0:00:01.920,0:00:05.910 I'm moving around, so I'm masking. I am[br]our mobile microphone, but we have a 0:00:05.910,0:00:09.360 standard microphone also. We have[br]people all over the place in the world 0:00:09.360,0:00:13.950 at home and we also have a resident[br]question asker right here. 0:00:14.190,0:00:16.641 So he's going to represent the[br]online questions right? 0:00:16.641,0:00:17.970 - Yes, correct.[br]Also, so you all know 0:00:17.970,0:00:22.290 I do not know what any of the[br]questions are in advance. I will be 0:00:22.290,0:00:24.930 hearing them all for the first time,[br]which also means I might not know the 0:00:24.930,0:00:28.650 answer or I might pass it to someone[br]in the audience, or sometimes I 0:00:28.650,0:00:31.040 just don't know. So that's what [br]happens with these. 0:00:31.040,0:00:33.407 That's my job. The passing. 0:00:33.407,0:00:37.260 All right, so we can kind of start [br]wherever you want. We can start 0:00:37.260,0:00:41.970 with in-person. We can start with some[br]pre-submitted. We can start with some 0:00:41.970,0:00:43.680 currently submitted. We have an [br]in-person - 0:00:43.680,0:00:45.540 Looks like we have a hand right here.[br]You mind coming over to the 0:00:45.540,0:00:52.290 microphone? Just so folks on the livestream[br]can hear. And if you have also a 0:00:52.290,0:00:56.850 question, feel free to go up and line[br]up. We're going to prioritize, of course, 0:00:56.850,0:01:02.520 those of you who came on a train for two[br]and a half days to be here and then I 0:01:02.520,0:01:06.180 think Paul will be reading some of the[br]ones that are coming in via the social 0:01:06.180,0:01:11.190 channels. YouTube, Twitter, etc. So[br]we'll have a mix of both. 0:01:11.190,0:01:13.370 Then we'll have food and drinks. 0:01:14.550,0:01:17.730 Thanks so much for the presentation.[br]Very exciting stuff. Looking forward to 0:01:17.730,0:01:23.220 the future. My question is about Openverse.[br]And I wonder if you could speak a 0:01:23.220,0:01:28.440 little bit about the safety measures[br]that have been thought about or will 0:01:28.440,0:01:32.820 need to be thought about in terms of the[br]content that is uploaded there? Will 0:01:32.820,0:01:38.280 EXIF data be removed from photos that[br]are uploaded? That's my question. 0:01:38.819,0:01:44.369 That's a great question, actually. So[br]first, I do not know if we've thought of 0:01:44.369,0:01:48.989 EXIF before. So you actually just raised[br]something really great that we should 0:01:49.499,0:01:56.609 write down and look at later. I will say[br]that - so there's two things there. 0:01:56.609,0:02:00.839 There's Openverse, which is - think of it[br]like a search engine. So it's crawling 0:02:00.839,0:02:03.959 literally the whole web, and looking for[br]things that are Creative Commons 0:02:03.959,0:02:08.279 licensed and providing a directory of[br]them. So what people publish to their own 0:02:08.279,0:02:11.759 websites is kind of the state of[br]responsibility there. But it's kind of 0:02:11.759,0:02:16.829 like a Google but for Creative Commons[br]licensed content. That is separate from 0:02:16.829,0:02:21.779 the WordPress.org/Photos directory that[br]we've created, which is kind of like a 0:02:21.779,0:02:26.129 Getty or an Unsplash or everything[br]but all CC0 licensed forever and 0:02:26.129,0:02:29.399 ever. By the way, we're not going to[br]change that on you like some other photo 0:02:29.399,0:02:38.519 directories have. That goes to[br]moderation. If you want to submit to 0:02:38.519,0:02:43.439 something there, you'll see that right[br]now, it says, "Hey" - one of the checkboxes 0:02:43.439,0:02:46.979 it certifies, of course, one, that[br]you have rights to the photo. Please 0:02:46.979,0:02:50.849 don't upload other people's photos to it,[br]only your own. But, two, that it doesn't 0:02:50.849,0:02:57.839 have any human faces or other copy[br]written material in the photo itself. So 0:02:57.839,0:03:02.129 this first phase of the photo directory[br]really focused on things that can truly be 0:03:02.129,0:03:07.019 CC0 all the way. Something we've all[br]been learning - and it's a little 0:03:07.019,0:03:14.189 complicated - is with humans and, like, a[br]picture of - let's say you had a picture 0:03:14.189,0:03:19.229 of a piece of art that might have a[br]copyright embedded. So even if the image 0:03:19.229,0:03:23.729 is CC0, something in it might be [br]copywritten. And so we're 0:03:23.729,0:03:30.149 working on - what is an open[br]source, GPL, CC0 model release? 0:03:30.149,0:03:38.279 What does that look like? And that is a[br]very open set of lawyers working on 0:03:38.279,0:03:43.139 things. But once we have it, I think[br]that's actually really exciting. Maybe 0:03:43.139,0:03:48.749 someone could license their likeness as[br]well to be in the Openverse. Maybe 0:03:48.749,0:03:53.549 we generate something with GPT-3[br]that replaces faces and then that's the 0:03:53.549,0:03:58.229 thing that's open. Or maybe someone even[br]says, "Maybe while I'm alive, I don't want 0:03:58.229,0:04:02.519 my likeness used. But maybe on my death, I[br]bequeath my likeness to this open 0:04:02.519,0:04:05.699 commons that belongs to humanity."[br]There's lots of different ways this 0:04:05.699,0:04:10.049 could work, kind of is fun to think[br]about and imagine. But that's how that's 0:04:10.049,0:04:15.959 working right now. We'll probably, you know,[br]what makes sense is something that maybe 0:04:15.959,0:04:19.679 shows the EXIF data you upload before it[br]goes into the thing, at least for a 0:04:19.679,0:04:22.499 photo directory. So you're just aware of[br]everything that's being put in there. 0:04:22.769,0:04:27.149 Location is actually fantastic to have.[br]Like if I have a picture of Stonehenge 0:04:27.779,0:04:31.829 the location where I took that picture[br]is kind of awesome. But other metadata, 0:04:31.829,0:04:35.609 which could be contained in EXIF,[br]probably people should just be aware of. 0:04:35.609,0:04:40.499 Right? So we'll work on getting that[br]added to the photo uploader. And by the 0:04:40.499,0:04:43.120 way, awesome question. Thank you.[br]- Thank you very much for the answer. 0:04:43.120,0:04:44.050 Strong open. 0:04:45.210,0:04:48.840 No problem. Did we cover everything you think[br]is important there? Anything else? 0:04:48.840,0:04:53.784 Okay, awesome. Bob, before you [br]ask your question 0:04:53.784,0:04:56.340 can you share how you got here? 0:04:59.130,0:05:02.820 By train, from Seattle[br]- From Seattle? 0:05:02.820,0:05:06.185 Yeah, Seattle.[br]- That's on the other side of the country, right? 0:05:06.185,0:05:11.549 On the other side of the country, and[br]spending about six days on the train, two 0:05:11.549,0:05:18.299 days here. And yeah, it's been an[br]adventure. So I've come all this way. 0:05:18.909,0:05:21.149 Give me some Woo for 2022. 0:05:21.849,0:05:23.550 - Some moo?[br]Woo. 0:05:23.550,0:05:27.710 I want to hear what WooCommerce is going [br]to do in 2022 in your eyes. 0:05:27.710,0:05:35.220 Sure. So Woo, spelled W-O-O for those who don't[br]know, is a plugin for WordPress, which 0:05:35.550,0:05:41.820 creates commerce functionality in[br]WordPress. It's one of the 55,000 0:05:41.820,0:05:45.420 plugins that exist. But it is a very[br]popular one, an important one, 0:05:45.420,0:05:49.680 especially as we look at things like - you[br]saw Shopify coming up on that usage 0:05:49.680,0:05:55.020 graph. WooCommerce is an open source[br]Shopify, and we hope that it can do to 0:05:55.380,0:06:00.540 democratizing commerce what WordPress[br]has done to democratizing publishing. 0:06:00.540,0:06:07.350 In terms of what's coming for WooCommerce[br]in 2022, the thing I'm most excited 0:06:07.350,0:06:12.030 about that's most relevant for this[br]audience is, I would say, embracing 0:06:12.030,0:06:17.220 Gutenberg and the block interfaces for[br]everything with Woo. So right now, Woo still 0:06:17.220,0:06:22.620 has some ways of doing things which are[br]more tied to the Classic Editor, or 0:06:22.620,0:06:26.880 shortcodes, or other ways of creating,[br]like, check out blocks, products, 0:06:26.880,0:06:31.980 everything like that. There are some[br]plugins and experiments around 0:06:31.980,0:06:37.260 Gutenberg and blocks. And I think that I[br]would love if Woo was one of the best 0:06:37.260,0:06:42.150 plugins in the world for embracing how[br]to use Gutenberg. And I think the team's 0:06:42.150,0:06:47.430 been working really hard on that. It is[br]an amazing team. That both includes a 0:06:47.430,0:06:50.520 lot of community and a lot of the folks[br]sponsored by Automattic to work on that. 0:06:50.880,0:06:55.860 And I'd say that's what 2022 - the thing[br]that's most relevant for this audience 0:06:55.860,0:06:59.388 I'm excited about is more Gutenberg in Woo. 0:06:59.388,0:07:01.740 And we also have the CEO of WooCommerce[br]here. Does that sound - 0:07:01.740,0:07:08.320 Giving me a thumbs up? That sounds good? [br]All right. Sounds good. 0:07:08.320,0:07:10.950 So more Gutenberg? That's kind of [br]the answer to everything is more 0:07:10.950,0:07:17.330 Gutenberg. It's like cowbell. You can[br]always have more cowbell. 0:07:17.330,0:07:18.840 You can always have more Gutenberg. 0:07:18.840,0:07:21.190 Thank you. Well, that was worth 6000[br]miles. 0:07:30.329,0:07:35.879 Cool. Alright, should we move to an online[br]question or - wait, we got one in 0:07:35.879,0:07:39.029 person. And then next, let's do an[br]online one, just to make sure we have 0:07:39.029,0:07:40.109 everything from those folks. 0:07:40.260,0:07:46.320 Sweet. So my question is about styles. I[br]think, you know, the theme styles and - or 0:07:46.320,0:07:49.500 variants, I think they were called[br]initially, is a very innovative idea that 0:07:49.500,0:07:53.220 lets people paint their sites. It's[br]great for developers, designers, and 0:07:53.220,0:07:57.840 everyday users. So I understand that. I[br]think, what could be interesting, and I 0:07:57.840,0:08:01.110 wonder if you've thought about this, is[br]perhaps there's a Style Directory like 0:08:01.110,0:08:05.550 we have a Pattern Directory. Is that[br]something we're in the thought of? 0:08:05.550,0:08:08.850 I know that there's a couple other[br]concerns, you know, we'd have to have a 0:08:08.850,0:08:11.880 standardized way that themes are being[br]made, which we're moving towards 0:08:11.880,0:08:15.870 already. So I don't know, I think that's[br]an interesting way to empower people to 0:08:15.870,0:08:20.250 also give back to the Directory or into[br]WordPress, just like patterns. Like if 0:08:20.250,0:08:24.450 you can save a pattern, can you save a style? [br]And then anybody can save a style? 0:08:24.450,0:08:26.310 Is that something on the docket? 0:08:26.820,0:08:32.070 I'm going to fast-forward a little bit here[br]into basically science fiction. But if 0:08:32.070,0:08:37.170 you could imagine us getting a really[br]great repository of truly CC0 0:08:37.170,0:08:43.980 Creative Commons, zero license stuff,[br]around images, fonts, etc. That opens up 0:08:43.980,0:08:48.210 a lot of possibilities for creating[br]essentially GPL compatible styles, like 0:08:48.210,0:08:53.190 you talked about. If you've ever watched[br]or helped a friend set up WordPress, or 0:08:53.190,0:08:57.570 watched a user test or something, one of[br]the most hard - most heartbreaking things 0:08:57.810,0:09:04.320 is when someone chooses a theme based[br]on the image in the demo. And I learned 0:09:04.320,0:09:08.460 this myself. So in one of the previous[br]themes, like Twenty Ten or Twenty Eleven 0:09:08.460,0:09:12.060 there wasn't a lot of open source licensed[br]imagery in the world and so I just took 0:09:12.060,0:09:16.470 all my photos and GPL-licensed them. So one[br]of these old themes - I think it's Twenty Ten 0:09:16.470,0:09:22.830 there's a picture from Ireland of some[br]sheep on a road. And we would literally 0:09:22.830,0:09:29.520 do user tests where people were like, "I like the[br]sheep, so I chose this theme." And it's 0:09:29.520,0:09:34.530 like, "Yes, I like the sheep too, but you can[br]put any image in the world there. It 0:09:34.530,0:09:40.380 doesn't just have to be a sheep theme."[br]It's really, it's a - yeah, you know what 0:09:40.380,0:09:45.540 I'm talking about. Styles right now are[br]tied to themes and it's tied to theme.json 0:09:45.540,0:09:52.800 And so I think theme.json is - theme[br]dot J-S-O-N, which I call JSON. I don't 0:09:52.800,0:09:56.130 know how you pronounce it, but that's[br]how I call it - it's the number one thing. If 0:09:56.130,0:10:00.510 you're a theme developer or interested in [br]developing themes, look up that. Learn as much 0:10:00.510,0:10:03.570 about theme.json as possible. So[br]right now, it's specific to the 0:10:03.570,0:10:09.090 theme. But over time, particularly for[br]things like typography, which is a 0:10:09.090,0:10:13.470 passion of mine. Actually, my very first[br]open source code I ever created, 0:10:13.830,0:10:18.450 which was a contribution to b2, the[br]predecessor to WordPress, was texturize. 0:10:18.810,0:10:24.780 Which was - I'd learned a ton about[br]typography and I wanted all posts to 0:10:24.780,0:10:29.370 have proper typography. So instead of a[br]prime mark in between a word like 0:10:29.370,0:10:34.080 that's - between the that and the s - I[br]wanted to be a proper curly quote. And 0:10:34.080,0:10:37.620 so this first code I ever contributed to[br]open source was texturized. I'm very 0:10:37.620,0:10:41.910 passionate about this. I would love for[br]people to be able to see the incredible 0:10:41.910,0:10:45.840 transformations that can happen to a[br]site through updating the typography 0:10:46.110,0:10:50.430 and particularly pairings of type where[br]you have might have like, a really 0:10:50.430,0:10:54.120 awesome serif paired with a really[br]awesome sans serif for the body text or 0:10:54.120,0:10:59.400 something like that. And I think how[br]themes evolve a little bit - actually 0:10:59.400,0:11:06.150 I'm not sure entirely how themes evolve but -[br]to be honest - but it's pretty 0:11:06.150,0:11:11.190 exciting that the theme can almost be a[br]little bit like - honestly it reminds me of 0:11:11.190,0:11:17.070 jazz. I grew up playing jazz. It's why[br]we name every WordPress release after a 0:11:17.070,0:11:22.530 jazz musician. Jazz are often based on[br]something called standards. So like a 0:11:22.530,0:11:27.660 good chunk of all popular jazz songs are[br]built on rhythm changes, which is a set of 0:11:27.660,0:11:32.251 chord changes, actually from I think, a[br]musical song called "I Got Rhythm." 0:11:32.251,0:11:35.726 [sings] I got rhythm, I got music. 0:11:35.726,0:11:38.310 Really cool chord changes there. [br]Really awesome bridge. 0:11:38.310,0:11:42.510 And people have written lots of other songs [br]on top of that. What's cool 0:11:42.510,0:11:47.280 is the chord changes - I think I'm a[br]little outside of my realm of expertise 0:11:47.280,0:11:50.640 here - but the chord changes themselves[br]are essentially open source, meaning 0:11:50.640,0:11:55.020 anyone can use those chord changes. Now[br]the melody right on top of it 0:11:55.020,0:11:59.130 might be proprietary, might belong to a[br]specific thing. But that kind of 0:11:59.130,0:12:03.000 underlying structure is open. And so I[br]think themes become that kind of 0:12:03.000,0:12:06.360 underlying structure. And then what[br]people take on top of it - it's the chord 0:12:06.360,0:12:10.320 changes. And then what people create on[br]top of it could be as varied and unique 0:12:10.320,0:12:14.730 as all the things written, people have[br]written on top of the rhythm changes 0:12:14.730,0:12:16.760 as they're called in jazz 0:12:17.250,0:12:24.930 which is incredible. Thousands of songs,[br]countless millions of, like, performances 0:12:24.930,0:12:31.260 and solos. So that's my hope for what[br]happens with themes. And hopefully, we 0:12:31.260,0:12:36.120 can get more - like, we don't have a ton of[br]CC0 licensed fonts yet. So hopefully, 0:12:36.120,0:12:40.680 we can develop more and more of that[br]content in the Openverse/metaverse 0:12:40.680,0:12:44.580 that is available to all WordPress [br]users. And the cool thing 0:12:44.580,0:12:48.750 about Openverse, as well, is the API is[br]totally open. So that's available to Drupal 0:12:48.750,0:12:53.130 users, Joomla users, everyone else -[br]Wix users, Squarespace users. Anyone 0:12:53.130,0:12:58.260 who wants to access this content, it is[br]something the WordPress community is 0:12:58.260,0:13:03.720 creating for benefit to the world. So if[br]you contribute to that you're 0:13:03.720,0:13:09.870 essentially contributing to humanity's[br]repository of cool open stuff that's 0:13:09.870,0:13:14.250 available for anyone to use in any way. So[br]I'm very excited about what the 0:13:14.250,0:13:18.720 future of Openverse will be. We have[br]the very first - we basically just got the 0:13:18.720,0:13:22.380 code ported over and the search engine[br]ported over, and not even the audio yet, 0:13:22.380,0:13:27.450 that's coming in January. And I cannot[br]believe more in the mission of that. 0:13:28.080,0:13:30.310 Thank you. [br]- Thank you. 0:13:33.030,0:13:36.597 Cool, and you can line up behind her [br]if you also have a question. 0:13:37.397,0:13:39.560 But come on in. What's your name,[br]by the way? 0:13:39.560,0:13:41.070 Ali.[br]- Hi Ali. 0:13:41.070,0:13:47.190 Hi Matt. So I create a lot of content[br]around WordPress for the people who are 0:13:47.190,0:13:51.360 looking at WordPress in front of them[br]for the first time looking to, you know, 0:13:51.360,0:13:55.410 build something with it having never[br]used it before. And I think a lot about 0:13:55.410,0:14:00.600 the young people who are looking at[br]WordPress as a path to something, as a 0:14:00.600,0:14:04.980 path to improving their life or[br]brightening their future whatever that 0:14:04.980,0:14:08.130 might be. And I know that we have in the[br]live stream right now a lot of young 0:14:08.130,0:14:15.120 people watching, listening, and being inspired[br]by this. What advice would you have to 0:14:15.120,0:14:22.020 those young people who are looking to[br]inherit this world that we're leaving 0:14:22.020,0:14:29.010 them? And what advice can you give[br]them as far as using WordPress as a tool 0:14:29.010,0:14:33.930 to improve what we're leaving them? [br]No pressure. 0:14:36.390,0:14:38.260 That's a cool one. 0:14:44.655,0:14:48.210 In my life, one of the most influential [br]things I ever realized 0:14:48.210,0:14:53.190 was that everything I was using, every [br]piece of technology, every piece 0:14:53.190,0:14:58.800 of furniture, every chair, everything[br]was created by someone who wasn't that 0:14:58.800,0:15:04.950 much different from me or people I[br]knew. And so there's crafts that can be 0:15:04.950,0:15:10.740 developed when you focus on an area. And[br]in fact, with the internet, there's more 0:15:10.740,0:15:16.620 and more of this through YouTube,[br]Wikipedia, online blogs, etc. There's so 0:15:16.620,0:15:22.050 much you can learn about pretty much any [br]area that you're passionate about. And I 0:15:22.050,0:15:26.010 think, for me, and it might be Steve Jobs or [br]someone else who talks about this, but 0:15:26.010,0:15:30.780 just this idea that the things that I use and [br]love are created by people 0:15:30.780,0:15:36.090 not that much different from me was [br]really powerful. And that's part of 0:15:36.090,0:15:40.620 what got me contributing to open source[br]in the beginning. When I was - again, I got 0:15:40.620,0:15:48.660 started on the forums of b2. So b2 is[br]the predecessor to WordPress. It had some 0:15:48.660,0:15:53.460 forums, probably run by like phpBB or[br]something. And I just, at first, I was 0:15:53.460,0:15:57.450 asking questions and then, later, I saw[br]questions I had already asked being 0:15:57.450,0:16:01.140 asked by other people. And I started [br]answering them. I didn't know anything. 0:16:02.130,0:16:09.780 I couldn't - I cannot overemphasize how[br]ignorant I was, as a 17, 18, 19 year old 0:16:09.780,0:16:15.450 kid in Houston, Texas, who had no formal[br]training, no university courses, etc. So 0:16:16.080,0:16:22.530 I think what's exciting about the[br]digital economy is that, in this 0:16:22.530,0:16:28.320 Openverse that we're trying to create[br]together, it doesn't matter who you are, 0:16:28.320,0:16:31.000 where you're from, or anything like[br]that. It matters what you contribute. 0:16:31.260,0:16:37.590 And learning to contribute has never been[br]more accessible and more open source 0:16:37.590,0:16:48.360 more open. The other advice I'd give is[br]that, when you're younger, you have a 0:16:48.360,0:16:54.090 lot more time than you realize. And to[br]try to invest that time - if there's 0:16:54.090,0:17:00.600 anyone young listening to this - in what[br]your passion is, you know. If you 0:17:00.600,0:17:05.910 feel drawn to a particular area - I was[br]actually shocked both in my own 0:17:05.910,0:17:12.450 experience, and in seeing many other[br]successful folks since then, in how 0:17:12.720,0:17:22.380 being a world expert in XYZ - whatever[br]XYZ is - is maybe 100 hours of work in 0:17:22.380,0:17:27.720 some areas. Maybe 200 hours of work. But[br]when you're young, you have a lot more 0:17:27.720,0:17:33.480 hours than folks who maybe are providing[br]for the family or full-time jobs or 0:17:33.480,0:17:40.080 other things. So really embrace that[br]opportunity of both school, education, 0:17:40.080,0:17:44.580 literature available to you, etc. to try to[br]consume and absorb as much of it 0:17:44.580,0:17:57.630 as possible. I feel so much - one of my only[br]regrets as a almost 38 year old is that 0:17:57.960,0:18:03.180 I didn't pay as much attention when I[br]was in school. And I went to all public 0:18:03.180,0:18:08.040 schools in Houston. But I had some[br]amazing teachers, like the text I was 0:18:08.040,0:18:16.290 given, the literature, etc. was free[br]or inexpensive, and was really 0:18:16.290,0:18:18.810 passion from these teachers of some[br]of the best things that humanity has 0:18:18.810,0:18:22.740 created so far. So check that out. And[br]the code equivalent of that is 0:18:22.740,0:18:29.370 WordPress in a lot of ways. Meaning[br]that, again, you can think of the other 0:18:29.370,0:18:34.350 largest Internet services in the world - [br]Amazon, Microsoft, Facebook, etc. You 0:18:34.350,0:18:41.880 can't go and look at how they work. You[br]can't suggest a change to how the Google 0:18:41.880,0:18:45.030 homepage works or the Facebook[br]algorithm or anything like that. Those 0:18:45.030,0:18:48.420 are all proprietary. With things like[br]Wikipedia and WordPress, it's all open 0:18:48.420,0:18:54.900 source. Which means that you could[br]suggest a change of the WP admin 0:18:54.900,0:19:00.630 homepage, which hundreds of thousands[br]of millions of people see and impacts a 0:19:00.630,0:19:06.090 lot of folks. So open source for me was[br]a huge enabler - again, not growing up in 0:19:06.090,0:19:10.410 the Bay area or the traditional, like,[br]Seattle or other traditional 0:19:10.410,0:19:15.780 centers of technology. It was really[br]exciting for me. So I'll start with 0:19:15.780,0:19:19.890 that. Hopefully, I guess folks and maybe[br]younger folks like something to start 0:19:19.890,0:19:22.800 with. And I saw Josepha raise her hand, so[br]maybe you have something to add there. 0:19:22.800,0:19:26.190 - I do. I also have an additional thing.[br]Can I introduce you really quick? 0:19:26.190,0:19:33.150 - Of course. [br]So Josepha is the lead of WordPress.org. So she - 0:19:39.359,0:19:44.399 she is - all of the cool things we talked[br]about around like the Directories, etc. 0:19:44.549,0:19:48.329 Josepha is in charge of that. So she[br]really leads the community development of 0:19:48.329,0:19:53.009 WordPress.org. Everything around that. So[br]thank you, Josepha. And now - 0:19:53.549,0:19:58.439 And now this. So I think also one of the[br]most important things - where am I 0:19:58.439,0:20:03.869 looking? I'm going to look at you, Matt.[br]Also, one really important thing to 0:20:03.869,0:20:07.469 remember for people who are getting[br]started with WordPress for the first 0:20:07.469,0:20:11.159 time is that the open source nature of[br]it does mean that we also have really 0:20:11.159,0:20:16.889 active and passive ways to learn some of[br]the most vital 21st century skills that 0:20:16.889,0:20:20.969 the workforce of the future will need.[br]We need it now. But not all of us 0:20:20.969,0:20:24.509 actually are any good at it in the world. [br]WordPressers are generally really 0:20:24.509,0:20:26.999 really good at it. And there's a[br]reason for it. It's because we do it 0:20:26.999,0:20:32.819 every day. And so like that, in the[br]immediate - in my immediate advice that I 0:20:32.819,0:20:36.449 can give to people, that is the number[br]one thing. Like, observe the way that 0:20:36.449,0:20:41.009 this works, because it's going to be[br]relevant from here until they're done 0:20:41.009,0:20:42.209 wanting to work. 0:20:43.589,0:20:48.839 Anything else in the audience? Because[br]we have an unusual audience here. 0:20:48.839,0:20:51.089 Here we go. Do you mind introducing [br]yourself really quick? 0:20:51.089,0:20:56.129 I'm Michelle Frechette and I'm with Stellar WP, [br]but I also do a whole bunch 0:20:56.129,0:21:02.789 of other stuff in the community, which[br]is fun. So my question is actually off of those 0:21:02.789,0:21:07.439 two responses as well. We have a ton[br]of education out there, right? So 0:21:07.439,0:21:12.029 whether it's through Learn WordPress,[br]whether it's people on YouTube, all these 0:21:12.029,0:21:15.959 opportunities to learn about it. What[br]are we doing to bring the next 0:21:15.959,0:21:21.299 generation in to help continue to grow?[br]I'm watching the age of people I see at 0:21:21.299,0:21:25.419 WordPress continue to grow, but not a[br]ton of people coming in with us? 0:21:25.950,0:21:28.550 I don't know, I'm looking around. This is [br]a very youthful group. 0:21:29.730,0:21:33.720 Well, I'm one of the older here. I admit[br]that. But what are we doing to bring - 0:21:33.720,0:21:39.240 I mean, I tweeted last week. Olivia[br]Bisset - she's in middle school - had a 0:21:39.240,0:21:43.890 hackathon. I think I tagged you in my[br]tweet. And she herself, with her sister 0:21:43.890,0:21:48.510 put on a huge hackathon of all middle[br]schoolers, but that's unusual. So what 0:21:48.510,0:21:52.920 are we doing to make sure that the next[br]generation of kids is going to want to 0:21:52.920,0:21:55.110 contribute the way that the people in[br]this room do? 0:21:55.410,0:21:59.860 You stole my answer because I was going[br]to talk about David and Olivia Bisset. 0:22:02.220,0:22:09.630 David Bisset, one of the most prolific[br]tweeters about WordPress, Hi, David. 0:22:09.630,0:22:16.650 Will post a lot of gifs from this talk.[br]Olivia is his daughter and already 0:22:16.650,0:22:21.360 started to be really active in the[br]WordPress community. I would put that 0:22:21.360,0:22:26.640 back to everyone in this room and[br]everyone listening here as well. You 0:22:26.640,0:22:31.260 know the old adage, like you teach a[br]person to fish or you teach a person - 0:22:31.260,0:22:34.560 you give a person a fish, you feed him[br]for a day. Teach a person to fish, you 0:22:34.560,0:22:40.890 feed them for their lifetimes. I think[br]you just give a person a blog or, even 0:22:40.890,0:22:45.750 worse, a social media account, you feed[br]him for a day. You teach them how to 0:22:45.750,0:22:53.220 create the web, which is, in many ways,[br]in my opinion, the most amazing 0:22:54.870,0:23:01.230 actualization of shared humanity and[br]knowledge. Like how do we create 0:23:01.230,0:23:06.090 something that lasts beyond our own[br]individual lifetimes? It's the web. How 0:23:06.090,0:23:10.410 do we create something that lasts beyond[br]us? A legacy, a true legacy? It's adding 0:23:10.410,0:23:14.220 to the information that's part of what[br]hopefully goes forward for future 0:23:14.220,0:23:18.150 generations. And then becomes - allows us[br]to sort of fast - skip all the 0:23:18.150,0:23:23.460 mistakes, skip all the learnings to[br]what's latest. It's upgrading the clock 0:23:23.460,0:23:31.350 speed and version of humanity. So for[br]anyone who's listening, mentoring and 0:23:31.350,0:23:36.600 guiding someone younger than yourself [br]into participating in the WordPress 0:23:36.600,0:23:48.360 community is - you get like. What is it?[br]A mitzvah? You get like an extra 0:23:48.360,0:23:54.510 special bonus and, sort of like the[br]history of open source in the world, if 0:23:54.510,0:23:58.650 you bring someone new into it. So I'd[br]highly encourage you - and there's so 0:23:58.650,0:24:01.620 many, if you look at some of the biggest[br]contributors to WordPress over the 0:24:01.620,0:24:08.610 years, a Ryan Boren or a Nacin, etc. part[br]of their legacy, beyond just all the code 0:24:08.610,0:24:16.050 they wrote, is all the people they[br]brought in. And the folks who felt like 0:24:16.050,0:24:18.930 you know, they knew a lot but they[br]weren't able to contribute or something. 0:24:18.930,0:24:25.050 And they said, "No, you got it. You can[br]be a Core committer. You can be someone 0:24:25.050,0:24:29.550 who patches a Core bug. You can be[br]someone who translates WordPress 0:24:29.550,0:24:33.300 into an entirely new language, or[br]preserves a language for posterity." 0:24:33.300,0:24:39.630 Like there's so much you can do using[br]WordPress as the launchpad for 0:24:39.630,0:24:44.460 contributing something positive to[br]humanity. And so that is, I think, a real 0:24:44.460,0:24:54.030 key. So I don't know what is perfect for[br]the young people because I'm not one of 0:24:54.030,0:24:59.790 them anymore. I was when WordPress[br]started. But to the extent you have anyone 0:24:59.790,0:25:04.620 in your lives, both here in the audience[br]or broader to the folks watching this 0:25:06.060,0:25:12.060 that has that desire to have an impact,[br]teach them how to be involved with open 0:25:12.060,0:25:15.510 source and whether that's WordPress or[br]some other open source project, I think 0:25:15.510,0:25:21.900 is the best way to contribute to the[br]future of humanity. Thank you. 0:25:21.900,0:25:23.580 What's that? [br]- More KidsCamps? 0:25:23.580,0:25:26.870 More KidsCamps? Yeah, we do have some [br]KidCamps. So very specifically 0:25:26.870,0:25:30.180 we have KidsCamps at places [br]like WordCamp - was it 0:25:30.180,0:25:38.490 Orlando? Miami, Miami. Yeah. Which David[br]Bisset helped organize. Let's all be 0:25:38.490,0:25:45.090 more like David. If you have kids, why[br]aren't they contributing? I wouldn't 0:25:45.090,0:25:47.880 put that on anyone because kids do[br]the opposite of what you ask them. So 0:25:47.880,0:25:53.100 like, tell them don't contribute to[br]WordPress. And then maybe they will. 0:25:53.100,0:25:56.400 - Take your kids to WordPress day.[br]Take your kids to WordPress day actually is 0:25:56.400,0:26:00.590 an awesome idea. [br]- We'll talk later. 0:26:02.460,0:26:05.390 Cool. Should we do one from online? 0:26:08.190,0:26:13.080 This is a question from - I lost the name.[br]But it was essentially - there were a couple 0:26:13.080,0:26:16.320 of references to the metaverse in, I[br]think, sort of a joking way, but 0:26:17.070,0:26:19.350 one's on WordPress in virtual reality. 0:26:21.030,0:26:23.460 WordPress in virtual reality. 0:26:27.805,0:26:29.940 Let's pass the mic really quick.[br]Do you want to say something? 0:26:29.940,0:26:34.350 Hey, no, we got one. We[br]got one. Here you go. Again, the 0:26:34.350,0:26:37.710 intelligence in this audience is far[br]greater than what I have so I want to 0:26:37.710,0:26:39.600 push this back as much as possible. [br]- I just wanted to say 0:26:39.600,0:26:43.980 WordCamp Boston did do that, if not[br]earlier this year - it was last year. 0:26:43.980,0:26:46.320 They had a virtual reality WordCamp [br]- Oh, cool. 0:26:46.320,0:26:50.270 And it was last year. Thank you. Just yeah. 0:26:54.270,0:26:57.600 That's a tricky one. I don't know how to[br]answer that, to be totally honest. 0:26:57.600,0:27:02.520 Because like, the internet is virtual[br]reality. It's just kind of text-based. 0:27:02.940,0:27:07.710 And then when you think of other ways of[br]interfacing with virtual reality, like 0:27:08.250,0:27:15.210 VR headsets, or AR, etc. One good thing[br]WordPress - WordPress is great at dealing 0:27:15.210,0:27:21.000 with content. So don't build on top of[br]WordPress if you're building like 0:27:21.000,0:27:25.290 a messaging system or real time game or[br]something like that. But if you're 0:27:25.290,0:27:29.700 making something that essentially[br]is people inputting content and 0:27:29.700,0:27:33.690 outputting that to the world, you should[br]probably be building it on WordPress. 0:27:34.320,0:27:40.020 Whether it's real estate, records, almost[br]anything. If it's content going in and out 0:27:40.020,0:27:50.010 that should be on WordPress. When[br]companies - nameless - should talk about 0:27:50.010,0:27:56.100 this idea of a metaverse, they often[br]talk about the interoperability. This 0:27:56.100,0:28:02.010 idea that contents or items that you[br]create in one metaverse is available in 0:28:02.010,0:28:09.486 all of them. If I imagine my most sci-fi[br]thoughts of the future - science fiction 0:28:10.710,0:28:17.940 it's hard for me to imagine that if humanity [br]interacts more and more in a 0:28:17.940,0:28:22.530 virtual space, that will be controlled[br]by one company. I really think it'll 0:28:22.530,0:28:29.010 look more like the web. Like a place[br]where people can register domains. We 0:28:29.010,0:28:36.270 actually had a joke in here, I forgot to[br]tell. So you get it now. What if there 0:28:36.270,0:28:42.930 were something like a DAO, a distributed[br]autonomous organization, that 0:28:42.930,0:28:48.270 manage a namespace, which you could pay[br]to own a part of, and in fact, there's 0:28:48.270,0:28:53.700 no gas fees for owning part of it.[br]The fees are borne by the merchant. 0:28:54.270,0:28:57.660 That would essentially be buying a[br]domain with a credit card on any 0:28:57.660,0:29:07.290 registrar. So we have things already[br]that any person listening to this can 0:29:07.290,0:29:13.350 have true ownership of, like a domain.[br]That's their, like, home on the internet. 0:29:13.770,0:29:16.980 Internet is the best metaverse we've[br]created so far. And part of that's 0:29:16.980,0:29:20.850 because of the interoperability, and the[br]open standards that these things are 0:29:20.850,0:29:28.110 built on. Patent-free standards as well,[br]which I'll emphasize. So to the extent 0:29:28.110,0:29:32.370 that things will be - I don't know exactly[br]what it'll look like. Nothing I've seen 0:29:32.370,0:29:36.540 so far is that compelling. But to the extent[br]that there are fun, content-driven things 0:29:36.540,0:29:40.140 that are going to be part of the next[br]generations of the web? Web3, Web4 0:29:40.140,0:29:45.330 Web5, Web10 - I expect WordPress[br]will be at the center of it. 0:29:47.670,0:29:50.880 We've got an in-person question. Okay.[br]Please introduce yourself. 0:29:50.880,0:29:54.660 Hi, my name is Bud Kraus. We've never had the[br]pleasure to meet but I've heard you 0:29:54.660,0:29:56.808 speak at several of these. [br]- Thank you. 0:29:56.808,0:30:00.000 And welcome to New York. So all [br]I want to know 0:30:00.000,0:30:04.530 is this is a brand new space. Sorry[br]for the people who aren't here, but 0:30:04.530,0:30:08.010 this is a brand new space. What are you[br]going to be doing here? And can we use 0:30:08.010,0:30:10.280 it too, the people who live in this area? 0:30:12.480,0:30:20.550 Yeah. So for those who are watching[br]online, we're in this cool space in the 0:30:20.550,0:30:25.950 Noho - which means north of Houston,[br]which is a New York incorrect way to 0:30:25.950,0:30:36.840 pronounce Houston, which is the city[br]where I'm from - neighborhood. And it's 0:30:36.840,0:30:42.630 a cool neighborhood, it's near a lot of[br]public transit. And it's a cool space. A 0:30:42.630,0:30:47.370 company I'm involved in, CEO of[br]Automattic, when we purchased the 0:30:47.370,0:30:55.890 company called Tumblr, got this space.[br]And so we have this until 2025. Not 0:30:55.890,0:30:59.880 coincidentally, a lot more of the people[br]working on Tumblr and everything we do 0:31:00.030,0:31:03.180 have gone more distributed. So there's[br]not as many people in this particular 0:31:03.180,0:31:07.860 space as there used to be. But we tried to[br]create this in a way that, much like 0:31:07.860,0:31:12.840 tonight, could be a place that people use[br]for events and other community things. 0:31:13.080,0:31:17.580 So if you're interested in doing that,[br]for something particularly open source 0:31:17.580,0:31:21.930 driven within the community, we're happy[br]to open up this space for anything in 0:31:21.930,0:31:27.270 the future. And a cool kind of aside is[br]all the art in the space, including 0:31:27.270,0:31:34.110 what's behind me, is from people on[br]Tumblr. And so these are all publishers 0:31:34.110,0:31:37.740 on Tumblr. So all the art that will be[br]in the space and eventually - right now 0:31:37.740,0:31:42.030 we have this wall covered. We're going[br]to cover every single wall here. So we 0:31:42.030,0:31:46.590 have many thousands of square feet to cover[br]still. It's all going to be people who 0:31:46.590,0:31:50.460 publish on WordPress and Tumblr. And in[br]the future, Tumblr will be powered by 0:31:50.460,0:31:54.540 WordPress, so that'll happen. So it'll[br]all be the same thing. So it's kind of 0:31:54.540,0:31:59.430 cool that it'll all be artists that use[br]open source publishing to put their 0:31:59.430,0:32:06.150 content into the Openverse. Alright. 0:32:06.690,0:32:12.090 Hi, Matt. My name is Anil, and I have a[br]curiosity question. You mentioned about 0:32:12.390,0:32:18.480 Gutenberg Phase Three, which will be[br]collaboration. So I'm curious, what can 0:32:18.480,0:32:23.310 we expect at that phase of [br]Gutenberg and collaboration? 0:32:23.490,0:32:28.140 That's a good question. Because I talked[br]twice as long as last year, but maybe 0:32:28.140,0:32:34.800 missed that particular point. So that[br]Collaboration Phase - collaboration? 0:32:34.800,0:32:40.020 Sorry. Phase Three of Gutenberg is -[br]imagine Google Docs. It's probably the 0:32:40.020,0:32:43.140 best analogy. You know how when you're[br]in a Google Doc, when someone 0:32:43.140,0:32:45.870 else is editing at the same time, you[br]see exactly what they're doing, what 0:32:45.870,0:32:50.310 they're changing. So imagine every single[br]thing on WordPress updating in real 0:32:50.310,0:32:55.770 time, as other people edit it. So[br]there's no more version conflicts or 0:32:55.770,0:33:00.810 anything like that. Literally, WordPress[br]represents the kind of real-time source 0:33:00.810,0:33:06.540 of truth for whatever the content -[br]whether it's, again, posts, pages, or 0:33:06.540,0:33:12.690 other in real-time. And then there's[br]both a real-time awareness and workflows 0:33:12.690,0:33:17.910 around editing that. And so the real-time [br]awareness is kind of the easy part 0:33:17.910,0:33:20.910 actually. It's that part where when[br]someone else is editing at the same 0:33:20.910,0:33:25.380 time, and you're editing it, you see[br]what's happening. So there's no 0:33:25.380,0:33:29.310 conflicts. The workflow is a little[br]trickier and that's what I'm 0:33:29.310,0:33:34.620 actually more excited about working on.[br]Where workflow is a word we use for 0:33:35.670,0:33:40.050 someone edits it, someone approves it,[br]someone like - there's different stages of 0:33:40.050,0:33:44.490 different forms of content. Which is[br]also very relevant for translation. 0:33:46.260,0:33:50.100 Someone writes the content, let's say[br]in English, and then maybe it gets 0:33:50.100,0:33:55.080 translated into another language. I[br]realized this personally, to share 0:33:55.080,0:34:00.210 another weird story like the economics[br]thing. On WordPress.com, we use 0:34:00.210,0:34:04.200 GlotPress and allowed anyone to[br]translate any string on WordPress.com. 0:34:04.710,0:34:10.230 And for a while, on every - I forget which[br]language it was, but let's just call it 0:34:10.230,0:34:15.240 Italian. Instead of saying "Leave a[br]Comment" on every Italian blog hosted on 0:34:15.240,0:34:22.440 WordPress.com, it said "Happy Birthday." So[br]someone obviously was like trolling us 0:34:22.440,0:34:25.320 and said, like, instead of "Leave a[br]Comment," it'll say "Happy Birthday." 0:34:25.320,0:34:31.830 That was actually pretty funny. Whoever[br]did that, I'll buy you a beer. But 0:34:32.280,0:34:35.640 ideally, there would have been a[br]workflow or someone else who speaks 0:34:35.640,0:34:41.550 Italian would have said, "This says 'Happy[br]Birthday.'" How do you even say that 0:34:41.550,0:34:47.520 in Italian? Does anyone know? I know you say[br]"Feliz navidad." How do you say like 0:34:47.520,0:34:51.410 happy birthday and merry Christmas. What[br]is happy birthday? 0:34:51.410,0:34:54.420 - Buon natale? I'm guessing 0:34:54.420,0:34:59.850 Buon natale? Okay, okay. We'll go there.[br]Someone would have seen that and said, 0:34:59.850,0:35:03.840 "That doesn't mean 'Leave a Comment.'[br]And we shouldn't put this on the 0:35:03.840,0:35:09.720 homepage of every single Italian[br]WordPress in the world." So that 0:35:09.720,0:35:15.360 workflow, I think, is key to Phase Four[br]of Gutenberg, which is why it's part of 0:35:15.360,0:35:21.660 Phase Three. So collaboration is the fun[br]part, which will be easy and hard to do 0:35:21.660,0:35:25.410 at the same time, which is that kind of[br]real time co-editing. And there's some 0:35:25.410,0:35:28.890 cool new standards in browsers that[br]allow us to do this in a decentralized 0:35:28.890,0:35:32.940 way, which I'm really excited about,[br]using essentially features built into 0:35:32.940,0:35:36.840 Chrome and others that allow us to, like[br]connect multiple people editing a 0:35:37.080,0:35:40.860 page or post at the same time, using[br]just a browser and open source 0:35:40.860,0:35:47.160 technology. But the more like, approval,[br]etc, is a little bit more of the later 0:35:47.160,0:35:53.160 Phase Three. So 2023, we'll work on[br]that. For now, contribute to Openverse, 0:35:53.160,0:35:59.790 block patterns, blocks, and block themes.[br]That is the key for 2022. Again, if I 0:35:59.790,0:36:04.350 get on stage next year, and say there's[br]30 - we've gone to 40 block themes? 0:36:05.100,0:36:12.120 Utter failure. Please throw fruit at me[br]or something else. I hope that we have 0:36:12.120,0:36:18.240 300, or ideally 3000, of these block-[br]enabled themes and that's - both that's 0:36:18.240,0:36:21.990 updating existing themes and creating[br]new ones to allow people to express their 0:36:21.990,0:36:27.060 creativity online through the Gutenberg[br]editor. Again, right now, if you look at 0:36:27.060,0:36:35.820 what social networks do, they try to[br]really narrow you into a very limited 0:36:35.820,0:36:39.690 expression of creativity. Why? Because[br]they want to serve ads against your 0:36:39.690,0:36:43.650 profile and what you're creating. They[br]want to target you. That's not what 0:36:43.650,0:36:48.000 we're trying to do with WordPress. So we[br]want you to create the most unique, cool 0:36:48.000,0:36:52.700 stuff online as possible. And blocks[br]enable people to do that. And I'm 0:36:52.700,0:36:56.120 looking forward to more and more of it.[br]Does that answer the question? 0:36:56.120,0:36:57.950 - Yes, thank you.[br]Cool, thank you. 0:37:02.820,0:37:07.915 I saw someone stand up over here. Was that? Okay. 0:37:11.490,0:37:14.820 You have preempted so many of the[br]questions that were submitted. 0:37:14.820,0:37:18.060 Oh! [br]- We're getting you one, though. 0:37:19.500,0:37:24.330 Somewhat related to what you were just [br]speaking to, the question is: 0:37:24.330,0:37:27.840 soon we'll have blocks that allow you to[br]drag everything everywhere. We'll soon 0:37:27.840,0:37:32.220 have a ton of free images, patterns,[br]etc. How are we going to make all that 0:37:32.220,0:37:34.620 easy to understand and use for users? 0:37:39.150,0:37:43.980 Yeah, that's our problem. So this is[br]what is going to be, I think, the focus 0:37:43.980,0:37:54.510 of Core WordPress iterations over[br]5.9, 6.0, 6.1, and beyond. I'll say it in 0:37:54.510,0:37:58.800 an abstract sense, which is things like[br]user tests. And we do run these and we 0:37:58.800,0:38:03.390 publish them on our Make WordPress blogs,[br]which is where we'll ask someone 0:38:03.660,0:38:08.400 who has never used WordPress before,[br]"Please try it out." And this is something 0:38:08.400,0:38:11.580 proprietary software companies do all[br]the time. But in WordPress, we actually 0:38:11.580,0:38:15.450 publish these. And so you can see them[br]and you can learn from them. And you can 0:38:15.450,0:38:19.380 see what someone who's never used[br]WordPress before has trouble with using 0:38:19.380,0:38:23.190 and not using. Things that might be very,[br]very intuitive to people in this room 0:38:23.190,0:38:25.890 because we've been using WordPress for[br]five or 10 years, might be very 0:38:25.890,0:38:29.550 challenging to someone entirely new to the[br]concepts or the abstractions that we 0:38:29.550,0:38:34.860 use. The other example, which I hope[br]everyone listening to this does - because 0:38:34.860,0:38:40.110 if you're listening to this, you're like[br]a WordPress OG - is helping a friend use 0:38:40.110,0:38:46.230 WordPress. Right? I hear a laugh in the[br]front row. It's like that whole thing 0:38:46.230,0:38:51.840 like, "Friends don't let friends publish on[br]Wix." Take someone who's 0:38:51.840,0:38:56.910 building a website, you say, "All right,[br]I'm going to help you set this up." And 0:38:56.910,0:38:59.850 while you're doing that, you're probably[br]going to learn a lot of things that are 0:38:59.850,0:39:05.850 tough in WordPress. And hopefully, that[br]helps you then contribute a bug or an 0:39:05.850,0:39:08.670 improvement or something into the Core[br]software that makes it easier for 0:39:08.670,0:39:13.680 everyone else to use. By the way, to the extent[br]WordPress - again, that's what's amazing 0:39:13.680,0:39:19.530 about it to me. When you look at that[br]10 times larger than the second in the 0:39:19.530,0:39:26.340 marketplace - by the way, Shopify is a[br]company valued at like $140 billion. How 0:39:26.340,0:39:31.560 did we do that? How do we be 10 times[br]larger than that? It's just people 0:39:31.560,0:39:37.350 helping other people. I can't put it [br]more simply than that. It's how 0:39:37.350,0:39:41.370 WordPress has had basically no marketing[br]dollars through its whole history. Its 0:39:41.370,0:39:46.290 friends telling friends, like, "Hey, you[br]want a website? Let me help you set it 0:39:46.290,0:39:52.290 up." And then when they have trouble,[br]coming back to a cool WordPress Make 0:39:52.290,0:39:57.630 site or something else and saying, "Hey,[br]my friend had trouble with XYZ. Can - I 0:39:57.630,0:40:01.800 think if we move this around or change[br]this widget or make this button more prominent 0:40:01.800,0:40:09.060 or something like that - that would be[br]more intuitive for folks." And the beauty 0:40:09.060,0:40:12.480 of a project like WordPress, and there's[br]a few other open source projects which 0:40:12.480,0:40:17.760 are similar, is we can simultaneously[br]become more intuitive for new users at 0:40:17.760,0:40:23.790 the same time that we become more[br]powerful for power users. That's not 0:40:23.790,0:40:29.430 easy. I think it can only happen in the[br]digital realm. Like an SLR camera with 0:40:29.430,0:40:34.320 like 80 buttons can't also become[br]simultaneously easier for people 0:40:34.320,0:40:38.010 just taking their first photo. But in the[br]digital world, we can do that. And 0:40:38.010,0:40:42.210 that's actually really, really exciting.[br]So that's part of what excites me about 0:40:42.210,0:40:46.170 WordPress, and I hope is a part of what[br]people contribute in the future. 0:40:53.550,0:40:58.890 Another from the off site questions?[br]Let's see. This is from Sarah Gooding. 0:40:58.890,0:41:02.400 What can WordPress do to protect small[br]publishers from the threat of big tech 0:41:02.400,0:41:04.890 companies' greed and hostility to the[br]open web? 0:41:06.390,0:41:08.180 Oh, my goodness. 0:41:12.140,0:41:16.580 Big tech companies - was it [br]hostility to the open web? 0:41:16.580,0:41:18.012 Greed and hostility to the open web. 0:41:18.012,0:41:21.210 Greed and hostility. Oh, my goodness, [br]we're dealing with one of the 0:41:21.210,0:41:31.530 seven deadly sins. First, I'll say that[br]there's some giant tech companies whose 0:41:31.530,0:41:37.800 greed and hostility is somewhat aligned[br]with the open web. Meaning that a Google 0:41:38.190,0:41:44.490 who is indexing the web, is probably more[br]aligned with the mission of WordPress 0:41:44.790,0:41:50.160 than a Facebook, which is trying to[br]create an alternative to the open web or 0:41:50.160,0:41:56.340 other companies. Fill in the blank there.[br]So that's something to keep in mind. The 0:41:56.340,0:42:05.190 number one thing I think we can do is[br]create an alternative. So it's easy to 0:42:05.190,0:42:10.170 forget that someone starting a WordPress[br]might not want - the thing they 0:42:10.170,0:42:14.010 wake up in the morning and think about is[br]not like, "I want to make more open source 0:42:14.010,0:42:18.990 software in the world." They might be[br]thinking, "Hey, I want more customers in 0:42:18.990,0:42:26.670 my restaurant" or "I want more visitors,[br]to my salon" or "I want more readers of 0:42:26.670,0:42:31.800 my novel I'm working on." Like, whatever[br]it might be. And the beauty of WordPress 0:42:31.800,0:42:35.670 is there's so many things you can do on[br]top of it. It's that WordPress is a means 0:42:35.670,0:42:41.670 to an end. And this is our strength and[br]our weakness. On third-party measuring 0:42:41.670,0:42:47.880 services, like a Quantcast or a Nielsen[br]or something like that, like 0:42:47.880,0:42:52.980 a facebook.com or a google.com shows up as[br]one domain. And WordPress is, in many 0:42:52.980,0:42:57.210 ways, like the dark matter of the web[br]in that it's the thing that comprises 0:42:57.210,0:43:00.810 the majority of the universe, but[br]doesn't show up on one domain by 0:43:00.810,0:43:05.310 definition. It's across millions, tens -[br]hundreds of millions of different 0:43:05.310,0:43:10.170 domains and represents each person on[br]the domain owning a piece of the web. 0:43:10.170,0:43:15.810 It belongs to them. Literally domains,[br]I'm not - I'm going to pitch domains 0:43:15.810,0:43:20.700 here. Domains are like the most Web3[br]thing you could create. It really 0:43:20.700,0:43:29.790 belongs to you far more than almost[br]anything else. So I think what we can do 0:43:29.790,0:43:34.170 is - well, I'll tell you the biggest[br]thing I've learned, which goes a little 0:43:34.170,0:43:38.970 back to your question on what is a[br]thing to talk about to the youth or 0:43:38.970,0:43:45.210 people that create things. Early on, I[br]was like a Slashdot reading zealot. 0:43:46.350,0:43:50.160 Meaning like, I was like, "Ah, Microsoft[br]and Bill Gates are evil." I had a very 0:43:50.160,0:43:54.930 like, black and white view of the world[br]where I saw open source as good and 0:43:54.930,0:44:02.880 anything proprietary as bad. And it was[br]binary. As you mature, you learn that 0:44:02.880,0:44:11.790 things are not binary. It's grayscale.[br]It's duotone. And there's things that 0:44:11.790,0:44:14.730 are both simultaneously good and bad,[br]and things that exist on the 0:44:14.730,0:44:19.530 spectrum. And over time, I've chosen to[br]devote more of my life to things that I 0:44:19.530,0:44:24.210 feel like are on the side of the[br]spectrum that I want future generations - 0:44:24.210,0:44:30.690 if I ever have children or grandchildren -[br]them to experience of the web. But that 0:44:30.990,0:44:42.300 the - everything exists on the spectrum. I[br]would say that for - pure philosophy does 0:44:42.300,0:44:47.880 not win. Meaning that for folks, maybe[br]like here in the room, or some of the 0:44:47.880,0:44:53.490 folks watching the livestream, the idea of[br]owning your content, owning the software 0:44:53.490,0:44:57.330 that powers it and everything like that,[br]is very compelling. That's probably 0:44:57.330,0:45:04.530 compelling for like 1 or 2% of humanity.[br]We're at the very end of the bell curve 0:45:04.530,0:45:10.200 of folks who care about those[br]things. For the rest, if we want a 0:45:10.200,0:45:15.060 majority of the web - hopefully, I hope a[br]majority, or even like 85 or 90% of the 0:45:15.060,0:45:19.530 web to be powered by open source. For them,[br]we need to create the best user experience. 0:45:19.530,0:45:24.600 Meaning it needs to be the easiest. It needs [br]to be the most intuitive. And it needs to be 0:45:24.600,0:45:28.440 the thing that gets them towards[br]their goals the fastest. For many 0:45:28.440,0:45:33.240 people, that means WordPress will be[br]invisible. And that's okay. We don't 0:45:33.240,0:45:37.260 need people to even know what WordPress[br]is. If they're using WordPress, open 0:45:37.260,0:45:41.820 source, open API, open data, everything[br]to get to where they're going, that is 0:45:42.210,0:45:46.980 infinitely better than using proprietary[br]software to get from A to B. So we need 0:45:46.980,0:45:49.350 to create as many use cases, as many - 0:45:51.120,0:45:57.300 work on usability as much as possible to[br]create that. So that is my learning. And 0:45:57.300,0:46:01.470 something I hope we can all work together [br]great, because even if someone 0:46:01.470,0:46:04.860 doesn't realize that using open source[br]and making the web more open. If by 0:46:04.860,0:46:08.520 creating their website, creating their[br]restaurant, creating their online service 0:46:08.520,0:46:12.510 selling something online, they are doing[br]so in a way that makes the web even just 0:46:12.510,0:46:17.160 a smidgen more open. That's cool. That's[br]good for humanity. That's the part I 0:46:17.160,0:46:20.900 want future generations to grow up in. [br]Thank you. 0:46:25.595,0:46:27.347 Okay, we got two minutes. 0:46:27.347,0:46:30.802 - No, no. Two questions.[br]Two questions! Okay. 0:46:31.290,0:46:34.470 Well, how I talk, that could take 20[br]minutes. 0:46:35.325,0:46:38.635 - Okay, we're down to 20 minutes, so I'm [br]giving you five for each. 0:46:38.635,0:46:42.140 Okay, five minutes per for each question, [br]apparently. So. 0:46:48.630,0:46:53.310 Hi Matt, my name is Aaron Jorbin. I[br]probably came the shortest distance 0:46:53.310,0:46:59.220 because I live, like, three blocks away.[br]A couple of times, tonight, you've 0:46:59.220,0:47:03.960 talked about the GPL, the importance of[br]the GPL, the importance of the Four 0:47:03.960,0:47:08.910 Freedoms of the GPL. Over the last year,[br]there's been an effort to dual license 0:47:08.910,0:47:16.110 the Gutenberg repository, and thus allow[br]people to use the WordPress code in ways 0:47:16.110,0:47:20.100 that would not confer those four[br]freedoms on to future users of 0:47:20.100,0:47:26.280 WordPress. I'm wondering how that lines up[br]with your ideas of the four freedoms and 0:47:26.490,0:47:32.700 why I, as a contributor to WordPress,[br]should support my code being re-licensed 0:47:32.700,0:47:36.150 to remove the four freedoms from future[br]users? 0:47:37.200,0:47:41.100 That's such a good question. So thank[br]you, Aaron, for asking that. And also, 0:47:41.100,0:47:44.040 thank you for being someone else who[br]makes me not the only person in the room 0:47:44.040,0:47:51.690 with a suit. And Aaron looks great. So[br]thank you very much for that. Hopefully, 0:47:51.690,0:47:59.940 we get that on camera. So this is[br]interesting. So the GPL was created in 0:47:59.940,0:48:06.570 the 80s and 90s, and had no concept of,[br]essentially, delivery over the web. So 0:48:06.570,0:48:13.470 the GPL says that if you share something,[br]distribute it, which was - historically 0:48:13.470,0:48:17.880 means, distributed the source code over[br]like floppy disk, or CDs, or things like 0:48:17.880,0:48:23.580 that, you must confer the same freedoms.[br]But it didn't count if you were just 0:48:23.580,0:48:29.280 running your website, which is good and[br]bad. It's good in that, like, your 0:48:29.280,0:48:35.670 password file on your WordPress site is[br]not GPL. Right? You don't need to share 0:48:35.670,0:48:39.990 that to the world. There are licenses[br]like the Affero GPL and others that say 0:48:39.990,0:48:44.160 like you need to share everything, but it[br]also creates a loophole. So technically, 0:48:44.160,0:48:48.510 like WordPress.com doesn't need to share[br]any of its code back to the world. It 0:48:48.510,0:48:52.170 does. Those folks work really hard on[br]putting improvements back into 0:48:52.170,0:48:56.880 WordPress, but they're not required to because[br]delivery and distribution through SaaS 0:48:56.880,0:49:04.050 services does not confer the distribution [br]in which the GPL was intended. 0:49:04.050,0:49:14.070 In practice, we do it but in letter of [br]law, it's not required. Mobile apps 0:49:14.790,0:49:21.780 are whole new worlds. And again, there[br]is the ideal thing and there's the 0:49:21.780,0:49:30.360 pragmatic thing. Practical - ideally, I[br]would love to use a mobile device which 0:49:30.360,0:49:36.420 had firmer hardware, and everything[br]involved with it was fully open source. 0:49:37.620,0:49:44.250 Pragmatically, I need to use an Android[br]or iOS device, probably from Apple or 0:49:44.250,0:49:50.640 Samsung, that works. That has good[br]battery life and everything like that. 0:49:51.450,0:49:58.920 So I've always thought of myself as a[br]pragmatic, open source evangelist. 0:50:00.450,0:50:05.640 Gutenberg. Now how do we bring this to[br]Gutenberg? So, Gutenberg is trying to 0:50:05.640,0:50:16.860 create a pan-CMS or pan-creation[br]standard for things like blocks. We 0:50:16.860,0:50:21.930 think, or I think, that in Gutenberg,[br]if we can create a standard interface for 0:50:21.930,0:50:27.030 things like adding an image or the[br]basic things that you do within a block 0:50:27.030,0:50:33.600 interface, that is good for the web and[br]humanity. So part of that is that I 0:50:33.600,0:50:37.680 would really like to see even[br]proprietary systems adopt Gutenberg 0:50:37.680,0:50:43.650 blocks. I think that would be a win. You[br]know, I've made fun of some systems like 0:50:43.650,0:50:48.750 Wix and Squarespace or Mailchimp or[br]others. I think they - I would love 0:50:48.750,0:50:53.670 I would be thrilled if they all used[br]Gutenberg. And Gutenberg is licensed 0:50:53.670,0:50:57.750 under a way that, if you use it, you[br]don't have to make the rest of your 0:50:57.750,0:51:04.140 software also open source. So the way[br]the GPL is, is it's what's called a 0:51:04.140,0:51:10.020 "viral license." So if you use part of it,[br]everything else that links it also has 0:51:10.020,0:51:14.940 to be open source. Which I like for[br]WordPress. I like for everything I do. 0:51:15.480,0:51:21.750 But I also recognize that maybe, in[br]let's say, a mobile app, I might want to 0:51:21.750,0:51:25.590 have an open source-based editor that[br]uses the standards and code of 0:51:25.590,0:51:31.740 Gutenberg, but the rest of the app might[br]not be open source. Maybe it's the 0:51:31.740,0:51:36.390 Mailchimp app. Let's use Mailchimp as an[br]example. I don't have any relation to 0:51:36.390,0:51:42.120 Mailchimp. So I can talk about that.[br]Mailchimp's awesome, very successful, just 0:51:42.120,0:51:46.230 sold to Intuit for like $10 billion or[br]whatever. If you look at what they're 0:51:46.230,0:51:49.800 doing with their newsletter creator,[br]it's blocks. If you look at what they're 0:51:49.800,0:51:53.820 doing and like - and they don't actually[br]have a great mobile app yet, so it'd be 0:51:53.820,0:51:57.720 cool. So when we took our mobile apps -[br]which means developing Gutenberg three 0:51:57.720,0:52:03.210 times. We have to develop for the web,[br]iOS, and Android, which is a lot of 0:52:03.210,0:52:11.310 work. We are re-licensing the mobile[br]versions of Gutenberg as MIT, which 0:52:11.310,0:52:15.420 means that they can be embedded in[br]mobile apps, which are not also open 0:52:15.420,0:52:22.170 source. This gets into another weird[br]thing, which is all mobile apps are 0:52:22.170,0:52:28.740 mediated by app stores. I don't love[br]that, for the record. But it's the 0:52:28.740,0:52:32.460 reality. You're either going through[br]Google or Apple to distribute on an app 0:52:32.460,0:52:34.710 store to the majority of humans in the[br]world. 0:52:36.270,0:52:40.290 And you have to - when you distribute your[br]app, you kind of have to - you don't kind of, 0:52:40.290,0:52:46.380 you have to agree to their terms of[br]services and licenses, which are sort of 0:52:46.380,0:52:49.930 compatible with open source. Actually,[br]WordPress has been a pioneer there. 0:52:51.420,0:52:55.590 Apple originally did not allow GPL[br]applications to be distributed on the 0:52:55.590,0:53:02.850 Apple Store. And WordPress fought for[br]that. And we won it, essentially. And, in 0:53:02.850,0:53:08.700 fact, Apple has used WordPress code in[br]demos. So we kind of got the unofficial 0:53:08.700,0:53:13.230 blessing that like, our GPL app was okay[br]to be on the Apple store. But like, 0:53:13.380,0:53:18.720 that's still a process, which we fight[br]and we go for. Most famously - was it 0:53:18.720,0:53:20.580 last year that it happened? 0:53:21.420,0:53:24.285 Either last year or earlier this year, [br]it all blends together. 0:53:24.285,0:53:28.540 It all blends together. I don't know. [br]Post-COVID, everything's a real mix. 0:53:28.540,0:53:38.310 But that Apple issued an incredibly rare apology,[br]which Apple never does, where they had 0:53:38.310,0:53:43.980 sort of told the WordPress open source[br]app they needed to do something that 0:53:43.980,0:53:49.410 seemed a little outside of the[br]requirements and the license. And they - 0:53:49.800,0:53:55.590 someone higher up realized that and[br]walked it back. So not often that 0:53:55.590,0:53:59.820 happens with a $2 trillion company. But[br]it happened with WordPress and Apple. 0:54:00.480,0:54:04.680 And that was exciting. So we will[br]continue fighting wherever we can for 0:54:04.980,0:54:09.270 getting these app stores to open up a[br]little bit. We will also be pragmatic in 0:54:09.270,0:54:14.460 that in reality, everyone who has an[br]Apple or iOS device means you go to the 0:54:14.460,0:54:20.220 app stores to reach them. And I think[br]it's actually a flaw of - if we think of why 0:54:20.220,0:54:23.970 Drupal or Joomla hasn't done as well, I[br]think they need apps. And I've 0:54:23.970,0:54:28.193 encouraged those communities to create [br]great apps because they need them. 0:54:28.193,0:54:36.150 Why we're expanding the license of Gutenberg,[br]in particular, to be both GPL and MIT 0:54:36.150,0:54:40.890 is that I would like WordPress blocks - or[br]Gutenberg blocks to become standards 0:54:41.400,0:54:47.100 that are larger than just WordPress. And[br]there is a Drupal version of Gutenberg 0:54:47.100,0:54:51.960 etc. But I think part of that is that if[br]blocks can become standards across every 0:54:51.960,0:54:59.220 proprietary system. I make fun of Wix - I[br]think it's fair, they've earned it. But 0:54:59.220,0:55:06.810 if they adopted Gutenberg, I would toast [br]them and take them out to beers. 0:55:06.810,0:55:12.330 I think that'd be awesome. Gutenberg is[br]something even bigger than WordPress, 0:55:12.330,0:55:16.620 which is basically saying how do we edit[br]and create the web? And can we get as 0:55:16.620,0:55:21.600 many people - both proprietary and open[br]source - collaborating on that as possible? 0:55:21.600,0:55:26.370 So that is the bet we've made. Maybe it's[br]correct, maybe it's incorrect. I hope 0:55:26.370,0:55:30.480 that you, as a contributor, still are[br]excited about being part of Gutenberg, 0:55:30.690,0:55:35.430 even though it's Gutenberg and MIT,[br]which are both open source licenses. But 0:55:35.430,0:55:41.220 MIT, of course, allows proprietary[br]licensing. I understand that. The 0:55:41.220,0:55:46.170 majority of open source software in the[br]world is, well, I think majority is GPL. 0:55:46.170,0:55:52.980 But there's a big chunk that's non-GPL.[br]I think, what we're doing - folks in this 0:55:52.980,0:55:57.210 room, you and I - are creating more that[br]open source stuff. And if proprietary people 0:55:57.210,0:56:00.650 use it along the way to creating more open[br]source, I think that's great and okay. 0:56:01.260,0:56:03.690 Thank you.[br]- And thank you for wearing a suit. 0:56:03.690,0:56:06.300 And thank you for coming tonight. 0:56:10.440,0:56:15.840 Someone asked me earlier why I wear a[br]suit. And it's actually - one of my 0:56:15.840,0:56:22.170 favorite folks is Frank Sinatra. And he[br]talked about - someone asked why they 0:56:22.170,0:56:27.150 wore a tux every night to perform. And[br]he said to the other band members, he 0:56:27.150,0:56:32.190 said, "Well, if we were performing for[br]the king or queen, what would we wear? 0:56:32.520,0:56:37.290 We'd dress up. We'd wear a tux to perform[br]for them." And he said, "Well, every 0:56:37.290,0:56:42.240 single night that this band performs,[br]there might be someone in the audience 0:56:42.240,0:56:45.930 who saved up two months to be there, or[br]a waitress or someone like that, who 0:56:45.930,0:56:50.160 really worked to be there. And so, guess[br]what? We're gonna dress up for them and 0:56:50.160,0:56:55.560 perform for them like they are the King or[br]Queen of England." Royalty. Every person 0:56:55.560,0:56:58.380 in the audience is royalty. So that's[br]why I wear a suit every year. If you're 0:56:58.380,0:57:05.010 wondering. This is like the only suit I wear[br]during the year, but I wear it because I 0:57:05.010,0:57:09.660 consider every member of the WordPress[br]community to be royalty. And I dress up for 0:57:09.660,0:57:12.260 y'all. So thank you. 0:57:17.345,0:57:19.638 Alright, this is the last question. [br]I'm so excited. 0:57:19.638,0:57:20.582 Bring us home. 0:57:20.582,0:57:23.159 I think it's a short question. Hopefully[br]it wasn't already asked. 0:57:23.160,0:57:24.220 Can you introduce yourself? 0:57:24.220,0:57:29.550 Hi, I'm Rachel Winchester. Most people[br]know me as Win. I'm here for representing 0:57:29.550,0:57:35.580 DigitalCube. And I'm just curious if[br]the topic of internet art has made it on 0:57:35.580,0:57:38.010 your radar. And if it's something of[br]interest to you. 0:57:38.730,0:57:40.980 Tell me more about internet art. [br]How do you define it? 0:57:40.980,0:57:46.410 Well, internet art is browser art or web-based[br]art. But it's art that uses the Internet 0:57:46.410,0:57:51.720 as a medium. So it works with WordPress,[br]because WordPress is that paintbrush. 0:57:52.020,0:57:52.740 Hmm. 0:57:53.130,0:57:57.270 I will also call out that you have an amazing [br]Issey Miyake purse, who's one of my 0:57:57.270,0:58:03.780 favorite designers of all time. Thank[br]you for bringing that to the microphone 0:58:03.780,0:58:11.310 as well. What do you think about the[br]Openverse and internet art? Like this idea 0:58:11.310,0:58:14.340 that people could maybe even contribute[br]internet art to the Openverse? 0:58:14.340,0:58:19.350 Oh, I love the idea of making publicly accessible[br]images more accessible. 0:58:19.350,0:58:20.430 I love that idea. 0:58:21.929,0:58:30.239 That this is - it's an interesting[br]tension, right? Because artists create 0:58:30.239,0:58:37.229 things, and they want to earn a living[br]from the things they create. And people 0:58:37.229,0:58:41.699 create things and want to contribute it[br]to the commons of humanity. That becomes 0:58:41.699,0:58:45.599 part of what we remix, part of what we[br]build on, part of the foundation of what 0:58:45.599,0:58:50.309 creates the next generations, next[br]versions of what happens. And in 0:58:50.309,0:58:55.139 copyright law, which I would say is[br]popularly epitomized - since in United 0:58:55.139,0:58:59.789 States copyright law, you have an[br]ability to do that. You know, rest in 0:58:59.789,0:59:04.979 peace for Joe Ablow. Like, would talk[br]about his 3% rule where he would take an 0:59:04.979,0:59:12.449 existing thing, modify 3%, and create[br]something new. Incredible, right? One of 0:59:12.449,0:59:16.769 the great artists of our generations, in[br]so many ways, that affected popular 0:59:16.769,0:59:22.919 culture, that affected art, that affected so[br]many things through that taking something 0:59:22.919,0:59:27.719 that exists and modifying it. So I don't [br]know. I think that's the epitome 0:59:27.719,0:59:33.629 of open source. I would say that[br]WordPress' limitation is, before, that 0:59:33.629,0:59:38.309 was basically all in the code and[br]language realm. It was all about the 0:59:38.309,0:59:41.879 plugins, the themes - a little bit of[br]design, and the translations that were 0:59:41.879,0:59:47.249 open source. If you had to define what's[br]next for us, it's expanding through the 0:59:47.249,0:59:51.959 Openverse, through things that are[br]more content-driven: images, video, 0:59:51.959,0:59:59.069 audio, art. I'm a photographer. My[br]username is Photomatt. So I consider 0:59:59.399,1:00:06.389 photographs to be art and I hope to put[br]more and more of the art I create and 1:00:06.389,1:00:11.039 hopefully others into that commons, so[br]that is the basis for what generations 1:00:11.039,1:00:16.719 create in the future. So, thank you so[br]much. I appreciate the question. 1:00:22.339,1:00:25.590 And with that, I think we might be -[br]I mean, Josepha's coming up. 1:00:25.590,1:00:28.407 I've got two notes for everyone, [br]because I would, naturally. 1:00:28.407,1:00:30.170 Number one, there were a lot of questions 1:00:30.170,1:00:34.230 that were asked beforehand and [br]also in the livestream chat that we 1:00:34.230,1:00:38.100 did not get to. But just like last year,[br]we will have a blog post up where we can 1:00:38.100,1:00:43.440 get those answered for you all. Don't[br]worry. And my final, final thing, let's 1:00:43.440,1:00:47.040 have a round of applause for the folks[br]who put this event together and for our 1:00:47.040,1:00:48.420 excellent slide makers.