0:00:05.609,0:00:10.026
[Glaser] When I was a kid,[br]I discovered

0:00:10.026,0:00:15.323
that I had great prestige[br]in the neighborhood.

0:00:15.323,0:00:20.236
My friends could ask me[br]to draw anything,

0:00:20.236,0:00:24.230
which turned out to be,[br]almost in all cases, naked ladies.

0:00:24.230,0:00:26.979
They would describe[br]the exact position

0:00:26.979,0:00:31.910
and physical characteristics,[br]and I could do that on request.

0:00:33.779,0:00:37.511
Sort of a short transition[br]between that beginning

0:00:39.241,0:00:42.604
and what eventually[br]became my career.

0:00:42.604,0:00:47.177
[♪ piano jazz ♪]

0:01:20.067,0:01:24.811
Well, people ask me why I chose design,[br]like most American artists.

0:01:24.811,0:01:29.152
When I was a kid,[br]I copied comic strips, Walt Disney,

0:01:29.152,0:01:31.663
and then I went to the[br]High School of Music & Art,

0:01:31.663,0:01:34.822
which gave me a lot of options[br]about what I should be doing,

0:01:34.822,0:01:37.560
where I was[br]introduced to the idea

0:01:37.560,0:01:40.122
of what was then[br]called commercial art,

0:01:40.122,0:01:44.572
which was making things[br]to sell for money.

0:01:45.742,0:01:47.414
At the same time,[br]or parallel to that,

0:01:47.414,0:01:49.321
was this other idea[br]of fine art,

0:01:49.321,0:01:52.349
which was about[br]some other kind of value.

0:01:54.229,0:01:57.245
But I never could get[br]the idea through my head

0:01:57.245,0:02:00.720
that I could make a living[br]making paintings

0:02:00.720,0:02:02.930
that somebody would buy[br]and put in their house.

0:02:02.930,0:02:09.293
It just seems so weird to me[br]and so inappropriate for me.

0:02:09.293,0:02:11.615
I wanted to do work[br]that was public.

0:02:11.615,0:02:13.974
I wanted to do work[br]that was on the street.

0:02:13.974,0:02:16.098
I wanted to do work[br]that people saw.

0:02:16.098,0:02:20.216
At that point, I had already[br]internalized this idea

0:02:20.216,0:02:23.345
that it didn't matter[br]whether I was called an artist

0:02:23.345,0:02:27.745
or a designer or an illustrator[br]or whatever else it was.

0:02:27.745,0:02:31.307
The core value was always[br]the act of making things,

0:02:31.307,0:02:35.092
and the transformation of an idea[br]that you hold in your mind,

0:02:35.092,0:02:38.090
that becomes[br]real or material.

0:02:38.090,0:02:42.136
That to me, still, is the glory[br]of any creative activity.

0:02:42.136,0:02:49.687
[♪]

0:02:49.687,0:02:53.593
[Caplan] As the creator of[br]"I Love New York"

0:02:53.593,0:02:57.009
and the moving sequel[br]that followed 9/11,

0:02:57.009,0:03:00.806
he may be the best-known[br]graphic designer in the world.

0:03:00.806,0:03:03.667
But they don't[br]begin to even hint

0:03:03.667,0:03:09.238
at the impact and significance[br]of Milton Glaser's work.

0:03:09.238,0:03:13.747
He's taken the gifts[br]he had to start with

0:03:13.747,0:03:20.398
and developed them[br]along a dazzling variety of lines

0:03:20.398,0:03:25.578
that have influenced every[br]serious designer I can think of,

0:03:25.578,0:03:30.976
and that have materially affected[br]the way we get information,

0:03:30.976,0:03:36.099
the way we buy things,[br]and in fact, the things that we buy.

0:03:36.099,0:03:40.569
I've known Milton about 30 years,[br]and I remember being struck

0:03:40.569,0:03:49.105
by the mixture of talent,[br]play, and intelligence.

0:03:49.105,0:03:53.658
[♪]

0:04:14.590,0:04:16.341
[Glaser][br]I love doing poses.

0:04:16.341,0:04:18.937
In fact, all designers[br]love doing poses.

0:04:18.937,0:04:22.488
Most of the time,[br]you're working on 5½ × 8½,

0:04:22.488,0:04:25.968
and suddenly you have[br]this enormous landscape,

0:04:25.968,0:04:29.091
which just gives you a different kind[br]of opportunity and presence.

0:04:29.091,0:04:35.692
[♪]

0:04:43.068,0:04:45.482
I love music[br]in all forms,

0:04:45.482,0:04:50.014
so I'm very responsive[br]to music experientially.

0:04:50.014,0:04:54.090
I loved to dance when my feet[br]would still obey my brain

0:04:54.090,0:04:56.252
and I think that[br]idea of movement

0:04:56.252,0:04:59.015
and a rhythmic response[br]has something to do with

0:04:59.015,0:05:01.682
the way you draw[br]and the way you make things.

0:05:01.682,0:05:04.240
I always tend to think[br]that the affinities

0:05:04.240,0:05:06.997
between all these forms[br]are very constant.

0:05:06.997,0:05:10.253
And also, I would like to see[br]whether it's possible to create

0:05:10.253,0:05:14.252
the same kind of emotional response[br]in graphics that music has.

0:05:17.712,0:05:20.734
Caplan: It occurs to me,[br]that for many people,

0:05:20.734,0:05:24.634
this poster is[br]as much the '60s

0:05:24.634,0:05:27.634
as anything they know[br]about the '60s.

0:05:27.634,0:05:29.514
People very often[br]remember it this way,

0:05:29.514,0:05:31.055
whether they were[br]there or not.

0:05:31.055,0:05:33.394
[Maxwell] When you[br]think of a Dylan poster,

0:05:33.394,0:05:35.382
that really speaks[br]to a generation.

0:05:35.382,0:05:37.854
It wasn't his generation,[br]but he was able to

0:05:37.854,0:05:41.597
understand what was happening,[br]and see what was happening,

0:05:41.597,0:05:44.426
and make work about--[br]in response to what was happening.

0:05:44.426,0:05:47.607
That's very unusual,[br]and I see the same thing in the poster

0:05:47.607,0:05:49.815
for Tony Kushner[br]for <i>Angels in America,</i>

0:05:49.815,0:05:55.096
to take the raw pain of a generation[br]of gay men who are all dying,

0:05:55.096,0:05:57.789
and transform it[br]into a piece of art.

0:05:58.539,0:06:02.470
His closeness to our culture,[br]to our civilization,

0:06:02.470,0:06:05.833
really allowed him[br]to change the design world.

0:06:05.833,0:06:09.669
[Heller] His influence[br]is one of a real star,

0:06:09.669,0:06:12.791
and there aren't that many stars[br]in the design field,

0:06:12.791,0:06:15.287
particularly in the[br]graphic design field.

0:06:15.287,0:06:19.317
Designers are-- their work is seen[br]but they're not necessarily heard.

0:06:19.317,0:06:23.117
Because Milton is so articulate,[br]so <i>damn</i> articulate,

0:06:23.117,0:06:27.318
um, his voice is requested[br]in many places.

0:06:27.318,0:06:31.566
So, between the voice,[br]the work, and the presence,

0:06:31.566,0:06:35.337
he's known[br]in many places all over.

0:06:35.337,0:06:39.494
And because the world itself,[br]the small world,

0:06:39.494,0:06:41.208
is so interested[br]in design,

0:06:41.208,0:06:43.615
and design becomes[br]this kind of Esperanto,

0:06:43.615,0:06:46.369
Milton speaks[br]the Esperanto well.

0:06:48.097,0:06:50.787
[♪ saxophone jazz ♪]

0:06:50.787,0:06:52.219
[Glaser][br]Back in the mid-'70s,

0:06:52.219,0:06:57.489
there was a collapse of well-being[br]and morale in this town.

0:06:57.489,0:06:58.931
Nobody wanted[br]to be here.

0:06:58.931,0:07:00.911
[♪]

0:07:00.911,0:07:02.859
And the city[br]and the state

0:07:02.859,0:07:06.609
had gotten very apprehensive[br]about what was going on.

0:07:06.609,0:07:10.009
[♪]

0:07:10.009,0:07:11.532
A guy was hired[br]and he said,

0:07:11.532,0:07:14.269
"Look, we got a line,[br]'I love New York,'

0:07:14.269,0:07:16.430
"and we need a visual thing[br]to go with it.

0:07:16.430,0:07:17.730
"Can you help us?"

0:07:17.730,0:07:19.840
So we did a funny thing[br]with two lozenges

0:07:19.840,0:07:21.239
and it was just[br]typographical,

0:07:21.239,0:07:23.470
and that was the end of the job,[br]I thought.

0:07:23.470,0:07:26.560
And then a day or two later,[br]I was in a taxi,

0:07:26.560,0:07:29.782
and I very often carry[br]a scrap of paper with me.

0:07:29.782,0:07:32.302
I say, you know,[br]there's a better way to do that:

0:07:32.302,0:07:35.269
"I heart N."

0:07:35.269,0:07:37.762
Yeah, that would[br]be better.

0:07:37.762,0:07:40.762
[♪]

0:07:40.762,0:07:42.541
The world[br]was waiting for it.

0:07:43.581,0:07:49.332
I explain to students in terms[br]of understanding communication

0:07:49.332,0:07:54.879
that the creation of a puzzle[br]is one of the tools that you have

0:07:54.879,0:07:56.728
to make people[br]understand things.

0:07:56.728,0:08:00.942
When they activate the mind[br]to try to figure something out,

0:08:00.942,0:08:04.883
the likelihood is that they will remember[br]and respond to it more

0:08:04.883,0:08:07.194
than if they're[br]told something directly.

0:08:08.874,0:08:11.243
And in the case "I Love New York,"[br]which seems so simple,

0:08:11.243,0:08:14.351
"I" is a word,[br]complete word in itself,

0:08:14.351,0:08:19.463
heart is a symbol for a feeling,[br]and "N-Y" are initials for a place.

0:08:19.463,0:08:26.244
And because of that[br]simple little trick of activating

0:08:26.244,0:08:29.411
the problem-solving[br]impulse of the brain,

0:08:29.411,0:08:30.993
it stuck[br]in people's mind.

0:08:30.993,0:08:32.795
They saw it once;[br]they remembered it.

0:08:35.695,0:08:41.733
I have made nothing on[br]"I Heart" or "I Love New York."

0:08:41.733,0:08:42.898
Ever.

0:08:42.898,0:08:47.154
There've been no cash rewards[br]as a consequence of doing it.

0:08:47.154,0:08:52.106
On the other hand, it really[br]makes me feel very, very proud

0:08:52.106,0:08:58.442
to have taken part in that shift[br]in the city's consciousness

0:08:58.442,0:09:05.276
from being indifferent to itself[br]to realizing we love this place.

0:09:05.276,0:09:15.836
[♪]

0:09:15.836,0:09:20.176
I've been in this building since 1965,[br]and one of the reasons I'm here

0:09:20.176,0:09:22.897
is because it faces[br]the schoolyard outside

0:09:22.897,0:09:28.527
so every day, at 12:00, you hear[br]this burst of energetic voices.

0:09:30.157,0:09:32.107
I'm always embarrassed[br]when people come in

0:09:32.107,0:09:34.178
because it doesn't[br]look like a design office

0:09:34.178,0:09:37.784
with beautiful furniture[br]and fancy fixtures.

0:09:37.784,0:09:40.289
One thing you'll notice[br]is that I'm sitting,

0:09:40.289,0:09:43.555
along with everybody else,[br]in this undifferentiated space,

0:09:43.555,0:09:45.288
and I realize that,[br]in part,

0:09:45.288,0:09:46.835
that was because[br]of the way I grew up

0:09:46.835,0:09:48.665
in a three-room apartment[br]in the Bronx.

0:09:48.665,0:09:51.846
My father would be sitting at one corner[br]reading the newspaper,

0:09:51.846,0:09:53.975
and my mother would be sitting[br]in the opposite corner.

0:09:53.975,0:09:57.588
She would be[br]sewing socks and shirts,

0:09:57.588,0:10:00.773
and my sister would be sitting[br]on the couch doing her homework.

0:10:00.773,0:10:04.133
Most of the room was occupied[br]by this enormous dining table

0:10:04.133,0:10:06.629
that we only use[br]once a year at Passover.

0:10:06.629,0:10:10.218
And of course, we were all[br]listening to the radio at the same time.

0:10:10.848,0:10:14.245
So ever since then,[br]I've always worked in a room

0:10:14.245,0:10:17.245
surrounded by[br]everybody else.

0:10:17.245,0:10:19.759
I have never written[br]a memo in my life

0:10:19.759,0:10:22.979
because everybody here[br]can hear everything that occurs.

0:10:23.839,0:10:25.519
That saves[br]a lot of time.

0:10:25.519,0:10:29.513
[Bernard] I remember him[br]on the phone in his office,

0:10:29.513,0:10:31.519
and I came down[br]with the new manuscript

0:10:31.519,0:10:33.788
and was waiting[br]to talk to him.

0:10:33.788,0:10:36.853
He just motioned me over,[br]read the first three paragraphs

0:10:36.853,0:10:41.841
while he was talking on the phone,[br]and made a sketch.

0:10:41.841,0:10:45.143
Milton said, "We should always[br]operate by interruption."

0:10:46.253,0:10:48.240
[Glaser] We had about[br]a hundred people in this building,

0:10:48.240,0:10:49.882
if you could imagine[br]such a thing,

0:10:49.882,0:10:53.920
running the magazine[br]of the first three or four years.

0:10:53.920,0:10:57.878
[Bernard] We were on the floor[br]of this building, the fourth floor.

0:10:57.878,0:11:03.110
It has one bathroom and[br]there were 30 or 40 people up there.

0:11:03.110,0:11:04.331
It was amazing.

0:11:04.331,0:11:07.492
And everybody was just crammed[br]trying to get this magazine

0:11:07.492,0:11:10.836
from Monday to Thursday[br]to a printer.

0:11:10.836,0:11:14.746
And this is well[br]before computers,

0:11:14.746,0:11:17.492
and we would be[br]talking on a Wednesday

0:11:17.492,0:11:19.321
in which we didn't[br]have a cover story,

0:11:19.321,0:11:21.621
we didn't have this story,[br]and we didn't have that story,

0:11:21.621,0:11:25.475
and Clay is on the phone[br]yelling at Jimmy Breslin and Tom Wolfe

0:11:25.475,0:11:28.104
or anybody else[br]that was not delivering in time.

0:11:28.104,0:11:30.432
Milton was the one[br]who was able to say,

0:11:30.432,0:11:32.262
"Don't worry.[br]We can do it."

0:11:32.262,0:11:35.104
If something fell through,[br]he'd do the illustration.

0:11:35.104,0:11:39.541
He gave me a real education[br]in the first year at New York.

0:11:39.541,0:11:41.443
The editor was Clay Felker.

0:11:41.443,0:11:44.264
Milton and Clay had founded[br]the magazine themselves.

0:11:44.264,0:11:45.652
Milton was[br]the chairman

0:11:45.652,0:11:50.522
and the kind of editorial force[br]in terms of service.

0:11:50.522,0:11:52.727
He kind of[br]reinvented--

0:11:52.727,0:11:54.922
if it had been invented[br]in the first place--

0:11:54.922,0:11:56.215
service journalism.

0:11:56.855,0:11:59.165
Our mantra was,[br]"Be on the reader's side."

0:11:59.165,0:12:02.265
Not the store owner's side,[br]not the subject's side.

0:12:02.265,0:12:04.538
If we were gonna[br]do a story on Macy's

0:12:04.538,0:12:06.853
or we were gonna do a story[br]on a little food shop,

0:12:06.853,0:12:09.314
it wasn't that we were trying[br]to promote that food shop.

0:12:09.314,0:12:13.745
It was trying to tell the reader[br]how to cope or to deal with that,

0:12:13.745,0:12:15.356
and how to get[br]the best out of it,

0:12:15.356,0:12:19.084
especially in the area[br]of teaching them how to

0:12:19.084,0:12:23.070
or learning with them how to[br]cope with New York City,

0:12:23.070,0:12:27.451
the Pastrami Olympics,[br]and the Underground Gourmet,

0:12:27.451,0:12:28.811
and things like that.

0:12:28.811,0:12:32.157
This is one of the first covers[br]Milton and I worked on together.

0:12:32.157,0:12:35.186
You can see it's[br]October 1968.

0:12:35.186,0:12:36.867
The hardest thing[br]was getting Gloria,

0:12:36.867,0:12:40.902
who wrote the story,[br]to sit in this Nixon box.

0:12:42.042,0:12:45.447
And later,[br]we helped her with the <i>Ms.</i>

0:12:46.367,0:12:48.884
There's one thing that,[br]to this day,

0:12:48.884,0:12:51.986
Milton and I were[br]too stupid to realize then.

0:12:51.986,0:12:53.900
Here we have[br]this magazine

0:12:53.900,0:12:57.720
that Gloria created[br]and we're presenting.

0:12:57.720,0:12:59.086
Should've been[br]a woman's hand

0:12:59.086,0:13:03.745
holding this magazine,[br]and it's not. [chuckling]

0:13:03.745,0:13:05.487
[Maxwell] What you had[br]in <i>New York</i> magazine

0:13:05.487,0:13:07.937
was what was happening[br]in New York City,

0:13:07.937,0:13:10.129
what was alive and kicking[br]in New York City,

0:13:10.129,0:13:12.008
and what energy[br]was flowing through,

0:13:12.008,0:13:14.117
and what food[br]was coming through,

0:13:14.117,0:13:15.741
and what dance[br]was coming through,

0:13:15.741,0:13:17.876
and you still see that in[br]<i>New York</i> magazine and <i>Time Out.</i>

0:13:17.876,0:13:21.037
It's a way of thinking[br]about life where, um,

0:13:21.037,0:13:23.127
without a filter,[br]really.

0:13:23.127,0:13:28.047
And you see that in every magazine[br]in every major city in the world.

0:13:28.047,0:13:32.207
But that's really only one--[br]it's one tiny example

0:13:32.207,0:13:34.219
of the way that[br]he's changed our lives.

0:13:35.659,0:13:40.273
And so the building's[br]had a bit of history connected with it.

0:13:40.273,0:13:43.417
It's kind of a bit[br]of a collective.

0:13:43.417,0:13:46.199
Now I have a little business[br]with Walter Bernard.

0:13:46.199,0:13:49.159
We do editorial design[br]upstairs,

0:13:49.159,0:13:50.546
and we've done[br]many, many magazine

0:13:50.546,0:13:53.769
and newspaper projects together,[br]and we still do.

0:13:53.769,0:13:55.420
And Mirko Ilić.

0:13:55.420,0:13:59.390
We worked on[br]<i>The Design of Dissent</i> together.

0:13:59.390,0:14:01.979
And while I once had[br]a very big studio--

0:14:01.979,0:14:07.169
when I was doing supermarket work,[br]we had 45 people here, and--

0:14:07.169,0:14:09.828
but it did not[br]make me happy.

0:14:09.828,0:14:14.061
I like the scale of the work[br]as we now do it.

0:14:14.061,0:14:17.390
We have very talented people[br]at this studio,

0:14:17.390,0:14:21.421
the kind of people that you[br]want to surround yourself with.

0:14:23.541,0:14:25.591
We are doing[br]a new identity

0:14:25.591,0:14:27.967
under the pressure[br]from these young people

0:14:27.967,0:14:31.492
who say we are perceived[br]as being fuddy-duddies.

0:14:31.492,0:14:33.117
I'll show you[br]our old identity,

0:14:33.117,0:14:36.839
which was based on[br]Russian constructivism.

0:14:36.839,0:14:40.092
You see that,[br]contrary to most designs,

0:14:40.092,0:14:43.324
that this emphasizes[br]perhaps the least important thing,

0:14:43.324,0:14:45.047
which was the number[br]on the building,

0:14:45.047,0:14:46.923
and obliterates[br]everything else.

0:14:46.923,0:14:49.766
Anyhow, we always liked this[br]because it was perverse.

0:14:49.766,0:14:53.533
So, I did this poster[br]for a lecture I did,

0:14:53.533,0:14:55.413
but I thought there was[br]something nice

0:14:55.413,0:14:59.385
about the symmetry of my name:[br]Mil-ton Gla-ser.

0:14:59.385,0:15:03.037
With Molly, we did a little version[br]of it just in one color.

0:15:03.037,0:15:04.886
I'm interested in work

0:15:04.886,0:15:07.544
that doesn't exactly look[br]as though it was designed.

0:15:07.544,0:15:10.006
It just sort of looks[br]as though it happened.

0:15:10.006,0:15:12.794
I always like that idea[br]that people have to work

0:15:12.794,0:15:15.035
to understand[br]what you're showing them.

0:15:16.005,0:15:19.617
Bernard: In 1996,[br]we were asked to redesign <i>Fortune.</i>

0:15:19.617,0:15:22.686
When we finished, John Huey,[br]the editor, called and said,

0:15:22.686,0:15:26.235
"It's time to rethink[br]the Fortune 500."

0:15:26.235,0:15:31.075
So Milton and I literally sat over here[br]working on 500,

0:15:31.075,0:15:33.435
and we were both trying[br]different things--

0:15:33.435,0:15:36.285
Milton on paper[br]and me on the computer, occasionally.

0:15:36.285,0:15:41.245
And I had this thought[br]of only doing it in type,

0:15:41.245,0:15:45.186
writing out[br]"The Fortune 500."

0:15:45.186,0:15:46.867
And while it was[br]very intriguing,

0:15:46.867,0:15:51.267
it didn't have power[br]from a distance.

0:15:51.267,0:15:54.235
And Milton and I[br]had also been playing

0:15:54.235,0:15:57.676
with various ways[br]of doing the big 5-0-0,

0:15:57.676,0:16:00.695
and while some of them[br]were really nice,

0:16:00.695,0:16:03.854
they also simply said 500,[br]and Milton said,

0:16:03.854,0:16:07.997
"Why don't we combine[br]the big number '5'

0:16:07.997,0:16:10.997
and the word[br]'hundred?' "

0:16:10.997,0:16:13.467
Well, it has been used[br]every year since.

0:16:13.467,0:16:16.403
It is now the 10th anniversary[br]of that cover.

0:16:16.403,0:16:19.191
As John Huey says,[br]it's Eustace Tilley,

0:16:19.191,0:16:25.121
and each year it's used, of course,[br]I divide our fee into the years

0:16:25.121,0:16:28.967
and I realize that we got paid[br]about three bucks. [laughing]

0:16:28.967,0:16:32.737
[Glaser] Thinking and making things,[br]mostly I do in the country.

0:16:32.737,0:16:36.806
Assembling and refining things,[br]we do here.

0:16:36.806,0:16:40.690
One is solitary,[br]and the others needs interaction.

0:16:40.690,0:16:42.450
And I love[br]this part of work.

0:16:42.450,0:16:43.415
You have[br]a partner,

0:16:43.415,0:16:46.471
you sort of go for a dance[br]and you move one way,

0:16:46.471,0:16:48.838
and the partner[br]sort of responds.

0:16:48.838,0:16:52.819
It's so much more fun[br]than doing things by yourself.

0:16:54.019,0:16:58.671
We are repackaging something[br]for a remarkable Brazilian pianist

0:16:58.671,0:17:04.056
called João Carlos Martins,[br]and our idea was

0:17:04.056,0:17:08.267
that instead of dealing with Bach[br]in a conventional sense,

0:17:08.267,0:17:11.793
that we would deal with[br]the idea of Brazil

0:17:11.793,0:17:15.968
and the fact that[br]ethnicity and location

0:17:15.968,0:17:18.408
produces a different view[br]of the music.

0:17:19.108,0:17:23.267
What I'm thinking is if we just[br]put that in the middle horizontally,

0:17:23.267,0:17:26.340
and we have a white panel[br]above and below,

0:17:26.340,0:17:29.855
and we just run our typography[br]in that white panel.

0:17:29.855,0:17:31.480
[Maas] Uncropped[br]in the middle, okay.

0:17:31.480,0:17:33.291
[Glaser] Yeah. Make it run[br]right through the middle.

0:17:33.291,0:17:35.141
[Maas] Kind of make it[br]smaller, all right.

0:17:35.141,0:17:38.788
[Glaser] We don't do it as[br]finishing something according to plan

0:17:38.788,0:17:42.162
because what's nice[br]is it it changes as you do it.

0:17:42.162,0:17:44.073
The energy[br]comes out of a work

0:17:44.073,0:17:48.412
that has been achieved[br]as a result of making it,

0:17:48.412,0:17:52.413
rather than as a premeditation[br]and then completion, you know.

0:17:54.353,0:17:57.463
I had designed that logo[br]for this school for the 40th.

0:17:57.463,0:17:59.884
So I got the mark[br]I'd done,

0:17:59.884,0:18:02.824
and I said just give me[br]a batch of these,

0:18:02.824,0:18:05.543
and we just ran them off[br]on our copier.

0:18:05.543,0:18:07.416
And I pasted[br]them all down,

0:18:07.416,0:18:10.333
and it looked just like a Frank Stella,[br]which wasn't bad.

0:18:10.333,0:18:11.662
And then as I was[br]pasting them,

0:18:11.662,0:18:13.262
some of the edges[br]were coming up

0:18:13.262,0:18:14.125
and says,[br]you know,

0:18:14.125,0:18:17.253
it sort of looks more interesting[br]with the edges coming up.

0:18:17.253,0:18:19.113
If I were doing this[br]on the computer

0:18:19.113,0:18:22.113
and it were not[br]real pieces of paper,

0:18:22.113,0:18:23.673
it never[br]would've happened.

0:18:25.713,0:18:28.913
You could create this on the computer[br]and the illusion,

0:18:28.913,0:18:31.893
but you wouldn't have[br]stumbled into it as a physical act.

0:18:31.893,0:18:36.153
[♪]

0:18:36.153,0:18:38.567
I've designed in[br]any number of typefaces,

0:18:38.567,0:18:41.277
but they're not[br]really typefaces.

0:18:41.277,0:18:46.079
They're kind of an idea that,[br]although it's done frequently now,

0:18:46.079,0:18:49.576
an idea about form that has been[br]translated through typeface.

0:18:49.576,0:18:53.716
The most obvious function of typography[br]is to convey a narrative.

0:18:53.716,0:18:57.166
But there's another whole range[br]of activity for typography,

0:18:57.166,0:19:00.105
which is more decorative[br]and more instrumental

0:19:00.105,0:19:02.395
in communicating[br]atmosphere.

0:19:02.395,0:19:06.820
I do a kind of novelty faces[br]which have a sort of premise

0:19:06.820,0:19:10.265
and then I use for a headline[br]or something else.

0:19:10.265,0:19:14.264
It's a modest intervention[br]into the world of typography.

0:19:16.574,0:19:18.204
Now, this is a[br]nice picture,

0:19:20.484,0:19:23.007
the two of us going[br]to work on something.

0:19:23.537,0:19:24.766
He was great.

0:19:26.217,0:19:29.217
I had an odd friendship[br]with Folon.

0:19:29.217,0:19:30.958
He spoke no English,[br]I spoke no French,

0:19:30.958,0:19:33.638
and we would have[br]these long conversations.

0:19:33.638,0:19:35.581
We would talk[br]for hours

0:19:35.581,0:19:38.567
without either of us[br]having the other's language.

0:19:41.327,0:19:42.397
And then one day,[br]I said,

0:19:42.397,0:19:43.519
"You know,[br]there's a good chance

0:19:43.519,0:19:46.382
we've been misunderstanding ourselves[br]all these years."

0:19:47.612,0:19:51.538
So, to celebrate that misunderstanding,[br]we said, let's do a book,

0:19:52.858,0:19:58.178
where I started drawing[br]and you continue it,

0:19:58.178,0:20:01.678
and then I continue your drawing,[br]and you continue mine,

0:20:01.678,0:20:06.379
and it's a series, in some degree,[br]of misunderstandings.

0:20:08.559,0:20:11.919
A little bit like[br]a series of improvisations.

0:20:11.919,0:20:15.719
It's like you get a theme going[br]and you just do variations on it.

0:20:15.719,0:20:17.670
But it sold very well[br]in Europe.

0:20:17.670,0:20:21.398
And of course, for me,[br]it really is a document

0:20:21.398,0:20:26.091
of my love and affection[br]for a wonderful, wonderful friend.

0:20:26.091,0:20:31.630
[♪]

0:20:31.630,0:20:36.181
[Heller] Milton probably has[br]the most international reputation

0:20:36.181,0:20:40.001
of any designer living today,[br]in large part because

0:20:40.001,0:20:46.351
he was at the center[br]of such culturally explosive things

0:20:46.351,0:20:49.607
culturally diverse things,[br]starting in the '60s.

0:20:49.607,0:20:53.891
I mean, because of Milton,[br]in large part, psychedelia exists.

0:20:53.891,0:20:55.910
Because of Milton,[br]in large part,

0:20:55.910,0:20:59.702
this kind of post-modern[br]sensibility exists.

0:20:59.702,0:21:02.031
He played a role[br]in all of these things,

0:21:02.031,0:21:03.832
and all of these things[br]got exported.

0:21:03.832,0:21:05.392
'Course there was[br]that big show

0:21:05.392,0:21:08.712
at Pushman Studios[br]early in my career,

0:21:08.712,0:21:11.271
which alerted Europeans[br]to the fact

0:21:11.271,0:21:15.541
that there was[br]a kind of new, um,

0:21:15.541,0:21:19.783
non-Swiss version of design[br]happening in the United States.

0:21:19.783,0:21:26.053
And as a result of that,[br]I became relatively well-known

0:21:26.053,0:21:29.465
in Europe and South America[br]and so on,

0:21:29.465,0:21:33.714
because of the kinds of assignments[br]that I got afterwards.

0:21:33.714,0:21:37.343
[Heller] We have done newspapers[br]around the world.

0:21:37.343,0:21:40.573
We've done[br]<i>La Vanguardia</i> in Barcelona,

0:21:40.573,0:21:42.964
<i>ABC</i> in Madrid,

0:21:42.964,0:21:44.794
<i>O Globo</i> in Rio.

0:21:44.794,0:21:47.214
We did <i>Espresso</i>[br]in Rome twice,

0:21:47.214,0:21:48.442
<i>Barron's</i> twice.

0:21:48.622,0:21:53.091
[Glaser] In France, we did <i>L'Express</i>[br]for Sir James Goldsmith,

0:21:53.091,0:21:57.794
who also owned a literary magazine[br]called <i>Lire</i> which we did,

0:21:57.794,0:22:01.662
and there were innumerable others--[br]<i>Business Tokyo</i> in Japan.

0:22:01.662,0:22:04.835
There was a time when I was[br]popping back and forth

0:22:04.835,0:22:09.220
to Europe often,[br]and other places as well.

0:22:09.220,0:22:12.617
I would think that[br]one thing that travel did

0:22:12.617,0:22:15.446
was simply amplify[br]what was already present,

0:22:15.446,0:22:20.732
which was an appetite[br]for whatever the surroundings offered,

0:22:20.732,0:22:25.188
whether they were cultural[br]or visual or whatever else.

0:22:25.188,0:22:28.415
I mean, you can't very well[br]go to Barcelona

0:22:28.415,0:22:32.155
and see Gaudí[br]and come back unchanged.

0:22:32.155,0:22:34.127
I mean,[br]there are some things

0:22:34.127,0:22:40.387
that travel just affects[br]your nervous system so much

0:22:40.387,0:22:44.023
that there's nothing[br]that you can do to avoid it

0:22:44.023,0:22:48.147
without even consciously[br]wanting to emulate something.

0:22:48.147,0:22:49.457
I would say,[br]in that way,

0:22:49.457,0:22:54.787
travel penetrates your consciousness,[br]but not in a rational way.

0:22:56.707,0:22:59.718
A woman in Milan[br]named Cristina Taverna

0:22:59.718,0:23:01.388
decided to go into[br]the publishing business

0:23:01.388,0:23:04.017
as she thought she would[br]publish <i>The Divine Comedy,</i>

0:23:04.017,0:23:06.108
and I was disappointed[br]because I wanted to do hell,

0:23:06.108,0:23:07.225
but then[br]I realized,

0:23:07.225,0:23:11.384
purgatory's much more interesting[br]because that's where we are now.

0:23:11.384,0:23:14.018
At any rate, I decided[br]to do it in mono prints,

0:23:14.018,0:23:16.329
which I hadn't done[br]for many years,

0:23:16.329,0:23:18.659
and so I took a course[br]in Woodstock.

0:23:18.659,0:23:20.640
The interesting thing[br]about a mono print--

0:23:20.640,0:23:23.909
and the name itself[br]reveals its limitation--

0:23:23.909,0:23:25.772
it says you can[br]only get one.

0:23:25.772,0:23:27.700
Except if you do it on[br]a piece of paper,

0:23:27.700,0:23:30.668
you could rearrange it[br]in the process of re-inking it

0:23:30.668,0:23:34.989
so that it gives you a very nice way[br]of doing a second version,

0:23:34.989,0:23:39.030
but what you can't do is[br]another print of the same thing.

0:23:39.030,0:23:42.320
Works that are too preconceived[br]tend to go dead.

0:23:42.320,0:23:44.879
They become inert[br]and less lively.

0:23:44.879,0:23:47.900
Work that responds to[br]the peculiarities of the moment

0:23:47.900,0:23:49.419
tend to be[br]more energized.

0:23:49.419,0:23:52.259
[woman] So, some of those surprises[br]are happy surprises.

0:23:52.259,0:23:55.390
[Glaser] Oh, absolutely.[br]You have both experiences.

0:23:55.390,0:23:58.454
You know, sometimes it's much better[br]than you thought it was going to be.

0:23:58.454,0:24:01.621
Like life itself,[br]sometimes it's much worse.

0:24:01.621,0:24:02.627
[woman][br]That's right.

0:24:02.627,0:24:03.673
[both laughing]

0:24:03.673,0:24:05.420
[Glaser] I loved[br]doing purgatory,

0:24:05.420,0:24:08.516
perhaps the best things[br]I've done in my later life,

0:24:08.516,0:24:10.411
basically because[br]they were dark.

0:24:10.411,0:24:12.786
But I like the[br]drama of the dark

0:24:12.786,0:24:16.521
and I like the idea of[br]the conflict between good and evil.

0:24:16.521,0:24:18.491
Finally, you get to a point[br]where you realize

0:24:18.491,0:24:21.898
everything is related[br]to its opposite,

0:24:21.898,0:24:25.872
that if you have light,[br]there has to be darkness.

0:24:25.872,0:24:28.028
If there's truth,[br]there has to be lies.

0:24:28.028,0:24:34.672
Everything is defined by its opposite,[br]and they both require exploration.

0:24:35.502,0:24:38.752
I mean, if you simply do a drawing,[br]a simple drawing,

0:24:38.752,0:24:42.566
you're already dealing with[br]questions of dark and light, right?

0:24:42.566,0:24:49.056
[♪]

0:24:49.056,0:24:51.900
So much of my work[br]depends on drawing.

0:24:51.900,0:24:55.959
I think of drawing[br]as my essential resource,

0:24:55.959,0:24:58.239
that that's where my understanding[br]of form comes from,

0:24:58.239,0:25:00.313
and whenever[br]I can draw,

0:25:00.313,0:25:03.893
because I find it so pleasurable,[br]I will draw.

0:25:03.893,0:25:08.923
[♪]

0:25:27.587,0:25:31.544
[Peter] You could just sit down[br]in front of a piece of paper

0:25:31.544,0:25:32.702
and you would[br]start right away.

0:25:32.702,0:25:35.354
What is it about drawing[br]and line--

0:25:35.354,0:25:40.093
[Glaser] I am a great believer in drawing[br]as a way of understanding the world.

0:25:40.093,0:25:44.401
In fact, I was thinking for the book[br]that you want to do of my drawings--

0:25:44.401,0:25:45.662
Peter: I do.

0:25:45.662,0:25:50.329
Glaser: --that a title might be[br]<i>Drawing Is Thinking.</i>

0:25:50.329,0:25:56.079
[♪]

0:26:01.536,0:26:04.490
Tabibian: The idea is to[br]make the hand do what you want.

0:26:04.490,0:26:09.152
In his case, the hands[br]have no resistance.

0:26:09.152,0:26:17.348
The hands are inanimate tools[br]without will of their own,

0:26:17.348,0:26:23.372
and so the translation[br]of image to drawing

0:26:23.372,0:26:29.310
is automatic, complete,[br]unmediated, instantaneous.

0:26:30.770,0:26:33.872
To see it at work,[br][chuckles], well...

0:26:33.872,0:26:35.963
[Glaser] It's funny, you know,[br]one of the great things

0:26:35.963,0:26:39.379
about being able to make[br]pictures and drawings--

0:26:39.379,0:26:42.452
it makes you feel like[br]you're really like God.

0:26:42.452,0:26:45.049
This drawing derives[br]from a photograph

0:26:45.049,0:26:47.487
of Monet and family,[br]and all I really did

0:26:47.487,0:26:52.680
was I put a snake in the foreground[br]that clearly wasn't there.

0:26:52.680,0:26:56.132
But I must say that it[br]transforms everything.

0:26:56.132,0:26:59.163
Once the snake enters it,[br]you see everything shift.

0:26:59.163,0:27:02.563
[♪]

0:27:24.690,0:27:27.375
[man]] How much of your work[br]is self-initiated?

0:27:28.155,0:27:30.218
[Glaser] Less than[br]I would like, actually.

0:27:30.218,0:27:36.105
I mean, I am so conditioned[br]to working to a specific problem.

0:27:36.105,0:27:38.755
But every once in a while,[br]I have the opportunity

0:27:38.755,0:27:45.156
to sort of do a cycle of work[br]that I basically start myself.

0:27:45.156,0:27:47.105
The Monet project[br]was pretty extensive.

0:27:47.105,0:27:49.455
There were[br]over 50 drawings.

0:27:50.035,0:27:52.605
All of these are events[br]that could've happened

0:27:52.605,0:27:54.574
but didn't necessarily.

0:27:55.394,0:27:58.317
Monet's dog.[br]I don't know if he had a dog.

0:27:58.317,0:28:01.057
[man] He does now.[br][Glaser chuckles]

0:28:01.976,0:28:03.987
[Glaser] The truth is that[br]I have been looking for

0:28:03.987,0:28:07.047
a definition of what art is[br]all my life

0:28:07.047,0:28:11.957
without fully understanding[br]exactly what it encompasses,

0:28:11.957,0:28:14.506
but, in the course[br]of doing a speech,

0:28:14.506,0:28:17.927
I looked up several references[br]to what art was,

0:28:17.927,0:28:21.906
and I found one by Horace,[br]who's a critic and poet

0:28:21.906,0:28:24.428
back in Roman times[br]first century, so--

0:28:24.428,0:28:26.201
and he had this[br]great, great line.

0:28:26.201,0:28:32.178
He said, "The purpose of art[br]is to inform and delight."

0:28:32.178,0:28:36.427
And I thought wow,[br]it can't get much better than that.

0:28:36.857,0:28:39.148
[Heller] Going back to the Bauhaus,[br]there was this thing called

0:28:39.148,0:28:42.808
the Gesamtkunstwerk,[br]the total work of art.

0:28:42.808,0:28:45.691
And I think that Milton[br]comes out of that

0:28:45.691,0:28:49.228
directly or indirectly[br]looking at art as art.

0:28:49.228,0:28:53.688
And so the commercial[br]is certainly one part of it

0:28:53.688,0:28:58.228
that requires certain requisites,[br]and then the artist part of him,

0:28:58.228,0:29:01.019
the pure artist part of him,[br]requires other requisites.

0:29:01.019,0:29:03.832
But they're really joined.[br]I mean, you can't separate the two.

0:29:03.832,0:29:07.168
He might do pictures of his cats[br]that are quite beautiful,

0:29:07.168,0:29:11.219
and have no place[br]in a graphic design annual,

0:29:11.219,0:29:12.449
but at the[br]same time,

0:29:12.449,0:29:17.139
he injects all of that artistic humanity[br]into everything he does.

0:29:17.139,0:29:19.571
[Glaser] I just thought of that project,[br]of doing Piero's,

0:29:19.571,0:29:22.705
and I realized that if I'm[br]simply copying Piero's,

0:29:22.705,0:29:24.518
what value[br]does it then have?

0:29:24.518,0:29:28.051
And then I realized,[br]if you looked at Piero as nature,

0:29:28.051,0:29:30.982
like you're drawing a tree,[br]you don't feel as though

0:29:30.982,0:29:32.923
you're obliged[br]to represent that tree.

0:29:32.923,0:29:37.000
But then you just have an idea[br]that the tree initiates.

0:29:37.000,0:29:40.038
And so, with the Piero projects,[br]that's what I did.

0:29:40.038,0:29:42.950
I sort of started drawing[br]as though I were

0:29:42.950,0:29:45.320
looking through[br]a window at Piero, so...

0:29:45.320,0:29:48.331
[♪]

0:29:48.331,0:29:50.951
Otherwise, I would have been[br]embarrassed to begin.

0:29:50.963,0:29:55.073
[♪]

0:29:55.073,0:29:57.086
Gombrich, in his great book,[br]he says,

0:29:57.086,0:30:00.313
"There is no art;[br]there are only artists."

0:30:00.313,0:30:03.632
And you say, "Well,[br]wait a minute; what, exactly--?"

0:30:03.632,0:30:05.222
And what he meant,[br]of course,

0:30:05.222,0:30:08.943
is that what art is[br]becomes defined generationally.

0:30:08.943,0:30:11.574
Everybody's sort of[br]redefined what art is,

0:30:11.574,0:30:14.874
because there's[br]no then there, right?

0:30:14.874,0:30:21.614
It is, in fact, what society determines[br]at any moment in history.

0:30:21.614,0:30:25.083
And the great enemy of art,[br]of course,

0:30:25.083,0:30:31.181
is the institutionalization of belief,[br]like style or like taste.

0:30:31.181,0:30:33.273
We say, "Well,[br]we finally got to that.

0:30:33.273,0:30:35.724
"Here we are.[br]This is <i>really</i> art."

0:30:35.724,0:30:40.504
And once that has-- that happens,[br]that crystallization of belief,

0:30:40.504,0:30:42.548
we're saying,[br]"Okay, I got it now.

0:30:42.548,0:30:46.235
"We put two yellows, one red,[br]and three of the green guys."

0:30:46.235,0:30:51.213
Once that happens, you realize that[br]that becomes a limitation, right?

0:30:51.213,0:30:54.985
When I had my show very early[br]at the Museum of Modern Art

0:30:54.985,0:30:57.266
that Emilio Ambasz[br]had arranged,

0:30:57.266,0:31:00.695
there was one large poster,[br]the big nude,

0:31:00.695,0:31:03.726
that didn't have[br]any typography on it.

0:31:03.726,0:31:06.126
The curator of prints[br]came in,

0:31:06.126,0:31:08.385
he said,[br]"You can't show that.

0:31:08.385,0:31:10.465
"It doesn't have any[br]typography in it."

0:31:10.465,0:31:12.345
He says,[br]"So what?"

0:31:12.345,0:31:13.835
"Well, that makes it[br]a print,

0:31:13.835,0:31:16.005
"and that comes[br]under my jurisdiction,

0:31:16.005,0:31:19.616
"and I don't want that[br]as representing the print."

0:31:19.616,0:31:21.756
I said,[br]"I can't believe it."

0:31:21.756,0:31:25.516
What I have always hated in my life[br]is the parochialization of art,

0:31:25.516,0:31:30.515
making it a special activity[br]unrelated to other activities.

0:31:30.515,0:31:34.507
It finally ends up as being[br]an instrument for social enhancement

0:31:34.507,0:31:37.647
and not what it really is,[br]which was an expression

0:31:37.647,0:31:40.528
of a very fundamental instinct[br]of the species.

0:31:42.588,0:31:45.664
There's a wonderful book[br]that I have quoted for most of my life

0:31:45.664,0:31:47.727
by Lewis Hyde[br]called <i>The Gift,</i>

0:31:47.727,0:31:51.164
and it basically says[br]that this gift-giving,

0:31:51.164,0:31:55.147
which occurs in primitive cultures[br]from one tribe to another,

0:31:55.147,0:32:01.297
which is a device for pacifying others[br]and establishing relationship,

0:32:01.297,0:32:03.888
is what artists do.

0:32:03.888,0:32:07.396
They basically create[br]the commonalities,

0:32:07.396,0:32:09.858
the symbolism,[br]so that people feel as though

0:32:09.858,0:32:12.368
they have some relationship[br]to one another.

0:32:12.368,0:32:15.837
When people don't feel that[br]they have that relationship,

0:32:15.837,0:32:17.138
they kill each other,

0:32:17.138,0:32:26.765
so that row of providing common ground[br]is absolutely essential to civilization.

0:32:26.765,0:32:27.736
The nice thing[br]about it is

0:32:27.736,0:32:31.199
there's always a next plateau[br]of understanding.

0:32:31.199,0:32:35.631
It's very exciting to think that[br]you don't run out, right?

0:32:35.631,0:32:38.109
That history doesn't run out,[br]that art doesn't run out,

0:32:38.109,0:32:41.944
and so you just,[br]you go as far as you can,

0:32:41.944,0:32:44.620
and then leave some room[br]for the next guy.

0:32:45.750,0:32:48.110
[♪ relaxing piano music ♪]

0:32:48.110,0:32:51.930
In junior high school,[br]when I was deciding whether

0:32:51.930,0:32:55.040
to go to Bronx Science[br]or music and art,

0:32:55.040,0:32:58.440
and I had a very encouraging[br]science teacher,

0:32:58.440,0:33:00.871
and I made the decision[br]that I would go to music and art.

0:33:00.871,0:33:02.720
And shortly after[br]I'd made that decision,

0:33:02.720,0:33:04.432
he stopped me[br]in the hall one day.

0:33:04.432,0:33:09.092
He said, "I wanna talk to you."[br]And my heart sank.

0:33:09.092,0:33:14.591
So we went into his office[br]and he reached down into his desk,

0:33:14.591,0:33:18.582
and he pulled out[br]a box of French conte crayons.

0:33:18.582,0:33:22.313
He gave it to me and he said,[br]"Do good work."

0:33:24.393,0:33:29.303
To some degree, everything I do[br]has been supported by this idea

0:33:29.303,0:33:32.462
that the only way[br]I could really pay him back

0:33:32.462,0:33:33.946
was to do[br]good work.

0:33:33.946,0:33:41.386
[♪]

0:33:42.476,0:33:46.312
Well, this is my old high school,[br]a high school of music and art.

0:33:46.312,0:33:49.513
I received an exceedingly[br]good education there.

0:33:49.513,0:33:52.234
And a few years ago,[br]the principal, Kim Bruno,

0:33:52.234,0:33:55.312
asked me if I would do[br]a new identity for the school.

0:33:55.312,0:33:58.665
Now, the problem seemed to be[br]the name of the school itself,

0:33:58.665,0:34:00.395
which, if you[br]can believe it,

0:34:00.395,0:34:05.251
is the Fiorello H. LaGuardia High School[br]of Music & Art and Performing Arts.

0:34:05.251,0:34:10.835
My suggestion was that they[br]change the name to LaGuardia Arts.

0:34:10.835,0:34:13.764
And on that basis,[br]I proceeded to design a logo

0:34:13.764,0:34:17.224
that is based on the idea[br]of musical score,

0:34:17.224,0:34:20.102
and it is the only logo[br]that can actually be sung.

0:34:20.562,0:34:24.149
[singing] ♪ La... ♪

0:34:26.305,0:34:29.705
But I entered the school at 15[br]because I came from junior high school.

0:34:29.705,0:34:33.635
After there, I got into Cooper Union,[br]and I must say,

0:34:33.635,0:34:36.305
I received a wonderful,[br]wonderful education.

0:34:37.195,0:34:39.386
Well, Push Pin[br]grew out of an attempt

0:34:39.386,0:34:42.436
to recreate the spirit[br]and the energy

0:34:42.436,0:34:45.415
of Cooper Union[br]while we were students there.

0:34:45.415,0:34:47.486
It was years later,[br]after I had come back

0:34:47.486,0:34:49.826
from Italy[br]on my Fulbright,

0:34:49.826,0:34:53.887
that we all decided we would[br]like to continue to work together.

0:34:53.887,0:34:58.926
[Heller] Push Pin gathered together[br]some very demonstrative personalities:

0:34:58.926,0:35:01.856
Milton Glaser, Seymour Chwast,[br]as the leaders,

0:35:01.856,0:35:04.609
Ed Sorel was involved,[br]and others.

0:35:04.609,0:35:10.337
And it created a stylistic buzz.[br]It created an attitude.

0:35:10.337,0:35:15.407
Push Pin was like[br]the epitome of fun in design.

0:35:15.407,0:35:17.475
[Glaser] We worked from[br]a different point of view.

0:35:17.475,0:35:19.376
It was an eclectic[br]point of view

0:35:19.376,0:35:23.379
that celebrated ornament[br]and drawing and narration,

0:35:23.379,0:35:26.438
all the things that the modernists[br]taught us to hate.

0:35:26.438,0:35:31.847
[Heller] In that sense,[br]Push Pin opened a door into eclecticism

0:35:31.847,0:35:35.922
that no other firm had done,[br]and did so in a sophisticated way.

0:35:35.922,0:35:44.692
[♪]

0:35:44.692,0:35:46.619
Push Pin had,[br]as a strategy,

0:35:46.619,0:35:50.398
to draw on these historical forms,[br]these passé forms,

0:35:50.398,0:35:53.052
bring them together,[br]meld them, mold them,

0:35:53.052,0:35:56.150
and make them into something[br]that was highly contemporary.

0:35:56.150,0:36:00.796
[Glaser] I felt, actually, that[br]our success had defined us too much.

0:36:00.796,0:36:04.567
Push Pin had become a style,[br]and I don't trust styles.

0:36:04.567,0:36:08.721
And above all, I don't want to[br]be encapsulated in a style.

0:36:08.721,0:36:16.001
So, it felt to me as though[br]I would have to redefine myself.

0:36:18.961,0:36:22.210
I really started Milton Glaser Inc.[br]at that time,

0:36:22.210,0:36:27.621
began to move into areas[br]of restaurant design for Joe Bau,

0:36:27.621,0:36:30.951
supermarket design[br]for Sir James Goldsmith,

0:36:30.951,0:36:32.600
and that required[br]really transforming

0:36:32.600,0:36:35.600
a small studio[br]into a large studio,

0:36:35.600,0:36:40.051
and still staying with all the activities[br]of <i>New York</i> magazine,

0:36:40.051,0:36:42.672
which included acquiring[br]the <i>Village Voice</i>

0:36:42.672,0:36:44.932
and starting up[br]<i>New West</i> magazine on--

0:36:44.932,0:36:47.762
and we were very ambitious[br]through all of that.

0:36:47.762,0:36:50.341
It was a very,[br]very busy time.

0:36:50.341,0:36:56.161
[♪]

0:36:56.161,0:36:58.561
And that kept me going[br]for a good long time,

0:36:58.561,0:37:01.982
until Murdoch bought <i>New York</i>[br]and we left,

0:37:01.982,0:37:06.323
and I continued to do supermarkets[br]for about 20 years.

0:37:06.323,0:37:10.013
I've spent a large part of my life[br]doing supermarkets.

0:37:10.013,0:37:12.314
And I learned a lot[br]from the act of doing that.

0:37:12.314,0:37:16.703
I'm very happy with the work[br]we did on supermarkets

0:37:16.703,0:37:18.943
because it made life better[br]for a lot of people.

0:37:18.943,0:37:20.074
It made things clearer.

0:37:20.074,0:37:21.934
It made the navigation[br]through the market

0:37:21.934,0:37:24.863
more understandable,[br]and less fatiguing.

0:37:24.863,0:37:27.104
Also because[br]we really had to

0:37:27.104,0:37:33.662
talk to your average American[br]all over the country,

0:37:33.662,0:37:36.693
and that was very,[br]very instructive.

0:37:36.693,0:37:44.183
[♪]

0:37:44.183,0:37:46.084
A lot of the work we do[br]is sort of for--

0:37:46.084,0:37:51.784
aimed at a thin hierarchy of[br]design-interested personalities,

0:37:51.784,0:37:57.085
and other designers,[br]and fancy people as well.

0:37:57.085,0:38:00.815
But those years designing supermarkets[br]were very fundamental

0:38:00.815,0:38:03.805
in shaping my perception[br]on how to communicate cleanly.

0:38:08.925,0:38:11.726
At that book event,[br]at least eight people

0:38:11.726,0:38:14.636
came over to me[br]at the event in publishing--

0:38:14.636,0:38:15.366
Man: Yes.

0:38:15.366,0:38:18.656
Glaser: --to have said, I studied[br]with you back 40 years ago.

0:38:18.656,0:38:19.958
I love to teach.

0:38:19.958,0:38:22.076
I don't think I have[br]an obligation to teach.

0:38:22.076,0:38:25.460
I teach because[br]I feel better when I teach

0:38:25.460,0:38:26.863
as when I don't teach.

0:38:26.863,0:38:29.282
Glaser: But I think what you've done[br]in this presentation--

0:38:29.282,0:38:30.934
you've really[br]got that.

0:38:30.934,0:38:33.595
It is withholding.[br]It doesn't give you everything.

0:38:33.595,0:38:35.550
It's just one of the[br]secrets of design.

0:38:35.550,0:38:38.454
[Glaser] People always ask me[br]why I teach, and, of course,

0:38:38.454,0:38:41.137
the fact that people[br]ask that question in itself

0:38:41.137,0:38:45.743
just indicates the kind[br]of low-voltage contempt

0:38:45.743,0:38:48.726
that teaching is actually held in[br]in America.

0:38:48.726,0:38:52.538
The idea of being a teacher[br]is that you've got to pass it on.

0:38:52.538,0:38:55.137
You learn something;[br]you develop some insights;

0:38:55.137,0:39:00.572
your experience can be transmitted[br]and that is the nature of civilization.

0:39:00.572,0:39:04.118
[Heller] Milton's summer program[br]is a monumental experience

0:39:04.118,0:39:06.828
for anybody who comes[br]into the programs.

0:39:06.828,0:39:10.358
He draws people[br]from all over the profession.

0:39:10.358,0:39:12.496
This is not somebody[br]just coming to school.

0:39:12.496,0:39:14.478
These are people who've been[br]working for years.

0:39:14.478,0:39:19.149
And what he does[br]is he gives them this wisdom,

0:39:19.149,0:39:21.379
as well as[br]tests them.

0:39:21.379,0:39:26.645
His curriculum is a constant--[br]let's call it boot camp.

0:39:26.645,0:39:29.800
I mean, he takes a problem[br]and he has people solve it

0:39:29.800,0:39:31.470
in a very short[br]amount of time,

0:39:31.470,0:39:34.614
so it's really testing[br]both sides of the brain at once.

0:39:34.614,0:39:39.101
And if they can succeed, great.[br]If they fail, even greater

0:39:39.101,0:39:42.310
because then you get[br]his wholehearted wisdom.

0:39:42.310,0:39:43.450
Glaser: I wanna just-

0:39:43.450,0:39:45.281
[Maxwell] I took his class[br]when I was 17.

0:39:45.281,0:39:55.180
I began to realize we were not[br]designing objects, like book covers.

0:39:55.180,0:39:57.010
We were[br]redesigning the world.

0:39:57.010,0:40:00.498
I don't think I've ever heard him[br]say we have a responsibility.

0:40:00.498,0:40:03.060
It swims into the consciousness[br]by his actions.

0:40:03.060,0:40:06.201
To have spent time with him[br]and not feel responsibility

0:40:06.201,0:40:08.502
would've been[br]to not be paying attention.

0:40:08.502,0:40:11.219
[Heller] The ripple effect[br]that Milton has had is enormous.

0:40:11.219,0:40:13.291
People who come out[br]of those programs,

0:40:13.291,0:40:16.691
there are-- you know, there are[br]certain epiphanies that they have,

0:40:16.691,0:40:21.019
and they go back into their jobs[br]with this new inspiration.

0:40:21.019,0:40:25.139
Or, as our students do,[br]they go back into the world

0:40:25.139,0:40:31.472
with a tool kit that they can draw on[br]at any given time.

0:40:31.472,0:40:34.532
It's not a specific thing,[br]necessarily.

0:40:34.532,0:40:37.192
But in the case of one of[br]our students, Deborah Adler,

0:40:37.192,0:40:42.463
her thesis project was to repackage[br]and redesign prescription drugs.

0:40:42.463,0:40:45.323
[Adler] My grandmother[br]was taking an antibiotic,

0:40:45.323,0:40:46.903
which is what my grandfather[br]was taking.

0:40:46.903,0:40:49.863
Her name is Helen Adler[br]and his name is Herman Adler,

0:40:49.863,0:40:53.183
and she accidentally took his drug,[br]which is a higher dosage.

0:40:53.183,0:40:55.523
Nothing bad happened[br]other than the fact that she got dizzy,

0:40:55.523,0:40:58.391
but it was enough to make me[br]aware of the packaging.

0:40:58.391,0:41:01.083
[Glaser] At one point,[br]we thought it should be something

0:41:01.083,0:41:03.042
that the federal government[br]would mandate,

0:41:03.042,0:41:04.852
and it wasn't[br]going to happen.

0:41:04.852,0:41:07.154
The government would[br]never get behind it.

0:41:07.154,0:41:10.561
It would take 35 years[br]for anything to happen and so on.

0:41:10.561,0:41:12.594
So, I had a connection to Target--

0:41:12.594,0:41:15.674
[Heller] --who then ultimately[br]bought the whole concept,

0:41:15.674,0:41:18.625
and rolled out a new[br]prescription drug package

0:41:18.625,0:41:22.208
that has become[br]the paradigm of design

0:41:22.208,0:41:25.725
in the service of society[br]and the service of culture.

0:41:25.725,0:41:29.495
I mean, without Milton's aid[br]and enthusiasm,

0:41:29.495,0:41:30.615
this would never[br]have happened.

0:41:30.615,0:41:32.444
And this is the highest bar.

0:41:32.444,0:41:35.445
There are middle bars where,[br]thanks to Milton,

0:41:35.445,0:41:38.366
people are just practicing in a[br]different, more thoughtful way.

0:41:38.366,0:41:40.236
It's not about[br]design as service.

0:41:40.236,0:41:44.156
It's design[br]as cultural value.

0:41:44.156,0:41:46.105
[Glaser] I learned[br]a lot about teaching

0:41:46.105,0:41:48.675
from studying with[br]Giorgio Morandi years ago.

0:41:48.675,0:41:53.326
What the students get from a[br]good teacher is not instruction.

0:41:53.326,0:41:56.791
What they get is a demonstration[br]of someone's view of life.

0:41:56.791,0:41:58.028
I mean,[br]that's what you teach.

0:41:58.028,0:42:01.609
You teach a way of[br]perceiving the world.

0:42:01.609,0:42:03.906
His entire life[br]was about the work.

0:42:03.906,0:42:05.627
There was nothing else.

0:42:05.627,0:42:07.546
I thought,[br]no matter what you're doing,

0:42:07.546,0:42:09.867
whether it's painting[br]or typography

0:42:09.867,0:42:13.458
or even working as a waiter[br]in a restaurant,

0:42:13.458,0:42:16.798
that complete commitment[br]is transformative.

0:42:16.798,0:42:18.498
I mean,[br]it makes you different

0:42:18.498,0:42:20.898
when you truly commit[br]to what you're doing.

0:42:21.908,0:42:25.446
I went to Italy having[br]never left home before.

0:42:25.446,0:42:28.738
I guess I was 20 or 21,[br]you know, smart-ass Jewish kid,

0:42:28.738,0:42:31.837
who really figured I knew[br]the way the world worked.

0:42:31.837,0:42:32.897
And then[br]I went to Italy,

0:42:32.897,0:42:35.898
and I realized that I didn't know[br]anything about anything.

0:42:35.898,0:42:41.035
And it gave me this sense[br]of the continuity

0:42:41.035,0:42:43.504
of human history,[br]of the human experience,

0:42:43.504,0:42:47.790
I mean, going from, you know,[br]Romanesque to the Gothic to the--

0:42:47.790,0:42:49.209
[man] It's a[br]kind of old place.

0:42:49.209,0:42:51.170
[Glaser] Right, it's an old place.[br]And it's all-

0:42:51.170,0:42:53.100
but more importantly,[br]it's all visible.

0:42:53.100,0:42:56.330
It really shifted me from[br]the idea of modernism

0:42:56.330,0:42:59.060
as being the[br]only available resource

0:42:59.060,0:43:01.850
to draw on[br]for a young designer.

0:43:01.850,0:43:04.930
I suddenly realized[br]history was not the enemy,

0:43:04.930,0:43:11.709
that you could use anything[br]as raw material to make something.

0:43:11.709,0:43:16.330
That was a great,[br]great transformation for me,

0:43:16.330,0:43:17.801
and it's persisted[br]to this day.

0:43:17.801,0:43:20.641
I mean, in that sense,[br]Italy was very important

0:43:20.641,0:43:23.802
to changing my view of, well,[br]the importance of food.

0:43:23.802,0:43:25.680
My mother[br]was a terrible cook.

0:43:25.680,0:43:29.701
I got to Bologna,[br]the best place for eating in Italy,

0:43:29.701,0:43:31.791
and suddenly[br]I understood something

0:43:31.791,0:43:33.621
that I'd never learned[br]in the Bronx.

0:43:33.621,0:43:39.810
[Tabibian] There were several things[br]about his mother's spaghetti recipe.

0:43:41.220,0:43:43.531
She would take a pound[br]of Mueller spaghetti,

0:43:43.531,0:43:46.779
which was,[br]as a brand,

0:43:46.779,0:43:50.931
much less intimidating[br]than Buitoni or Rozoni.

0:43:50.931,0:43:53.702
It sort of sounded[br]a little Jewish to my mother.

0:43:53.702,0:43:59.553
And she would boil it in a[br]big aluminum pot for about an hour.

0:43:59.553,0:44:05.482
[Tabibian] And she puts on it[br]some Velveeta cheese.

0:44:05.482,0:44:08.531
And about a half cup[br]of Heinz tomato ketchup.

0:44:08.531,0:44:12.732
And, uh, bakes it.[br]Bakes!

0:44:12.732,0:44:15.922
And then allowed to cool,[br]and she would de-mold it,

0:44:15.922,0:44:19.903
take it out, and sort of looked like[br]the dome of St. Peters.

0:44:21.403,0:44:24.094
Bravo.[br]Guess what happens next?

0:44:24.094,0:44:25.658
And then[br]she would slice it--

0:44:26.018,0:44:27.418
And fries it!

0:44:27.418,0:44:29.022
--and fry it in chicken fat.

0:44:29.022,0:44:36.184
[Tabibian] From that to Ristorante Diana[br]in Bologna, it's a long way.

0:44:36.184,0:44:39.488
It's a very long way.

0:44:39.488,0:44:41.162
One thing[br]I can tell you about Milton

0:44:41.162,0:44:48.824
uh, is that he loves food,[br]and he loves to have, uh, lunch.

0:44:51.014,0:44:52.544
[Glaser] Okay,[br]so here we are

0:44:52.544,0:44:56.295
at one of the great[br]dim sum palaces in Chinatown.

0:44:56.295,0:45:01.275
My favorite way of eating--[br]a lot of little things.

0:45:01.275,0:45:04.439
[Bernard] When he was at[br]<i>New York</i> magazine, he had a--

0:45:04.439,0:45:07.437
several regular lunches[br]with Jerome Snyder,

0:45:07.437,0:45:09.256
who was his partner[br]at <i>The Underground Gourmet.</i>

0:45:09.256,0:45:11.187
So they would invite[br]three or four people,

0:45:11.187,0:45:13.376
and we'd go to some[br]Polish delicatessen

0:45:13.376,0:45:14.966
or cheap coffee shop[br]or whatever,

0:45:14.966,0:45:16.626
but we'd always have[br]these wonderful lunches

0:45:16.626,0:45:19.526
because we'd have to sample[br]everything on the menu.

0:45:19.526,0:45:20.637
[Glaser] So what[br]you would do is

0:45:20.637,0:45:22.956
you would go into[br]an ethnic neighborhood.

0:45:22.956,0:45:24.847
You would always[br]find small restaurants

0:45:24.847,0:45:26.938
catering to the[br]local community.

0:45:26.938,0:45:30.176
It was the first time anyone[br]had ever written about cheap restaurants,

0:45:30.176,0:45:33.172
because cheap restaurants[br]don't advertise in magazines.

0:45:33.172,0:45:34.761
But the great thing[br]about it

0:45:34.761,0:45:40.477
was that it really had a profound effect[br]on eating patterns in New York

0:45:40.477,0:45:43.187
because we made it acceptable[br]to the middle class

0:45:43.187,0:45:45.698
to eat in a[br]cheap restaurant.

0:45:45.698,0:45:51.278
And I think maybe that was the[br]best thing I ever did because it began--

0:45:51.278,0:45:53.967
We were certainly not[br]solely responsible,

0:45:53.967,0:45:58.598
but it began that shift[br]of the city's awareness

0:45:58.598,0:46:02.428
of this incredible reservoir[br]of interesting food

0:46:02.428,0:46:05.158
that was in this city[br]already.

0:46:05.158,0:46:10.629
And then the realization[br]of the diversity and the richness

0:46:10.629,0:46:13.239
of this available,[br]good-quality food.

0:46:13.239,0:46:16.309
Because if you went in a[br]Hungarian neighborhood,

0:46:16.309,0:46:19.779
they were not going to be[br]serving lousy Hungarian food.

0:46:19.779,0:46:25.229
But that idea that it was okay[br]to go to a cheap dive,

0:46:25.229,0:46:27.589
to have a good meal,[br]was really something that

0:46:27.589,0:46:30.359
<i>The Underground Gourmet</i>[br]brought to the surface,

0:46:30.359,0:46:33.350
and a lot of things happened[br]as a consequence of that.

0:46:34.720,0:46:38.451
[woman] Do you still enjoy going to[br]offbeat, inexpensive restaurants?

0:46:38.451,0:46:40.948
[Glaser] Oh, I love-- I love[br]going to cheesy restaurants.

0:46:40.948,0:46:44.830
There are a couple in my neighborhood[br]down at 32nd street,

0:46:44.830,0:46:46.488
but I'm not gonna tell you[br]what they are.

0:46:46.488,0:46:47.847
Woman: No, no.[br]It would ruin them.

0:46:47.847,0:46:49.340
[Glaser] Yeah, absolutely.

0:46:49.350,0:46:51.950
[♪]

0:46:51.950,0:46:56.688
[Tabibian] In his work,[br]food is a major issue,

0:46:56.688,0:47:00.628
[♪]

0:47:00.628,0:47:03.438
because for him,[br]food is nurture.

0:47:04.198,0:47:05.838
Food is warmth.

0:47:06.538,0:47:08.390
Food is generosity.

0:47:08.630,0:47:10.030
Food is sharing.

0:47:10.030,0:47:12.932
[Glaser] I experience[br]the same satisfaction

0:47:12.932,0:47:15.861
from preparing any dish[br]that requires cutting

0:47:15.861,0:47:19.102
and chopping and arranging[br]as I do when I'm drawing.

0:47:19.102,0:47:23.442
I mean, I don't-- I don't view those[br]as different kinds of experiences.

0:47:23.922,0:47:30.450
[Caplan] Milton's love affair with[br]and his expertness in food

0:47:30.450,0:47:35.934
has informed his design of menus,[br]restaurant interiors,

0:47:35.934,0:47:38.834
and for that matter,[br]restaurant concepts.

0:47:38.834,0:47:43.344
[♪]

0:48:02.502,0:48:04.737
[Glaser] That's[br]the big nose.

0:48:05.457,0:48:10.174
This was a disreputable old Irish bar,[br]and to Shelly Fireman's credit,

0:48:10.174,0:48:14.953
he saw that it was a,[br]uh, unpolished diamond.

0:48:14.953,0:48:18.022
And so we completely[br]ripped it apart

0:48:18.022,0:48:23.394
and designed it so that it would have[br]a series of unfolding experiences:

0:48:23.394,0:48:27.494
the bar,[br]informal and friendly.

0:48:29.604,0:48:30.865
We have[br]the grand room,

0:48:30.865,0:48:35.845
which is a paraphrase of the academia[br]where I studied in Bologna.

0:48:35.845,0:48:40.266
So you have this sky light,[br]this north light.

0:48:40.266,0:48:42.495
I hired a painter[br]named Elliot Levine

0:48:42.495,0:48:46.175
to do these[br]fake Renaissance details.

0:48:46.175,0:48:49.177
And then I also commissioned[br]a friend of mine, Jordan Stecko,

0:48:49.177,0:48:52.957
to do enlargements of[br]details of the body

0:48:52.957,0:48:55.677
to signal the idea[br]this is an art school.

0:48:55.677,0:48:57.407
I don't know[br]how many people get that

0:48:57.407,0:49:00.527
but I like the idea that if they're[br]eating here for ten years,

0:49:00.527,0:49:03.608
one day you look up and[br]you say, "Oh, I get it."

0:49:03.608,0:49:07.546
I love that kind of[br]sustained mystery.

0:49:12.606,0:49:17.328
This thing, I guess they've remade[br]into fancy apartments, huh?

0:49:17.328,0:49:18.308
Woman: Yeah.

0:49:18.308,0:49:20.988
Glaser: This old building?[br]That's a new development.

0:49:20.988,0:49:24.588
It really was once[br]a refuge for people

0:49:24.588,0:49:26.288
who couldn't pay[br]adequate rents.

0:49:26.288,0:49:30.657
We got our apartment,[br]which was a floor-through,

0:49:30.657,0:49:33.417
for $135 a month.

0:49:33.417,0:49:36.348
That wouldn't get you very much[br]in New York these days.

0:49:37.328,0:49:39.828
Well, here.[br]Here is a sadness.

0:49:41.568,0:49:43.358
I was gonna show you[br]my old building.

0:49:43.358,0:49:44.558
It's gone.

0:49:45.438,0:49:49.148
54 St. Mark's Place[br]used to be here.

0:49:50.858,0:49:54.548
Gone.[br][laughing]

0:49:54.548,0:49:57.548
Absolutely[br]and completely gone.

0:49:57.548,0:49:59.659
[Shirley] When we[br]returned from Rome,

0:49:59.659,0:50:02.160
we found an apartment[br]on St. Mark's Place

0:50:02.160,0:50:04.920
where we stayed[br]for 18 years.

0:50:04.920,0:50:09.930
And then, we bought[br]this apartment 30 years ago.

0:50:11.550,0:50:13.140
[Glaser] What we have[br]on the walls here

0:50:13.140,0:50:15.690
are my first purchase[br]in the realm of art,

0:50:15.690,0:50:17.741
which was a[br]Picasso lithograph,

0:50:17.741,0:50:22.770
magnificent one,[br]when he was influenced by Ang,

0:50:22.770,0:50:28.685
and an odd painting of a man[br]on a fantastically armored horse

0:50:28.685,0:50:31.597
that I bought while[br]we were living in Rome

0:50:31.597,0:50:33.687
in a flea market[br]for two dollars

0:50:33.687,0:50:35.801
that was[br]covered over with

0:50:35.801,0:50:38.211
a crudely drawn cowboy[br]on horseback.

0:50:38.211,0:50:40.494
I took it up to the house[br]and I told Shirley,

0:50:40.494,0:50:44.692
"We have something under this,[br]and I think it might be Uccello."

0:50:44.692,0:50:47.201
So I cleaned it[br]with turpentine,

0:50:47.201,0:50:53.300
because I saw that the painting underneath[br]was in egg tempera,

0:50:53.300,0:50:56.682
and this extraordinary[br]figure emerged.

0:50:56.682,0:50:59.082
Maybe 10 years later,[br]I was looking at a book

0:50:59.082,0:51:03.322
of Jacopo Bellini's[br]and I found the exact drawing.

0:51:03.322,0:51:09.272
Whether it's Bellini or not is arguable,[br]but we like to think it is.

0:51:09.272,0:51:11.142
[♪]

0:51:11.142,0:51:13.462
[Shirley] Of all of the things[br]that we've collected,

0:51:13.462,0:51:17.284
the African has lasted[br]longer and deeper.

0:51:17.284,0:51:20.304
[♪]

0:51:20.304,0:51:25.384
[Glaser] In African culture,[br]the word for "good"

0:51:25.384,0:51:30.993
and the word for "beautiful"[br]are identical, which is--

0:51:30.993,0:51:35.223
that link to the notion[br]of beauty and good,

0:51:35.223,0:51:37.183
which we sort of[br]skirt about,

0:51:37.183,0:51:40.183
is actually explicit[br]in African culture.

0:51:41.563,0:51:44.954
[Shirley] One of my friends said[br]that it made her very uncomfortable,

0:51:44.954,0:51:47.332
having all these[br]stare at her.

0:51:47.332,0:51:50.025
They don't make me[br]uncomfortable at all.

0:51:51.215,0:51:52.534
They're my friends.

0:51:52.534,0:51:56.475
[Glaser] When we come home,[br]we feel as though we're at a party.

0:51:58.655,0:52:01.855
I've done any number of children's books[br]with my wife Shirley

0:52:01.855,0:52:06.006
and that's always been[br]an interesting back-and-forth process.

0:52:06.006,0:52:07.500
At the end,[br]I always felt

0:52:07.500,0:52:12.336
that the conversation made for a[br]much better product

0:52:12.336,0:52:16.806
than I could have done[br]with a more compliant partner.

0:52:17.516,0:52:19.204
The first year[br]we were married,

0:52:19.204,0:52:23.745
we started working on a children's book[br]called <i>If Apples Had Teeth.</i>

0:52:23.745,0:52:26.347
We enjoyed[br]that experience so much

0:52:26.347,0:52:29.216
that 40 years later,[br]we did another one.

0:52:29.216,0:52:31.386
[both laughing]

0:52:31.386,0:52:34.846
At any rate,[br]that was <i>The Alphazeds.</i>

0:52:43.136,0:52:45.154
We helped in the[br]color palette;

0:52:45.154,0:52:49.199
we designed the basic logo[br]in all their communications;

0:52:49.199,0:52:51.298
we designed[br]the landings.

0:52:55.188,0:53:01.245
Oh, this is a wall made of steel[br]but gilded in copper,

0:53:01.245,0:53:04.368
and it reflects all the light coming in[br]through the windows,

0:53:04.368,0:53:07.827
and then at night,[br]has very different characteristics.

0:53:07.827,0:53:12.108
It's basically based on the[br]Tibetan cloud drawings that I discovered,

0:53:12.108,0:53:17.779
and then rolled so that the forms[br]would open up all along the way.

0:53:17.779,0:53:20.878
We had no idea what it was[br]gonna look like until it was installed.

0:53:21.798,0:53:23.780
That's a very[br]different character.

0:53:23.780,0:53:26.170
Woman: Very beautiful.[br]Very mysterious.

0:53:26.170,0:53:27.450
Glaser: That's right.

0:53:28.580,0:53:29.839
This opportunity[br]was great

0:53:29.839,0:53:35.536
to actually learn more about Tibet,[br]particularly in the Himalayas.

0:53:35.536,0:53:38.897
I mean, my interest[br]has always been

0:53:38.897,0:53:42.809
not about the differences in art,[br]but their commonalities,

0:53:42.809,0:53:45.844
and what you find is,[br]whatever you've learned

0:53:45.844,0:53:48.349
goes into the[br]next project.

0:53:48.349,0:53:52.535
So I don't look at these so much[br]as being separate things

0:53:52.535,0:53:55.505
but rather as[br]a kind of continuum.

0:53:56.965,0:54:02.681
I've always had an interest,[br]at least, as most people do,

0:54:02.681,0:54:06.759
in what is called[br]a spiritual side of life.

0:54:06.759,0:54:10.441
I mean, that intersection[br]between religion and belief,

0:54:10.441,0:54:15.982
and making art,[br]and a sense of community,

0:54:15.982,0:54:18.722
and all those things[br]that are involved,

0:54:19.652,0:54:23.042
a departure from[br]the material world.

0:54:23.042,0:54:29.133
All of that has shaped[br]the kind of interest,

0:54:29.133,0:54:33.182
um, even though it hasn't[br]coalesced into hard belief.

0:54:33.912,0:54:36.233
I think you have to[br]hold your beliefs lightly.

0:54:37.243,0:54:39.601
Lang: Unexpected pleasure.

0:54:39.601,0:54:41.521
Glaser: Peter,[br]you know George Lang.

0:54:41.521,0:54:42.334
Lang: I do.

0:54:42.334,0:54:48.625
About, uh, 1990 or so,[br]my friend and partner, Ronald Lauder,

0:54:48.625,0:54:53.454
decided to buy something[br]extraordinary in Budapest,

0:54:53.454,0:54:57.825
this incredible restaurant complex[br]called Gundel.

0:54:57.825,0:55:01.625
And the first thing was, you know,[br]what's going to be the logo?

0:55:01.625,0:55:05.184
And of course, the first thought[br]I had was Milton.

0:55:05.184,0:55:08.874
And I found a letter[br]and the menu

0:55:08.874,0:55:14.036
and a couple of other things[br]from the beginning of the century

0:55:14.036,0:55:17.435
and it had[br]a elephant on it.

0:55:17.435,0:55:22.485
And Milton, about two weeks later,[br]made a presentation.

0:55:22.485,0:55:25.205
[♪]

0:55:25.205,0:55:29.631
Amazingly, Milton,[br]without knowing anything about it,

0:55:29.631,0:55:33.088
came up with the same logo[br]which was there 100 years ago.

0:55:33.088,0:55:39.018
[♪]

0:55:39.021,0:55:41.105
Milton has two things.

0:55:41.875,0:55:49.005
He's able to put together[br]the technical equipment

0:55:49.005,0:55:51.685
of creating things,[br]actually making it,

0:55:51.685,0:55:54.197
knowing what you[br]have to worry about,

0:55:54.197,0:56:01.126
and something else, spirit,[br]which comes from heaven knows where.

0:56:01.126,0:56:04.346
[♪ dramatic orchestra finale ♪]

0:56:04.346,0:56:06.116
[Vanden Heuvel] When[br]you're sitting with Milton,

0:56:06.116,0:56:09.797
you have one of the[br]graphic geniuses of,

0:56:09.797,0:56:12.438
not only the United States,[br]but of the world in my view.

0:56:12.438,0:56:16.107
So I have to admit that in those[br]first few meetings many years ago--

0:56:16.107,0:56:22.218
I mean, I've been working closely[br]with Milton since '85.

0:56:22.218,0:56:26.046
He's intimidating.[br]He can be intimidating because

0:56:26.046,0:56:30.188
it's the breath of an intellect,[br]allied with a vision.

0:56:30.188,0:56:34.782
And so in those first few meetings,[br]was I a partner in that?

0:56:34.782,0:56:35.723
Probably not.

0:56:35.723,0:56:39.873
I was more a disciple and a student,[br]and one remains that,

0:56:39.873,0:56:41.584
but what becomes[br]clear with Milton

0:56:41.584,0:56:46.335
is that there is a sweetness there,[br]and there is a humanity,

0:56:46.335,0:56:51.249
and there is a spirit[br]of wanting to be of help

0:56:51.249,0:56:54.519
in bringing your ideas[br]and your message

0:56:54.519,0:56:57.839
with more power[br]to a broader audience.

0:56:57.839,0:57:03.033
So it kind of melts away[br]the fear factor,

0:57:03.033,0:57:06.248
which is something that Milton's[br]always working against anyway.

0:57:06.248,0:57:10.920
He and I've had long talks[br]about the importance of fighting fear,

0:57:10.920,0:57:12.780
which is so prevalent[br]in these times.

0:57:13.780,0:57:15.851
He has a great sense[br]of the nation's history

0:57:15.851,0:57:18.851
and its place[br]in our culture and politics,

0:57:18.851,0:57:21.241
and so he has that[br]in the back of his mind

0:57:21.241,0:57:25.370
that the redesign[br]be in sync with that spirit.

0:57:25.370,0:57:27.571
And I think[br]the great designers

0:57:27.571,0:57:30.500
have that sense of[br]continuity and change,

0:57:30.500,0:57:33.201
and Milton has that as[br]an abiding vision.

0:57:33.201,0:57:38.111
He's so articulate,[br]so there's a great kind of dynamism

0:57:38.111,0:57:41.231
between the visual product[br]he'll show you

0:57:41.231,0:57:43.121
and as[br]he explains it.

0:57:43.121,0:57:44.797
And those meetings[br]are wonderful.

0:57:44.797,0:57:48.382
Occasionally, he'll email a note,[br]which is also great to get,

0:57:48.382,0:57:54.732
but to hear him[br]explain the vision is priceless.

0:57:54.732,0:57:56.262
[chuckling]

0:57:56.262,0:57:59.802
[Bernard] For a while now, he's wanted[br]to work with people that he likes.

0:57:59.802,0:58:03.132
He's always had that feeling, but--[br]but I think, at times,

0:58:03.132,0:58:06.073
he did things that,[br]you know, were necessary.

0:58:06.073,0:58:08.302
Glaser: When I was younger,[br]I could do anything.

0:58:08.302,0:58:12.063
Peter: Yeah, you told me this was[br]an evolving problem and an evolving--

0:58:12.074,0:58:16.022
[Glaser] I could do anything.[br]I could make a fruit pie outta shit.

0:58:16.022,0:58:18.224
I mean, there was nothing[br]I wouldn't--

0:58:18.224,0:58:21.183
Because I felt, geez,[br]I can learn something doing this.

0:58:21.183,0:58:24.721
Now, I realize,[br]I can do very little with anyone

0:58:24.721,0:58:27.184
where I don't[br]feel sympathetic.

0:58:27.830,0:58:29.625
[Glaser] There were two guys[br]who came to see me

0:58:29.625,0:58:32.430
about 15 years ago,[br]Tom Potter and Steve Hindy.

0:58:32.430,0:58:34.701
It was a time at the beginning[br]of the microbreweries,

0:58:34.701,0:58:36.780
and they wanted to call it[br]the Brooklyn Eagle Beer,

0:58:36.780,0:58:38.491
and I said,[br]"The first thing I can tell you

0:58:38.491,0:58:42.233
"is since you can basically own[br]the entire burrow, call it Brooklyn.

0:58:42.233,0:58:45.983
"You have an extraordinary[br]resonance and history."

0:58:45.983,0:58:48.783
[Hindy] I had a very difficult time[br]meeting this guy.

0:58:48.783,0:58:54.588
The first time I called his office,[br]his secretary, Eva,

0:58:54.588,0:58:58.554
basically told me to get lost.[br]She said, uh--

0:58:58.554,0:58:59.823
[Glaser] Can't believe[br]this story.

0:58:59.823,0:59:01.393
[Hindy] "Do you[br]know who Milton is?"

0:59:01.393,0:59:03.236
And I said, "Yeah,[br]I hear he's pretty good.

0:59:03.236,0:59:04.593
"I'd like to talk to him."

0:59:04.593,0:59:05.443
And she said,[br]"Wait,

0:59:05.443,0:59:07.833
"he doesn't just talk to[br]anyone who calls here."

0:59:07.833,0:59:08.929
Uh, and so--

0:59:08.929,0:59:11.975
Glaser: Well, we did get a lot of[br]crank calls during that period, I mean.

0:59:11.975,0:59:14.741
[Hindy] It, uh, sort of[br]spurred me on,

0:59:14.741,0:59:18.876
so I started calling there every day[br]and badgering Eva.

0:59:18.876,0:59:20.646
One day [br]she said to me,

0:59:20.646,0:59:22.184
"You're not gonna give up,[br]are you?"

0:59:22.184,0:59:24.526
And I said, "No, I want to[br]talk to Milton Glaser."

0:59:24.526,0:59:27.596
She said, "Okay, here he is."[br]Put him on the phone.

0:59:27.596,0:59:31.025
So I kinda blurted out my idea[br]about starting a Brooklyn Brewery,

0:59:31.025,0:59:34.016
and Milton said,[br]"Wow, that sounds like fun.

0:59:34.016,0:59:36.016
"Why don't you come in?[br]We'll talk."

0:59:36.016,0:59:37.346
[chuckling]

0:59:37.346,0:59:39.689
[Glaser] Amusing story.

0:59:39.689,0:59:44.625
And also why I don't seem to[br]get as much work as I'd like.

0:59:44.625,0:59:46.415
[both chuckling]

0:59:47.275,0:59:48.705
Glaser: Well,[br]I have to admit,

0:59:48.705,0:59:50.555
I've been at so many[br]startups that have failed,

0:59:50.555,0:59:53.285
I had no idea[br]we would get this far.

0:59:53.285,0:59:54.317
Hindy: Yeah.

0:59:54.317,0:59:56.496
Glaser: And the company[br]is in such wonderful shape.

0:59:56.496,0:59:58.546
Hindy: And now we're looking[br]to build a brewery, uh,

0:59:58.546,0:59:59.756
twice as big[br]as this.

0:59:59.756,1:00:00.637
Glaser:[br]That's fantastic.

1:00:00.637,1:00:02.127
[Hindy][br]Be the next step.

1:00:02.127,1:00:04.936
[Glaser] This was a first:[br]a bottle that people think

1:00:04.936,1:00:07.270
is a reference[br]to the Brooklyn Dodgers,

1:00:07.270,1:00:11.318
but there was no letter form[br]that looked this way.

1:00:11.318,1:00:13.958
They just had the words[br]"Brooklyn Dodgers" in normal type.

1:00:13.958,1:00:15.797
However, people[br]are so convinced

1:00:15.797,1:00:18.656
that it has some reference[br]to the uniform

1:00:18.656,1:00:21.668
that the association[br]is convincing.

1:00:22.628,1:00:24.098
Hindy: I think[br]it's time for a beer.

1:00:24.098,1:00:26.238
Glaser: Ah,[br]that's a good idea.

1:00:26.238,1:00:28.159
[chuckling]

1:00:28.429,1:00:31.518
[Glaser] What we like--[br]what <i>I</i> like--

1:00:31.518,1:00:36.118
is basically working on[br]all levels of the culture

1:00:36.118,1:00:38.389
from the high[br]to the low

1:00:38.389,1:00:40.339
because the idea[br]behind all of that

1:00:40.339,1:00:42.329
is that[br]whatever the level is,

1:00:42.329,1:00:45.045
excellence can always exist[br]on that level.

1:00:45.545,1:00:49.055
So, a good ham[br]and cheese sandwich

1:00:49.055,1:00:51.859
is really every bit as good[br]as a crème brûlée.

1:00:52.019,1:00:53.769
In fact, it's better[br]than a crème brûlée,

1:00:53.769,1:00:57.209
but each form[br]requires its own level

1:00:57.209,1:00:58.889
of intelligence[br]and passion.

1:00:58.889,1:01:05.369
[♪]

1:01:07.489,1:01:12.237
[Glaser] The idea was[br]to do a mural above this entryway,

1:01:12.237,1:01:15.310
and I saw that the lights[br]that they had chosen

1:01:15.960,1:01:18.270
create this[br]series of arches.

1:01:18.270,1:01:22.988
Any mural you put up there would,[br]in effect, be destroyed by the lights,

1:01:22.988,1:01:28.075
so I used that arch thematically[br]so that would look as though

1:01:28.075,1:01:30.383
you had actually[br]planned on it.

1:01:30.383,1:01:36.100
The race starts slowly,[br]but the designs on these wheels

1:01:36.100,1:01:40.649
were based on an idea[br]that Marcel Duchamp had.

1:01:40.649,1:01:42.698
He made these[br]rotoscopes.

1:01:42.698,1:01:45.421
If you look at them,[br]the objects and the forms

1:01:45.421,1:01:48.621
seem to be moving independently[br]of one another,

1:01:48.621,1:01:56.222
and as they accelerate,[br]they sort of change their meaning.

1:02:02.242,1:02:05.993
[Kenny] what happens in the end[br]is that the people,

1:02:05.993,1:02:08.493
the faculty, the staff,[br]the students,

1:02:08.493,1:02:13.710
are profoundly, profoundly affected[br]by what happens in the design.

1:02:13.710,1:02:17.362
In the end, the most important audience,[br]I think, is internal.

1:02:17.362,1:02:19.924
The way they feel[br]about the place

1:02:19.924,1:02:23.004
makes a difference[br]in their learning experience.

1:02:24.924,1:02:26.854
This September,[br]Stony Brook

1:02:26.854,1:02:32.584
will take over Southampton Campus[br]from Long Island University.

1:02:32.584,1:02:38.054
[Glaser] So, we're thinking of creating[br]a kind of austere, sustainable place,

1:02:38.054,1:02:43.426
but it's some combination of[br]the WPA, the Peace Corps, the Kibbutz.

1:02:43.426,1:02:46.585
Well, here are some of the signs[br]we're playing with for the new campus,

1:02:46.585,1:02:49.658
and we introduce this idea[br]of a little wind power,

1:02:49.658,1:02:52.481
the whirligig,[br]to get the idea

1:02:52.481,1:02:55.611
that we're concerned about[br]sustainable energy.

1:02:55.611,1:02:57.098
[Kenny] It happens[br]you and I've

1:02:57.098,1:03:02.120
been talking forever[br]about ecological sustainability

1:03:02.120,1:03:05.359
and how we get over[br]to this generation of students.

1:03:05.359,1:03:07.316
It has to be not just[br]what they get in class

1:03:07.316,1:03:10.452
but the way their[br]entire experience happens.

1:03:10.452,1:03:15.768
And that's why your thinking about it[br]is shaping of what we're doing.

1:03:15.768,1:03:20.560
You're not just about pictures;[br]you're not just about designs.

1:03:20.560,1:03:23.361
You're about ideas;[br]you're about words.

1:03:23.361,1:03:25.511
[Glaser] We need that[br]in the world these days.

1:03:25.511,1:03:31.101
We need a more generous view[br]of what life and education is about.

1:03:31.101,1:03:34.572
People are so anxious to sacrifice[br]for what they believe in now

1:03:34.572,1:03:37.127
that it's the right moment[br]for this sort of thing.

1:03:37.127,1:03:40.832
But potentially at least,[br]it could be the biggest,

1:03:40.832,1:03:42.661
in terms of[br]its impact,

1:03:42.661,1:03:45.010
meaning the biggest thing[br]that I've ever worked on.

1:03:49.490,1:03:52.283
We are in a show at[br]the School of Visual Arts

1:03:52.283,1:03:55.381
that is based on a book[br]I did with Mirko Ilic

1:03:55.381,1:03:57.790
called[br]<i>The Design of Dissent.</i>

1:03:58.840,1:04:00.133
More than[br]anything else,

1:04:00.133,1:04:02.662
what you feel is the[br]energy of commitment.

1:04:02.662,1:04:05.602
People really care about[br]things that are in the air.

1:04:05.602,1:04:09.873
It's so different from the persuasion[br]of most advertising that you see

1:04:09.873,1:04:12.038
that, uh,[br]it's refreshing.

1:04:12.718,1:04:15.123
In New York,[br]the design profession

1:04:15.123,1:04:18.589
is mostly used by[br]commercial purposes.

1:04:18.589,1:04:20.224
That's what pays it.

1:04:20.224,1:04:22.421
There is art[br]you do free

1:04:22.421,1:04:25.401
and there is design[br]you do for money.

1:04:25.401,1:04:27.725
He has come to[br]the conclusion

1:04:27.725,1:04:31.064
that essentially the job[br]of advertising is to lie.

1:04:31.064,1:04:36.738
[Glaser] The saddest thing is that,[br]when people experience television

1:04:36.738,1:04:39.009
and know that[br]it's lying--

1:04:39.009,1:04:42.822
let's just say, or misrepresenting[br]the advertising that you see--

1:04:42.822,1:04:44.952
they'll still go out[br]and buy the product.

1:04:44.952,1:04:49.425
And I think this has[br]a real correlation between

1:04:49.425,1:04:52.085
what has happened[br]in American politics.

1:04:52.755,1:04:58.932
A couple weeks ago, I had a roll[br]of vinyl bags in my closet

1:04:58.932,1:05:02.934
that someone had bought for us[br]at a dollar store.

1:05:03.694,1:05:08.895
And it was extremely[br]cheap plastic,

1:05:08.895,1:05:12.707
so that when you pulled it[br]out of the box, it tore,

1:05:12.707,1:05:15.566
and you could just puncture it[br]with your hand.

1:05:16.216,1:05:19.390
I said, "These are the worst,[br]stupid, flimsiest thing!"

1:05:20.030,1:05:24.040
And I saw that the name of it was[br]Super Tough Vinyl Bags.

1:05:24.040,1:05:26.529
[audience laughing]

1:05:26.529,1:05:27.779
Just like [indistinct].

1:05:27.779,1:05:29.706
[audience laughing]

1:05:29.706,1:05:32.926
One thing we have learned[br]is that all you have to do

1:05:32.926,1:05:35.396
is repeat it[br]often enough, right?

1:05:35.396,1:05:37.116
I know when I was growing up[br]in the Bronx--

1:05:37.116,1:05:39.327
I was born in 1929,[br]and I grew up in

1:05:39.327,1:05:42.007
what was basically[br]a left-wing neighborhood in the Bronx.

1:05:42.007,1:05:44.067
It was called Little Moscow[br]at the time.

1:05:44.067,1:05:45.097
[audience chuckling]

1:05:45.097,1:05:48.477
[insdistinct], which was basically[br]a kind of socialist enclave,

1:05:48.477,1:05:50.536
by people who'd[br]come from Europe

1:05:50.536,1:05:54.301
and who were convinced[br]that they could invent a better life.

1:05:54.301,1:05:57.618
And everybody was a political activist[br]because that's what you did.

1:05:57.618,1:05:59.001
You woke up[br]in the morning,

1:05:59.001,1:06:00.828
and you went out[br]and you distributed leaflets.

1:06:00.828,1:06:02.623
That was just normal.

1:06:02.623,1:06:04.380
[audience laughing]

1:06:04.380,1:06:14.002
The accomplishment of the '60s[br]made us so full of naïve enthusiasm

1:06:14.002,1:06:16.630
about the fact that[br]love could conquer all

1:06:16.630,1:06:20.002
and that all[br]you had to do is love,

1:06:20.002,1:06:23.940
and the[br]Civil Rights Movement

1:06:23.940,1:06:25.230
and the[br]Anti-War Movement,

1:06:25.230,1:06:31.605
and all these assertions of the young[br]saying it's all possible

1:06:32.925,1:06:37.460
was an extraordinary[br]moment in time.

1:06:37.460,1:06:41.799
And here we are[br]at a moment in time

1:06:41.799,1:06:45.545
where all of that view[br]has been swept away.

1:06:46.305,1:06:48.479
The triumph,[br]I would say,

1:06:48.479,1:06:55.933
of a dark vision of meanness,[br]of stupidity, of arrogance.

1:06:56.693,1:07:00.165
That seems to be so pervasive[br]all over the world, not only--

1:07:01.215,1:07:02.630
not only in[br]Washington.

1:07:03.650,1:07:08.482
But you realize things change,[br]and not necessarily for the better.

1:07:09.002,1:07:13.141
Then it's simply a condition[br]that you have to play your part,

1:07:13.141,1:07:16.342
and your part is to be[br]on this side of the line.

1:07:16.782,1:07:18.932
I mean,[br]that's my view of it.

1:07:18.932,1:07:21.912
[Bernard] Milton is now[br]starting projects

1:07:21.912,1:07:23.472
and he'll take them[br]to someone

1:07:23.472,1:07:25.693
the way he did[br]buttons for the nation.

1:07:25.693,1:07:27.403
The nation didn't[br]commission buttons.

1:07:27.403,1:07:30.373
Milton said,[br]"You've gotta start doing this."

1:07:30.373,1:07:32.103
[Vanden Heuvel] What he[br]has done beyond,

1:07:32.103,1:07:33.855
above and beyond[br]the pro bono

1:07:34.805,1:07:36.513
work with the design[br]of the magazine

1:07:36.513,1:07:38.844
is in these last years[br]he's had these great ideas,

1:07:38.844,1:07:41.473
and he comes--[br]came to us with this button series.

1:07:41.473,1:07:44.636
He will send them, you know,[br]in the middle of the night or--

1:07:44.636,1:07:46.904
and they're so much a part of[br]what he's thinking about.

1:07:47.504,1:07:48.715
Facts not fear.

1:07:48.715,1:07:51.015
That is so much part of[br]what Milton believes:

1:07:51.015,1:07:53.635
the danger of a kind of[br]Messianic belief system--

1:07:53.635,1:07:56.636
much more important[br]to inform and enlighten.

1:07:56.636,1:07:58.396
So, Milton has sent us[br]a slew of buttons

1:07:58.396,1:07:59.524
over these[br]last few years

1:07:59.524,1:08:02.385
which we publish in the magazine[br]and our readers devour,

1:08:02.385,1:08:05.037
and we take them to student conferences[br]and students love them,

1:08:05.037,1:08:07.073
and it's always wonderful[br]to see people wearing them--

1:08:07.073,1:08:10.635
not just <i>Nation</i> readers,[br]but they move around.

1:08:10.635,1:08:12.583
[Bernard] If you look at[br]any of his recent work,

1:08:12.583,1:08:15.409
he's increasingly thinking[br]about world issues

1:08:15.409,1:08:18.093
and wants to[br]design in a way

1:08:18.093,1:08:20.337
that can help the causes[br]that he's interested in.

1:08:20.337,1:08:22.906
[Heller] What he brings[br]to this conversation

1:08:22.906,1:08:25.506
is more than idealism;[br]it's true eloquence.

1:08:25.506,1:08:27.656
It's more than a[br]doctrinaire philosophy;

1:08:27.656,1:08:29.437
it's a humanist[br]philosophy.

1:08:29.437,1:08:31.837
And after all these years[br]of practicing,

1:08:31.837,1:08:34.837
of seeing design[br]go up and down,

1:08:34.837,1:08:39.181
graphic design go up and down[br]as a practice of importance,

1:08:39.181,1:08:43.936
he wants to imbue it[br]with a sense of a real gravitas.

1:08:44.976,1:08:46.697
[Glaser] Starting four or[br]five years ago,

1:08:46.697,1:08:50.868
I realized I didn't have[br]the right to be indifferent

1:08:50.868,1:08:53.506
or to ignore[br]what was going on.

1:08:53.506,1:08:58.407
And since I have some talent[br]for communicating ideas,

1:08:58.407,1:09:00.876
I thought I might[br]use that talent

1:09:00.876,1:09:04.577
or else feel like a real jerk[br]for the rest of my life.

1:09:06.127,1:09:09.049
[Tabibian] Milton, he's got[br]qualities and characteristics

1:09:09.049,1:09:11.878
that are both great[br]and contradictory.

1:09:12.648,1:09:16.125
He and his wife lead[br]a perfectly private life.

1:09:16.125,1:09:17.125
[Glaser] How are ya?

1:09:17.125,1:09:19.256
[♪]

1:09:19.256,1:09:21.669
[Tabibian] He has a house[br]in Woodstock, New York.

1:09:21.669,1:09:26.287
He reproduced[br]Claude Monet's studio.

1:09:26.287,1:09:29.230
So he's very, very private[br]in his personal life,

1:09:29.230,1:09:32.445
but he's the most[br]public man in New York.

1:09:32.445,1:09:34.556
But public[br]for the public good.

1:09:34.556,1:09:36.477
[Glaser][br]It isn't possible for me

1:09:36.477,1:09:39.621
to separate my work[br]from my life in general,

1:09:39.621,1:09:42.721
and certainly not my life[br]from this city.

1:09:42.721,1:09:47.479
Here you have these[br]extraordinary strands of differences,

1:09:47.479,1:09:54.186
existing simultaneously and,[br]in some curious way, advantageously.

1:09:54.186,1:09:57.057
So it's all of the people[br]who live here.

1:09:57.057,1:09:58.999
There really is[br]nothing like it.

1:09:58.999,1:10:03.572
I mean, it does-- New York does the job[br]that America's supposed to do.

1:10:03.572,1:10:08.200
It really takes everybody[br]and not only accepts them

1:10:08.200,1:10:11.671
but responds to them,[br]and that's a big deal.

1:10:11.671,1:10:14.047
I mean, if you come to New York[br]from another place,

1:10:14.047,1:10:17.387
nobody forces you[br]to become a New Yorker

1:10:17.387,1:10:21.630
in terms of an attitude[br]or a spirit.

1:10:21.630,1:10:25.002
It-- the city is[br]enormously accommodating.

1:10:25.002,1:10:28.041
Not to mention[br]the extraordinary gift

1:10:28.041,1:10:30.491
that the city gives you[br]of education.

1:10:30.491,1:10:34.222
This is the best town in the world[br]to be educated.

1:10:34.222,1:10:37.302
The number of schools,[br]the amount of free events,

1:10:37.882,1:10:40.638
lectures,[br]classes--

1:10:40.638,1:10:43.653
I mean,[br]no place on earth!

1:10:43.653,1:10:46.874
You can study anything[br]that you want,

1:10:46.874,1:10:49.654
any time,[br]anywhere in this city.

1:10:49.654,1:10:53.392
All of these opportunities--[br]being able to go to the Metropolitan,

1:10:53.392,1:10:55.974
being able to study at[br]the Art Students League,

1:10:55.974,1:10:58.522
being able to go to[br]a superb high school

1:10:58.522,1:11:00.272
like the High School[br]of Music & Art--

1:11:00.832,1:11:05.443
all of that sort of contributed[br]to my well-being,

1:11:05.443,1:11:08.645
to my understanding,[br]to my history, to my passion.

1:11:08.645,1:11:10.542
It's not possible.

1:11:10.542,1:11:14.746
It would not have been possible for me[br]to have been what I am

1:11:14.746,1:11:17.588
and to have done what I've done[br]any place else on earth.

1:11:18.628,1:11:21.935
This is the town[br]that made it possible.

1:11:21.942,1:11:28.342
[♪]