WEBVTT 00:00:01.048 --> 00:00:03.119 Gloria Steinem: Yes, hello, hello. NOTE Paragraph 00:00:03.143 --> 00:00:04.651 Pat Mitchell: Hello, hello. 00:00:04.675 --> 00:00:07.714 What a thrill to have this opportunity. 00:00:07.738 --> 00:00:11.767 When we ask all of our TED community, many of them, 00:00:11.791 --> 00:00:16.815 "Who would you like to hear from if we're going to look forward and onward, 00:00:16.839 --> 00:00:19.402 when it comes to women in the world?" 00:00:19.800 --> 00:00:23.783 Unanimously, the answer was "Gloria Steinem." 00:00:23.807 --> 00:00:27.964 Now I know you're way too modest to accept that easily, 00:00:27.988 --> 00:00:30.964 so before we move onward, 00:00:30.988 --> 00:00:32.742 may I go back a bit, 00:00:32.766 --> 00:00:35.940 since we have known each other for a long time, 00:00:35.964 --> 00:00:42.038 and talk about those early days when you were building a movement, 00:00:42.062 --> 00:00:44.371 challenging stereotypes, 00:00:44.395 --> 00:00:47.102 moving beyond cultural norms. 00:00:47.126 --> 00:00:51.498 You must have had some manifestation of "Fearless" in your life. 00:00:51.522 --> 00:00:55.585 What were your fears and how did you overcome them? NOTE Paragraph 00:00:56.847 --> 00:00:58.823 GS: No, I certainly had a lot of fears, 00:00:58.847 --> 00:01:02.047 and chief among them was speaking in public, 00:01:02.071 --> 00:01:03.511 just like I am now. 00:01:04.166 --> 00:01:07.614 Because, you know, we choose to express ourselves 00:01:07.638 --> 00:01:09.912 in the way that is most natural, 00:01:09.936 --> 00:01:12.529 and I became a writer because I didn't want to talk. 00:01:12.553 --> 00:01:17.656 So the first thing I had to overcome was the fear of public speaking, 00:01:17.680 --> 00:01:21.464 and because I was afraid to do it by myself, 00:01:21.488 --> 00:01:23.607 I asked a friend to do it with me -- 00:01:23.631 --> 00:01:26.133 Dorothy Pitman Hughes, and then Flo Kennedy -- 00:01:26.157 --> 00:01:30.855 anyway, so we became, in that way, somewhat accidentally, 00:01:30.879 --> 00:01:35.404 one white woman, one Black woman, speaking together, which, you know, 00:01:35.428 --> 00:01:40.014 was very helpful to express that the movement was for everyone. NOTE Paragraph 00:01:41.807 --> 00:01:43.988 PM: And in those early days, 00:01:44.012 --> 00:01:50.364 when you were becoming, not only a really powerful public speaker, 00:01:50.388 --> 00:01:52.252 in spite of your fears, 00:01:52.276 --> 00:01:55.773 you were also normalizing and creating 00:01:55.797 --> 00:02:01.209 response to a word that became the anthem for so many of us, 00:02:01.233 --> 00:02:03.339 literally changing lives, 00:02:03.363 --> 00:02:06.863 standing in front of crowds and saying, 00:02:06.887 --> 00:02:10.221 "Feminism is for every woman." 00:02:10.728 --> 00:02:14.895 And I see now, as you do, that there are still ways 00:02:14.919 --> 00:02:18.712 in which feminism is not understood as a concept. 00:02:18.736 --> 00:02:21.680 Misunderstood, criticized, sometimes ridiculed. 00:02:22.116 --> 00:02:25.895 How do you describe feminism? NOTE Paragraph 00:02:26.724 --> 00:02:30.296 GS: Well, it's just the radical idea that human beings are all equal 00:02:30.320 --> 00:02:36.863 and we can dispense with the labels of gender and class and race 00:02:36.887 --> 00:02:41.545 and begin to realize our unique individuality. 00:02:41.569 --> 00:02:44.640 Of course feminism was misunderstood in the beginning, 00:02:44.664 --> 00:02:48.122 as if it were about female superiority 00:02:48.146 --> 00:02:51.744 or it was a movement for lesbians only, 00:02:51.768 --> 00:02:52.926 not for all women. 00:02:52.950 --> 00:02:57.212 I mean, you know, there were all kinds of misunderstandings, 00:02:57.236 --> 00:02:59.045 not to mention ridicule. 00:02:59.069 --> 00:03:00.403 But I hope that that's past. 00:03:00.427 --> 00:03:03.283 I used to just send people to the dictionary 00:03:03.307 --> 00:03:05.393 to look up feminism, very helpful. NOTE Paragraph 00:03:05.417 --> 00:03:06.567 (Both laugh) NOTE Paragraph 00:03:07.069 --> 00:03:09.322 PM: How do you feel the new generation 00:03:09.346 --> 00:03:12.109 and the next generation of young women -- 00:03:12.133 --> 00:03:15.458 what is their relationship with the word 00:03:15.482 --> 00:03:18.261 and the concept of, "there's still a lot to be done 00:03:18.285 --> 00:03:20.497 to reach that equal step"? NOTE Paragraph 00:03:21.514 --> 00:03:23.369 GS: Yeah, well I don't think that -- 00:03:23.393 --> 00:03:27.752 I mean, the word is still there, womanism, women's liberation, 00:03:27.776 --> 00:03:29.815 there are all kinds of words, 00:03:29.839 --> 00:03:33.003 but I think it's much more about content 00:03:33.027 --> 00:03:36.241 and not worrying too much about form. 00:03:36.265 --> 00:03:41.527 So Black Lives Matter was started by three young Black feminists. 00:03:41.998 --> 00:03:44.640 You know, that was their creation 00:03:44.664 --> 00:03:50.164 that is beginning to change much that needs to be changed. 00:03:50.188 --> 00:03:51.887 And they just assumed 00:03:51.911 --> 00:03:55.478 that of course they were there as three young Black feminists. NOTE Paragraph 00:03:55.502 --> 00:03:58.622 PM: And in the early days of the women's movement 00:03:58.646 --> 00:04:00.328 and continuing all the way through, 00:04:00.352 --> 00:04:03.351 one of the ways that we have learned to talk to each other 00:04:03.375 --> 00:04:07.439 about difficult issues in which we may have disagreements, 00:04:07.463 --> 00:04:11.400 were sort of the talking circles or the consciousness raising, 00:04:11.424 --> 00:04:14.479 but is this something we could do 00:04:14.503 --> 00:04:18.240 to begin to build back the bridges between us? NOTE Paragraph 00:04:20.302 --> 00:04:23.808 GS: You know, I regret the emphasis on divisions, 00:04:23.832 --> 00:04:27.723 because we are more unified than any other movement in history. 00:04:27.747 --> 00:04:32.859 So I think we ought to celebrate that fact. 00:04:32.883 --> 00:04:36.789 And it comes out of talking circles as you point out, 00:04:36.813 --> 00:04:39.377 which used to be called consciousness raising groups. 00:04:39.401 --> 00:04:42.892 And it just means that you sit in a circle, 00:04:42.916 --> 00:04:46.329 as Native Americans taught us long ago, 00:04:46.353 --> 00:04:50.516 and you each get to speak in turn -- 00:04:50.540 --> 00:04:54.262 Native Americans passed around a talking stick -- 00:04:54.286 --> 00:04:57.889 and everybody has to listen while each person -- 00:04:57.913 --> 00:05:01.726 and in that way, you say unsayable things 00:05:01.750 --> 00:05:04.116 and somebody on the other side of the circle says, 00:05:04.140 --> 00:05:06.093 "Oh, I've experienced that too." 00:05:06.117 --> 00:05:10.791 And you discover what is shared 00:05:10.815 --> 00:05:16.391 and also, you discover how you can help each other. 00:05:16.415 --> 00:05:21.319 There's no substitute for those kinds of talking circles. NOTE Paragraph 00:05:22.098 --> 00:05:26.146 PM: I want to be the first to volunteer with you, Gloria, 00:05:26.170 --> 00:05:30.662 to start the talking circles and passing the talking sticks again. 00:05:30.686 --> 00:05:35.082 One of the surprising things that people who come into your presence 00:05:35.106 --> 00:05:38.816 are always surprised to find out what a great sense of humor you have. 00:05:39.201 --> 00:05:42.423 And one of my favorite books of the many you have written 00:05:42.447 --> 00:05:44.033 sits by my bedside, 00:05:44.057 --> 00:05:48.371 and the title of it -- forgive me those who might not like bad language -- 00:05:48.395 --> 00:05:53.544 the title is "The Truth Will Set You Free, But First It Will Piss You Off!" 00:05:53.568 --> 00:05:57.452 So I'm wondering now what truth is setting you free 00:05:57.476 --> 00:06:00.610 and what continues to piss you off? NOTE Paragraph 00:06:02.888 --> 00:06:05.539 GS: Well, actually, right at this moment, 00:06:05.563 --> 00:06:08.774 I mean, the truth is COVID -- 00:06:08.798 --> 00:06:13.537 you know, and we understand that is a universal experience 00:06:13.561 --> 00:06:15.815 and danger we're all dealing with, 00:06:15.839 --> 00:06:22.172 and what pisses me off is that we don't use that experience 00:06:22.196 --> 00:06:23.876 in the positive sense. 00:06:24.265 --> 00:06:29.164 In the sense that we learn from dangers 00:06:29.188 --> 00:06:32.093 as well as from accomplishments. 00:06:32.117 --> 00:06:37.153 It pisses me off that this is not used in a positive way 00:06:37.177 --> 00:06:43.550 to overcome the idea of categories of human beings 00:06:43.574 --> 00:06:46.545 or of national boundaries or of countries. 00:06:46.569 --> 00:06:49.360 I mean, we're all here on Spaceship Earth. NOTE Paragraph 00:06:49.384 --> 00:06:50.384 (Laughs) NOTE Paragraph 00:06:50.408 --> 00:06:54.349 We're all citizens of Spaceship Earth, and COVID knows that, 00:06:54.372 --> 00:06:57.053 so it should help to teach us that. NOTE Paragraph 00:06:57.767 --> 00:07:00.246 PM: And as we're looking at our current reality, 00:07:00.270 --> 00:07:03.863 we've seen yet another great milestone for women, 00:07:03.887 --> 00:07:06.061 in this country for sure, 00:07:06.085 --> 00:07:09.013 with the newly elected Vice President Kamala Harris, 00:07:09.037 --> 00:07:11.236 who said in her speech, you know, 00:07:11.260 --> 00:07:14.088 "I may be the first, but I won't be the last," 00:07:14.112 --> 00:07:18.541 and I think of the many times that you and I and others have said that. 00:07:18.565 --> 00:07:21.445 What difference will it make, 00:07:21.469 --> 00:07:23.720 in our country and around the world, 00:07:23.744 --> 00:07:27.847 when there are more women in all leadership positions, 00:07:27.871 --> 00:07:30.950 what are our differences as leaders? NOTE Paragraph 00:07:30.974 --> 00:07:32.474 GS: Well, I mean for one thing, 00:07:32.498 --> 00:07:36.022 we will have the advantage of using all of human intelligence 00:07:36.046 --> 00:07:38.908 instead of only a small portion of it; 00:07:38.932 --> 00:07:40.339 this would be a good thing. 00:07:42.307 --> 00:07:47.102 And we will also allow children 00:07:47.126 --> 00:07:51.181 to see themselves as leaders universally, 00:07:51.205 --> 00:07:53.386 instead of just one small group. 00:07:53.984 --> 00:07:57.619 Because right now, when kids look at leaders, 00:07:57.643 --> 00:08:00.729 they don't necessarily see themselves. NOTE Paragraph 00:08:01.047 --> 00:08:03.683 PM: When we look at you, we see a leader, Gloria, 00:08:03.707 --> 00:08:07.181 and there are so many things that you could point to with pride, 00:08:07.205 --> 00:08:09.608 although I know you don't. 00:08:10.339 --> 00:08:14.751 But what is it that motivates you 00:08:14.775 --> 00:08:20.128 or keeps you on the path onward in those moments of doubt, 00:08:20.152 --> 00:08:23.324 or the times when things look bleak or there are fears, 00:08:23.348 --> 00:08:25.117 or do you ever fear, 00:08:25.141 --> 00:08:26.776 ever feel those feelings? NOTE Paragraph 00:08:26.800 --> 00:08:31.605 GS: No, of course I fear, I mean, definitely. 00:08:31.629 --> 00:08:34.042 But as the slogan goes, 00:08:34.066 --> 00:08:36.257 "Follow the fear and do it anyway. 00:08:36.281 --> 00:08:38.304 Fear is a sign of growth." NOTE Paragraph 00:08:38.328 --> 00:08:39.478 (Laughs) NOTE Paragraph 00:08:39.502 --> 00:08:41.315 It's a good thing, right? NOTE Paragraph 00:08:41.339 --> 00:08:42.497 PM: Right. NOTE Paragraph 00:08:42.521 --> 00:08:44.606 GS: I'm so inspired by young women, 00:08:44.630 --> 00:08:46.253 I mean, I keep feeling 00:08:46.277 --> 00:08:50.537 as if I just had to wait for some of my friends to be born. 00:08:51.617 --> 00:08:57.729 And to see that this is profoundly 00:08:57.753 --> 00:09:01.204 a global movement, as it always has been. 00:09:01.228 --> 00:09:06.609 I mean, you know, even the response to the march right after the inauguration 00:09:06.633 --> 00:09:09.601 of the current president, in every -- 00:09:09.625 --> 00:09:13.688 Latin America, Africa, you know, were marching together. 00:09:13.712 --> 00:09:16.919 It really has become a global movement, 00:09:16.943 --> 00:09:19.886 thanks in large part to technology, 00:09:19.910 --> 00:09:23.371 because we can see each other, as we are now, 00:09:23.395 --> 00:09:30.151 and also just to the contagion of the idea of freedom, you know. 00:09:30.175 --> 00:09:36.395 If women spend nine months being pregnant and caring for a child, 00:09:36.419 --> 00:09:38.767 why isn't it that men are responsible 00:09:38.791 --> 00:09:42.141 for spending that much more than half the time 00:09:42.165 --> 00:09:44.410 taking care of the child, hello? NOTE Paragraph 00:09:44.434 --> 00:09:45.585 (Laughs) NOTE Paragraph 00:09:45.609 --> 00:09:47.807 Logic is in the eye of the logician, right? NOTE Paragraph 00:09:47.831 --> 00:09:48.982 (Laughs) NOTE Paragraph 00:09:49.006 --> 00:09:52.939 So you know, wherever you look, 00:09:52.963 --> 00:09:59.137 there's just a discovery of freedom, of common sense, of companionship. NOTE Paragraph 00:09:59.528 --> 00:10:00.875 PM: Is there, 00:10:00.899 --> 00:10:03.228 of all the things in your life, 00:10:03.252 --> 00:10:08.593 what has been the greatest source of confidence building and inspiration? 00:10:08.617 --> 00:10:12.189 Is it the global sisterhood that you've built around the world? NOTE Paragraph 00:10:12.213 --> 00:10:15.235 GS: Well, it's just other women. 00:10:15.259 --> 00:10:17.827 I mean, I would not have been able to ever conquer 00:10:17.851 --> 00:10:19.365 my fear of public speaking, 00:10:19.389 --> 00:10:21.664 which is where we started out, 00:10:21.688 --> 00:10:26.574 if it hadn't been for my fearless friend, 00:10:26.598 --> 00:10:27.947 Dorothy Pitman Hughes, 00:10:27.971 --> 00:10:30.104 you know, for doing it together. 00:10:30.718 --> 00:10:35.592 So you know, it's learning from each other, 00:10:35.616 --> 00:10:39.926 and just remembering to ask, really, 00:10:39.950 --> 00:10:41.934 because the help is there, 00:10:41.958 --> 00:10:45.228 the inspiration is there, 00:10:45.252 --> 00:10:48.251 the sense of community is there, 00:10:48.275 --> 00:10:54.496 and I hope that technology can help us in this way, 00:10:54.520 --> 00:10:56.747 especially because for women, that's important, 00:10:56.771 --> 00:11:00.558 because we can communicate in safety. 00:11:01.040 --> 00:11:06.012 But I do regret and worry about the COVID emergency, 00:11:06.036 --> 00:11:10.613 because we do also need to be together with all five senses 00:11:10.637 --> 00:11:13.256 in order to truly empathize. 00:11:13.280 --> 00:11:16.404 So I look forward to the day 00:11:16.428 --> 00:11:20.993 when you and I can once again be in the same room. NOTE Paragraph 00:11:21.895 --> 00:11:24.562 PM: Well, you and I have been in a lot of the same rooms, 00:11:24.586 --> 00:11:27.878 and even when you're not in the same room with women everywhere, 00:11:27.902 --> 00:11:29.950 you have inspired them, Gloria. 00:11:29.974 --> 00:11:32.324 And to see the full and total story, 00:11:32.348 --> 00:11:35.522 well, at least part of the full and total story, 00:11:35.546 --> 00:11:38.656 the movie has been made about Gloria's life. 00:11:38.680 --> 00:11:42.802 It's called "The Glorias," based on her book "My Life on the Road," 00:11:42.826 --> 00:11:45.769 which is certainly the way you've spent your life, 00:11:45.793 --> 00:11:49.683 and it's available for livestreaming on Amazon Prime 00:11:49.707 --> 00:11:52.649 and I do highly recommend it. 00:11:53.125 --> 00:11:56.910 Gloria, thank you for your work, 00:11:56.934 --> 00:11:58.322 for your life, 00:11:58.346 --> 00:12:02.839 for the fearless way in which you have led us all forward, 00:12:02.863 --> 00:12:07.450 and one last next step for moving onward from you? 00:12:07.474 --> 00:12:09.585 What advice or counsel? NOTE Paragraph 00:12:11.363 --> 00:12:12.513 GS: Ah. 00:12:14.030 --> 00:12:15.529 Just do it. NOTE Paragraph 00:12:15.831 --> 00:12:16.981 (Laughs) NOTE Paragraph 00:12:17.005 --> 00:12:21.738 You know, I think we kind of wait for instructions from up there, 00:12:21.762 --> 00:12:24.222 or we worry or something, 00:12:24.246 --> 00:12:29.141 and you know, if we just get up in the morning and say, 00:12:29.165 --> 00:12:31.125 "OK, I'm going to do this, 00:12:31.149 --> 00:12:35.228 and I'm going to get in touch with three or four other people," 00:12:35.252 --> 00:12:39.387 and just think of change as a tree, you know -- 00:12:39.411 --> 00:12:41.287 it doesn't grow from the top down, 00:12:41.311 --> 00:12:44.755 so we shouldn't be waiting for somebody to tell us what to do. 00:12:44.779 --> 00:12:47.212 It grows from the bottom up, 00:12:47.236 --> 00:12:49.521 and we are the roots of change. NOTE Paragraph 00:12:50.910 --> 00:12:54.158 PM: We are bearing the roots of your work, Gloria, with gratitude. 00:12:54.182 --> 00:12:58.460 Thank you very much for joining us for TEDWomen 2020. NOTE Paragraph 00:12:58.484 --> 00:13:00.841 GS: No, and thank you for bringing women together, 00:13:00.865 --> 00:13:02.039 which is the magic. NOTE Paragraph 00:13:02.063 --> 00:13:03.213 Thank you.