1 00:00:05,340 --> 00:00:11,600 Hi, this is Mark Brown with Game Maker's Toolkit, a series on video game design. 2 00:00:11,600 --> 00:00:17,160 Sony's new PS4 game Until Dawn is billed as an interactive horror film, where 3 00:00:17,160 --> 00:00:21,160 TRAILER DUDE: Only your choices determine who will survive 4 00:00:21,160 --> 00:00:23,860 And I want to talk about that, but not about how 5 00:00:23,860 --> 00:00:26,460 much you can effect the story with your choices. 6 00:00:26,460 --> 00:00:31,250 Because, it's basically identical to the systems we've seen in games by Telltale and Quantic 7 00:00:31,250 --> 00:00:36,730 Dream. Yes, your decisions will make a dent in the plot, but it's also full of false choices, 8 00:00:36,730 --> 00:00:41,620 characters who can't die until the very end, branching paths that snap back to a central 9 00:00:41,620 --> 00:00:45,700 point, and that cute little indicator to tell you that this choice will definitely have 10 00:00:45,700 --> 00:00:48,440 an effect on the plot, somewhere down the line. 11 00:00:48,480 --> 00:00:52,120 CHRIS: Boom, butterfly effect 12 00:00:52,129 --> 00:00:56,200 It does have some ideas that I haven't seen in one of these types of games before, though. 13 00:00:56,200 --> 00:01:00,829 Sometimes, you'll get a nice sepia-tinged flashback, to give you a better idea of which 14 00:01:00,829 --> 00:01:03,140 choices led up to the events onscreen. 15 00:01:03,140 --> 00:01:08,020 But don't be fooled by these screens which show how all your choices play out, and the 16 00:01:08,020 --> 00:01:12,479 incredibly granular meters that show your current personality traits and relationships 17 00:01:12,479 --> 00:01:16,700 to the other characters. They're all a bit smoke and mirrors, to be honest. 18 00:01:16,700 --> 00:01:21,090 And that's fine. As we talked about in this video, these games aren't about offering infinite 19 00:01:21,090 --> 00:01:26,789 story states. And simply making choices is often more fulfilling than seeing wildly unique 20 00:01:26,789 --> 00:01:31,649 consequences play out. Plus, games are expensive to make without considering a billion unique 21 00:01:31,649 --> 00:01:34,289 paths. Especially when they look like this. 22 00:01:34,289 --> 00:01:42,319 DR HILL: I believe that in our last session, you were not completely honest with me. 23 00:01:42,319 --> 00:01:46,869 So what I want to talk about, is the question of whether all these choices and their consequences 24 00:01:46,869 --> 00:01:51,479 - especially the more grisly, blood-soaked of the consequences - can actually lead to 25 00:01:51,479 --> 00:01:52,939 good drama. 26 00:01:52,940 --> 00:01:57,300 Because, while it is true that any story can become more meaningful and memorable when 27 00:01:57,310 --> 00:02:01,439 you're having a say on the proceedings. Much like how almost anything is improved with 28 00:02:01,439 --> 00:02:03,239 the addition of cooperative play. 29 00:02:03,239 --> 00:02:04,539 Or chocolate 30 00:02:04,560 --> 00:02:08,660 Does that actually make the stories dramatically satisfying? 31 00:02:08,660 --> 00:02:13,660 And this question is especially important to Until Dawn as it wants to play out like 32 00:02:13,670 --> 00:02:18,650 a Hollywood horror movie. This isn't a naturalistic story like The Wire, where characters can 33 00:02:18,650 --> 00:02:22,730 be snuffed out seemingly at random. This is a horror movie, man... 34 00:02:22,730 --> 00:02:27,750 RANDY: There's a formula to it! A very simple formula! 35 00:02:30,260 --> 00:02:35,180 The game is heavily based on slasher movies. It's got a bunch of horny teenagers, getting 36 00:02:35,180 --> 00:02:39,620 together in a isolated cabin in the woods, on the anniversary of some horrible event. 37 00:02:39,620 --> 00:02:42,980 And there's a psychopath, who wants to pick them off - one by one. 38 00:02:42,989 --> 00:02:47,379 It also has elements of psychological horror and torture porn and - well, I don't want 39 00:02:47,379 --> 00:02:49,879 to spoil things. So let's stick to slasher flicks. 40 00:02:49,879 --> 00:02:53,819 The thing about these movies is that there is always a very specific reason why some 41 00:02:53,819 --> 00:02:58,439 characters live, and others die. And sometimes, importance is placed on the sequence of the 42 00:02:58,439 --> 00:03:03,810 kills, too. In early slasher flicks, for example, it was all about morals. Sniffy, puritanical, 43 00:03:03,810 --> 00:03:06,980 thou shalt not morals, maybe, but those were the rules. 44 00:03:06,980 --> 00:03:13,010 RANDY: There are certain rules that one must abide by to successfully survive a horror movie. 45 00:03:13,010 --> 00:03:19,670 RANDY: Number one. You can never have sex. Big no no! Big no no! 46 00:03:19,670 --> 00:03:21,879 STU: You're dead Meg. RANDY: Sex equals 47 00:03:21,879 --> 00:03:28,290 death, okay? Number two. You can never drink, or do drugs. 48 00:03:28,290 --> 00:03:34,530 No, it's the sin factor. It's a sin. It's an extension of number one. 49 00:03:34,530 --> 00:03:40,659 Break those rules and you'll be killed, leaving one last girl. An innocent, virginal, Final 50 00:03:40,659 --> 00:03:45,439 Girl. Early slashers were often criticised for being misogynistic. Which should make 51 00:03:45,439 --> 00:03:47,930 them the perfect source material for video games. 52 00:03:48,609 --> 00:03:54,769 Anyway, the point is that in drama, people die for a reason. Whether that's a heroic sacrifice or 53 00:03:54,769 --> 00:03:59,650 in vengeance or to give another character motivation to do something, or - in horror movies - because 54 00:03:59,650 --> 00:04:02,499 they smoked pot, or chugged a beer, or were a total bully. 55 00:04:02,499 --> 00:04:07,760 But when interactivity comes into play, the rules can go out of the window. In Until Dawn, 56 00:04:07,760 --> 00:04:10,180 take Emily, who is a monster bitch. 57 00:04:10,180 --> 00:04:15,300 MATT: Let me think. EMILY: Don't think you idiot just get me outta here! 58 00:04:15,300 --> 00:04:19,739 She would be killed in the most gruesome way possible in any horror movie, but can 59 00:04:19,739 --> 00:04:25,919 survive the entire night in Until Dawn, while her put upon boyfriend Matt is, uh, hung out to dry 60 00:04:25,919 --> 00:04:31,789 Or take Jess and Mike. Horror movie tropes say these sexpots should die, while innocent characters 61 00:04:31,789 --> 00:04:36,550 should live. But that's not how things work in Until Dawn. In fact, any combination of characters 62 00:04:36,550 --> 00:04:38,280 can make it to the finale. 63 00:04:38,280 --> 00:04:43,800 And you'll probably end with multiple survivors. If not all of them making it through the night, 64 00:04:43,800 --> 00:04:50,120 even though that goes against the horror movie set up where just one person survives. 65 00:04:50,120 --> 00:04:54,590 But even if you don't care about horror movie formulas. Or you revel in the idea of a horror 66 00:04:54,590 --> 00:05:00,460 flick that ignores them entirely, the interactive story can sometimes just be... a bit rubbish. 67 00:05:00,460 --> 00:05:04,500 Take Jess, for example, who gets killed in the game, but you don't see a body so of course she's going 68 00:05:04,500 --> 00:05:09,340 to come back. And she does: hours later into the story she wakes up, alone, in the mines. 69 00:05:09,340 --> 00:05:15,750 And then, in my game, she walked forward a few paces, and was immediately killed. Oh. I think any script editor 70 00:05:15,750 --> 00:05:19,110 would put a big red circle around that scene. 71 00:05:19,110 --> 00:05:22,479 And that's the thing: while interactivity can lead to more memorable, more surprising, 72 00:05:22,479 --> 00:05:26,979 and more personal narratives, without the smart guiding hand of a director or a script 73 00:05:26,979 --> 00:05:31,870 editor, the story can fall apart. It can be desperately unsatisfying, or lack important 74 00:05:31,870 --> 00:05:35,990 elements like character arcs, poetic justice, and good pacing. 75 00:05:35,990 --> 00:05:39,199 And that's the way it will always be. Thanks for watching, please like, comment, and subscribe. 76 00:05:39,199 --> 00:05:44,639 Throw all your money at my Patreon - and, wait. Actually. Maybe we can fix this. 77 00:05:46,050 --> 00:05:50,849 You see, the thing I liked the most about Until Dawn is that you get to control eight different 78 00:05:50,849 --> 00:05:54,639 characters. That's much more than games like Life is Strange, Tales from the Borderlands, 79 00:05:54,639 --> 00:05:56,669 and Beyond: Two Souls. 80 00:05:56,669 --> 00:06:00,979 Which meant that while I normally play these sorts of games as a kind and compassionate 81 00:06:00,979 --> 00:06:04,860 character, having eight different people to play with, some of them archetypical arseholes 82 00:06:04,860 --> 00:06:09,460 and narcissists, I felt much more comfortable role playing them as jerks. And while I tried 83 00:06:09,460 --> 00:06:14,020 my best to save my favourite characters, like Sam, Chris, and Ashley, I was happy for the 84 00:06:14,020 --> 00:06:17,800 others to make dumb decisions and wouldn't really mind if they ended up as puddles of 85 00:06:17,800 --> 00:06:19,880 bones and teeth. 86 00:06:22,000 --> 00:06:26,840 I realised that I wasn't really playing as the characters, but the as the director. Influencing 87 00:06:26,840 --> 00:06:31,889 who lived and who died, based on my own judgmental preferences. Suddenly, those horror rules 88 00:06:31,889 --> 00:06:35,840 were falling back into place and the story was way less disconnected. 89 00:06:35,840 --> 00:06:39,300 Perhaps you might want to try and subvert the most problematic tropes of horror movies. 90 00:06:39,300 --> 00:06:43,629 Have the ditzy, slutty blonde survive the ordeal, stop the black guy from getting 91 00:06:43,629 --> 00:06:48,360 killed first, or have the archetypical Final Girl bite it at the last moment. 92 00:06:48,360 --> 00:06:52,789 And you do have some ability to influence events in a specific way, because the deaths 93 00:06:52,789 --> 00:06:57,330 often follow some internal logic. Characters can get killed if you screw up quick-time 94 00:06:57,330 --> 00:07:01,789 events. Messing with those relationship meters can lead to at least one death. And if you 95 00:07:01,789 --> 00:07:06,210 ignore the tropes of the genre - like wandering off from the group to investigate a spooky 96 00:07:06,210 --> 00:07:10,430 noise - then perhaps that character deserves to get killed for not watching enough horror movies. 97 00:07:10,430 --> 00:07:14,270 And then there are these totems, which is another clever mechanic. Find one of these 98 00:07:14,270 --> 00:07:17,599 and pick it up, and it will show you a clip of one of the characters getting killed or 99 00:07:17,599 --> 00:07:22,539 surviving an attack. They're vague, but you might be able to use them to help guide later choices. 100 00:07:22,550 --> 00:07:27,879 But not all deaths are so easy to foresee. Understandable, of course, as Supermassive 101 00:07:27,879 --> 00:07:31,590 wanted to surprise you. And the legions of YouTubers who have made this game famous. 102 00:07:31,590 --> 00:07:36,430 So, your choice of how to deal with this flare gun, for example, is an almost entirely opaque 103 00:07:36,430 --> 00:07:39,819 decision but will have huge consequences for Emily and Matt. 104 00:07:39,819 --> 00:07:44,669 And that's only if, like me, you were even trying to tell a specific story. Until Dawn 105 00:07:44,669 --> 00:07:48,830 doesn't give players any instructions, and while the trophies - which reward you for 106 00:07:48,830 --> 00:07:53,050 finishing the game with certain combinations - could push you to try and get a specific 107 00:07:53,050 --> 00:07:55,390 outcome, they're all hidden trophies. 108 00:07:56,620 --> 00:08:00,780 So how about this for an idea. And, before I go on, I want to acknowledge that maybe I am trying 109 00:08:00,789 --> 00:08:04,780 to make the game into something that it's not. And, for the record, I really enjoyed Until 110 00:08:04,780 --> 00:08:09,600 Dawn and would recommend it. But, what if the game was actually about being the director. 111 00:08:09,600 --> 00:08:14,700 Similar gameplay, but at the outset of the game you would be told who must live and who must die 112 00:08:14,700 --> 00:08:19,180 and maybe even in what order. And then, you'd have to force the characters to act in different ways 113 00:08:19,189 --> 00:08:23,879 to ensure their death or survival. For those who are fated to die, you must act immorally 114 00:08:23,879 --> 00:08:29,150 and say nasty things to force the big baddy to enact poetic justice on their guts, or 115 00:08:29,150 --> 00:08:33,669 play into obvious horror cliches and get them split up from the rest of the group. 116 00:08:33,669 --> 00:08:38,080 The game could be a lot shorter, but designed to be replayed over and over again with different 117 00:08:38,080 --> 00:08:41,630 instructions each time. It would also need some random elements, to keep you on your 118 00:08:41,630 --> 00:08:46,210 toes and also ensure that those jump scares and creepy moments don't become blasé. 119 00:08:46,960 --> 00:08:52,900 Because here's the main issue that nags at Until Dawn. On the one hand it, it wants to 120 00:08:52,910 --> 00:08:58,790 be a horror movie where characters get killed in increasingly gruesome ways. But on the 121 00:08:58,790 --> 00:09:02,540 other hand, it's a video game, and video games are there to be won. 122 00:09:02,540 --> 00:09:07,140 Games teach us to make the smart dialogue decisions that will give us the best outcomes. 123 00:09:07,140 --> 00:09:10,300 When buttons flash up on the screen, we've been taught to hit them as quickly as 124 00:09:10,300 --> 00:09:15,130 possible. And systems, like the totems that warn of potential deaths, are supposed to 125 00:09:15,130 --> 00:09:17,070 be solved, right? 126 00:09:17,070 --> 00:09:22,330 Until Dawn the movie wants everyone to die. But Until Dawn the game wants everyone to 127 00:09:22,330 --> 00:09:25,720 survive. Something's gotta give. 128 00:09:25,720 --> 00:09:31,100 That conflict is somewhat solved when you put yourself in the director's chair. And 129 00:09:31,100 --> 00:09:36,880 try your hand at being Wes Craven or John Carpenter. But without that push, and reliable 130 00:09:36,880 --> 00:09:42,820 mechanics, many players could miss out on Until Dawn's greatest pleasures. 131 00:09:46,320 --> 00:09:49,780 Thanks for watching. I hope you enjoyed the episode - if you did, please give it a like 132 00:09:49,790 --> 00:09:54,670 on YouTube. Plus: how would you make an interactive horror movie, or did Supermassive get it right? 133 00:09:54,670 --> 00:09:57,010 Let me know your thoughts in the comments below.