0:00:00.000,0:00:03.083 (melodic jazz music) 0:00:05.810,0:00:08.140 - [Steven] We're in the Vatican Museums 0:00:08.140,0:00:10.560 looking at one of the most famous works 0:00:10.560,0:00:12.430 in the entire Western tradition. 0:00:12.430,0:00:14.930 This is a sculpture known[br]as the "Apoxyomenos," 0:00:14.930,0:00:15.763 the "Scraper." 0:00:15.763,0:00:17.960 - [Beth] By a very famous[br]ancient Greek sculptor 0:00:17.960,0:00:20.100 named Lysippos, we're actually looking 0:00:20.100,0:00:21.766 at an ancient Roman copy. 0:00:21.766,0:00:23.420 - [Steven] So what we're[br]gonna try to answer 0:00:23.420,0:00:25.480 in this video is how a major sculpture 0:00:25.480,0:00:28.970 by a famous ancient Greek[br]ended up as a Roman copy 0:00:28.970,0:00:32.100 in the Vatican in the[br]city of Rome in the third, 0:00:32.100,0:00:34.430 the second and even the[br]first centuries, BCE. 0:00:34.430,0:00:37.300 The Romans not only conquered Greece, 0:00:37.300,0:00:39.660 but also its many territories and colonies 0:00:39.660,0:00:42.170 and triumphant Roman generals 0:00:42.170,0:00:45.301 brought back enormous[br]numbers of Greek sculptures 0:00:45.301,0:00:48.260 and to a lesser extent,[br]ancient Greek paintings 0:00:48.260,0:00:49.765 and even architectural fragments. 0:00:49.765,0:00:52.020 - [Beth] Now the Romans were not unique 0:00:52.020,0:00:54.334 in making off with booty during war, 0:00:54.334,0:00:57.200 there was an age old precedent for that, 0:00:57.200,0:01:00.019 but when the Romans confronted Greek art 0:01:00.019,0:01:02.200 and brought it back to Rome, 0:01:02.200,0:01:05.410 that was a transformational experience. 0:01:05.410,0:01:07.600 In fact, Horace wrote 0:01:07.600,0:01:10.830 that although the Romans[br]had conquered Greece, 0:01:10.830,0:01:13.625 Greece through its culture conquered Rome, 0:01:13.625,0:01:17.130 - [Steven] It symbolized a[br]great intellectual tradition, 0:01:17.130,0:01:20.410 that Rome saw itself as[br]becoming the inheritor of. 0:01:20.410,0:01:23.720 - [Beth] It signified a kind of luxury, 0:01:23.720,0:01:27.448 a life of educated cultural refinement, 0:01:27.448,0:01:29.870 that seemed very different 0:01:29.870,0:01:32.161 than the current life of ancient Romans. 0:01:32.161,0:01:35.010 - [Steven] So let's just walk[br]through how this would work. 0:01:35.010,0:01:38.240 Rome would conquer an area,[br]perhaps a Greek city state, 0:01:38.240,0:01:41.750 or perhaps simply an area that[br]had been allied with Greece 0:01:41.750,0:01:44.541 and soon after objects that[br]were deemed worthy of import 0:01:44.541,0:01:47.367 would be packed onto ships[br]and brought back to Rome, 0:01:47.367,0:01:50.800 where they would often be[br]paraded through the city 0:01:50.800,0:01:51.633 during a triumph. 0:01:51.633,0:01:53.989 - [Beth] A triumph was[br]essentially an opportunity 0:01:53.989,0:01:57.300 for a victorious general[br]to exhibit the booty 0:01:57.300,0:01:58.630 that they had brought back 0:01:58.630,0:02:00.669 and to celebrate their military victory 0:02:00.669,0:02:02.990 and it would have given the agent Romans, 0:02:02.990,0:02:04.550 who lived here in Rome 0:02:04.550,0:02:07.240 and hadn't traveled to[br]these distant places, 0:02:07.240,0:02:11.167 a sense of the wealth and[br]power of these places, 0:02:11.167,0:02:14.260 that were being conquered[br]by the great Roman army. 0:02:14.260,0:02:16.720 - [Steven] And then after the triumph, 0:02:16.720,0:02:20.360 an enormous number of objects[br]would be put on public display 0:02:20.360,0:02:21.820 in various parts of the city, 0:02:21.820,0:02:24.240 but most famously in the Temple of Peace, 0:02:24.240,0:02:26.242 just beside the Roman Forum. 0:02:26.242,0:02:28.680 Now ancient Rome didn't have museums, 0:02:28.680,0:02:31.670 but in a way places[br]like the Temple of Peace 0:02:31.670,0:02:33.760 become a kind of proto-museum. 0:02:33.760,0:02:36.480 So many of these Greek objects[br]had been used originally 0:02:36.480,0:02:38.567 in religious or civic environments, 0:02:38.567,0:02:41.640 but the Romans ripped them[br]out of their original context 0:02:41.640,0:02:43.860 and made them aesthetic objects, 0:02:43.860,0:02:45.233 made them objects of luxury. 0:02:45.233,0:02:46.975 - [Beth] When objects are looted, 0:02:46.975,0:02:49.320 whether we're talking[br]about the ancient world 0:02:49.320,0:02:52.562 or the modern world, they often[br]lose that original meaning. 0:02:52.562,0:02:55.880 - [Steven] And the "Apoxyomenos"[br]is a perfect case in point, 0:02:55.880,0:02:58.290 we don't have its original location, 0:02:58.290,0:03:00.860 we don't know from literature[br]or from any evidence, 0:03:00.860,0:03:02.889 where this originally[br]would have been placed, 0:03:02.889,0:03:04.917 the Romans took it and now it's here. 0:03:04.917,0:03:06.340 - [Beth] But let's be careful, 0:03:06.340,0:03:08.090 when we say the Romans took it, 0:03:08.090,0:03:10.309 the Romans took the bronze original 0:03:10.309,0:03:13.470 and because of this[br]developing love of Greek art, 0:03:13.470,0:03:15.780 ultimately many copies were made of it, 0:03:15.780,0:03:19.070 one of the most beautiful is[br]here in the Vatican Museums. 0:03:19.070,0:03:22.860 So the "Apoxyomenos" is[br]brought to the city of Rome 0:03:22.860,0:03:27.470 as war booty and it's set up by Agrippa 0:03:27.470,0:03:30.610 in front of the baths that he built 0:03:30.610,0:03:31.828 for the public here in Rome. 0:03:31.828,0:03:33.710 - [Steven] And it was[br]in the Baths of Agrippa, 0:03:33.710,0:03:36.058 that the Roman public really fell in love 0:03:36.058,0:03:37.310 with this sculpture. 0:03:37.310,0:03:39.323 The baths were essentially a public place 0:03:39.323,0:03:41.100 and a place where the average Roman 0:03:41.100,0:03:42.797 could see ancient Greek sculpture. 0:03:42.797,0:03:46.910 - [Beth] So what Agrippa did[br]was considered to be generous, 0:03:46.910,0:03:48.950 he was giving this to the people 0:03:48.950,0:03:51.750 the way that a private collector today 0:03:51.750,0:03:53.740 might donate a work to a museum, 0:03:53.740,0:03:54.999 so it could be shared with the public. 0:03:54.999,0:03:58.364 - [Steven] So you can imagine[br]how upset that public was, 0:03:58.364,0:04:01.500 when the emperor Tiberius[br]took the sculpture 0:04:01.500,0:04:05.030 from the Baths of Agrippa and[br]brought it to his own house, 0:04:05.030,0:04:07.215 put it in his own bed chambers. 0:04:07.215,0:04:11.570 - [Beth] Pliny says Lysippos[br]was most prolific in his works 0:04:11.570,0:04:14.610 and made more statues[br]than any other artist. 0:04:14.610,0:04:18.150 Among these is the man[br]using the body scraper, 0:04:18.150,0:04:22.210 which Marcus Agrippa had erected[br]in front of his warm baths 0:04:22.210,0:04:25.860 and which wonderfully[br]pleased the emperor Tiberius. 0:04:25.860,0:04:29.330 This emperor could not[br]resist the temptation 0:04:29.330,0:04:33.100 and had this statue[br]removed to his bed chamber, 0:04:33.100,0:04:36.740 having substituted another[br]for it at the baths. 0:04:36.740,0:04:40.840 The people however were so[br]resolutely opposed to this, 0:04:40.840,0:04:43.920 that at the theater,[br]they clamorously demanded 0:04:43.920,0:04:46.570 the "Apoxyomenos" to be replaced 0:04:46.570,0:04:49.407 and the emperor not withstanding[br]his attachment to it 0:04:49.407,0:04:51.199 was obliged to restore it. 0:04:51.199,0:04:53.918 - [Steven] So the court of[br]public opinion was so loud, 0:04:53.918,0:04:56.610 that the emperor actually[br]gave it back to the people, 0:04:56.610,0:04:59.180 it speaks to the power of images, 0:04:59.180,0:05:01.710 in a way the sculpture became a way 0:05:01.710,0:05:04.593 of differentiating public[br]good from private greed. 0:05:04.593,0:05:08.490 - [Beth] And this was part of[br]a long standing conversation 0:05:08.490,0:05:12.107 in Rome among those like Cato and Cicero, 0:05:12.107,0:05:15.216 who believed that this[br]booty that was taken 0:05:15.216,0:05:17.280 should be available to the public 0:05:17.280,0:05:22.280 versus those who took the booty[br]and kept it for themselves 0:05:22.610,0:05:24.333 to decorate their private villas. 0:05:24.333,0:05:27.093 - [Steven] And all of these[br]issues remain important today, 0:05:27.093,0:05:29.550 our museums are filled with objects, 0:05:29.550,0:05:31.350 that come from different places 0:05:31.350,0:05:33.480 and many of those objects were looted. 0:05:33.480,0:05:35.540 Museums are looking at[br]their collections now 0:05:35.540,0:05:38.940 and wondering whether some of[br]them should be repatriated, 0:05:38.940,0:05:41.330 that is returned to[br]their country of origin 0:05:41.330,0:05:44.780 and in any case how their[br]meaning has been transformed 0:05:44.780,0:05:47.100 by being taken out of[br]their original context 0:05:47.100,0:05:48.183 and put into a museum, 0:05:48.183,0:05:50.800 where their meaning is[br]completely transformed. 0:05:50.800,0:05:53.700 - [Beth] The Romans were[br]not without sympathy 0:05:53.700,0:05:56.020 for the conquered peoples, in fact, 0:05:56.020,0:06:01.020 Livy wrote very sympathetically[br]about the King of Syracuse. 0:06:01.160,0:06:04.690 If this King were to rise[br]from the realms below, 0:06:04.690,0:06:08.335 with what words could we show[br]him either Syracuse or Rome, 0:06:08.335,0:06:10.170 when after he looked back 0:06:10.170,0:06:13.780 on his half-destroyed[br]and despoiled fatherland, 0:06:13.780,0:06:16.230 he would see as he entered Rome 0:06:16.230,0:06:19.430 in the vestibule of the[br]city, almost in the gates, 0:06:19.430,0:06:21.238 the spoils of his own fatherland. 0:06:21.238,0:06:23.810 - [Steven] So when we[br]look at the "Apoxyomenos" 0:06:23.810,0:06:27.530 now on display in the[br]Vatican in the 21st century, 0:06:27.530,0:06:31.400 we generally look at it as an[br]exemplar of ancient Greek art 0:06:31.400,0:06:34.070 and too often, we forget the complex story 0:06:34.070,0:06:37.240 of how this sculpture was[br]looted, how it was loved, 0:06:37.240,0:06:38.990 how it was adopted by the Roman people, 0:06:38.990,0:06:42.600 how it was copied and[br]ultimately ended up here. 0:06:42.600,0:06:45.683 (melodic jazz music)