WEBVTT

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Kiersten Beigel: Good
afternoon, everybody.

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This is Kiersten Beigel.

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I'm with the Office of Head
Start, and I would love

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to welcome you this afternoon
(or midday or morning,

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as the case may be
for some of you).

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I'm going to be your
moderator for this webinar,

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"Father Engagement is
Everybody's Business",

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and I am absolutely thrilled
to be able to do that.

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We have a lot going on this week
at the Office of Head Start,

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as you know since you
registered for this webinar.

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This is part of a series
of resources/events

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that are happening the
week before Father's Day,

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and we're really excited to be able

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to offer the field some new
resources to support the work

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that we do in partnering with
fathers in our programs --

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Head Start and Early
Head Start programs.

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So, before we get
going I'm going to --

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let's do a little tech talk here.

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I wanted to remind you you
can use your computer speakers

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to hear the webinar.

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If you can't hear the presenters
you can, of course, always attempt

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to turn on your computer speakers.

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And if you're having
problems with your speakers,

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or they're not working, you can --

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we've got a phone number here
in the public chat that Natalie,

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who's our webinar coordinator,
put up for everybody.

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So, you can see that
in the public chat.

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It's a number with a
dial in that you can call

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in if you're having trouble.

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I also wanted to direct you to Sam.

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Sam has his own tab next
to the public-private tab.

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There's a Sam tab.

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And if you are having any trouble,
any kind of technical issues,

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you can do some private chatting
with Sam and he'll help you out.

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So, that's our tech talk.

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I wanted to tell you that we
have a pretty interactive session

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for you today.

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We're really excited.

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We have a pretty laid back group
of folks, who are very passionate

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about their work with
fathers, to say the least.

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And I think they're going to keep
it pretty conversational so this --

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we may be doing a little
webinar free styling here,

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a little different than
the usual style of webinar.

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And they're also excited to get
to know a little bit about you.

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We'll be doing some polling
questions, asking you to weigh in,

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and they'll guide you
when it's time to do that.

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So, now I would like to give
you a chance to hear from them.

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They're going to introduce
themselves, and we'll start

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with David who is in the
upper left hand corner here.

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And if you guys could just tell
us who you are and a little bit

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about your connection
with this work.

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David Jones: Okay,
thank you Kiersten.

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Welcome everyone.

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I'm so excited that
you're all participating

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with us on this webinar.

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My name is David Jones.

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I am the Fatherhood Specialist
here in the Office of Head Start.

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I co-lead all of our fatherhood
efforts with Kiersten Beigel.

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And I have about 15 to 20 years

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of experience providing services
directly, indirectly for fathers,

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individual work, group work,
you name it, within the context

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of Early Head Start, Head Start,

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and also as a consultant
to other programs.

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So welcome.

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John Hornstein: Okay,
I'm John Hornstein.

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I'm on the upper right hand side,
the one with the glasses up there.

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I'm delighted to be working with
David and Ed and Kiersten on this.

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I work at the National
Center for Parent, Family,

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and Community Engagement and
have been doing fatherhood work

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for over 30 years.

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And kind of backed into it
when -- at a time when --

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I remember very distinctly the
first time I said to myself,

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"I've got to do more about
this," was at a conference

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when the keynote speaker
was asked, well,

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what do you do with fathers then?

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And the speaker said, "well,

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nothing because they
don't show up."

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So, that got me not laid back,

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as Kiersten said,
but quite passionate.

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So, I'll move onto Ed.

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[Foreign Language]

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Edwin Cheromiah: This is --
my name is Edwin Cheromiah,

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and I just greeted you

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in our Pueblo Laguna
language, the Keres language.

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I was just wishing
everybody a good afternoon.

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Also again, I've been with the
Pueblo Laguna Fatherhood Program

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through the Laguna Head Start
for the past eight years.

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Way back in 2004, these men -- a
few men got together and wanted

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to have fathers more engaged.

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So it went through
PFS first of all,

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but then finally came
into Head Start.

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That's where I've been,

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that's where I was
hired for this position.

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And I continue to offer
services for dads, you know,

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resources to different programs
that we have here in Laguna,

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and also offering
them just the support

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that sometimes fathers
need to move forward.

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And it's a pleasure
to be with you today.

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Kiersten: So how we're really --

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you might have heard
some of our muted voices.

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We were really excited to see
folks rolling in, and we have well

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over 1,000 people register for
this, which is very telling

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about how interested people
are in father engagement.

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So, today what we're going to
do is about an hour and a half.

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And I'm going to monitoring chat.

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So, as questions come up along the
way, we might stop and take some

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of those, or I might
make some decisions

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about holding those
towards the end.

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But, what we're going to do is
reflect kind of on where we are now

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and where we hope to go in
building supportive partnerships

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with fathers, think a little bit
about sort of the movement --

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of the fatherhood movement and how
things have evolved in Head Start

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with regards to father engagement.

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And we want to renew our enthusiasm
and commitment to this work.

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We want to identify some ways
to build father engagement

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that is systemic,
integrated and comprehensive,

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and we'll talk more
about what that means.

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And we hope to share some
new resources for you.

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Some of the resources that
are coming out this week

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that you may use to improve your
program practice with fathers.

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So, without further ado,
I turn it over to David.

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David: Hi, so we're going to begin
with our first polling question,

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which is a two part question.

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We want to get a feel for,
you know, the participants

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on the call today, so we'd like
to ask that everyone participate.

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So, Natalie can you please
go ahead and launch the poll?

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[ Background Noise ]

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David: And the first
question is, what is your role

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within the Head Start program?

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So, we'd like for everyone to
sort of take a moment and click

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on the choice that best
fits the role that you have

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in the program within
where you work.

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If - obviously, if you're not

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within a Head Start program you can
choose one of the other options.

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We'll give you a few
seconds to do that.

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[ Background Noise ]

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David: And Natalie, I'm
not sure in terms of time,

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but give them a couple more seconds

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and then we can take
a look at the results.

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[ Background Noise ]

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David: Okay, can we see
results from the first question?

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Wow, so it looks like about
26 percent of you are family

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and community partnership staff,

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11 percent are parent involvement
staff, and then just sort of mix

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of sort of directors, sort
of leadership in the program.

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We actually have some focused male
involvement staff, health staff.

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So, this is great and this
sort of connects with the title

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of this webinar, which
is, you know,

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"Father Engagement is
Everybody's Business"

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so this is really nice to see.

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So, can we move now to
the next polling question?

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[ Background Noise ]

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David: Okay, it's going
to come up in a second.

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[ Background Noise ]

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David: So, what is your gender?

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[ Background Noise ]

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David: Take a few moments,
make your selection.

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[ Background Noise ]

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David: And the one
thing I want to say

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about the previous
polling question is, again,

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irrespective of your role
within the program, you know,

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everyone can make a meaningful
contribution to working with,

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supporting and engaging fathers.

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John: Uh huh.

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David: That's one of the
things that we really want

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to underscore with today's webinar.

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Okay, can we see the
results please, Natalie?

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[ Background Noise ]

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David: It takes a
couple of seconds.

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>> David: Ah.

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>> John: Wow.

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>> John: You know that leaves a
certain percentage unaccounted for.

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>> David: Yeah.

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>> John: But still, the proportion
is pretty interesting isn't it?

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>> David: It is.

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It is and I mean this is
really important for us

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because again we want to make
sure that we're being thoughtful

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in terms of how we respond, how
we present and what we're saying.

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We have a sense that you know
our programs are predominantly

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populated by female staff,
but we just want to make sure

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that we're being thoughtful and
sensitive to the entire audience.

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So, thank you so much
for your participation.

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Natalie, you can go ahead
and close that poll.

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[ Background Noise ]

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John: What it also says David
is the majority of conversations

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with fathers are between
female staff and fathers.

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David: That's right.

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John: Yeah.

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David: That's right.

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And so, it speaks to and
underscores the importance of,

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sort of, what happens when those
opportunities present themselves

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in terms of what we do with them.

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So, we're waiting
for the next slide.

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And while we're waiting,
basically what we're going

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to do moving forward is just
going to be really reflecting

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on fatherhood and Head Start
and Early Head Start and sort

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of talking a little bit about
the historical evolution

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of the fatherhood
movement within Head Start.

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[ Background Noise ]

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David: Seems -- we may be having
a little technical difficulty.

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John: I've -- David:
Do you see the slide?

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John: Yeah, but I
clicked on the tab

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at the top that'll put me
back to father engagement.

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I did -- David: Okay.

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So, I just did the same thing.

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So, I mean there's a lot that we
can cover to address, you know,

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why fatherhood evolved
in the way that it has.

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You know, we can sort of
ask ourselves some questions

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about the role the women played.

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And let me say that women have been
exceptional in their understanding

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and support of the movement
to support father engagement.

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And I think were it not for their
initial insight and their fortitude

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and support, I'm not
certain we would have evolved

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to where we have today.

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John: Yeah.

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David: You know, they
had to allow men in.

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John: Right.

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David: And then what about the men?

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John: Yeah.

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David: I think they had to
dare to be different and step

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out of their comfort zone, but what
is important is involving fathers.

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Initially, we got to a place
where in the awareness stage what

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that meant was that we were not
only asking more from fathers,

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but we were also asking more
from programs and from staff.

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So, that means everybody had to
be a little bit different in terms

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of the way that they were
working and what they did.

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In the second stage, the
acknowledging stage, you know,

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programs -- we began to believe
that programs needed sort

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of an adjunct or separate services
for fathers in order for them

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to be effective, in order
for them to meaningful.

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And I think at the
time, John and Ed

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if you agree, that was appropriate.

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John: Sure.

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David: Until we began
to see what happened

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when the father involvement
staff left the organization.

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You know sometimes the -- all
the great effort, the great work

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that had gone into producing
this program sort of went

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out the door with that individual.

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So, we've evolved now in our
thinking to not only expect

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that staff build relationships with
fathers and that fathers engage.

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We are suggesting that fully
integrating services for fathers

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as a component of overall
services is not only appropriate,

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but it can contribute to
sustainable service provision

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when we make fatherhood
everybody's business.

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John: Uh huh.

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David: And it's important to note

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that initially you know
some fathers were hesitant,

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almost reluctant, for
very valid reasons.

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You know there were some cultural
reasons for their distance

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from educational programs as well
as some of the systemic stuff

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that we're all aware of.

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But, in some cases we have fathers

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who have received incredible
support and guidance

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from their own fathers, and
they drew from that experience,

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and it was easy to really work
with them and talk to them

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about what was important
for them as fathers.

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And then we had the other end
of the spectrum with fathers

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that did not have that
experience that were committed

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to doing something
different for their children

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than what they received.

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John, would you like
to say -- John: Yeah.

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David: Anything about the
connections and opportunities

00:13:52.366 --> 00:13:54.676
for connections at the
different developmental stages?

00:13:54.856 --> 00:13:56.856
John: Yeah sure.

00:13:56.856 --> 00:14:00.986
I mean I think this is a great
kind of reflection on the history.

00:14:00.986 --> 00:14:03.716
And I -- the other day I
was wondering, you know,

00:14:04.016 --> 00:14:07.306
what did fathers themselves
have to do with this change?

00:14:07.306 --> 00:14:11.586
And I think fathers themselves
are expecting more of programs

00:14:11.586 --> 00:14:13.786
because society as
a whole has changed.

00:14:14.216 --> 00:14:17.496
But, I think, one of the
things about expectations is

00:14:17.496 --> 00:14:21.286
that it may feel really different
at different ages, what --

00:14:21.776 --> 00:14:25.416
the kind of connection
you can make with a father

00:14:25.416 --> 00:14:27.416
when he brings an
infant to a program,

00:14:27.416 --> 00:14:29.936
or when you do a home
visit, is quite different

00:14:29.936 --> 00:14:32.466
than that father whose thinking

00:14:32.466 --> 00:14:36.346
of their four year
old as a ball player.

00:14:36.736 --> 00:14:40.976
So, I think there is a lot of
complexity to this process.

00:14:41.196 --> 00:14:46.056
But I also think that this
idea that somehow everybody --

00:14:46.056 --> 00:14:50.596
that full engagement means really
thinking about every aspect

00:14:50.596 --> 00:14:54.306
of the program as being something
that fathers are involved with

00:14:54.746 --> 00:14:58.916
and that it's not a
distinct and separate thing.

00:14:58.916 --> 00:15:00.916
I think that's an important thing.

00:15:00.916 --> 00:15:02.916
At the same time there may be
some things that are distinctly

00:15:02.916 --> 00:15:05.746
for fathers, and those
shouldn't end necessarily.

00:15:06.116 --> 00:15:08.116
David: That's a really good point.

00:15:08.546 --> 00:15:12.586
>> Yeah. David: So, as we
consider what we mean or, sort of,

00:15:12.586 --> 00:15:15.716
what we're thinking about when we
talk about moving from involvement

00:15:16.116 --> 00:15:18.736
to engagement, as you
can see from this slide.

00:15:18.736 --> 00:15:22.886
You know a lot of times, in
my experience sort of being

00:15:22.886 --> 00:15:26.696
in a program, sort of leading
the evolution of a program

00:15:26.696 --> 00:15:30.036
that became more father friendly,
consulting with other programs

00:15:30.036 --> 00:15:32.596
that were beginning or attempting
to start fatherhood initiatives.

00:15:32.986 --> 00:15:35.736
Programs tend to gravitate
to do what comes easy

00:15:36.016 --> 00:15:38.856
or what satisfies program's goals

00:15:38.856 --> 00:15:41.496
of actually having
a fathers' event.

00:15:41.526 --> 00:15:44.746
And that's not to say that
these events are not meaningful

00:15:44.746 --> 00:15:47.396
and they don't provide
opportunities for connectedness,

00:15:47.536 --> 00:15:49.796
but tying the event to a process

00:15:49.796 --> 00:15:52.756
that facilitates ongoing
opportunities for connectedness

00:15:53.246 --> 00:15:55.956
and relationship building is
the key with the goal in mind

00:15:55.956 --> 00:15:59.536
of learning about how you
know fathers think and feel

00:15:59.536 --> 00:16:03.046
about their role as parents
and what's important to them

00:16:03.046 --> 00:16:05.046
in relationship to their
child's development.

00:16:05.606 --> 00:16:10.076
You know, we are at a place where
we want staff to extend themselves

00:16:10.076 --> 00:16:12.646
and seek opportunities to connect.

00:16:12.766 --> 00:16:17.166
There's so many routines
and complimentary supports

00:16:17.586 --> 00:16:20.526
within Head Start that provide
opportunities to connect

00:16:20.526 --> 00:16:24.876
with fathers that can result
in systemic, integrated

00:16:24.876 --> 00:16:27.716
and comprehensive services,
as shown on this slide.

00:16:27.756 --> 00:16:30.966
You know, we encourage you to dig

00:16:30.966 --> 00:16:33.126
into the resources that's
being released this week

00:16:33.126 --> 00:16:38.166
and begin assessing your programs'
current services, the intersections

00:16:38.166 --> 00:16:41.506
and or opportunities for
connections with fathers, you know,

00:16:41.506 --> 00:16:43.506
at times of pickup and drop off.

00:16:43.896 --> 00:16:46.326
You know, if families transition

00:16:46.326 --> 00:16:48.326
and then I know there's
this process where a lot

00:16:48.326 --> 00:16:52.396
of families transition into Head
Start or Early Head Start initially

00:16:52.396 --> 00:16:54.396
in home-based and they move

00:16:54.396 --> 00:16:56.396
into a center-based
option if that available.

00:16:57.836 --> 00:17:00.676
There's a significant change in
the amount of time that you have

00:17:00.676 --> 00:17:03.856
to communicate with families when
they're in home-based juxtaposed

00:17:03.856 --> 00:17:06.096
to center-based during
pickup and drop off.

00:17:06.096 --> 00:17:08.915
So, staff have to be really
crafty about seizing the moments

00:17:09.386 --> 00:17:11.386
and taking advantage
of those opportunities

00:17:11.386 --> 00:17:13.496
to communicate with families.

00:17:14.106 --> 00:17:16.526
John: Can you go back?

00:17:16.746 --> 00:17:18.746
David: Sure.

00:17:18.746 --> 00:17:20.746
John: Is it possible to go back?

00:17:20.746 --> 00:17:22.746
David: Of course.

00:17:22.746 --> 00:17:24.746
John: Because I want to put
an X right there, alright.

00:17:24.746 --> 00:17:26.746
David: Okay.

00:17:26.746 --> 00:17:28.886
John: And there's some interesting
research on mothers and fathers

00:17:28.886 --> 00:17:33.296
when they drop off
kids at childcare.

00:17:33.766 --> 00:17:37.836
And one of things they've found is
that after a problem, I'm sure many

00:17:37.836 --> 00:17:40.706
of you have seen situations
where the child kind

00:17:40.706 --> 00:17:45.736
of has a hard time transitioning
in and cries and both the parent

00:17:45.736 --> 00:17:47.736
and the child have difficulty.

00:17:47.736 --> 00:17:51.366
So, in this research they called
up both mothers and fathers

00:17:51.366 --> 00:17:54.856
like 10 minutes or so after
they dropped the child off

00:17:54.996 --> 00:17:58.546
and what they found was that
when it was a problematic one,

00:17:58.546 --> 00:18:01.756
when it was a separation
issue, both mothers

00:18:01.756 --> 00:18:04.476
and fathers were still upset.

00:18:04.826 --> 00:18:06.826
They were still really concerned.

00:18:07.086 --> 00:18:11.066
The difference was, was that the
mothers typically had somebody

00:18:11.066 --> 00:18:13.846
to talk to about it
and the fathers didn't.

00:18:13.846 --> 00:18:18.406
So, you know, what David said
about these particular times

00:18:18.406 --> 00:18:21.186
to make a connection,
that time when the,

00:18:21.556 --> 00:18:24.356
with the difficult drop off,
that may be a great time

00:18:24.356 --> 00:18:28.026
to build a connection
with a father.

00:18:28.206 --> 00:18:30.206
Now, you can move the slide.

00:18:30.206 --> 00:18:32.206
David: Make a point.

00:18:32.206 --> 00:18:37.706
John: I just wanted to use the
X. David: This is yours, John.

00:18:38.156 --> 00:18:40.156
John: Okay, yeah.

00:18:40.156 --> 00:18:42.156
So, and this kind of gets
to what I was talking about,

00:18:42.156 --> 00:18:46.256
is these barriers to involvement
and engagement are different.

00:18:46.256 --> 00:18:50.476
So, involvement is, like,
what's getting in the way as far

00:18:50.476 --> 00:18:52.476
as just a physical thing, you know?

00:18:52.476 --> 00:18:54.476
Is it transportation?

00:18:54.476 --> 00:18:57.186
Is it ability to make
it to the program?

00:18:57.486 --> 00:19:01.646
It's all kinds of these almost
physical kind of barriers,

00:19:01.646 --> 00:19:06.156
whereas the barriers to true
engagement, to a true partnership

00:19:06.196 --> 00:19:09.776
with fathers is really
more internal.

00:19:09.996 --> 00:19:14.396
It's more, what am I bringing
to these relationships?

00:19:14.396 --> 00:19:17.236
What do I believe that
the father believes

00:19:17.236 --> 00:19:20.286
about the program or
about child rearing?

00:19:20.556 --> 00:19:24.366
So, it's more this internal
stuff that's in the way

00:19:24.366 --> 00:19:26.366
of fully engaging with fathers.

00:19:26.366 --> 00:19:28.436
And so, when we get to
professional development,

00:19:28.636 --> 00:19:31.526
that's what we're going
to want to think about.

00:19:31.526 --> 00:19:35.376
So, you know, what is in
the way of a father walking

00:19:35.376 --> 00:19:40.566
across the threshold into a
program or actually participating

00:19:40.566 --> 00:19:44.666
in a meeting when there's an issue?

00:19:44.666 --> 00:19:50.306
So, I think that we're moving
to thinking in a deeper way

00:19:50.306 --> 00:19:52.696
about how we form
these partnerships.

00:19:53.916 --> 00:19:56.566
So, yeah, so now we can
move to the research.

00:19:57.156 --> 00:20:00.556
David: Well John, before we move

00:20:01.256 --> 00:20:03.336
to the research slide
-- John: Yeah, yeah.

00:20:03.376 --> 00:20:07.436
David: I would just like to
add a little conversation

00:20:08.336 --> 00:20:10.336
about this last bullet.

00:20:10.816 --> 00:20:12.816
John: Okay.

00:20:12.816 --> 00:20:14.816
Oh, you're using the star.

00:20:14.816 --> 00:20:16.816
I see. David: Getting fancy here.

00:20:17.686 --> 00:20:22.186
You know this is where a lot of
the work really happens with staff

00:20:22.186 --> 00:20:24.516
as it relates to professional
development when we start

00:20:24.516 --> 00:20:26.516
to think about the barriers.

00:20:26.516 --> 00:20:28.516
John: Yeah.

00:20:28.516 --> 00:20:30.516
David: I think it's important
for us to really acknowledge

00:20:30.516 --> 00:20:32.516
and accept the fact
that it is difficult

00:20:32.516 --> 00:20:36.876
and that it may take
time and effort.

00:20:36.876 --> 00:20:39.546
You know in the fatherhood
resource that we're releasing today

00:20:39.546 --> 00:20:43.816
on the ECLKC on page 22
there's really nice quotes

00:20:43.816 --> 00:20:48.736
from a staff member that speaks to
her beliefs about the father's role

00:20:49.386 --> 00:20:53.216
and who she felt she should be
talking to about child development.

00:20:53.706 --> 00:20:57.256
And how with good staff
training, peer support

00:20:57.766 --> 00:21:02.256
and supervision she was able to
change her belief system and begin

00:21:02.256 --> 00:21:04.876
to look at other personal
and professional biases

00:21:04.876 --> 00:21:06.876
that were affecting
her work with fathers.

00:21:06.876 --> 00:21:08.876
John: Yeah, yeah.

00:21:08.876 --> 00:21:10.876
That's -- David: I think that's
just a really important point

00:21:10.876 --> 00:21:12.876
to make that we know that this
work there's some complex issues.

00:21:13.186 --> 00:21:15.366
And moving from one place

00:21:15.366 --> 00:21:18.126
to the next will take some
time, energy and effort.

00:21:18.486 --> 00:21:20.486
John: Yeah.

00:21:20.486 --> 00:21:23.926
And David, so much of that
stuff thus sets the beliefs

00:21:23.926 --> 00:21:28.276
about what my role as a parent
or my role in communicating

00:21:28.276 --> 00:21:31.216
to a parent about which
issues is pretty deep stuff.

00:21:31.216 --> 00:21:33.216
We're not necessarily
conscious of it.

00:21:33.216 --> 00:21:35.216
We just do it.

00:21:35.216 --> 00:21:37.216
David: Right.

00:21:37.216 --> 00:21:39.216
John: It's something that's
culturally formed in us.

00:21:39.216 --> 00:21:41.216
And so, I think some of it
is just acknowledging that

00:21:41.216 --> 00:21:43.216
and bringing it to the surface.

00:21:43.216 --> 00:21:45.216
So, yeah it's a really good point.

00:21:45.216 --> 00:21:47.216
David: And the trust that
has to be involved in terms

00:21:47.216 --> 00:21:49.216
of the relationship with your
supervisor to get to a place

00:21:49.216 --> 00:21:51.216
where you're actually beginning to
wrestle with some of those issues.

00:21:51.216 --> 00:21:53.216
John: Exactly, yeah.

00:21:53.216 --> 00:21:55.216
David: Okay.

00:21:55.216 --> 00:21:59.706
John: Okay, so the research says a
lot and to try to put the research

00:21:59.706 --> 00:22:03.146
on fatherhood on one
slide is very difficult.

00:22:03.676 --> 00:22:07.556
And before I get into
this, I'd like to say

00:22:07.556 --> 00:22:12.396
that this might feel
a little offensive

00:22:12.596 --> 00:22:15.636
to some people, and that's okay.

00:22:15.976 --> 00:22:21.606
But, part of it is that
this doesn't say anything

00:22:21.606 --> 00:22:23.606
about women really.

00:22:23.866 --> 00:22:27.726
And when I say well, fathers
make important contributions

00:22:27.726 --> 00:22:29.726
to children's development.

00:22:29.726 --> 00:22:32.626
Well that doesn't mean that mothers
don't make the same contributions,

00:22:33.256 --> 00:22:36.216
or that mothers in some cases
make the same contributions

00:22:36.216 --> 00:22:38.896
that fathers do, or some
fathers that mothers do.

00:22:38.926 --> 00:22:42.436
So, I think this you know it's
not as like you know one --

00:22:42.666 --> 00:22:44.686
two sided as it may seem.

00:22:45.126 --> 00:22:47.726
So, I just want to you know
make that disclaimer first

00:22:47.726 --> 00:22:50.636
because I think this can start
feeling like oh, dads do this

00:22:50.636 --> 00:22:53.276
and mothers do this when,
in fact, it gets mixed

00:22:53.276 --> 00:22:55.276
up a lot more than we might think.

00:22:55.356 --> 00:22:58.906
The first bullet is
men are fully capable

00:22:58.906 --> 00:23:00.906
of nurturing young children.

00:23:00.906 --> 00:23:02.906
We know that.

00:23:02.906 --> 00:23:04.906
We know that throughout history.

00:23:04.906 --> 00:23:06.906
Men have nurtured young children.

00:23:06.906 --> 00:23:09.966
In some societies men play a
larger role in the nurturance.

00:23:10.086 --> 00:23:14.546
In many societies that's
changing, but men's brains respond

00:23:14.546 --> 00:23:18.426
to a babies cry the same
way women's brains do.

00:23:18.426 --> 00:23:21.206
The same parts of the brain get
activated when they hear a cry.

00:23:21.586 --> 00:23:25.866
Society has helped them figure out
what to do when they hear that cry,

00:23:26.276 --> 00:23:29.626
but the neurological
phenomenon is the same.

00:23:30.246 --> 00:23:33.956
Men naturally raise their
voices to a higher pitch

00:23:33.956 --> 00:23:35.956
when they're talking to infants.

00:23:36.066 --> 00:23:38.686
Of course, if you ask them
whether they are they might say

00:23:38.686 --> 00:23:40.686
"no, I'm not doing that".

00:23:40.686 --> 00:23:42.686
But, then they go "ooh
yeah, [inaudible]".

00:23:42.846 --> 00:23:47.416
So, you know there are things
that men are very capable

00:23:47.416 --> 00:23:49.416
of nurturing young children.

00:23:49.416 --> 00:23:53.286
Another point on this one is that
men tend to look more nurturant

00:23:53.286 --> 00:23:56.736
with young children when
there aren't women there.

00:23:57.046 --> 00:24:01.736
That when there's not, and I would
attribute it to well, you know,

00:24:01.736 --> 00:24:05.386
there's some role definition
going on here and I'm going

00:24:05.386 --> 00:24:07.386
to you know play this role.

00:24:07.386 --> 00:24:11.636
But, we find in general that
when there aren't women near,

00:24:11.636 --> 00:24:13.636
men show more nurturance.

00:24:13.636 --> 00:24:16.906
The second bullet, and this
could go on and on and on,

00:24:16.906 --> 00:24:21.526
and some of this material is in
the guide that David referred to,

00:24:21.976 --> 00:24:26.626
fathers make important
varied contributions

00:24:26.626 --> 00:24:30.366
to children's development,
regulation and self-control.

00:24:30.786 --> 00:24:36.656
There -- the way they play with
young children causes children

00:24:36.686 --> 00:24:40.506
to actually control their
impulses a little more

00:24:40.506 --> 00:24:42.956
or know what the limits
of that are.

00:24:42.956 --> 00:24:45.986
We -- you know there's this
discussion of fathers tend

00:24:45.986 --> 00:24:47.986
to play more roughly
with their children,

00:24:48.206 --> 00:24:51.876
and sometimes mothers get a
little nervous about that,

00:24:51.876 --> 00:24:55.296
or even Head Start staff get
a little nervous about that.

00:24:55.296 --> 00:24:59.236
And certainly we don't want
that to go too far and --

00:24:59.546 --> 00:25:02.546
but at the same time a
certain amount of that is --

00:25:02.546 --> 00:25:05.466
helps the child gain
self-regulation.

00:25:05.766 --> 00:25:10.426
Language development, well men
tend to make children work harder

00:25:10.646 --> 00:25:12.896
when they say something.

00:25:12.896 --> 00:25:17.536
And the classic example is when the
toddler goes to the refrigerator

00:25:17.536 --> 00:25:22.256
and goes "ju", like that, the
mother opens up the refrigerator,

00:25:22.606 --> 00:25:27.006
gets a cup and pours juice
whereas the father goes "what?"

00:25:27.756 --> 00:25:30.416
And then the child goes "juice".

00:25:31.066 --> 00:25:33.546
And the father goes "oh,
you want some juice".

00:25:33.546 --> 00:25:37.606
And so, like I said
that's in general.

00:25:37.606 --> 00:25:39.656
Some mothers are going to be
more like fathers that way,

00:25:39.656 --> 00:25:42.596
some fathers more like
mothers, but in general kids

00:25:42.596 --> 00:25:46.136
in the toddler period anyway have
to work harder with their language.

00:25:47.246 --> 00:25:49.646
Same is true for cognitive
and emotional development.

00:25:49.646 --> 00:25:52.236
Fathers have a distinct
impact on that.

00:25:52.466 --> 00:25:55.246
That active play with
fathers, nurturant play,

00:25:55.546 --> 00:25:59.656
actually supports cognitive
and emotional development

00:25:59.656 --> 00:26:03.956
and there's pretty strong
research evidence to support that.

00:26:04.556 --> 00:26:09.546
It, the -- in fact, the
relationship between,

00:26:09.546 --> 00:26:12.606
this is a different piece of
research, but the relationship

00:26:12.606 --> 00:26:17.276
between a father and a child
is not necessarily measured

00:26:17.276 --> 00:26:21.436
by whether the child goes
to the father for security.

00:26:21.806 --> 00:26:24.896
Certainly in good
relationships that happens.

00:26:25.066 --> 00:26:27.846
But, a better measure, better
predictor of the relationship

00:26:27.846 --> 00:26:32.016
between a father and a child
is how they play together.

00:26:32.216 --> 00:26:34.866
So, that's something that
we want to encourage.

00:26:35.116 --> 00:26:37.116
And then the final bullet is well,

00:26:37.176 --> 00:26:39.466
it's good for a lot
of other things too.

00:26:39.466 --> 00:26:45.426
When fathers are involved, when
other men are involved in the lives

00:26:45.426 --> 00:26:49.386
of mother's children, then
mothers can be better mothers.

00:26:49.506 --> 00:26:54.136
They can mother more
effectively and some

00:26:54.136 --> 00:26:56.566
of that is economic, of course.

00:26:56.566 --> 00:27:00.486
Some of it is, as with any of
us when we've got the support

00:27:00.486 --> 00:27:03.326
of another person, we
can do our jobs better.

00:27:03.616 --> 00:27:07.226
Fathers themselves report
that when they're involved

00:27:07.226 --> 00:27:10.456
with their children, when they're
engaged with their children,

00:27:10.456 --> 00:27:12.456
they feel better about themselves.

00:27:12.456 --> 00:27:16.826
And that's almost self-explanatory
and then society as a whole,

00:27:17.256 --> 00:27:19.786
people that are engaged in
fathering and men who are engaged

00:27:19.786 --> 00:27:22.486
in fathering engage in less crime.

00:27:22.936 --> 00:27:25.246
They're more productive
members of society

00:27:25.966 --> 00:27:29.356
and there's a number of outcomes.

00:27:29.716 --> 00:27:35.786
So, that's a lot of the research
in a nutshell and I don't think

00:27:35.786 --> 00:27:39.816
that most people on this call need
to be convinced of this in any way.

00:27:39.816 --> 00:27:43.126
But, it's nice to have some of
these ideas so that we can kind

00:27:43.126 --> 00:27:46.366
of deepen our understanding of
what the effect of fathers is

00:27:46.366 --> 00:27:48.946
and what the effect of being
involved in children's lives

00:27:48.946 --> 00:27:50.946
and their programs is on fathers.

00:27:51.516 --> 00:27:56.706
[ Background Noise ]

00:27:57.206 --> 00:27:59.286
John: Oh. Yeah go
ahead David, yeah.

00:27:59.706 --> 00:28:05.736
David: So, with this particular
slide what we kind of wanted

00:28:06.046 --> 00:28:11.036
to do was to have our participants
that have engaged in a little bit

00:28:11.036 --> 00:28:13.036
of interactive exercise.

00:28:13.036 --> 00:28:15.286
Sort of, if you can,
if you're willing,

00:28:15.836 --> 00:28:19.506
take a look at this picture and
then just type into the chat sort

00:28:19.956 --> 00:28:22.706
of what you see in this picture.

00:28:22.766 --> 00:28:28.066
We just kind of want to get a
feel for sort of is there anything

00:28:28.066 --> 00:28:33.316
that strikes you as you're looking
at this father and this child?

00:28:33.906 --> 00:28:36.816
So, if you could take a
moment to type into it.

00:28:36.816 --> 00:28:39.246
I think we're going to
use the public chat.

00:28:40.266 --> 00:28:43.786
So, type into the chat
your sort of reactions

00:28:43.786 --> 00:28:45.786
when you see this picture.

00:28:45.786 --> 00:28:48.706
So, we'll take a few
minutes to have you do that.

00:28:49.516 --> 00:29:04.716
[ Background Noise ]

00:29:05.216 --> 00:29:08.156
David: John, is there anything else
you wanted to say while they're --

00:29:08.296 --> 00:29:10.296
while we're waiting for
someone maybe to type a --

00:29:10.296 --> 00:29:12.886
John: Well, the picture
is so compelling.

00:29:12.886 --> 00:29:17.006
I hate to distract people.

00:29:17.006 --> 00:29:21.416
But, I would -- if anything I've
said about the research was --

00:29:21.416 --> 00:29:26.536
struck you as gee I don't really --
I'd like to hear more about that,

00:29:26.536 --> 00:29:30.396
I would direct people to the
guide because there's a section

00:29:30.396 --> 00:29:35.616
of the guide that kind of
summarizes the research on fathers,

00:29:35.616 --> 00:29:40.356
in particular the contribution they
make to children's development.

00:29:40.756 --> 00:29:48.446
David: Okay, well it doesn't look
like we have any brave souls.

00:29:48.446 --> 00:29:50.446
Oh, whoa here we go.

00:29:50.446 --> 00:29:52.446
John: Okay.

00:29:52.446 --> 00:29:55.946
David: There is -- thank you
so much Lada, a dear friend

00:29:55.946 --> 00:29:57.946
of mine, former colleague.

00:29:57.946 --> 00:29:59.946
Well, hopefully she still
considers herself a colleague.

00:29:59.946 --> 00:30:04.426
John: She's -- she felt sorry felt
for you and had to write something.

00:30:04.426 --> 00:30:06.426
David: I know, right.

00:30:06.426 --> 00:30:09.066
She sees a picture of the
loving father with his child.

00:30:09.336 --> 00:30:11.336
John: Uh huh.

00:30:11.336 --> 00:30:13.336
David: Very interesting.

00:30:13.336 --> 00:30:16.216
Now, is there anyone else out
there that sees something similar

00:30:16.296 --> 00:30:18.296
or something different
that would be willing

00:30:18.296 --> 00:30:20.296
to share it with the group?

00:30:21.456 --> 00:30:23.456
We need one brave soul.

00:30:23.456 --> 00:30:26.146
Sam Gourlay: Actually this is
Sam Gourlay [assumed spelling].

00:30:26.146 --> 00:30:28.746
Unfortunately, we're having
a little bit of an issue

00:30:28.746 --> 00:30:30.746
with public chat right now.

00:30:30.746 --> 00:30:33.736
So, there are a lot of people that
are airing wonderful comments,

00:30:33.736 --> 00:30:35.736
but they're unable to get them
into the public chat area.

00:30:35.736 --> 00:30:37.736
I apologize for this.

00:30:37.736 --> 00:30:39.736
John: Okay.

00:30:39.736 --> 00:30:41.736
David: Can you see them, Sam?

00:30:41.736 --> 00:30:43.736
Can you see them?

00:30:43.736 --> 00:30:45.736
Sam: Yeah.

00:30:45.736 --> 00:30:47.736
I'm going to try to relate
them through the private chat.

00:30:47.736 --> 00:30:49.736
Thanking everyone for
directing them to me.

00:30:49.736 --> 00:30:51.736
I'll try to push them in.

00:30:51.736 --> 00:30:53.736
David: Awesome, thank you.

00:30:53.736 --> 00:30:55.736
John: Great, great.

00:30:55.736 --> 00:30:57.736
Well maybe we can come back to
that and move on with the slides.

00:30:57.736 --> 00:30:59.736
You want to do that David or?

00:30:59.736 --> 00:31:01.736
David: Yeah, that works.

00:31:01.736 --> 00:30:58.000
John: Yeah.

00:31:04.496 --> 00:31:11.026
David: So, in this slide it's
going to be an opportunity for Ed,

00:31:11.436 --> 00:31:13.856
John and myself to kind
of weigh in a little bit.

00:31:14.696 --> 00:31:16.696
John: Yeah.

00:31:16.696 --> 00:31:19.346
David: I particularly like this
slide because it is illustrative

00:31:20.046 --> 00:31:23.126
of our expanding definition
of the father's role.

00:31:23.806 --> 00:31:26.826
We've completely moved away
from men thinking of themselves

00:31:27.386 --> 00:31:29.386
as solely financial providers.

00:31:29.646 --> 00:31:32.926
Each of these roles
have specific meanings

00:31:32.926 --> 00:31:37.626
to fathers given their past
experiences, where they are

00:31:37.626 --> 00:31:41.696
in their current lives,
where they are going

00:31:41.696 --> 00:31:43.696
and of course their maturity level.

00:31:43.696 --> 00:31:46.536
And I'll just start with
one of them and give John

00:31:46.536 --> 00:31:48.536
and Ed an opportunity to chime in.

00:31:48.846 --> 00:31:53.496
Advocating, you know, to me,
advocating is what should you learn

00:31:53.496 --> 00:31:55.496
that you're an advocate
for your child.

00:31:55.496 --> 00:32:00.986
It's one of those now and
forever roles, so John.

00:32:01.746 --> 00:32:06.696
John: Yeah, you know it's
funny, David, when you picked

00:32:06.696 --> 00:32:10.176
on the advocate role because
you immediately brought me back

00:32:10.176 --> 00:32:12.176
to when my daughter
was born and she was

00:32:12.966 --> 00:32:15.076
in the neonatal intensive
care unit.

00:32:15.706 --> 00:32:19.996
And my job as a father at
that time was to advocate

00:32:19.996 --> 00:32:21.996
for the wellbeing of my child.

00:32:21.996 --> 00:32:26.196
You know it was to deal
with this healthcare system

00:32:26.196 --> 00:32:29.406
that I didn't understand
and was really angry at.

00:32:30.036 --> 00:32:34.056
And so, you know there's that,
there was the nurturer part

00:32:34.056 --> 00:32:36.606
of that, the protector part
of that, but there was also,

00:32:36.606 --> 00:32:38.866
like I had to advocate
for my child.

00:32:38.866 --> 00:32:43.046
I had to know something, and
so I appreciate you starting

00:32:43.046 --> 00:32:45.046
with that one.

00:32:45.046 --> 00:32:47.476
The one that I pick up on
is this friend-playmate

00:32:47.476 --> 00:32:50.946
because that's a very complex one.

00:32:51.666 --> 00:32:56.756
You know we tell fathers "well,

00:32:56.756 --> 00:32:59.866
if you want to be the
disciplinarian you can't be your

00:32:59.906 --> 00:33:01.906
child's friend.

00:33:01.906 --> 00:33:03.906
You got to be the father.

00:33:03.906 --> 00:33:06.136
You got to be the discipline, the
person that provides discipline."

00:33:06.136 --> 00:33:11.166
At the same time, you know, there's
a slash playmate and we know

00:33:11.166 --> 00:33:14.426
that in the relationships
between fathers

00:33:14.546 --> 00:33:17.866
and their children is often
a very playful relationship

00:33:18.166 --> 00:33:21.126
in that the child, as early
childhood people we know,

00:33:21.566 --> 00:33:24.726
the child learns through
the process of play.

00:33:25.126 --> 00:33:29.576
So, I think that that one is,
that one's got a lot of complexity

00:33:29.576 --> 00:33:36.106
to it, but it's one that we know
kind of fathers connect with.

00:33:36.516 --> 00:33:39.476
So, that's my two
cents on that one.

00:33:39.566 --> 00:33:41.566
David: Awesome, Ed.

00:33:41.566 --> 00:33:43.566
Edwin: Yeah I'm here.

00:33:43.566 --> 00:33:45.566
I would -- we had just
talked about this earlier,

00:33:45.566 --> 00:33:47.606
and I was just talking to
one of the fathers here that,

00:33:47.606 --> 00:33:50.236
or actually a grandfather,
about some of these things.

00:33:50.236 --> 00:33:52.626
And we -- you know, a lot of
it has to deal with for us,

00:33:52.776 --> 00:33:55.546
from a native side,
is our core values.

00:33:55.996 --> 00:33:59.206
You know, again, you know,
building strength on the --

00:33:59.636 --> 00:34:04.346
where we incorporate culture,
ceremony, traditions and healing

00:34:04.346 --> 00:34:07.556
and of course humor is a big
part of you know native men

00:34:07.556 --> 00:34:09.556
and of course all men in general.

00:34:09.686 --> 00:34:11.846
And that -- we are
hoping that was going --

00:34:12.025 --> 00:34:15.085
some of the teaching that we do
through spiritual guidance is

00:34:15.085 --> 00:34:20.386
that it help us, you know, increase
and strengthen family preservation.

00:34:20.386 --> 00:34:22.906
And that's what we're all kind
of looking for is offering

00:34:22.906 --> 00:34:25.966
that family preservation and
for our children to continue

00:34:25.966 --> 00:34:28.916
to offer those teachings as
they become parents later on,

00:34:29.396 --> 00:34:31.406
role modeling some of
those things especially.

00:34:31.666 --> 00:34:35.315
Again, you know a lot of
it is creating a safe place

00:34:35.315 --> 00:34:39.505
for men you know to come and
talk about these types of things.

00:34:39.505 --> 00:34:42.315
And a lot of it sometimes
doesn't always take place

00:34:42.315 --> 00:34:44.636
in a [Inaudible] setting, but
a lot of it also takes part

00:34:44.636 --> 00:34:47.426
at our fatherhood
program here at Laguna.

00:34:47.426 --> 00:34:51.366
Again, it's again all about
strengthening, you know,

00:34:51.426 --> 00:34:53.426
family relationships,
family involvement

00:34:53.426 --> 00:34:55.596
and just being a responsible father

00:34:56.025 --> 00:34:58.146
that again goes back
to the preservation.

00:34:59.016 --> 00:35:01.016
David: Okay.

00:35:01.016 --> 00:35:03.016
Edwin: You know those are just some
of the things that we had talked

00:35:03.016 --> 00:35:05.016
about earlier, so -- John: Yeah.

00:35:05.016 --> 00:35:09.676
The other day, Ed, you also said
something about how in Laguna

00:35:09.736 --> 00:35:14.636
that the -- that men transmit
certain things culturally

00:35:14.636 --> 00:35:16.996
to the kids as the
educator in a sense.

00:35:17.756 --> 00:35:21.856
Edwin: Right, right and that's -- a
lot of the cultural teachings come

00:35:21.856 --> 00:35:23.856
in from the [inaudible] side.

00:35:23.856 --> 00:35:27.706
It also includes planting because
the planting doesn't only include

00:35:27.706 --> 00:35:30.306
just planting of a seed in
the ground, but it also --

00:35:30.536 --> 00:35:32.536
there's a cultural teaching behind

00:35:32.536 --> 00:35:35.516
that where you're planting
other knowledge into a child

00:35:35.516 --> 00:35:37.516
and you know planting
those important roles

00:35:37.536 --> 00:35:39.906
that they will be facing
as they become adults.

00:35:39.906 --> 00:35:41.906
So, those are some of the things
that growing and nurturing

00:35:41.906 --> 00:35:43.906
of those particular things.

00:35:43.906 --> 00:35:45.906
John: Wow, right.

00:35:45.906 --> 00:35:48.336
David: You know, and John I
was thinking a little bit too

00:35:48.336 --> 00:35:51.016
about what you said you
know with your daughter.

00:35:51.166 --> 00:35:55.026
And I think one of the things
that we don't always acknowledge

00:35:55.026 --> 00:35:57.196
or allow ourselves
to sort of appreciate

00:35:57.406 --> 00:36:02.176
in men is they are afraid,
that they're scared.

00:36:02.706 --> 00:36:05.466
They're scared of embracing
the fatherhood role.

00:36:05.666 --> 00:36:07.666
John: Yeah.

00:36:07.666 --> 00:36:10.626
David: Embracing sort of the
expanding definition of their role,

00:36:11.216 --> 00:36:13.416
and also afraid of
negotiating systems.

00:36:13.416 --> 00:36:16.866
I can't even imagine what it must
be, feel like to have a daughter

00:36:16.866 --> 00:36:18.986
in a neonatal intensive
care unit and have

00:36:18.986 --> 00:36:21.356
to negotiate you know
all these professionals.

00:36:21.356 --> 00:36:26.786
And we, you know, as humans we
tend to rely on professionals

00:36:26.786 --> 00:36:30.096
to make important decisions
that impact our lives for us

00:36:30.096 --> 00:36:32.266
because we trust that they
have a particular expertise.

00:36:32.936 --> 00:36:35.526
So, I think that as we continue
to expand our understanding

00:36:35.526 --> 00:36:39.986
of how we need to be thinking about
working with fathers it's okay,

00:36:39.986 --> 00:36:43.116
it's important for us to realize
rather that they do become afraid.

00:36:43.116 --> 00:36:46.696
They are challenged by
fulfilling all the multiple roles

00:36:46.726 --> 00:36:50.056
that we're asking them to fulfill
and that these fears are very real

00:36:50.056 --> 00:36:52.226
for them, and they have to
acknowledged and supported.

00:36:52.276 --> 00:36:54.276
John: Yeah that's great David.

00:36:54.276 --> 00:36:57.086
I mean you're right on.

00:36:57.086 --> 00:37:01.126
And I think that of course when
you're talking about fear in men

00:37:02.096 --> 00:37:05.776
and society you know we
don't like to show it.

00:37:05.776 --> 00:37:07.776
David: Right.

00:37:07.776 --> 00:37:10.166
John: Right, we don't
necessarily like to show our fears,

00:37:10.166 --> 00:37:12.926
but probably if you
ask most men who happen

00:37:12.926 --> 00:37:16.676
to be fathers too what their
greatest fear is they're not going

00:37:16.676 --> 00:37:18.676
to say their own safety.

00:37:18.676 --> 00:37:20.676
They're going to say
fear for their child.

00:37:20.696 --> 00:37:22.696
David: Right.

00:37:22.696 --> 00:37:24.696
John: Which is probably
very in common with women.

00:37:24.976 --> 00:37:30.776
But, its -- and, but do men
actually reveal their fears

00:37:30.776 --> 00:37:32.776
in the same way?

00:37:32.776 --> 00:37:34.776
Do they talk about them?

00:37:34.776 --> 00:37:39.136
And I think that's real
[Inaudible] when you --

00:37:39.136 --> 00:37:45.026
when a father actually will
say, you know, that I'm afraid

00:37:45.026 --> 00:37:48.446
that my child isn't going
to succeed in school,

00:37:48.446 --> 00:37:51.826
or my child isn't going
to be accepted by peers,

00:37:51.826 --> 00:37:56.686
or whatever the issue is, then
you're dealing with a passion

00:37:56.686 --> 00:37:58.686
that makes him a father.

00:37:58.686 --> 00:38:01.256
Then you're nurturing the
nurturer when you can listen

00:38:01.256 --> 00:38:03.256
to that and support that man.

00:38:03.306 --> 00:38:06.736
But, if you're at the place
where a father is sharing some

00:38:06.736 --> 00:38:13.096
of those fears with you in a way
that's comfortable then I think

00:38:13.096 --> 00:38:15.706
you've made real progress
in your relationship

00:38:15.706 --> 00:38:17.706
with that father, for sure.

00:38:17.706 --> 00:38:19.706
David: That is a really
important point.

00:38:19.706 --> 00:38:21.816
Alright, so I think
we had a few comments.

00:38:21.816 --> 00:38:24.466
We're going to move back
really quickly -- John: Okay.

00:38:24.466 --> 00:38:26.466
David: To the previous slide.

00:38:26.466 --> 00:38:29.106
And I just want to share
what's interesting --

00:38:29.106 --> 00:38:32.666
Lada sort of kicked this off
and she's obviously female.

00:38:33.236 --> 00:38:38.126
But, then we had three men
comment and the comments were:

00:38:38.546 --> 00:38:42.136
wanting to stay connected; a
father wanting to stay connected

00:38:42.136 --> 00:38:46.726
to his child; the importance of the
skin to skin contact between father

00:38:46.726 --> 00:38:50.826
and child; and a man
showing gentle love and care.

00:38:51.436 --> 00:38:53.436
John: Yeah.

00:38:53.436 --> 00:38:55.436
David: All very positive,
which is great.

00:38:55.436 --> 00:38:57.436
John: Yeah.

00:38:57.436 --> 00:38:59.436
David: So, I think we've
done a good job of sort

00:38:59.436 --> 00:39:01.436
of getting people
excited and getting them

00:39:01.436 --> 00:39:03.436
to celebrate what we're doing

00:39:03.436 --> 00:39:05.436
and having them feel really
positively about fatherhood.

00:39:05.436 --> 00:39:09.396
When Kiersten and I recently showed
this slide and sort of used it

00:39:10.026 --> 00:39:12.026
as part of our presentation

00:39:12.026 --> 00:39:16.856
in the Leadership Institute there
was some different perceptions

00:39:16.976 --> 00:39:19.126
that came from a predominately
female audience,

00:39:19.126 --> 00:39:21.126
which was really interesting.

00:39:21.126 --> 00:39:26.316
For the most part participants
were supportive and they were able

00:39:26.316 --> 00:39:28.326
to actually look at the
strength in the picture.

00:39:28.946 --> 00:39:34.036
But, then some of the participants
seemed like the father looked

00:39:34.136 --> 00:39:36.396
like he was uncomfortable.

00:39:36.676 --> 00:39:38.676
He didn't really know
what he was doing.

00:39:38.866 --> 00:39:42.476
The baby's face looks like
it's a little crunched

00:39:42.476 --> 00:39:44.476
up in between his shoulder.

00:39:44.476 --> 00:39:46.476
The baby looked uncomfortable.

00:39:46.476 --> 00:39:48.476
I mean they took it to some
really interesting places

00:39:48.476 --> 00:39:50.686
and it was almost as if they
wanted to take the baby out of

00:39:50.686 --> 00:39:55.086
that father's hands, which
was really interesting to us.

00:39:55.686 --> 00:39:59.886
And a question for -- from
us to the group would be,

00:40:00.386 --> 00:40:03.446
how would you help this
father build upon what we see

00:40:03.446 --> 00:40:05.736
in the photo that is a strength?

00:40:05.736 --> 00:40:08.166
And if there are some things that
now that you're looking at it

00:40:08.206 --> 00:40:11.626
from a different lens that you
would want to sort of change

00:40:11.626 --> 00:40:13.966
or provide some support
and guidance around.

00:40:14.496 --> 00:40:17.106
What might be the first thing
that you would say to this guy?

00:40:17.956 --> 00:40:19.956
That's rhetorical.

00:40:19.956 --> 00:40:21.956
I'm not expecting you to answer.

00:40:21.956 --> 00:40:23.956
But, John you want to weigh in?

00:40:23.956 --> 00:40:27.056
John: Yeah, I think -- I
mean any picture of a man

00:40:27.056 --> 00:40:32.006
or a woman holding a child
evokes a pretty strong kind

00:40:32.006 --> 00:40:34.446
of just below the
surface responses.

00:40:34.916 --> 00:40:40.676
And I mean you see a baby and
you want to hold the baby.

00:40:40.906 --> 00:40:44.806
I see babies in supermarkets, and
I try to steal them all the time.

00:40:44.896 --> 00:40:47.316
I mean it's like it's
-- there is a response.

00:40:47.316 --> 00:40:50.596
There's a very -- and I
guess if you had a response

00:40:50.596 --> 00:40:55.486
and you didn't even put it down on
paper, or the computer I guess now,

00:40:55.876 --> 00:40:59.486
is oh -- I would try to understand

00:40:59.486 --> 00:41:02.206
that response before
doing anything, you know,

00:41:02.206 --> 00:41:04.206
or as you're doing something.

00:41:04.206 --> 00:41:06.656
But, certainly I like,
David, what you're saying,

00:41:06.656 --> 00:41:12.476
so yea there's plenty that you can
see in this picture to work from.

00:41:13.006 --> 00:41:16.806
And yeah, I -- actually
I immediately go

00:41:16.806 --> 00:41:19.156
to what you're asking.

00:41:19.156 --> 00:41:22.146
It's like well, how would you
start making a relationship

00:41:22.146 --> 00:41:24.326
with his father based on
what you see right here?

00:41:24.716 --> 00:41:26.716
>> Uh huh.

00:41:26.716 --> 00:41:28.716
>> Yeah. David: And, you know,

00:41:28.716 --> 00:41:30.826
I mean it's like just really
simple basic questions that's going

00:41:30.826 --> 00:41:34.116
to give you some insight
into where this father is at.

00:41:34.536 --> 00:41:36.536
What's important to him?

00:41:36.536 --> 00:41:38.536
How he might be thinking
in that moment?

00:41:38.536 --> 00:41:40.536
You know, how does
this feel for you?

00:41:40.536 --> 00:41:44.096
What are you thinking when you hold
your child so close in this way?

00:41:44.466 --> 00:41:46.696
Is there a particular reason
why you hold him that way

00:41:46.696 --> 00:41:48.696
because it could be cultural?

00:41:48.696 --> 00:41:51.846
But, those are points,
questions that will then begin

00:41:51.916 --> 00:41:55.416
to generate some really significant
conversations with that father.

00:41:56.236 --> 00:41:58.236
John: Yeah, yeah, great.

00:41:58.236 --> 00:42:01.126
David: So, we're going
to move and John

00:42:01.196 --> 00:42:03.196
as you -- John: Oh, look at this.

00:42:03.196 --> 00:42:05.196
Look at this.

00:42:05.196 --> 00:42:07.196
That's good.

00:42:07.196 --> 00:42:09.196
I've seen this before.

00:42:09.196 --> 00:42:11.196
This is the Parent, Family, and
Community Engagement Framework,

00:42:11.196 --> 00:42:13.196
and I assume that many of you

00:42:13.196 --> 00:42:16.086
on the webinar have seen
this very colorful graphic.

00:42:16.626 --> 00:42:21.576
I think it's -- I actually
really like this Framework.

00:42:21.576 --> 00:42:25.736
I think it puts together
exactly what it says that parent

00:42:25.736 --> 00:42:28.126
and family engagement,
and you could --

00:42:28.256 --> 00:42:30.666
instead of parent and
family, you could put father

00:42:30.666 --> 00:42:32.666
in there, not without family.

00:42:32.966 --> 00:42:36.056
Not without the parent,
but you could put father

00:42:36.546 --> 00:42:39.656
and it would all still apply.

00:42:39.656 --> 00:42:44.136
So, when father engagements
are systematic and integrated

00:42:44.136 --> 00:42:46.816
across program foundations
and impact areas,

00:42:46.816 --> 00:42:49.196
family outcomes are achieved.

00:42:49.426 --> 00:42:52.796
So, and then hence you're
working on child outcomes.

00:42:53.216 --> 00:42:55.216
But, this progression
is interesting.

00:42:55.216 --> 00:42:57.216
And I almost like
to think of this as,

00:42:57.216 --> 00:43:00.696
so the program foundations
they're like the nervous system.

00:43:00.696 --> 00:43:02.696
They're the brain.

00:43:02.696 --> 00:43:07.206
They're the thing that sends
messages to the whole body, right?

00:43:07.206 --> 00:43:10.616
So, the program leadership is
like yes, we believe in it.

00:43:10.766 --> 00:43:15.806
My brain believes in
father engagement.

00:43:15.926 --> 00:43:19.536
I actually reflect on my own
relationship with my father,

00:43:19.536 --> 00:43:22.246
and I want to make it a
priority for this program

00:43:22.246 --> 00:43:24.846
and these are the ways I'm
going to support everybody.

00:43:25.266 --> 00:43:27.996
And that -- part of the
point here is that everybody

00:43:28.306 --> 00:43:31.946
in the system is engaging
with fathers,

00:43:31.946 --> 00:43:34.916
the same for continuous improvement
and professional development.

00:43:34.916 --> 00:43:36.916
They're kind of like --
these are the things,

00:43:36.916 --> 00:43:38.916
these are the foundations.

00:43:38.916 --> 00:43:40.916
These are what makes
a whole system work.

00:43:40.916 --> 00:43:43.616
Kind of see the program
environment that --

00:43:43.616 --> 00:43:46.406
the impact areas as
kind of the muscles

00:43:46.406 --> 00:43:48.996
and the organs of
the organism, right?

00:43:48.996 --> 00:43:51.536
You know, these are things
that get things done.

00:43:51.536 --> 00:43:58.116
The partnerships with
families, with fathers are

00:43:58.116 --> 00:44:00.116
where we get things done.

00:44:00.116 --> 00:44:03.696
The teaching and learning, the
partnerships with other agencies

00:44:03.696 --> 00:44:06.506
and certainly creating
a welcoming environment

00:44:06.506 --> 00:44:10.466
for fathers is a large
piece of what we need

00:44:10.466 --> 00:44:12.536
to do to send that message.

00:44:12.946 --> 00:44:18.176
But, if you notice along
the top, the arrow, positive

00:44:18.176 --> 00:44:20.186
and goal oriented relationships.

00:44:20.186 --> 00:44:22.786
Well, I see that as the
blood in the system.

00:44:22.786 --> 00:44:24.786
That's the circulatory system.

00:44:24.786 --> 00:44:27.406
That's what keeps everything
refreshed and going.

00:44:28.186 --> 00:44:30.496
Maybe the metaphor
doesn't work that well.

00:44:30.496 --> 00:44:32.496
I don't know.

00:44:32.496 --> 00:44:35.176
But, the -- I don't want to
neglect that arrow at the top

00:44:35.266 --> 00:44:39.306
because for all these pieces
to work together, for this body

00:44:39.646 --> 00:44:43.896
to work together, we've got to
reflect on our relationships

00:44:43.896 --> 00:44:47.126
with men who have their
children in our program.

00:44:48.526 --> 00:44:52.016
That we have to keep
that blood flowing

00:44:52.316 --> 00:44:57.356
by constantly giving it
oxygen, by refreshing it,

00:44:57.356 --> 00:44:59.916
and that is through
our relationships

00:44:59.916 --> 00:45:02.546
with these fathers whether
it's at the drop off,

00:45:03.006 --> 00:45:07.176
whether it's in -- at a picnic.

00:45:07.176 --> 00:45:12.706
Whether it's sending a
document home or calling home.

00:45:13.006 --> 00:45:15.826
Whether -- you know
in so many ways --

00:45:15.826 --> 00:45:17.826
Ed did you want to say something?

00:45:17.826 --> 00:45:19.826
Was that -- I just
heard somebody's voice.

00:45:20.126 --> 00:45:24.786
Okay, so-- Edwin: No John
I was muted there, sorry.

00:45:25.366 --> 00:45:27.366
John: Okay.

00:45:27.366 --> 00:45:30.496
So, in any case, I think in
every one of these elements

00:45:30.496 --> 00:45:34.816
and the outcomes you can
see specific kind of things

00:45:34.816 --> 00:45:41.506
that we can do with fathers, family
wellbeing as an outcome area.

00:45:41.836 --> 00:45:47.026
Well, one of the things that
I think I've seen in programs

00:45:47.026 --> 00:45:51.176
that do very well with fathers
is that they acknowledge

00:45:51.176 --> 00:45:56.346
that these men also need to
feel good as men in our society

00:45:56.346 --> 00:45:58.346
if they're going to do
a good job as fathers.

00:45:58.906 --> 00:46:03.146
So, and we talked about this the
other day when we were planning

00:46:03.146 --> 00:46:05.146
that this is an important
piece too.

00:46:05.146 --> 00:46:10.306
It doesn't just mean that we
scrutinize fathers and expect them

00:46:10.306 --> 00:46:12.306
to be nurturant and play
with their children.

00:46:12.566 --> 00:46:15.276
But, we also want
them to be supported

00:46:15.336 --> 00:46:19.946
in who they are themselves and
how they feel about themselves

00:46:20.736 --> 00:46:24.436
as competent human
beings in this society.

00:46:24.666 --> 00:46:27.426
So -- Edwin: So -- John:
Yeah, go ahead Ed, yeah.

00:46:27.766 --> 00:46:30.856
Edwin: Yeah, again just talking
about the program leadership,

00:46:30.856 --> 00:46:32.856
the continuous program improve --

00:46:32.856 --> 00:46:35.286
all the things that
you have up there.

00:46:35.286 --> 00:46:38.446
I think that's where we're at right
now with supporting the fathers

00:46:38.446 --> 00:46:41.696
in those things because, you
know, again, the more you're --

00:46:41.836 --> 00:46:44.736
again it goes back into our core
values of what we just talked

00:46:44.736 --> 00:46:47.526
about the strengths, to build
upon those strengths too

00:46:47.856 --> 00:46:49.856
for family preservation.

00:46:50.236 --> 00:46:52.926
Right now within our
process, again,

00:46:53.196 --> 00:46:55.196
since we've had this
fatherhood initiative,

00:46:55.336 --> 00:46:57.906
but we've had some challenges,
but still yet we're --

00:46:57.946 --> 00:47:01.316
I think the most important
thing is to try to make sure

00:47:01.316 --> 00:47:06.936
that we encourage fathers to
come in and be a part of their --

00:47:06.936 --> 00:47:11.206
the whole cycle for the educational
piece, school readiness.

00:47:11.206 --> 00:47:13.206
John: Uh huh.

00:47:13.206 --> 00:47:15.206
Edwin: You know, again,
we do that through --

00:47:15.206 --> 00:47:17.686
we have a lot of dads now
that are coming to program,

00:47:18.136 --> 00:47:20.496
I don't know what they have to
do with the fatherhood program,

00:47:20.496 --> 00:47:23.926
but I think it's just making
more making the men feel more

00:47:23.926 --> 00:47:27.496
comfortable and setting -- by
setting goals that they're able

00:47:27.496 --> 00:47:31.146
to you know come up with the
family priority goal worksheet

00:47:31.186 --> 00:47:33.186
screening tools.

00:47:33.186 --> 00:47:35.966
And again, very involved
in ISSP or IEPs, you know?

00:47:36.186 --> 00:47:38.646
Involving parents in those
things make them comfortable

00:47:38.646 --> 00:47:41.416
and help them engage, I guess,

00:47:41.416 --> 00:47:43.636
more so in their child's
readiness for school.

00:47:43.906 --> 00:47:45.906
So, I just wanted
to interject that.

00:47:45.916 --> 00:47:48.336
John: Yeah, that's great Ed.

00:47:48.336 --> 00:47:53.766
When I was out in Laguna this
last year we were looking

00:47:53.766 --> 00:47:56.036
at the transition
to school and you --

00:47:56.036 --> 00:48:00.286
there was an event in which
the kindergarten teachers came

00:48:00.286 --> 00:48:03.026
to the program and each was
in a different classroom

00:48:03.026 --> 00:48:05.176
because there's a number
of elementary schools.

00:48:06.326 --> 00:48:10.316
And what was -- one of the
things that was really striking

00:48:10.566 --> 00:48:15.666
about that was I think there were
just as many men there as women.

00:48:16.066 --> 00:48:18.976
I could be wrong.

00:48:19.096 --> 00:48:21.096
You know, I could be
primed to look for that,

00:48:21.236 --> 00:48:25.966
but I felt that there were a lot
of men engaged, just as engaged,

00:48:26.296 --> 00:48:30.136
having just as many conversations
with these kindergarten teachers.

00:48:30.666 --> 00:48:34.756
And it was great to
see, but it was --

00:48:34.946 --> 00:48:38.836
I mean you didn't
have to look for it.

00:48:39.156 --> 00:48:41.156
It was there.

00:48:41.156 --> 00:48:43.156
It seemed very equitable.

00:48:43.156 --> 00:48:45.156
David: Okay.

00:48:45.156 --> 00:48:47.156
So, John we need to move on to the
-- John: Okay, sorry, yeah, yeah.

00:48:47.156 --> 00:48:49.156
David: That's okay.

00:48:49.156 --> 00:48:51.316
John: So, a polling question.

00:48:51.646 --> 00:48:53.646
David: Uh huh.

00:48:53.646 --> 00:48:55.646
John: Okay.

00:48:55.646 --> 00:48:57.646
I need to see it.

00:48:57.646 --> 00:48:59.646
Let's see.

00:48:59.646 --> 00:49:01.646
David Jones: And yeah,
Natalie's going to load it.

00:49:01.646 --> 00:49:02.000
John: Okay.

00:49:04.146 --> 00:49:07.076
[ Background Noise ]

00:49:07.576 --> 00:49:09.576
John: Right.

00:49:11.076 --> 00:49:13.076
When thinking about
-- David: Hey John --

00:49:13.076 --> 00:49:15.076
John: Do you want me to read it?

00:49:15.076 --> 00:49:17.076
David: Yes, yes.

00:49:17.076 --> 00:49:19.076
John: Yeah, yeah.

00:49:19.076 --> 00:49:21.076
When thinking about father
engagement that is systemic,

00:49:21.076 --> 00:49:25.736
integrated and comprehensive I
would say our program is beginning,

00:49:25.736 --> 00:49:30.316
progressing, thriving
and innovating, or stuck.

00:49:31.386 --> 00:49:33.886
And go ahead and answer
the question.

00:49:34.516 --> 00:50:35.576
[ Background Noise ]

00:50:36.076 --> 00:50:41.796
David: So, can we see the results?

00:50:41.796 --> 00:50:45.906
John: Oh, there they
are just as you asked.

00:50:45.936 --> 00:50:47.936
Isn't that interesting?

00:50:47.936 --> 00:50:49.936
David: Um hmm hmm.

00:50:49.936 --> 00:50:54.296
John: What's that mean
David, that umm hmm hmm?

00:50:54.366 --> 00:50:57.476
But, 29 percent progressing,
that's great.

00:50:57.506 --> 00:50:59.506
David: That is really great.

00:50:59.506 --> 00:51:01.506
John: Yeah, yeah.

00:51:01.506 --> 00:51:04.156
David: And we have five percent
that are thriving and innovating.

00:51:04.466 --> 00:51:06.466
John: Yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:51:06.696 --> 00:51:11.766
David: What's going to be really
important post this webinar is

00:51:11.766 --> 00:51:13.906
that any of you out there who feel

00:51:13.906 --> 00:51:19.556
that you are stuck please do
not hesitate to reach out to us.

00:51:20.376 --> 00:51:22.616
If there's any way that we're going
to be able to provide some support

00:51:22.616 --> 00:51:24.616
and guidance for you that is one

00:51:24.616 --> 00:51:26.616
of the main reasons why
we're doing this webinar.

00:51:26.616 --> 00:51:29.586
For those of you that
are beginning, kudos.

00:51:30.166 --> 00:51:34.196
We hope that you're moving forward
in a really nice way and, you know,

00:51:34.196 --> 00:51:38.076
you move onto a place
where you're progressing

00:51:38.076 --> 00:51:40.076
and you're thriving and innovating.

00:51:40.076 --> 00:51:43.116
But again, for all of you at
any stage of your evolution,

00:51:43.116 --> 00:51:46.996
if there's some way in which we can
be supportive once you've looked

00:51:46.996 --> 00:51:49.666
in at the resources that
we're launching this week

00:51:50.326 --> 00:51:54.666
and you have questions about
them please reach out to us.

00:51:55.516 --> 00:51:57.806
That's why we're here.

00:51:57.806 --> 00:51:59.806
Natalie, thank you.

00:51:59.806 --> 00:52:04.726
John. John: Yeah, I
actually mentioned some

00:52:04.726 --> 00:52:11.266
of these things earlier that the
foundations are essential here,

00:52:11.376 --> 00:52:14.936
and I think the question that
we just looked at is basically

00:52:14.936 --> 00:52:16.936
about continuous improvement.

00:52:16.936 --> 00:52:21.966
So, where are you in
relation to engaging fathers?

00:52:22.366 --> 00:52:28.556
I mentioned that there's a lot
that can be done in the leadership

00:52:28.766 --> 00:52:31.436
of a program to support.

00:52:31.436 --> 00:52:33.976
I mean, if we go back to the
framework, we're thinking

00:52:33.976 --> 00:52:36.386
of a systemic and integrated thing.

00:52:36.386 --> 00:52:41.746
Well, that whole idea of a
dynamic system, an organization

00:52:41.746 --> 00:52:47.386
as a system, the leadership within
the system needs to be fully behind

00:52:47.386 --> 00:52:50.076
that and engage with that.

00:52:50.126 --> 00:52:54.586
So, that's an important
component of it.

00:52:54.846 --> 00:52:58.806
My experience with this
is that often the programs

00:52:58.806 --> 00:53:03.346
that are thriving in relation
to this -- well first of all,

00:53:03.516 --> 00:53:05.516
they almost always say --

00:53:05.516 --> 00:53:08.746
the leadership almost always
says we still have a ways to go.

00:53:09.176 --> 00:53:14.416
But then, I also find that there
really is a personal commitment

00:53:14.416 --> 00:53:20.836
on the part of the director or the
manager toward work with fathers.

00:53:21.146 --> 00:53:26.086
And I'm not saying everybody
has to make that their sole

00:53:26.086 --> 00:53:29.696
and primary mission,
but I think that when --

00:53:29.696 --> 00:53:33.486
what I found is that there's
often for the programs

00:53:33.486 --> 00:53:36.626
that are thriving a real passion
in the leadership for this.

00:53:36.626 --> 00:53:40.766
The continuous improvement,
going back to that, is --

00:53:41.216 --> 00:53:45.306
this is part of this whole
idea of having a framework

00:53:45.306 --> 00:53:49.156
and having a webinar like
this and having the guide is

00:53:49.156 --> 00:53:51.526
that we can be intentional
about what we do.

00:53:51.846 --> 00:53:56.216
We may feel that we're doing
very good work with fathers,

00:53:56.456 --> 00:54:00.386
but when you're doing it in a
systemic way and an integrated

00:54:00.386 --> 00:54:03.446
and comprehensive way that means
you're doing it intentionally

00:54:03.446 --> 00:54:05.446
as well.

00:54:05.446 --> 00:54:09.106
And so, that's when -- so yeah,
where were we five years ago?

00:54:09.106 --> 00:54:11.106
Where are we now?

00:54:11.106 --> 00:54:13.106
And where are we going?

00:54:13.106 --> 00:54:15.106
What steps do we need
to take to get there?

00:54:15.106 --> 00:54:17.106
David: Awesome.

00:54:17.106 --> 00:54:19.106
John: Yeah.

00:54:19.106 --> 00:54:21.106
David: So, this next
slide sort of builds upon

00:54:21.106 --> 00:54:23.106
and expands upon the last
part of that previous slide,

00:54:23.106 --> 00:54:25.106
the sort of professional
development piece.

00:54:25.106 --> 00:54:27.806
Not to negate, sort of, the men
in the audience or in the rooms,

00:54:28.096 --> 00:54:31.986
but I want to speak sort of
directly to the women in the room.

00:54:32.616 --> 00:54:35.516
And then, before I continue,
remember I was the one

00:54:36.006 --> 00:54:39.596
who said how instrumental
women have been in contributing

00:54:39.596 --> 00:54:42.336
to the success of the
fatherhood movement.

00:54:42.876 --> 00:54:44.876
So, now you know I'm getting
ready to be a little --

00:54:44.876 --> 00:54:46.876
John: Yeah, but --

00:54:46.876 --> 00:54:50.106
David: Professional
development is so tricky.

00:54:50.106 --> 00:54:52.106
I can't tell you.

00:54:52.106 --> 00:54:54.106
I've spent so much time, energy
and effort as a director,

00:54:54.846 --> 00:54:59.126
supporting directors,
supporting programs around getting

00:54:59.126 --> 00:55:01.686
to this piece of, if you're
really going to do this work

00:55:01.686 --> 00:55:04.036
in a way that's systemic,
integrated and comprehensive,

00:55:04.356 --> 00:55:08.166
it begins with the leadership
understanding that there has

00:55:08.236 --> 00:55:10.236
to be this continuous
improvement process.

00:55:10.476 --> 00:55:13.086
But it is grounded and it begins
with professional development.

00:55:14.146 --> 00:55:17.686
So, this can be a really hard
conversation to have in programs

00:55:17.686 --> 00:55:22.226
because I've never met a successful
fatherhood program that had a one

00:55:22.476 --> 00:55:25.606
and done staff development
that prepared the staff

00:55:25.606 --> 00:55:27.606
to adequately work with fathers.

00:55:27.606 --> 00:55:29.606
John: Yeah.

00:55:29.606 --> 00:55:32.406
David: In my experience when
staff have been trained and are

00:55:32.406 --> 00:55:35.616
on board it is synonymous
with being involved

00:55:35.616 --> 00:55:37.616
in the process of
supporting fathers.

00:55:38.016 --> 00:55:40.706
Very basic, show up
and we can dance.

00:55:41.296 --> 00:55:46.176
But, when they are on board
or willing to grow to do

00:55:46.176 --> 00:55:48.216
that self-assessment
and wrestle with some

00:55:48.216 --> 00:55:51.646
of their own more deep seeded
issues and/or challenges,

00:55:52.126 --> 00:55:55.556
they are now engaged in the
process of engaging fathers.

00:55:56.546 --> 00:55:58.686
You know, just like we have
to help men get to a place

00:55:58.686 --> 00:56:01.786
where they were healthy enough
to confront their challenges,

00:56:01.956 --> 00:56:05.276
we have to also help female
staff be healthy enough to know

00:56:05.276 --> 00:56:07.276
when they require
additional supports.

00:56:07.926 --> 00:56:13.176
And this slide sort of speaks to
my belief based upon my experience,

00:56:13.176 --> 00:56:17.646
there's no research connected to
this, that when staff have sort

00:56:17.646 --> 00:56:20.666
of said, "okay we're on board with
working with expanding services

00:56:20.666 --> 00:56:23.316
for fathers and supporting
and engaging fathers,"

00:56:23.666 --> 00:56:25.836
that they will engage in
conversations with them

00:56:25.836 --> 00:56:28.166
that takes them a little bit
outside of their comfort zone.

00:56:28.556 --> 00:56:31.146
Those conversations are going
to be extremely child-focused.

00:56:31.606 --> 00:56:33.606
They'll be very specific.

00:56:33.606 --> 00:56:36.226
They're going to be so self-aware
of how they're communicating

00:56:36.676 --> 00:56:38.676
and what they're communicating.

00:56:38.676 --> 00:56:41.466
So they're clinging to those
boundaries at an optimal distance.

00:56:42.856 --> 00:56:47.096
Those anchors are really, really
important, but once they move

00:56:47.096 --> 00:56:50.296
to a place where they're a little
bit more engaged and again,

00:56:50.296 --> 00:56:52.406
they're doing the self-assessment,
they're wrestling with some

00:56:52.406 --> 00:56:55.696
of their own deep seeded issues
and supervision or in therapy

00:56:55.696 --> 00:56:57.696
if necessary, whatever
the case may be,

00:56:57.856 --> 00:57:02.436
then they're a lot more comfortable
in terms of how they sort

00:57:02.606 --> 00:57:05.286
of approach these
conversations with fathers.

00:57:05.806 --> 00:57:08.286
John. John: Okay.

00:57:08.286 --> 00:57:10.286
David: Was that you who put the X?

00:57:10.286 --> 00:57:12.286
John: You bet.

00:57:12.286 --> 00:57:14.286
David: Oh, okay.

00:57:14.286 --> 00:57:16.286
John: But, I'll wait till
the elephant slide comes up.

00:57:16.286 --> 00:57:18.286
David: Okay.

00:57:18.286 --> 00:57:21.766
John: So, let's -- do
you want to move to?

00:57:21.766 --> 00:57:23.766
-- yeah David: Yeah.

00:57:23.766 --> 00:57:25.766
John: So we've got
a polling question.

00:57:25.766 --> 00:57:27.766
David: We have another polling
question for you, because we want

00:57:27.766 --> 00:57:29.766
to try to keep this interactive.

00:57:29.766 --> 00:57:31.766
And I know that once we do
something that's a little bit

00:57:31.766 --> 00:57:33.766
provocative we might
get more responses.

00:57:33.766 --> 00:57:35.766
So, Natalie, please
launch the first question.

00:57:35.766 --> 00:57:37.766
I'll go ahead and read it
as she -- oh there it is.

00:57:37.766 --> 00:57:42.346
How comfortable are you in
building partnerships with fathers?

00:57:43.166 --> 00:57:45.166
I am very comfortable.

00:57:45.306 --> 00:57:47.306
I am mostly comfortable.

00:57:48.346 --> 00:57:50.346
I am somewhat comfortable.

00:57:50.976 --> 00:57:52.976
I am uncomfortable.

00:57:52.976 --> 00:57:54.976
I am very uncomfortable.

00:57:54.976 --> 00:57:57.656
So, this is sort of a way that
you can sort of privately weigh in

00:57:57.656 --> 00:58:02.556
and chime in now on where you're
at with respect to this question.

00:58:02.556 --> 00:58:04.000
We'll give you a couple
seconds for you to do that.

00:58:05.056 --> 00:58:15.656
[ Background Noise ]

00:58:16.156 --> 00:58:17.000
John: Somebody's whispering.

00:58:18.656 --> 00:58:21.836
[ Background Noise ]

00:58:22.336 --> 00:58:24.336
David: We have a lot of
people, so we're going

00:58:24.336 --> 00:58:26.336
to give you guys a
little bit more time.

00:58:26.416 --> 00:58:28.556
John: Ah, there it is.

00:58:28.556 --> 00:58:30.746
David: Thank you so
much for calling in.

00:58:30.886 --> 00:58:32.886
We have results?

00:58:32.886 --> 00:58:34.886
John: Yeah.

00:58:34.886 --> 00:58:36.886
David: So, it's taking my system a
little bit longer for them to show.

00:58:36.886 --> 00:58:38.886
John, can you speak to them?

00:58:38.886 --> 00:58:40.886
John: Yeah, yeah.

00:58:40.886 --> 00:58:42.886
23 percent of the people

00:58:42.886 --> 00:58:44.886
on the call are saying
they're very comfortable,

00:58:44.886 --> 00:58:47.726
20 percent I am mostly
comfortable, 10 percent somewhat,

00:58:47.726 --> 00:58:52.606
1 percent I am uncomfortable, and
zero said I'm very uncomfortable.

00:58:53.086 --> 00:58:58.666
So, what this is that people
seem to be in a pretty good place

00:58:58.666 --> 00:59:02.686
with building partnerships
with fathers for the most part.

00:59:02.856 --> 00:59:11.046
I think that, yeah, really the
large majority are going I am

00:59:11.046 --> 00:59:13.826
mostly comfortable or above.

00:59:14.266 --> 00:59:18.346
And I think that's great.

00:59:18.556 --> 00:59:20.556
That's great.

00:59:20.556 --> 00:59:22.556
Now, being comfortable
and engaging --

00:59:22.556 --> 00:59:26.686
certainly the comfort level is
important to genuine engagement.

00:59:27.096 --> 00:59:30.086
But, as I said before,
it's not just comfort,

00:59:30.086 --> 00:59:33.076
its intentional things
that we do to do that.

00:59:33.166 --> 00:59:35.166
But -- David: Exactly.

00:59:35.166 --> 00:59:37.436
And so, let's move to the second
part of that polling question,

00:59:37.436 --> 00:59:40.746
which actually speaks to competence
and the way you get to a place --

00:59:40.746 --> 00:59:43.976
I think increasing competence goes
back to professional development.

00:59:43.976 --> 00:59:47.956
So, this question says, have you
received professional development

00:59:47.956 --> 00:59:51.076
around building supportive
partnerships with fathers?

00:59:51.076 --> 00:59:54.596
So again, we ask you
to please weigh in.

00:59:55.796 --> 00:59:58.866
Give you a few minutes to do that.

00:59:59.056 --> 01:00:01.406
I have received extensive training.

01:00:01.606 --> 01:00:04.456
I have received some training.

01:00:04.666 --> 01:00:07.666
I have received a little training.

01:00:08.756 --> 01:00:10.000
I have received no training.

01:00:11.256 --> 01:00:27.596
[ Background Noise ]

01:00:28.096 --> 01:00:31.086
David: Okay, Natalie can
you do the honors please.

01:00:31.296 --> 01:00:33.296
Oh, I think you're right on time.

01:00:34.096 --> 01:00:36.226
Wow, so look at this John.

01:00:36.226 --> 01:00:38.226
John: Yeah.

01:00:38.226 --> 01:00:40.226
David: A little bit different.

01:00:40.226 --> 01:00:42.226
John: Yeah, yeah.

01:00:42.226 --> 01:00:44.916
No, like eight percent - so, of
the respondents says this isn't --

01:00:44.916 --> 01:00:46.916
this doesn't add up to 100 percent.

01:00:46.916 --> 01:00:50.396
So, if this were 100
percent of the people

01:00:50.396 --> 01:00:52.936
on the call these numbers
would actually be higher.

01:00:53.466 --> 01:01:01.136
So, if you -- like so 16, so 24
percent are saying "received little

01:01:01.136 --> 01:01:07.106
or no training" and that actually
probably would need to be increased

01:01:07.106 --> 01:01:10.216
if we were looking at 100
percent because we're only talking

01:01:10.216 --> 01:01:13.386
about maybe less than
50 percent here.

01:01:13.386 --> 01:01:22.446
So, that's a pretty large portion
that haven't had specific training.

01:01:23.346 --> 01:01:26.956
David: And again, what
that could result in is,

01:01:26.956 --> 01:01:29.086
once we have a better
understanding about what some

01:01:29.086 --> 01:01:32.526
of the limitations are for
programs around getting

01:01:32.526 --> 01:01:34.526
that professional development,

01:01:34.526 --> 01:01:36.536
is ways in which we
may be instrumental

01:01:36.536 --> 01:01:38.746
in providing some support
and guidance around that.

01:01:38.836 --> 01:01:41.726
That sounds like we should
be getting some inquiries

01:01:41.726 --> 01:01:44.036
and some questions around
how programs might be able

01:01:44.036 --> 01:01:46.036
to build their capacity to do this.

01:01:46.036 --> 01:01:48.856
John: Yeah, I think that
both parts of this question,

01:01:50.376 --> 01:01:53.126
it's also a reflection
of who called in.

01:01:53.446 --> 01:01:55.446
David: Yes, oh go ahead.

01:01:55.446 --> 01:01:58.166
John: So, we've got people on
the webinar that have an interest

01:01:58.166 --> 01:02:02.646
and perhaps even a comfort
with working with fathers.

01:02:03.106 --> 01:02:08.106
And not surprising that they would
want or expect a little bit more

01:02:08.146 --> 01:02:10.146
in professional development.

01:02:10.146 --> 01:02:12.146
David: Exactly.

01:02:12.146 --> 01:02:14.146
John: Yeah.

01:02:14.146 --> 01:02:16.146
David: Okay, so the
social worker in me,

01:02:16.146 --> 01:02:18.146
or I would not actually be
true to the social worker

01:02:18.146 --> 01:02:20.146
within me -- John: Yeah.

01:02:20.146 --> 01:02:22.146
David: If I didn't ask you
to dig a little bit deeper

01:02:22.146 --> 01:02:24.376
with a few rhetorical questions.

01:02:24.866 --> 01:02:27.016
And they're up on the screen.

01:02:27.326 --> 01:02:29.836
So, when we talk about what
does it mean to really connect

01:02:29.876 --> 01:02:32.966
with fathers, some questions
that come to mind is,

01:02:33.016 --> 01:02:35.016
what are the potential benefits?

01:02:35.016 --> 01:02:37.016
What, if any, are the costs?

01:02:37.536 --> 01:02:39.866
What might be some
unintended consequences?

01:02:40.006 --> 01:02:42.396
And are there any other
potential concerns?

01:02:42.836 --> 01:02:44.836
John: Uh huh.

01:02:44.836 --> 01:02:46.836
David: So, for me, just
to prompt some discussion,

01:02:46.836 --> 01:02:50.906
I think benefits are --
you have the opportunity

01:02:50.976 --> 01:02:54.196
to receive another parent's
perspective on child development

01:02:54.446 --> 01:02:58.716
and what's important to them
as it relates to their child.

01:02:58.716 --> 01:03:03.036
You have opportunities to increase
staff competency and capacity

01:03:03.036 --> 01:03:05.916
to communicate with
and support fathers.

01:03:06.286 --> 01:03:11.016
And then you're also
increasing fathers comfort being

01:03:11.156 --> 01:03:13.156
in the program environment.

01:03:13.926 --> 01:03:16.516
The more comfortable they
are in the environment,

01:03:16.516 --> 01:03:18.796
the more willing they are to engage

01:03:18.796 --> 01:03:20.916
in the various activities
that are offered.

01:03:21.466 --> 01:03:23.466
What are some of the costs?

01:03:23.976 --> 01:03:28.056
Well again, we sometimes
push and encourage staff

01:03:28.596 --> 01:03:30.596
to work outside of
their comfort zone.

01:03:30.596 --> 01:03:33.476
We want them to be
intentionally different,

01:03:33.526 --> 01:03:35.526
which is not necessarily
always easy to do.

01:03:35.536 --> 01:03:39.976
We want them to be okay
with the time that it takes

01:03:40.176 --> 01:03:42.176
for programs to transition.

01:03:42.176 --> 01:03:44.176
And we don't talk
enough about this.

01:03:44.176 --> 01:03:47.356
You know, you go from starting
to progressing to innovating.

01:03:47.806 --> 01:03:50.236
Those are sort of three
different points of intersection,

01:03:50.236 --> 01:03:54.546
but there could huge chasms between
what it means to go from starting

01:03:55.056 --> 01:03:58.746
to progressing, from
progressing to innovating.

01:03:58.746 --> 01:04:01.206
And few programs I've seen
are at that innovative place.

01:04:01.646 --> 01:04:03.766
And some aspects of what
they do may be innovating,

01:04:03.766 --> 01:04:05.766
but not as an entire program.

01:04:06.086 --> 01:04:09.486
Ed, you had talked as we
were preparing for this

01:04:09.486 --> 01:04:11.486
about some unintended consequences.

01:04:11.486 --> 01:04:13.846
You want to speak to
that a little bit?

01:04:14.396 --> 01:04:17.266
Edwin: The intended
consequences, oh God.

01:04:17.696 --> 01:04:19.696
I can't remember where
I was at with that.

01:04:19.696 --> 01:04:21.696
We were just sitting there
talking about different things.

01:04:21.696 --> 01:04:24.076
But, I think -- David: You were --
I can just prompt you a little bit.

01:04:24.076 --> 01:04:29.166
You were talking about some of the
reaction of some of the mothers

01:04:29.166 --> 01:04:31.306
and -- Edwin: Oh yeah, exactly.

01:04:31.306 --> 01:04:33.846
You know, I know that
when I first came

01:04:33.846 --> 01:04:36.426
into the program there was
really nothing geared to fathers,

01:04:36.426 --> 01:04:38.426
and that was the whole
initiative behind this.

01:04:38.426 --> 01:04:41.056
But, now that the strength of the
fathers has started to come in,

01:04:41.056 --> 01:04:45.116
I think the women were feeling
a little bit left out and again,

01:04:45.116 --> 01:04:47.116
that's where the consequences were.

01:04:47.116 --> 01:04:50.256
Again, you know it's hard to
just, you know, really, you know,

01:04:50.256 --> 01:04:53.096
to focus on just 100
percent of either or.

01:04:53.476 --> 01:04:56.876
So, you know, that was kind of
a challenge that we're facing.

01:04:57.126 --> 01:05:01.506
And so, the women started their
group up again, and again,

01:05:01.506 --> 01:05:03.826
you know, it's good and
it's all well and good.

01:05:03.826 --> 01:05:07.616
We all work together as a team,
but again, you know, it was like --

01:05:07.616 --> 01:05:11.006
I think the women were feeling
a little left out of the loop

01:05:11.006 --> 01:05:14.066
because more dads -- we were
actually having a lot more dads

01:05:14.066 --> 01:05:18.336
coming into program and, you know,
before when it used to be kind

01:05:18.336 --> 01:05:20.336
of pretty much women-based.

01:05:20.336 --> 01:05:23.816
And even going on further out of
the Head Start program, you know,

01:05:23.816 --> 01:05:28.416
we see a lot more fathers now at
WIC, Child Find, all those things.

01:05:28.416 --> 01:05:30.546
And, I don't -- I'm not
going to say it's entirely

01:05:30.546 --> 01:05:32.546
because of our fatherhood program,

01:05:32.556 --> 01:05:36.386
but I think that men are feeling
more comfortable and in coming

01:05:36.386 --> 01:05:38.386
into these types of environments.

01:05:38.386 --> 01:05:42.466
John: Yeah, it's -- yeah I
think that it's a challenge

01:05:42.466 --> 01:05:46.816
because it takes some skill
on the part of a staff person

01:05:46.816 --> 01:05:48.816
when both the parents are there.

01:05:48.816 --> 01:05:50.816
Who do you talk to?

01:05:50.816 --> 01:05:52.816
And if you're talking
to the father --

01:05:52.816 --> 01:05:55.116
I actually know a mother
who told me this is --

01:05:55.116 --> 01:05:57.436
why are you talking to him?

01:05:57.436 --> 01:05:59.836
I know the answers
to your questions.

01:05:59.836 --> 01:06:01.836
He doesn't.

01:06:01.836 --> 01:06:05.216
And so, you get into those
kind of gate keeping kind

01:06:05.216 --> 01:06:07.216
of issues around the child.

01:06:07.216 --> 01:06:10.936
So, it's harder to talk to two
people at once then to one.

01:06:10.936 --> 01:06:13.546
So, I think the consequences
are kind

01:06:13.546 --> 01:06:15.546
of professional development
consequences

01:06:15.546 --> 01:06:19.086
and skill consequences
on top of it, yeah.

01:06:19.086 --> 01:06:22.016
David: Any other potential
concerns, John, that you would --

01:06:22.586 --> 01:06:27.766
John: Well, it may actually, and
that brings up the next slide.

01:06:27.766 --> 01:06:34.406
You know, in dealing with men
who are nurturing young children,

01:06:34.706 --> 01:06:36.706
there may be some
elephants in the room.

01:06:37.246 --> 01:06:39.716
And, maybe I just stop
for a moment and --

01:06:39.966 --> 01:06:42.036
this is an awful cute
elephant though David.

01:06:42.036 --> 01:06:44.816
It's -- David: It is.

01:06:45.346 --> 01:06:47.346
Edwin: It is Dave.

01:06:47.346 --> 01:06:50.556
John: But, this, you know, what
is the elephant in the room?

01:06:50.856 --> 01:06:57.556
What is there between women who
care for young children and men,

01:06:57.636 --> 01:07:01.596
who come into the program, who
are the fathers of those children,

01:07:01.716 --> 01:07:06.056
or the men in the mothers
of those children's lives?

01:07:06.726 --> 01:07:13.446
And the larger kind of elephant
in the room, in my opinion,

01:07:13.476 --> 01:07:19.596
in having done a lot of this work
over the years, is that all of us,

01:07:19.656 --> 01:07:24.056
men and women, have, kind of,

01:07:24.056 --> 01:07:26.736
previous relationships
with men in our lives.

01:07:26.736 --> 01:07:29.966
You know, whether it's our
fathers, or whether it's that game

01:07:29.966 --> 01:07:36.676
that so many people play from early
adolescence on, and in high school

01:07:36.676 --> 01:07:41.276
about relations between the
sexes, in that those dynamics

01:07:41.416 --> 01:07:50.446
of how you talk to men period can
enter into a conversation about --

01:07:50.606 --> 01:07:52.966
that have kind of under the
surface when you're talking

01:07:52.966 --> 01:07:54.966
about the care of a child.

01:07:54.966 --> 01:07:59.516
And so, I think it's raising that
elephant in the room, kind of,

01:07:59.516 --> 01:08:04.786
as David has portrayed it, as not
necessarily operating all the time

01:08:04.786 --> 01:08:08.396
or preventing good
communications from happening.

01:08:08.756 --> 01:08:12.546
But, I think we do have to
acknowledge that the game,

01:08:12.656 --> 01:08:16.636
the various kind of communications
that go on between men and women

01:08:16.636 --> 01:08:21.126
in our society often involve the --

01:08:21.126 --> 01:08:23.725
you know, other things than
caring for young children.

01:08:24.336 --> 01:08:28.296
And again, to bring that to
awareness is probably an important

01:08:28.296 --> 01:08:30.756
part of a professional
development program.

01:08:31.526 --> 01:08:33.586
David: It really is.

01:08:33.935 --> 01:08:37.796
And just I think really a few
other important things to add

01:08:37.796 --> 01:08:39.796
to it you've already said.

01:08:39.796 --> 01:08:41.906
You know this brings
up sort of implications

01:08:41.906 --> 01:08:47.316
for how you support families,
particularly fathers,

01:08:47.316 --> 01:08:50.536
around substance abuse issues
and domestic violence issues

01:08:50.536 --> 01:08:54.026
and even just fear issues
of what it means to connect

01:08:54.026 --> 01:08:57.645
and build a relationship
given the sexual tension

01:08:57.645 --> 01:08:59.645
that takes place between
men and women.

01:08:59.645 --> 01:09:01.645
John: Yeah.

01:09:01.645 --> 01:09:03.645
Edwin: David.

01:09:03.645 --> 01:09:05.645
David: Yes.

01:09:05.645 --> 01:09:07.645
Edwin: This is Ed.

01:09:07.645 --> 01:09:09.645
Again, just talking
about the elephant,

01:09:09.645 --> 01:09:11.645
I think from the native perspective
also again, a lot of it has to do

01:09:11.645 --> 01:09:13.645
with our historical traumas.

01:09:13.645 --> 01:09:15.645
You know again, you're looking
back at what men versus women,

01:09:15.645 --> 01:09:19.296
what their -- what we're --
what is culturally appropriate

01:09:19.296 --> 01:09:21.296
at that time.

01:09:21.296 --> 01:09:23.296
David: Right.

01:09:23.296 --> 01:09:25.296
Edwin: That's some
of the major impacts

01:09:25.296 --> 01:09:27.296
of some of our programs here.

01:09:27.296 --> 01:09:29.296
You know [inaudible] that you
know the elephant is right there

01:09:29.296 --> 01:09:31.296
on your back, you know.

01:09:31.296 --> 01:09:33.296
Again, that's where we're --

01:09:33.296 --> 01:09:35.296
you know, we have a lot of
these social emotional issues.

01:09:35.296 --> 01:09:37.296
And, all the economic health and
wellbeing of our children are kind

01:09:37.296 --> 01:09:41.246
of compromised because of sometimes
those cultural -- I'm not --

01:09:41.246 --> 01:09:45.296
in a sense inadequacies, or I don't
know if that's the right term,

01:09:45.296 --> 01:09:48.076
but that's something
that sometimes we kind

01:09:48.076 --> 01:09:50.076
of have to face here in Laguna.

01:09:51.176 --> 01:09:53.176
>> Oh.

01:09:53.176 --> 01:09:55.176
>> Yeah. David: Okay, thank you.

01:09:55.176 --> 01:09:57.606
So, we will move along.

01:09:58.186 --> 01:10:02.106
John, this is you.

01:10:02.106 --> 01:10:04.106
John: Yeah, yeah.

01:10:04.106 --> 01:10:08.536
I think that this area -- and I
love these pictures by the way.

01:10:09.216 --> 01:10:12.326
The -- look at the engagement.

01:10:12.326 --> 01:10:15.156
Look at like the man, the woman

01:10:15.206 --> 01:10:18.266
and the kids all paying
attention to the same thing.

01:10:18.266 --> 01:10:20.876
So much learning is
happening when you see that.

01:10:20.936 --> 01:10:24.436
And I just love the
picture down below.

01:10:24.436 --> 01:10:26.436
You can see how the kids just --

01:10:26.436 --> 01:10:28.436
this child that's on
the carpet is just

01:10:28.436 --> 01:10:30.446
like loving looking up at this guy.

01:10:30.446 --> 01:10:33.396
I don't know what he's
saying, but it's --

01:10:33.396 --> 01:10:36.506
he certainly has engagement
from the children right there.

01:10:37.096 --> 01:10:42.996
The program environment, I think,
you might ask the fathers what it's

01:10:42.996 --> 01:10:44.996
like to walk into your program.

01:10:44.996 --> 01:10:47.846
The experience of a father
walking into a program

01:10:47.846 --> 01:10:50.096
with young children
that's designed by women,

01:10:50.096 --> 01:10:54.936
and I've got numerous slides
of program environments,

01:10:54.936 --> 01:10:57.836
and I can put them up there and
say, you know, "is this comfortable

01:10:57.836 --> 01:10:59.836
for most men to walk into".

01:10:59.836 --> 01:11:01.836
The step across the threshold

01:11:01.836 --> 01:11:04.806
into the program may feel
very different -- David: Yeah.

01:11:04.806 --> 01:11:06.806
John: -- for a man.

01:11:06.806 --> 01:11:08.806
So, I think it's very
valuable to think

01:11:08.806 --> 01:11:11.636
about you know is this a
welcoming environment for a man?

01:11:11.636 --> 01:11:13.636
That doesn't mean you have
to have like deer heads

01:11:13.636 --> 01:11:15.636
on the wall or anything.

01:11:15.636 --> 01:11:19.436
What it means is you know
having pictures of men,

01:11:20.246 --> 01:11:23.846
having the size seats
somewhere that they can fit in.

01:11:24.026 --> 01:11:26.796
And really, I think, you
can probably go to men

01:11:26.796 --> 01:11:28.796
and have them walk in and see.

01:11:28.866 --> 01:11:33.566
But, it's almost less a physical
environment than it's the, kind of,

01:11:33.746 --> 01:11:35.746
interpersonal environment.

01:11:35.746 --> 01:11:37.746
And, that goes back

01:11:37.746 --> 01:11:39.796
to the relationships
on the framework slide.

01:11:40.046 --> 01:11:44.166
Is -- is it a welcoming
place when a man walks

01:11:44.166 --> 01:11:47.416
into the door with a child.

01:11:47.786 --> 01:11:52.516
Since most of you said you were
comfortable you probably have those

01:11:52.516 --> 01:11:57.976
places, but it's something again to
be -- to think intentionally about.

01:11:58.496 --> 01:12:05.076
I -- the other one that's circled
here is teaching and learning

01:12:05.076 --> 01:12:07.556
and I already addressed
the pictures.

01:12:07.556 --> 01:12:10.896
But, when men come into
volunteer the classroom,

01:12:10.896 --> 01:12:13.276
their interactions may
look a little different

01:12:13.306 --> 01:12:16.176
than you would expect
when a mother comes in.

01:12:16.386 --> 01:12:19.086
The instruction may
not be quite as direct.

01:12:19.086 --> 01:12:22.266
It might a little bit wilder.

01:12:22.266 --> 01:12:27.676
That's not to say that some women
won't come in and be quite loud

01:12:27.676 --> 01:12:29.676
when they come into the classroom.

01:12:29.676 --> 01:12:31.676
I certainly have seen that.

01:12:31.676 --> 01:12:34.346
But, the frame is different.

01:12:34.346 --> 01:12:37.506
The interactions may look a
little different and they,

01:12:37.506 --> 01:12:39.506
as I pointed out in
the research slide,

01:12:39.526 --> 01:12:42.386
those kind of interactions
have benefits for kids as well.

01:12:42.676 --> 01:12:44.676
David: Awesome.

01:12:44.676 --> 01:12:52.916
And so now we have the distinct
pleasure of having Edwin Cheromiah,

01:12:52.916 --> 01:12:56.716
Sr. talk specifically
about what all this looks

01:12:56.716 --> 01:12:59.106
like within the context
of a program.

01:12:59.396 --> 01:13:01.396
So, Ed I'm going to
turn it over to you.

01:13:01.656 --> 01:13:04.146
Edwin Cheromiah, Sr.:
Alright, thank you very much,

01:13:04.146 --> 01:13:06.146
and thank you for having me.

01:13:06.146 --> 01:13:08.146
I do appreciate it.

01:13:08.146 --> 01:13:10.146
Again, this is just, kind
of, a picture of, you know,

01:13:10.436 --> 01:13:14.676
really good feelings at the Head
Start with the rainbow showing,

01:13:14.906 --> 01:13:18.756
depicting you know that
children are very important,

01:13:18.796 --> 01:13:21.676
sacred in our lives here
at the Head Start program.

01:13:21.676 --> 01:13:23.966
I just have a few
slides here just too kind

01:13:23.966 --> 01:13:27.616
of depict some of those things.

01:13:27.936 --> 01:13:29.936
[inaudible] okay.

01:13:29.936 --> 01:13:31.936
We were talking about all the
things that we have just talked

01:13:31.936 --> 01:13:34.386
about coming from the
beginning of the slides.

01:13:34.706 --> 01:13:37.026
Here are things that we're
attempting to do here

01:13:37.026 --> 01:13:39.826
at the program is to
make sure that we ensure

01:13:39.826 --> 01:13:41.926
that we support fathers
in every way.

01:13:42.006 --> 01:13:44.536
And, a lot of that has
to deal with, you know,

01:13:44.886 --> 01:13:46.886
making them feel comfortable.

01:13:46.886 --> 01:13:52.046
The picture on the upper left
hand corner there is a picture

01:13:52.046 --> 01:13:56.796
of just some dads who were
helping with an activity,

01:13:56.796 --> 01:13:59.246
and I believe it was
our Easter activity.

01:13:59.646 --> 01:14:02.936
And, you know, the dads are
coming in doing that more because,

01:14:02.936 --> 01:14:08.086
I think, the teachers are more
engaging with their fathers

01:14:08.086 --> 01:14:10.466
as they're coming and they're
making them feel comfortable,

01:14:10.756 --> 01:14:13.486
knowing that they
are important part

01:14:13.486 --> 01:14:16.346
of their child's upbringing
and wellbeing.

01:14:16.746 --> 01:14:21.326
Again, we always encourage
parents, dads, to come in

01:14:21.326 --> 01:14:26.566
and show their talents and that was
just a picture they had taken of me

01:14:26.566 --> 01:14:29.756
as I was talking to
the kids about music.

01:14:29.756 --> 01:14:32.356
And there's other things that
we do in the culturally --

01:14:32.696 --> 01:14:35.036
the cultural way of
things, you know,

01:14:35.036 --> 01:14:37.036
our cultural traditional dances.

01:14:37.326 --> 01:14:41.466
We encourage dads to come in and
sing songs for their parents.

01:14:41.466 --> 01:14:43.466
I'm sorry, sing songs
for their kids.

01:14:43.896 --> 01:14:46.086
They are helping making the --

01:14:46.186 --> 01:14:50.036
our traditional costumes
for the dances.

01:14:50.036 --> 01:14:52.386
They're making -- the teachers
are absolutely making them,

01:14:52.806 --> 01:14:54.806
you know, feel comfortable here.

01:14:54.806 --> 01:14:59.076
And, of course we always have the
challenges all the time still yet,

01:14:59.076 --> 01:15:01.076
but I think that's
also helping them

01:15:01.076 --> 01:15:06.776
with helping the men set
goals, set priorities.

01:15:07.056 --> 01:15:12.566
And also again, you know if
a child comes in with an IEP

01:15:12.596 --> 01:15:15.836
or [inaudible] you know the dads
are more comfortable knowing

01:15:15.836 --> 01:15:18.966
that they can do these
things for their kids.

01:15:19.356 --> 01:15:23.586
Like I said, we include
fathers in classroom activities.

01:15:23.846 --> 01:15:25.846
We have literacy programs to --

01:15:25.846 --> 01:15:28.456
where dads are coming in
and reading to the children.

01:15:28.456 --> 01:15:33.176
There's also programs to where
we're teaching Keres language

01:15:33.176 --> 01:15:37.556
to the kids and we have actually
in our program one, two -

01:15:37.556 --> 01:15:41.596
two teachers that actually speak
-- teach the Keres language.

01:15:41.676 --> 01:15:45.156
And we also have two
custodians and a male cook.

01:15:45.156 --> 01:15:48.076
So we're starting to get
more male involvement

01:15:48.076 --> 01:15:51.966
because of just the comfort
level that they feel right now.

01:15:51.966 --> 01:15:57.006
And again, all of it is just to
ensure that the kids are ready

01:15:57.006 --> 01:15:59.006
for the next level of education.

01:16:00.086 --> 01:16:02.086
Again, on the -- we --

01:16:02.086 --> 01:16:05.746
I also coordinate a
monthly fatherhood night.

01:16:06.006 --> 01:16:09.086
And that's what we call them, just
simply as that, fatherhood nights.

01:16:09.476 --> 01:16:12.826
And I have a grandparent here, if
you don't mind, I'd like for him

01:16:12.826 --> 01:16:15.366
to kind of give an idea
of you know is perspective

01:16:15.366 --> 01:16:17.366
on our fatherhood nights.

01:16:17.436 --> 01:16:21.846
Wilbur Lockwood: Yeah, I'm Wilbur
Lockwood, and I'm a grandparent

01:16:21.986 --> 01:16:24.976
to the fatherhood
organization here in Laguna.

01:16:24.976 --> 01:16:31.436
And they been very instrumental
to spelling out different things

01:16:31.436 --> 01:16:37.256
that need to be possibly addressed,
not only traditionally wise,

01:16:37.256 --> 01:16:41.836
but how we can go ahead and
be a better parent, I guess,

01:16:41.836 --> 01:16:43.836
is what it is, you know.

01:16:43.836 --> 01:16:49.506
Nowadays we've got a lot of young
parents out there with kids that,

01:16:49.506 --> 01:16:55.316
really, they don't know how
to run or raise as a family.

01:16:55.316 --> 01:17:01.966
And, in order to do that then we,
you know, we all sit down together

01:17:02.066 --> 01:17:08.056
and offer suggestions of what
we need to do, maybe possibly

01:17:08.056 --> 01:17:13.046
to better each other in raising
our kids or grandfathering,

01:17:13.046 --> 01:17:15.916
grandmothering our kids and also

01:17:15.916 --> 01:17:19.016
that they can have a
productive life when --

01:17:19.086 --> 01:17:24.876
whether they leave the reservation
or not, and go out into the world,

01:17:25.636 --> 01:17:28.296
which is like when Ed
mentioned about seed planting.

01:17:28.296 --> 01:17:33.226
You know, that's one of the things
that we try to stress that life is

01:17:33.226 --> 01:17:35.226
like a seed, you put
it in the ground

01:17:35.226 --> 01:17:37.226
and it grows and spreads out.

01:17:37.666 --> 01:17:46.526
Well, that's basically how our life
is, is you know we put ourselves

01:17:46.526 --> 01:17:51.696
on the pedestal and let our
parents teach us different things.

01:17:51.696 --> 01:17:56.696
And not necessarily we try to
avoid all the bad stuff, but still

01:17:56.696 --> 01:18:00.996
yet you know somehow, somewhere
they get in there and all.

01:18:01.556 --> 01:18:06.056
But, we try to tell the fathers,
you know, try to live as an example

01:18:07.536 --> 01:18:09.536
for your own kids
and love your kids.

01:18:09.536 --> 01:18:12.976
You know it's not, not to
a point to where you --

01:18:13.676 --> 01:18:16.916
it's embarrassing when you go
up to your child and hug them

01:18:16.916 --> 01:18:20.246
or give them a kiss on
the cheek or whatever

01:18:20.246 --> 01:18:22.436
and say, you know, "I love you".

01:18:22.436 --> 01:18:25.866
And all the sudden we see
that on the reservation

01:18:25.866 --> 01:18:29.436
because that's not part
of us really and all.

01:18:29.436 --> 01:18:34.236
But, you know Ed has gone out
of his way, I think anyway,

01:18:34.236 --> 01:18:38.096
to really try to stress that
to us fathers out there;

01:18:38.096 --> 01:18:42.646
his nightly meetings that
he has every month and all.

01:18:43.266 --> 01:18:46.726
If we could get more
fathers in there,

01:18:46.726 --> 01:18:51.946
I think basically we can have a
better working relationship among

01:18:51.946 --> 01:18:54.916
each other and among
their own families

01:18:54.916 --> 01:18:56.916
out there in the community.

01:18:56.916 --> 01:18:58.916
Edwin Cheromiah, Sr.: Right,
just some of the things

01:18:58.916 --> 01:19:00.916
that we've been doing along
them with our father program.

01:19:00.916 --> 01:19:02.916
And again, the expected
outcomes, of course,

01:19:02.916 --> 01:19:04.916
is to overcome some
of the barriers.

01:19:04.916 --> 01:19:06.916
And this, kind of, picture
depicts some of those things,

01:19:06.916 --> 01:19:10.276
overcoming barriers to
improve positive involvement

01:19:10.276 --> 01:19:12.276
in our children.

01:19:12.276 --> 01:19:15.276
This is something just called a
jackrabbit shuffle that, you know,

01:19:15.276 --> 01:19:17.896
that was created by Dr.
Clayton Small in the Road

01:19:17.896 --> 01:19:20.036
of Life curriculum,
which we also use here.

01:19:20.366 --> 01:19:24.106
And also it's culturally
appropriate.

01:19:24.196 --> 01:19:27.776
It's educational, especially,
you know, again, it helps.

01:19:28.196 --> 01:19:30.196
You know, it helps,
especially if it's --

01:19:30.196 --> 01:19:33.556
and that's the parent coming in for
the first time seeing these things,

01:19:33.556 --> 01:19:35.686
how important it is to drop
some of those barriers.

01:19:36.016 --> 01:19:39.076
So again, that's all
to increase, you know,

01:19:39.076 --> 01:19:41.766
just fatherhood involvement.

01:19:41.766 --> 01:19:46.616
We are also developing
fathers and cultural fathers

01:19:46.616 --> 01:19:50.056
and children's cultural
development.

01:19:50.136 --> 01:19:52.486
This particular slide
here is a father.

01:19:52.486 --> 01:19:56.556
This father is teaching
these children our annual --

01:19:56.556 --> 01:20:00.326
it's called a -- it's
called the Corn Dance.

01:20:00.326 --> 01:20:04.916
And it's, again, going back into
preservation of our livelihood

01:20:05.096 --> 01:20:08.966
and hoping and praying for
rain so that we can plant --

01:20:08.966 --> 01:20:11.596
the seed has been planted
will continue to grow

01:20:11.596 --> 01:20:13.596
and also flourishes
back into the children.

01:20:13.936 --> 01:20:17.336
So, those are some of the things
that we've been really working

01:20:17.336 --> 01:20:19.646
at here at the Laguna
Head Start Program.

01:20:19.786 --> 01:20:23.336
And again, this is just a group
picture of some of the guys

01:20:23.336 --> 01:20:26.296
that have been here
throughout the years.

01:20:26.706 --> 01:20:29.876
This guy in the center holding
the ribbon has been a very

01:20:29.876 --> 01:20:31.876
instrumental part.

01:20:31.876 --> 01:20:33.876
He no longer has children
here at Head Start

01:20:33.876 --> 01:20:35.876
but continues to come back.

01:20:35.876 --> 01:20:38.056
And he was one of the guys back in
'04 that started the whole program.

01:20:38.466 --> 01:20:41.066
And the guy off to the
left-hand side behind him

01:20:41.066 --> 01:20:43.066
on the back row there with the cap,

01:20:43.066 --> 01:20:45.356
the big guy with the big
cheesy smile, he's also.

01:20:45.596 --> 01:20:51.126
And the guy also, kind of, with
his hand over his shoulder is a --

01:20:51.126 --> 01:20:53.126
oh wow, what's happening?

01:20:53.306 --> 01:20:55.306
Did something there.

01:20:55.306 --> 01:20:57.306
How I'd get out of that?

01:20:57.306 --> 01:20:59.306
David: That's alright
just go ahead.

01:20:59.306 --> 01:21:01.306
Edwin Cheromiah, Sr.:
He's one of the guys --

01:21:01.306 --> 01:21:04.256
those are the men that have really
pushed this program along before he

01:21:04.256 --> 01:21:06.256
came to Head Start.

01:21:06.256 --> 01:21:08.646
It was first done under the,
the -- what was it called now?

01:21:08.646 --> 01:21:12.766
The oh, PFS, Partners
For Success Program,

01:21:12.766 --> 01:21:15.176
and they eventually
came here to Laguna.

01:21:15.176 --> 01:21:18.306
But right now this -- our mission
statement kind of says that all --

01:21:18.356 --> 01:21:20.356
summarizes everything
that we're trying

01:21:20.356 --> 01:21:22.356
to do here at Laguna Head Start.

01:21:22.356 --> 01:21:24.356
And our mission is just this,

01:21:24.896 --> 01:21:27.146
the mission at Laguna
Fatherhood Group is

01:21:27.146 --> 01:21:31.406
to support fathers interested
in contributing their skills

01:21:32.366 --> 01:21:35.086
and resources for the development
of their children at home,

01:21:35.116 --> 01:21:37.516
in the community and school
settings, all the things

01:21:37.516 --> 01:21:39.516
that we've been just, kind of,

01:21:39.516 --> 01:21:41.516
talking about all
throughout the whole slides.

01:21:41.516 --> 01:21:44.256
So, again that's kind of
what we do here at Laguna.

01:21:44.536 --> 01:21:46.536
And if there's any, you know --

01:21:46.536 --> 01:21:48.536
I would encourage
anyone to give us a call

01:21:48.536 --> 01:21:51.246
and we can always talk a
little bit more about this.

01:21:51.246 --> 01:21:53.786
So again, that's kind of
my presentation there.

01:21:53.856 --> 01:21:55.856
Thank you.

01:21:55.856 --> 01:21:57.856
David: Yep, one more.

01:21:57.856 --> 01:22:02.396
>> Okay, oh this is the
Father Engagement Resources?

01:22:02.826 --> 01:22:04.826
Kiersten: Yep.

01:22:04.826 --> 01:22:07.996
I think -- this is Kiersten,
and I know we're wrapping up.

01:22:08.156 --> 01:22:10.676
We're probably going to go a couple
minutes over for those of us --

01:22:10.816 --> 01:22:14.946
for those of you who want to stick
around for another five minutes.

01:22:15.606 --> 01:22:19.456
We -- I want to just let you know
a little bit about the resources

01:22:19.456 --> 01:22:21.456
that we keep referring to.

01:22:21.536 --> 01:22:23.736
The Head Start Father
Engagement Birth

01:22:23.736 --> 01:22:26.376
to Five Programming
Guide just came out today

01:22:26.376 --> 01:22:28.766
with an information
memorandum to all programs.

01:22:28.916 --> 01:22:34.256
Las Manos de Apรก is a set of
resources for programs for working

01:22:34.326 --> 01:22:37.396
with Latino fathers around
supporting their relationships

01:22:37.396 --> 01:22:40.236
with their young children,
particularly around literacy.

01:22:40.236 --> 01:22:42.766
There's support group
curriculum and training material.

01:22:43.726 --> 01:22:47.986
We also have a couple of
videos that we're sharing.

01:22:47.986 --> 01:22:52.806
The Best Practices Series that
the National Center is doing.

01:22:52.806 --> 01:22:54.806
This is the first in the
series that we're putting

01:22:54.806 --> 01:22:56.806
out called Engaging Fathers

01:22:56.806 --> 01:22:59.246
and Engaging Young Fathers
Through Support Groups.

01:22:59.246 --> 01:23:04.516
These are basically -- they'll
be some facilitation guides

01:23:04.516 --> 01:23:08.996
to support training conversations
and group interactions

01:23:08.996 --> 01:23:12.946
with staff around, kind of, what
your takeaways from the videos are.

01:23:12.946 --> 01:23:14.946
So, these are, kind of --

01:23:14.946 --> 01:23:16.946
can function like exercises
in your program for thinking

01:23:16.946 --> 01:23:18.946
about father engagement.

01:23:18.946 --> 01:23:23.496
There was a -- I'm sorry that our
public chat wasn't working so well.

01:23:23.906 --> 01:23:25.906
I appreciated some of the comments.

01:23:25.906 --> 01:23:28.406
Janus McBride had
talked about, you know,

01:23:28.656 --> 01:23:32.296
just really reiterating the point
that you really need staff buy-in

01:23:32.726 --> 01:23:35.746
in terms of, you know,
getting father engagement,

01:23:35.746 --> 01:23:37.746
involvement going.

01:23:37.746 --> 01:23:39.746
Otherwise, it's a real struggle.

01:23:39.746 --> 01:23:41.746
And there was a question
about the PowerPoint.

01:23:41.746 --> 01:23:43.766
This PowerPoint won't be
shared, but the resources --

01:23:43.766 --> 01:23:46.906
there are a lot of training
material in the resources

01:23:46.906 --> 01:23:48.906
that we've talked about.

01:23:48.906 --> 01:23:52.096
And you can contact us for
specific things that you're looking

01:23:52.096 --> 01:23:55.876
for from the PowerPoint
if you're wanting

01:23:55.876 --> 01:23:58.176
to support a particular
exercise, that kind of thing.

01:23:58.426 --> 01:24:00.936
We'd be happy to share it.

01:24:00.936 --> 01:24:02.936
So, David, I think,
if you want to take us

01:24:02.976 --> 01:24:05.096
out with some summarizing points

01:24:05.096 --> 01:24:07.096
about what we've talked
about today.

01:24:07.096 --> 01:24:13.796
David: Sure, so our last slide
just really underscores everything

01:24:13.796 --> 01:24:17.066
that we discussed, basically
saying that fathers are important

01:24:17.066 --> 01:24:19.066
to their children,
which all of you know,

01:24:19.066 --> 01:24:21.626
their families and
their communities.

01:24:22.016 --> 01:24:25.436
You know, the relationship
building with fathers is key,

01:24:25.806 --> 01:24:27.806
looking at the program leadership,

01:24:27.896 --> 01:24:29.896
the continuous improvement
processes,

01:24:29.906 --> 01:24:32.166
professional development, all of
those things that we discussed.

01:24:32.976 --> 01:24:35.366
Utilize these resources
that we're providing to you

01:24:35.366 --> 01:24:38.816
to really assess your family
and your father engagement.

01:24:39.526 --> 01:24:41.526
Hold thoughtful conversations,

01:24:41.526 --> 01:24:43.526
even some of the challenging
conversations

01:24:43.526 --> 01:24:45.526
that you may need to have.

01:24:45.526 --> 01:24:47.526
When we say let's have
a real conversation

01:24:47.526 --> 01:24:49.526
and you know what that means.

01:24:49.526 --> 01:24:51.526
You know, conduct some real
program planning on how to do this.

01:24:51.526 --> 01:24:54.016
Make this integrated
throughout your entire program.

01:24:54.576 --> 01:24:56.576
Engage in staff development.

01:24:56.576 --> 01:24:58.576
Implement and evaluate and review.

01:24:58.576 --> 01:25:00.646
And, celebrate fathers
and families.

01:25:00.646 --> 01:25:03.616
This is our time to not only
do it just because it's June

01:25:03.616 --> 01:25:07.886
and it's Father's Day approaching,
but fathers are so instrumental

01:25:08.116 --> 01:25:10.426
to their families and their
communities and we want

01:25:10.426 --> 01:25:12.536
to make sure that you're thinking
about that throughout the year.

01:25:12.896 --> 01:25:17.006
I want to take this time
to really thank first

01:25:17.006 --> 01:25:19.726
and foremost Yvette Sanchez
Fuentes, our fearless leader,

01:25:20.166 --> 01:25:22.676
the Director of the Office of
Head Start, for just supporting

01:25:22.766 --> 01:25:27.256
such important work; Edwin
and John for co-facilitating;

01:25:28.156 --> 01:25:30.856
Kiersten Biegel, who
is an absolute gem,

01:25:31.116 --> 01:25:33.116
and without whom I'm not
sure we would have been able

01:25:33.116 --> 01:25:35.116
to pull all of this off this week.

01:25:35.116 --> 01:25:37.116
Thank you so much.

01:25:37.116 --> 01:25:39.626
The National Center on Parent,
Family and Community Engagement,

01:25:39.626 --> 01:25:44.376
our technical support team at
I-Link, Natalie and Sam and all

01:25:44.376 --> 01:25:46.376
of the participants who
joined us for this webinar.

01:25:47.256 --> 01:25:50.466
It is extremely important
to note that we are aware

01:25:50.826 --> 01:25:53.696
of the great work that's
taking place in programs

01:25:53.696 --> 01:25:56.376
across the country and through
some collaborative partnerships

01:25:56.376 --> 01:25:58.376
that you've established.

01:25:58.376 --> 01:26:00.696
Our only goal is to
provide tangible resources

01:26:00.696 --> 01:26:02.696
that can increase the likelihood

01:26:02.796 --> 01:26:06.706
that your father engagement efforts
are not tied to an individual

01:26:07.046 --> 01:26:11.756
or external consultant, but are
connected to an integrated system

01:26:11.756 --> 01:26:14.396
of meaningful services
with fathers, children

01:26:14.796 --> 01:26:22.346
and families, and we thank you.

01:26:22.936 --> 01:26:25.796
Kiersten. Kiersten:
Thanks everybody.

01:26:26.936 --> 01:26:29.246
John: That was awesome, David.

01:26:30.026 --> 01:26:33.506
David: That was a wonderful
job all the way around guys.

01:26:33.596 --> 01:26:35.596
Thank you so, so much.

01:26:35.596 --> 01:26:37.596
Thank you all the participants.

01:26:37.596 --> 01:26:39.596
I think people are
starting to sign out.

01:26:39.596 --> 01:26:41.596
So, we don't have
time for questions

01:26:41.596 --> 01:26:43.596
but I guess people will email us.

01:26:43.646 --> 01:26:45.646
>> Okay, that sounds great.

01:26:45.816 --> 01:26:47.816
>> Alright, thank you very much.

01:26:47.816 --> 01:26:49.816
>> Thank you.

01:26:49.816 --> 01:26:51.816
>> Thanks everyone.

01:26:51.816 --> 01:26:53.816
>> Thank you.

01:26:53.816 --> 01:26:55.816
>> Goodbye we'll see you all.

01:26:55.816 --> 01:26:57.816
>> We'll talk to you soon.

01:26:57.816 --> 01:26:59.816
>> Very soon.