Well let me help you understand.
You don't understand my faith like I do, alright, so,
so give me, for a moment, the benefit of the doubt
that having been a leader of my church, a bishop and a state president,
I understand my church better than you do. - Right.
- Alright, my church has very strong beliefs that Mormons
should not participate in, encourage, in any way support abortion.
- You could be excommunicated if you do, it says right there. That's what they say, I don't say it! [laughs]
- Are you thinking I'm disagreeing with you?
- No, I don't know but if it's stronger...
- Are you disagreeing with me?
Let me once again say, I understand my faith better than you do.
- Right.
- You don't believe that do you?
- I'm not sure, you see, I...
- Well, then it's hardly worth having a discussion with you.
- Well no no, I'm...
- Listen, let me... can I complete the point?
- Well, the reason I said that, is because you also said in another forum,
I think it was on Stephanopoulos, about the second coming of Christ. - Right.
- And you said it's gonna happen in Jerusalem. - And it is.
- And your church says it's gonna happen in Missouri. - No it doesn't.
- Oh, is that wrong? - Is what wrong, is what wrong?
The church says that Christ appears on the Mount of Olives and splits the Mount of Olives
and appears in Jerusalem. That's what the church says.
And then over a thousand years, the millennium, that the world is reigned in two places,
Jerusalem and Missouri. That's what the church says.
The second coming, the arrival of Jesus Christ, our church says is in Jerusalem. That's the church doctrine.
- So Stephanopoulos mis-quoted your church, which is not surprising...
- That's fine, that's fine.
- ...but I was basing my question on that premise.
- Cleon Skousen has a book called "A Thousand Years" you can talk about.
Christ appears, it's throughout the Bible, Christ appears in Jerusalem,
splits the Mount of Olives to stop the war that's coming in to kill all the Jews,
it's... our church believes that. That's where the coming and glory of Christ occurs.
We also believe that over the thousand years that follows, the millennium,
he will reign from two places, that the law will come forward from one place...
from Missouri, and the other will be in Jerusalem. Alright, that's... now back to abortion.
- Before we... I have to get back on... but before we do anything else
I want you to understand one thing. I take this stuff real seriously.
- Oh I don't though. For me this is all frivolous. [!]
- No, I take you... no seriously now...
- Come on, I'm running for President!
- Now gimme a second, I'm just... just relax. I take you seriously, and I take what you're saying seriously.
- But you're not giving me the opportunity to explain to you...
- We only got eight minutes.
- ... that my, that my... my faith has very strong beliefs, that if I commit abortion, encourage an abortion...
I was beaten up in Boston because I pointed out time and again that I encouraged girls
not to get abortions. That I told her [sic] to have adoptions.
I have never done anything that in any way violates the principles of my church in that regard.
I've made other mistakes, but in that regard.
But the church does not say that a member of our church has to be opposed to allowing choice in society.
It does not say that. And therefore, there are Mormon Democrats.
There's a Democratic Party in Utah, filled with Mormons,
and the church doesn't say "they're wrong, they're being ex-communicated", no, it says,
"Look, we are vehemently opposed to abortion. Ourselves, and for ourselves."
"But we allow other people to make their own choice."
I disagree with that view. Politicially, I looked at it and I said, you know what, that's wrong.
And it's not a Mormon thing, it's a secular position to say, you know what, I was wrong.
We should have as a society a prohibition on abortion in the following circumstances.
But it's not violating my faith, let me assure you.
- I hope we can do this, and we can spend some quality time on the air,
rather than the soundbite stuff.
- No I, I mean, I don't like coming on the air and having you go after my church and me and my...
- I'm not going after your church, I agree with your church!
- I know, that's right, but... I'm not running as a Mormon,
and I get a little tired of coming on a show like yours and having it all about Mormon. [sic]
- See, I don't mind it being about that...
- Yeah, I do. I do.
- I agree with the ethics of your church, for Pete's sake!
- So do I, so do I.
- Well, [laughs], so I was trying to...
- No, you're trying to tell me that I'm not a faithful Mormon, that I'm not faithful to my church.
- No, I'm trying to get you to reconcile what I think is a disparity between...
- ...and have a great discussion about Mormonism and the Mormon church
and reading the doctrines of the church and where my view is, and you know what?
I'm not running to talk about Mormonism.
- No, but the point is, you know, people who are likely to vote don't want to elect
a Ted Kennedy, who runs, comes back, or a Senator Harken,
who comes here to dalley, and comes here to Iowa and says "I'm pro-life",
and when he gets to Washington stands up and becomes pro-choice.
- Here's your opportunity to have that settled in your mind.
I was Governor for four years. See, that is what I'm talking about.
I was Governor for four years. I had a number of pieces of legislation that came to my desk
that dealt with abortion, abstinence education, RU486, and so forth.
I vetoed any bill that was in favour of choice. I was entirely consistent in favour of life.
So it's not just my word that have to take, but my record. Alright, thank you.
- Thank you. Thanks a lot.