0:00:00.950,0:00:02.878
Imagine you're in Rome

0:00:02.878,0:00:06.105
and you've made your way[br]to the Vatican Museums,

0:00:06.105,0:00:09.727
and you've been shuffling[br]down long corridors,

0:00:09.727,0:00:14.417
past statues, frescoes,[br]lots and lots of stuff.

0:00:14.417,0:00:16.925
You're heading towards the Sistine Chapel.

0:00:16.925,0:00:22.149
At last, a long corridor,[br]a stair, and a door.

0:00:22.149,0:00:25.354
You're at the threshold[br]of the Sistine Chapel.

0:00:25.354,0:00:27.141
So what are you expecting?

0:00:27.141,0:00:29.575
Soaring domes? Choirs of angels?

0:00:29.575,0:00:31.757
We don't really have any of that there.

0:00:31.757,0:00:36.285
Instead, you may ask yourself,[br]what do we have?

0:00:36.285,0:00:38.932
Well, curtains up on the Sistine Chapel.

0:00:38.932,0:00:41.649
And I mean literally, you're surrounded[br]by painted curtains,

0:00:41.649,0:00:44.087
the original decoration of this chapel.

0:00:44.087,0:00:48.870
Churches used tapestries not just[br]to keep out cold during long masses,

0:00:48.870,0:00:52.631
but as a way to represent[br]the great theater of life.

0:00:52.631,0:00:57.786
The human drama in which each one of us[br]plays a part is a great story,

0:00:57.786,0:01:00.619
a story that encompasses the whole world,

0:01:00.619,0:01:03.985
and that came to unfold[br]in the three stages

0:01:03.985,0:01:06.284
of the painting in the Sistine Chapel.

0:01:06.284,0:01:09.767
Now, this building started out[br]as a space for a small group

0:01:09.767,0:01:12.600
of wealthy, educated Christian priests.

0:01:12.600,0:01:15.456
They prayed there.[br]They elected their Pope there.

0:01:15.456,0:01:19.774
Five hundred years ago, it was the ultimate[br]ecclesiastical man cave.

0:01:19.774,0:01:25.277
So, you may ask, how can it be[br]that today it attracts and delights

0:01:25.277,0:01:28.133
five million people a year,

0:01:28.133,0:01:30.339
from all different backgrounds?

0:01:30.339,0:01:34.843
Because in that compressed space,[br]there was a creative explosion,

0:01:34.843,0:01:39.812
ignited by the electric excitement[br]of new geopolitical frontiers

0:01:39.812,0:01:44.131
which set on fire the ancient[br]missionary tradition of the Church

0:01:44.131,0:01:47.776
and produced one of the greatest[br]works of art in history.

0:01:47.776,0:01:52.722
Now, this development took place[br]as a great evolution,

0:01:52.722,0:01:55.439
moving from the beginning of a few elite

0:01:55.439,0:01:58.898
and eventually able to speak[br]to audiences of people

0:01:58.898,0:02:01.313
that come from all over the world.

0:02:01.313,0:02:04.123
This evolution took place in three stages,

0:02:04.123,0:02:07.257
each one linked[br]to a historical circumstance.

0:02:07.257,0:02:09.417
The first one was rather limited in scope.

0:02:09.417,0:02:12.203
It reflected the rather[br]parochial perspective.

0:02:12.203,0:02:16.614
The second one took place after[br]worldviews were dramatically altered

0:02:16.614,0:02:19.261
after Columbus's historical voyage.

0:02:19.261,0:02:20.190
And the third,

0:02:20.190,0:02:23.520
when the Age of Discovery[br]was well under way

0:02:23.520,0:02:28.373
and the Church rose to the challenge[br]of going global.

0:02:28.373,0:02:32.366
The original decoration of this church[br]reflected a smaller world.

0:02:32.366,0:02:34.224
There were busy scenes

0:02:34.224,0:02:37.521
that told the stories of the lives[br]of Jesus and Moses,

0:02:37.521,0:02:41.747
reflecting the development[br]of the Jewish and Christian people.

0:02:41.747,0:02:44.185
The man who commissioned this,[br]Pope Sixtus IV,

0:02:44.185,0:02:47.431
assembled a dream team[br]of Florentine art,

0:02:47.431,0:02:50.450
including men like Sandro Botticelli,

0:02:50.450,0:02:53.979
and the man who would become[br]Michelangelo's future painting teacher,

0:02:53.979,0:02:55.535
Ghirlandaio.

0:02:55.535,0:03:00.805
These men, they blanked the walls[br]with a frieze of pure color,

0:03:00.805,0:03:04.288
and in these stories you'll notice[br]familiar landscapes,

0:03:04.288,0:03:07.051
the artists using Roman monuments[br]or a Tuscan landscape

0:03:07.051,0:03:11.556
to render a faraway story,[br]something much more familiar,

0:03:11.556,0:03:15.224
with the addition of images[br]of the Pope's friends and family.

0:03:15.224,0:03:18.080
This was a perfect decoration[br]for a smart court

0:03:18.080,0:03:20.240
limited to the European continent,

0:03:20.240,0:03:25.208
but in 1492, the New World was discovered,

0:03:25.208,0:03:27.321
horizons were expanding,

0:03:27.321,0:03:33.289
and this little 133 x 46 foot microcosm[br]had to expand as well.

0:03:33.289,0:03:35.007
And it did,

0:03:35.007,0:03:37.050
thanks to a creative genius,

0:03:37.050,0:03:40.208
a visionary, and an awesome story.

0:03:40.208,0:03:42.781
Now, the creative genius[br]was Michelangelo Buonarroti,

0:03:42.781,0:03:47.309
33 years old when he was tapped[br]to decorate 12,000 square foot of ceiling,

0:03:47.309,0:03:49.027
and the deck was stacked against him.

0:03:49.027,0:03:52.161
He had trained in painting,[br]but had left to pursue sculpture.

0:03:52.161,0:03:55.621
There were angry patrons in Florence[br]because he had left a stack

0:03:55.621,0:03:57.200
of incomplete commissions,

0:03:57.200,0:04:00.822
lured to Rome by the prospect[br]of a great sculptural project,

0:04:00.822,0:04:03.492
and that project had fallen through,

0:04:03.492,0:04:06.831
and he had been left with a commission[br]to paint 12 apostles

0:04:06.831,0:04:09.757
against a decorative background[br]in the Sistine Chapel ceiling

0:04:09.757,0:04:13.402
which would look like[br]every other ceiling in Italy.

0:04:13.402,0:04:15.678
But genius rose to the challenge.

0:04:15.678,0:04:19.114
In an age when a man dared[br]to sail across the Atlantic Ocean,

0:04:19.114,0:04:22.899
Michelangelo dared to chart[br]new artistic waters.

0:04:22.899,0:04:25.360
He too would tell a story,

0:04:25.360,0:04:28.843
no apostles, but a story[br]of great beginnings,

0:04:28.843,0:04:31.304
the story of Genesis.

0:04:31.304,0:04:33.928
Not really an easy sell,[br]stories on a ceiling.

0:04:33.928,0:04:38.874
How would you be able to read[br]a busy scene from 62 feet below?

0:04:38.874,0:04:41.706
The painting technique that had been[br]handed on for 200 years

0:04:41.706,0:04:45.514
in Florentine studios was not equipped[br]for this kind of a narrative.

0:04:45.514,0:04:48.742
But Michelangelo wasn't really a painter,

0:04:48.742,0:04:50.994
and so he played to his strengths.

0:04:50.994,0:04:54.500
Instead of being accustomed[br]to filling space with busyness,

0:04:54.500,0:04:58.378
he took a hammer and chisel[br]and hacked away at a piece of marble

0:04:58.378,0:05:01.025
to reveal the figure within.

0:05:01.025,0:05:03.138
Michelangelo was an essentialist.

0:05:03.138,0:05:07.712
He would tell his story[br]in massive, dynamic bodies.

0:05:07.712,0:05:12.170
This plan was embraced[br]by the larger-than-life Pope Julius II,

0:05:12.170,0:05:15.815
a man who was unafraid[br]of Michelangelo's brazen genius.

0:05:15.815,0:05:19.066
He was nephew to Pope Sixtus IV,[br]and he had been steeped in art

0:05:19.066,0:05:21.852
for 30 years, and he knew its power.

0:05:21.852,0:05:24.940
And history has handed down the moniker[br]of the Warrior Pope,

0:05:24.940,0:05:29.050
but this man's legacy to the Vatican,[br]it wasn't fortresses and artillery,

0:05:29.050,0:05:30.281
it was art.

0:05:30.281,0:05:32.858
He left us the Raphael Rooms,[br]the Sistine Chapel.

0:05:32.858,0:05:35.342
He left St. Peter's Basilica as well as

0:05:35.342,0:05:39.940
an extraordinary collection[br]of Greco-Roman sculptures,

0:05:39.940,0:05:44.421
decidedly un-Christian works[br]that would become the seedbed

0:05:44.421,0:05:48.531
of the world's first modern museum,[br]the Vatican Museums.

0:05:48.531,0:05:50.295
Julius was a man

0:05:50.295,0:05:54.103
who envisioned a Vatican[br]that would be eternally relevant

0:05:54.103,0:05:56.216
through grandeur and through beauty,

0:05:56.216,0:05:57.679
and he was right:

0:05:57.679,0:06:02.555
the encounter between these two giants,[br]Michelangelo and Julius II,

0:06:02.555,0:06:05.016
that's what gave us the Sistine Chapel.

0:06:05.016,0:06:08.453
Michelangelo was so committed[br]to this project

0:06:08.453,0:06:13.004
that he succeeded in getting the job done[br]in three and a half years

0:06:13.004,0:06:14.582
using a skeleton crew

0:06:14.582,0:06:17.322
and spending most of the time,[br]hours on end,

0:06:17.322,0:06:21.641
reaching up above his head[br]to paint the stories on the ceiling.

0:06:21.641,0:06:23.591
So let's look at this ceiling

0:06:23.591,0:06:26.517
and see storytelling gone global.

0:06:26.517,0:06:30.789
No more familiar artistic references[br]to the world around you.

0:06:30.789,0:06:35.456
There's just space[br]and structure and energy,

0:06:35.456,0:06:40.077
and a monumental painted framework[br]which opens onto nine panels,

0:06:40.077,0:06:43.908
more driven by sculptural form[br]than painterly color,

0:06:43.908,0:06:46.625
and we stand in the far end

0:06:46.625,0:06:49.039
by the entrance, far from the altar

0:06:49.039,0:06:51.965
and from the gated enclosure[br]intended for the clergy,

0:06:51.965,0:06:57.236
and we peer into the distance[br]looking for a beginning.

0:06:57.236,0:07:01.276
And whether in scientific inquiry[br]or in Biblical tradition,

0:07:01.276,0:07:04.619
we think in terms of a primal spark.

0:07:04.619,0:07:07.638
Michelangelo gave us an initial energy[br]when he gave us

0:07:07.638,0:07:09.542
the separation of light and dark,

0:07:09.542,0:07:12.955
a churning figure blurry in the distance

0:07:12.955,0:07:15.463
compressed into a tight space.

0:07:15.463,0:07:17.668
The next figure looms larger,

0:07:17.668,0:07:21.267
and you see a figure hurtling[br]from one side to the next.

0:07:21.267,0:07:26.097
He leaves in his wake[br]the sun, the moon, vegetation.

0:07:26.097,0:07:30.439
Michelangelo didn't focus[br]on the stuff that was being created,

0:07:30.439,0:07:32.436
unlike all the other artists.

0:07:32.436,0:07:35.849
He focused on the act of Creation.

0:07:35.849,0:07:38.357
And then the movement stops,

0:07:38.357,0:07:41.630
like a caesura in poetry,[br]and the Creator hovers.

0:07:41.630,0:07:42.931
So what's He doing?

0:07:42.931,0:07:45.972
Is he creating land? Is He creating sea?

0:07:45.972,0:07:50.314
Or is He looking back over His handiwork,[br]the Universe and His treasures,

0:07:50.314,0:07:54.447
just like Michelangelo must have looking[br]back over his work in the ceiling

0:07:54.447,0:07:58.580
and proclaiming, "It is good."

0:07:58.580,0:08:00.786
So now the scene is set,

0:08:00.786,0:08:03.990
and you get to the culmination[br]of Creation which is Man.

0:08:03.990,0:08:08.356
Adam leaps to the eye,[br]a light figure against a dark background,

0:08:08.356,0:08:10.236
but looking closer,

0:08:10.236,0:08:13.139
that leg is pretty languid on the ground,

0:08:13.139,0:08:15.344
the arm is heavy on the knee.

0:08:15.344,0:08:19.268
Adam lacks that interior spark

0:08:19.268,0:08:21.358
that will impel him to greatness.

0:08:21.358,0:08:26.373
That spark is about to be conferred[br]by the Creator in that finger,

0:08:26.373,0:08:28.974
which is one millimeter[br]from the hand of Adam.

0:08:28.974,0:08:32.294
It puts us at the edge of our seats,[br]because we're one moment

0:08:32.294,0:08:33.850
from that contact,

0:08:33.850,0:08:36.776
through which that man[br]will discover his purpose,

0:08:36.776,0:08:39.864
leap up and take his place[br]at the pinnacle of Creation.

0:08:39.864,0:08:43.068
And then Michelangelo threw a curveball.

0:08:43.068,0:08:45.808
Who is in that other arm?

0:08:45.808,0:08:47.572
Eve, first woman.

0:08:47.572,0:08:50.010
No, she's not an afterthought.[br]She's part of a plan.

0:08:50.010,0:08:52.681
She's always been in His mind.

0:08:52.681,0:08:55.676
Look at her, so intimate with God[br]that her hand curls

0:08:55.676,0:08:57.255
around his arm,

0:08:57.255,0:09:00.970
and for me, an American art historian

0:09:00.970,0:09:02.920
from the 21st century,

0:09:02.920,0:09:05.637
this was the moment[br]that the painting spoke to me,

0:09:05.637,0:09:08.771
because I realized that this representation[br]of the human drama

0:09:08.771,0:09:13.438
was always about men[br]and women, so much so

0:09:13.438,0:09:15.760
that the dead center,[br]the heart of the ceiling

0:09:15.760,0:09:18.198
is the creation of Woman, not Adam,

0:09:18.198,0:09:22.146
and the fact is, and when you see them[br]together in the Garden of Eden,

0:09:22.146,0:09:23.887
they fall together,

0:09:23.887,0:09:26.766
and together their proud posture

0:09:26.766,0:09:28.647
turns into folded shame.

0:09:28.647,0:09:31.503
You art a critical juncture[br]now in the ceiling.

0:09:31.503,0:09:34.568
You are exactly at the point[br]where you and I can go

0:09:34.568,0:09:36.239
no further into the church.

0:09:36.239,0:09:39.095
The gated enclosure[br]keeps us out of the inner sanctum,

0:09:39.095,0:09:41.905
and we are cast out[br]much like Adam and Eve.

0:09:41.905,0:09:43.623
The remaining scenes in the ceiling,

0:09:43.623,0:09:46.316
they mirror the crowded chaos[br]of the world around us.

0:09:46.316,0:09:48.847
You have Noah and his Ark and the flood.

0:09:48.847,0:09:52.353
You have Noah. He's making a sacrifice[br]and a covenant with God.

0:09:52.353,0:09:53.839
Maybe he's the Savior?

0:09:53.839,0:09:57.787
Oh, but no, Noah is the one[br]who grew grapes, invented wine,

0:09:57.787,0:09:59.969
got drunk, and passed out[br]naked in his barn.

0:09:59.969,0:10:02.941
It is a curious way to design the ceiling,

0:10:02.941,0:10:04.706
now starting out with God creating life,

0:10:04.706,0:10:07.446
ending up with some guy[br]blind drunk in a barn.

0:10:07.446,0:10:09.814
And so, compared with Adam,

0:10:09.814,0:10:12.693
you might think Michelangelo[br]is making fun of us.

0:10:12.693,0:10:14.829
But he's about to dispel the gloom

0:10:14.829,0:10:18.302
by using those bright colors[br]right underneath Noah:

0:10:18.302,0:10:21.716
emerald, taupe, and scarlet[br]on the Prophet Zechariah.

0:10:21.716,0:10:24.901
Zechariah foresees a light[br]coming from the east,

0:10:24.901,0:10:28.431
and we are turned at this juncture[br]to a new destination,

0:10:28.431,0:10:32.076
with sibyls and prophets[br]who will lead us on a parade.

0:10:32.076,0:10:35.652
You have the heroes and heroines[br]who make safe the way,

0:10:35.652,0:10:38.160
and we follow the mothers and fathers.

0:10:38.160,0:10:42.269
They are the motors of this great[br]human engine, driving it forward.

0:10:42.269,0:10:45.799
And now we're at the keystone[br]of the ceiling,

0:10:45.799,0:10:48.422
the culmination of the whole thing,

0:10:48.422,0:10:50.744
with a figure that looks like[br]he's about to fall out of his space

0:10:50.744,0:10:52.021
into our space,

0:10:52.021,0:10:53.452
encroaching our space.

0:10:53.452,0:10:55.797
This is the most important juncture.

0:10:55.797,0:10:57.863
Past meets present.

0:10:57.863,0:11:00.789
This figure, Jonah, who spent three days[br]in the belly of the whale,

0:11:00.789,0:11:03.552
for the Christians is the symbol[br]of the renewal of humanity

0:11:03.552,0:11:06.385
through Jesus's sacrifice,[br]but for the multitudes

0:11:06.385,0:11:10.657
of visitors to that museum[br]from all faiths who visit there every day,

0:11:10.657,0:11:13.722
he is the moment the distant past

0:11:13.722,0:11:18.250
encounters and meets immediate reality.

0:11:18.250,0:11:22.708
All of this brings us to the yawning[br]archway of the altar wall,

0:11:22.708,0:11:25.680
where we see Michelangelo's Last Judgment,

0:11:25.680,0:11:29.385
painted in 1534 after the world[br]had changed again.

0:11:29.385,0:11:31.359
The Reformation had splintered the Church.

0:11:31.359,0:11:34.494
The Ottoman Empire had made[br]Islam a household word,

0:11:34.494,0:11:37.619
and Magellan had found a route[br]into the Pacific Ocean.

0:11:37.619,0:11:42.379
How is a 59-year old artist who has never[br]been any further than Venice

0:11:42.379,0:11:44.747
going to speak to this new world?

0:11:44.747,0:11:47.928
Michelangelo chose to paint destiny,

0:11:47.928,0:11:49.739
that universal desire,

0:11:49.739,0:11:51.481
common to all of us,

0:11:51.481,0:11:54.383
to leave a legacy of excellence.

0:11:54.383,0:11:58.005
Told in terms of the Christian vision[br]of the Last Judgment,

0:11:58.005,0:11:59.421
the end of the world,

0:11:59.421,0:12:01.697
Michelangelo gave you[br]a series of figures

0:12:01.697,0:12:05.040
who are wearing these[br]strikingly beautiful bodies.

0:12:05.040,0:12:07.873
They have no more covers,[br]no more portraits

0:12:07.873,0:12:09.266
except for a couple.

0:12:09.266,0:12:11.936
It's a composition[br]only out of bodies,

0:12:11.936,0:12:15.373
391, no two alike,

0:12:15.373,0:12:17.764
unique like each[br]and every one of us.

0:12:17.764,0:12:21.572
They start in the lower corner,[br]breaking away from the ground,

0:12:21.572,0:12:24.359
struggling and trying to rise.

0:12:24.359,0:12:26.820
Those who have risen[br]reach back to help others,

0:12:26.820,0:12:28.538
and in one amazing vignette,

0:12:28.538,0:12:31.905
you have a black man and a white man[br]pulled up together

0:12:31.905,0:12:35.945
in an incredible vision of human unity[br]in this new world.

0:12:35.945,0:12:39.544
The lion's share of the space[br]goes to the winner's circle.

0:12:39.544,0:12:44.257
There you find men and women[br]completely nude like athletes.

0:12:44.257,0:12:46.672
They are the ones[br]who have overcome adversity,

0:12:46.672,0:12:50.410
and Michelangelo's vision[br]of people who combat adversity,

0:12:50.410,0:12:51.827
overcome obstacles,

0:12:51.827,0:12:53.800
they're just like athletes.

0:12:53.800,0:12:57.237
So you have men and women[br]flexing and posing

0:12:57.237,0:12:59.187
in this extraordinary spotlight.

0:12:59.187,0:13:02.252
Presiding over this assembly is Jesus,

0:13:02.252,0:13:04.342
first a suffering man on the cross,

0:13:04.342,0:13:06.594
now a glorious ruler in Heaven.

0:13:06.594,0:13:09.636
And as Michelangelo[br]proved in his painting,

0:13:09.636,0:13:11.981
hardship, setbacks, and obstacles,

0:13:11.981,0:13:16.276
they don't limit excellence,[br]they forge it.

0:13:16.276,0:13:18.784
Now, this does lead us[br]to one odd thing.

0:13:18.784,0:13:20.850
This is the Pope's private chapel,

0:13:20.850,0:13:23.869
and the best way you can describe that[br]is indeed a stew of nudes.

0:13:23.869,0:13:27.863
But Michelangelo was trying to use[br]only the best artistic language,

0:13:27.863,0:13:30.231
the most universal artistic language[br]he could think of,

0:13:30.231,0:13:32.112
that of the human body.

0:13:32.112,0:13:37.893
And so instead of the way of showing[br]virtue such as fortitude or self-mastery,

0:13:37.893,0:13:42.212
he borrowed from Julius II's[br]wonderful collection of sculptures

0:13:42.212,0:13:46.972
in order to show inner strength[br]as external power.

0:13:46.972,0:13:50.757
Now, one contemporary did write

0:13:50.757,0:13:54.936
that the chapel was too beautiful[br]to not cause controversy,

0:13:54.936,0:13:56.236
and so it did.

0:13:56.236,0:13:59.719
Michelangelo soon found[br]that thanks to the printing press,

0:13:59.719,0:14:02.900
complaints about the nudity[br]spread all over the place,

0:14:02.900,0:14:07.219
and soon his masterpiece of human drama[br]was labeled pornography,

0:14:07.219,0:14:09.239
at which point he added[br]two more portraits,

0:14:09.239,0:14:11.747
one of the man who criticized him,[br]a papal courtier,

0:14:11.747,0:14:15.903
and the other one of himself[br]as a dried up husk, no athlete,

0:14:15.903,0:14:18.457
in the hands of a long-suffering martyr.

0:14:18.457,0:14:22.079
The year he died he saw[br]several of these figures covered over,

0:14:22.079,0:14:28.069
a triumph for trivial distractions[br]over his great exhortation to glory.

0:14:28.069,0:14:30.206
And so now we stand

0:14:30.206,0:14:32.156
in the here and now.

0:14:32.156,0:14:34.292
We are caught in that space

0:14:34.292,0:14:36.428
between beginnings and endings,

0:14:36.428,0:14:40.538
in the great, huge totality[br]of the human experience.

0:14:40.538,0:14:44.532
The Sistine Chapel forces us[br]to look around as if it were a mirror.

0:14:44.532,0:14:46.134
Who am I in this picture?

0:14:46.134,0:14:48.641
Am I one of the crowd?[br]Am I the drunk guy?

0:14:48.641,0:14:50.197
Am I the athlete?

0:14:50.197,0:14:52.589
And as we leave this haven[br]of uplifting beauty,

0:14:52.589,0:14:56.373
we are inspired to ask ourselves[br]life's biggest questions.

0:14:56.373,0:15:01.621
Who am I and what role do I play[br]in this great theater of life?

0:15:01.621,0:15:03.293
Thank you.

0:15:03.293,0:15:06.358
(Applause)

0:15:06.358,0:15:09.399
Bruno Giussani: Elizabeth Lev, thank you.

0:15:09.399,0:15:13.091
Elizabeth, you mentioned[br]this whole issue of pornography,

0:15:13.091,0:15:17.619
too many nudes and too many[br]daily life scenes and improper things

0:15:17.619,0:15:20.126
in the eyes of the time.

0:15:20.126,0:15:21.938
But actually the story is bigger.

0:15:21.938,0:15:24.793
It's not just touching up[br]and covering up some of the figures.

0:15:24.793,0:15:27.766
This work of art was almost[br]destroyed because of that.

0:15:27.766,0:15:31.504
Elizabeth Lev: The effect[br]of the Last Judgment was enormous.

0:15:31.504,0:15:34.406
The printing press made sure[br]that everybody saw it,

0:15:34.406,0:15:36.891
and so this wasn't something[br]that happened within a couple of weeks.

0:15:36.891,0:15:42.115
It was something that happened[br]over the space of 20 years

0:15:42.115,0:15:44.088
of editorials and complaints,

0:15:44.088,0:15:45.249
saying to the Church,

0:15:45.249,0:15:47.827
"You can't possibly tell us[br]how to live our lives.

0:15:47.827,0:15:51.310
Did you notice you have[br]pornography in the Pope's chapel?"

0:15:51.310,0:15:53.701
And so after complaints and insistence

0:15:53.701,0:15:56.534
of trying to get this work destroyed,

0:15:56.534,0:15:58.740
it was finally the year[br]that Michelangelo died

0:15:58.740,0:16:00.667
that the Church finally found[br]a compromise,

0:16:00.667,0:16:02.501
a way to save the painting,

0:16:02.501,0:16:05.720
and that was in putting up[br]these extra 30 covers,

0:16:05.720,0:16:08.552
and that happens to be[br]the origin of fig-leafing.

0:16:08.552,0:16:10.271
That's where it all came about,

0:16:10.271,0:16:12.848
and it came about from a church[br]that was trying to save a work of art,

0:16:12.848,0:16:16.958
not indeed deface or destroyed it.

0:16:16.958,0:16:19.790
BG: This, what you just gave us,[br]is not the classic tour

0:16:19.790,0:16:22.670
that people get today[br]when they go to the Sistine Chapel.

0:16:22.670,0:16:24.388
(Laughter)

0:16:24.388,0:16:26.733
EL: I don't know, is that an ad?

0:16:26.733,0:16:31.400
BG: No, no, no, not necessarily,[br]it is a statement.

0:16:31.400,0:16:35.765
It is, the experience of art today[br]is encountering problems.

0:16:35.765,0:16:38.268
Too many people want to see this there,

0:16:38.268,0:16:40.984
and the result is five million people[br]going through that tiny door

0:16:40.984,0:16:43.190
and experiencing it[br]in a completely different way

0:16:43.190,0:16:44.862
than we just did in the last 15 minutes.

0:16:44.862,0:16:47.903
EL: Right. I agree. I think it's really nice[br]to be able to pause and look,

0:16:47.903,0:16:50.685
but also realize,[br]even when you're in those days,

0:16:50.685,0:16:52.775
with 20,000 people a day,

0:16:52.775,0:16:55.352
even those days when you're in there[br]with all those other people,

0:16:55.352,0:16:58.278
look around you and think[br]how amazing it is

0:16:58.278,0:17:01.958
that some painted plaster[br]from 500 years ago

0:17:01.958,0:17:05.090
can still draw all those people[br]standing side by side with you

0:17:05.090,0:17:07.089
looking upwards with their jaws dropped.

0:17:07.089,0:17:09.829
It's a great statement about how beauty

0:17:09.829,0:17:11.918
truly can speak to us all

0:17:11.918,0:17:14.914
through time and through[br]geographic space.

0:17:14.914,0:17:17.584
BG: Liz, grazie.[br]EL: Grazie a te.

0:17:17.584,0:17:20.276
BG: Thank you.[br](Applause)