[Script Info]
Title: 
[Events]
Format: Layer, Start, End, Style, Name, MarginL, MarginR, MarginV, Effect, Text
Dialogue: 0,0:00:10.81,0:00:14.05,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,What I want to talk about this morning \Nis a remarkable phenomenon:
Dialogue: 0,0:00:14.24,0:00:17.00,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,that people not only talk to God
Dialogue: 0,0:00:17.02,0:00:21.07,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,but they learn to experience\NGod is talking back.
Dialogue: 0,0:00:21.96,0:00:25.68,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Many, many Americans are involved -\Nand many other people -
Dialogue: 0,0:00:25.68,0:00:29.68,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,are involved in what you may call \Na renewalist spirituality,
Dialogue: 0,0:00:29.76,0:00:31.20,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,a kind of spirituality
Dialogue: 0,0:00:31.20,0:00:36.64,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,in which they want to experience God\Nintimately, personally and interactively;
Dialogue: 0,0:00:36.91,0:00:40.53,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,they want to reach out\Nand touch the Divine here on earth.
Dialogue: 0,0:00:40.78,0:00:43.64,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,I wanted to find out how they did that.
Dialogue: 0,0:00:44.58,0:00:46.31,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,I am an anthropologist.
Dialogue: 0,0:00:46.32,0:00:49.96,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,My job is to immerse myself\Nin the world that I've come to study
Dialogue: 0,0:00:49.97,0:00:52.07,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,and to keep observing
Dialogue: 0,0:00:52.10,0:00:53.92,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,so that to some degree,
Dialogue: 0,0:00:53.92,0:00:57.82,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,I get a sense of what it would take\Nto become a native in that world.
Dialogue: 0,0:00:58.21,0:01:00.18,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Unlike Margret Mead and Gregory Bateson,
Dialogue: 0,0:01:00.18,0:01:02.02,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,who are pictured here in New Guinea,
Dialogue: 0,0:01:02.02,0:01:04.27,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,I did this work in America.
Dialogue: 0,0:01:04.53,0:01:07.92,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,I spent two years \Nin the Renewalist Church in Chicago
Dialogue: 0,0:01:07.94,0:01:11.39,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,and another two years\Nin one in the Bay Area.
Dialogue: 0,0:01:11.39,0:01:13.19,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,I went to Sunday morning services.
Dialogue: 0,0:01:13.19,0:01:16.39,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,I was a member of house group.\NI was in a prayer circle.
Dialogue: 0,0:01:16.39,0:01:17.62,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,I hung out with people.
Dialogue: 0,0:01:17.62,0:01:18.64,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,I prayed with people.
Dialogue: 0,0:01:18.64,0:01:22.69,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,I really wanted to know\Nhow their God became real to them.
Dialogue: 0,0:01:23.54,0:01:25.33,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,So let me begin by asking,
Dialogue: 0,0:01:25.36,0:01:27.78,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Who is God in a church like this?
Dialogue: 0,0:01:27.80,0:01:31.84,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Well, God is God, God is big, \NGod is mighty and holy and beyond,
Dialogue: 0,0:01:32.32,0:01:34.95,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,but God is also a person among people.
Dialogue: 0,0:01:35.22,0:01:37.23,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,The pastors in this kind of church
Dialogue: 0,0:01:37.23,0:01:42.07,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,want you to experience God the way\Nthe early disciples experienced Jesus.
Dialogue: 0,0:01:42.24,0:01:43.45,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,They walked with Jesus.
Dialogue: 0,0:01:43.45,0:01:44.62,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,They ate with Jesus.
Dialogue: 0,0:01:44.62,0:01:45.81,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,They talked with Jesus.
Dialogue: 0,0:01:45.81,0:01:47.10,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,He was their friend.
Dialogue: 0,0:01:47.77,0:01:49.41,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,And these pastors
Dialogue: 0,0:01:49.41,0:01:53.82,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,will tell you that you should put out\Na cup of coffee for God,
Dialogue: 0,0:01:54.03,0:01:55.79,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,you should have a beer with God,
Dialogue: 0,0:01:55.79,0:01:57.77,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,go for a walk with God, hang out,
Dialogue: 0,0:01:57.77,0:01:59.27,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,do the kind of thing with God
Dialogue: 0,0:01:59.27,0:02:03.59,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,that you'd get to not do with anyone\Nwho you wanted to know as a person.
Dialogue: 0,0:02:03.63,0:02:07.13,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,And he cares about all the stuff \Nin your life, the little stuff:
Dialogue: 0,0:02:07.13,0:02:09.23,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,where you want to go\Nin your summer vacation,
Dialogue: 0,0:02:09.23,0:02:11.38,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,what shirt you want to wear \Ntomorrow morning.
Dialogue: 0,0:02:11.38,0:02:13.51,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,You can talk to him about that.
Dialogue: 0,0:02:14.54,0:02:15.74,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,So I wanted to know
Dialogue: 0,0:02:15.75,0:02:20.02,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,how people learned to interact with God,\Nhow they felt that God was speaking back.
Dialogue: 0,0:02:20.02,0:02:21.59,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,And I knew that they learned
Dialogue: 0,0:02:21.59,0:02:23.84,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,because newcomers\Nwould come to these churches,
Dialogue: 0,0:02:23.84,0:02:27.23,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,and they would say things like\N"God doesn't talk to me,"
Dialogue: 0,0:02:27.23,0:02:28.90,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,and then six to nine months later,
Dialogue: 0,0:02:28.90,0:02:29.98,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,they would say,
Dialogue: 0,0:02:29.98,0:02:31.80,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,"I recognize God's voice
Dialogue: 0,0:02:31.80,0:02:35.07,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,the way I recognize\Nmy mom's voice on the phone."
Dialogue: 0,0:02:36.26,0:02:38.74,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,What I saw the church teach
Dialogue: 0,0:02:38.76,0:02:40.72,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,was that you should think about your mind
Dialogue: 0,0:02:40.72,0:02:41.73,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,not as a fortress
Dialogue: 0,0:02:41.73,0:02:45.31,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,full of your own self-generated thoughts\Nand feelings and images,
Dialogue: 0,0:02:45.33,0:02:46.91,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,but you should think of your mind
Dialogue: 0,0:02:46.92,0:02:49.26,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,as a place where you were\Ngoing to meet God,
Dialogue: 0,0:02:49.26,0:02:52.68,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,and that some of those thoughts\Nthat you might have thought of as yours,
Dialogue: 0,0:02:52.69,0:02:56.46,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,they were really God's thoughts \Nbeing given to you,
Dialogue: 0,0:02:56.49,0:02:59.84,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,and your job was\Nto figure out who was God.
Dialogue: 0,0:03:00.04,0:03:05.23,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,And in fact, people did talk in ways\Nthat suggested that they would have -
Dialogue: 0,0:03:06.58,0:03:09.65,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,as if they had experiences \Nthat weren't their own.
Dialogue: 0,0:03:09.93,0:03:12.74,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,A woman said to me,\N"As I've started to pray in this church,
Dialogue: 0,0:03:12.79,0:03:17.82,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,it feels like my mind is a screen\Nthat images are projected on.
Dialogue: 0,0:03:18.04,0:03:21.02,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Somebody else is controlling\Nthat clicker."
Dialogue: 0,0:03:21.26,0:03:25.90,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,And of course, not all thoughts\Nwere thought to be good candidates
Dialogue: 0,0:03:25.93,0:03:28.04,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,for the kinds of things God would say.
Dialogue: 0,0:03:28.48,0:03:30.96,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,People would look for thoughts\Nthat stood out,
Dialogue: 0,0:03:30.97,0:03:33.37,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,that were more spontaneous \Nthan other thoughts,
Dialogue: 0,0:03:33.37,0:03:36.73,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,thoughts that were louder,\Nthat captured your attention.
Dialogue: 0,0:03:37.74,0:03:42.55,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,One woman explaining to me\Nhow she learned to discern God speaking
Dialogue: 0,0:03:42.55,0:03:45.34,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,said that people were praying\Nover her one day,
Dialogue: 0,0:03:45.34,0:03:49.60,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,and the phrase "Go to Kansas" \Nflashed into her mind.
Dialogue: 0,0:03:50.57,0:03:52.16,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,So her parents live in Kansas.
Dialogue: 0,0:03:52.16,0:03:54.83,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,She was kind of idly thinking \Nabout visiting them,
Dialogue: 0,0:03:54.83,0:03:57.59,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,but when this thought\Njust captured her attention,
Dialogue: 0,0:03:57.68,0:04:01.16,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,it made her say, "You know,\Nmakes me want to say,
Dialogue: 0,0:04:01.16,0:04:02.94,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,'Where did that come from?'"
Dialogue: 0,0:04:03.59,0:04:08.100,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,So you could imagine there would be risks\Nfrom this style of discerning God's voice.
Dialogue: 0,0:04:09.00,0:04:10.19,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,(Laughter)
Dialogue: 0,0:04:10.19,0:04:13.94,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,I did think people were\Nreasonably thoughtful about the process.
Dialogue: 0,0:04:14.15,0:04:18.47,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,I also thought that the church\Ntook care to minimize those risks.
Dialogue: 0,0:04:18.62,0:04:20.94,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,One morning, the pastor said in church,
Dialogue: 0,0:04:20.98,0:04:25.16,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,"You know, if you think God is telling you\Nto relax and calm down -
Dialogue: 0,0:04:25.21,0:04:27.51,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,totally fine, take it as God.
Dialogue: 0,0:04:27.67,0:04:30.67,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,If you think that God\Nis telling you to quit your job,
Dialogue: 0,0:04:30.67,0:04:33.06,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,pack your bags and move to Los Angeles,
Dialogue: 0,0:04:33.38,0:04:36.68,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,I want you to be praying\Nwith every member of your house group,
Dialogue: 0,0:04:36.68,0:04:39.08,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,I want you to be praying\Nwith your prayer circle,
Dialogue: 0,0:04:39.08,0:04:41.51,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,I want you to be praying with me
Dialogue: 0,0:04:41.51,0:04:42.56,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,so that together,
Dialogue: 0,0:04:42.56,0:04:46.64,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,this community can help you\Nto discern whether that's actually God
Dialogue: 0,0:04:46.64,0:04:48.48,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,or just some of your own stuff
Dialogue: 0,0:04:48.48,0:04:51.06,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,that's getting in the way\Nof your relationship."
Dialogue: 0,0:04:51.06,0:04:52.52,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,(Laughter)
Dialogue: 0,0:04:53.94,0:04:57.00,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,So what are people doing \Nwhen they're praying like this?
Dialogue: 0,0:04:57.20,0:04:59.10,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,They're using their imagination
Dialogue: 0,0:04:59.11,0:05:02.80,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,to do something that they do not\Nregard as imaginary.
Dialogue: 0,0:05:02.93,0:05:06.20,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,If you're going to represent God,\Nif you're going to think about God,
Dialogue: 0,0:05:06.20,0:05:07.86,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,you've got to use imagination
Dialogue: 0,0:05:07.87,0:05:09.33,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,because God is invisible.
Dialogue: 0,0:05:10.70,0:05:13.38,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,It's a very 21st-century thing
Dialogue: 0,0:05:13.38,0:05:16.38,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,to draw the inference\Nthat if you're using your imagination,
Dialogue: 0,0:05:16.38,0:05:18.24,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,you are doing something false.
Dialogue: 0,0:05:18.55,0:05:22.37,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,It turns out that using the inner senses,\Nusing the imagination
Dialogue: 0,0:05:22.37,0:05:25.95,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,has been part of the tradition\Nof Christian spirituality
Dialogue: 0,0:05:25.95,0:05:27.81,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,for many, many years.
Dialogue: 0,0:05:27.81,0:05:30.96,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,The medieval monastics\Ncultivated their inner senses
Dialogue: 0,0:05:30.97,0:05:34.23,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,to make God more alive\Nand present to them.
Dialogue: 0,0:05:34.51,0:05:36.76,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,That's what these Christians are doing.
Dialogue: 0,0:05:36.76,0:05:39.06,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,They are not only\Ntalking to God in their mind -
Dialogue: 0,0:05:39.08,0:05:42.43,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,using their mind's ear to talk
Dialogue: 0,0:05:42.43,0:05:45.06,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,and then to listen\Nto something that God might say -
Dialogue: 0,0:05:45.06,0:05:49.32,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,they are imagining that they are sitting \Non God's lap while they're doing that,
Dialogue: 0,0:05:49.32,0:05:50.66,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,or they're on a park bench
Dialogue: 0,0:05:50.66,0:05:53.64,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,and they're trying to feel God's arm\Naround their shoulders,
Dialogue: 0,0:05:53.64,0:05:56.84,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,or they're in the throne room\Nand their cheek feels warm
Dialogue: 0,0:05:56.84,0:06:01.61,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,because of the heat\Nof the blazing light from the throne,
Dialogue: 0,0:06:01.61,0:06:03.97,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,or they're lighting a candle\Nto God in their mind
Dialogue: 0,0:06:03.97,0:06:07.98,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,and they're trying to smell the scent\Nof the smoke as it wafts up to heaven.
Dialogue: 0,0:06:09.14,0:06:13.46,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,My work demonstrates\Nthat this cultivation of the inner senses,
Dialogue: 0,0:06:13.69,0:06:15.16,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,it's a skill.
Dialogue: 0,0:06:16.08,0:06:19.58,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,You get better at it over time,\Nand it changes you.
Dialogue: 0,0:06:19.60,0:06:24.16,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,The people who do this, they say\Nthat their mental imagery gets sharper,
Dialogue: 0,0:06:24.17,0:06:28.69,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,they say that things they have to imagine\Nbecome more real to them,
Dialogue: 0,0:06:28.70,0:06:30.64,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,and they are more likely to report
Dialogue: 0,0:06:30.64,0:06:34.64,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,that God's voice would\Nsort of pop out into the world
Dialogue: 0,0:06:34.64,0:06:37.27,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,and they'll hear it with their ears.
Dialogue: 0,0:06:38.60,0:06:42.34,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,So just to give you a sense of the way \Npeople talk about their own change:
Dialogue: 0,0:06:42.83,0:06:44.26,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,This is a woman who said to me
Dialogue: 0,0:06:44.26,0:06:48.31,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,that as she began to pray,\Nher images would get so vivid,
Dialogue: 0,0:06:48.31,0:06:52.23,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,"Sometimes," she said, "it's almost\Nlike a PowerPoint presentation."
Dialogue: 0,0:06:52.98,0:06:55.30,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,And then she spontaneously\Ngave this example
Dialogue: 0,0:06:55.30,0:06:59.52,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,of God's voice popping out into the world\Nso she could hear it with her ears.
Dialogue: 0,0:07:00.41,0:07:02.70,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,So one morning, \Nshe had wonderful devotions,
Dialogue: 0,0:07:02.71,0:07:05.17,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,she felt great about\Nher prayer time with God,
Dialogue: 0,0:07:05.17,0:07:08.83,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,she came out on to the street -\Nit was Chicago, it was freezing -
Dialogue: 0,0:07:08.83,0:07:12.86,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,she was very grateful that God \Nbrought the bus along really quickly,
Dialogue: 0,0:07:12.86,0:07:14.95,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,she gets onto the bus,\Nshe's reading a book,
Dialogue: 0,0:07:14.95,0:07:17.08,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,she's getting all caught up in the book,
Dialogue: 0,0:07:18.13,0:07:20.58,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,and she is missing her stop\Nto get off the bus.
Dialogue: 0,0:07:20.58,0:07:23.69,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,And God says to her\Nin a way she can hear with her ears,
Dialogue: 0,0:07:23.69,0:07:25.41,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,"Get off the bus!"
Dialogue: 0,0:07:25.94,0:07:27.94,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,So she stops the bus driver, she gets off,
Dialogue: 0,0:07:27.94,0:07:29.42,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,and she feels wonderful all day
Dialogue: 0,0:07:29.42,0:07:32.03,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,that God has been\Nso intimately involved with her
Dialogue: 0,0:07:32.03,0:07:35.22,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,as to enable her to make her stop.
Dialogue: 0,0:07:36.52,0:07:39.24,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,What do we make\Nof those kinds of experiences?
Dialogue: 0,0:07:39.58,0:07:42.40,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,It turns out that\Nthese funny voices and visions,
Dialogue: 0,0:07:42.73,0:07:45.19,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,they are less unusual than you'd imagine.
Dialogue: 0,0:07:45.19,0:07:47.62,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,So depending on the way \Nthat you ask the questions,
Dialogue: 0,0:07:47.62,0:07:50.66,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,somewhere between 10%\Nof the general population
Dialogue: 0,0:07:50.66,0:07:53.48,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,and 70% of the general population
Dialogue: 0,0:07:53.48,0:07:56.48,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,will say they've had\None of these odd experiences,
Dialogue: 0,0:07:56.48,0:08:01.23,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,like maybe even drifting off to sleep\Nand you hear your mom calling your name,
Dialogue: 0,0:08:01.23,0:08:03.09,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,or maybe you walk into the living room
Dialogue: 0,0:08:03.09,0:08:05.47,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,and you look at the cat,\Nthe cat's on the couch,
Dialogue: 0,0:08:05.47,0:08:08.01,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,you look again, you realize\Nthe cat was never there.
Dialogue: 0,0:08:09.28,0:08:10.96,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,These are not crazy;
Dialogue: 0,0:08:11.13,0:08:13.61,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,they have a different\Nstructure and pattern
Dialogue: 0,0:08:13.63,0:08:15.76,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,than the kinds\Nof experiences people have
Dialogue: 0,0:08:15.76,0:08:19.03,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,when, for example, they meet\Nthe criteria for schizophrenia.
Dialogue: 0,0:08:19.24,0:08:24.46,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,They tend to be rare, they're common,\Nand many people have them.
Dialogue: 0,0:08:24.83,0:08:25.93,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,But when you ask people
Dialogue: 0,0:08:25.93,0:08:27.98,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,whether they've ever had\Nsuch an experience,
Dialogue: 0,0:08:27.98,0:08:31.57,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,they'll remember one, maybe two,\Nmaybe a handful of these experiences.
Dialogue: 0,0:08:31.62,0:08:33.00,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,They're really brief.
Dialogue: 0,0:08:33.00,0:08:35.64,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,You see the wingtip of an angel\Nand then it's gone.
Dialogue: 0,0:08:35.67,0:08:39.23,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,You hear a voice, four to six words,\Nand then it stops.
Dialogue: 0,0:08:39.33,0:08:40.81,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,And they are positive.
Dialogue: 0,0:08:40.81,0:08:45.81,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,I remember a woman who was in distress,\Nand she was driving down the street,
Dialogue: 0,0:08:45.82,0:08:51.97,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,and she really heard God speak\Nout of the seat behind her in the car
Dialogue: 0,0:08:51.97,0:08:55.10,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,and say, "I will always be with you."
Dialogue: 0,0:08:55.40,0:08:56.85,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,It was a little freaky.
Dialogue: 0,0:08:56.85,0:08:58.76,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,She pulled over to the side of the road.
Dialogue: 0,0:08:58.76,0:09:02.83,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,But then she wept with joy\Nbecause, I mean, why would you not?
Dialogue: 0,0:09:03.89,0:09:06.45,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,So these experiences can be powerful.
Dialogue: 0,0:09:07.70,0:09:10.82,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,My work demonstrates \Nthat they respond to training.
Dialogue: 0,0:09:11.08,0:09:14.22,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,The more people practice\Ninner sense cultivation,
Dialogue: 0,0:09:16.11,0:09:17.81,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,the more likely it is
Dialogue: 0,0:09:17.81,0:09:20.96,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,that they'll say that they've had\None or more of these experiences,
Dialogue: 0,0:09:20.96,0:09:25.16,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,and the more likely they are\Nto say that the experience was powerful.
Dialogue: 0,0:09:26.25,0:09:29.40,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,While doing this work,\NI ran an experiment.
Dialogue: 0,0:09:29.40,0:09:31.22,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,I got a hundred people into my office.
Dialogue: 0,0:09:31.22,0:09:32.23,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,We randomize them
Dialogue: 0,0:09:32.23,0:09:36.21,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,into lectures on the Gospels\Nor this inner-sense-rich prayer.
Dialogue: 0,0:09:36.37,0:09:40.65,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,And the rule was 30 minutes a day, \Nsix days a week, for four weeks.
Dialogue: 0,0:09:40.65,0:09:41.67,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,We brought them back;
Dialogue: 0,0:09:41.67,0:09:43.76,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,we gave them a bunch\Nof computers experiments
Dialogue: 0,0:09:43.76,0:09:45.47,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,and standardized questionnaires.
Dialogue: 0,0:09:45.47,0:09:48.27,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,And turned out it was the folks\Nin the prayer condition
Dialogue: 0,0:09:48.27,0:09:51.75,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,who, on average, reported\Nsharper mental images -
Dialogue: 0,0:09:51.75,0:09:54.56,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,they reported more sense\Nof God's presence,
Dialogue: 0,0:09:54.57,0:09:57.66,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,and they said that God was more present\Nas a person to them,
Dialogue: 0,0:09:57.66,0:10:02.25,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,and they were more likely to say that\Nthey had unusual spiritual experiences -
Dialogue: 0,0:10:02.25,0:10:05.23,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,among them these voices and visions.
Dialogue: 0,0:10:06.04,0:10:07.61,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,We were also able to demonstrate
Dialogue: 0,0:10:07.64,0:10:11.02,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,that some people\Nare better at this kind of stuff,
Dialogue: 0,0:10:11.04,0:10:14.38,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,independent of the amount of time \Nthey spend praying.
Dialogue: 0,0:10:14.39,0:10:18.71,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,We give people a standardized\Nquestionnaire that asks them, in effect,
Dialogue: 0,0:10:18.71,0:10:22.33,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,whether they feel comfortable\Nbeing adsorbed in their imagination.
Dialogue: 0,0:10:22.59,0:10:26.10,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Turns out that the more items \Nyou say true to on that scale,
Dialogue: 0,0:10:26.10,0:10:30.01,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,the more likely you are to say \Nthat you experience God as a person,
Dialogue: 0,0:10:30.03,0:10:31.78,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,the more likely you are to say
Dialogue: 0,0:10:31.80,0:10:34.64,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,that you have a back-and-forth\Nrelationship to God,
Dialogue: 0,0:10:34.64,0:10:36.45,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,the more likely you are to say
Dialogue: 0,0:10:36.45,0:10:40.64,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,that you've had one or more\Nof these odd voices and visions.
Dialogue: 0,0:10:42.21,0:10:44.05,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,So what do we learn from this?
Dialogue: 0,0:10:44.64,0:10:47.40,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Well, the skeptic could say\Nthat we learned that, you know,
Dialogue: 0,0:10:47.40,0:10:50.12,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Christians are just making it up\Nout of their imagination,
Dialogue: 0,0:10:50.12,0:10:52.86,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,and that's what I have\Nalways thought - end of story.
Dialogue: 0,0:10:53.16,0:10:54.25,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,I actually don't think
Dialogue: 0,0:10:54.25,0:10:56.92,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,that we learned anything\Nabout the real nature of God
Dialogue: 0,0:10:56.92,0:10:58.85,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,from these observations.
Dialogue: 0,0:10:58.87,0:11:02.04,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,I don't think that social science\Ncan answer that question.
Dialogue: 0,0:11:02.27,0:11:04.63,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,There's also a Christian way\Nto ask this question,
Dialogue: 0,0:11:04.63,0:11:09.37,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,which is, If God is always speaking,\Nhow come not everybody hears?
Dialogue: 0,0:11:11.39,0:11:14.44,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,I think what we learn\Nis that change is real,
Dialogue: 0,0:11:14.62,0:11:17.24,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,that as people enter churches like these
Dialogue: 0,0:11:17.24,0:11:19.98,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,and they begin to pay attention\Nto their mind in new ways,
Dialogue: 0,0:11:19.98,0:11:22.79,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,they begin to pay attention\Nto their inner senses,
Dialogue: 0,0:11:22.79,0:11:26.04,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,they really do have different experiences
Dialogue: 0,0:11:26.06,0:11:28.82,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,that they associate\Nwith the presence of God.
Dialogue: 0,0:11:29.22,0:11:30.93,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,I came to think of churches
Dialogue: 0,0:11:30.93,0:11:35.92,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,as offering a social invitation\Nto pay attention in particular ways,
Dialogue: 0,0:11:35.93,0:11:40.59,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,and I thought of individuals\Nas having a psychological response
Dialogue: 0,0:11:40.59,0:11:43.63,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,to the way that they trained\Nthat attention.
Dialogue: 0,0:11:45.06,0:11:48.70,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,I also think that we learned\Nthat belief is not a thing.
Dialogue: 0,0:11:48.82,0:11:50.93,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Sometimes if you are a secular person
Dialogue: 0,0:11:50.93,0:11:53.45,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,and you kind of look at somebody\Nwho is a believer,
Dialogue: 0,0:11:53.45,0:11:57.02,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,it is tempting to think that they have\Nthis extra thing in their life -
Dialogue: 0,0:11:57.02,0:11:59.82,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,it's like they've got\Na piece of furniture in their house
Dialogue: 0,0:11:59.82,0:12:01.68,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,that you don't have.
Dialogue: 0,0:12:01.69,0:12:02.75,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,(Laughter)
Dialogue: 0,0:12:02.90,0:12:06.21,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,I think these observations \Nsuggest that in many ways,
Dialogue: 0,0:12:06.21,0:12:09.10,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,the experience of God is made slowly,
Dialogue: 0,0:12:09.10,0:12:11.92,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,through the way that you pay\Nattention to your world,
Dialogue: 0,0:12:11.92,0:12:14.21,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,to the way that you pay\Nattention to your mind,
Dialogue: 0,0:12:14.21,0:12:17.08,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,to your history of hearing God\Nand talking with God
Dialogue: 0,0:12:17.08,0:12:20.04,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,and feeling more confident\Nthat God is there.
Dialogue: 0,0:12:20.19,0:12:24.86,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,I think these practices make\NGod more real to people,
Dialogue: 0,0:12:24.86,0:12:27.79,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,and that has a palpable effect\Non their life.
Dialogue: 0,0:12:28.39,0:12:31.42,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,I also think this helps to explain\Nwhy these kinds of practices
Dialogue: 0,0:12:31.45,0:12:34.67,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,are so much more appealing\Nin this kind of society.
Dialogue: 0,0:12:35.05,0:12:39.94,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Since the 1960s, there is\NChristian mainstream liberal churches -
Dialogue: 0,0:12:40.16,0:12:42.20,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,their membership has been plummeting.
Dialogue: 0,0:12:42.20,0:12:47.08,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Churches like these, they've exploded; \Nthe congregations are huge.
Dialogue: 0,0:12:47.08,0:12:49.84,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,I think it's because\Nof these kinds of practices.
Dialogue: 0,0:12:49.95,0:12:52.37,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,I think that they make God more relevant.
Dialogue: 0,0:12:52.71,0:12:55.83,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,You know, you're trying\Nto hear God speak -
Dialogue: 0,0:12:56.13,0:12:59.53,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,God shifts from a 45-minute\Nengagement on Sunday Morning
Dialogue: 0,0:12:59.53,0:13:01.98,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,to something you're doing\Nthroughout the week.
Dialogue: 0,0:13:01.98,0:13:04.74,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,These practices\Nmake God more real to people,
Dialogue: 0,0:13:04.88,0:13:07.05,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,they make God more alive.
Dialogue: 0,0:13:07.05,0:13:08.34,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,And I think these churches,
Dialogue: 0,0:13:08.34,0:13:11.08,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,by putting the emphasis\Non these practices,
Dialogue: 0,0:13:11.45,0:13:16.50,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,emphasize the experience of God\Nand emphasize God's mystery.
Dialogue: 0,0:13:16.73,0:13:20.19,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,And that helps somebody\Nto hang on to a sense of God
Dialogue: 0,0:13:20.19,0:13:25.52,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,in what they perceive\Nto be a skeptical, secular society.
Dialogue: 0,0:13:26.45,0:13:30.07,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,And finally, I think we learned\Nsomething about our minds.
Dialogue: 0,0:13:30.61,0:13:33.85,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,I think that we learned that the way\Nwe pay attention to our minds
Dialogue: 0,0:13:33.85,0:13:36.40,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,changes our mental experience.
Dialogue: 0,0:13:36.40,0:13:37.64,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,It's so tempting to think
Dialogue: 0,0:13:37.64,0:13:39.80,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,that the inner landscape\Nof your experience
Dialogue: 0,0:13:39.80,0:13:42.39,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,is somehow set as the way that it is.
Dialogue: 0,0:13:42.82,0:13:44.63,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,I think that we learned from this
Dialogue: 0,0:13:44.63,0:13:47.66,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,that whether or not\Nyou are a religious person,
Dialogue: 0,0:13:47.66,0:13:50.00,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,whether or not you believe in God,
Dialogue: 0,0:13:50.01,0:13:51.62,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,you are making choices
Dialogue: 0,0:13:51.62,0:13:55.16,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,in the way that you use\Nyour imagination and your inner senses,
Dialogue: 0,0:13:55.16,0:13:58.41,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,and the choices you make will change you.
Dialogue: 0,0:13:58.41,0:13:59.99,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Thank you very much.
Dialogue: 0,0:13:59.99,0:14:02.47,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,(Applause)