WEBVTT
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People from Here
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Welcome back to People from Here.
What we want to tell you today
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is the story of two young people,
of two young people with high hopes.
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There is Adelina,
a brilliant lawyer who worked
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at a prestigious legal firm in Milan.
Then there is Ettore,
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an industrial chemist.
The future can only smile
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upon Adelina and Ettore.
Actually,
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their future will be more troubled
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than they could have ever imagined.
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In fact,
in 1938 Ettore
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and Adelina are Jewish.
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On September 18th,
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from the balcony
of Trieste's town hall,
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Benito Mussolini announced
for the first time the Racial Laws
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for the defense of the race.
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The world of those two young people
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suddenly collapses under their feet.
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We will tell this story
about Ettore and Adelina
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on the eve of the day.
We will tell it with the son
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of Ettore and Adelina,
Daniele Finzi, who in 2011,
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decided to donate
his parents letters and documents
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to The Archives of Pieve Santo Stefano.
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Shortly we will also discuss why
this choice was made.
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Now I would like to start
with September 1938.
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with Mussolini's announcement
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of the laws for the defense of the race.
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Ettore and Adelina immediately started
to understand that there wasn't
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a future for them in that country.
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Deciding to leave was
was a difficult decision to make.
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It was a difficult decision,
but one that will save their lives.
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Yes, Ettore Finzi, my father,
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was very knowledgable about history.
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Also because he knew German very well.
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He had two aunts, aunt Genie
and aunt Lazigudita Gentiluomo,
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who both lived in Vienna.
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He had followed
all the Nazi antisemitism
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up to March 1938.
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So, in July 1938,
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when the Race Manifesto was published,
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he didn't expect it.
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He knew what it was about,
although he hoped
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that Italy would be
a little different than Germany.
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And my father, more than my mother,
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made quick and immediate decisions.
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He was also very intuitive.
He had known my mom only a few months,
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and he returns
to these months in April 1938.
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It was love at first sight,
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and because of the Race Manifesto
and the Racial Laws,
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they decided to get married.
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They were married in Milan
on December 1, 1938.
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In 1938 and now we arrive in 1939.
- Yes.
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An ominous date for many.
- Yes.
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Very unjust, but there is a turning point.
- There is a...
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Ettore and Adelina decide to leave.
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Or rather, how do they depart?
Because, in a way,
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they leave informed.
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Yes and no.
The problem is immediate
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and that of money.
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Because the White Paper of the British,
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from perhaps February
or March of 1939,
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had mandated
a total of 75,000 Jews
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that could enter Palestine for five years.
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However, to qualify to enter,
every person needed to have 1,000 stars.
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Because, like we said, they had chosen.
- To go to...
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The goal was Palestine.
- Yes.
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The choice was not a coincidence,
because my father had also thought
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about Latin America.
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But the idea of going
to Palestine was because it was nearby.
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He was from Trieste so it was close.
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He also hoped his parents could join him.
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In any case,
the issue of money was really
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a huge problem
because they didn't have any.
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So, thanks to the lawyer Gianni Morandi,
who was the owner of the firm
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where my mom worked,
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they went to Zurich for their honeymoon.
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Then they went to Lugano
to gather a large sum
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of money from the lawyer's clients.
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And I still remember two leather bags
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with thousands of stars inside.
They were gold little stars.
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At this point, they reach Palestine.
A tangent about Palestine.
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The State of Israel still didn't exist.
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There wasn't any money to protect them.
Therefore, they had to start from scratch.
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Yes, and so, they started all over again
from January to April 1, 1939.
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They arrived in Haifa on April 6th.
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Yes, because as of 1922,
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the British controlled Palestine.
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There were Palestinian Arabs.
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The Jewish Palestinians were organized
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by the Yishuv,
who were more concerned
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with the kibbutz,
and wanted to dedicate themselves
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to agriculture, etc.
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But the foundation,
the political one,
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was led by the Jewish agency.
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The Jewish agency was, well,
I'll give you an example.
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Okay,
so they arrived in Tel Aviv
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on April 7th.
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Twenty days later they were
in school learning modern Hebrew,
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because there were various Jews
in Tel Aviv
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from every part of Europe.
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So it was necessary
to learn this common language.
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There was some organization,
but there were a lot of problems.
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In any case, where I mentally find...
- Ah yes.
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this small amount of protection.
However, they had to start...
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Yes, they had to restart.
- from scratch.
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On the other hand, however,
there was a lot of bitterness
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that was left behind by the fact
of having to abandon...
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Yes.
- Italy.
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Having to leave Italy was stressful.
- Yes.
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In regard to this,
I will also read an excerpt
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from the letters
that have been donated to the archive.
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Diaries in which Ettore specifically tells
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about what he was feeling shortly after
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the time in which he abandoned Italy.
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We will read this excerpt:
"When I left Italy four months ago,
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"feeling more disgusted by the burden
of having to leave the country
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"than for the imminent danger,
many of my colleagues
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"and friends were quick
to express to me their discontent
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"about what was happening.
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"Through their conversations,
I felt they knew about condolences
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"and they ended up
only making me withdraw.
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"They were whispered conversations,
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"only because they knew me
and they valued me.
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"For many, being an example against
the persecution of Jews not being born
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"in Italy, could also be considered fair,
because it is understood that they came
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"to the country to make a fortune
by going behind other's backs.
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"They had some expert political views.
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"The Fascist government's right
to persecute people that it had let into
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"the country was generally recognized."
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So Ettore felt betrayed by Italy?
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Without a doubt.
Also because, as I was saying prior,
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my father was from Trieste.
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From his father, my grandfather,
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he also received an irredentist
and nationalist upbringing.
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Trieste had always been divided
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between people from Trieste, Austria...
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Let's say Austriacanti.
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Rather than irredentists,
who loved Italy, the Italian culture,
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the Italian language,
like my grandfather and the Slovenians.
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He had received this upbringing
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and so he was an irredentist nationalist.
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Additionally, he was a genius official,
and he felt like an Italian.
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He loved Italy
and he felt betrayed by this terrible law.
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In addition, in Ettore's letters,
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in this text, it also highlights
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a responsibility
by the Italian people themselves
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for what was happening.
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He writes:
"The political maturity
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"of the Italian people
is apparently that of government rule
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"that it has and that it deserves."
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There is a precise responsibility
by the people.
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Well, the Italian people's problem...
(Laughter)
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(Interview talking)
- Like saying living today like yesterday.
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In other words,
the lack of personal responsibility
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and this...
Well yes, accepting anything,
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like a leader or a guide,
that which is of
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an uglier appearance, if you will.
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And that Trieste...
Not coincidentally Mussolini
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and September 18, 1938,
where they were
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at the Unity of Italy Square
to present the Racial Laws.
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Not only because of
the nationalism that was there,
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but because Trieste was
a very multiethnic, multicultural city.
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There were more than two centuries
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in which ethnic groups were diverse.
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They coexisted.
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But at the very moment
in which Mussolini showed his cruelty
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towards Jews, who were Italian,
and felt as such,
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and had also fought
for Italy during the First World War...
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At the point,
everyone was inclined
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to accept Fascist rule.
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We return to Ettore and Adelina,
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who, because of their decisions,
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leave the Second World War behind,
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in which the persecution of Jews
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and the holocaust are about to start.
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They leave behind the errors of the war,
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however, as it is said,
they face a life
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that is not easy.
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Like we said,
Adelina was a lawyer with a great career.
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She finds herself having
to start her work up again.
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Yes, because the main difficulty was
a work shortage.
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There was an excess of workers
(Laughter)
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from Tel Aviv.
And then, there were few jobs
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or they were completely insecure.
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Another big problem was
a housing shortage.
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So much so that my parents were forced
to live with a family,
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with a Polish family in an apartment.
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Above all,
the main difficulty was the work shortage.
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Also because the two bags
of the two thousand stars were not
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to be touched at all.
My father was not flexible.
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Then my mom,
as long as my father remained in Tel Aviv
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until August 23, 1944,
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when he went to work
at the British oil refinery...
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(Interviewer Talking)
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No, he was also with my mom
because they then had my sister first,
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and then I was born in 1942.
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So when my father left,
he felt the need
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to work to support the family.
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He also liked the idea
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of having money to freely spend.
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As mentioned, your mother was free...
- Yes, free.
00:13:30.457 --> 00:13:31.946
in Palestine.
- Yes.
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Your father Ettore, on the other hand,
had to move abroad to Persia
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because, meanwhile, he found work
with an oil company.
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So two lovers
who find themselves far apart
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in foreign lands,
and the only point of contact
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between these two people becomes
the writing,
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the letters
that will then become so important
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for documenting, for their memories.
- Yes.
00:14:00.166 --> 00:14:05.812
In fact, my father accepted
this two year contract
00:14:05.832 --> 00:14:08.214
with the Iranian company.
00:14:08.634 --> 00:14:13.294
He was in Abadan in Persia.
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And indeed it was a military zone.
00:14:17.690 --> 00:14:21.607
He did his work there
as an industrial chemist.
00:14:21.909 --> 00:14:26.797
Naturally, he had to detach
and leave his wife
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and his children in Tel Aviv.
00:14:28.877 --> 00:14:31.222
Then, although very tired,
00:14:31.712 --> 00:14:36.111
every evening my mom wrote
00:14:36.191 --> 00:14:40.849
and reported what had happened
during her workday,
00:14:41.349 --> 00:14:45.539
because she had found work
with a company that was part
00:14:45.689 --> 00:14:48.852
of the Tel Aviv pharmaceutical industry.
00:14:48.982 --> 00:14:50.946
After then being fired,
00:14:51.336 --> 00:14:55.416
she went to work at a house to iron.
00:14:55.443 --> 00:14:59.096
So, she could do any job.
00:14:59.106 --> 00:15:04.458
She reported with great ability,
00:15:04.698 --> 00:15:07.968
descriptive, careful about everything
00:15:07.968 --> 00:15:13.072
that went on during the day.
Rather, my father sometimes wrote letters
00:15:13.072 --> 00:15:17.600
with extensive description.
He explained to her a bit about his duty,
00:15:17.600 --> 00:15:22.722
weather problems because it was very hot,
relationships with the British
00:15:22.765 --> 00:15:28.004
and with the local population
that was in truly devastating conditions.
00:15:28.035 --> 00:15:31.806
They were letters that,
among other things...
00:15:31.816 --> 00:15:34.907
If you permit me a tangent.
- (Interviewer) Of course.
00:15:35.327 --> 00:15:39.247
They were things one absolutely knew
but I didn't know
00:15:39.297 --> 00:15:41.343
the letters even existed.
00:15:41.696 --> 00:15:46.456
Then perhaps we can also elaborate
on how they were found.
00:15:46.506 --> 00:15:50.714
Then also about how the decision
to publish them came about.
00:15:50.980 --> 00:15:54.618
Let's go back.
We had said that while Ettore
00:15:54.618 --> 00:15:58.273
and Adelina were in Palestine,
their children were born.
00:15:58.273 --> 00:15:59.983
Yes, my sister...
- You were born
00:15:59.983 --> 00:16:01.530
and your sister Ana was born.
00:16:01.866 --> 00:16:06.705
It is fitting that the future
of these two children was often focused on
00:16:06.705 --> 00:16:10.667
in these letters that Ettore
and Adelina exchange.
00:16:10.916 --> 00:16:15.703
I would like to read another
particularly significant passage
00:16:15.722 --> 00:16:18.131
that is again written by Ettore
00:16:18.381 --> 00:16:22.701
from Abadan in February 23, 1945:
00:16:23.151 --> 00:16:26.775
"If on one hand, the war tends
to be nearing its end, on the other,
00:16:26.775 --> 00:16:30.075
"the situation in Palestine
is taking a favorable turn for us.
00:16:30.301 --> 00:16:34.102
"These days, I am overthinking
and continuously thinking
00:16:34.102 --> 00:16:38.384
"about the problem and worried,
not so much about our personal future,
00:16:38.544 --> 00:16:42.247
"but the future of our children.
I feel irresistibly taken towards
00:16:42.247 --> 00:16:45.734
"a solution that,
although never once explored,
00:16:45.734 --> 00:16:47.487
"today seems inevitable to me.
00:16:47.723 --> 00:16:50.068
"Perhaps in a year's time,
00:16:50.408 --> 00:16:54.008
"we will find the need
to return to Italy."
00:16:54.008 --> 00:16:57.616
"Then they will become
one hundred percent Italians."
00:16:58.070 --> 00:17:01.410
Probably if your father could have chosen,
00:17:01.453 --> 00:17:05.403
he would have never wanted
to return to Italy.
00:17:05.659 --> 00:17:08.307
Yes, I would not have wanted to also.
Quite the opposite
00:17:08.307 --> 00:17:13.035
because my father,
due to having been betrayed by Italy,
00:17:13.710 --> 00:17:17.520
deeply desired to return to Italy.
00:17:17.720 --> 00:17:20.930
Apart from the experience in Abadan,
00:17:21.620 --> 00:17:26.700
also because life
in Palestine was truly very hard,
00:17:26.700 --> 00:17:30.238
very difficult because
of the work problem,
00:17:30.628 --> 00:17:35.718
and the problem of the lack of apartments.
00:17:35.718 --> 00:17:40.475
However, we can't forget
that the attention
00:17:40.495 --> 00:17:42.837
from the Palestinian Arabs
00:17:43.177 --> 00:17:47.317
and the British made life difficult.
00:17:47.977 --> 00:17:53.307
If we could return back in time.
- Yes.
00:17:53.910 --> 00:17:57.441
In September 1940,
00:17:58.003 --> 00:18:02.343
Tel Aviv was bombed
by Italian planes, right.
00:18:02.443 --> 00:18:07.620
Yes.
- They bombed Tel Aviv
00:18:07.620 --> 00:18:10.527
and it seems like there were one hundred
and fifty two deaths.
00:18:10.527 --> 00:18:13.320
So life was very hard.
00:18:13.580 --> 00:18:16.170
Another tangent.
In other words,
00:18:17.090 --> 00:18:21.772
one of the big problems was also food.
00:18:22.253 --> 00:18:24.753
For example,
my sister and I went to the gan,
00:18:24.773 --> 00:18:28.713
which was like kindergarten.
00:18:29.083 --> 00:18:33.101
To help you understand, at lunch they used
to give us half an egg to eat.
00:18:34.471 --> 00:18:36.759
On the other hand,
00:18:36.829 --> 00:18:41.856
while facing this situation,
there continuously remained
00:18:41.856 --> 00:18:45.676
the hope of returning to Italy.
00:18:45.866 --> 00:18:49.513
And how did Adelina live
with the hope of returning?
00:18:49.513 --> 00:18:52.120
I will read another significant passage:
00:18:52.610 --> 00:18:57.410
"I will never ask who is taking that step.
Here I undoubtedly feel hesitant
00:18:57.410 --> 00:19:00.902
"by instinct and by force of tradition.
And I won't ever ask myself,
00:19:00.902 --> 00:19:04.421
"not only out of obedience,
but because, more than anything else,
00:19:04.421 --> 00:19:07.803
"I am concerned
about doing everything possible
00:19:07.803 --> 00:19:10.587
"for the future of our children."
00:19:10.947 --> 00:19:14.784
(Interviewer) It's like saying,
she was also willing to do her part.
00:19:14.784 --> 00:19:18.704
There was a sense of pride
of returning to Italy,
00:19:18.718 --> 00:19:22.306
that country that had dismissed them,
in order to guarantee
00:19:22.306 --> 00:19:24.000
a future for you children.
00:19:24.000 --> 00:19:27.914
Here there is a...
(Laughter)
00:19:27.914 --> 00:19:31.716
There are many letters.
In any case, when my father says
00:19:31.716 --> 00:19:34.439
that they will become
one hundred percent Italians,
00:19:34.839 --> 00:19:40.377
he also suggested
to my mom the idea
00:19:40.984 --> 00:19:43.684
of converting us to Catholicism,
00:19:43.991 --> 00:19:46.284
because we were Jews.
- (Interviewer) Of course.
00:19:46.987 --> 00:19:52.987
Then, meanwhile,
the Finzi of Trieste were
00:19:53.287 --> 00:19:55.217
almost completely assimilated.
00:19:55.457 --> 00:19:58.485
That is to say,
they went to the temple twice a year.
00:19:59.128 --> 00:20:03.990
Instead, my mom was
from a much more orthodox family,
00:20:04.444 --> 00:20:08.483
They came from the Parrdo lineage,
00:20:08.483 --> 00:20:12.153
which was a very important Iberian family.
00:20:12.203 --> 00:20:14.324
Parrdo which used to be Prado.
00:20:14.404 --> 00:20:18.744
They came from Spain after the expulsion.
00:20:18.744 --> 00:20:21.659
So my father proposes this idea
00:20:21.949 --> 00:20:25.349
of converting to Catholicism.
00:20:25.619 --> 00:20:30.762
in order for his children...
- (Interviewer) To become...
00:20:30.825 --> 00:20:34.506
Yes, to become entirely Italian,
even as a religion.
00:20:34.556 --> 00:20:39.192
However my mom...
Here it says that she was reluctant.
00:20:39.192 --> 00:20:43.165
Not because she was personally orthodox,
00:20:43.325 --> 00:20:48.765
but because,
when it was known what was happening
00:20:49.105 --> 00:20:54.693
in Europe with the extermination camps
or some other difficult situation,
00:20:54.703 --> 00:20:57.741
they absolutely didn't know
where my paternal
00:20:58.211 --> 00:21:00.877
and maternal grandparents were.
00:21:00.936 --> 00:21:03.537
However, the news arrived,
00:21:03.747 --> 00:21:08.617
even betraying the origin and...
00:21:08.617 --> 00:21:12.320
(Interviewer) It was quite heavy.
- Yes, very heavy.
00:21:12.716 --> 00:21:18.527
Speaking of, how did the news
about the war arrive meanwhile
00:21:18.527 --> 00:21:22.558
it continued in Europe?
Was there just an awareness
00:21:22.558 --> 00:21:25.522
of what was happening?
Was there an awareness
00:21:25.522 --> 00:21:29.823
of the existence
of the extermination camps?
00:21:29.823 --> 00:21:32.752
Above all, how did they also live
with these dual feelings?
00:21:32.752 --> 00:21:34.860
Because, on the one hand,
there was this hope
00:21:34.860 --> 00:21:38.927
of being able to return
to a normal life in Italy one day.
00:21:39.219 --> 00:21:42.063
On the other hand, however,
there was a lot of fear
00:21:42.063 --> 00:21:43.598
also for the fate of loved ones.
00:21:45.064 --> 00:21:46.317
They knew everything.
00:21:47.137 --> 00:21:52.008
Both about the Jewish agency
and about the British.
00:21:52.691 --> 00:21:56.707
The news arrived quite detailed.
00:21:57.527 --> 00:21:58.903
I don't want to forget
00:21:58.903 --> 00:22:02.743
that there was a noteworthy group
00:22:02.763 --> 00:22:05.437
of young Jews
00:22:05.837 --> 00:22:08.997
that were part of the Jewish brigade.
00:22:09.707 --> 00:22:13.530
They fought alongside the British
00:22:13.530 --> 00:22:16.170
and they also fought in Italy.
00:22:16.170 --> 00:22:17.811
Then in all of Europe.
00:22:18.321 --> 00:22:22.071
They were the ones who said
00:22:22.101 --> 00:22:27.570
that they offered very detailed news
of what was going to happen.
00:22:27.607 --> 00:22:31.253
So, they knew about everything
that was coming
00:22:31.273 --> 00:22:33.853
to Italy and Europe.
00:22:34.403 --> 00:22:39.442
The concerns were precisely
00:22:39.502 --> 00:22:43.692
that my paternal grandparents,
00:22:43.692 --> 00:22:48.285
who later died in Auschwitz,
didn't...
00:22:48.285 --> 00:22:53.875
The last official news was transmitted
by a type of telegram
00:22:54.265 --> 00:22:58.625
of the Red Cross
in July of 1943.
00:22:58.985 --> 00:23:01.733
My father knew absolutely nothing.
00:23:02.091 --> 00:23:03.432
My mom didn't know either.
00:23:03.542 --> 00:23:08.642
She knew that her parents were in hiding.
00:23:08.792 --> 00:23:10.957
Her brother was in Switzerland.
00:23:11.467 --> 00:23:14.317
But they had absolutely no news.
00:23:14.577 --> 00:23:18.615
They couldn't say or write anything,
00:23:19.045 --> 00:23:21.775
because the mail was altered.
00:23:22.625 --> 00:23:26.074
Both the outgoing
and the incoming mail was altered.
00:23:26.634 --> 00:23:29.048
I found that some of the letters...
00:23:29.048 --> 00:23:30.968
(Interviewer talking)
- Yes, the details.
00:23:30.978 --> 00:23:36.724
They were deleted
by the person that made the changes.
00:23:36.724 --> 00:23:40.883
So, dad needed to be attentive,
because they were altered by the British.
00:23:41.214 --> 00:23:43.769
They were altered by the Persians.
(Laughter)
00:23:43.859 --> 00:23:46.099
Then they were altered
on arrival in Palestine.
00:23:46.099 --> 00:23:46.884
So, they were...
00:23:46.884 --> 00:23:50.453
In this situation,
they also found themselves
00:23:50.453 --> 00:23:56.180
in a state of uncertainty being far
from Europe.
00:23:56.370 --> 00:23:59.809
Being far
from what was happening in Europe.
00:24:00.019 --> 00:24:01.999
Far from the war.
00:24:03.059 --> 00:24:08.363
For a moment, Adelina perhaps had hoped,
from what Ledi writes,
00:24:09.363 --> 00:24:13.273
that her family would have an advantage
00:24:13.273 --> 00:24:17.753
over the immense tragedy
that afflicted the Jews of Europe.
00:24:18.035 --> 00:24:21.255
That they would all find themselves
reunited upon their return.
00:24:21.255 --> 00:24:23.675
There was almost this illusion, this hope.
00:24:24.060 --> 00:24:28.538
Having high hopes is often the last idea.
They did have hope.
00:24:28.985 --> 00:24:33.907
They hadn't had detailed news,
00:24:34.421 --> 00:24:39.071
even though then my dad's brother,
who was...
00:24:39.571 --> 00:24:44.932
He was a doctor who lived in Bologna,
00:24:44.952 --> 00:24:50.400
but in the mountain area
of Monghidoro and Loiano.
00:24:51.137 --> 00:24:55.290
He knew
that his parents had been arrested,
00:24:55.293 --> 00:24:56.843
that they had been deported.
00:24:57.233 --> 00:25:02.515
However, he had not communicated anything.
Even though assuming,
00:25:02.905 --> 00:25:06.711
that they went to Auschwitz,
there could have always been
00:25:07.121 --> 00:25:10.601
the hope of their return
Therefore, they hoped.
00:25:11.311 --> 00:25:14.575
Unfortunately, however,
the terrible news arrived.
00:25:14.575 --> 00:25:19.609
They also arrived in Palestine while
the war by now...
00:25:19.609 --> 00:25:22.092
It was over.
- By now it was over.
00:25:22.276 --> 00:25:26.075
And like you said,
the terrible news arrived by mail.
00:25:26.405 --> 00:25:31.742
News so terrible
that Adelina cannot even transcribe them
00:25:31.742 --> 00:25:34.153
in a letter to Ettore.
She writes:
00:25:34.343 --> 00:25:38.025
"My dear, unfortunately,
the dreary news has arrived.
00:25:38.275 --> 00:25:41.129
"I am sending you the letter
because I don't have the courage
00:25:41.379 --> 00:25:42.330
"to write about it."
00:25:42.330 --> 00:25:47.086
It's terrible.
Unfortunately, they were effects
00:25:47.086 --> 00:25:51.448
(Interviewer) of what just happened
in the war in Europe.
00:25:52.466 --> 00:25:55.684
(Daniele) In a letter separate
from the international cross.
00:25:55.747 --> 00:25:59.793
(Interviewer) Maybe in that exact moment
is when Ettore and Adelina understood
00:25:59.853 --> 00:26:03.168
what they had escaped from?
00:26:03.712 --> 00:26:08.954
Yes without a doubt.
I will also tell you
00:26:08.954 --> 00:26:14.752
that when dad had
the great idea of going to Palestine,
00:26:14.845 --> 00:26:19.890
everyone criticized him;
friends, parents, brothers, the sister,
00:26:19.946 --> 00:26:25.663
because they said:
"You are always pessimistic".
00:26:26.395 --> 00:26:31.497
He would rather have wanted them all
to also come with him.
00:26:32.038 --> 00:26:36.209
However, we can say
that he expected it,
00:26:36.213 --> 00:26:39.353
also because the war
00:26:39.873 --> 00:26:43.773
in Europe ended on May 8, 1945.
00:26:44.103 --> 00:26:46.587
The news gets to him in August.
00:26:47.357 --> 00:26:53.147
Given that months go by
where he doesn't receive
00:26:53.147 --> 00:26:57.124
positive news,
he feared for the lives of his parents.
00:26:57.744 --> 00:27:00.066
Excuse me, if you allow me...
(Interviewer) Sure.
00:27:00.066 --> 00:27:04.320
But before the communication
00:27:04.480 --> 00:27:07.560
about the deaths of his parents,
00:27:07.560 --> 00:27:10.336
he received communication from Sweden
00:27:10.685 --> 00:27:14.936
that said his sister was saved.
00:27:17.106 --> 00:27:23.103
Then my aunt Yolanda Clara was part
of that group of prisoners
00:27:23.103 --> 00:27:28.008
that were moved
from Auschwitz in December 1944.
00:27:28.008 --> 00:27:32.150
They were moved west
because the Red Army was coming.
00:27:32.150 --> 00:27:34.709
Since they didn't want them to see
00:27:34.709 --> 00:27:39.989
a mass of prisoners in Auschwitz,
they were moved.
00:27:40.409 --> 00:27:44.858
She was then liberated
in the north of Ravensbrück
00:27:46.288 --> 00:27:49.088
in April 1945.
00:27:49.088 --> 00:27:52.952
She was then transferred
to Sweden to recover.
00:27:53.535 --> 00:27:59.169
We have said that at this point,
the war had ended and Ettore and Adelina
00:27:59.403 --> 00:28:04.286
along with their children decide
to return to Italy.
00:28:04.714 --> 00:28:09.234
How difficult was it once again to start
from scratch because they actually had
00:28:09.234 --> 00:28:10.284
to start from scratch.
00:28:10.290 --> 00:28:12.409
Ah yes.
It was difficult.
00:28:12.619 --> 00:28:17.951
My father's brother helped him obtain
a job at his work in Sansepolcro.
00:28:18.460 --> 00:28:22.143
He spoke with Mr. Marco Vittoni,
who said:
00:28:22.143 --> 00:28:26.364
"I am willing to hire your brother
because he is a chemist.
00:28:26.660 --> 00:28:32.109
"Also, I want a change of pace
for the company, etc".
00:28:32.662 --> 00:28:38.159
But when we arrived in Italy in May 1946,
00:28:38.400 --> 00:28:40.680
with a short stop in Bologna
and then to Parma
00:28:40.680 --> 00:28:42.571
with my maternal grandparents,
00:28:42.571 --> 00:28:45.351
and then to Sansepolcro precisely
00:28:45.906 --> 00:28:51.122
in November of 1946,
we had absolutely nothing.
00:28:52.328 --> 00:28:54.212
And there was nothing...
(Laughter)
00:28:54.212 --> 00:28:56.832
(Interviewer) Without a doubt,
a country in devastation.
00:28:56.832 --> 00:28:58.512
Yes, a country in devastation.
00:28:58.512 --> 00:29:03.040
I remember the path with holes.
I remember the Tower of Berta Square
00:29:03.040 --> 00:29:06.523
in a pile of ruins.
- The Tower of Berta Square was destroyed.
00:29:06.771 --> 00:29:12.297
I repeat, it was also a problem to eat.
00:29:12.367 --> 00:29:16.527
I remember my dad rented
a furnished apartment
00:29:16.527 --> 00:29:21.762
in Saint Claire Square
in which the conditions were really...
00:29:21.911 --> 00:29:24.129
Insecure.
- Very, very insecure.
00:29:24.129 --> 00:29:28.309
However, they were young
and they wanted to start over.
00:29:28.717 --> 00:29:31.269
There was my sister and myself.
00:29:31.272 --> 00:29:36.776
So, they wanted to put a painful time
00:29:36.776 --> 00:29:39.546
of their lives behind them and start over.
00:29:39.546 --> 00:29:44.762
You have previously already answered
that there was resentment towards
00:29:44.762 --> 00:29:49.694
that country that made them escape
and also towards those friends
00:29:49.701 --> 00:29:52.467
that...
- No.
00:29:52.467 --> 00:29:56.248
were against the idea
of the Racial Laws.
00:29:56.398 --> 00:29:59.018
No, absolutely not.
00:29:59.018 --> 00:30:02.690
Other than it being something
that is part of our DNA,
00:30:02.690 --> 00:30:06.305
resentment is useless.
00:30:06.305 --> 00:30:09.545
I was taught
that it's best to let things go,
00:30:10.815 --> 00:30:12.192
move forward,
00:30:12.195 --> 00:30:17.047
have the will to start again,
and to overcome difficulties.
00:30:17.047 --> 00:30:17.825
Not resentment.
00:30:17.935 --> 00:30:23.530
I never heard my father
nor my mother speak ill
00:30:23.530 --> 00:30:25.002
of Italians.
00:30:25.332 --> 00:30:28.911
Yes, it was upsetting to have lost.
00:30:29.411 --> 00:30:30.701
(Interviewer talking)
- Yes.
00:30:30.701 --> 00:30:36.332
To having lost parents.
To having lost years of work.
00:30:36.342 --> 00:30:41.473
My mom could not return to work
in Milan because there was no way
00:30:41.773 --> 00:30:42.766
to find a home.
00:30:44.518 --> 00:30:47.365
In 2011,
the epistolary
00:30:47.375 --> 00:30:52.925
of Ettore Finzi and Adelina was donated
00:30:52.925 --> 00:30:57.000
to the Pieve diary archives.
It's awarded the Premio Pieve.
00:30:57.048 --> 00:31:02.938
First and foremost, how were you able
to find these letters again,
00:31:02.938 --> 00:31:06.199
because they were made public
by the decision of donating them.
00:31:07.327 --> 00:31:11.486
My father died on June 18, 2002.
00:31:13.724 --> 00:31:18.572
He lived in an apartment
in Parma and in August,
00:31:18.592 --> 00:31:20.772
I was ready to let go
of the apartment.
00:31:21.612 --> 00:31:27.001
By chance, I found a bag in his office,
00:31:27.451 --> 00:31:31.411
a leather one with straps
that holds documents.
00:31:31.961 --> 00:31:37.704
There were letters inside
this document holder.
00:31:38.691 --> 00:31:42.948
And there were two notebooks,
black ones with a red border
00:31:42.948 --> 00:31:46.444
that were used in the past,
and inside was his diary.
00:31:47.327 --> 00:31:51.653
I understood right away
because I have done historical research
00:31:51.653 --> 00:31:55.606
for many years, so I understood
it was something interesting.
00:31:56.022 --> 00:31:59.670
I found it strange
that my father never told me anything,
00:31:59.670 --> 00:32:02.141
because he didn't say to me:
"Listen,
00:32:02.791 --> 00:32:06.071
"there are letters and diaries".
00:32:06.671 --> 00:32:10.739
And so I took them all to my house,
to my office and I left them there
00:32:10.739 --> 00:32:12.870
for a year, a year and a half.
00:32:13.360 --> 00:32:16.734
Then I gradually began to read them
with a bit of fear.
00:32:17.538 --> 00:32:21.698
Because with diaries and letters...
- (Interviewer) One will find...
00:32:21.698 --> 00:32:26.119
always find something intimate.
Then I think in my family,
00:32:26.119 --> 00:32:31.574
nothing would ever be talked about.
No one had ever commented,
00:32:31.574 --> 00:32:35.307
or made any references.
00:32:35.899 --> 00:32:40.136
Then I gradually began
to transcribe these letters.
00:32:40.136 --> 00:32:43.837
I can't tell you how I did so,
because they were written...
00:32:43.897 --> 00:32:45.573
(Interviewer) No doubt handwritten.
00:32:45.573 --> 00:32:49.340
Yes, handwritten with a fountain pen,
on tissue paper,
00:32:49.339 --> 00:32:51.827
because back then it was airmail paper.
00:32:52.217 --> 00:32:56.357
In short, it was a type of job
00:32:56.357 --> 00:32:58.977
that strained the eyes.
00:32:59.627 --> 00:33:05.530
In any case, I did this transcription job
of the diary, of the letters, etc.
00:33:05.530 --> 00:33:08.136
I had the idea of publishing
00:33:08.764 --> 00:33:13.865
the copy or, in other words,
the full version
00:33:14.305 --> 00:33:16.655
of this diary, of these letters...
00:33:17.345 --> 00:33:22.759
Just to be certain...
I was already collaborating
00:33:22.759 --> 00:33:26.979
with the diary archives
for some time for my own research
00:33:27.239 --> 00:33:30.529
in the topics of Rinisci, Paganini, etc.
00:33:31.029 --> 00:33:35.810
Just to be certain,
I went to Pieve Santo Stefano
00:33:36.760 --> 00:33:39.550
and I had the volume in hand.
00:33:40.212 --> 00:33:43.096
It was Cristina Cangi, who you will meet.
00:33:43.946 --> 00:33:46.926
And she asked me:
"What is that professor"?
00:33:46.930 --> 00:33:52.281
"It's work that I did".
- "Why don't you submit it for the award"?
00:33:52.930 --> 00:33:57.227
I said I really had not thought
about wanting to publish it.
00:33:58.045 --> 00:34:03.656
Then I start reading
some very interesting things,
00:34:03.676 --> 00:34:04.965
and then I submit it.
00:34:04.965 --> 00:34:09.972
They asked me for the archive
and also for the letters,
00:34:09.972 --> 00:34:11.745
but I wasn't going to do that.
00:34:11.781 --> 00:34:17.007
It's possible
to read this publication
00:34:17.007 --> 00:34:19.611
that is titled Transparenti,
in which the documentation
00:34:19.611 --> 00:34:23.531
is presented
and published by Il Mulino.
00:34:23.876 --> 00:34:28.146
Our arrangement time has ended,
although we would like to talk for hours
00:34:28.146 --> 00:34:34.142
about this story that is a bit similar,
by certain passages and elements,
00:34:34.142 --> 00:34:36.660
to the story
of many other families.
00:34:36.905 --> 00:34:39.858
Also similar to the province of Arezzo.
00:34:40.138 --> 00:34:44.168
Perhaps there will be a way
to talk more about it in the future.
00:34:44.448 --> 00:34:46.937
Thank you Daniele Finzi.
00:34:46.937 --> 00:34:52.562
Thanks to all of you
who have followed our episode,
00:34:52.562 --> 00:34:54.776
a special episode
that was made possible
00:34:54.776 --> 00:35:00.425
in collaboration
with The Archives of Pieve Santo Stefano.
00:35:00.425 --> 00:35:05.443
I naturally thank The Archives.
Specifically,
00:35:05.443 --> 00:35:08.245
the archives
for this episode were made available
00:35:08.245 --> 00:35:10.307
by Nadia Frulli.
00:35:10.630 --> 00:35:15.017
Thank you to all of you
for watching the program.