0:00:03.524,0:00:10.320
*36c3 preroll music*

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Herald: OK, good. Gauthier Roussilhe[br]investigates the impact of the digital

0:00:20.720,0:00:35.832
industry on the environment and how we can[br]actually reduce this industry's footprint,

0:00:35.832,0:00:43.482
ecological footprint. One example is his[br]own home page. It's visually appealing,

0:00:43.482,0:00:48.280
but it only loads in 450 kilobytes.[br]Gauthier stage is yours.

0:00:48.280,0:01:00.880
Gauthier Roussilhe: So. So thank you for[br]inviting me here. Uh, so my talk will look

0:01:01.440,0:01:08.240
at digital industry, but in a broader[br]scope. We gonna look and analyze what is

0:01:08.240,0:01:15.680
digital industry nowadays, looking at what[br]is possible to do within transition. Which

0:01:15.680,0:01:25.120
should be our goal altogether. So to just[br]give me a sense of who I am and from which

0:01:25.120,0:01:30.480
position I am speaking of. Uh, first of[br]all, I'm a designer. I don't know if there

0:01:30.480,0:01:39.200
is much designers here, but it's quite a[br]nice practice, I recommend. Which means I

0:01:39.200,0:01:44.640
make digital services. I don't have a[br]technical expertise on programing or

0:01:44.640,0:01:50.720
coding, but I do understand a little bit.[br]But most of my work as a designer and also

0:01:50.720,0:01:57.200
as a PhD candidate, I've been looking at[br]transitions, policies, energy policies,

0:01:58.160,0:02:04.960
environmental policies, legal policies,[br]when it comes to, and the Anthropocene and

0:02:04.960,0:02:11.520
the paradigm change, the paradigm shift[br]that we to operate regarding that. So

0:02:12.320,0:02:18.640
within the scope of transition and climate[br]crisis, environmental crisis, I've been

0:02:18.640,0:02:24.640
looking especially at the digital[br]industry, its footprints. The way it will

0:02:24.640,0:02:29.520
evolve and if it's going far away from[br]transition goals or if it is going the

0:02:29.520,0:02:36.080
same direction. I use sometimes the term[br]low tech, which I don't really like. And I

0:02:36.080,0:02:41.680
will explain later why. But basically[br]looking at: What, what does, uh,

0:02:41.680,0:02:48.400
digital... sustainable digital industry[br]looks like? Which is quite a long way. And

0:02:48.400,0:02:54.640
also I have been doing a side research on[br]economics as it is very interesting to

0:02:54.640,0:02:58.960
look at that when doing this kind of[br]stuff. At the same time I was also the

0:02:58.960,0:03:02.960
director of online documentary called[br]Ethics for Design, looking at the

0:03:02.960,0:03:10.000
responsibility of designers. When you put[br]goods and services massively in people's

0:03:10.000,0:03:16.960
everyday life, what is your[br]responsibility? So today my position as a

0:03:16.960,0:03:24.560
speaker will be mostly looking at at least[br]making a transition politics arguments

0:03:25.120,0:03:31.200
linked to a social argument. But I don't[br]only... I will not focus on technical

0:03:31.200,0:03:36.800
arguments per se. I will focus on[br]techniques and technologies through the

0:03:36.800,0:03:40.800
scope of transition. So please remember[br]that I am not that much of a technician.

0:03:42.400,0:03:48.640
So first we need to set up the framework.[br]I will not give you a lecture on the state

0:03:48.640,0:03:52.480
of the planet right now. I don't think you[br]need me to go through that. And I think

0:03:52.480,0:03:57.280
there is a far better people to talk about[br]that. Anyway, I prefer to talk about

0:03:57.280,0:04:01.734
transition. So what is it? What are the[br]targets? There is a first target. We all

0:04:01.734,0:04:10.237
know it. That 2° target. Paris agreement,[br]which means we need to stabilize carbon

0:04:10.237,0:04:18.531
concentration in the atmosphere to 480 ppm[br](particles per million). To stabilize

0:04:18.531,0:04:24.718
that, to stay under 2° average on Earth,[br]we need energy transition. We need to

0:04:24.718,0:04:32.400
apply an energy transition. And sometimes[br]we reduce it to just shifting our energy

0:04:32.400,0:04:39.721
mix to less carbon intensive energy mix.[br]When actually the first step is firstly to

0:04:39.721,0:04:45.786
reduce energy consumption, then you can[br]make it less carbon intensive. But if you

0:04:45.786,0:04:50.149
don't know, if you don't learn how to[br]reduce energy consumption, there not that

0:04:50.149,0:04:55.214
much to do. So I'm gonna go through that[br]first. And first, because I think we've

0:04:55.214,0:05:00.569
been talking about carbon quite a lot. Uh,[br]just before. And also this morning with

0:05:00.569,0:05:05.180
Chris Adams. But I realize that not that[br]much people understand why we picked

0:05:05.180,0:05:11.924
carbon between the halls of greenhouse[br]gases that are on earth. Why do we set up

0:05:11.924,0:05:19.156
a target on carbon? Uh, carbon has two[br]specificities: time lag, residence time.

0:05:19.156,0:05:25.831
First thing to know about carbon is on[br]average, a particle of carbon that just

0:05:25.831,0:05:31.920
being emitted from your car will on[br]average take 20 years to reach its maximum

0:05:31.920,0:05:37.976
heating effect on the atmosphere. So when[br]we are doing transition now or engaging

0:05:37.976,0:05:43.874
for transient policies, we are doing it to[br]have a result and effect 20 years ahead.

0:05:43.874,0:05:49.878
So when we are doing stuff now, we are[br]doing it for 2040 on average. So which

0:05:49.878,0:05:57.011
means also that the transition. I mean,[br]the emission for the next 20 years are

0:05:57.011,0:06:03.640
not... we have pretty good estimates.[br]Secondly, carbon has the highest residence

0:06:03.640,0:06:12.066
time from all the greenhouse gases, one of[br]the highest at least. It will take 20, uh,

0:06:12.066,0:06:17.946
10000 years for all the carbon that we[br]emitted so far to go through the

0:06:17.946,0:06:23.998
atmosphere. We add carbon. It doesn't go[br]through the atmosphere happily. And going

0:06:23.998,0:06:31.520
into the outer space. We add carbon. And[br]the carbon that we emit today, right now,

0:06:31.520,0:06:38.432
it will stay at least for 1000 years. And[br]some of it will go through the carbon

0:06:38.432,0:06:43.565
cycle and will stabilize. But we are[br]adding more carbon in the atmosphere and

0:06:43.565,0:06:49.112
carbon has the specific nature of staying[br]a very long time in the atmosphere. That's

0:06:49.112,0:06:54.385
why our targets are in looking at carbon,[br]because it has the maximum heating effect

0:06:54.385,0:06:59.147
regarding its residence time in the[br]atmosphere. So if we look at France,

0:06:59.147,0:07:06.459
because you have to remember that in this[br]talk I'm speaking from the perspective of

0:07:06.459,0:07:13.147
a French designer and most of the work[br]I've been using as a result, I've been

0:07:13.147,0:07:20.176
using or I've made is from the French[br]perspective and the French research. So on

0:07:20.176,0:07:27.797
average on France, we emit 12 tons of[br]carbon equivalent per person per year. In

0:07:27.797,0:07:34.798
Germany I don't know. I think you are[br]roughly around the same number. What's

0:07:34.798,0:07:43.601
interesting here is that digital industry[br]in this total is almost 1 ton and 200

0:07:43.601,0:07:50.600
kilograms of carbon equivalence. That's[br]where we are looking right now. With this

0:07:50.600,0:07:56.110
talk, we are looking only a small portion[br]in green, in goods and services, but it's

0:07:56.110,0:08:01.684
dynamically linked to all the other[br]sectors. So when I'm operating transition

0:08:01.684,0:08:08.298
in this sector, I'm also looking: How does[br]it link to everything around them? And we

0:08:08.298,0:08:15.275
have to know that if we want to reach[br]Paris agreement, we have to stabilize our

0:08:15.275,0:08:21.708
carbon emission per person per year to 2t.[br]So in France, we have a lot, we have to

0:08:21.708,0:08:28.600
reduce by 10t of carbon emissions per[br]person per year. So roughly, roughly the

0:08:28.600,0:08:35.801
same thing goes with Germany. So this is[br]another calculation with less, just a

0:08:35.801,0:08:41.854
smaller amount because they don't[br]integrate digital industry as much as a

0:08:41.854,0:08:49.972
precedent one. But basically the road here[br]is 11 to 2. And what's interesting: It's a

0:08:49.972,0:08:57.399
French study looking at what is my[br]responsibility as an individual to go to

0:08:57.399,0:09:05.296
the target, and they estimated that with a[br]realistic individual behavior change.

0:09:05.296,0:09:13.925
Eating less meat, not taking planes, using[br]less car, biking, cycling more. I can only

0:09:13.925,0:09:20.355
do one quarter of the effort needed. So[br]when companies are focusing on individual

0:09:20.355,0:09:25.580
behavior change it's bullshit. Because[br]individual behavior change always goes

0:09:25.580,0:09:31.760
with systemic change, which is three[br]quarters of the road we have to take. So

0:09:31.760,0:09:37.880
you cannot engage in individual behavior[br]change. We thought asking or fighting for

0:09:37.880,0:09:43.351
systemic change. So here most of the road[br]that we have to make is through

0:09:43.351,0:09:48.276
decarbonizing or making less carbon[br]intensive industry, agriculture,

0:09:48.276,0:09:54.400
transport, public services, energy[br]production, something I cannot do through

0:09:54.400,0:10:00.681
my own individual behavior, but my own[br]individual behavior is needed. If I want

0:10:00.681,0:10:08.849
to act on the political scale, on the[br]systemic scale. So we live in a paradox,

0:10:08.849,0:10:18.920
then that's every individual change is[br]necessary, but insufficient. But we need

0:10:18.920,0:10:28.231
it. So looking back at digital industry,[br]we need to frame digital industry in 0.6t

0:10:28.231,0:10:34.453
of carbon left for goods and services.[br]That's where we need to put new

0:10:34.453,0:10:39.927
imaginaries, uh, new ways of practicing[br]digital in this target. And we have to

0:10:39.927,0:10:46.138
share it with other goods and services,[br]clothing and so on. So going quickly

0:10:46.138,0:10:59.920
through the impacts of ICTs right now. In[br]2019, 3% of the worldwide energy is

0:10:59.920,0:11:08.560
consumed by ICTs, its main primary energy,[br]fuel, oil, gas, nuclear power,

0:11:08.560,0:11:15.200
hydroelectric power. Everything that we[br]need to power, uh, transport, boats, cars,

0:11:15.200,0:11:20.960
your phone, data centers. 3% of worldwide[br]energy is consumed by digital industry.

0:11:22.240,0:11:29.440
Accordingly to that, now, we are almost 4%[br]of greenhouse gases emitted worldwide are

0:11:29.440,0:11:34.480
coming from digital industry. But they are[br]only numbers. So we need to see how they

0:11:34.480,0:11:42.240
will evolve. Right now, the growth rate of[br]these two numbers are quite shocking. So

0:11:42.240,0:11:50.400
basically, the energy consumption of this[br]industry is doubling every 8 years, I

0:11:50.400,0:11:58.320
think. Yeah, 9% of growth rate. That's the[br]only industry worldwide, I think, with

0:11:58.320,0:12:06.240
that kind of growth rate. And it goes with[br]greenhouse gases emission 8%. So which

0:12:06.240,0:12:15.200
give us perspective that digital industry[br]in 2025 will be 5% of all of the worldwide

0:12:15.200,0:12:21.840
energy consumption and 7.5% of greenhouse[br]emissions. The fact is greenhouse

0:12:21.840,0:12:26.560
emissions are growing faster than energy[br]consumption is because the increase of

0:12:26.560,0:12:33.600
energy demand coming from digital industry[br]cannot be absorbed by renewables. You need

0:12:33.600,0:12:43.600
coal power plants, or carbonated energy to[br]go with this fast growth rate of digital

0:12:43.600,0:12:51.600
industry. So if I look closer at energy,[br]you can see that right now on the global

0:12:51.600,0:13:02.800
average, 45% to 50% of all energy is used[br]to manufacture. And the rest of energy is

0:13:03.760,0:13:10.800
for making things work, when you are using[br]them. But it's a global average. And when

0:13:10.800,0:13:19.920
we are looking at that... So in our[br]calculation methodology, we have 3 places

0:13:19.920,0:13:24.960
we are looking at: Consumer equipment,[br]networks, data centers. So we are looking

0:13:24.960,0:13:30.080
at the energy consumption of these three[br]places, both to manufacture them and to

0:13:30.080,0:13:37.840
use them. But it's a global average. So if[br]I look at a specific consumer equipment

0:13:37.840,0:13:43.200
like a smartphone, it will look like that.[br]So mainly when you are buying a

0:13:43.200,0:13:49.920
smartphone, 90% of all energy has already[br]been used. And if you charge it every day

0:13:49.920,0:13:57.040
for three years, it will be the 10% left.[br]So when you are using a phone, changing a

0:13:57.040,0:14:03.200
phone, you actually trashing 90% of[br]energy. And then there is water, minerals

0:14:03.200,0:14:10.960
and so on. But I don't have time to enter[br]in this topic. So today the main impact of

0:14:10.960,0:14:16.880
digital industry is manufacturing and[br]producing electricity to make all the

0:14:16.880,0:14:22.640
infrastructure work. So when we think of[br]web design or designing digital services.

0:14:23.680,0:14:30.560
It's little compared to these impacts. But[br]we need to think of services that enable

0:14:30.560,0:14:38.240
to reduce this impact. That's how we link[br]it together. And this infrastructure has

0:14:38.240,0:14:43.840
been used mainly for videos. So Chris[br]Adams, uh, showed this graph today. I was

0:14:43.840,0:14:51.840
part of the study that look at the impact[br]of online video on Internet. So mainly 20%

0:14:53.040,0:15:00.320
of all data moving in the world is not[br]video. 80% is video. So as Chris shows

0:15:00.320,0:15:08.400
this morning, most of it is Netflix, uh,[br]pornography, tubes and others. Uh, the

0:15:08.400,0:15:16.320
fact is Netflix with 150 million users[br]worldwide is basically representing 15% of

0:15:16.320,0:15:24.160
the global Internet traffic. And they've[br]been doing that for... And they launched

0:15:24.160,0:15:28.320
the streaming services ten years ago, I[br]guess. So that's quite a big growth rate.

0:15:29.440,0:15:34.400
But this graphic, I want to challenge it[br]because I was part of this study. So I

0:15:34.400,0:15:40.080
also know its limits. This doesn't show[br]pollution or energy consumption. It just

0:15:40.080,0:15:49.440
shows you data moving. And 1 gigabyte of[br]Netflix data, video data, has way less

0:15:49.440,0:15:54.000
energy consumption than once you get bytes[br]of banking data, especially if it's

0:15:54.000,0:16:00.480
running on old data centers that haven't[br]been be updated for 30 years. Netflix has

0:16:01.360,0:16:08.240
incredible infrastructure. So moving 1 GB[br]for Netflix is less energy. So it doesn't

0:16:08.240,0:16:16.800
represent energy consumption. It's just[br]data moving. So how do we deal with that

0:16:16.800,0:16:21.600
now? We have a good... We know the[br]transient framework in which we are

0:16:21.600,0:16:28.640
operating. We know the impacts. How do we[br]do differently knowing that? First we need

0:16:28.640,0:16:34.400
to challenge the discourse that have been[br]put up when we speak of Internet and

0:16:34.400,0:16:39.680
digital infrastructure. When digital[br]infrastructure arrived in civil society,

0:16:40.880,0:16:47.440
there was two discourses. First that it[br]was dematerialized. Secondly, that it will

0:16:47.440,0:16:52.160
create a global village. Well, I think now[br]we can know, we have enough data to say

0:16:52.160,0:17:01.680
that both of these discourses were myth or[br]lies. If anything, digital industry is

0:17:01.680,0:17:08.960
hyper-materialized. It requires an[br]astonishing amount of minerals, resources,

0:17:08.960,0:17:17.280
water, energy, infrastructures that never[br]been seen before for such a small. I mean,

0:17:17.280,0:17:22.400
such a young infrastructure. So when you[br]are dematerialized, you don't account for

0:17:22.400,0:17:27.840
resources. You don't account for energy,[br]because there is no impact, at least in

0:17:27.840,0:17:34.800
public discourse. When you think of a[br]global village, it's quite an aggressive

0:17:34.800,0:17:39.520
thing when you say global village. It[br]means basically your erase culture,

0:17:39.520,0:17:43.120
geography and history of places in which[br]you are implementing the infrastructure.

0:17:45.440,0:17:51.520
So I think we need to change this both,[br]these discourses. If we want to look at

0:17:51.520,0:17:59.280
what digital industry can be in a system,[br]a paradigm of sustainability. And we have

0:17:59.280,0:18:04.240
to understand that because of these two[br]things that have been said about digital

0:18:04.240,0:18:10.640
industry by default, at least in my[br]perspective, most of the usage of the uses

0:18:10.640,0:18:17.600
were created with the current digital[br]industry. By default energy intensive or

0:18:17.600,0:18:25.520
high energy based, by default. I can show[br]you quite easily with Netflix. So Netflix,

0:18:25.520,0:18:32.880
one of the biggest data movers on the[br]Internet. But actually, when you think of

0:18:32.880,0:18:43.200
it being able to broadcast to 150 million[br]users worldwide, high quality videos, is

0:18:43.200,0:18:48.080
already based on the fact that they don't[br]pay that much energy. And secondly, to be

0:18:48.080,0:18:57.760
able to incite people to watch more, to[br]create an interaction of auto play so

0:18:57.760,0:19:02.720
people can see more and more videos, can[br]watch more and more videos. It's because

0:19:02.720,0:19:09.040
you don't account for energy. It's not a[br]cost. It's not really something that

0:19:09.040,0:19:17.600
matters. But also to look at Netflix[br]precisely: Netflix also created one of the

0:19:19.200,0:19:27.440
very efficient network broadcast its[br]videos. So here to be quite precise, when

0:19:27.440,0:19:34.560
you are watching a Netflix episode, it[br]will never go through the Internet because

0:19:35.360,0:19:41.680
in each data centers of Internet service[br]providers, there is this little red box,

0:19:41.680,0:19:47.040
this little servers from Netflix that are[br]actually caching all the catalog every

0:19:47.040,0:19:51.600
morning. So when you are clicking on play[br]on Netflix, it's just streaming you a

0:19:51.600,0:19:56.560
video from your ISP data center. So it[br]will never go through the rest of the

0:19:56.560,0:20:04.880
Internet. So they actually don't, they[br]optimize a lot the streaming services. But

0:20:04.880,0:20:11.200
the fact is, even if it's a very energy[br]efficient, they are growing so much that a

0:20:11.200,0:20:17.040
gain of energy are being completely[br]overwhelmed by the growth rate that they

0:20:17.040,0:20:23.920
are fostering through their practice. And[br]yet Netflix account for if it was going

0:20:24.480,0:20:28.960
through the Internet for real, it will[br]account for 37% of all the peak internet

0:20:28.960,0:20:39.760
traffic. So if we look at the way we think[br]of designing websites, applications, so

0:20:39.760,0:20:47.520
on. Uh, normally we start with money.[br]Someone is giving you money and goals,

0:20:47.520,0:20:53.920
targets that, in design we say KPI. So key[br]performance indicators. And they will tell

0:20:53.920,0:20:57.600
you, I want that much audience. I want[br]that much engagements. I want that much

0:20:57.600,0:21:04.480
people buying my stuff. Do a service. A[br]web service. Uh, website application so

0:21:05.680,0:21:12.400
you can reach my targets. So from my[br]perspective, you are giving money for

0:21:12.400,0:21:17.520
people to move data because also data is[br]getting back to the people paying for it.

0:21:19.360,0:21:26.080
But in this framework, when do we think of[br]energy? When do we think of resources?

0:21:27.200,0:21:34.240
Because so far we've been very good at[br]creating efficient equipment and in

0:21:34.240,0:21:39.840
design, in the design practice, energy[br]never really mattered. In computer

0:21:39.840,0:21:44.880
sciences it's different. We created[br]fantastic efficient, energy efficient

0:21:44.880,0:21:53.600
equipment. But the fact is, the more[br]efficient our equipment became, the more

0:21:53.600,0:21:59.760
we consume of it. So there is a constant[br]rebound effect that it is not giving us

0:21:59.760,0:22:04.594
any possibility to transition in a less[br]intensive infrastructure. So the fact is

0:22:04.594,0:22:10.383
we never account for energy. We never[br]account for resources from the design

0:22:10.383,0:22:15.215
side. And I've been trawling quite a few[br]designers with that, asking them, can you

0:22:15.215,0:22:20.120
make me a website for 2 Watts per hour?[br]Nobody knows how to do that. No designers,

0:22:20.120,0:22:26.790
no designers can answer this question. And[br]they might be very senior. I asked senior

0:22:26.790,0:22:33.707
designers or students, junior designers,[br]nobody could answer this question. Because

0:22:33.707,0:22:41.909
energy never mattered. So from the way I[br]see it, I'm designing from energy, so I

0:22:41.909,0:22:48.102
start with energy budget because my goal[br]here is to reduce carbon emissions. To

0:22:48.102,0:22:52.262
reduce carbon emissions I need to reduce[br]the amount of energy I'm consuming. To

0:22:52.262,0:22:57.160
reduce the amount of energy I'm consuming,[br]I need to reduce the amount of data I'm

0:22:57.160,0:23:03.273
moving. And from that, I can decide how[br]much money I'm spending to design a

0:23:03.273,0:23:10.414
specific service. I don't start from[br]carbon. It is very inefficient and it's

0:23:10.414,0:23:18.485
unfair because for most countries, I mean,[br]if I give like a carbon threshold... In

0:23:18.485,0:23:25.231
France, we could do amazing website[br]spending a lot of energy because we don't

0:23:25.231,0:23:30.017
have a very carbon intensive energy mix.[br]Australia, USA will end up with very

0:23:30.017,0:23:36.882
crappy websites because they will have[br]maybe three kilobytes to move. So it's

0:23:36.882,0:23:43.432
better to start from energy than from[br]carbon, because energy is fair, to some

0:23:43.432,0:23:49.211
extent. And it's more efficient to reduce[br]because it is more important to reduce

0:23:49.211,0:23:54.371
energy than to reduce carbon emissions.[br]Because if you reduce energy consumption,

0:23:54.371,0:24:00.602
normally you would reduce carbon[br]emissions. So I did that with my website.

0:24:00.602,0:24:08.167
When I start to realize the also blind[br]spot in Zen practice, I go for my own

0:24:08.167,0:24:15.462
transformation. So my website is consuming[br]one kilowatt per hour for 1000 visits.

0:24:15.462,0:24:22.743
It's quite an average website. I mean, no,[br]it's not average anymore. It's 450

0:24:22.743,0:24:31.426
kilobytes on average. And I will add a new[br]thing in the next month, I will limit my

0:24:31.426,0:24:38.181
traffic to 5000 visitors a month, because[br]if you want to constrain energy budgets,

0:24:38.181,0:24:42.880
if you want to apply a real energy budget,[br]you need to constrain traffic. So you have

0:24:42.880,0:24:48.968
to decide how much visitors you want to[br]come every month. And once there is there

0:24:48.968,0:24:54.745
be 5000 visitors then. So the other ones[br]will wait for the next month and it's

0:24:54.745,0:25:00.035
fine. It's not that important to get[br]information all the time. So if you are

0:25:00.035,0:25:08.063
not up to do all this calculation that I[br]can explain with with you later. Uh, I

0:25:08.063,0:25:15.540
design a Firefox extension that shows you[br]the amount of data moving. And so the

0:25:15.540,0:25:21.390
energy consumption and the carbon emission[br]linked to this data moving on your

0:25:21.390,0:25:28.122
computer from your browser and shows you[br]what's moving them. What are the different

0:25:28.122,0:25:34.836
ways, where is the data going. And it[br]gives you some equivalences on charged

0:25:34.836,0:25:40.126
smartphones and kilometer in a car. So I[br]did that for, uh, for a lobby in France

0:25:40.126,0:25:44.320
called the shift project that also[br]produced most of... a lot of the studies

0:25:44.320,0:25:51.543
looking for impacts of digital industry.[br]It's called Carbonalyser. So as I was

0:25:51.543,0:26:01.458
saying to do an energy budget, you need 3[br]things: You need to describe or to reclaim

0:26:01.458,0:26:06.612
energy infrastructure. Where does your[br]energy come from? It's very important. You

0:26:06.612,0:26:11.516
need to reclaim the digital[br]infrastructure, which is: What is hosting,

0:26:11.516,0:26:17.510
what is the network, on which consumer[br]equipment? So you have to define in which

0:26:17.510,0:26:22.760
territory you're operating. So at that[br]point, the global village is dead because

0:26:22.760,0:26:27.678
you cannot be global anymore, you need to[br]precisely know where is your energy coming

0:26:27.678,0:26:32.960
from, which are the impact of the data[br]center you are using in a specific place

0:26:32.960,0:26:37.970
and you need to decide about traffic. So[br]now while I'm working sometimes with

0:26:37.970,0:26:44.080
clients, we decide how much traffic they[br]want to go for. And we put a hard cap on

0:26:44.080,0:26:51.400
that. So a good example of that, I think[br]you all know it, is the Low Tech Magazine.

0:26:51.400,0:26:56.700
First, they Reclaim Energy. They built a[br]solar panel, I mean, they installed a

0:26:56.700,0:27:01.282
solar panel on a balcony in Barcelona that[br]is powering a website. You can see the

0:27:01.282,0:27:06.400
battery in the yellow part on the website.[br]So first they reclaim energy. Then they

0:27:06.400,0:27:13.986
reclaim digital infrastructure. So they[br]are doing a self hosting with a Raspberry

0:27:13.986,0:27:22.005
Pi. And they are not looking at traffic so[br]far, but it will come. That's kind of the

0:27:22.005,0:27:29.120
example I want to show you, because the[br]territory here is paramount to the design.

0:27:29.120,0:27:35.610
You don't design stuff without knowing why[br]it actually be. What is the materiality of

0:27:35.610,0:27:39.555
what you are doing? So and you can see[br]here in the footers, they are also giving

0:27:39.555,0:27:44.200
the weather for the next coming days in[br]Barcelona, what's our base and where the

0:27:44.200,0:27:50.560
energy is coming from. And because I was[br]speaking of low tech, I just want to do

0:27:50.560,0:27:56.084
like a quick heads up on when we speak of[br]high tech or low tech. I'm coming from a

0:27:56.084,0:28:00.951
social science background, especially[br]anthropology of techniques, philosophy,

0:28:00.951,0:28:06.361
political sciences and so on. So I've[br]always been shocked by the word tech. What

0:28:06.361,0:28:12.429
does it mean? Is it technology,[br]techniques? Nobody defines it. So it was

0:28:12.429,0:28:18.880
interesting, to say that when we think of[br]low tech in our perspective of transition,

0:28:18.880,0:28:23.948
we are speaking of low technology and high[br]techniques. When when you are speaking of

0:28:23.948,0:28:28.029
high tech from the Silicon Valley[br]perspective, you are speaking of high

0:28:28.029,0:28:33.155
technology, low techniques, which means[br]you are relying on blackboxing technology,

0:28:33.155,0:28:37.812
making it the less open to people, which[br]means you will reduce drastically the

0:28:37.812,0:28:42.449
skills and the knowledge that people can[br]get from the technology you are deploying.

0:28:42.449,0:28:47.528
So low techniques, low skills. On the[br]other way, when you think of low tech, we

0:28:47.528,0:28:54.072
are also relying on technology. You cannot[br]do digital without thinking of high

0:28:54.072,0:29:00.746
technology Infrastructure. But you are[br]relying less on that. And you are relying

0:29:00.746,0:29:07.732
on techniques. How do you spread[br]knowledge? How do you share skills? How do

0:29:07.732,0:29:13.957
you learn to maintain stuff is important.[br]And I think you've been doing that for

0:29:13.957,0:29:19.672
quite a while here. Not telling you[br]something new. But what's changing here is

0:29:19.672,0:29:25.688
a perspective of drastically changing[br]living conditions on earth. And also the

0:29:25.688,0:29:30.461
material condition of production are[br]drastically changing. The way we've been

0:29:30.461,0:29:37.066
extracting minerals, producing energy,[br]using water for mining exploitation will

0:29:37.066,0:29:46.513
change forever and nothing will be the[br]same anymore on that level. And this is

0:29:46.513,0:29:53.505
more of my anthropology side speaking[br]here, but I've seen much more interesting

0:29:53.505,0:29:58.179
stuff of empowerment, of what is[br]technology, what is digital infrastructure

0:29:58.179,0:30:03.589
in other places in the world, especially[br]el paquete semanal in Cuba, which is

0:30:03.589,0:30:10.442
basically people coming to office in Cuba[br]with a hard drive. They get one terabyte

0:30:10.442,0:30:15.989
of TV shows, film, whatever, tutorials,[br]books, and they go back and they pay a

0:30:15.989,0:30:20.254
little fee for that. It's basically a[br]content distribution network, except that

0:30:20.254,0:30:24.976
you don't need network, you just need your[br]feet. Daknet in north India is quite

0:30:24.976,0:30:30.560
interesting, too. They don't have access[br]to cellular or mobile networks as we can

0:30:30.560,0:30:37.228
have here. So they deal with the problem[br]quite interestingly. So sometimes there is

0:30:37.228,0:30:41.498
this guy on a motorcycle with a little[br]antenna and sever in the back of the

0:30:41.498,0:30:46.425
motorcycle and is basically going into[br]every village in a specific place. He

0:30:46.425,0:30:51.320
broadcasts a signal. He creates a hotspot.[br]Everybody is sending the stuff and he goes

0:30:51.320,0:30:56.244
from village to village and go back to the[br]city. He plugs on the main network and

0:30:56.244,0:31:03.414
everything is sent. It's also do that with[br]bus that are picking up kids going to the

0:31:03.414,0:31:11.082
school. Also in Brooklyn: Every network[br]tells a story. Great initiative, people

0:31:11.082,0:31:17.149
getting to design their own networks and[br]to understand the materiality of networks

0:31:17.149,0:31:23.240
or the Association of French Internet[br]Provider in France. Fantastic initiative,

0:31:23.240,0:31:28.348
too. So I will kind of conclude on that.[br]This is my own framework to think of

0:31:28.348,0:31:34.006
digital industry now in the context of[br]transition. So we gonna start from the

0:31:34.006,0:31:40.160
inner circle: materialisation. That is the[br]issue with digital industry. That's the

0:31:40.160,0:31:44.892
only infrastructure that has been to my[br]knowledge that have been publicized and

0:31:44.892,0:31:50.278
thus a discourse of being dematerialized.[br]You cannot do that with roads, with roads

0:31:50.278,0:31:55.617
network or any other infrastructure,[br]that's unique to digital infrastructure.

0:31:55.617,0:32:00.700
So the first step is always to materialize[br]it. That's why we need the plugin. So you

0:32:00.700,0:32:05.412
can see that there is impacts, but this[br]impacts you need to frame it in two

0:32:05.412,0:32:10.382
different ways. You need to frame the[br]impacts on the territory in which your

0:32:10.382,0:32:15.840
energy and your infrastructure is hosted.[br]And also the impacts at the scale of the

0:32:15.840,0:32:23.859
earth. Watching porn is emitting carbon.[br]So you have a global impact with very

0:32:23.859,0:32:31.381
intimate use of the Internet. Then you[br]need to defend your territory. Very

0:32:31.381,0:32:36.486
interesting, because since we've be living[br]in the myth of the global village, we

0:32:36.486,0:32:42.821
never thought on how the territory can[br]actually influence the way we are

0:32:42.821,0:32:50.275
designing web services or websites. So we[br]need to start from the territory, as low

0:32:50.275,0:32:55.480
tech magazine did, accepting the[br]constraint of Barcelona and playing with

0:32:55.480,0:33:02.046
it. And then you need to understand that[br]we also are working on a planetary scale,

0:33:02.046,0:33:07.898
what I call terrestrialisation which is[br]like kind of a mouthful. But that's what

0:33:07.898,0:33:13.105
it is. We need to understand the effect of[br]digital industry on a global scale, on a

0:33:13.105,0:33:18.222
planetary scale. And the fact that the[br]living condition on earth are quickly

0:33:18.222,0:33:24.345
changing, are impacting territories, which[br]will also impact the way we think of

0:33:24.345,0:33:30.400
services. So starting from the territory[br]is a good place to start because that's

0:33:30.400,0:33:35.400
where there is a materiality of digital[br]industry. The ones that have been hidden

0:33:35.400,0:33:39.933
so far, or we don't want you to look at.[br]And I wanted to finish with this little

0:33:39.933,0:33:47.911
picture, because right now in France, we[br]are striking because of the reform of the

0:33:47.911,0:33:54.464
pension system. And there was something[br]quite interesting in the way the strike

0:33:54.464,0:34:00.053
evolved in the last days, because in[br]between... there is many people striking

0:34:00.053,0:34:04.070
in France right now, lawyers,[br]firefighters. So the Paris Opera Ballet,

0:34:04.070,0:34:10.320
because they want to change the pension[br]system. So we have moments now in Paris

0:34:10.320,0:34:16.370
where the ballerinas are performing for[br]the strikers. And it creates something

0:34:16.370,0:34:21.713
very interesting because it goes beyond[br]act of resistance. It creates beauty and

0:34:21.713,0:34:26.825
opportunities in the way we think of[br]changing the system. It goes beyond

0:34:26.825,0:34:31.187
resistance. It creates imaginaries. And[br]that's the most important thing that we

0:34:31.187,0:34:37.044
need to do right now for the digital[br]industry. Sustain and create imaginaries.

0:34:37.044,0:34:43.670
Thank you.

0:34:43.670,0:34:48.508
Herald: Gauthier, Merci beaucoup. We have[br]five minutes time for a couple of

0:34:48.508,0:34:57.584
questions. Please line up at the[br]microphones. And is there a question

0:34:57.584,0:35:02.770
already from the Internet? No question[br]from the Internet. Please to the

0:35:02.770,0:35:11.840
microphones. Number three, please.[br]Q: Okay. I'm still formulating it, but

0:35:11.840,0:35:18.480
I'll try. I've been looking a lot about[br]how the new push in the digital industries

0:35:19.120,0:35:23.920
is framed around the fourth industrial[br]revolution, which is pushing us more

0:35:23.920,0:35:31.520
towards Internet of Things, always on, the[br]artificial intelligence ideas the industry

0:35:31.520,0:35:38.400
is coming up with. And I'm wondering if[br]there is a way to push us in the opposite

0:35:38.400,0:35:44.320
direction, to go away from personal[br]devices and more towards library modes of

0:35:44.320,0:35:52.000
technology? So like trying to create[br]places like the hack labs, the hack spaces

0:35:52.960,0:35:58.480
where we go to use things instead of[br]people constantly having their devices on,

0:35:59.040,0:36:05.200
feeding the data surveillance capitalism[br]and so going against the grain of pushing

0:36:05.200,0:36:10.560
against this expansionism. And if you have[br]looked at that in that way?

0:36:10.560,0:36:15.600
Gauthier: Well, I can give you like a[br]prime experience from the French landscape

0:36:15.600,0:36:22.400
because I think I'm only legitimate to[br]talk about that. One thing that will be

0:36:23.280,0:36:30.320
quite dramatic for the way digital[br]industry is going to evolve is in my own

0:36:30.320,0:36:35.440
perspective, the deployment of 5G because[br]for 5G then you get autonomous cars, IoT,

0:36:35.440,0:36:41.840
4K videos streaming in a tube. It is not[br]going in a good direction. The

0:36:41.840,0:36:47.520
massification of [unintelligible] is not a[br]solution. And I was recently talking I

0:36:47.520,0:36:52.560
mean, giving a talk in the biggest, French[br]telecom company called Orange. And there

0:36:52.560,0:36:57.280
is actually like, an inner revolt inside[br]the company because engineers don't want

0:36:57.280,0:37:02.320
to deploy 5G because it's useless. We[br]don't need that. And that's right now,

0:37:02.320,0:37:05.520
that's kind of the shift that we are[br]observing in France. We think there is a

0:37:05.520,0:37:10.560
momentum of people. I mean, also, some[br]laws are getting passed in the parliament

0:37:10.560,0:37:17.280
regarding that. But companies in France, I[br]understood that they cannot do... they

0:37:18.560,0:37:23.360
will be accountable for environmental[br]impact of digital industries. Uh, several

0:37:23.360,0:37:30.160
cities are contacting me to influence or[br]to give them advice on the digital

0:37:30.160,0:37:35.840
strategy, going far away from the 4th[br]Industrial Revolution, the Rifkin thing.

0:37:36.640,0:37:42.640
So I think right now it is about[br]resistance and trying to stop the coming

0:37:42.640,0:37:48.640
flow of whatever techno solution is[br]incoming from the Silicon Valley to

0:37:48.640,0:37:53.600
actually stop at a specific moment. The[br]next big infrastructure, which would be

0:37:53.600,0:38:01.200
5G. Fighting against 5G in my regard is[br]what creates great space to rethink what

0:38:01.200,0:38:05.040
we want from the digital industry and what[br]digital use we want to foster.

0:38:05.040,0:38:07.070
*scattered applause*

0:38:07.070,0:38:12.000
Herald: Okay. We got time for one more[br]question. Microphone number two, please.

0:38:12.000,0:38:17.840
Q: Hello there. I found your model very,[br]very interesting of terrestrialization,

0:38:17.840,0:38:23.520
territorialization, materialization. I'm[br]looking for like worked examples of what

0:38:23.520,0:38:26.880
design decisions you would make[br]differently as a result for that. And I

0:38:26.880,0:38:31.120
didn't quite get that from the talk. Where[br]would I look to find a really concrete

0:38:31.120,0:38:34.400
example of this?[br]Russilhe: Yeah. So there is free projects

0:38:34.400,0:38:42.000
going on now. The first one. Well, I got a[br]European fund actually, to do a specific

0:38:42.000,0:38:46.000
project that I'm very keen on because I[br]don't come from a big city. I come from a

0:38:46.000,0:38:50.640
rural place in France. And I always kept[br]this perspective. What thinking from the

0:38:50.640,0:38:57.440
territory, thinking from the rural aspect[br]of life. Well, what digital use are also

0:38:57.440,0:39:05.520
less excessive. So I receive funding to[br]make low energy template to make cities

0:39:05.520,0:39:13.200
websites. And so I want to spread this[br]open source template. So all the little

0:39:13.200,0:39:19.040
village cities or little cities of France[br]can get the best of what we can do

0:39:19.040,0:39:25.040
regarding low energy web design and spread[br]it through the territory of France. That's

0:39:25.040,0:39:29.440
what we are doing right now. It will be[br]documented in, I mean, the first version

0:39:29.440,0:39:35.680
will pushed in March. Secondly, we are[br]also doing another website for the low

0:39:35.680,0:39:41.200
tech lab in brittany. What we're doing[br]here is documenting how to think

0:39:41.200,0:39:47.120
differently of maps, digital maps[br]especially. Because Google Map is not

0:39:47.120,0:39:51.200
something I want to foster, especially in[br]terms of energy impacts, because even if

0:39:51.200,0:39:56.000
it's very efficient, there's so much[br]growth regarding its use that we need to

0:39:56.000,0:40:01.680
think differently. And when you think of[br]digital maps, there is four. I look at it

0:40:01.680,0:40:07.200
from a design perspective. So I see for[br]uses. Localisation: Where I am or where is

0:40:07.200,0:40:13.520
the point I'm looking for. Orientation.[br]How those are related? Modelization of the

0:40:13.520,0:40:19.520
map. Or, uh, what is the fourth one?[br]Giving a route. When you are using Google

0:40:19.520,0:40:26.160
map, the photos that you are given at the[br]same time. But because it was thought on a

0:40:26.160,0:40:32.880
high energy perspective, but you don't[br]need to display the map if you don't know

0:40:32.880,0:40:37.760
where you want to go. So it's not[br]necessary to show the map if you haven't

0:40:38.960,0:40:44.240
decided where you're going next. So we are[br]just, most of the use I've been developing

0:40:44.240,0:40:48.720
on the digital industry so far, we are[br]trying to rethink it very differently with

0:40:48.720,0:40:54.080
the lowest energy possible. And it means[br]that we need to break down some of the

0:40:54.080,0:41:00.080
things that have been made. It will be[br]documented in February. So I have things

0:41:00.080,0:41:04.851
to show, but not yet.[br]Herald: Encore en fois, merci beaucop.

0:41:04.851,0:41:16.124
Russilhe: Thank you.[br]Herald: Gauthier

0:41:16.124,0:41:37.891
*applause*

0:41:37.891,0:41:40.060
*postroll music*