WEBVTT

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[ギター音楽]

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ジェフ・ウォール: 常に写真を探しています

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私の仕事です

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写真を探す

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被写体という人もいます

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私は出発点と呼びます

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同じことです

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何かが起こるんです

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例えば２００１年にこのドアを開けて外に出た時

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３、４人の人が荷物を引きずって歩いているのが見えました

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カメラを持っていたら写真を撮ったでしょう

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けれど持っていなかった

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だからこの出来事を再現する必要がありました

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２ブロック歩いたところで青空と弧を描く高架橋が見えました

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”よしここだ”そう思いました

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それまでこのようなことをしたいと思ったことは
一度もありませんでした

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偶然だったんです

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この偶然により全く新しい発想が生まれました

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何か写真を -

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例えばこの本にのっている北斎の”駿州江尻”を見ていたとします

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すぐに これは再現できるぞと思いつきます

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私たちは何かが起きるのを待たなければなりません

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そして一度それが起これば
もうやるしか無いんです

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誰かが牛乳パックを持っていて

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何かの拍子で撒き散らしてしまう

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起こり得る話です

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誰でもミルクはこぼします
ただ私はより洗練された方法で

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見せているだけです

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[柔らかな電子音楽]

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生まれた時からこの街を知っています

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人生のほとんどをこの街で過ごしました
そういう人は街が好きか ー

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憎んでいるかでしょう

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多くのことを知っている

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多くのことがあった
だから私もバンクバーに複雑な思いを抱いています

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ここで仕事をするということは
そういった感情と折り合いをつけることだと感じます

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ある瞬間瞬間でどちらの感情が勝るかは
全くもって予測できません

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私の作品がそういった感情を含んでいると思いたいものです

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♪ ♪

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いまだになぜ自分が絵描きにならなかったのかわかりません

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１９６４年頃 私が１９か２０歳の時に絵をやめました

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６０年代の半ば概念芸術のような
オルタナティブアートが爆発的に生み出された時期でした

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どういうわけか当時のバンクーバーは
その風潮にピッタリはまっていたんです

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だから転向しました

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スタジオ持ちの絵描きをやめたんです

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スタジオは１５歳の時に手に入れたものでした
他のことに挑戦したかったんです

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知られていない対象に潜在的な力が宿っていると解ったとき

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本当に真剣に写真に取り組むことになったと思います

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That had to do with the scale of the picture,

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and it seemed to me there was simply 
no technical reason

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why photography couldn't become bigger.

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[beeping of machine]

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Photographs have a beautiful, molecular,

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granular surface that both shows itself and
hides itself in the image it makes,

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so there are qualities thatare revealed in
photography when it gets larger.

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[Indistinct chatter]

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After having seen some advertisements backlighted,
I thought,

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"OK.

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I'll try "the backlighted.

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"It's kind of interesting.

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It has a kind of luminosity that's really
different."

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So then I just started using it, and it worked.

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It created an object, and the object was sort
of, you know, emphatic.

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There's no real rules about–for me at least–

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how I should proceed, so sometimes, I build
replicas…

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but when you start building a replica,

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it can get really exciting and technically
interesting and artistically very absorbing

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to make that thing.

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[Jeff Wall] Where are you looking?

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— My hand, my thumb.

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[Jeff Wall] Look at Andrew's face.

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Now.

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Yeah, that's it.

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Just like that.

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Oh, that's good.

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Hold it.

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Go.

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Stop.

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Go.

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Stop.

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Nothing in my pictures is fake.

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Everything that you see happening is really
happening.

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— Action.

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[Camera clicks, flash pops]

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Good one.

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[Camera clicks, flash pops]

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Good.

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There's really no difference between capturing
a gesture by accident and capturing a gesture

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by design,

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so it's not really possible to have fakery
in photography, not really.

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♪ ♪

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I don't think it's very easy to practice any
art form very well,

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so there's no reason why photography should
be easy.

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It's easy to click the shutter.

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— But they're gonna do a whole run-through first.

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So I need you guys on your marks just to
double-check all the marks before we start.

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[Jeff Wall] But bringing things together, however you
do it,

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is always difficult because the standards
are high.

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— You're standing in a way that doesn't
make you look very tough.

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— OK.

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— Make yourself look like someone who's ready
to do something bad.

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—OK.

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[Jeff Wall] I think working with performers, it's always
very collaborative.

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—Look it yourself if you want to see yourself
up close.

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[Jeff Wall] They always give me things that I didn't even
know I wanted from them.

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— Looks good out here.

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— You look like a sculpture by Michelangelo
right now.

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[laughs]

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— Which is great.

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— Action.

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[Camera clicks] Good.

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Let's do another one.

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Ready… action.

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[Jeff Wall] I've learned that in order to do what I like
to do I need to have an open-ended schedule.

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It could take 5 days, could take 10 days,
it could take 20 days.

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I don't really know.

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You can shoot hundreds of pictures of the
same thing, and one of them's always different

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from all the others.

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It just is the way it goes,

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and that picture discloses something that
wasn't in the plan.

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It was based on things I'd seen from the bringing
of a person under the control of others to

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a place,

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and you see that all over the news.

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That doesn't happen till discussion has come
to an end, and so I added something.

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He talks.

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And the second thing that happens is the other
one listens.

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Neither of those things is likely to happen
in that situation.

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Talking is great in photography because it
can't be captured.

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It's the elusive element,

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and that shows you the limits of the art form
you're in.

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I love that about it.

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It always escapes.

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[strumming acoustic music]

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Pictures can never narrate.

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They can only imply a narrative,

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but they can never deliver it.

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So what happens is when the viewer's having
that experience what they're really doing

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is writing the story.

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They're intuiting a narrative for themselves,

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which not be the same narrative for everybody.

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Well, the title of that picture is "Daybreak
on an Olive Farm in the Negev, Israel."

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The picture included the Bedouin farm workers,
the olive grove,

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and one of the biggest prisons in Israel.

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So it was a great subject of many things.

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Some sleeping under the stars, who were probably
poor,

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and others sleeping in incarceration.

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Who knows what they are,

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and there could be thousands of them there.

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Probably I identify with those kind of people
in some way,

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and I think I identify with all the people
I photograph in some way.

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So I think artistically a subject has no connection
to the viewer unless the picture creates the

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connection by its artistry,

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by its beauty.

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So let's say you come into the gallery and
you see a picture of a homeless person

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and you experience it in a way you hadn't
experienced it before

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because you hadn't seen it in that picture
before.

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Then you will know that the beauty of that
picture was caused by that person somehow,

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and as soon as you realize that that subject
can cause that experience,

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you've changed your own relation to that subject.

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That's the social value of art, that it does
that not by convincing you of anything,

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telling you you should do this, but by giving
you an experience or creating an experience

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that itself,

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yeah, alters something.

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♪ ♪

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The mainstream of my work has been a kind
of realism because it's devoted to contemplating

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photography as a phenomenon,

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but I don't want to be obliged to a be a reporter
all the time,

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even a pseudo reporter.

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Works of pictorial art have to be something
that can be looked at endlessly.

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Supposing it flashed into my mind this image
of the ocean for no reason.

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Like a daydream or a moment of imagination.

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When you have flashes like that, they only
last just an amazingly short time,

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and they're gone, but you remember them.

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They set off a photographic possibility.

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For me, there's something
called a picture

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that is there all the time.

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♪ ♪

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I'm always searching for that
picture, the next one.

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♪ ♪

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[soft electronic music]