1 00:00:00,079 --> 00:00:06,270 but ever since these companies started 2 00:00:03,020 --> 00:00:10,559 amassing our data the clock has been 3 00:00:06,270 --> 00:00:13,049 ticking in 2008 we showed you how you 4 00:00:10,559 --> 00:00:16,049 and your friends 'facebook data could be 5 00:00:13,049 --> 00:00:21,390 accessed by a rogue facebook application 6 00:00:16,049 --> 00:00:23,369 without consent in 2011 a researcher 7 00:00:21,390 --> 00:00:26,189 called Mikael Kaczynski warns that if 8 00:00:23,369 --> 00:00:28,710 computers could analyze enough Facebook 9 00:00:26,189 --> 00:00:30,570 data from enough people they could spot 10 00:00:28,710 --> 00:00:33,660 connections between the way you act 11 00:00:30,570 --> 00:00:38,600 online and your personality traits the 12 00:00:33,660 --> 00:00:38,600 type of person you are what's really 13 00:00:38,930 --> 00:00:43,739 world-changing about those algorithms 14 00:00:41,250 --> 00:00:46,190 it's that they can take your music 15 00:00:43,739 --> 00:00:48,809 preferences or your book preferences and 16 00:00:46,190 --> 00:00:51,149 extract from these seemingly innocent 17 00:00:48,809 --> 00:00:53,219 information very accurate predictions 18 00:00:51,149 --> 00:00:56,070 about your religiosity leadership 19 00:00:53,219 --> 00:00:58,770 potential political views personality 20 00:00:56,070 --> 00:01:00,539 and so on by having hundreds and 21 00:00:58,770 --> 00:01:02,670 hundreds of thousands of Americans 22 00:01:00,539 --> 00:01:05,188 undertake this survey we were able to 23 00:01:02,670 --> 00:01:07,229 form a model to predict the personality 24 00:01:05,188 --> 00:01:11,189 of every single adult in the United 25 00:01:07,229 --> 00:01:13,170 States of America by 2016 alexander nix 26 00:01:11,189 --> 00:01:15,990 was explaining how cambridge analytic 27 00:01:13,170 --> 00:01:18,180 could use this kind of research to find 28 00:01:15,990 --> 00:01:21,119 people of different personality types 29 00:01:18,180 --> 00:01:24,030 and target them with specific messages 30 00:01:21,119 --> 00:01:26,460 that might influence their behavior if 31 00:01:24,030 --> 00:01:28,439 you know that the personality of the 32 00:01:26,460 --> 00:01:30,420 people you're targeting you can nuance 33 00:01:28,439 --> 00:01:32,790 your messaging to resonate more 34 00:01:30,420 --> 00:01:35,400 effectively with those key audience 35 00:01:32,790 --> 00:01:37,530 groups because it's personality that 36 00:01:35,400 --> 00:01:40,860 drives behavior and behavior that 37 00:01:37,530 --> 00:01:43,110 obviously influences how you vote soon 38 00:01:40,860 --> 00:01:46,110 afterwards these techniques were used by 39 00:01:43,110 --> 00:01:48,649 two political campaigns that would rock 40 00:01:46,110 --> 00:01:48,649 the world 41 00:01:49,860 --> 00:01:55,540 yes your likes and dislikes your 42 00:01:53,049 --> 00:01:58,720 comments and posts your personal data 43 00:01:55,540 --> 00:02:02,920 they are valuable but it's what they say 44 00:01:58,720 --> 00:02:07,420 about you as a person that's where the 45 00:02:02,920 --> 00:02:09,008 real power lies no one knows exactly how 46 00:02:07,420 --> 00:02:11,590 much these techniques actually 47 00:02:09,008 --> 00:02:14,080 contributed to the results of the votes 48 00:02:11,590 --> 00:02:16,450 one of the first researchers to ask the 49 00:02:14,080 --> 00:02:18,250 question was Paul Olivier - hey 50 00:02:16,450 --> 00:02:20,290 he works on an article at the end of 51 00:02:18,250 --> 00:02:22,150 2016 that investigated what was 52 00:02:20,290 --> 00:02:24,459 happening and this week he was here in 53 00:02:22,150 --> 00:02:28,150 London to give evidence to MPs about the 54 00:02:24,459 --> 00:02:29,920 latest revelations sitting alongside him 55 00:02:28,150 --> 00:02:31,690 in the Commons Select Committee was 56 00:02:29,920 --> 00:02:34,900 Cambridge analytic a whistleblower 57 00:02:31,690 --> 00:02:39,100 Christopher Wylie and straight after the 58 00:02:34,900 --> 00:02:40,420 session Paul sat down with me this isn't 59 00:02:39,100 --> 00:02:41,890 just about Facebook and this isn't just 60 00:02:40,420 --> 00:02:43,870 about Cambridge analytic where is it 61 00:02:41,890 --> 00:02:45,430 this kind of data collection analysis 62 00:02:43,870 --> 00:02:47,410 has been going on for a long time 63 00:02:45,430 --> 00:02:50,200 and it's being done by lots of people 64 00:02:47,410 --> 00:02:53,680 right so it's in two ways it's not just 65 00:02:50,200 --> 00:02:55,150 about those companies Facebook enables a 66 00:02:53,680 --> 00:02:58,540 lot more companies than just camber 67 00:02:55,150 --> 00:03:01,090 charity care to suck out data in similar 68 00:02:58,540 --> 00:03:03,130 ways so that's the first thing and then 69 00:03:01,090 --> 00:03:05,380 Facebook is just one player in a big 70 00:03:03,130 --> 00:03:08,560 ecosystem of online advertising online 71 00:03:05,380 --> 00:03:10,900 profiling some of the companies you have 72 00:03:08,560 --> 00:03:13,660 heard of but some of them you just have 73 00:03:10,900 --> 00:03:15,310 no relationship with even if you fully 74 00:03:13,660 --> 00:03:17,109 understand the terms and conditions that 75 00:03:15,310 --> 00:03:19,690 you're agreeing to about what data 76 00:03:17,109 --> 00:03:21,640 you're sharing I don't think anyone 77 00:03:19,690 --> 00:03:25,060 really understood what can be inferred 78 00:03:21,640 --> 00:03:27,790 from the data so not the list of your 79 00:03:25,060 --> 00:03:28,959 friends not your likes and dislikes but 80 00:03:27,790 --> 00:03:31,239 the things that you've never talked 81 00:03:28,959 --> 00:03:33,340 about that now they can tell from your 82 00:03:31,239 --> 00:03:34,930 digital footprint yeah it's really hard 83 00:03:33,340 --> 00:03:36,970 to understand the inference power of 84 00:03:34,930 --> 00:03:39,100 this data what can be deduced from it 85 00:03:36,970 --> 00:03:41,709 that's true how people make decisions 86 00:03:39,100 --> 00:03:43,329 basically whether they think about about 87 00:03:41,709 --> 00:03:45,790 the issue but before making a decision 88 00:03:43,329 --> 00:03:47,850 or not another way to say this is that 89 00:03:45,790 --> 00:03:50,950 they were trying to find gullible people 90 00:03:47,850 --> 00:03:52,750 so if you are able to do that you can 91 00:03:50,950 --> 00:03:55,780 just make them you know buy into 92 00:03:52,750 --> 00:04:00,819 anything into any content it's easy to 93 00:03:55,780 --> 00:04:02,310 believe that Facebook managed to swing 94 00:04:00,819 --> 00:04:05,450 the u.s. election 95 00:04:02,310 --> 00:04:09,270 to swing brexit was only people on 96 00:04:05,450 --> 00:04:10,680 Facebook who saw these new ads that were 97 00:04:09,270 --> 00:04:13,080 targeted to them and then went out and 98 00:04:10,680 --> 00:04:14,880 possibly changed their votes is that 99 00:04:13,080 --> 00:04:16,560 what we're talking about or are we 100 00:04:14,880 --> 00:04:18,600 talking about Facebook just being used 101 00:04:16,560 --> 00:04:21,690 as a research tool that could then be 102 00:04:18,600 --> 00:04:23,940 applied to the wider community in in 103 00:04:21,690 --> 00:04:25,530 many ways whether people were 104 00:04:23,940 --> 00:04:27,510 individually convinced to vote 105 00:04:25,530 --> 00:04:30,300 differently I don't personally believe 106 00:04:27,510 --> 00:04:32,220 that's how it happens what I believe is 107 00:04:30,300 --> 00:04:34,919 that Facebook itself could be 108 00:04:32,220 --> 00:04:37,350 manipulated using those techniques to 109 00:04:34,919 --> 00:04:39,810 make some content go viral that would 110 00:04:37,350 --> 00:04:42,210 affect public discourse so that would 111 00:04:39,810 --> 00:04:45,060 steer the conversation basically and if 112 00:04:42,210 --> 00:04:47,130 you're able to do this more or less you 113 00:04:45,060 --> 00:04:49,229 know automated more less repetitive in a 114 00:04:47,130 --> 00:04:50,790 repetitive fashion then you've partly 115 00:04:49,229 --> 00:04:52,110 already won the election because you're 116 00:04:50,790 --> 00:04:55,229 steering the conversation around the 117 00:04:52,110 --> 00:04:56,610 election and that's precisely the point 118 00:04:55,229 --> 00:04:58,350 that Hillary Clinton has been making 119 00:04:56,610 --> 00:05:00,240 again and again about camera gigantica 120 00:04:58,350 --> 00:05:02,400 is their ability to steer the 121 00:05:00,240 --> 00:05:08,760 conversation on specific topics like 122 00:05:02,400 --> 00:05:10,320 emails and that's that had an impact the 123 00:05:08,760 --> 00:05:12,510 fact that some content was Reshard 124 00:05:10,320 --> 00:05:15,000 widely during the election had an impact 125 00:05:12,510 --> 00:05:17,490 on editorial decisions made by classic 126 00:05:15,000 --> 00:05:19,260 media more established media which in 127 00:05:17,490 --> 00:05:24,390 turn had an impact on you know other 128 00:05:19,260 --> 00:05:26,130 people's opinions Paul says that even 129 00:05:24,390 --> 00:05:27,870 though Facebook and Google have recently 130 00:05:26,130 --> 00:05:30,260 allowed us to download everything that 131 00:05:27,870 --> 00:05:33,600 they have on us it's not really 132 00:05:30,260 --> 00:05:35,700 everything so Facebook can collect data 133 00:05:33,600 --> 00:05:36,479 of people who don't have Facebook 134 00:05:35,700 --> 00:05:40,139 accounts 135 00:05:36,479 --> 00:05:41,970 yeah it's called shadow profiles yeah so 136 00:05:40,139 --> 00:05:45,479 that practice for instance has been 137 00:05:41,970 --> 00:05:48,090 forbidden in Belgium where I'm from they 138 00:05:45,479 --> 00:05:50,970 even people who do have an account are 139 00:05:48,090 --> 00:05:53,220 being tracked all over the web all over 140 00:05:50,970 --> 00:05:55,050 that same information is collected about 141 00:05:53,220 --> 00:05:57,270 them why can't they see it why can't 142 00:05:55,050 --> 00:06:00,479 they see all the web pages that Facebook 143 00:05:57,270 --> 00:06:02,430 knows they visited before making that 144 00:06:00,479 --> 00:06:05,370 transparent will have a very dramatic 145 00:06:02,430 --> 00:06:07,979 effect I think in making people aware of 146 00:06:05,370 --> 00:06:11,370 how much tracking goes on do you think 147 00:06:07,979 --> 00:06:13,540 that UK or EU regulation is strong 148 00:06:11,370 --> 00:06:16,510 enough when it comes to protecting 149 00:06:13,540 --> 00:06:18,730 our data that's what part of what I 150 00:06:16,510 --> 00:06:20,260 wanted to say in the committee we have 151 00:06:18,730 --> 00:06:22,600 very strong regulations around personal 152 00:06:20,260 --> 00:06:24,280 data that are going to get stronger but 153 00:06:22,600 --> 00:06:26,890 it's completely useless and actually 154 00:06:24,280 --> 00:06:29,050 worse than not having them if we're not 155 00:06:26,890 --> 00:06:30,760 going to enforce them they need to be 156 00:06:29,050 --> 00:06:32,680 enforced that's the critical point we're 157 00:06:30,760 --> 00:06:34,960 currently things are failing why are 158 00:06:32,680 --> 00:06:36,580 they not being enforced because the 159 00:06:34,960 --> 00:06:38,560 regulator's currently see their role as 160 00:06:36,580 --> 00:06:40,780 balancing commercial interests with 161 00:06:38,560 --> 00:06:43,450 Democratic interest around oversight of 162 00:06:40,780 --> 00:06:46,150 personal data and that balancing they've 163 00:06:43,450 --> 00:06:48,040 done so far was wrong or simply wrong 164 00:06:46,150 --> 00:06:51,130 too much on the side of commercial 165 00:06:48,040 --> 00:06:54,760 interests and not enough the 166 00:06:51,130 --> 00:06:57,850 counterbalances issue on Facebook's 167 00:06:54,760 --> 00:06:59,950 reputation and its wealth has taken a 168 00:06:57,850 --> 00:07:02,980 massive hit in the last couple of weeks 169 00:06:59,950 --> 00:07:05,620 with 80 billion dollars being wiped off 170 00:07:02,980 --> 00:07:07,600 its value so can the recently announced 171 00:07:05,620 --> 00:07:12,420 new privacy tools help to restore 172 00:07:07,600 --> 00:07:14,710 confidence this is the end for Facebook 173 00:07:12,420 --> 00:07:16,780 Facebook can still adapt their ways they 174 00:07:14,710 --> 00:07:18,610 can still change they will have to 175 00:07:16,780 --> 00:07:22,090 anyway because of the regulation that's 176 00:07:18,610 --> 00:07:24,010 coming into force it's an opportunity to 177 00:07:22,090 --> 00:07:26,340 revenge themselves if you want to say it 178 00:07:24,010 --> 00:07:26,340 that way