relation to activities that today
would not
relation to activities that today
would not attract a
relation to activities that today
would not attract a criminal
would not attract a criminal
sanction. Those things
would not attract a criminal
sanction. Those things
sanction. Those things are covered
off. Once
sanction. Those things are covered
off. Once
sanction. Those things are covered
off. Once again I thank members
sanction. Those things are covered
off. Once again I thank members
off. Once again I thank members for
their questions. I
off. Once again I thank members for
their questions. I
their questions. I look forward to
the
their questions. I look forward to
the
their questions. I look forward to
the ongoing discussion.
the ongoing discussion.
I
the ongoing discussion.
I call the Hon Clare
the ongoing discussion.
I call the Hon Clare
the ongoing discussion.
I call the Hon Clare Curran.
I call the Hon Clare Curran.
Thank
I call the Hon Clare Curran.
Thank Madam Chair. I feel
I call the Hon Clare Curran.
Thank Madam Chair. I feel
Thank Madam Chair. I feel proud and
hum to
Thank Madam Chair. I feel proud and
hum to
Thank Madam Chair. I feel proud and
hum to take a call
Thank Madam Chair. I feel proud and
hum to take a call
Thank Madam Chair. I feel proud and
hum to take a call on this
Thank Madam Chair. I feel proud and
hum to take a call on this bill,
hum to take a call on this bill,
such
hum to take a call on this bill,
such
hum to take a call on this bill,
such a necessary
hum to take a call on this bill,
such a necessary
hum to take a call on this bill,
such a necessary piece of
such a necessary piece of
legislation
such a necessary piece of
legislation in the healing
such a necessary piece of
legislation in the healing
such a necessary piece of
legislation in the healing process
legislation in the healing process
which
legislation in the healing process
which
legislation in the healing process
which continues around
legislation in the healing process
which continues around
legislation in the healing process
which continues around this stigma
legislation in the healing process
which continues around this stigma
which continues around this stigma
that
which continues around this stigma
that has persisted
which continues around this stigma
that has persisted
which continues around this stigma
that has persisted despite
which continues around this stigma
that has persisted despite the
which continues around this stigma
that has persisted despite the
that has persisted despite the 1986
piece of
that has persisted despite the 1986
piece of
that has persisted despite the 1986
piece of legislation but the
that has persisted despite the 1986
piece of legislation but the
piece of legislation but the stigma
that
piece of legislation but the stigma
that
piece of legislation but the stigma
that has been
piece of legislation but the stigma
that has been
piece of legislation but the stigma
that has been suffered by
piece of legislation but the stigma
that has been suffered by
piece of legislation but the stigma
that has been suffered by people who
piece of legislation but the stigma
that has been suffered by people who
that has been suffered by people who
are
that has been suffered by people who
are being punished or have
that has been suffered by people who
are being punished or have felt
are being punished or have felt that
they continue
are being punished or have felt that
they continue
are being punished or have felt that
they continue to be
are being punished or have felt that
they continue to be
are being punished or have felt that
they continue to be punished for
are being punished or have felt that
they continue to be punished for
they continue to be punished for
being themselves by previous
they continue to be punished for
being themselves by previous
being themselves by previous
criminal convictions.
being themselves by previous
criminal convictions. I
being themselves by previous
criminal convictions. I feel
being themselves by previous
criminal convictions. I feel proud
criminal convictions. I feel proud
of the whole of
criminal convictions. I feel proud
of the whole of
criminal convictions. I feel proud
of the whole of this
criminal convictions. I feel proud
of the whole of this Parliament
criminal convictions. I feel proud
of the whole of this Parliament
criminal convictions. I feel proud
of the whole of this Parliament and
of the whole of this Parliament and
the Parliament of New
of the whole of this Parliament and
the Parliament of New Zealand
the Parliament of New Zealand that
we are taking
the Parliament of New Zealand that
we are taking
the Parliament of New Zealand that
we are taking this step.
the Parliament of New Zealand that
we are taking this step. I've
the Parliament of New Zealand that
we are taking this step. I've got
the Parliament of New Zealand that
we are taking this step. I've got
we are taking this step. I've got
some
we are taking this step. I've got
some specific
we are taking this step. I've got
some specific questions
we are taking this step. I've got
some specific questions
we are taking this step. I've got
some specific questions around
we are taking this step. I've got
some specific questions around
some specific questions around
section
some specific questions around
section
some specific questions around
some specific questions around
which was inserted at the select
committee
which was inserted at the select
committee process,
which was inserted at the select
committee process,
committee process, around the
offence
committee process, around the
offence
committee process, around the
offence to
committee process, around the
offence to require or request
committee process, around the
offence to require or request
committee process, around the
offence to require or request that
offence to require or request that
individual disregard expungement.
offence to require or request that
individual disregard expungement. I
individual disregard expungement. I
note that again the
individual disregard expungement. I
note that again the
individual disregard expungement. I
note that again the purpose of the
individual disregard expungement. I
note that again the purpose of the
note that again the purpose of the
bill to reduce
note that again the purpose of the
bill to reduce prejudice,
bill to reduce prejudice, still ma
and all
bill to reduce prejudice, still ma
and all
bill to reduce prejudice, still ma
and all the other
bill to reduce prejudice, still ma
and all the other
bill to reduce prejudice, still ma
and all the other negative effects
bill to reduce prejudice, still ma
and all the other negative effects
and all the other negative effects
arising
and all the other negative effects
arising from
and all the other negative effects
arising from a
and all the other negative effects
arising from a
and all the other negative effects
arising from a conviction for
and all the other negative effects
arising from a conviction for
arising from a conviction for
historical
arising from a conviction for
historical homosexual offence, but
arising from a conviction for
historical homosexual offence, but
historical homosexual offence, but
the
historical homosexual offence, but
the
historical homosexual offence, but
the select
historical homosexual offence, but
the select committee
historical homosexual offence, but
the select committee obviously felt
historical homosexual offence, but
the select committee obviously felt
the select committee obviously felt
concerned enough
the select committee obviously felt
concerned enough
the select committee obviously felt
concerned enough to want to insert
the select committee obviously felt
concerned enough to want to insert
concerned enough to want to insert a
new clause.
concerned enough to want to insert a
new clause. I
concerned enough to want to insert a
new clause. I don't know whether
concerned enough to want to insert a
new clause. I don't know whether
new clause. I don't know whether
that was
new clause. I don't know whether
that was as
new clause. I don't know whether
that was as a result of good
new clause. I don't know whether
that was as a result of good
that was as a result of good work
just
that was as a result of good work
just
that was as a result of good work
just by the select
that was as a result of good work
just by the select
just by the select committee
members,
just by the select committee
members, thinking
members, thinking of the unintended
consequences or
members, thinking of the unintended
consequences or
members, thinking of the unintended
consequences or whether this came
members, thinking of the unintended
consequences or whether this came
consequences or whether this came
from
consequences or whether this came
from submissions,
from submissions, the 37
submissions,
from submissions, the 37
submissions, but
from submissions, the 37
submissions, but the concern that
from submissions, the 37
submissions, but the concern that
submissions, but the concern that in
some situations even
submissions, but the concern that in
some situations even
submissions, but the concern that in
some situations even if
submissions, but the concern that in
some situations even if a conviction
submissions, but the concern that in
some situations even if a conviction
some situations even if a conviction
had
some situations even if a conviction
had been successfully
some situations even if a conviction
had been successfully
had been successfully expunged that
people might
had been successfully expunged that
people might be
people might be required to disclose
the
people might be required to disclose
the fact
people might be required to disclose
the fact of the
people might be required to disclose
the fact of the conviction.
people might be required to disclose
the fact of the conviction. So
people might be required to disclose
the fact of the conviction. So
people might be required to disclose
the fact of the conviction. So the
the fact of the conviction. So the
insertion
the fact of the conviction. So the
insertion
the fact of the conviction. So the
insertion of
the fact of the conviction. So the
insertion of clause
the fact of the conviction. So the
insertion of clause
the fact of the conviction. So the
insertion of clause 13 (a) makes it
the fact of the conviction. So the
insertion of clause 13 (a) makes it
insertion of clause 13 (a) makes it
an explicit
insertion of clause 13 (a) makes it
an explicit
insertion of clause 13 (a) makes it
an explicit offence to require or
insertion of clause 13 (a) makes it
an explicit offence to require or
an explicit offence to require or
request
an explicit offence to require or
request an individual to
an explicit offence to require or
request an individual to
request an individual to disregard
the
request an individual to disregard
the
request an individual to disregard
the effect of expungement under
request an individual to disregard
the effect of expungement under
the effect of expungement under this
bill. So
the effect of expungement under this
bill. So
the effect of expungement under this
bill. So my question
the effect of expungement under this
bill. So my question
the effect of expungement under this
bill. So my question to the
the effect of expungement under this
bill. So my question to the chair,
bill. So my question to the chair,
to the minister in the
bill. So my question to the chair,
to the minister in the
to the minister in the chair is
around
to the minister in the chair is
around
to the minister in the chair is
around the problem
to the minister in the chair is
around the problem
to the minister in the chair is
around the problem definition around
to the minister in the chair is
around the problem definition around
around the problem definition around
that
around the problem definition around
around the problem definition around
around the problem definition around
around the problem definition around
around the problem definition around
circumstances where in actual cases
where
circumstances where in actual cases
where it
circumstances where in actual cases
where it
circumstances where in actual cases
where it was concerned
circumstances where in actual cases
where it was concerned this
circumstances where in actual cases
where it was concerned this kind of
circumstances where in actual cases
where it was concerned this kind of
where it was concerned this kind of
behaviour
where it was concerned this kind of
behaviour would
where it was concerned this kind of
behaviour would
where it was concerned this kind of
behaviour would occur
where it was concerned this kind of
behaviour would occur and
where it was concerned this kind of
behaviour would occur and
behaviour would occur and also what
would be
behaviour would occur and also what
would be the
behaviour would occur and also what
would be the process
behaviour would occur and also what
would be the process for
behaviour would occur and also what
would be the process for actually
behaviour would occur and also what
would be the process for actually
would be the process for actually
enacting
would be the process for actually
enacting that
would be the process for actually
would be the process for actually
would be the process for actually
thought that went into that and I
will
thought that went into that and I
will remind
thought that went into that and I
will remind the
thought that went into that and I
will remind the
thought that went into that and I
will remind the House
thought that went into that and I
will remind the House that
thought that went into that and I
will remind the House that
thought that went into that and I
will remind the House that clause
will remind the House that clause 13
(a) has two
will remind the House that clause 13
(a) has two parts
will remind the House that clause 13
(a) has two parts to it
will remind the House that clause 13
(a) has two parts to it
(a) has two parts to it and the
first
(a) has two parts to it and the
first
(a) has two parts to it and the
first part, the person
(a) has two parts to it and the
first part, the person
(a) has two parts to it and the
first part, the person commits an
(a) has two parts to it and the
first part, the person commits an
first part, the person commits an
offence if that person
first part, the person commits an
offence if that person
first part, the person commits an
offence if that person requires or
first part, the person commits an
offence if that person requires or
offence if that person requires or
requests that
offence if that person requires or
requests that
offence if that person requires or
requests that an individual
offence if that person requires or
requests that an individual
requests that an individual
disregards
requests that an individual
disregards the
requests that an individual
disregards the effective expungement
requests that an individual
disregards the effective expungement
disregards the effective expungement
under the act, when
disregards the effective expungement
under the act, when
disregards the effective expungement
under the act, when answering
under the act, when answering a
question about
under the act, when answering a
question about
question about the individual's
criminal
question about the individual's
criminal
question about the individual's
criminal history
question about the individual's
criminal history or
question about the individual's
criminal history or
question about the individual's
criminal history or disclosing
criminal history or disclosing
information
criminal history or disclosing
information
criminal history or disclosing
information concerning convictions
criminal history or disclosing
information concerning convictions
information concerning convictions
of the individual or both
information concerning convictions
of the individual or both
of the individual or both or that
they
of the individual or both or that
they
of the individual or both or that
they disregard
they disregard the effective
expungement
they disregard the effective
expungement under
they disregard the effective
expungement under this act.
they disregard the effective
expungement under this act. So
they disregard the effective
expungement under this act. So it
expungement under this act. So it
sounds
expungement under this act. So it
sounds as if it
expungement under this act. So it
sounds as if it
expungement under this act. So it
sounds as if it is
expungement under this act. So it
sounds as if it is blatant disregard
sounds as if it is blatant disregard
for
sounds as if it is blatant disregard
for this legislation,
sounds as if it is blatant disregard
for this legislation,
sounds as if it is blatant disregard
for this legislation, what it stands
sounds as if it is blatant disregard
for this legislation, what it stands
for this legislation, what it stands
for and there
for this legislation, what it stands
for and there is
for this legislation, what it stands
for and there is still the
for this legislation, what it stands
for and there is still the
for and there is still the prejudice
that exists
for and there is still the prejudice
that exists partly
for and there is still the prejudice
that exists partly
for and there is still the prejudice
that exists partly in
that exists partly in this
community, where there
that exists partly in this
community, where there are
that exists partly in this
community, where there are people
that exists partly in this
community, where there are people
community, where there are people
who
community, where there are people
who would disregard and
community, where there are people
who would disregard and if
community, where there are people
who would disregard and if they did
community, where there are people
who would disregard and if they did
who would disregard and if they did
p then, as
who would disregard and if they did
p then, as
who would disregard and if they did
p then, as point two, that
who would disregard and if they did
p then, as point two, that
who would disregard and if they did
p then, as point two, that a
p then, as point two, that a person
commits
p then, as point two, that a person
commits
p then, as point two, that a person
commits an offence, is liable
p then, as point two, that a person
commits an offence, is liable
p then, as point two, that a person
commits an offence, is liable to a
p then, as point two, that a person
commits an offence, is liable to a
commits an offence, is liable to a
conviction
commits an offence, is liable to a
conviction on a fine not
commits an offence, is liable to a
conviction on a fine not
commits an offence, is liable to a
conviction on a fine not exceeding
conviction on a fine not exceeding
conviction on a fine not exceeding
conviction on a fine not exceeding
into how that would be enacted and
what
into how that would be enacted and
what would
into how that would be enacted and
what would the
into how that would be enacted and
what would the recourse be. If
into how that would be enacted and
what would the recourse be. If
into how that would be enacted and
what would the recourse be. If they
what would the recourse be. If they
wanted
what would the recourse be. If they
wanted to get their
what would the recourse be. If they
wanted to get their
what would the recourse be. If they
wanted to get their conviction
what would the recourse be. If they
wanted to get their conviction they
wanted to get their conviction they
have
wanted to get their conviction they
have
wanted to get their conviction they
have to apply,
wanted to get their conviction they
have to apply, am
wanted to get their conviction they
have to apply, am I correct,
wanted to get their conviction they
have to apply, am I correct,
wanted to get their conviction they
have to apply, am I correct, to the
wanted to get their conviction they
have to apply, am I correct, to the
have to apply, am I correct, to the
minister and how
have to apply, am I correct, to the
minister and how
have to apply, am I correct, to the
minister and how do
have to apply, am I correct, to the
minister and how do you
minister and how do you get that
offence
minister and how do you get that
offence
minister and how do you get that
minister and how do you get that
through the minister to be referred
to
through the minister to be referred
to the court or
through the minister to be referred
to the court or
through the minister to be referred
to the court or is there some other
to the court or is there some other
to the court or is there some other
to the court or is there some other
question I have for the chair on
this
question I have for the chair on
this bill.
question I have for the chair on
this bill. I
question I have for the chair on
this bill. I
question I have for the chair on
this bill. I certainly
question I have for the chair on
this bill. I certainly am not
this bill. I certainly am not
disagreeing
this bill. I certainly am not
disagreeing with
this bill. I certainly am not
disagreeing with
this bill. I certainly am not
disagreeing with clause 13
this bill. I certainly am not
disagreeing with clause 13
disagreeing with clause 13 (a), it
obviously
disagreeing with clause 13 (a), it
obviously
disagreeing with clause 13 (a), it
obviously showed good thinking by
disagreeing with clause 13 (a), it
obviously showed good thinking by
obviously showed good thinking by
the
obviously showed good thinking by
the select
obviously showed good thinking by
the select committee members, but
obviously showed good thinking by
the select committee members, but
the select committee members, but I,
on reading
the select committee members, but I,
on reading
the select committee members, but I,
on reading through it, and
the select committee members, but I,
on reading through it, and
on reading through it, and of course
not having
on reading through it, and of course
not having
on reading through it, and of course
not having been at the
on reading through it, and of course
not having been at the
not having been at the select
committee, am
not having been at the select
committee, am unsure
not having been at the select
committee, am unsure about
not having been at the select
committee, am unsure about how
committee, am unsure about how that
actually played out.
committee, am unsure about how that
actually played out.
committee, am unsure about how that
actually played out. Other
actually played out. Other than
that,
actually played out. Other than
that,
actually played out. Other than
that, this is t
actually played out. Other than
that, this is t
that, this is t other than having
that
that, this is t other than having
that question
that, this is t other than having
that question answered, this
that, this is t other than having
that question answered, this
that, this is t other than having
that question answered, this is
that, this is t other than having
that question answered, this is an
that, this is t other than having
that question answered, this is an
that question answered, this is an
extremely important
that question answered, this is an
extremely important
extremely important piece of
legislation,
extremely important piece of
legislation,
extremely important piece of
legislation, part
legislation, part of the healing
process. I
legislation, part of the healing
process. I
legislation, part of the healing
process. I commend it to the House.
legislation, part of the healing
process. I commend it to the House.
process. I commend it to the House.
I
process. I commend it to the House.
I call
process. I commend it to the House.
I call Dr
process. I commend it to the House.
I call Dr Duncan Webb. Madam
process. I commend it to the House.
I call Dr Duncan Webb. Madam
process. I commend it to the House.
I call Dr Duncan Webb. Madam Chair
I call Dr Duncan Webb. Madam Chair
it's a short point I
I call Dr Duncan Webb. Madam Chair
it's a short point I
it's a short point I would like to
put
it's a short point I would like to
put
it's a short point I would like to
put to the minister. It
it's a short point I would like to
put to the minister. It
it's a short point I would like to
put to the minister. It is around
it's a short point I would like to
put to the minister. It is around
put to the minister. It is around
clause 5
put to the minister. It is around
clause 5 of
put to the minister. It is around
clause 5 of the act
put to the minister. It is around
clause 5 of the act
put to the minister. It is around
clause 5 of the act which defines
put to the minister. It is around
clause 5 of the act which defines
clause 5 of the act which defines
historical homosexual offences.
clause 5 of the act which defines
historical homosexual offences. My
historical homosexual offences. My
concern is that
historical homosexual offences. My
concern is that
historical homosexual offences. My
concern is that there are
historical homosexual offences. My
concern is that there are a
concern is that there are a number
of offences
concern is that there are a number
of offences
concern is that there are a number
of offences which
concern is that there are a number
of offences which may
concern is that there are a number
of offences which may have been
concern is that there are a number
of offences which may have been
concern is that there are a number
of offences which may have been led
of offences which may have been led
to
of offences which may have been led
to
of offences which may have been led
to conviction but which
of offences which may have been led
to conviction but which
of offences which may have been led
to conviction but which don't fall
of offences which may have been led
to conviction but which don't fall
to conviction but which don't fall
within