WEBVTT

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So Manson's sentence was committed to life in prison.

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Now there's a book “Manson in His Own Words”

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as told to Nuel Emmons.

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Emmons is an ex-con who first met Manson

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while serving a short term in prison for car theft and,

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true to the unwritten code of the underworld,

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Manson cooperated on the book

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because he owed Emmons a favor.

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Today correspondent Heidi Schulman went

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to talk with Manson to find out,

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after all these years, is there any remorse?

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Is he sorry?

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Does he feel guilty?

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Well then we here on The Today Show staff

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debated among ourselves whether to air his answers.

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Half of our staff said “absolutely not even though

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Manson doesn't make a cent off this book

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let's not give them any publicity,”

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but another half said “Yes, believing that some of you

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are as curious as some of us are.”

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Well at any rate here is what Manson had to say.

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[Schulman] Charles Manson is serving his life sentence

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for murder in San Quentin prison.

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That is where we talked to him

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and with Nuel Emmons author of

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“Charles Manson: In his own words.”

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Our conversation lasted an hour and a half

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during which Manson was sometimes lucid,

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sometimes incoherent, and frequently manipulative.

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[Schulman] From your words as Mr. Emmons

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quotes them in this book,

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it's clear that you were guilty of murder,

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and yet he says in all his conversations with you

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he never heard you express remorse.

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Have you never felt it?

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[Manson] Remorse for what?

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You people have done everything in the world to me.

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Doesn't that give me equal right?

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I can do anything I want to you people

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at any time I want to because that's what

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you've done to me.

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If you spit in my face and smack me in the mouth

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and throw me in solitary confinement for nothing

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what do you think is gonna happen

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when I get out of here?

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Guilty, hmm I wouldn't do anything

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that I felt guilty about.

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[Schulman] You don't feel guilty at all?

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[Manson] There is no need to feel guilty.

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I haven't done anything I'm ashamed of.

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Maybe I haven't done enough.

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I might be ashamed of that;

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for not doing enough,

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for not giving enough,

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for not being more perceptive,

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for not being aware enough

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for not understanding,

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for being stupid.

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Maybe I should've killed four, five hundred people,

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then I would have felt better.

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Then I would have felt like I really

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offered society something.

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You know, if I wanted to kill somebody

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I’d take this book and beat you to death with it

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and I wouldn't feel a thing.

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It would be just like walking to the drugstore.

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“Do you feel blame?

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Are you mad?

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Do you feel like”… (Unintelligible nonsense words) …

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[Sculman] Nuel Emmons is an ex-convict

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who first met Manson in prison in the 50s.

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He claims he wrote the Manson book

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after seven years of conversation with Manson

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to show that he is no leader, no guru, but just a loser.

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[Shulman] Why should anyone care to read this book?

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[Emmons] My purpose when I first started

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was virtually to destroy the myth.

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I show that he is not as complex

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or the occult leader or etcetera,

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that he has been projected as being.

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[Manson] I don't fit in society,

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and I am incompetent.

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I am definitely incompetent.

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[Emmons] That’s not what I said.

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[Manson] I say that. I say that.

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I say that there's nothing wrong with being incompetent

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because you don't have to do as much.

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If you’re competent then you got a lot to do you see,

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but there is another aspect of it too.

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I've learned to reflect.

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I just reflect back.

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I know I don't know, I know I'm stupid.

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I admit I'm a pity, whatever.

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I've never been a success at anything.

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I even got to the point where I didn't want

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to be a success at anything.

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What would being a success,

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what does that mean, you know?

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Money?

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Oh, I've had all the money in the world three times

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and had to give it back.

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That’s a stupid little game, you know?

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My awareness and my consciousness is not the same

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as somebody that goes to school

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and has a mom and dad.

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See not having parents has left me

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in another dimension so to say, you know?

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I don't have no bad going for nothing.

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I don't judge.

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I hardly even think about too much.

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It's hard for me to remember breakfast.

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In fact, if I didn't have two, three girls to help me,

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I would pretty much be lost

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and I wouldn’t know what the hell I’m doing.

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[Schulman] You write that in all your conversations

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with Charles Manson he never expressed remorse.

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[Emmons] Have you seen any today?

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I mean, perhaps he believes totally

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in his own mind that he is not guilty.

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[Manson] You guys got the stuff in your head

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that I've murdered somebody.

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You’ve got it stuck in your brain

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that I murdered somebody.

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What do you want to call me a murderer for?

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I've never killed anyone.

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I don't need to kill anyone.

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I think it.

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I have it here.

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[Schulman] Who is this man you’ve been talking to

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for seven years?

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[Emmons] Well, to me he’s a convict that was a failure.

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I mean, he's the person that is not capable.

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I mean and I still lay it to the way

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the book reads it wasn't to start

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cleaning the earth or anything.

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I mean there was a drug burn

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that initiated the first one and the black guy

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the first tone of violence that surfaced anyway

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and then the death of Gary Hinman.

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There again, it was dope related,

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and it just kept feeding from there,

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and so it had no spiritual aspects at all.

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It was just a bunch of guys out there,

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kids out there that was living,

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doing their own thing

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and it used to be party time and play time

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and then through drugs and the whole bit,

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well, it started to get a little bit nasty,

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a little bit meaner and the first thing

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you know there's murders.

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[Manson] In my whole life I burglarized a grocery store,

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stole some nickels and dimes,

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busted open a stamp machine,

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stole a few automobiles, and cashed a couple checks.

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I'm a petty car thief.

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I've been with prostitutes and bums

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and winos all my life.

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The street is my world.

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I don't, I don't pretend to go uptown and be anything fancy.

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I can, but I find more real in the world that I'm in

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than I do the tinsel.

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And the real world is the one

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I have to deal with everyday, ya know?

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Believe me if I started murdering people…