Roden,

00:11:07.400 --> 00:11:12.301
you see no contrast with the 
depth of the sky and your view.

00:11:13.040 --> 00:11:16.240
So you realize its closeness.

00:11:16.240 --> 00:11:20.920
And sometimes if you're conscious enough, you can,

00:11:20.920 --> 00:11:23.658
you'll discover that you're in the atmosphere.

00:11:24.240 --> 00:11:27.200
You're not separated from the sky at night.

00:11:27.200 --> 00:11:29.920
And even during the day you have this feeling

00:11:29.920 --> 00:11:32.441
that you're one with the universe.

00:11:37.680 --> 00:11:38.680
You know, when you read a book

00:11:38.680 --> 00:11:40.600
you're often so involved in the space

00:11:40.600 --> 00:11:41.720
generated by the author

00:11:41.720 --> 00:11:44.640
that whatever happens in front of you disappears.

00:11:44.640 --> 00:11:45.360
People pass by.

00:11:45.360 --> 00:11:47.160
You don't even notice them.

00:11:47.160 --> 00:11:48.520
So you've paid the price of admission

00:11:48.520 --> 00:11:50.000
and you've entered that space.

00:11:51.040 --> 00:11:53.000
A lot of people come to art and they look at it

00:11:53.000 --> 00:11:55.400
and this is one of the 
problems in contemporary art.

00:11:55.400 --> 00:11:57.967
And so, they don't actually enter the realm

00:11:58.280 --> 00:11:59.680
that the artist was involved in.

00:11:59.680 --> 00:12:05.640
We have a little more of a 
distance there and the situation

00:12:05.640 --> 00:12:08.880
of the journey to the place like Roden Crater.

00:12:08.880 --> 00:12:11.760
The fact that you actually 
have to do some thing or some

00:12:11.760 --> 00:12:14.840
involvement to have this come over you,

00:12:14.840 --> 00:12:16.320
you have to quiet

00:12:16.320 --> 00:12:19.560
and it actually makes this experience,

00:12:19.560 --> 00:12:21.508
I think, much stronger.