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Welcome to the Brigham Young
University Family History

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Library Webinar Series.
My name is Sean Firmage.

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I will be your host 
for this webinar.

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Today we will be pleased to hear 
from Kathryn Grant, who will be

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giving a presentation titled,
"What every Family Tree User

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should know about 
name-finding apps.

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After years on the sidelines, 
Kathryn started doing

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family history and discovered to her 
surprise that she loved it.

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Her specialty is mentoring 
new family historians and

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helping them find success,
and maybe even avoid

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some of the mistakes
that she's made.

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Kathryn teaches Sunday classes 
at the BYU Family History Library.

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She also presents at 
Riverton Saturday Seminars

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and other family 
history events.

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Her column on family history 
ran in the Nauvoo Times

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for about a year and is still 
available online.

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Kathryn works for the LDS Church 
as a technical writer,

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with a focus on usability 
and process improvement.

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Besides family history, 
she loves uplifting music,

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thought-provoking books 
and spring lilacs.

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Kathryn, we’ll turn 
the time over to you.

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(Kathryn) Great! Shaun, 
thank you so much.

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Hi everybody and welcome 
to our webinar today.

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As we’ve seen, technology has 
its blessings and challenges

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and we appreciate your patience 
as we’ve gotten started with this.

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Today’s webinar is about a very 
important topic that has become

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of interest to people with the 
many name-finding apps

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being made available 
to Family Tree users.

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Maybe you have had a friend 
approach you and say something like,

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“Hey! Have you tried 
such-and-such an app?

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It’s amazing! 
In a matter of minutes,

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I found over a hundred names 
for temple work!”

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Name-finding apps have become
popular in the last few years

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for doing family history, 
but they’re also widely

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misunderstood 
and even misused.

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And that misuse has some 
unexpected consequences.

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Today I’m hoping that we can shed
some light on those consequences

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and talk about how 
to avoid them.

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I hope this webinar will be of help 
to three main audiences.

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The first is for people 
who are using the apps

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or may be considering 
using the apps.

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The second audience 
is for consultants

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who help others 
to find family names.

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And then finally, 
developers of name-finding apps

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or those who may be considering 
developing a name-finding app.

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Here's a short overview of what 
we’re going to be talking about.

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First of all, we’re going to get 
on the same page as far as what

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we’re talking about 
in this particular webinar

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when we say 
“name-finding apps.”

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Then we’re going to talk about 
some common misconceptions

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that people have about 
name-finding apps.

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Then we’ll look at some 
unintended consequences.

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And finally, we’ll look 
at an alternative approach.

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So let’s go ahead 
and dive in.

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What do we mean in this webinar 
when we talk about name-finding apps?

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Basically we’re talking about apps 
that crawl FamilySearch Family Tree

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to find names with 
green temples.

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Why is there such an appeal 
for name-finding apps?

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I am guessing if you 
joined this webinar,

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you’ve probably had more than one 
friend talk to you about their

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favorite name-finding app 
and how much they love it.

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So, why do people love 
these apps so much?

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Well, name-finding apps say that 
they will save you time,

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that they will reduce the effort 
required for family history,

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that they will eliminate the tedium
(and who doesn’t want that),

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and then finally, they promise to 
make family history fast and easy.

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Now, for a lot of us, especially 
if we are just starting out,

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family history can seem like 
kind of a black box

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and we hear people talk about 
how they spent years

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trying to break down 
a brick wall.

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And we might look at some 
genealogical problem

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and just be completely 
flummoxed.

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What’s not to love about 
an app that says

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it’s going to take away 
all those problems?

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But there’s a little bit more to it, 
so let’s look at some of the common

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misconceptions that happen when 
people use these apps.

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It’s important to point out 
that people don’t promote

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these misconceptions 
on purpose.

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In other words, no user 
or developer, for that matter,

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says, “I think I’ll spread 
some misconceptions.”

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When we have misconceptions, 
one of the reasons we have them

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is that we don’t know they’re 
misconceptions.

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It’s been my experience 
that these misconceptions

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lead to using 
name-finding apps

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and using the apps tends to 
reinforce the misconceptions.

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Let’s look at a few 
of those misconceptions.

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First of all there are 
three misconceptions

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that tend to go 
hand-in-hand.

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The first is that the 
Church is the entity

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that provided the 
names in Family Tree.

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If we think that, 
it’s not a very far leap

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to believe if the Church 
provided the names,

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they must be verified
and ready for temple work.

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It’s a logical conclusion, 
right?

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Finally, if we believe the Church
has provide the names

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and they are ready for temple work, 
it’s not too much of a stretch

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to believe Family Tree 
was supposed to be

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an on-going source 
of temple names.

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Let’s take a look at the truth 
about each of these.

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The first misconception
that the Church provided

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the names in Family 
Tree is not true.

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Where the names came from was
users, interestingly enough.

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And that's something that is 
very often misunderstood

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especially by new users
to FamilySearch because

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the FamilySearch website is 
sponsored by the Church

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so it's logical to think the
Church provided those names.

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But what the Church and 
and FamilySearch did 


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was they gathered names 
that were provided by users.

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I have another webinar 
that goes into a lot more detail

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on that so I won’t go into 
a lot of detail here,

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but it's important to realize 
the names in Family Tree

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were ultimately 
contributed by users.

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Here’s an example, for those 
of you who might remember

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the 4-generation program
of the last century.


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We sent in our 
family history

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on family group sheets 
like this one.

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This is an actual family group 
sheet for James Waterfield.

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He’s got a couple of daughters, 
but notice there’s no wife,

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and there’s a half-sister 
to these other daughters here,

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but the information 
is scanty.

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Rose Hannah has more information; 
Mary, not so much.

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But before we judge 
people too harshly,

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we might look at 
this record and go,

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“Wow, that’s kind of shoddy work! 
That wasn’t very complete.”

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Remember, this sheet was prepared 
before the days of the internet.

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The person may not have even had 
access to a typewriter back then,

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for those of you who know 
what typewriters are

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since we don’t use them 
much anymore.

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I have no doubt this person was 
doing the very best that they could.

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They were following the 
counsel to collect names

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for four generations and to 
submit them to the church.

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And to be honest with you, 
many of the names that are

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submitted to Family Tree, 
are about of this quality.

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It’s harder to see when 
the name is digital.

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We can look at this family group 
sheet and see there’s a lot missing.

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But when you look at this 
same name in Family Tree,

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it's not quite so obvious
what's missing.

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We don’t want to be judgmental 
or critical of people

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who have put names in 
Family Tree.

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Whether they did it through 
an old 4-generation program

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or they're doing it today, 
they’re doing the best they can

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with the information 
and skills that they have.

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For any of you who 
have indexed,

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you may be familiar with the old
extraction program,

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which was the forerunner 
of the indexing program.

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Many extracted names were 
also added to Family Tree.

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We see the neat screen in 
Family Tree and it's all digital

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and beautiful and easy to read,
and sometimes we don't stop

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to think about where that
information came from.

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It came from a record like this. 
Some are a little easier to read.

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Some are a lot harder.
But they were, in many cases,

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handwritten records made 
at the time of the event

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by a person who may or may not 
have had an extensive education.

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People were doing their best, 
but this kind of information

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ended up in Family Tree and it 
varied widely in quality.

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So, did the Church verify all the 
names in FamilySearch Family Tree?

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Actually, they didn’t. 
Not because they didn't want to,

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but because it simply 
wouldn’t be feasible.

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Family Tree has 1.1 
billion names in it, 


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so it wouldn’t have been 
feasible for the Church to get

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the staff and the manpower 
to verify every single one.

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The truth is, we the users 
are responsible for

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verifying the names 
in Family Tree.

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Many of those names 
that we just looked at

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became green temples 
in Family Tree.

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So those extracted records 
or names submitted with the old

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3 and 4 generation program, 
ended up in Family Tree

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with green temples 
looking like they need

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temple work when 
they actually don’t.

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And that’s an important 
thing to be aware of

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when you’re using 
a name-finding app.

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In my experience, about 80% 
of the green temples that I find

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in Family Tree do not need 
temple work and there are

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four main reasons for that, 
that are listed here on the screen.

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The first one is they 
might be a duplicate.

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If they are a duplicate 
of a record that already has

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temple work attached, then 
that work doesn’t need to be done,

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the records just
need to be merged.

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The records might also have 
errors in vital information.

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As an example, I found a record 
in Family Tree that had come from

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an early submission that 
had the birth place

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of Cathearth in 
Cambridgeshire, England.

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And there was no such place 
as Cathearth, but because

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the last name of that person on the 
record was one of my family names,

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and because it was close to 
where that family lived,

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which was actually 
a place called Chatteris,

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I thought there’s something going 
on, I’m going to check this out.

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So I found the original submission 
and was able to determine

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that the person had meant 
Chatteris and not Cathearth.

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But because of the error 
in that vital information,

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a duplicate did not come up 
when I did the search.

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As soon as I corrected the error, 
the duplicate came up

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and this woman’s temple work 
had already been done.

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So errors in vital information 
can cause problems.

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There can be relationship errors. 
Not too long ago,

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I found a mother having 
children when she was four.

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Not so likely, right? 
So there was a problem there.

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Even though those names 
had green temples on them,

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they weren’t ready 
for temple work.

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Another common problem is that 
people will put in names,

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maybe based on a census 
or they’ll come from extraction,

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where they won’t have a death date 
because they don’t know it

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so the person shows up 
with a green temple,

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but a little more research shows 
that they died before eight

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and all they need is 
sealing to parents.

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So green temple names may not need
work for any of these reasons

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and a name-finding app will normally 
not be able to distinguish this.

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They may tell some duplicates 
but on most of the rest of them,

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these other three 
bullet points,

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they don’t have the 
programming power

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or the algorithms, to determine 
whether those problems exist.

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The last misconception of those 
three is that Family Tree

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is intended to be an ongoing
source of temple names.

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Again, that’s logical if you think 
that the Church originally

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populated Family Tree 
with these temple names.

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I found that this misconception 
gets passed so frequently,

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kind of like wildfire gossip, 
from one member to another.

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Where I live, people are constantly 
telling each other this, saying,

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“All you have to do is go to Family
Tree and find your temple names.

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Isn’t that awesome that the 
Church has made it so easy!

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They’ve just handed 
us these names.”

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And so the “good news” gets 
spread around with people

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not realizing that it’s 
actually a misconception.

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But the truth is that Family Tree 
is a wonderful gift that was

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given to us by the Church 
through FamilySearch

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as a place to collaborate 
with other researchers,

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a place to track temple work, and 
where we can add family names.

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Once in a while when I talk 
about the problems

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with the data in Family Tree, 
I have had a couple of people say,

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“Wow! It sounds to me like you’re 
criticizing Family Tree.”

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00:14:46,415 --> 00:14:50,426
One person even felt like I was 
criticizing the Prophet because

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00:14:50,426 --> 00:14:54,364
the Church sponsors Family Tree. 
But the truth is,

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00:14:54,364 --> 00:14:58,013
to point out the reality of the 
data in Family Tree

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00:14:58,013 --> 00:15:02,397
isn’t a criticism, 
it’s actually empowering,

235
00:15:02,397 --> 00:15:05,644
because if we understand 
the data in Family Tree,

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00:15:05,644 --> 00:15:08,384
we understand better 
how to use it.

237
00:15:08,385 --> 00:15:11,963
So data issues don’t mean 
that Family Tree is flawed,

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00:15:11,963 --> 00:15:14,907
or that the Church 
did something wrong

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00:15:14,907 --> 00:15:17,802
by putting this data 
in Family Tree.

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00:15:17,802 --> 00:15:24,581
It only looks like a criticism of 
Family Tree to point out the data

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00:15:24,581 --> 00:15:28,418
if a person thought the data was 
supposed to be perfect

242
00:15:28,418 --> 00:15:31,838
and that Family Search had
intended it to be perfect.

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00:15:31,841 --> 00:15:35,836
If you think something’s perfect 
and then someone says it’s not,

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00:15:35,836 --> 00:15:40,590
that sounds like criticism and
like the program failed.

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00:15:40,590 --> 00:15:46,730
But if we realize that the 
purpose of Family Tree

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00:15:46,730 --> 00:15:50,081
is for us to collaborate, 
track temple work, and add names,

247
00:15:50,081 --> 00:15:55,826
and it was never meant to be a 
perfect source of verified names,

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00:15:55,826 --> 00:16:00,569
then we realize it’s not a 
criticism of Family Tree.

249
00:16:00,569 --> 00:16:02,755
So the problem isn’t 
the Family Tree data.

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00:16:02,755 --> 00:16:08,473
The problem is the misconceptions 
that we might have about it.

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00:16:08,473 --> 00:16:12,953
Two more common misconceptions 
that go a little bit hand in hand --

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00:16:12,964 --> 00:16:16,343
One of those is that success 
in family history

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00:16:16,343 --> 00:16:19,685
means reserving large 
numbers of names.

254
00:16:19,685 --> 00:16:27,673
Again, this is one of those 
misconceptions promoted by apps,

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00:16:27,673 --> 00:16:31,540
at least the way they are used, 
because so many people use them

256
00:16:31,540 --> 00:16:34,184
to find large numbers 
of temple names.

257
00:16:34,184 --> 00:16:39,518
Associated with that, is the 
misconception that family history

258
00:16:39,518 --> 00:16:44,753
is tedious and time-consuming, 
especially so without an app.

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00:16:44,753 --> 00:16:51,033
Let’s look a little bit closer 
at those two misconceptions.

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00:16:51,035 --> 00:16:53,069
So, does success in 
family history mean

261
00:16:53,069 --> 00:16:55,075
reserving large 
numbers of names?

262
00:16:55,075 --> 00:16:58,834
We’ve been taught in conference 
that’s not the case.

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00:16:58,834 --> 00:17:02,212
You might remember Elder Scott’s
talk where he mentioned that he

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00:17:02,212 --> 00:17:07,232
didn’t think people would be very 
happy beyond the veil if someone

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00:17:07,251 --> 00:17:11,211
reserved a large number of names 
and kept them in their temple queue.

266
00:17:11,211 --> 00:17:16,236
So that's a problem and
the Church has dealt

267
00:17:16,236 --> 00:17:18,753
with that problem by 
releasing names from

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00:17:18,753 --> 00:17:22,337
people’s temple queues if they’re 
older than two years.

269
00:17:22,337 --> 00:17:29,817
So that took care of that problem, 
but still I hear people saying,

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00:17:29,823 --> 00:17:38,119
“Wow! I found 400 names!” 
It almost becomes a matter of pride.

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00:17:38,119 --> 00:17:43,349
I remember hearing a talk that was 
given in my stake by a young woman

272
00:17:43,349 --> 00:17:47,329
who had been taught to use a 
name-finding app to just comb

273
00:17:47,332 --> 00:17:49,767
through family tree and 
find bunches of names.

274
00:17:49,767 --> 00:17:52,926
So she had used the app. 
She had gone through and gotten

275
00:17:52,926 --> 00:17:56,896
a couple hundred names and then 
her sister tried to use the app

276
00:17:56,896 --> 00:18:02,138
to crawl the tree, but the older 
girl had already reserved the names

277
00:18:02,138 --> 00:18:05,610
after the app had run 
for a certain period of time.

278
00:18:05,610 --> 00:18:09,710
So the younger sister was really 
frustrated and discouraged because

279
00:18:09,732 --> 00:18:11,972
she tried to do the same
thing her sister did

280
00:18:11,977 --> 00:18:18,857
and wasn’t able to get 
this huge number of names.

281
00:18:18,862 --> 00:18:24,553
Another problem with this 
misconception is that it can lead

282
00:18:24,553 --> 00:18:27,482
to cutting corners and 
not verifying the names.

283
00:18:27,482 --> 00:18:30,501
So people will use the app. 
They’ll gather hundreds

284
00:18:30,501 --> 00:18:34,104
and in some cases I’ve heard of, 
people doing thousands of names,

285
00:18:34,104 --> 00:18:36,768
and then they don’t verify them. 
They either put them in their

286
00:18:36,768 --> 00:18:40,505
temple queue or share them 
with the temple system,

287
00:18:40,505 --> 00:18:43,148
and then other people end up 
doing the invalid names,

288
00:18:43,148 --> 00:18:46,563
which is not really
fair to them.

289
00:18:46,563 --> 00:18:50,303
So if success in family history 
doesn’t mean reserving

290
00:18:50,304 --> 00:18:56,867
huge numbers of names, how do we 
qualify success in family history?

291
00:18:56,867 --> 00:19:00,243
After years of working with people 
and helping them get started,

292
00:19:00,243 --> 00:19:03,621
I’ve come to believe that 
success in family history

293
00:19:03,621 --> 00:19:06,920
means a consistent, 
diligent effort.

294
00:19:06,920 --> 00:19:10,682
In a way, for those of you who 
are home or visiting teachers,

295
00:19:10,682 --> 00:19:14,602
it’s the same principle. 
Home and visiting teaching

296
00:19:14,614 --> 00:19:17,332
isn’t a one and done. 
We don’t just visit a person

297
00:19:17,332 --> 00:19:19,904
once and then say, 
“Okay, you’re good for life.”

298
00:19:19,904 --> 00:19:25,704
or just think about them once 
towards the end of the month.

299
00:19:25,704 --> 00:19:27,970
Being a good home or 
visiting teacher means

300
00:19:27,970 --> 00:19:31,271
consistent, diligent effort 
on a regular basis.

301
00:19:31,271 --> 00:19:34,485
And I really believe it’s 
the same in family history.

302
00:19:34,485 --> 00:19:37,609
So, our goal shouldn’t be 
to be gathering large

303
00:19:37,609 --> 00:19:40,791
numbers of family names, 
but instead to be

304
00:19:40,791 --> 00:19:45,430
making a consistent, 
diligent effort.

305
00:19:45,430 --> 00:19:48,719
And this one, oh my goodness, 
please forgive me because

306
00:19:48,719 --> 00:19:52,385
this is actually one of 
my greatest concerns,

307
00:19:52,385 --> 00:19:56,485
one that I just wish I 
could shout from the rooftops

308
00:19:56,497 --> 00:20:00,584
and tell people it’s a 
myth that family history

309
00:20:00,584 --> 00:20:02,374
is tedious and 
time-consuming.

310
00:20:02,374 --> 00:20:04,934
Let’s leave the app 
aside for a minute.

311
00:20:04,934 --> 00:20:08,874
There’s a misconception in the 
church that family history is

312
00:20:08,879 --> 00:20:13,279
tedious and time-consuming. 
It’s true that some time periods

313
00:20:13,282 --> 00:20:19,797
and some areas of the world are 
more difficult than others.

314
00:20:19,797 --> 00:20:24,999
I wish I could tell people 
that everybody has places

315
00:20:24,999 --> 00:20:28,222
on their line like that, 
but everybody also has

316
00:20:28,222 --> 00:20:31,722
places on their line that 
are easier than others.

317
00:20:31,722 --> 00:20:37,642
So family history is not tedious 
and time-consuming per se.

318
00:20:37,642 --> 00:20:43,173
What is tedious and time-consuming 
is doing it without the spirit.

319
00:20:43,173 --> 00:20:47,118
Let me give you an example. 
I was helping my friend Marci

320
00:20:47,118 --> 00:20:55,697
get started with family history
quite a few years ago.

321
00:20:55,697 --> 00:20:59,804
I was kind of new to what I was
doing and hadn’t fully realized

322
00:20:59,804 --> 00:21:03,173
the power of prayer and the 
power of following the spirit.

323
00:21:03,173 --> 00:21:06,055
So Marci and I just met in 
the Family History Center and

324
00:21:06,055 --> 00:21:09,152
sat down to work on her lines. 
I asked what she wanted to work on.

325
00:21:09,152 --> 00:21:12,772
And she said, “Well, what about this?” 
So we got in there

326
00:21:12,773 --> 00:21:18,797
and we looked and looked and tried
stuff and churned and finally

327
00:21:18,797 --> 00:21:25,323
after 45 minutes or an hour, 
we both looked at each other and

328
00:21:25,323 --> 00:21:31,064
agreed it wasn't working 
and didn't feel right.

329
00:21:31,064 --> 00:21:33,276
It was a good learning 
experience that it took me

330
00:21:33,276 --> 00:21:36,296
that long to realize 
that it wasn’t working.

331
00:21:36,299 --> 00:21:39,906
And it was tedious. 
And it was time consuming.

332
00:21:39,906 --> 00:21:44,266
And we both felt that we had not 
made the best use of our time.

333
00:21:44,266 --> 00:21:48,584
But what was interesting 
is that after we realized that,

334
00:21:48,584 --> 00:21:52,773
and then we sought the Lord 
and the inspiration of the Spirit,

335
00:21:52,773 --> 00:21:55,238
we felt prompted to move 
to a different place

336
00:21:55,238 --> 00:21:58,190
in her family tree 
and things just opened up.

337
00:21:58,190 --> 00:22:01,695
And it was not tedious, 
and it was not time-consuming.

338
00:22:01,695 --> 00:22:07,111
So, I really believe it’s a myth, 
and we do people a disservice

339
00:22:07,111 --> 00:22:11,631
when we teach them family history 
is tedious and time-consuming.

340
00:22:11,631 --> 00:22:18,727
So, technology can help us. 
It can take some of the searching.

341
00:22:18,727 --> 00:22:21,366
We can search digital records 
so much more quickly than if we

342
00:22:21,366 --> 00:22:27,422
had to travel to a court house. 
But family history only becomes

343
00:22:27,422 --> 00:22:30,934
tedious and time-consuming when 
we’re not going by the Spirit.

344
00:22:30,934 --> 00:22:33,601
It can be challenging, 
but it won’t be tedious

345
00:22:33,601 --> 00:22:37,921
and it won’t be this 
terrible experience.

346
00:22:37,921 --> 00:22:43,241
So, unintended consequences 
of those misconceptions,

347
00:22:43,241 --> 00:22:49,965
let’s take a look at some of those.
Invalid or duplicate temple work.

348
00:22:49,965 --> 00:22:54,266
We’ve talked a little bit 
about that with the high percentage

349
00:22:54,266 --> 00:22:57,854
of green temples 
that are invalid.

350
00:22:57,854 --> 00:23:01,603
Another problem that 
has surfaced within

351
00:23:01,603 --> 00:23:06,357
the last year or so is using a 
name-finding app to take

352
00:23:06,357 --> 00:23:16,137
names that somebody else is 
right in the process of reserving.

353
00:23:16,143 --> 00:23:20,905
And then not realizing that names 
need to be added to Family Tree.

354
00:23:20,905 --> 00:23:25,822
So if we think that Family Tree 
is this pool of names that

355
00:23:25,822 --> 00:23:28,841
the Church has provided, 
then we don’t realize that

356
00:23:28,841 --> 00:23:31,534
a lot of names are missing 
and that we are the ones

357
00:23:31,534 --> 00:23:35,054
who are supposed to be 
adding those names.

358
00:23:35,055 --> 00:23:38,720
And finally, another unintended 
consequence is not becoming

359
00:23:38,720 --> 00:23:43,592
self-sufficient in finding names 
because we don’t think we have to

360
00:23:43,592 --> 00:23:48,172
and so we don't and so we never 
learn to become self-sufficient.

361
00:23:48,172 --> 00:23:51,533
I want to go into a little bit 
more detail about this problem

362
00:23:51,533 --> 00:23:56,033
of taking names that other 
people are currently reserving.

363
00:23:56,033 --> 00:23:59,391
I want to share two experiences 
that I had on that.

364
00:23:59,391 --> 00:24:03,611
The first is that one of my friends 
called me almost in tears.

365
00:24:03,620 --> 00:24:08,120
Her voice was teary when she said, 
“I’ve been working on this

366
00:24:08,120 --> 00:24:10,415
such and such family.” 
She was pretty new to

367
00:24:10,415 --> 00:24:13,654
family history at the time 
and she was learning to

368
00:24:13,654 --> 00:24:16,692
do careful verification 
and find family and

369
00:24:16,692 --> 00:24:20,206
it had just been such a beautiful 
experience for her to finally

370
00:24:20,206 --> 00:24:22,419
take her own family 
names to the temple.

371
00:24:22,419 --> 00:24:25,444
So she had found this family 
and she was very carefully

372
00:24:25,444 --> 00:24:29,132
putting them in family tree, 
verifying the names,

373
00:24:29,142 --> 00:24:31,663
adding the sources, 
and so forth and then,

374
00:24:31,663 --> 00:24:34,527
before she could finally 
make the reservations,

375
00:24:34,527 --> 00:24:38,539
someone else came through 
with a name-finding app

376
00:24:38,539 --> 00:24:42,151
to reserve those green temples 
and took the names that

377
00:24:42,151 --> 00:24:45,619
my friend had very carefully 
researched and verified,

378
00:24:45,619 --> 00:24:47,975
and this other person 
had not done any

379
00:24:47,975 --> 00:24:51,048
research or verification
on the names.

380
00:24:51,048 --> 00:24:57,754
So that’s one experience that I 
learned first-hand from my friend.

381
00:24:57,754 --> 00:25:00,474
And then I had an experience 
the other night,

382
00:25:00,489 --> 00:25:06,242
where I was working on a name 
and I promise you the name had not

383
00:25:06,242 --> 00:25:10,810
been available in the system 
for more than five minutes,

384
00:25:10,810 --> 00:25:13,634
and I think it was more 
like about 3 minutes,

385
00:25:13,634 --> 00:25:16,934
when somebody else came 
through and got the name.

386
00:25:16,934 --> 00:25:21,850
I was in the very process of 
reserving it for temple work.

387
00:25:21,850 --> 00:25:27,857
Now, it’s important to point out 
that it is not wrong to reserve a

388
00:25:27,857 --> 00:25:31,297
name added by somebody else. 
That’s not what I’m saying.

389
00:25:31,297 --> 00:25:35,977
So, my niece, just as an example, 
she loves doing family history

390
00:25:35,985 --> 00:25:39,940
and the other day she had found 
some names that were very

391
00:25:39,940 --> 00:25:44,711
difficult to find while she was 
working on our family.

392
00:25:44,711 --> 00:25:47,422
So she found family names, 
but she found some other names

393
00:25:47,422 --> 00:25:52,605
in that process, of people that it
took her awhile and they were

394
00:25:52,605 --> 00:25:55,822
tricky to find. Well, she 
made the choice to put

395
00:25:55,822 --> 00:26:00,254
those names in Family Tree because 
she suspected that it would be very

396
00:26:00,254 --> 00:26:04,963
difficult for somebody else to 
repeat the research she had done.

397
00:26:04,963 --> 00:26:06,697
So she put the names 
in Family Tree,

398
00:26:06,697 --> 00:26:10,595
but because they weren’t on her
line she did not reserve them.

399
00:26:10,595 --> 00:26:13,538
So if somebody comes along 
and reserves those names,

400
00:26:13,538 --> 00:26:18,224
that’s why she put them there. 
So that is not a problem at all.

401
00:26:18,224 --> 00:26:23,604
The problem arises when --
Well, I just have to ask myself,

402
00:26:23,604 --> 00:26:26,617
is it fair to take names
that somebody else

403
00:26:26,617 --> 00:26:29,897
has loved and labored 
over with no more

404
00:26:29,897 --> 00:26:34,177
thought than running an 
automated name-finding program.

405
00:26:34,177 --> 00:26:37,977
So to avoid this problem,
as you’ve probably noticed

406
00:26:37,980 --> 00:26:40,261
if you’ve used one of these 
name-finding apps,

407
00:26:40,261 --> 00:26:45,181
they don't tell, at least none
of the ones that I have tried,

408
00:26:45,181 --> 00:26:47,681
tell you when the 
name was created.


409
00:26:47,681 --> 00:26:50,681
And so, if a name 
was created,

410
00:26:50,681 --> 00:26:53,560
and you can tell this is by 
looking in the change log.

411
00:26:53,560 --> 00:26:57,570
Over on the right-hand side 
of the Person page,

412
00:26:57,570 --> 00:27:00,457
there’s a link that says 
“Show All Changes.”

413
00:27:00,457 --> 00:27:03,125
If you click that link and
scroll to the bottom,

414
00:27:03,125 --> 00:27:06,845
it will tell you when 
that name was created.

415
00:27:06,845 --> 00:27:10,989
So you can tell if the name was 
created within the last week

416
00:27:10,989 --> 00:27:12,805
or maybe even within 
the last month,

417
00:27:12,805 --> 00:27:17,473
it would be a nice courtesy 
to contact the person who

418
00:27:17,473 --> 00:27:20,761
contributed that name and say, 
“I noticed that you

419
00:27:20,761 --> 00:27:24,578
contributed this name. 
They’re on my family line too,

420
00:27:24,578 --> 00:27:28,404
and I was hoping to reserve 
some names for the temple.

421
00:27:28,404 --> 00:27:31,064
Are you OK with me 
reserving these names?”

422
00:27:31,066 --> 00:27:33,473
And who knows, through that 
process you might meet a

423
00:27:33,473 --> 00:27:36,445
cousin who you can collaborate 
on research with.

424
00:27:36,445 --> 00:27:41,156
But just doing that resolves 
the problem of reserving names

425
00:27:41,156 --> 00:27:45,545
that other people are right 
in the process of reserving.

426
00:27:45,545 --> 00:27:48,611
You can imagine how discouraging 
that is, especially for a new

427
00:27:48,611 --> 00:27:53,051
family historian, to be right in 
the process of adding names and

428
00:27:53,054 --> 00:27:56,194
just have those names vanish
right before their eyes as

429
00:27:56,194 --> 00:28:02,952
they’re trying to add them. 
That’s a reason that I recommend

430
00:28:02,952 --> 00:28:07,627
not adding lots of names all at 
once with a name-finding app,

431
00:28:07,627 --> 00:28:10,345
but rather checking those names 
and checking to make sure that

432
00:28:10,345 --> 00:28:17,172
somebody else is not already 
planning to reserve those names.

433
00:28:17,172 --> 00:28:22,305
Another problem is that people 
get the mindset that family

434
00:28:22,305 --> 00:28:25,999
history means searching in 
Family Tree for names and

435
00:28:25,999 --> 00:28:28,596
they don’t realize 
names need to be added.

436
00:28:28,596 --> 00:28:31,221
So I did some checking and 
got some updated figures.

437
00:28:31,221 --> 00:28:36,187
These population totals used 
to be higher but current estimates

438
00:28:36,187 --> 00:28:41,707
are that about 100 to 115 billion 
people have lived on the earth

439
00:28:41,710 --> 00:28:45,499
since the beginning 
of human history.

440
00:28:45,499 --> 00:28:50,005
Only 1.1 billion people 
are in Family Tree.

441
00:28:50,005 --> 00:28:54,945
I am not really good at math, 
but even I can figure out that

442
00:28:54,948 --> 00:29:01,553
this leaves between 99 billion 
and 114 billion people

443
00:29:01,553 --> 00:29:05,393
that probably need to be 
added to Family Tree.

444
00:29:05,397 --> 00:29:10,512
Granted there are not records 
for many people who lived

445
00:29:10,512 --> 00:29:13,151
back through time where either 
the records have been destroyed

446
00:29:13,151 --> 00:29:17,439
or they didn’t keep them. 
So there are some of this

447
00:29:17,439 --> 00:29:20,838
large group that we’re not going 
to be able to find records for,

448
00:29:20,838 --> 00:29:28,523
but there are a surprisingly large 
number that do have records.

449
00:29:28,523 --> 00:29:31,781
A lot of people still need
to be added to Family Tree

450
00:29:31,781 --> 00:29:35,258
and it is an absolute joy. 
I don’t know that I’ve ever

451
00:29:35,258 --> 00:29:38,498
felt the Spirit stronger 
than when I find a name

452
00:29:38,499 --> 00:29:42,639
and add it to Family Tree. 
That person has just gone

453
00:29:42,639 --> 00:29:47,337
from being lost to 
“getting in the queue”

454
00:29:47,337 --> 00:29:52,346
of having the opportunity 
to get their temple work done.

455
00:29:52,346 --> 00:29:55,912
Some more unintended 
consequences --

456
00:29:55,912 --> 00:29:57,769
An unfortunate one 
that I’ve noticed

457
00:29:57,769 --> 00:30:01,169
is relying on technology 
instead of the Spirit.

458
00:30:01,181 --> 00:30:05,021
Now let me be careful to 
explain what I mean there.

459
00:30:05,021 --> 00:30:09,250
One problem is that people 
trust technology more than

460
00:30:09,250 --> 00:30:13,650
they trust themselves. 
I’ve been in information technology

461
00:30:13,659 --> 00:30:17,439
for about 20 or 25 years now 
as a web designer,

462
00:30:17,444 --> 00:30:21,444
as a database person, 
done different things

463
00:30:21,444 --> 00:30:24,184
with technology and 
I love technology. 


464
00:30:24,190 --> 00:30:31,390
Technology is so 
miraculous to us

465
00:30:31,399 --> 00:30:35,435
in so many ways that we give it 
more credit than it deserves.

466
00:30:35,435 --> 00:30:39,855
We think it’s maybe a little 
more perfect then it is.

467
00:30:39,855 --> 00:30:43,778
Because of that sometimes 
people will trust the technology

468
00:30:43,778 --> 00:30:49,442
and not trust the Spirit. 
And usually in a case like that,

469
00:30:49,442 --> 00:30:52,140
it’s not so much that they 
don’t trust the Spirit,

470
00:30:52,140 --> 00:30:55,405
but more that they doubt the 
prompting that they’re hearing

471
00:30:55,405 --> 00:30:58,365
because they think, “why 
am I getting that prompting

472
00:30:58,365 --> 00:31:01,573
because the technology right
on my screen that I can trust,

473
00:31:01,573 --> 00:31:05,652
or I feel I can trust, is showing 
me something different.”

474
00:31:05,652 --> 00:31:10,016
If it’s a toss-up and they’re 
not quite sure that the Spirit’s

475
00:31:10,016 --> 00:31:12,891
really speaking to them, 
I’ve seen that a lot of people

476
00:31:12,891 --> 00:31:18,978
will tend to go with technology.
Another issue is that technology

477
00:31:18,978 --> 00:31:21,918
can just make the Spirit 
seem unnecessary.

478
00:31:21,925 --> 00:31:24,279
So it’s not that people are 
blocking the spirit

479
00:31:24,279 --> 00:31:27,094
or ignoring the spirit, 
it’s just that if you use

480
00:31:27,094 --> 00:31:30,523
a name-finding app and it 
presents you with 400 names

481
00:31:30,523 --> 00:31:33,429
of people who apparently 
need temple work,

482
00:31:33,429 --> 00:31:37,343
then why do you need to 
follow the Spirit on that,

483
00:31:37,343 --> 00:31:40,959
The names are right I front of you. 
And I understand that.

484
00:31:40,959 --> 00:31:46,479
I can see why people would.
It would not even occur to them

485
00:31:46,479 --> 00:31:49,765
that they would need to follow 
the Spirit in a case like that

486
00:31:49,765 --> 00:31:54,789
because the names have just been 
handed to them as they see it.

487
00:31:54,789 --> 00:32:01,009
So another challenge that comes up, 
another unintended consequence is

488
00:32:01,009 --> 00:32:04,240
that these misconceptions 
just spread like wildfire.

489
00:32:04,240 --> 00:32:09,090
Because somebody reserves 
400 names or 8,000 or whatever,

490
00:32:09,090 --> 00:32:12,003
and they feel that they’ve 
experienced such great success,

491
00:32:12,003 --> 00:32:14,932
and they can’t wait to share 
it with everybody else.

492
00:32:14,932 --> 00:32:19,072
Just in the last couple of weeks, 
I’ve seen people posting on facebook

493
00:32:19,074 --> 00:32:23,981
and posting on forums, saying, 
“I’ve found this wonderful app,

494
00:32:23,981 --> 00:32:28,179
and I reserved these hundreds 
of names and now I’m just so glad

495
00:32:28,179 --> 00:32:31,185
that I did that and you 
guys should try it too.

496
00:32:31,185 --> 00:32:36,091
So it just spreads because 
it sounds so fantastic.

497
00:32:36,091 --> 00:32:42,171
And it sounds like it’s going to 
make a difficult task easier.

498
00:32:42,171 --> 00:32:48,311
The problem is because people 
have these false expectations,

499
00:32:48,311 --> 00:32:52,435
then when somebody tries to 
share the facts with them,

500
00:32:52,435 --> 00:32:58,059
the facts are really not welcome. 
And that also is understandable.

501
00:32:58,059 --> 00:33:01,759
Nobody likes to be disappointed 
in their expectations.

502
00:33:01,762 --> 00:33:05,591
I’ll give you a couple of examples. 
There was someone on a public forum

503
00:33:05,591 --> 00:33:09,602
who was talking about gathering 
hundreds and hundreds of names,

504
00:33:09,602 --> 00:33:14,469
and submitting them to the temple. 
When a few of us very gently tried

505
00:33:14,469 --> 00:33:18,989
to suggest that a lot of the names 
gathered that way probably

506
00:33:18,989 --> 00:33:21,733
weren’t valid and at least 
they should be verified,

507
00:33:21,733 --> 00:33:24,787
the person responded, 
“Do you mean to tell me that

508
00:33:24,787 --> 00:33:28,794
the Church has spent millions 
of dollars to make Family Tree

509
00:33:28,794 --> 00:33:32,196
and the names in it aren’t 
even ready for temple work?”

510
00:33:32,196 --> 00:33:35,794
So that was shock to them and 
it was a huge disappointment,

511
00:33:35,794 --> 00:33:40,371
because they had been led to 
believe that all they had to do

512
00:33:40,371 --> 00:33:44,989
was run an app and gather 
names out of Family Tree.

513
00:33:44,989 --> 00:33:47,877
Another person that I was 
helping not too long ago,

514
00:33:47,877 --> 00:33:53,057
we sat down and he happily showed
me his name-finding results,

515
00:33:53,059 --> 00:33:58,785
where he had around 300 names 
that the app had found

516
00:33:58,785 --> 00:34:04,178
and he said, “Isn’t this great? 
I’d like to get these names done.”

517
00:34:04,178 --> 00:34:09,190
And I said, “I’m so glad 
you found those names.

518
00:34:09,190 --> 00:34:12,846
We really should verify them. 
There’s a chance that some

519
00:34:12,846 --> 00:34:16,385
of them may not be accurate 
and it’s always just a good idea

520
00:34:16,385 --> 00:34:18,870
to go through and attach 
some sources and so forth.”

521
00:34:18,870 --> 00:34:22,990
And he just said, 
“No, I’d really rather not.

522
00:34:22,991 --> 00:34:26,968
The names look ready to me so I 
think I’m just going to go ahead.”

523
00:34:26,968 --> 00:34:32,334
Of course as a consultant, you 
can’t put your foot down and say

524
00:34:32,334 --> 00:34:35,292
“NO! You’re not submitting those 
names until you’ve verified them.”

525
00:34:35,292 --> 00:34:38,222
We all have our agency 
and we’re all responsible,

526
00:34:38,222 --> 00:34:42,229
but I have to think that this 
brother had very good intentions,

527
00:34:42,229 --> 00:34:47,699
I know he had very good intentions, 
and I have to think that one reason

528
00:34:47,699 --> 00:34:51,496
he felt that it was appropriate was 
because he had used an app that

529
00:34:51,496 --> 00:34:55,703
presented those names to him as 
apparently needing temple work,

530
00:34:55,703 --> 00:35:03,643
and it just seemed superfluous that
he would need to verify them.

531
00:35:03,643 --> 00:35:09,412
For the last part of these 
unintended consequences,

532
00:35:09,412 --> 00:35:18,646
I want to talk about some of the 
more spiritual downsides to using

533
00:35:18,646 --> 00:35:22,286
name-finding apps and gathering 
large numbers of names.

534
00:35:22,286 --> 00:35:26,201
What I’m noticing among people 
that have done this is that they

535
00:35:26,201 --> 00:35:29,494
don’t really get to know the 
people whose names they’re

536
00:35:29,494 --> 00:35:33,319
reserving so their hearts 
aren’t really turned.

537
00:35:33,319 --> 00:35:39,058
All those people are 
is names on a list to them.

538
00:35:39,058 --> 00:35:41,719
Don’t get me wrong, 
they feel a general sense of

539
00:35:41,719 --> 00:35:45,308
“Wow, this is great! Now 
their temple work can be done.”

540
00:35:45,308 --> 00:35:49,768
That is wonderful but they don’t 
know anything about these people.

541
00:35:49,768 --> 00:35:53,013
Where did they live? 
What was their life like?

542
00:35:53,013 --> 00:35:58,903
What did they experience that has 
contributed to the way I live?

543
00:35:58,903 --> 00:36:02,791
What sacrifices did they 
make that enabled me

544
00:36:02,791 --> 00:36:05,704
to enjoy the blessings 
I have today?

545
00:36:05,704 --> 00:36:10,084
So when we don’t dig into those 
names as we’ve actually been

546
00:36:10,094 --> 00:36:15,086
counselled to do then we lose 
something really precious and,

547
00:36:15,086 --> 00:36:20,166
in my experience, people’s hearts 
are not turned by just

548
00:36:20,166 --> 00:36:24,108
submitting names from an app, 
and especially just by submitting

549
00:36:24,108 --> 00:36:28,508
large numbers of names 
that aren’t verified.

550
00:36:28,515 --> 00:36:33,576
Another problem that I’ve seen 
is that an app can encourage

551
00:36:33,576 --> 00:36:37,731
people to have that 
“one and done” mentality,

552
00:36:37,731 --> 00:36:41,208
like the woman that I mentioned, 
I don’t think I told this

553
00:36:41,208 --> 00:36:43,754
whole story in this webinar, 
but I mentioned somebody

554
00:36:43,754 --> 00:36:49,349
who found 8,000 names. 
She was a sister from California,

555
00:36:49,349 --> 00:36:53,100
who had been taught to use a 
name-finding app and didn’t realize

556
00:36:53,100 --> 00:36:57,087
that there were some possible 
problems with it so she had just

557
00:36:57,087 --> 00:37:00,683
reserved all these names and 
shared them with the temple system

558
00:37:00,683 --> 00:37:08,970
and thought, “OK, that’s done. 
I’ve fulfilled my obligation

559
00:37:08,970 --> 00:37:12,545
to family history.” 
What’s interesting about

560
00:37:12,545 --> 00:37:15,676
family history is that, 
as Boyd K. Packer said,

561
00:37:15,676 --> 00:37:21,792
there is no work that is 
more spiritually refining.

562
00:37:21,792 --> 00:37:24,187
When we treat it like 
a “one and done”

563
00:37:24,187 --> 00:37:28,185
I think we miss out on that 
spiritual refinement.

564
00:37:28,185 --> 00:37:32,583
We don’t have that on-going 
blessing of learning to

565
00:37:32,583 --> 00:37:36,063
recognize the spirit, 
of connecting with our ancestors,

566
00:37:36,063 --> 00:37:38,703
of discovering 
our family stories.

567
00:37:38,706 --> 00:37:44,721
And so, I think we rob ourselves 
of that blessing when we make

568
00:37:44,721 --> 00:37:50,649
family history into a 
“one and done” experience.

569
00:37:50,649 --> 00:38:00,842
I debated whether or not to share 
this next one because once

570
00:38:00,842 --> 00:38:05,628
in a while people have gotten 
offended at my bringing this up.

571
00:38:05,628 --> 00:38:11,450
But, I’ve experienced it myself and 
I’ve talked to so many other people

572
00:38:11,450 --> 00:38:15,559
that have experienced it that I 
think it’s worth mentioning.

573
00:38:15,559 --> 00:38:21,161
And that is, that when we submit 
invalid names for temple work,

574
00:38:21,161 --> 00:38:25,519
our temple experience 
is less meaningful.

575
00:38:25,519 --> 00:38:29,340
And I think there’s a 
good reason for that.

576
00:38:29,340 --> 00:38:33,370
As perhaps you have, I have been 
in the temple when I have

577
00:38:33,370 --> 00:38:37,589
literally felt the gratitude of the
person whose work I was doing.

578
00:38:37,589 --> 00:38:41,292
I could tell they were pleased. 
I could tell that they accepted

579
00:38:41,292 --> 00:38:45,647
the work and that they were so 
happy about the chance to progress.

580
00:38:45,647 --> 00:38:50,542
I don’t think I would feel that 
same joy and gratitude from

581
00:38:50,542 --> 00:38:55,063
somebody if I were doing their 
work for the 20th time.

582
00:38:55,063 --> 00:38:59,263
I had a friend who had an 
experience that illustrated

583
00:38:59,263 --> 00:39:03,210
this not too long ago.
He had gone to the baptistery

584
00:39:03,210 --> 00:39:05,867
to do some family names
that he had carefully

585
00:39:05,867 --> 00:39:09,461
researched and validated and 
he said that the Spirit was so

586
00:39:09,461 --> 00:39:13,832
strong during that experience. 
He was just overjoyed to tell that

587
00:39:13,832 --> 00:39:16,772
those people were happy 
about their temple work.

588
00:39:16,778 --> 00:39:19,834
So after he did the work 
for his ancestors,

589
00:39:19,834 --> 00:39:25,261
apparently it wasn’t a very busy 
day so the officiator asked if he

590
00:39:25,261 --> 00:39:30,330
could stay and do other names. 
And so he agreed gladly and

591
00:39:30,330 --> 00:39:34,416
started doing the names. 
As he did, he noticed that the

592
00:39:34,416 --> 00:39:39,456
wonderful feelings were no longer 
present, and that seemed strange.

593
00:39:39,456 --> 00:39:44,163
As they went through the names, 
what he started to notice is that

594
00:39:44,163 --> 00:39:48,252
there were a couple of them that 
were apparently the wrong gender.

595
00:39:48,252 --> 00:39:53,499
They were clearly women’s names 
that were being baptized as men.

596
00:39:53,499 --> 00:39:57,420
And also there were some dates 
that were suspect and some places,

597
00:39:57,420 --> 00:40:00,941
and things that you could just
tell that these names

598
00:40:00,941 --> 00:40:03,653
had not been very 
carefully researched.

599
00:40:03,653 --> 00:40:07,175
And for my friend, 
that was just another testimony

600
00:40:07,175 --> 00:40:12,021
that when we are careless with 
our family names and don’t

601
00:40:12,021 --> 00:40:15,606
properly verify them, 
and then if we do work and

602
00:40:15,606 --> 00:40:19,980
the names turn out to be invalid, 
it’s not going to be as meaningful

603
00:40:19,980 --> 00:40:23,430
of a temple experience. 
Now the reason some people have

604
00:40:23,430 --> 00:40:26,488
expressed concern before, 
is that they’ve misunderstood me

605
00:40:26,488 --> 00:40:29,918
to say the temple’s not 
a good experience.

606
00:40:29,918 --> 00:40:35,284
No, that’s not what I’m saying. 
But what I am saying is that

607
00:40:35,284 --> 00:40:39,894
if we’re careful about doing 
our research and we find

608
00:40:39,894 --> 00:40:44,765
valid names and we’re guided by 
the Spirit in doing that work,

609
00:40:44,765 --> 00:40:47,804
then we’re going to have an 
especially beautiful experience

610
00:40:47,804 --> 00:40:53,564
at the temple which we 
might not otherwise have.

611
00:40:53,564 --> 00:40:58,806
Let’s return, if you don’t mind, 
to the misconception that I said

612
00:40:58,806 --> 00:41:03,041
was one of my greatest concerns, 
and that is that we're teaching

613
00:41:03,041 --> 00:41:06,627
people that family history 
is tedious and difficult.

614
00:41:06,627 --> 00:41:09,613
And in this particular context 
people are being taught that

615
00:41:09,613 --> 00:41:12,834
it's tedious and difficult 
without the app.

616
00:41:12,834 --> 00:41:15,581
The truth is 
family history is

617
00:41:15,581 --> 00:41:24,437
tedious and difficult 
without the Spirit.

618
00:41:24,437 --> 00:41:33,377
What I’d like to do now 
is show you an alternative

619
00:41:33,377 --> 00:41:36,567
approach to using 
name finding apps,

620
00:41:36,567 --> 00:41:40,782
especially to find 
large numbers of names.

621
00:41:40,782 --> 00:41:44,468
A little while ago, 
the Church did some research

622
00:41:44,468 --> 00:41:47,530
and I learned about this 
in a presentation that I attended

623
00:41:47,530 --> 00:41:51,650
by a brother named Mike Sandberg 
who works for family search.

624
00:41:51,652 --> 00:41:54,410
He said that the Church 
had done research on people

625
00:41:54,410 --> 00:41:58,767
who were not submitting 
any temple names at all

626
00:41:58,767 --> 00:42:02,202
and suddenly they went to 
submitting names regularly.

627
00:42:02,202 --> 00:42:06,192
So naturally, the Church 
had a burning question.

628
00:42:06,192 --> 00:42:10,733
How did they make the transition? 
What enabled them to go from

629
00:42:10,733 --> 00:42:14,731
not submitting any names at all 
to successfully submitting

630
00:42:14,731 --> 00:42:17,991
temple names regularly? 
What they found out

631
00:42:17,991 --> 00:42:23,011
was very interesting. 
85% of those who made this

632
00:42:23,011 --> 00:42:30,930
transition had a helper and 65% 
of them got help multiple times.

633
00:42:30,930 --> 00:42:36,512
So the Church discovered that 
having a person to help or mentor

634
00:42:36,512 --> 00:42:42,772
somebody new to family history 
was the key to success.

635
00:42:42,772 --> 00:42:46,581
If this is sounding familiar 
to any of you, you will realize

636
00:42:46,581 --> 00:42:51,431
that this became the basis for the 
Church’s Find-Take-Teach program.

637
00:42:51,431 --> 00:42:57,056
Find-Take-Teach is a Spirit-led, 
one-on-one effort

638
00:42:57,056 --> 00:43:04,202
where help is given 
by a person who pays the price

639
00:43:04,202 --> 00:43:07,896
to know how to help 
that person by the Spirit.

640
00:43:07,896 --> 00:43:12,159
Let me go ahead and show you 
in a little more detail

641
00:43:12,159 --> 00:43:18,239
why this approach works. 
I’m simplifying this.

642
00:43:18,239 --> 00:43:22,356
If you want more information 
you can look on FamilySearch.org.

643
00:43:22,356 --> 00:43:24,707
They’ve got a complete 
description of it.

644
00:43:24,707 --> 00:43:29,680
But very simply, the helper and 
the patron both pray for guidance

645
00:43:29,680 --> 00:43:34,900
and then the helper prepares a 
personalized lesson by the Spirit.

646
00:43:34,900 --> 00:43:37,931
And during this lesson, 
also by the Spirit,

647
00:43:37,931 --> 00:43:40,387
they find a starting place 
for this person

648
00:43:40,387 --> 00:43:45,757
or they find valid temple 
names for the person.

649
00:43:45,757 --> 00:43:49,768
Finally, when they get together, 
the helper guides the patron

650
00:43:49,768 --> 00:43:54,825
in a one-on-one setting to 
reserve those temple names.

651
00:43:54,825 --> 00:44:00,885
I want to show you as a person who 
has responsibility currently for

652
00:44:00,885 --> 00:44:04,645
helping and mentoring people, 
I want to show you the process

653
00:44:04,645 --> 00:44:09,175
that I go through to find a good 
starting place when I’m working

654
00:44:09,175 --> 00:44:12,344
with somebody in a 
Find-Take-Teach experience.

655
00:44:12,344 --> 00:44:17,518
This is not the only way to do it. 
It’s the way that works best for me

656
00:44:17,518 --> 00:44:22,098
and I have other friends that are 
equally successful in using

657
00:44:22,098 --> 00:44:26,602
different approaches but I can 
speak to what works for me.

658
00:44:26,602 --> 00:44:29,678
I hope that this example 
might be helpful to you

659
00:44:29,678 --> 00:44:35,079
in finding your own best approach.
So the first, most important thing

660
00:44:35,079 --> 00:44:39,539
for me is that I have to go 
some place quiet where I can

661
00:44:39,539 --> 00:44:44,135
hear the Spirit in preparing 
this Find-Take-Teach experience.

662
00:44:44,135 --> 00:44:49,055
I can’t be where I’m distracted. 
I can’t be where I feel pressured.

663
00:44:49,055 --> 00:44:52,283
I have to be in a place 
where I can truly feel

664
00:44:52,283 --> 00:44:54,710
the inspiration 
of the Holy Ghost.

665
00:44:54,710 --> 00:45:01,272
So, I make those arrangements, 
whatever it takes.

666
00:45:01,272 --> 00:45:06,652
In one of my classes a sister said 
that she can’t do it at home.

667
00:45:06,652 --> 00:45:08,638
There’s just no way, 
even in the bathroom

668
00:45:08,638 --> 00:45:11,578
it’s like knock, knock, knock 
“Mom! Are you in there?”

669
00:45:11,578 --> 00:45:15,918
So what she does is she 
goes to the public library

670
00:45:15,918 --> 00:45:17,961
where people are 
supposed to be quiet.

671
00:45:17,961 --> 00:45:21,157
And so that place works for her. 
You might find a different quiet

672
00:45:21,157 --> 00:45:24,535
place that works for you. 
But whatever you do,

673
00:45:24,535 --> 00:45:27,651
find a place where you can be 
in tune with the Spirit.

674
00:45:27,651 --> 00:45:31,791
And then, I bring up the Fan Chart, 
that’s my favorite place to work.

675
00:45:31,791 --> 00:45:35,718
And I listen for what I call 
“heart tugs” which are

676
00:45:35,718 --> 00:45:39,498
spiritual promptings to me 
that somebody is wanting

677
00:45:39,498 --> 00:45:43,405
their temple work to be done. 
So here’s an example.

678
00:45:43,405 --> 00:45:47,685
I had offered to help a sister 
at the MTC as part of a

679
00:45:47,685 --> 00:45:52,786
Find-Take-Teach experience there. 
This sister had a very full tree

680
00:45:52,786 --> 00:45:56,976
and she wasn’t convinced that we 
would be able to find anything.

681
00:45:56,976 --> 00:45:59,956
So I asked for her
helper number.

682
00:45:59,956 --> 00:46:03,197
The place where we were working 
that Sunday in the MTC was very

683
00:46:03,197 --> 00:46:07,669
noisy and I knew that it was 
not a good place for me to

684
00:46:07,669 --> 00:46:12,127
really hear the Spirit and 
find a good starting place.

685
00:46:12,127 --> 00:46:17,816
I asked for her helper number and we
arranged to meet the following week.

686
00:46:17,816 --> 00:46:22,136
And I went to a place where 
I could listen to the Spirit.

687
00:46:22,136 --> 00:46:27,050
As I did, I prayed sincerely, and 
I had asked her to pray with me.

688
00:46:27,050 --> 00:46:32,150
And so, I looked at the fan chart 
and as I pondered and looked and

689
00:46:32,150 --> 00:46:36,124
clicked on a few different names, 
I found that I was drawn to this

690
00:46:36,124 --> 00:46:40,724
name of Abraham Chadwick. 
So I thought, "OK, I’ll follow that

691
00:46:40,724 --> 00:46:43,342
prompting and I will 
check Abraham’s

692
00:46:43,342 --> 00:46:46,561
Person page and see
what’s going on there."

693
00:46:46,561 --> 00:46:51,341
Well, as my friend mentioned, 
he had done a lot.

694
00:46:51,341 --> 00:46:54,578
As it turned out, and I had no way 
of knowing this of course,

695
00:46:54,578 --> 00:47:01,834
he was the first member of their 
family to join the Church.

696
00:47:01,834 --> 00:47:04,665
So as I looked here and read 
his personal history and clicked

697
00:47:04,665 --> 00:47:07,660
on his wives’ names and 
his children’s names,

698
00:47:07,660 --> 00:47:10,809
sure enough all their work 
was done and it was evident

699
00:47:10,809 --> 00:47:14,521
that he was a good, faithful 
man from reading his testimony.

700
00:47:14,521 --> 00:47:17,715
So I thought, "Wow, this might 
be harder than I thought."

701
00:47:17,715 --> 00:47:21,273
But I continued to pray and ask 
the Spirit for guidance to be led

702
00:47:21,273 --> 00:47:24,624
to that place where the 
Spirit wanted me to work

703
00:47:24,624 --> 00:47:30,239
for my dear sister in the MTC. 
And as I did, again just another

704
00:47:30,239 --> 00:47:32,898
line-upon-line gentle prompting, 
I found that I was

705
00:47:32,898 --> 00:47:35,814
led to this name of 
Sarah Ann Chadwick.

706
00:47:35,814 --> 00:47:39,854
So I looked at that and 
this is what I found.

707
00:47:39,861 --> 00:47:46,206
She had a husband, George Bradbury, 
and they had six kids.

708
00:47:46,206 --> 00:47:52,066
And all their work was done too, 
so I’m so grateful that by this

709
00:47:52,066 --> 00:47:55,546
point I had learned better 
how to recognize the Spirit,

710
00:47:55,546 --> 00:47:59,303
because in my younger days I might 
have doubted myself and just said,

711
00:47:59,303 --> 00:48:03,860
“Wow, I’ve been digging around here 
and I’m not finding anything so that

712
00:48:03,860 --> 00:48:05,850
might not really have 
been the Spirit.”

713
00:48:05,850 --> 00:48:11,420
I might have questioned myself. 
But because I had, fortunately,

714
00:48:11,420 --> 00:48:16,265
tried really hard to grow in my 
ability, and I’m far from perfect,

715
00:48:16,265 --> 00:48:19,273
but I’d really tried to grow in 
my ability to hear the Spirit,

716
00:48:19,273 --> 00:48:23,664
I trusted these promptings. 
I thought, “I’m gonna keep going.

717
00:48:23,664 --> 00:48:26,423
I am not sure why ‘cause this 
isn’t looking too good,

718
00:48:26,423 --> 00:48:30,676
but I’m gonna keep trying.” 
So I clicked on the first name of

719
00:48:30,676 --> 00:48:37,190
their first son and that’s when I 
started to feel that I was going

720
00:48:37,190 --> 00:48:40,829
the right direction. 
And so the first thing that caught

721
00:48:40,829 --> 00:48:44,790
my attention was that Samuel’s wife 
didn’t even have a last name.

722
00:48:44,790 --> 00:48:48,790
So that indicated more research 
definitely needed to be done.

723
00:48:48,790 --> 00:48:53,307
And I noticed that they 
didn’t have many children.

724
00:48:53,307 --> 00:49:01,727
Back in the 1800’s, most families 
had a large number of children.

725
00:49:01,738 --> 00:49:07,187
With just a little bit of research, 
it wasn’t like I took days and days,

726
00:49:07,187 --> 00:49:09,709
in fact I don’t think 
it was even hours,

727
00:49:09,709 --> 00:49:15,609
it was just a little quick checking 
in Ancestry and FamilySearch

728
00:49:15,613 --> 00:49:19,268
historical records. 
It didn’t take long to discover

729
00:49:19,268 --> 00:49:23,793
that Samuel and Kate were missing 
four children from Family Tree.

730
00:49:23,793 --> 00:49:27,554
These children were not there and 
needed to be added so that their

731
00:49:27,554 --> 00:49:29,899
temple work could be done. 
And then I thought,

732
00:49:29,899 --> 00:49:32,919
“OK, that is why I 
got that prompting.”

733
00:49:32,919 --> 00:49:36,819
I think the reason I was prompted 
to start with Abraham was that if

734
00:49:36,819 --> 00:49:40,639
I got a prompting like suppose 
that the name Samuel Bradbury

735
00:49:40,643 --> 00:49:44,394
came into my mind, I would not 
have a clue what to do with it.

736
00:49:44,394 --> 00:49:51,132
And so the Spirit led me along a
path where I could see how this

737
00:49:51,132 --> 00:49:55,772
family first got involved with 
the Church and then how these

738
00:49:55,772 --> 00:50:01,469
people who needed their ordinances 
were related to that first convert.

739
00:50:01,469 --> 00:50:05,272
So this was just a wonderful, 
beautiful experience in

740
00:50:05,272 --> 00:50:12,217
finding these names. 
Also, as I did more research,

741
00:50:12,217 --> 00:50:17,697
I found in the 1911 census that 
Kate had died and so Samuel had

742
00:50:17,697 --> 00:50:21,690
remarried and his second wife 
Ada Sarah was not in

743
00:50:21,690 --> 00:50:25,530
Family Tree either, and her 
temple work needed to be done.

744
00:50:25,534 --> 00:50:29,016
So just from following that 
prompting, I was able to find and

745
00:50:29,016 --> 00:50:34,956
verify these five names and pass 
those on to the sister in the MTC

746
00:50:34,956 --> 00:50:38,379
so that she could get 
that temple work done.

747
00:50:38,379 --> 00:50:42,539
Another example on this family, 
was that when I looked at Hannah,

748
00:50:42,539 --> 00:50:47,041
Samuel’s younger sister, 
she did not have a spouse.

749
00:50:47,041 --> 00:50:49,017
Again, just a little 
bit of research.

750
00:50:49,017 --> 00:50:52,509
This wasn’t hours of looking 
through court records or something,

751
00:50:52,509 --> 00:50:56,774
this was doing a search on 
Ancestry in available censuses.

752
00:50:56,774 --> 00:50:59,894
In just a short period of time 
I discovered that at one point

753
00:50:59,900 --> 00:51:02,325
Hannah had been living 
with her mother.

754
00:51:02,325 --> 00:51:10,085
And so there was the definite proof 
there that this really was my

755
00:51:10,085 --> 00:51:14,243
Hannah that I was looking for, 
and found out that she did have a

756
00:51:14,243 --> 00:51:17,199
husband and they had 
three children together.

757
00:51:17,199 --> 00:51:20,990
Right there were four more names, 
four valid names that needed

758
00:51:20,990 --> 00:51:26,756
to be added to Family Tree.
So that is an example of how

759
00:51:26,756 --> 00:51:31,604
to follow the Spirit to find 
a place to work in Family Tree.

760
00:51:31,604 --> 00:51:36,167
But I was mentioning this to a dear
sister in my stake who I was

761
00:51:36,167 --> 00:51:40,807
helping get started with family 
history and this is what she said,

762
00:51:40,809 --> 00:51:43,966
“I don’t think I’m that good 
at hearing the Spirit.”

763
00:51:43,966 --> 00:51:46,197
I have to tell you 
something about this sister.

764
00:51:46,197 --> 00:51:49,865
She is amazing! She serves people. 
She’s wonderful.

765
00:51:49,865 --> 00:51:52,726
I don’t think she was giving 
herself enough credit.

766
00:51:52,726 --> 00:51:57,570
But, I think all of us have felt 
that kind of sense of inadequacy.

767
00:51:57,570 --> 00:52:01,823
I know I certainly did, especially 
when I was first starting to really

768
00:52:01,823 --> 00:52:04,627
try to follow the Spirit 
in family history.

769
00:52:04,627 --> 00:52:10,167
Fortunately we all learn to hear 
the Spirit line upon line.

770
00:52:10,167 --> 00:52:13,805
Wherever you are in learning 
to follow the Spirit,

771
00:52:13,805 --> 00:52:18,905
wherever I am, that’s a place 
to start growing from.

772
00:52:18,905 --> 00:52:22,902
In fact the only place we can start 
growing from is where we are.

773
00:52:22,902 --> 00:52:25,620
So we all learn to hear the 
Spirit line upon line,

774
00:52:25,620 --> 00:52:29,044
and to me that is such good news, 
because that’s doable.

775
00:52:29,044 --> 00:52:31,873
I can do that. 
I can grow line upon line.

776
00:52:31,873 --> 00:52:35,353
And the wonderful thing I that have 
found about family history,

777
00:52:35,359 --> 00:52:41,814
and to me it’s one of its greatest, 
greatest blessings is that it is

778
00:52:41,814 --> 00:52:46,909
simply one of the best tutorials 
in learning to hear the Spirit.

779
00:52:46,909 --> 00:52:50,890
I could give you dozens of 
examples on this, but I won’t.

780
00:52:50,890 --> 00:52:56,290
I’ve got a whole other webinar 
on that and I’ll show you the

781
00:52:56,290 --> 00:53:01,097
link at the end of this one and 
you can watch that if you'd like.

782
00:53:01,097 --> 00:53:09,152
I have found as I listen to the 
Spirit in doing family history,

783
00:53:09,152 --> 00:53:12,672
I’ve learned more about how the
Spirit speaks to me and that

784
00:53:12,680 --> 00:53:17,491
knowledge has grown over the years 
as I continue to hear promptings

785
00:53:17,491 --> 00:53:21,497
and discern then correctly, 
and sometimes not correctly.

786
00:53:21,497 --> 00:53:26,478
I learn from making mistakes too. 
But the point that I wanted to

787
00:53:26,478 --> 00:53:30,151
make is that family history 
is one of the very best

788
00:53:30,151 --> 00:53:33,278
tutorials in learning 
to hear the Spirit.

789
00:53:33,278 --> 00:53:37,297
And if we don’t try to follow the 
Spirit in family history then we

790
00:53:37,297 --> 00:53:44,803
lose that great opportunity of 
refining our ability to hear.

791
00:53:44,803 --> 00:53:51,061
Hearing the Spirit better brings 
blessings in all areas of our lives.

792
00:53:51,061 --> 00:53:55,441
I love this quote by Joseph Smith, 
and it’s something that I have

793
00:53:55,441 --> 00:54:00,463
experienced doing family history. 
And that is that a person may

794
00:54:00,463 --> 00:54:04,958
profit by noticing the 
first intimation (or hint)

795
00:54:04,958 --> 00:54:08,527
of the spirit of revelation.
It may give you sudden strokes

796
00:54:08,527 --> 00:54:13,282
of ideas like call so and so, 
or sit here at this meeting

797
00:54:13,282 --> 00:54:16,319
because you don’t know this 
but you’re going to find somebody

798
00:54:16,319 --> 00:54:20,691
to help you with temple names, 
or there’s a mistake in your record,

799
00:54:20,691 --> 00:54:23,443
go back and check it. 
So it may give you these sudden

800
00:54:23,443 --> 00:54:28,140
strokes of ideas so that by 
noticing it you find it fulfilled.

801
00:54:28,140 --> 00:54:30,806
So you find that prompting 
you got was a real

802
00:54:30,806 --> 00:54:35,058
prompting because whatever
it told you about was true.

803
00:54:35,058 --> 00:54:37,430
So you find it fulfilled 
the same day or soon

804
00:54:37,430 --> 00:54:41,824
and thus by learning the Spirit 
of God and understanding it,

805
00:54:41,824 --> 00:54:45,200
you may grow into the 
principle of revelation.

806
00:54:45,200 --> 00:54:49,309
And it’s my testimony that this 
is absolutely true and that doing

807
00:54:49,309 --> 00:54:51,674
family history gives 
you the opportunity

808
00:54:51,674 --> 00:54:56,734
to grow in hearing 
revelation in this way.

809
00:54:56,734 --> 00:55:05,698
So, closing thoughts. 
This is something that comes up

810
00:55:05,698 --> 00:55:09,730
from time to time when we 
talk about the problems with

811
00:55:09,730 --> 00:55:14,142
misusing name-finding apps. 
So the person will say,

812
00:55:14,142 --> 00:55:17,391
“But, the app I’m using is 
certified by FamilySearch.

813
00:55:17,391 --> 00:55:20,081
Doesn’t that mean that it 
finds valid names?”

814
00:55:20,081 --> 00:55:23,753
And that’s understandable why 
people would think that because

815
00:55:23,753 --> 00:55:27,672
the word “certified” sounds 
really official, doesn’t it.

816
00:55:27,672 --> 00:55:31,150
It sounds like there’s some 
type of guarantee on the app

817
00:55:31,150 --> 00:55:33,850
that it’s going to perform 
as I expect it to.

818
00:55:33,853 --> 00:55:38,871
But, that’s actually not the case. 
The short answer is no,

819
00:55:38,871 --> 00:55:42,505
being certified doesn’t guarantee 
finding valid names.

820
00:55:42,505 --> 00:55:46,825
And, in fact, it doesn’t have 
anything to do with valid names.

821
00:55:46,829 --> 00:55:52,694
Let’s take a look at what 
FamilySearch certification means.

822
00:55:52,694 --> 00:55:57,192
This is a direct quote from the 
FamilySearch certification site.

823
00:55:57,192 --> 00:56:00,386
The reason most people probably 
don’t read this is that it’s

824
00:56:00,386 --> 00:56:03,497
geared towards developers. 
So most of us don’t have any

825
00:56:03,497 --> 00:56:07,488
reason to go out to this site. 
But, listen to what it says.

826
00:56:07,488 --> 00:56:11,844
The designation is simply used 
to identify software applications

827
00:56:11,844 --> 00:56:16,284
that FamilySearch believes to be 
generally compatible with

828
00:56:16,284 --> 00:56:20,060
FamilySearch or its application 
programming interfaces,

829
00:56:20,060 --> 00:56:23,761
which is basically the way the 
programs talk to each other.

830
00:56:23,761 --> 00:56:28,405
So FamilySearch believes that 
this app is generally compatible

831
00:56:28,405 --> 00:56:32,529
but FamilySearch takes no 
responsibility and is no way

832
00:56:32,529 --> 00:56:38,451
liable for any such application. 
Accordingly, FamilySearch in no way

833
00:56:38,451 --> 00:56:44,071
warrants that these applications 
will function as intended or that

834
00:56:44,071 --> 00:56:48,157
they are free from harmful 
or undesirable aspects

835
00:56:48,157 --> 00:56:54,068
or free from errors. 
So, the reason I bring this up

836
00:56:54,068 --> 00:56:58,788
is just to help us understand 
that to say an app is FamilySearch

837
00:56:58,788 --> 00:57:03,747
certified is a wonderful thing and 
it does mean something specific.

838
00:57:03,747 --> 00:57:07,738
It means that you can generally
count on it to work correctly with

839
00:57:07,738 --> 00:57:15,017
the FamilySearch.org website, 
but it does not guarantee anything

840
00:57:15,017 --> 00:57:20,097
about the app being used in a 
certain way, or misused, or any

841
00:57:20,097 --> 00:57:26,537
problem that result from its use.
Here’s another thing that I hear

842
00:57:26,537 --> 00:57:30,808
sometimes in talking with a couple 
of different app developers or

843
00:57:30,816 --> 00:57:33,981
reading their websites. 
They say, “I’m an app developer

844
00:57:33,981 --> 00:57:37,418
and my app warns people that they 
should research the names that

845
00:57:37,418 --> 00:57:41,699
they find so isn’t that enough?” 
You would hope that it would be.

846
00:57:41,699 --> 00:57:44,347
You would hope that everybody 
reads the fine print,

847
00:57:44,347 --> 00:57:51,147
but my own experience is that 
I don’t always read the fine print.

848
00:57:51,147 --> 00:57:55,517
Sometimes if I’m in a hurry 
I just glance at it and think

849
00:57:55,517 --> 00:57:59,907
"I don't have time for this."
My experience is most people don't

850
00:57:59,907 --> 00:58:04,734
read the warnings not only for 
these apps but for anything.

851
00:58:04,734 --> 00:58:07,441
In fact, I’ll give you an example. 
The other day I was helping

852
00:58:07,441 --> 00:58:11,861
somebody in a Find-Take-Teach 
experience and several warnings

853
00:58:11,861 --> 00:58:15,288
came up during the process of 
our working together and

854
00:58:15,288 --> 00:58:18,761
the person I was helping just
clicked right past the warnings.

855
00:58:18,761 --> 00:58:23,829
And the sense that I got was that 
they felt that they would not

856
00:58:23,829 --> 00:58:27,258
have understood the warnings anyway
so why bother to read them.

857
00:58:27,258 --> 00:58:31,749
So maybe it was a little sense of 
technophobia or inadequacy or

858
00:58:31,749 --> 00:58:36,608
whatever, but for whatever reason, 
most people don’t read the warnings

859
00:58:36,608 --> 00:58:41,158
on these apps or anyplace else.
I’ve also found that the few people

860
00:58:41,158 --> 00:58:45,405
who read the warnings don’t really 
understand how to apply it because

861
00:58:45,405 --> 00:58:48,985
often the main users of 
name-finding apps are people

862
00:58:48,985 --> 00:58:51,543
who are just getting started 
in family history and

863
00:58:51,543 --> 00:58:54,686
somebody has told them about 
the app and said this is a

864
00:58:54,686 --> 00:58:57,021
quick and easy way to 
find temple names.

865
00:58:57,021 --> 00:59:00,073
So they get to the app, 
and if they read the warning,

866
00:59:00,073 --> 00:59:05,693
they go, “Oh, Okay, I’ll research, 
whatever that means.”

867
00:59:05,704 --> 00:59:09,110
And so they reserve their 
hundred names, or whatever,

868
00:59:09,110 --> 00:59:11,845
and then they look at the list 
of a hundred and they go,

869
00:59:11,845 --> 00:59:17,576
“Well, looks fine to me. 
I’m not really sure what I’m

870
00:59:17,576 --> 00:59:22,764
looking for but I don’t see any 
problems so I guess I’ll go ahead.”

871
00:59:22,764 --> 00:59:26,068
And we can’t fault people for 
that because if they’re just

872
00:59:26,068 --> 00:59:29,684
getting started and they don’t 
understand, then they’re doing

873
00:59:29,684 --> 00:59:33,804
their best to follow the warning 
but they didn’t really understand

874
00:59:33,811 --> 00:59:36,829
what the app developer 
meant by the warning.

875
00:59:36,829 --> 00:59:42,329
So, that’s an example of how just 
putting a warning on an app doesn’t

876
00:59:42,329 --> 00:59:47,177
really help solve the problem of 
the app being misused to find

877
00:59:47,177 --> 00:59:51,417
invalid names or large 
numbers of names.

878
00:59:51,417 --> 00:59:53,762
So at this point you might 
be asking yourself,

879
00:59:53,762 --> 00:59:57,774
what if I submitted a lot of names 
like the dear sister in California

880
00:59:57,774 --> 01:00:02,234
that has submitted 8,000 names 
gathered with a name-finding app?

881
01:00:02,234 --> 01:00:06,202
Well, if the names are in your 
reservation list, verify them.

882
01:00:06,202 --> 01:00:12,523
You’ve got them. There's no
reason to not verify them.

883
01:00:12,523 --> 01:00:16,319
What that means is not just kind of 
looking at them and going

884
01:00:16,319 --> 01:00:21,392
“Well, I don’t see any problems,” 
but rather going back and verifying

885
01:00:21,392 --> 01:00:25,663
is the vital information correct? 
Is it supported by sources?

886
01:00:25,663 --> 01:00:28,799
Are the relationships correct? 
Are there any obvious problems

887
01:00:28,799 --> 01:00:32,209
like the mom having kids 
when she’s age four?

888
01:00:32,209 --> 01:00:33,707
So verifying
those names,

889
01:00:33,707 --> 01:00:36,739
you can’t really verify 
names en masse.

890
01:00:36,739 --> 01:00:39,107
You need to verify 
them individually,

891
01:00:39,107 --> 01:00:43,076
just like when the Savior had 
the individuals come to him.

892
01:00:43,076 --> 01:00:46,290
When he appeared in the Americas, 
they came one by one.

893
01:00:46,290 --> 01:00:49,138
We also need to verify 
names one by one

894
01:00:49,138 --> 01:00:51,166
and make sure that
they’re correct.

895
01:00:51,166 --> 01:00:54,705
So that, of course, is not 
necessarily a short process,

896
01:00:54,705 --> 01:00:57,905
especially if you have 8,000 
names in your temple queue.

897
01:00:57,905 --> 01:01:01,405
So if it’s going to take longer 
than two years before the names

898
01:01:01,411 --> 01:01:06,191
will be released by the Church, 
then you probably would want to

899
01:01:06,191 --> 01:01:09,608
put those names back in 
FamilySearch and let other people

900
01:01:09,608 --> 01:01:12,546
go ahead and reserve them and 
hopefully they would reserve

901
01:01:12,546 --> 01:01:16,055
just a few and they would 
carefully verify them.

902
01:01:16,055 --> 01:01:18,683
If the ordinances 
are already done,

903
01:01:18,683 --> 01:01:21,223
don’t worry about it. 
Don’t beat yourself up.

904
01:01:21,223 --> 01:01:24,295
I know of people who have 
beat themselves up.

905
01:01:24,295 --> 01:01:27,590
Like a sister I’m aware of 
who found out that she had,

906
01:01:27,590 --> 01:01:33,090
after reserving green temple names
and doing about 30 ordinances,

907
01:01:33,090 --> 01:01:37,691
a cousin contacted her and said, 
“Did you realize you just did

908
01:01:37,691 --> 01:01:40,938
all this duplicate work? 
Those names were done years ago.

909
01:01:40,938 --> 01:01:44,880
And she was so hurt and so 
frustrated and so disappointed

910
01:01:44,880 --> 01:01:48,348
because she had been told that the
right thing to do was just gather

911
01:01:48,348 --> 01:01:51,168
these green names and that
she didn’t need to verify them.

912
01:01:51,168 --> 01:01:54,084
So she was so hurt and disappointed
that she exclaimed,

913
01:01:54,084 --> 01:01:57,628
“I am never doing 
family history again!”

914
01:01:57,628 --> 01:02:02,134
Now, hopefully after she thought 
about it she changed her mind.

915
01:02:02,134 --> 01:02:06,734
That was hopefully just said in the 
disappointment of the moment,

916
01:02:06,734 --> 01:02:10,340
but that’s what we don’t want 
to do is beat ourselves up.

917
01:02:10,340 --> 01:02:13,660
If you’ve done some of these names, 
especially if you did them with

918
01:02:13,660 --> 01:02:16,571
the best of intentions, 
consider it a learning

919
01:02:16,571 --> 01:02:19,671
experience and just say, “Okay, 
that’s water under the bridge.

920
01:02:19,671 --> 01:02:22,583
Going forward I’ll know 
better what to do.”

921
01:02:22,583 --> 01:02:26,683
And, you can help people that you
talk to be aware of these problems

922
01:02:26,686 --> 01:02:31,586
so that they don’t run into 
the same types of issues.

923
01:02:31,586 --> 01:02:35,081
Your next question might be, 
are you saying that I should

924
01:02:35,081 --> 01:02:39,647
never use a name-finding app? 
No, I’m not saying that,

925
01:02:39,647 --> 01:02:44,874
because it is possible to use name-
finding apps to find valid names.

926
01:02:44,874 --> 01:02:48,114
It's just that in my experience, 
and this is anecdotal,

927
01:02:48,114 --> 01:02:51,314
so this is just my experience
as a Stake Temple and

928
01:02:51,314 --> 01:02:53,768
Family History Consultant
and a ward consultant

929
01:02:53,768 --> 01:02:57,994
in a number of different 
wards, it’s been my experience

930
01:02:57,994 --> 01:03:01,345
that they usually aren’t 
used to find valid names.

931
01:03:01,345 --> 01:03:04,443
Most of the time the people 
who are using them have been

932
01:03:04,443 --> 01:03:07,381
told that it’s a fast 
and easy way to find

933
01:03:07,381 --> 01:03:13,461
temple names and they’re 
not told about verification.

934
01:03:13,462 --> 01:03:18,002
So, if I use a name finding app, 
how can I find valid names?

935
01:03:18,002 --> 01:03:21,269
You can! So here are some tips 
for finding valid names

936
01:03:21,269 --> 01:03:26,737
with name-finding apps.
First of all, most importantly,

937
01:03:26,737 --> 01:03:33,982
seek the guidance of the Spirit. 
I know a woman who started to use

938
01:03:33,982 --> 01:03:37,327
a name-finding app and the 
Spirit told her not to.

939
01:03:37,327 --> 01:03:40,602
Now that was specifically 
for her situation.

940
01:03:40,602 --> 01:03:43,551
That should not be 
generalized to anybody else

941
01:03:43,551 --> 01:03:46,511
in any other situation.
That was just in hers.

942
01:03:46,512 --> 01:03:51,237
But, she was told not to 
and if she had disobeyed

943
01:03:51,237 --> 01:03:54,321
the Spirit, then that would 
have been a mistake for her.

944
01:03:54,321 --> 01:03:57,301
So you want to seek the 
guidance of the Spirit

945
01:03:57,301 --> 01:03:59,889
in using the name-finding apps, 
and if you’re warned

946
01:03:59,889 --> 01:04:02,902
not to use them, then don’t. 
On the other hand, if you’re

947
01:04:02,902 --> 01:04:10,313
told to use them by a definite 
spiritual prompting then do.

948
01:04:10,313 --> 01:04:13,598
Verify each and every name 
carefully that you find.

949
01:04:13,598 --> 01:04:16,826
So verify the vital information, 
the relationships,

950
01:04:16,826 --> 01:04:21,466
check for duplicates, add sources, 
make sure the vital information

951
01:04:21,471 --> 01:04:28,151
agrees with the sources. 
And here a tip is to use

952
01:04:28,151 --> 01:04:32,591
one or more names as a starting 
point to find and add more names.

953
01:04:32,592 --> 01:04:36,812
So you can find, maybe a couple 
of names using a name-finding app

954
01:04:36,813 --> 01:04:41,273
and then go back to Family Tree and 
thoroughly research those names and

955
01:04:41,273 --> 01:04:44,789
see if anybody’s missing, 
kind of as we did in the example

956
01:04:44,789 --> 01:04:53,679
that I showed you of the Find-
Take-Teach experience in the MTC.

957
01:04:53,679 --> 01:04:57,899
And then finally, I found 
that it really helps to work

958
01:04:57,906 --> 01:05:03,688
on one family at a time, rather
than a large list of random names.

959
01:05:03,688 --> 01:05:07,248
The reason it’s helpful to work on 
one family at a time is that you

960
01:05:07,248 --> 01:05:10,397
get to know that family, 
you become familiar with

961
01:05:10,397 --> 01:05:13,586
the place that they lived, 
with what they did for a living,

962
01:05:13,586 --> 01:05:17,395
with how many children they had, 
with when their kids left home

963
01:05:17,395 --> 01:05:20,583
and got married, and so forth.
And so, as you follow

964
01:05:20,583 --> 01:05:24,127
this family through time, 
as you find their birth records,

965
01:05:24,127 --> 01:05:26,976
their census records, 
their death records,

966
01:05:26,976 --> 01:05:30,167
all those different things that 
help you know that family,

967
01:05:30,167 --> 01:05:34,927
then you’re able to correctly 
find the information for them,

968
01:05:34,927 --> 01:05:38,103
validate those names and 
add them to Family Tree.

969
01:05:38,103 --> 01:05:41,219
And I felt so much more 
comfortable working in

970
01:05:41,219 --> 01:05:45,981
family units to add names
to Family Tree rather than

971
01:05:45,981 --> 01:05:51,041
just working from a mass list of 
random names that are just in

972
01:05:51,041 --> 01:05:58,020
whatever order they were found 
by the name-finding app.

973
01:05:58,020 --> 01:06:00,887
So, therefore what? 
Do you remember President Packer

974
01:06:00,887 --> 01:06:04,167
used to say this a lot, 
so what are the takeaways that

975
01:06:04,167 --> 01:06:08,136
I hope we’ll get from this webinar? 
Well, if you are a user

976
01:06:08,136 --> 01:06:11,062
of a name-finding app, 
the takeaways are

977
01:06:11,062 --> 01:06:13,805
I hope that you would be aware 
of the potential problems

978
01:06:13,805 --> 01:06:17,204
that we’ve talked about today 
and also that you’d help others

979
01:06:17,204 --> 01:06:20,788
be aware because there’s so many 
misconceptions going around,

980
01:06:20,788 --> 01:06:24,871
that you would use these apps 
as guided by the Spirit,

981
01:06:24,871 --> 01:06:27,660
that you would remember 
that there are so many names

982
01:06:27,660 --> 01:06:31,295
that still need to be
added to Family Tree,

983
01:06:31,295 --> 01:06:33,850
that you would realize 
that a good helper can help you

984
01:06:33,850 --> 01:06:38,314
in a way that an app can’t, 
and that you would remember

985
01:06:38,314 --> 01:06:44,134
that technology doesn’t replace
thought, research, or the Spirit.

986
01:06:44,134 --> 01:06:48,244
As amazing as technology is, 
it’s not perfect and we need

987
01:06:48,244 --> 01:06:51,603
to use it as a tool and 
as a companion to our

988
01:06:51,603 --> 01:06:55,971
spiritual efforts but not 
as a replacement for them.

989
01:06:55,971 --> 01:06:59,103
If you are a developer, 
what would I hope that

990
01:06:59,103 --> 01:07:02,523
you would take away from 
this webinar today?

991
01:07:02,540 --> 01:07:06,175
I would love to see app 
developers educate people about

992
01:07:06,175 --> 01:07:10,548
the data in Family Tree to 
combat those misconceptions.

993
01:07:10,548 --> 01:07:14,928
Again, I don’t think most 
developers are setting out

994
01:07:14,928 --> 01:07:20,298
to tell people wrong facts 
about the data in Family Tree.

995
01:07:20,298 --> 01:07:23,721
They’re not meaning to 
communicate misconceptions,

996
01:07:23,721 --> 01:07:28,341
but users pick them up anyway, 
especially when they’re shared

997
01:07:28,341 --> 01:07:32,594
word of mouth from user to user 
or posted on Facebook or wherever.

998
01:07:32,594 --> 01:07:36,567
So app developers could do 
a huge favor to users

999
01:07:36,567 --> 01:07:40,941
by educating them about 
the data in Family Tree.

1000
01:07:40,941 --> 01:07:43,843
Also, teach people that 
Family Tree is not meant

1001
01:07:43,843 --> 01:07:46,890
to be a primary source 
for finding names.

1002
01:07:46,890 --> 01:07:50,850
Yes, there are some great, valid 
green temple names in Family Tree,

1003
01:07:50,851 --> 01:07:55,591
but Family Tree was never intended 
to be a primary source of temple

1004
01:07:55,591 --> 01:08:02,067
names so we don’t have to find our 
own family or do our own research.

1005
01:08:02,067 --> 01:08:06,947
I would love it if app developers
did not give users the impression

1006
01:08:06,947 --> 01:08:10,968
that family history without the 
app is difficult and tedious.

1007
01:08:10,968 --> 01:08:15,128
Again, family history is only 
difficult and tedious

1008
01:08:15,133 --> 01:08:19,494
if we don’t have the Spirit. Let
me take that back on difficult.

1009
01:08:19,494 --> 01:08:23,790
There can be challenges, 
especially in some time periods

1010
01:08:23,790 --> 01:08:28,770
and some places, but what I found 
is that if you follow the Spirit,

1011
01:08:28,772 --> 01:08:31,332
you’ll be led to solve those 
problems and there’s a

1012
01:08:31,332 --> 01:08:36,706
sense of joy and it’s not 
difficult in a horrible way.

1013
01:08:36,706 --> 01:08:40,570
It’s difficult in a challenging 
and invigorating way.

1014
01:08:40,570 --> 01:08:43,844
So, I would love for this 
misconception to be done

1015
01:08:43,844 --> 01:08:48,286
away with in the Church, 
that family history is synonymous

1016
01:08:48,286 --> 01:08:54,266
with difficult and tedious. 
I would also love it if apps

1017
01:08:54,266 --> 01:08:58,002
put caps on the number 
of names that they found.

1018
01:08:58,002 --> 01:09:01,427
I’m aware of some that do, 
but to my understanding,

1019
01:09:01,427 --> 01:09:05,163
there are some that don’t, 
that allow users to just grab

1020
01:09:05,163 --> 01:09:10,523
huge numbers of names and 
submit them for temple work.

1021
01:09:10,523 --> 01:09:15,258
I was talking with some friends 
the other day about the problems

1022
01:09:15,258 --> 01:09:19,621
that we continue to see with people 
submitting large numbers of invalid

1023
01:09:19,621 --> 01:09:24,081
names using name-finding 
apps and we would love it if

1024
01:09:24,081 --> 01:09:26,929
there was some kind of
feature that would allow

1025
01:09:26,929 --> 01:09:30,933
people to clean up those large 
numbers of the invalid names

1026
01:09:30,933 --> 01:09:34,090
that have been submitted, 
whether it was some

1027
01:09:34,090 --> 01:09:37,963
super duplicate search or 
something, I don’t know.

1028
01:09:37,963 --> 01:09:40,610
This was on our wish list. 
We thought it would be

1029
01:09:40,610 --> 01:09:43,930
so wonderful if there was 
some way to clean up

1030
01:09:43,934 --> 01:09:48,654
those many invalid names 
that have been submitted.

1031
01:09:48,654 --> 01:09:52,732
I would like to close with 
a quote from David Rancher,

1032
01:09:52,732 --> 01:09:55,803
who is currently the chief 
genealogical officer

1033
01:09:55,803 --> 01:09:59,668
at FamilySearch. 
He said, “I love my computer.

1034
01:09:59,668 --> 01:10:02,255
I love it for everything 
it can do for me,

1035
01:10:02,255 --> 01:10:06,655
but the computer is not 
what turns my heart.

1036
01:10:06,655 --> 01:10:10,343
What turns my heart are the 
experiences and the impressions

1037
01:10:10,343 --> 01:10:17,255
I have from the Spirit and the 
things that I know and understand.

1038
01:10:17,255 --> 01:10:19,178
So that concludes 
our webinar for today.

1039
01:10:19,178 --> 01:10:22,750
I wanted to share with you those
promised additional resources.

1040
01:10:22,750 --> 01:10:27,630
The first one is a list of other 
webinars that you can get on this

1041
01:10:27,630 --> 01:10:31,193
link down at the bottom and 
they are webinars that go into

1042
01:10:31,193 --> 01:10:33,972
more detail about what 
we’ve talked about today.

1043
01:10:33,972 --> 01:10:42,132
Many times people use name-finding 
apps because they’ve been told that

1044
01:10:42,132 --> 01:10:45,604
it is the only way to find 
success as a beginner.

1045
01:10:45,604 --> 01:10:48,478
And, unfortunately, I’ve 
even seen this attitude

1046
01:10:48,478 --> 01:10:52,390
among consultants where 
they will say it is too hard

1047
01:10:52,390 --> 01:10:55,497
to teach a beginner to do 
careful family history.

1048
01:10:55,497 --> 01:10:58,353
They’re going to get discouraged
and they won’t do it.

1049
01:10:58,353 --> 01:11:02,785
And so therefore I have to teach 
them to use the name-finding app.

1050
01:11:02,785 --> 01:11:07,205
Well of course, Find-Take-Teach 
has turned that on its head.

1051
01:11:07,205 --> 01:11:12,668
As a helper prepares a Spirit-led 
Find-Take-Teach experience

1052
01:11:12,668 --> 01:11:18,425
to find valid names, beginners do 
learn to do valid family history.

1053
01:11:18,425 --> 01:11:23,665
So that first webinar kind 
of touches on that subject.

1054
01:11:23,665 --> 01:11:26,254
The second one dives more 
into using the Holy Ghost

1055
01:11:26,254 --> 01:11:29,922
in family history, duplicates 
in Family Tree, obviously.

1056
01:11:29,922 --> 01:11:34,189
And then the last one goes into 
a lot more detail on understanding

1057
01:11:34,189 --> 01:11:37,014
the data in Family Tree,
where it came from and

1058
01:11:37,014 --> 01:11:39,940
what some of the additional 
challenges are with it.

1059
01:11:39,940 --> 01:11:42,007
And then lastly, 
I want to recommend to you

1060
01:11:42,007 --> 01:11:46,275
this amazing book that I just love. 
It’s available at Deseret Book.

1061
01:11:46,275 --> 01:11:48,249
It’s called "Hearts Turned 
to the Fathers,"

1062
01:11:48,249 --> 01:11:52,900
and it’s a history of family 
history since the restoration.

1063
01:11:52,900 --> 01:11:55,192
So it starts out from 
the beginning of the

1064
01:11:55,192 --> 01:12:00,032
restored gospel to about 
the 1990’s when the book was

1065
01:12:00,032 --> 01:12:04,200
published and when FamilySearch 
was just gaining traction.

1066
01:12:04,200 --> 01:12:09,040
So if you love family history 
I think you would love this book.

1067
01:12:09,040 --> 01:12:11,961
So thank you everybody for your 
time and attention today

1068
01:12:11,965 --> 01:12:14,945
and I hope that this webinar 
is helpful to you,

1069
01:12:14,946 --> 01:12:17,687
hope that it makes your 
family history more meaningful

1070
01:12:17,687 --> 01:12:21,209
and more successful. 
Thank you.

1071
01:12:21,209 --> 01:12:24,055
(Sean) Okay thank you so much 
to Kathryn for that wonderful

1072
01:12:24,055 --> 01:12:27,951
presentation. I would just like 
to remind everybody that these

1073
01:12:27,951 --> 01:12:31,386
webinars will be uploaded onto 
YouTube and our channel name

1074
01:12:31,386 --> 01:12:35,746
is BYU Family History Library. 
If you could, before you leave

1075
01:12:35,746 --> 01:12:39,132
the webinar today, look at the 
different polls that we have

1076
01:12:39,132 --> 01:12:41,477
down at the bottom 
of the screen.

1077
01:12:41,477 --> 01:12:46,717
We’d love to hear any feedback 
that you have or suggestions

1078
01:12:46,717 --> 01:12:50,417
to different topics that you’d 
like us to cover in the future.

1079
01:12:50,417 --> 01:12:54,677
That would be very helpful for us 
and our different presenters.

1080
01:12:54,680 --> 01:12:57,941
And again, thanks to Kathryn for 
that wonderful presentation today

1081
01:12:57,941 --> 01:13:08,161
and we hope to see you guys at our 
next webinar. Alright, Bye.