WEBVTT 00:00:18.800 --> 00:00:19.800 *37C3 Anspannungsmusik* 00:00:19.800 --> 00:00:20.800 *Applaus* 00:00:20.800 --> 00:00:24.150 Boris: All right so everybody can hear me very well my name is Boris I'm part of the 00:00:24.150 --> 00:00:27.720 ABC black cross Belarus and I will be talking about tractors Rockets and the 00:00:27.720 --> 00:00:32.680 internet and I have very short time so you will see very few things of those one 00:00:32.680 --> 00:00:37.320 thing we are in the sal g because I didn't want to be in the sal z. z as it's kind of 00:00:37.320 --> 00:00:40.200 like ideologically doesn't pass for people in the Eastern Europe 00:00:40.200 --> 00:00:46.820 *lachen, applaus* 00:00:46.820 --> 00:00:51.780 yeah and yeah we will have like a short question answer section in the end what 00:00:51.780 --> 00:00:55.220 the [ __ ] is ABC-Belarus? Many of you don't know we are like an activist 00:00:55.220 --> 00:00:59.149 Anarchist Collective that supports for the last 15 years people who ended up in 00:00:59.149 --> 00:01:04.390 prison fighting dictatorship in the country since our existence beginning of 00:01:04.390 --> 00:01:08.390 our existence we never had any people or we never had a situation where we never 00:01:08.390 --> 00:01:12.509 had people in the prison so people are constantly in prison in Belarus in the 00:01:12.509 --> 00:01:17.070 last 15 years fighting the dictatorship we do solidarity work also with those who are 00:01:17.070 --> 00:01:23.600 around the people who are in prisons so their families and so on we also promote 00:01:23.600 --> 00:01:27.100 we we promoting we don't have so much time left anymore but before building up a 00:01:27.100 --> 00:01:32.020 security culture so for the activists to know how to go around the new mechanisms 00:01:32.020 --> 00:01:37.460 of a dictatorship to suppress the population we do collect a little bit of 00:01:37.460 --> 00:01:41.960 data from like the courts so we see what the government is using for example to 00:01:41.960 --> 00:01:46.040 crack the laptops we see all this [ __ ] coming up in in the documents from time to 00:01:46.040 --> 00:01:50.299 time and this is not a talk about our group so you can check out our website and 00:01:50.299 --> 00:01:55.860 see what is it about so tractors here they are they don't always look like that 00:01:55.860 --> 00:02:01.070 sometimes they look like that tractors are one of the important parts of like for 00:02:01.070 --> 00:02:05.250 you to imagine how Belarusian industry looks like so after collapse of the Soviet 00:02:05.250 --> 00:02:12.340 Union Belarusia Bellarus was and remained like a zone of heavy and Light Industry 00:02:12.340 --> 00:02:19.260 production of tractors but also we had industry that was connected with war or 00:02:19.260 --> 00:02:24.190 militarism of the Soviet Union right? So there are factories that are producing 00:02:24.190 --> 00:02:28.610 small chips for the rockets and [ __ ] like that and this continues so partly 00:02:28.610 --> 00:02:33.660 Russian war industry on Belarus in production of the Rockets the situation 00:02:33.660 --> 00:02:37.920 where you know Russian Rockets hit wrong Target in Ukraine also connected with the 00:02:37.920 --> 00:02:42.360 fact that Belarusian workers are stealing precious metals from the factories. So 00:02:42.360 --> 00:02:48.319 like those produced chips are working like [ __ ] and we do have it but it's not like 00:02:48.319 --> 00:02:51.810 Taiwan or something like that it's more like imagine Soviet Union post Soviet 00:02:51.810 --> 00:02:58.190 Union country that people are doing like some outdated Technologies. Yeah. So those 00:02:58.190 --> 00:03:01.680 are like the topic about the Rockets. Belarus is participating in the war 00:03:01.680 --> 00:03:07.560 efforts of Russia right now and it was participating for very long in buildup to 00:03:07.560 --> 00:03:12.909 the war so helping producing enough rockets and enough of the you know like 00:03:12.909 --> 00:03:18.270 flying [ __ ] that goes to Ukraine right now. However after collapse of the Soviet 00:03:18.270 --> 00:03:22.080 Union Belarus became also very dependent and it was dependent and became dependent 00:03:22.080 --> 00:03:26.659 on Russian resources so oil gas and all this [ __ ] comes mostly from Russia 00:03:26.659 --> 00:03:32.770 economically dependent on Russia and that's politically dependent as well. 00:03:32.770 --> 00:03:36.840 Talking about Lukashenka so belus is a dictatorship that ruled by this guy, next 00:03:36.840 --> 00:03:42.049 year is 30 years anniversary. Lukashenka and Technologies he's a very special 00:03:42.049 --> 00:03:47.079 character you can do like lectures in universities about his personality I will 00:03:47.079 --> 00:03:51.269 do a couple of quotes about how he perceives Technologies and how he sees 00:03:51.269 --> 00:03:56.069 himself in the technological World. For example "we do not need an imported system 00:03:56.069 --> 00:04:21.850 for falsifying elections we will create our own one run by the State" so he's 00:04:21.850 --> 00:04:27.490 very close to the nature he thinks also shows his like attitude to Technologies 00:04:27.490 --> 00:04:31.380 and the last part is "I even don't have a mobile phone I'm looking at other 00:04:31.380 --> 00:04:35.770 presidents and see how they're preoccupied with their iPhones I'm not doing that I 00:04:35.770 --> 00:04:41.400 know what security is" and even more "I have enough people who can do that for me" 00:04:41.400 --> 00:04:45.280 and that's an important factor Lukashenka knows how to drive a tractor, he doesn't 00:04:45.280 --> 00:04:50.199 know how to operate iPhone most probably. But he's he has this mentality that 00:04:50.199 --> 00:04:54.370 understands okay I need enough smart people around me who will help me to go 00:04:54.370 --> 00:04:58.850 through the modern world and that's what he's doing a lot so he has quite a huge 00:04:58.850 --> 00:05:02.590 let's say cabinet of people who are helping him out to figure out the modern 00:05:02.590 --> 00:05:06.010 world in a different directions politically technologically wise 00:05:06.010 --> 00:05:11.500 economically. Although Belarus is a dictatorship it is a country that was for 00:05:11.500 --> 00:05:18.591 many years a partner of the European Union it changed recently before 2020 protest 00:05:18.591 --> 00:05:23.640 before the uprising of 2020 European Union was cooperating with Belarus on the border 00:05:23.640 --> 00:05:28.160 security what they're doing also in turkey and many other authoritarian regimes so 00:05:28.160 --> 00:05:31.680 for European politicians to protect the borders build up a fences it's fine to 00:05:31.680 --> 00:05:35.780 have like a bloody dictator that is ready to kill people. So that's what European 00:05:35.780 --> 00:05:40.230 Union was doing and that involved also transaction of Technologies so for example 00:05:40.230 --> 00:05:43.950 you go to the Belarusian border and you get in controlled and you have this huge 00:05:43.950 --> 00:05:47.660 x-ray machine that is going to x-ray your car or whatever [ __ ] you have and it's 00:05:47.660 --> 00:05:50.690 written like there's a plate that says like this machine is financed by the 00:05:50.690 --> 00:05:53.960 European Union and you think like wow thank you European Union you're like 00:05:53.960 --> 00:05:59.889 really helping democracy in Belarus. So European Union was also investing a lot in 00:05:59.889 --> 00:06:04.250 the infrastructure projects inside of the country roads and [ __ ] like that this 00:06:04.250 --> 00:06:07.539 was connected also because belus is Transit country so you need a lot of 00:06:07.539 --> 00:06:12.449 Transit between Russia and Europe not anymore but before it was the case right 00:06:12.449 --> 00:06:18.530 everybody wanted to trade with Russia a lot still do. Also some countries inside 00:06:18.530 --> 00:06:22.070 of the European Union were supporting police efforts in Belarus, there was a 00:06:22.070 --> 00:06:27.180 huge scandal in Germany that German cops were bringing Belarusian Riot cops to 00:06:27.180 --> 00:06:31.660 evictions of or like protection of Gorleben transport like the nuclear waste 00:06:31.660 --> 00:06:35.319 transport back in the days so they wouldn't have like Belarusian cops hitting 00:06:35.319 --> 00:06:39.130 you you know but they would have them like just sitting next to you and and watching 00:06:39.130 --> 00:06:43.300 how the German cops are working and that's where for example Belarusian cops learned 00:06:43.300 --> 00:06:47.380 to film everything at the demonstrations or at some events so they're also running 00:06:47.380 --> 00:06:51.310 with these cameras and filming and then post factum might apply repressions to the 00:06:51.310 --> 00:06:54.440 people who were participating in the protests and some of the cameras were 00:06:54.440 --> 00:07:02.000 donated generously by the German state to the Belarusian cops. And there are many 00:07:02.000 --> 00:07:09.680 more other money flows like ecological technological also private public 00:07:09.680 --> 00:07:14.090 everything goes in Belarus dictatorship yes but I mean money you know that cross 00:07:14.090 --> 00:07:20.130 the border easily. Very simple Technologies to fight the population, 00:07:20.130 --> 00:07:25.310 water cannons were brought from Canada so we had this fancy water Canadian water 00:07:25.310 --> 00:07:29.060 cannons I will show you how belarussian people hacked those during the protests 00:07:29.060 --> 00:07:34.100 very easy. Camera usage for documentation as I was mentioning cops running around 00:07:34.100 --> 00:07:37.780 with cameras all the time this is they what they learned from the German cops 00:07:37.780 --> 00:07:42.930 there were like a new technologies that were like mobile car Shields so they bring 00:07:42.930 --> 00:07:46.680 it up to block the whole street. Russians have like bigger machines belarusians have 00:07:46.680 --> 00:07:51.160 smaller machines but in general the idea is that you you have this kind of like a a 00:07:51.160 --> 00:07:54.819 truck that brings a huge shield and you block the whole street so protesters 00:07:54.819 --> 00:08:00.960 cannot go through it. And crowd control equipment from other countries like we had 00:08:00.960 --> 00:08:05.370 tear gas from Czech and stun grenades from Czech and Israelis and so on so like 00:08:05.370 --> 00:08:10.120 everybody were delivering and providing weapons to Belarus as if it's like sure 00:08:10.120 --> 00:08:14.900 you know we know that you doing some [ __ ] there but have it for you. But there are 00:08:14.900 --> 00:08:19.680 some other funny you know like hacking from Belarusian state so for example here 00:08:19.680 --> 00:08:24.340 like during the protest people were putting Flags like white red white flags 00:08:24.340 --> 00:08:31.910 which were the protest Flags [ __ ] I have to put the sound in one second but it's 00:08:31.910 --> 00:08:37.459 not really important what people was laughing about him *some laughs* So yeah 00:08:37.459 --> 00:08:41.519 this is one of the hack that this is I think somebody connected with the ban 00:08:41.519 --> 00:08:48.709 State who was trying to remove the flag then we have like this systems of 00:08:48.709 --> 00:08:54.310 notification in the city that were used to play like a patriotic music during the 00:08:54.310 --> 00:08:59.459 protests which Belarusian state was doing trying to like you know demoralize the 00:08:59.459 --> 00:09:06.120 protest testers looks [ __ ] bizarre and crazy and that was the hacking part of the 00:09:06.120 --> 00:09:10.320 Canadian water cannon Belarusian people are very creative you can see you love 00:09:10.320 --> 00:09:15.500 hacking we all love hacking that's how you hack the the water. 00:09:15.500 --> 00:09:22.529 *Applause* 00:09:22.529 --> 00:09:27.460 cannon. Later on they stopped using them because this what happened to them when 00:09:27.460 --> 00:09:28.870 you hack them 00:09:28.870 --> 00:09:29.940 *Music* 00:09:29.940 --> 00:09:39.621 yeah but they were they were very open for hacking like nothing is closed you can 00:09:39.621 --> 00:09:46.560 just open and take it away. Internet in Belarus right so this is a separate topic, 00:09:46.560 --> 00:09:50.720 we we are the country of the post Soviet so we didn't have internet for very long I 00:09:50.720 --> 00:09:55.660 think like the general consumers market for the internet opened like beginning of 00:09:55.660 --> 00:10:01.620 2000s maybe middle of 2000s I got my internet connection first 2004 - 2005 so 00:10:01.620 --> 00:10:05.930 internet is a is a is kind of like a thing that was developing very slowly but then 00:10:05.930 --> 00:10:12.620 it exploded. One of the things was for example internet like U online 00:10:12.620 --> 00:10:19.150 infrastructure was used for the protests in 2005 2005 wrong date of the elections 00:10:19.150 --> 00:10:24.930 so we had like a protest camp on the streets and people set up an indymedia 00:10:24.930 --> 00:10:30.670 media information point which was broadcasting updates online life you know. 00:10:30.670 --> 00:10:34.170 And this was one of the first situations in Belarus where the website started 00:10:34.170 --> 00:10:38.670 getting blocked. So Belarus in IND media was the first attemp of Belarusian state 00:10:38.670 --> 00:10:42.800 to fight certain content on the internet there was like mirrors there was a lot of 00:10:42.800 --> 00:10:46.700 solidarity also from outside. So this worked pretty well for the protesters 00:10:46.700 --> 00:10:51.040 didn't work so well for the government the protest was smashed, but for a lot of 00:10:51.040 --> 00:10:54.529 people the opportunity of organizing through the internet became very obvious 00:10:54.529 --> 00:11:00.399 and people started using it in mass later on Belarusian State started blocking from 00:11:00.399 --> 00:11:05.640 2016 tour network with different success of course like you can't block it with 00:11:05.640 --> 00:11:10.680 tractors putting it on the road so you need more sufficient you know like or 00:11:10.680 --> 00:11:14.810 complicated systems and of course you can't get them easily in Belarus from the 00:11:14.810 --> 00:11:19.800 factories that are producing Rockets. You can't hit the tour network with the rocket 00:11:19.800 --> 00:11:24.740 so like they started searching for those and you can see that like three years 00:11:24.740 --> 00:11:28.000 Belarusian cops were going to security congresses where like this private 00:11:28.000 --> 00:11:33.060 companies was selling [ __ ] to anybody pretty much and they were searching for 00:11:33.060 --> 00:11:37.370 Solutions there were like for 2014 I think there was a hacking team Italian hacking 00:11:37.370 --> 00:11:41.180 team leak where we figure out that Belarusian state was trying to buy 00:11:41.180 --> 00:11:44.440 something from Italians and stuff like that, right? So at the end of the day they 00:11:44.440 --> 00:11:48.720 got some stuff in 2016 and slowly started applying more and more censorship in on 00:11:48.720 --> 00:11:52.130 the internet, Anarchist websites oppositional websites starting getting 00:11:52.130 --> 00:11:57.560 blocked in 2020 this system like exploded in Mass so we have like hundreds and 00:11:57.560 --> 00:12:03.120 hundreds of the websites some of them like you know islamist [ __ ] and and stuff 00:12:03.120 --> 00:12:06.400 like that but some of them are legit oppositional anarchists and stuff like 00:12:06.400 --> 00:12:13.410 that that are blocked and you can't access them through like a normal Network. Yeah 00:12:13.410 --> 00:12:20.690 and right now because Belarusian state was under attack for quite often from certain 00:12:20.690 --> 00:12:25.209 groups, a lot of websites governmental websites kind of created a white listing 00:12:25.209 --> 00:12:31.430 just for belarian IPs so you can't go to the belarusian state websites from outside 00:12:31.430 --> 00:12:36.340 so a lot of people paradoxically left the country live in Exile but use Belarusian 00:12:36.340 --> 00:12:42.190 VPN to know if they're included in extremist the terrorist lists. Yeah so one 00:12:42.190 --> 00:12:45.440 more thing about Belarusian internet and Belarusian like communication 00:12:45.440 --> 00:12:49.250 infrastructure is sorm, some of you have heard about it this is like a saying that 00:12:49.250 --> 00:12:53.160 was developed for many years and there are different versions of it and it's pretty 00:12:53.160 --> 00:13:00.910 much backdoor like legal back door to put into the networks of the communication 00:13:00.910 --> 00:13:07.389 providers before it was just a smart smartphone a cell network now it's also 00:13:07.389 --> 00:13:11.460 internet Network and so on internet providers you just put a black box and the 00:13:11.460 --> 00:13:15.310 cops somewhere on the other side of the of the country can have access to your 00:13:15.310 --> 00:13:19.740 network directly and they can see all the what is happening on the network and they 00:13:19.740 --> 00:13:25.010 you know like clone easily IDs and so on and so forth so they are like owning 00:13:25.010 --> 00:13:29.580 pretty much the net the private networks of the private providers also what is not 00:13:29.580 --> 00:13:36.070 mentioned on the slides Belarusian internet is in one way or another is 00:13:36.070 --> 00:13:39.890 governmental so you have like one exit for the internet to the outside world and this 00:13:39.890 --> 00:13:43.570 is controlled by the state and all the private companies that are working with 00:13:43.570 --> 00:13:47.390 the internet are actually like renting internet from the state and then reselling 00:13:47.390 --> 00:13:52.620 it to the private biders. Internet censorship so I was telling you that they 00:13:52.620 --> 00:13:57.930 were going and buying [ __ ] on the market one of the things that kind of blew out 00:13:57.930 --> 00:14:02.930 and we figure out in 2020 was this company sandvine you might have heard about it 00:14:02.930 --> 00:14:13.500 they were selling pretty much the the gear the hardware for for censoring traffic in 00:14:13.500 --> 00:14:16.709 the first days after elections but the network was set up already for longer so 00:14:16.709 --> 00:14:20.090 it was not like s Vine is rushing into Minsk and on the day of Elections but 00:14:20.090 --> 00:14:23.710 rather this was sold for some years before and the Belarus and state was successfully 00:14:23.710 --> 00:14:29.759 using it and on the day of Elections like we lost internet connection for most of 00:14:29.759 --> 00:14:35.459 the country. There was also coming a lot of assistance days following that from 00:14:35.459 --> 00:14:40.240 Russian and Chinese government who would try to you know nav help to navigate 00:14:40.240 --> 00:14:44.750 Belarusian government through the fact that they basically shut down not only 00:14:44.750 --> 00:14:47.769 like a protest infrastructure but their own infrastructure because a lot of their 00:14:47.769 --> 00:14:51.399 own [ __ ] was dependent on the internet and that was one of the reasons why 00:14:51.399 --> 00:14:55.210 internet was returned to Belarus three days later as a lot of repressive 00:14:55.210 --> 00:15:00.579 infrastructure was not working for the state. Yeah so those were very supportive 00:15:00.579 --> 00:15:05.009 of Belarusian regime and they're still doing that but there were some also 00:15:05.009 --> 00:15:09.430 private companies that were helping Belarus to deal with the protests 00:15:09.430 --> 00:15:16.470 Microsoft I mean there is a lot of pirated Microsoft installs but Skype server 00:15:16.470 --> 00:15:20.740 infrastructure was used for prosecuting protesters this was very handy so you 00:15:20.740 --> 00:15:25.069 would have a court, where there will be like just a computer standard, like it's 00:15:25.069 --> 00:15:28.721 not really technological country so much right? So in the court there will be a 00:15:28.721 --> 00:15:32.339 laptop and there would be like a guy in the Mask who would be a witness in the 00:15:32.339 --> 00:15:36.709 case of the of the protesters and it takes around like 2 minutes to prosecute the 00:15:36.709 --> 00:15:41.510 person for them to get like 15 25 days in prison. The person leaves and then there 00:15:41.510 --> 00:15:45.579 is a new case and quite often there were like the same cops basically testifying 00:15:45.579 --> 00:15:49.459 for the people on many on multiple occasions and this provided a lot of 00:15:49.459 --> 00:15:53.000 anonymity from one side for the infrastructure of repressions because the 00:15:53.000 --> 00:15:56.610 cops didn't ha:ve to be at the place and they couldn't be identified but on the 00:15:56.610 --> 00:16:01.680 other side it provided allso this kind of like a mobility of repressions. You don't 00:16:01.680 --> 00:16:05.120 need to bring another cop who would stand there and he doesn't know what to read and 00:16:05.120 --> 00:16:10.430 to say and so on and so forth. So this was there and this was like Skype was not in 00:16:10.430 --> 00:16:14.931 any way you know and Microsoft was not in any way reacting how the Belarusian state 00:16:14.931 --> 00:16:21.040 is using their services in the country at that .Then we had cinezis, cinezis is like 00:16:21.040 --> 00:16:24.550 a Belarusian company that was developing a face recognition system and this smart 00:16:24.550 --> 00:16:30.870 City [ __ ] and all the crap you can find on the pages of the internet days. So one 00:16:30.870 --> 00:16:36.360 of the products they had was keypod and this was basically like a life face 00:16:36.360 --> 00:16:40.470 recognition system that they installed in Minsk. And this keypod was used for 00:16:40.470 --> 00:16:45.850 identifying also protesters during the protests and also identifying High Target 00:16:45.850 --> 00:16:50.420 like high political Targets in the city at some point. So for example one of the 00:16:50.420 --> 00:16:56.269 congress warrs an anarchist was arrested through like a common operation of keypod. 00:16:56.269 --> 00:16:59.560 That was telling the police that he's there so they would follow him to the 00:16:59.560 --> 00:17:03.600 place where he was living underground and so on and so forth. So, face recognition 00:17:03.600 --> 00:17:08.410 system worked pretty well in certain situations right? They were also using 00:17:08.410 --> 00:17:13.380 like their own face recognition system for postprocess so they get images of high 00:17:13.380 --> 00:17:17.730 resolution from Big crowds like 100,000 people and from there they would pick up 00:17:17.730 --> 00:17:22.589 some faces of the protesters and this would be like ending up in the court cases 00:17:22.589 --> 00:17:25.860 of the people. So you would have like a print out from keod system that was saying 00:17:25.860 --> 00:17:31.559 okay we identify this person like this and that. The CEO of the company is like a son 00:17:31.559 --> 00:17:37.799 of the KGB agent so they had like a lot of connections with the state and what else 00:17:37.799 --> 00:17:42.620 is here? Like the company itself was trying to present itself, we are like an 00:17:42.620 --> 00:17:46.980 IT company that is doing just a you know like a nice thing for everybody and make 00:17:46.980 --> 00:17:52.321 people happy in Belarus. But reality was different and we figured that also po 00:17:52.321 --> 00:17:57.120 factum I think a month later there was a bigger article published on what they're 00:17:57.120 --> 00:18:00.530 doing and how they are basically like helping out the Belarusian state to 00:18:00.530 --> 00:18:07.510 suppress the uprising. And here we also have a great Corporation Called Intel that 00:18:07.510 --> 00:18:12.520 doesn't you know for whom money also doesn't smell it's it's very funny because 00:18:12.520 --> 00:18:18.409 intel was very proud of cooperating with cinezis till 2022 even though cinezis was 00:18:18.409 --> 00:18:22.909 on sanction under sanctions in the European Union by that time but US was not 00:18:22.909 --> 00:18:27.020 sanctioning. So when the fullscale war in Ukraine broke broke out cinezis ended up 00:18:27.020 --> 00:18:32.190 on us sanction list so intel was like okay we we this is not good imagery for us, so 00:18:32.190 --> 00:18:36.510 they deleted the keypod page from their website, where they were very proud of it 00:18:36.510 --> 00:18:42.500 but if you search keypod Intel it's you still find a Chinese page like a page in 00:18:42.500 --> 00:18:46.590 Chinese on the Intel website that still does like all this [ __ ] advertisement we 00:18:46.590 --> 00:18:49.860 are helping human rights and developing Technologies and progress and blah blah 00:18:49.860 --> 00:18:54.280 blah. So Intel is still partly proud of cooperating with the repressive 00:18:54.280 --> 00:18:59.750 organization in belarus but only for the Chinese market most probably. Social 00:18:59.750 --> 00:19:04.490 networks, so there is like a certain you know a hype around that telegram was used 00:19:04.490 --> 00:19:10.000 a lot to coordinate protest and so on and so forth but reality I mean and it was 00:19:10.000 --> 00:19:17.360 but reality the other side of the coin was that we ended up in quite a [ __ ] storm 00:19:17.360 --> 00:19:23.049 because people could be identified through the telegram or the way telegram is built 00:19:23.049 --> 00:19:28.140 through ID IDs like the unique IDs that are doesn't matter if you change the phone 00:19:28.140 --> 00:19:32.640 number and so on and so forth. So a lot of people ended up being prosecuted because 00:19:32.640 --> 00:19:38.159 they did some [ __ ] on telegram and in like the further we went after repressions 00:19:38.159 --> 00:19:42.620 of the uprising the more ridiculous those could be, like even putting you know a [ 00:19:42.620 --> 00:19:48.150 __ ] Emoji under information that a KGB agent was shot during a raid would be 00:19:48.150 --> 00:19:54.830 enough to start criminal prosecution against you. So those things became very 00:19:54.830 --> 00:19:58.880 problematic and at the end of the day we've seen that Belarusian in state is 00:19:58.880 --> 00:20:04.130 observing not only telegram but also other social networks. Telegram at that point 00:20:04.130 --> 00:20:07.620 was not really Cooperative with belarussian State and they were still 00:20:07.620 --> 00:20:11.860 selling like Durov was still selling this you know image of we are like for the 00:20:11.860 --> 00:20:18.470 human rights and for people and all this [ __ ] but by the time like a year later 00:20:18.470 --> 00:20:24.140 we ended up with a situation when the protest like died out that Durov started 00:20:24.140 --> 00:20:28.620 blocking like telegram started blocking certain website certain [ __ ] not 00:20:28.620 --> 00:20:33.480 websites certain channels in telegram that were for example dedoxing police or 00:20:33.480 --> 00:20:38.070 documenting police violence and and court cases and so on and so forth. So those 00:20:38.070 --> 00:20:41.660 channels are for example like U there is a channel that is called Belarusian 00:20:41.660 --> 00:20:44.900 punishers that has a list of police officers who were responsible for the 00:20:44.900 --> 00:20:52.309 violence and this is blocked on Telegram and you can't find it. Official point of 00:20:52.309 --> 00:20:56.500 like telegram this is not us saying, they said okay Apple actually forced us to do 00:20:56.500 --> 00:21:01.230 that but reality is that it goes both ways. You know like you have to cooperate 00:21:01.230 --> 00:21:05.880 with each other for this to to happen and this was happening on one side on the 00:21:05.880 --> 00:21:12.220 other side telegram was blocking also channels of the same kind of groups in 00:21:12.220 --> 00:21:16.150 Russia that were also dedoxing cops who were using violence and who were 00:21:16.150 --> 00:21:20.880 participating in repressions even after the fullscale invasion. So we see a lot of 00:21:20.880 --> 00:21:25.559 censorship and a lot of cooperation happening after like the protest, so 00:21:25.559 --> 00:21:29.010 during the the active phase like they would be like yeah we standing with you 00:21:29.010 --> 00:21:33.680 and you're almost one so we would like to be with you but when you know they see 00:21:33.680 --> 00:21:37.529 that the status quo is maintained they start cooperating they start like 00:21:37.529 --> 00:21:42.490 following the laws of the country even if those laws are oppressive or doesn't make 00:21:42.490 --> 00:21:47.680 any [ __ ] sense and so on and so forth. Yeah and vkontakte, I think you know this 00:21:47.680 --> 00:21:52.710 is like a social network in Russia, they are like completely working with FSB and 00:21:52.710 --> 00:21:56.140 and [ __ ] and Belarusian State also has pretty much direct access on what you're 00:21:56.140 --> 00:22:01.970 doing there. So there there were some people organizing but for even like normal 00:22:01.970 --> 00:22:06.020 people it became clear that like don't use Russian social networks, this is like a 00:22:06.020 --> 00:22:10.770 bad idea and then apparently you shouldn't use Chinese social networks and maybe 00:22:10.770 --> 00:22:15.400 don't use social networks in general because a lot of them have like a 00:22:15.400 --> 00:22:19.330 potential of repressions of not on the individuals but the social movements and 00:22:19.330 --> 00:22:25.940 and [ __ ] like that. Mobile phones and data collection. So what did we figure out 00:22:25.940 --> 00:22:32.340 during the protests and and the last years celebrate of course they are [ __ ] happy 00:22:32.340 --> 00:22:37.820 to to sell themselves to any repressive regime so Belarus is not an exception and 00:22:37.820 --> 00:22:41.760 they they're they they were used they're still used so belarusan state is still 00:22:41.760 --> 00:22:46.659 buying celebrite licenses through some third party companies and I mean sanctions 00:22:46.659 --> 00:22:50.400 is is a [ __ ] joke in general. And even the companies who are saying we are not 00:22:50.400 --> 00:22:55.721 doing that in most cases they are doing that but through the third party. Data 00:22:55.721 --> 00:23:01.159 dumps so through cellebride but through other certain other companies you just get 00:23:01.159 --> 00:23:06.460 like a set of phones right and I don't know there would be like 500 people 00:23:06.460 --> 00:23:11.140 detained there would be all the phones confiscated and the cops would be dumping 00:23:11.140 --> 00:23:16.559 all the data from those phones and then you know like they wouldn't have a time to 00:23:16.559 --> 00:23:20.320 go through this data at the point but then you might be prosecuted in half a year 00:23:20.320 --> 00:23:26.220 later for what they found from those phones. And also you know like there is a 00:23:26.220 --> 00:23:30.020 lot discussions you're the Congress as well and in general in the security 00:23:30.020 --> 00:23:34.169 Community the strong passwords you know encryption is very important but we 00:23:34.169 --> 00:23:40.120 figured out that you know encryption works very bad if they're torturing you. And 00:23:40.120 --> 00:23:43.590 that was the Belarusian like way to break encryption, they didn't try to you know 00:23:43.590 --> 00:23:48.220 make a technological way into this, but rather they [ __ ] you up to the point 00:23:48.220 --> 00:23:52.700 where you decide okay I rather die or I give them the password and quite often it 00:23:52.700 --> 00:23:57.120 worked pretty well and it worked also in the way like not retrospectively but in a 00:23:57.120 --> 00:24:02.370 in a threaten way so you know, okay some people were tortured to get access to the 00:24:02.370 --> 00:24:05.970 encrypted drives and other people would be like okay I give you the password without 00:24:05.970 --> 00:24:11.831 torture. So encryption doesn't work against torture in Belarusian State and in 00:24:11.831 --> 00:24:17.190 many other cases and this is yeah it doesn't matter how perfect your security 00:24:17.190 --> 00:24:23.169 system built technologically wise quite often the human factor is still the the 00:24:23.169 --> 00:24:27.320 the weakest link in the whole situation. Then we had situations where the cops were 00:24:27.320 --> 00:24:30.900 impersonating activists. Up to the point where they were registering like for 00:24:30.900 --> 00:24:34.620 example on the dating apps and putting like naked pictures that they would get 00:24:34.620 --> 00:24:38.429 from the data damps and so on and then people would be calling those activists 00:24:38.429 --> 00:24:42.980 hooking up with them and so on and so forth. Sim cloning that's a huge thing 00:24:42.980 --> 00:24:49.690 that I think people should [ __ ] like get engraved in their like brain that's that 00:24:49.690 --> 00:24:53.250 your phone and the SIM cards that you get do not belong to you you are like 00:24:53.250 --> 00:24:57.179 borrowing them from the companies and quite often if the companies have or the 00:24:57.179 --> 00:25:01.510 state has access to the companies then the state owns those and that means the state 00:25:01.510 --> 00:25:05.110 owns your [ __ ] phone number and that means phone number is not unique 00:25:05.110 --> 00:25:11.210 identification. So we had a lot of situations where telegram accounts were 00:25:11.210 --> 00:25:15.549 hijacked by the state just by you know like cloning the SIM card and getting all 00:25:15.549 --> 00:25:21.700 the access and normal person wouldn't put a password on your account. Yeah so be 00:25:21.700 --> 00:25:27.830 aware of that and please like stop using that for your you know technological 00:25:27.830 --> 00:25:32.501 things you're doing or software that you are developing this is not a secure way in 00:25:32.501 --> 00:25:40.350 any way. This also goes to Signal people. Traffic analysis yes as I was mentioning 00:25:40.350 --> 00:25:44.390 like the [ __ ] storm is there so they're trying to identify what people are doing 00:25:44.390 --> 00:25:48.380 and this might be also a reason for a house rate or something like that if your 00:25:48.380 --> 00:25:55.649 traffic looks suspicious. Resistance so resistance unfortunately is very low 00:25:55.649 --> 00:26:02.250 technologically speaking so there's not so much of like you know laser rifles and [ 00:26:02.250 --> 00:26:05.910 __ ] like that. But rather and and and that's like unfortunately the story of 00:26:05.910 --> 00:26:11.820 resistance against authoritarian regimes, that normally even when the state has like 00:26:11.820 --> 00:26:16.380 very sophisticated heat guns and [ __ ] like that people end up on the streets 00:26:16.380 --> 00:26:21.500 with the stones and sticks and that was the case also in Belarus. However people 00:26:21.500 --> 00:26:26.799 started learning Technologies very fast so there were a lot of people who learned how 00:26:26.799 --> 00:26:33.260 to use toxy tor VPN, you see how the whole usage of those Services spiked during the 00:26:33.260 --> 00:26:37.529 protest and this is not like you know your 20 30 year old friends but rather like 00:26:37.529 --> 00:26:42.580 older people 50 60 who were forced into doing that, because they are interested in 00:26:42.580 --> 00:26:46.130 joining the protest. So to be part of the protest you actually have to learn how to 00:26:46.130 --> 00:26:51.179 do those. We also figured out that mesh networks although it's such a great idea 00:26:51.179 --> 00:26:55.700 and maybe one day on the other planet it will work out but for your average 00:26:55.700 --> 00:27:00.440 protester and average participant in in like an anti-authoritarian uprising this 00:27:00.440 --> 00:27:04.559 is not the case you can't [ __ ] get them working and people are not really capable 00:27:04.559 --> 00:27:09.279 of of using them. Destruction of surveillance property so there were people 00:27:09.279 --> 00:27:13.120 who would just go around and smash the [ __ ] cameras that was the way to resist 00:27:13.120 --> 00:27:18.789 the facial recognition system. Hacking of infrastructure so there were a lot of 00:27:18.789 --> 00:27:23.930 different attempts and the biggest one I think was hacking into the ID database 00:27:23.930 --> 00:27:28.830 where which brought like a lot of other stuff so there databases of all this 00:27:28.830 --> 00:27:32.960 Belarusian citizens their criminal records and and [ __ ] like that available to 00:27:32.960 --> 00:27:38.850 certain groups right now and this gives also opportunity to look into police 00:27:38.850 --> 00:27:43.500 activity and what the cops are doing what they own where they work and so on and so 00:27:43.500 --> 00:27:49.890 Forth. The doxxing of the police officers and regime functions like the judges and 00:27:49.890 --> 00:27:54.559 other bureaucrats basically as I was mentioning like on telegram you have this 00:27:54.559 --> 00:27:59.769 whole list like thousands and tens of thousands of people there is also a map so 00:27:59.769 --> 00:28:04.000 you can have a look if you're living next to a [ __ ] in your house who is like a 00:28:04.000 --> 00:28:07.490 colonel of repression operatus or something like that so this is also 00:28:07.490 --> 00:28:11.399 helping a lot but it also build up a lot of pressure on the police because police 00:28:11.399 --> 00:28:15.410 apparently think if you know if you know the address of the police officer most 00:28:15.410 --> 00:28:19.020 probably you will go and smash his [ __ ] house and kill everybody and so on which 00:28:19.020 --> 00:28:23.580 didn't didn't happen but it did provide a certain pressure on the repression 00:28:23.580 --> 00:28:29.420 apparatus. We also ended up with the solution for like what do you do when the 00:28:29.420 --> 00:28:34.169 cops torture you for your password for encrypted hard drive you break your hard 00:28:34.169 --> 00:28:38.381 drive and sometimes maybe you wouldn't be able to break your hard drive so you do 00:28:38.381 --> 00:28:42.730 like this thing that they do in the movies you know in US you break the screen. *some 00:28:42.730 --> 00:28:47.840 laughs* Really bizarre right but it works the the point here and I'm not talking 00:28:47.840 --> 00:28:51.580 about the laptop the point here is you have a smartphone and there you have 00:28:51.580 --> 00:28:57.519 something going on so if you smash it the average Riot cob guy doesn't know what 00:28:57.519 --> 00:29:03.450 what to do with it, so he can't torture you to open it right it doesn't work. And 00:29:03.450 --> 00:29:07.200 that was like a solution for a lot of activist so basically if you are in the 00:29:07.200 --> 00:29:12.690 danger of being arrested you just break the phone and you have this buffer time 00:29:12.690 --> 00:29:16.990 when the cops arrest you put you in jail and blah blah blah and this expert comes 00:29:16.990 --> 00:29:21.450 who knows how to you know open the phone that has a broken screen. And that's kind 00:29:21.450 --> 00:29:26.480 of like a place where most of the torture happens so you're capable of avoiding and 00:29:26.480 --> 00:29:31.549 the cops also figured out that pretty fast so they started trying to get you arrested 00:29:31.549 --> 00:29:35.059 before you break that and I have a story like of a friend who you know like who was 00:29:35.059 --> 00:29:38.320 laying on the ground and he was putting his hand in the pocket and like smashing 00:29:38.320 --> 00:29:42.570 the screen and he did it and the cops were like how did you do that we were formed 00:29:42.570 --> 00:29:47.000 sitting on you you couldn't [ __ ] move so these kind of things and these kind of 00:29:47.000 --> 00:29:53.210 things I think saved at least a health of certain people and also there was a lot of 00:29:53.210 --> 00:29:57.929 online education where there were like workshops for the people how to figure out 00:29:57.929 --> 00:30:02.490 out their smartphone security their telegram security and [ __ ] like that. 00:30:02.490 --> 00:30:06.669 This is one of the examples of online education that is not connected with the 00:30:06.669 --> 00:30:11.279 security of the smartphones it is more about production of new technologies 00:30:11.279 --> 00:30:17.230 right? In Belarus not connected the tractors and those are like just to 00:30:17.230 --> 00:30:22.810 immobilize the police Vans Yeah so this this was a lot of this kind of online 00:30:22.810 --> 00:30:27.130 education as well the interesting fact again that a lot of people were afraid to 00:30:27.130 --> 00:30:31.850 put to do that online education because eventually on many social networks you can 00:30:31.850 --> 00:30:38.130 get banned for that like if you put you know how do you say a video how to make 00:30:38.130 --> 00:30:44.240 molotov cocktail this is considered illegal activity and you know your account 00:30:44.240 --> 00:30:54.210 can be banned and [ __ ] like that and I think people in not in the first World War 00:30:54.210 --> 00:30:59.159 figure that out a lot. Like people who are in in Palestine and in many other places 00:30:59.159 --> 00:31:02.850 figure that you know the repressions are working from the private companies against 00:31:02.850 --> 00:31:07.990 them when they're fighting against the regimes. Conclusions so this is a small 00:31:07.990 --> 00:31:12.710 sticker that says if you can't break the dictatorship you can still burn it down. 00:31:12.710 --> 00:31:15.549 *laughter* 00:31:15.549 --> 00:31:21.320 Conclusions are very short there they can there is a lot to talk about. Capitalism 00:31:21.320 --> 00:31:27.460 is [ __ ] evil I mean hundreds of years of this [ __ ] up story you I hope all of you 00:31:27.460 --> 00:31:31.210 figured this out this is not really a [ __ ] mystery you know you don't have to come 00:31:31.210 --> 00:31:36.049 from USSR indoctrinated by Marxism leninism to know that capitalism is evil 00:31:36.049 --> 00:31:39.960 and capitalism 00:31:39.960 --> 00:31:43.980 *Many Applaus* 00:31:43.980 --> 00:31:48.059 and capitalism destroys lives not only here you know like in in Germany in US or 00:31:48.059 --> 00:31:52.120 whatever and your political life but it destroys lives everywhere in Belarus, 00:31:52.120 --> 00:31:56.730 Myanmar, Hong Kong, Syria like the [ __ ] corporations and the [ __ ] private 00:31:56.730 --> 00:32:02.570 business is ready to sell anything even their [ __ ] mothers and brothers and 00:32:02.570 --> 00:32:09.820 sisters to the dictators just to make money. Your phone number is not a good ID 00:32:09.820 --> 00:32:14.360 it's a bad ID don't [ __ ] use it ever because it can be easily identified in 00:32:14.360 --> 00:32:19.260 Germany as well in many other countries it is like it it's a [ __ ] like if giving a 00:32:19.260 --> 00:32:23.149 passport. Just when you are registering with your phone number just imagine that 00:32:23.149 --> 00:32:25.909 you're giving a passport to some company right? 00:32:25.909 --> 00:32:28.660 Someone from the audience: taking pictures. 00:32:28.660 --> 00:32:34.470 Boris: Yeah password is a good thing, still, many years after you can also 00:32:34.470 --> 00:32:39.700 forget it. You get a concussion you forget it, you get tortured you forget it, 00:32:39.700 --> 00:32:44.490 password is good right? Surveillance is good for the state bad for society so all 00:32:44.490 --> 00:32:50.500 those corporations that are selling right now also in Western world the business of 00:32:50.500 --> 00:32:55.830 surveillance they are destroying the social glue of the society and this is 00:32:55.830 --> 00:33:00.279 like a different topic but but in general like surveillance is destructive for us as 00:33:00.279 --> 00:33:05.870 a humankind. Western private companies are crucial for the dictatorship, we are not 00:33:05.870 --> 00:33:09.110 living in the world where you know like the dictators have horses and they are 00:33:09.110 --> 00:33:14.529 riding them into the crowd and like w hooray but rather a lot of technologies 00:33:14.529 --> 00:33:19.600 that are used by the state by the Belarusian state but also by Syrian state, 00:33:19.600 --> 00:33:23.250 by Russian state are not the technologies that were developed within the small 00:33:23.250 --> 00:33:27.690 states by the local companies but rather a lot of technologies that were brought in 00:33:27.690 --> 00:33:32.450 and developed in this countries where we are sitting you know? And they were 00:33:32.450 --> 00:33:38.500 developed under certain freedom but at the same time they are now used to engrave the 00:33:38.500 --> 00:33:42.929 dictatorship and those dictatorships are spreading like Russia wants to [ __ ] 00:33:42.929 --> 00:33:48.250 conquer half of the Europe so you have to be aware of that and you have to like WE 00:33:48.250 --> 00:33:53.039 have to fight that back. This is not you know whether it is should be done or not 00:33:53.039 --> 00:33:58.130 it is more like how much energy and how [ __ ] your ass should be on on fire to 00:33:58.130 --> 00:34:05.070 fight those. Smart also doesn't mean smart and by that I mean that a lot of Engineers 00:34:05.070 --> 00:34:08.700 believe that they they you know they can open a [ __ ] Wikipedia page, so they know 00:34:08.700 --> 00:34:14.600 everything about the world. But it is not the case a lot of Engineers fail miserably 00:34:14.600 --> 00:34:18.609 in understanding how the world is working how the society is working so if we 00:34:18.609 --> 00:34:23.139 develop technological solutions to certain problems we do have to work with 00:34:23.139 --> 00:34:27.879 sociologists Political scientists with activists to understand how those 00:34:27.879 --> 00:34:31.400 technologies will influence the world you know: 00:34:31.400 --> 00:34:38.290 *very many ovations* 00:34:38.290 --> 00:34:42.929 The time is [ __ ] running out and I'm not talking about all only about ecological 00:34:42.929 --> 00:34:47.690 catastrophe but also technologically speaking. We are in the race with you know 00:34:47.690 --> 00:34:52.890 the dictators and authoritarian regimes who want to enforce and make their regime 00:34:52.890 --> 00:34:57.720 stronger through Technologies, face recognition systems and all this [ __ ] 00:34:57.720 --> 00:35:03.180 that is making the state way stronger against the society so yeah get your [ __ 00:35:03.180 --> 00:35:08.060 ] done and get your [ __ ] like going already now today, you know. And digital 00:35:08.060 --> 00:35:12.810 resistance is part of a broader Uprising so do not see yourself you know as a 00:35:12.810 --> 00:35:16.690 hackers community that exist in isolated world and you're in a bubble and [ __ ] 00:35:16.690 --> 00:35:21.400 like that but rather if we want to stop like technological dictatorships or 00:35:21.400 --> 00:35:25.240 whatever [ __ ] you can imagine we actually have to work together, 00:35:25.240 --> 00:35:29.490 technological activists, Street activists, Community organizers all of those get 00:35:29.490 --> 00:35:32.320 together and fight against the dictatorships fight against the 00:35:32.320 --> 00:35:36.920 authoritarian attacks on us, on our society, on our families, on our friends 00:35:36.920 --> 00:35:38.150 and only then we can win thank you! 00:35:38.150 --> 00:35:39.150 *Applause* 00:35:39.150 --> 00:35:40.150 *Music* 00:35:40.150 --> 00:36:14.071 Angel: I have one more thing ... Boris: And don't forget to donate to our 00:36:14.071 --> 00:36:17.440 group we are not like getting money for ourselves we're collecting money for the 00:36:17.440 --> 00:36:22.859 political prisoners so don't forget to do that this is an important part of just 00:36:22.859 --> 00:36:33.109 supporting the struggle. Angel: Yeah *Applaus* so we have a couple 00:36:33.109 --> 00:36:38.680 minutes for questions but if you have to leave, leave super quietly and also a 00:36:38.680 --> 00:36:43.650 question is a short sentence with a question mark behind it not a long essay. 00:36:43.650 --> 00:36:48.981 I have chat GPT for that and we have a question from the the signal Angel by the 00:36:48.981 --> 00:36:53.570 way the microphones are up front here here 1 2 3 4 that's where you have to stand in 00:36:53.570 --> 00:36:56.590 order to do a question signal Angel go ahead. 00:36:56.590 --> 00:37:02.750 Signal Angel: Yes the internet wants to know what you expect Microsoft or Skype to 00:37:02.750 --> 00:37:08.170 do for example blocking Belarus as a whole or wouldn't that also negatively impact 00:37:08.170 --> 00:37:13.800 the activist? What's your opinion on that? Boris: I mean I don't think that blocking 00:37:13.800 --> 00:37:19.349 Skype like or Skype stopping providing services in bellus would negatively affect 00:37:19.349 --> 00:37:24.800 activist scene, nobody in activist scene was using Skype right? On the other side 00:37:24.800 --> 00:37:28.780 like you do have mechanisms of black listing cord IPS at least you know like 00:37:28.780 --> 00:37:33.300 this is Belarusian state is not you know super sophisticated going to connect to 00:37:33.300 --> 00:37:36.300 the [ __ ] bpn and [ __ ] like that, but rather you block those and the court is 00:37:36.300 --> 00:37:40.200 already not doing that. The thing with the Microsoft and Skype is that it's story of 00:37:40.200 --> 00:37:44.870 the past because right now they switched to Viber so like this is this is gone, 00:37:44.870 --> 00:37:49.220 like they did their part and nobody will most probably remember that and I mean 00:37:49.220 --> 00:37:52.260 honestly [ __ ] Microsoft. 00:37:52.260 --> 00:37:54.920 *few ovations* 00:37:54.920 --> 00:37:58.089 Angel: We're running out of time question for Num 3. 00:37:58.089 --> 00:38:06.270 -Okay I have a question how much would a better and more secure VPN technology and 00:38:06.270 --> 00:38:12.579 better anonymizing systems help in these kinds of situations and what what has the 00:38:12.579 --> 00:38:18.370 Bella russian State done against using VPS into foreign countries? 00:38:18.370 --> 00:38:24.079 B: I mean in the first days of the protests in the first days of the uprising 00:38:24.079 --> 00:38:27.990 the whole internet infrastructure was gone. Like there were certain ways to go 00:38:27.990 --> 00:38:32.010 around the blocking that were connected with telegram proxies, I have no [ __ ] 00:38:32.010 --> 00:38:35.970 clue how they managed to do it successfully but they did and in general 00:38:35.970 --> 00:38:38.960 like the internet was just not working. So it doesn't matter if you have VPN and a 00:38:38.960 --> 00:38:45.920 Tor, the internet doesn't work and later on when they unlocked the internet they 00:38:45.920 --> 00:38:52.250 were very slow in reacting to the fast protest community so in those cases VPNs 00:38:52.250 --> 00:38:57.140 very important somehow but for us at that point the the local organizing and 00:38:57.140 --> 00:39:02.250 providing infrastructure for the local organizers was way more important. So also 00:39:02.250 --> 00:39:05.630 like building decentralized networks inside of the country sometimes is way 00:39:05.630 --> 00:39:09.609 more crucial to the protests than getting out to the services that are outside of 00:39:09.609 --> 00:39:14.819 the country and that's what was happening as well. But in general like it's still an 00:39:14.819 --> 00:39:19.680 important part of fighting back like having a reliable VPN or any other 00:39:19.680 --> 00:39:28.329 anonymizing and like censorship circumsing Technologies. How to develop those more 00:39:28.329 --> 00:39:31.290 successfully? I have no [ __ ] clue honestly. Because those like the fight 00:39:31.290 --> 00:39:37.720 against those are going on very fast and I like I can't answer this, I'm very sorry. 00:39:37.720 --> 00:39:41.900 Herald: So we might be able to squeeze in another two questions very briefly. on 00:39:41.900 --> 00:39:46.470 number one. -How bad is the suppression of the APC 00:39:46.470 --> 00:39:51.010 Belarus activists and can you safely reside inside Belarus without getting 00:39:51.010 --> 00:39:54.930 arrested immediately or do you have to flee into Exile? 00:39:54.930 --> 00:40:03.119 B: Like in general not talking only about us but the bigger political spectrum of 00:40:03.119 --> 00:40:06.250 all the groups that are providing solidarity work all of them are gone like 00:40:06.250 --> 00:40:11.240 from Belarus. So all of the activists from Liberal also human right defending groups 00:40:11.240 --> 00:40:15.640 and so on had to leave and if you would be identified as a member of such a group 00:40:15.640 --> 00:40:19.710 inside of the country this would be enough to prosecute you and to put I mean any 00:40:19.710 --> 00:40:24.460 case they want on you. This is not a you know like a legal state but rather they 00:40:24.460 --> 00:40:28.810 prosecute you and that's it. And with the case of activist Anarchist activists in 00:40:28.810 --> 00:40:35.619 general there are laws that would allow them to make a group extremist 00:40:35.619 --> 00:40:39.819 organization that doesn't need a core decision and through that you can get like 00:40:39.819 --> 00:40:45.420 five six seven years in prison easily without any other actions you know. And 00:40:45.420 --> 00:40:51.410 this is happening to certain solidarity groups already yeah. So we also have in 00:40:51.410 --> 00:40:56.460 tomorrow in like a self-organized sessions a bigger presentation another collegue 00:40:56.460 --> 00:41:01.310 will be doing that about repressions in Belarus about the political situation less 00:41:01.310 --> 00:41:05.460 like focused on Technologies more focused on social political situation so if you 00:41:05.460 --> 00:41:09.960 want to know a little bit more about that you can come there and ask your questions 00:41:09.960 --> 00:41:12.550 and and [ __ ] like that. Herald: I would suggest that for anybody 00:41:12.550 --> 00:41:16.339 in the room but we will take one last question very briefly from the signal 00:41:16.339 --> 00:41:18.640 Angel and then we'll have to call it quits unfortunately. 00:41:18.640 --> 00:41:24.440 Signal Engel: Yes another question regarding the use of encryption. It is if 00:41:24.440 --> 00:41:30.290 theography is used with to encryption or instead of encryption in Belarus by 00:41:30.290 --> 00:41:35.369 activists. B: I mean we do not have so many people 00:41:35.369 --> 00:41:39.720 who were like technologically savvy and were participating in the protests that's 00:41:39.720 --> 00:41:45.210 why nobody was hiding messages like that but we did have like a collective for 00:41:45.210 --> 00:41:51.780 example that developed a telegram app that would have like a double I don't know 00:41:51.780 --> 00:41:58.530 how it's in English like a double something double like basically you have 00:41:58.530 --> 00:42:04.760 two accounts in the telegram and one of those accounts like is is is a very nice 00:42:04.760 --> 00:42:08.840 fluffy you don't do anything and that's where what the cops see and then you need 00:42:08.840 --> 00:42:14.839 to put a password to get another one so we got like this kind of hiding your activity 00:42:14.839 --> 00:42:20.470 on the internet but this was I think like the biggest people can imagine using on 00:42:20.470 --> 00:42:25.020 their smartphones. In general like we have to understand that technological savy is 00:42:25.020 --> 00:42:28.849 dropping right people when people are using smartphones they know less about 00:42:28.849 --> 00:42:33.390 Technologies than they did like 10 years ago so people are capable of doing less 00:42:33.390 --> 00:42:36.390 and less and less yeah. Herald: So that's all the questions we can 00:42:36.390 --> 00:42:40.763 take please help me thank him for this wonderful talk something we never and... 00:42:40.763 --> 00:42:41.763 B: Thanks for doing it! 00:42:41.763 --> 00:42:42.263 *a lot of ovations*