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Herald: Hello, and welcome back to the FM-
channel. Our next speaker is Kai Konsa.

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He's a professor at the Graduate School of
Media Design at Cairo University Japan.

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His talk will be about focus on Wirfs.
From what I understood is that it's about

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shivers and goosebumps in media
performances that are usually spontaneous.

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But somehow he and his team managed to
induce them artificially. But I'm very

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forward. I'm looking very forward to this
talk as I don't really understand it. But

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now, if you want to ask questions in the
end, RC at the Channel rc3-fm in the

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rocket chat at the Channel FM and on
Twitter, and the videos and the hashtag

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3FM without the Dash, you can ask
questions that will be answered in the Q&A

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session afterwards.
*repated but on english*

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Allardyce parking Seotioa your current
idea that some 200 images of a player for

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native of translated and that and now I'm
looking forward to a hopefully very

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interesting talk.
Konsa: Hello and welcome to my talk

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"Frisson Waves", augmenting esthetic
chills in classical music performances.

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This is conceptual, early research work
from collaboration of a lot of artists,

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designers, researchers, and I'm just
speaker to introduce it to you a little

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bit. My name is Kai. And in the next 20
minutes, I will talk to you a little bit

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about what is Frisson. Give you a bit of
motivation and background information, why

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we are interested in this feeling. And
then I will talk about how can we

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recognize into youth and also share
Frisson. And then at the end, I'll talk

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about some conclusion and a little bit of
outlook. So the question is, what is

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Frisson? You might not have heard the
term, I actually haven't heard Frisson

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before we started the research. Two and a
half years, three years ago. But I

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definitely knew the feeling. So if you're
listening attentively to a musical piece,

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sometimes you might get goose bumps or
some shiver down your spine. And that is

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usually triggered from the music. Frisson
is from the French shivers and sorry, my

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pronunciation with the German accent. So
you applied for that, I hope. And it's

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this psycho physiological phenomenon, that
we feel when we get these goose bumps or

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shivers that are triggered from music, but
also other. If you insist and you might

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wonder why goosebumps, how can goosebumps
be related to a positive feeling? There is

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actually no need to answer theories. I'm
one that I particularly like, is that

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Frisson is often induced over music or
over some kind of stimulus that is

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repetitive, that has a certain pattern,
and that at one point the pattern breaks

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and that surprises you. So this triggers
your autonomous nervous system. So the

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fight or flight response you get to
surprise you wonder alertness goes up and

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you realize that there's no danger and you
will relax. And feel this esthetic chills.

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So the talk, I will give today is an
exploration of the feeling of Frisson with

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technology. So how could we detect, induce
or transmit it using especially variable

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sensors and actuators and to be a little
bit aclimactic? I can already tell you

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that this is still in process. So this is
really exploratory work. However, you

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might also wonder why do you care about
this? Why do you want to do this? And you

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know, one reason, of course, is. Because
we can and because it's fun, and I think

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that's definitely, you know, kind of one
aspect of of the research, however. Also

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another reason is so our lab in Yokohama
works in human factors, research, so HCI

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and human computer interaction. And we
lately revisited a lot of work also from

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cybernetics, also nonlinear dynamics in
terms of research and also in terms of art

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and performance. We are very much inspired
by Stilnox work on extending and

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augmenting our body. And there's this
realization, if you work on research that,

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you know, knowledge is not merely
functional, there's always some kind of

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enjoyment in understanding a concept. And
I think also this community will really

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understand that type of feeling and this
sense of wonder and this feeling we also

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want to explore. We want to understand
ourselves better in terms of cognition

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perception, but also in terms of our
feeling. And actually, last year, I gave

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also a talk on on boiling mind on an
Frisson loop that we played with and

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started researching on. And to some
extent, this expression. If this all beef

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talk is just the continuation of this, and
overall, we are also looking for more

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creative ways to use physiological data or
other wearable computing sensing that is

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not related to surveillance. So extended
to this, we also wonder what does it mean

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to be life? It's easy if you think about
transmitting audio video, easy in

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quotation marks because yeah, there are
some experts that know a lot about that.

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And I see also the effort that goes into
the remote experience and not the

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congresses or conferences. However, we
still don't know how to transmit an

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atmosphere or a feeling that's much more
difficult. I think the Congress is a very

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nice example for that because it moved
from Berlin to Hamburg to Leipzig. But

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every time I visited, I kind of felt at
home. I felt, Oh yeah, these are, you

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know, kind of the people I like. These are
the culture, the community I belong to,

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even though it's at different places. And
we wonder, you know, kind of how can we

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transmit at this type of feeling and to
efforts that we get inspired from from

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this work is one is neuro life. That's a
project, an EU project with co-

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investigator Jamie Ward and also
cybernetic being project here in Japan,

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headed by Quarterman Minami. So that deals
with things like parallel agency and

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similar. And both of them are actually
also collaborators in the work that I will

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present today. So this is the high level
overview why we are interested in this

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song, but now getting back to the esthetic
chills. And first, the question is how

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could we go about and try to detect or
recognize them? Looking into related work,

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of course, we'll see Frisson is that
chills, of course, affect our physiology.

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And the first thing that you notice is, of
course, the payload erection. So the goose

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bumps that you can get on your arm so the
hairs go up. So we could try to detect

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that. However, that might be a little bit
difficult because some people might not

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have so much hair on on them and so on. So
then looking into other physiological

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changes, respiratory rate is going up for
the sweat glands, electro dermal activity.

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You will see more peaks. That's a stress
and excitement indicator, and heart rate

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goes up, blood pressure goes up and
usually heart rate variability related

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features go down. Because also, if you saw
last year's talk, we already built a

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system to record electro dermal activity.
So the sweating on the hand as well as

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heart rate we just thought will move along
and use that. Luckily, we also did a

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redesign of the wristband bands in the
meantime, so they look a little bit nicer

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now and you see also a life demo on my
background right now. So you see EDA and

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heart rate behind and if I press here. You
should also see some noise on the sensor.

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The visualization, by the way, is done by
Kirill Ragodzin. So thanks for the work!

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And then moving forward, so we use these
wristbands to set up a controlled

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experiment to detect esthetic chill
events. We just added a trigger, so to add

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some self-reporting to it. So in this
case, we really use the user as a self-

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report to classify or to label the Frisson
events that has, of course, you know, also

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some limitations. So you hope that that's
good enough to capture it. And we used

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some music pieces also from related work
and did some counterbalancing and run this

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lab study just in know kind of controlled
space or with headphones and so on. We

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finished this, but then we also wondered,
you know, how does it look like in real

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life in the wild experiments? So we also
organized a concert. With 18 audience

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members for one album musical program, and
the set up was the same, so everybody got

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a wristband and a trigger. We also added a
third for the pianist, so using EDA from

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the foot actually works also relatively
well and then recorded here the data and

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hope that people would report their focus
on their esthetic chills. Here's now one

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video. A short minute video that shows you
the recording. *piano music* How about the

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analysis? I have to see? I'm sorry the
this is still ongoing, so we don't really

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have a lot of results yet. And of course,
there were a lot of issues with the life

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recording. If you're interested in doing
something similar, contact some of the

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technical stuff or also me. We can give
you hints and doing this now over 15 or 20

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years and always do something is going
wrong, depending on the setting and so on.

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Now I also know more about the classical
music concerts. However, we got some

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useful data. The problem there was we
could also train a machine learning model

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because we really wanted to dect it real
time. And it seemed to work really well.

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We are just still not sure if it really
works or not, so we want to be very

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careful about that. So we get higher
accuracy spec. But given the limited

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amount of uses we had also and we want to
look into that a little bit more. However,

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the analysis, as well as the data sets,
will be publicly available. And if you

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want to get them a little bit earlier to
also contact me. So then moving on, this

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is the progress on detection. How does it
look like for triggering or inducing

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Frisson? So there's also a lot of cool
related work. I just show or highlight two

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of them. One is work by Shoko Fukushima at
all. And they're using the electrostatic

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effect on the arm to control payload
erection. And they use it to increase the

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surprise feeling of somebody, so you put
your arm inside and they can control the

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payload erection. Other work is from Ha at
all, whether using three Peltier elements

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on your back, on your spine and deactivate
them upwards to also induce Frisson or

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static chills. The problem with those two
setups, it's quite hard to get them into a

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into a concert hall. And, you know, some
people might not really have much hair on

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their arms or so on, so there might be
limitations for it. So then, you know, for

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first iteration, we decided to go for a
neck prototype, because kind of the neck

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is also a part of some of the Frisson
responses. So you get either chills down

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the spine or up the neck or also your hair
might stand up. So we thought it's a good

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start and we used first healthy elements
or thermal modules and also vibrant

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tactile feedback. In later iterations we
moved just to a thermal feedback to

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activate this on the back of the neck
around on the upper side of the trapezius

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muscle, and they would activate with
slight cold feedback. So for an initial

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tests, it seemed to work or just this,
just with 10 participants, around 30

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minutes per participant, we had two music
pieces that are based on related works or

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Chopin and Gustav Holst. We counterbalance
the conditions or music pieces with

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neckband without neck bent with neck bent,
with activation and without activation.

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And from an initial test, we can see that
it seems that slight cold feedback really

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provides more instances of reported
Frisson. So there is a slight positive

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feedback, but you know, it was still quite
little participants and we'll have to

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continue and see also with a little bit of
redesign. So we want to change the order

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and placement of the pelty elements for
the continuation work as well. Now moving

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to the last part, so we talked about
detection, induction, and now let's talk

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about sharing or transmitting Frisson. He
had the idea would be, you know, you are

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listening to a musical piece, a classical
piece and one person gets Frisson, does

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this detect it over the wristband and then
it's distributed ripples through the

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neighbors? They get activated over the
Nick Bend and hopefully also free Frisson

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again around the same time it just after
the red circled person felt that the

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esthetic chills. So in this case, then,
you know, we would have all of the

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audience members need to wear sensors and
actuators, and we would need to freshen

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detection and also then the activation
based on that. And for that, we also

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organized a not a concert in this case, 50
audience members. The program was around

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1,5 hours. And the set up was, as you see
here. So performers on the top, and then

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we had two sections. One saw 25 users
would wear just the wristband as a kind of

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control group. And the second group, 25
users would wear wristband and neck bent,

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so it would get to actually the detection
and also the activation. That's all, you

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know, 50 plus wristbands needed charging
and 25 neck bands were manufactured, and

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this is the picture from the actual
concert with an nick bent section. And

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here is how this should work, so, you
know, you have first one person, you

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detect the Frisson and then you ripple it
out to the neighbors, then the next person

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might feel Frisson we detected over the
wristband and then replay it out to the

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other people that haven't gotten
activation yet and so on. So you have then

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a wave of Frisson hopefully moving through
the audience members. This is not a setup

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up, yab he (NAME!) who also did a lot of
the organization parts or so on at the

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piano, and he is then a small video that
summarizes the work. And at the end you

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see also the servers, the recording
server, the activation server and the I

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know the detection server and also the
activation server. *piano music playes*

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*one person plays piano, another plays
chello* So the question you might have

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now, did it work? Hmm. Not not completely
sure. Again, here, work in progress or

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analysis is ongoing, and we can't also
really see because, yeah, we had this

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control group and we could see more
Frisson events in the sharing group. But

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how to interpret that, that's really,
really difficult. We are also working on

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the design of the wristbands as well as
the neckband and especially for the

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neckband. We got a couple of uses, I think
five or six or seven that really didn't

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like the neckband, not the activations or
the slight called activation was OK, but

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just because it was a little bit too tight
and a little bit too uncomfortable. So

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we're working on a redesign we have for
the next concert in april. All of the data

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make it also publicly available. Soon
enough, look also a little bit more what

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we can find out about what happened. This
brings me to the end of the presentation.

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I hope you enjoyed it. Yeah, I just wanted
to thank a couple of people first and

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foremost Yann He, who organized this
Frisson , who introduced us. And also the

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teams are dismissed for their second
concert. The extended team thanks a lot

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for everybody who was involved here, then
also all of the names. So these are the

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people that did the actual work did not
just doing the presenting like I do right

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now. I hope I haven't missed anybody. So
also, thanks to George, Dingding, Denny

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and so on and all of the other people
involved in group planning the studio

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Apollo and also the piano NIST's and
interactive performers. So thanks a lot.

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Yeah, that brings me to the end of the
presentation. As I said, we have a third

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concert, probably in April next year in
Yokohama, Tokyo area. So if you're

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interested, let me know also if you have a
general interest in effect or similar

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phenomenon. Also, just write me an email.
It would be good if you mentioned Frisson

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remote experience in the subject, so I can
just filter that out and something

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completely different. We also have a
conference next year. March submission

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deadline is January 7th, augmented humans
in Japan and Germany and cyberspace that

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deals with maybe similar work. So thanks a
lot for listening and I hope. Yeah, I told

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you something interested in the last 20
minutes. By.

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Herald: Hello, and welcome back to the FM
Channel, thank you Kay for the very

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interesting talk, and Kay should actually
be with us to answer a few questions.

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Hello, Kay.
Kay: Hello.

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Herald: And we actually do have a few
questions already. And the first one

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sounds a bit more like a comment, but I
tell you anyway. So one one viewer noted

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that this a technical cybernetics and
systems course here in Illmenau, the two

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in the know and wanted to know if you were
aware of this already.

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Kay: Actually, it wasn't, but it sounds
that sounds quite fun and getting more and

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more interested in cybernetics as well.
And I think it's useful to revisit some of

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the ideas around feedback loops, as I said
at the beginning. So that's cool if you if

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you're already looking into that. And I
think especially if people go into HCI

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fields, I think it's quite useful to get a
little bit of that background.

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Herald: Yes, nice. OK, let's go to the
next question. It's about neural networks,

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which have the neural network was us. Have
you considered neural net different doing

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differential equations such as echo-state
network or reservoir computing, which are

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good when modeling stiff time
consciousness processes?

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Kay: That's actually a really good
question and actually also good hint for

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what to do next. I just tried to look up.
I saw the question already. Also in the

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chat, I try to look up what we used, and I
think at the beginning we just used

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support vector machines, so not neural
networks. And no, no, we are using some

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neural network, but I don't know the
configuration and I couldn't check. I'll

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get back to the person who asked the
question. What was interesting for me was

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that the the data looks already quite
good. The sensor data looks actually quite

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good. And I would assume that in most
cases, any classifier will do a decent job

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for the lab experiments for the other
works. I think, yeah, that sounds quite

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interesting. I also want to go more
towards, um yeah, nonlinear dynamics work

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as well in terms of of of estimating
Frisson or different feelings. But that's

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that's a really good hint, that it would
be more question also for Jo Ann Hunt,

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coauthor of the paper that is also linked.
She is our data analyst and so on, and

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notes what what she used to the first
classifier was a support vector machine

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fairly basic and I think recently we use a
neural network, but I thought it's just

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very straightforward. PyTorch long
training, but nothing, nothing special and

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nothing fancy so far.
Herald: OK, nice, I guess I guess she will

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probably also hear from the questions
then. And then let's go to the next

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question. Have you considered or tested
the effects of editorial stimulus, such as

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attempting to cross Frisson Waves and in
boring situations instead of like

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interesting ones?
Kay: That's also quite a good or

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interesting question. I mean, there were
some some audience members also that

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mentioned that Nick Bend was actually a
little bit uncomfortable. So I'm not

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really sure if we cost Frisson with them.
And I don't know what would happen if you,

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I think you probably would just make the
situation uncomfortable anyways. I'm not

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sure what would happen then, if you
stimulating called feedback. Actually, you

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might get the fear response in these cases
if you're in a boring situation, I'm not

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sure if you if you. Hmm. Yeah, I actually
I don't know. It's definitely an

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interesting idea to to use it in boring
situations. Can you get somebody to change

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their? The feeling and get to the more
excited state? We are playing often, we

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played a little bit with the thermal
feedback and it was always interesting if

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you change the thermal feedback. So
instead of if you see something hot in VR,

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you give cold stimulus or so on. It really
is a little bit confusing and interesting.

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I haven't thought about that in Frisson
situation. And if it works for boring

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work, but it's definitely cool or
interesting. So if somebody wants to play

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with that, I would be up for also giving a
little bit of help or ideas in that

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direction.
Herald: OK, thank you for. For answering

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these questions, unfortunately, that don't
seem to be any more of them. So that's it.

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Thank you very much for the very
interesting talk. That's a topic I haven't

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really thinking that much about, but thank
you very much. It was very interesting.

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Kay: Thanks a lot also for having me, and
it's always fun and I always enjoyed the

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feedback. Yet there's also a candlelight
life demonstration behind me. So you saw

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my excitement level kind of increasing or
decreasing with the questions.

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Herald: Oh wow, that's pretty cool.
Kay: OK. Yeah, thanks a lot.

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Herald: Then here and here on the FM
channel, the next thing happening will at

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11:00 p.m. the lightening think talk or
not on the film channel. But one of the

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next things happening at three will be at
11:00 p.m. The lightning talks at remote

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range. And here on on our channel,
actually at 12:00 a.m. or midnight, there

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will be the next terror news show. And
that until then by.