How Dolly Parton led me to an epiphany
-
0:06 - 0:09I want to tell you about my search
for purpose as a journalist -
0:09 - 0:12and how Dolly Parton
helped me figure it out. -
0:13 - 0:16So I've been telling audio stories
for about 20 years, -
0:16 - 0:18first on the radio and then in podcasts.
-
0:18 - 0:21When I started the radio show
"Radiolab" in 2002, -
0:22 - 0:25here was the quintessential
story move we would do. -
0:25 - 0:26We'd bring on somebody --
-
0:26 - 0:29(Audio) Steven Strogatz:
It's one of the most hypnotic -
0:29 - 0:31and spellbinding spectacles in nature,
-
0:31 - 0:34because, you have to keep in mind,
it is absolutely silent. -
0:34 - 0:37Jad Abumrad: Like this guy,
mathematician, Steve Strogatz, -
0:37 - 0:39and he would paint a picture.
-
0:39 - 0:41SS: Picture it.
There's a riverbank in Thailand, -
0:41 - 0:42in the remote part of the jungle,
-
0:42 - 0:45you're in a canoe,
slipping down the river. -
0:46 - 0:47There's no sound of anything,
-
0:47 - 0:50maybe the occasional, you know,
exotic jungle bird or something. -
0:50 - 0:53JA: So you're in this imaginary
canoe with Steve, -
0:53 - 0:56and in the air all around you
are millions of fireflies. -
0:56 - 1:00And what you see is sort of
a randomized starry-night effect. -
1:01 - 1:04Because all the fireflies
are blinking at different rates. -
1:04 - 1:05Which is what you would expect.
-
1:05 - 1:08But according to Steve, in this one place,
-
1:08 - 1:11for reasons no scientist
can fully explain -- -
1:11 - 1:12SS: Whoop.
-
1:13 - 1:14Whoop.
-
1:15 - 1:16Whoop.
-
1:16 - 1:19With thousands of lights on
and then off, all in sync. -
1:19 - 1:26(Music and electric sounds)
-
1:26 - 1:28JA: Now it's around this time
-
1:28 - 1:31that I would generally bring in
the beautiful music, as I just did, -
1:31 - 1:33and you'd start to get that warm feeling.
-
1:33 - 1:35A feeling, that we know from science,
-
1:35 - 1:37kind of localizes in your head and chest
-
1:37 - 1:38and spreads through your body.
-
1:38 - 1:40It's that feeling of wonder.
-
1:40 - 1:43From 2002 to 2010,
I did hundreds of these stories. -
1:45 - 1:48Sciency, neurosciency,
very heady, brainy stories -
1:48 - 1:51that would always resolve
into that feeling of wonder. -
1:52 - 1:53And I began to see that as my job,
-
1:53 - 1:56to lead people to moments of wonder.
-
1:56 - 1:58What that sounded like was:
-
1:58 - 2:02(Various voices) "Huh!" "Wow!" "Wow!"
-
2:02 - 2:03"That's amazing."
-
2:03 - 2:05"Whoa!" "Wow!"
-
2:05 - 2:08JA: But I began to get
kind of tired of these stories. -
2:09 - 2:11I mean, partially, it was the repetition.
-
2:11 - 2:13I remember there was a day
I was sitting at the computer, -
2:13 - 2:15making the sound of a neuron.
-
2:15 - 2:16(Crackling sound)
-
2:16 - 2:19You know, take some white noise,
chop it up, very easy sound to make. -
2:19 - 2:23I remember thinking,
"I have made this sound 25 times." -
2:23 - 2:25But it was more than that --
-
2:25 - 2:27there was a familiar path
to these stories. -
2:27 - 2:30You walk the path of truth,
which is made of science, -
2:30 - 2:31and you get to wonder.
-
2:31 - 2:33Now, I love science, don't get me wrong.
-
2:33 - 2:35My parents emigrated
from a war-torn country, -
2:35 - 2:37came to America,
-
2:37 - 2:41and science for them was, like,
more their identity than anything else, -
2:41 - 2:44and I inherited that from them.
-
2:44 - 2:47But there was something
about that simple movement -
2:47 - 2:48from science to wonder
-
2:48 - 2:50that just started to feel wrong to me.
-
2:50 - 2:52Like, is that the only path
a story can take? -
2:53 - 2:55Around 2012,
-
2:55 - 2:59I ran into a bunch of different stories
that made me think, "No." -
2:59 - 3:01One story in particular,
-
3:01 - 3:05where we interviewed
a guy who described chemical weapons -
3:05 - 3:07being used against him
and his fellow villagers -
3:07 - 3:09in the mountains of Laos.
-
3:09 - 3:11Western scientists went there,
-
3:11 - 3:13measured for chemical weapons,
didn't find any. -
3:13 - 3:15We interviewed the man about this,
-
3:15 - 3:16he said the scientists were wrong.
-
3:16 - 3:18We said, "But they tested."
-
3:18 - 3:20He said, "I don't care,
I know what happened to me." -
3:20 - 3:23And we went back and forth
and back and forth, -
3:23 - 3:24and make a long story short,
-
3:24 - 3:26the interview ended in tears.
-
3:27 - 3:28I felt ...
-
3:29 - 3:30I felt horrible.
-
3:31 - 3:34Like, hammering at a scientific truth,
when someone has suffered. -
3:35 - 3:37That wasn't going to heal anything.
-
3:37 - 3:42And maybe I was relying
too much on science to find the truth. -
3:42 - 3:44And it really did feel, at that moment,
-
3:44 - 3:46that there were a lot
of truths in the room, -
3:46 - 3:48and we were only looking at one of them.
-
3:48 - 3:50So I thought, "I've got to get
better at this." -
3:50 - 3:52And so for the next eight years,
-
3:52 - 3:55I committed myself to doing stories
where you heard truths collide. -
3:55 - 3:57We did stories
about the politics of consent, -
3:57 - 4:00where you heard the perspective
of survivors and perpetrators -
4:00 - 4:02whose narratives clashed.
-
4:02 - 4:03We did stories about race,
-
4:03 - 4:05how black men are systematically
eliminated from juries, -
4:05 - 4:08and yet, the rules that try
and prevent that from happening -
4:08 - 4:10only make things worse.
-
4:10 - 4:12Stories about counter terrorism,
Guantanamo detainees, -
4:12 - 4:14stories where everything is disputed,
-
4:14 - 4:16all you can do is struggle
to try and make sense. -
4:16 - 4:19And this struggle
kind of became the point. -
4:20 - 4:22I began to think, "Maybe that's my job."
-
4:22 - 4:24To lead people to moments of struggle.
-
4:25 - 4:26Here's what that sounded like:
-
4:27 - 4:29(Various voices) "But I see -- I, like --"
-
4:29 - 4:30"Uh, I --" (Sighs)
-
4:30 - 4:32"Well, so, like, huh --"
-
4:32 - 4:33"That, I mean, I --"
-
4:33 - 4:38"You know -- golly -- I --" (Sighs)
-
4:38 - 4:40JA: And that sigh right there,
-
4:40 - 4:43I wanted to hear that sound
in every single story, -
4:43 - 4:46because that sound
is kind of our current moment, right? -
4:46 - 4:51We live in a world where truth
is no longer just a set of facts -
4:51 - 4:52to be captured.
-
4:52 - 4:53It's become a process.
-
4:53 - 4:55It's gone from being a noun
to being a verb. -
4:55 - 4:57But how do you end that story?
-
4:57 - 5:01Like, what literally kept happening
is we'd be, you know, telling a story, -
5:01 - 5:04cruising along,
two viewpoints in conflict, -
5:04 - 5:06you get to the end and it's just like --
-
5:06 - 5:07No, let me see.
-
5:07 - 5:09What do I say at the end?
-
5:09 - 5:10Oh, my God.
-
5:10 - 5:12What do you -- how do you end that story?
-
5:12 - 5:14You can't just happily-ever-after it,
-
5:14 - 5:15because that doesn't feel real.
-
5:15 - 5:16At the same time,
-
5:16 - 5:19if you just leave people
in that stuck place, -
5:19 - 5:21like, "Why did I just listen to that?"
-
5:21 - 5:23Like, it felt like there had to be
another move there. -
5:23 - 5:26Had to be a way beyond the struggle.
-
5:26 - 5:30And this is what brings me to Dolly.
-
5:30 - 5:33Or Saint Dolly, as we like
to call her in the South. -
5:33 - 5:36I want to tell you about one little
glimmer of an epiphany that I had, -
5:36 - 5:40doing a nine-part series
called "Dolly Parton's America" last year. -
5:40 - 5:41It was a bit of a departure for me,
-
5:41 - 5:45but I just had this intuition
that Dolly could help me -
5:45 - 5:46figure out this ending problem.
-
5:46 - 5:48And here was the basic intuition:
-
5:48 - 5:49You go to a Dolly concert,
-
5:49 - 5:52you see men in trucker hats
standing next to men in drag, -
5:52 - 5:54Democrats standing next to Republicans,
-
5:54 - 5:55women holding hands,
-
5:55 - 5:57every different kind of person
smashed together. -
5:58 - 6:00All of these people that we are told
should hate each other -
6:00 - 6:02are there singing together.
-
6:02 - 6:06She somehow carved out
this unique space in America, -
6:06 - 6:08and I wanted to know, how did she do that?
-
6:08 - 6:13So I interviewed Dolly 12 times,
two separate continents. -
6:13 - 6:14She started every interview this way:
-
6:15 - 6:17(Audio) Dolly Parton: Ask me
whatever you ask me, -
6:17 - 6:19and I'm going to tell you
what I want you to hear. -
6:19 - 6:20(Laughter)
-
6:20 - 6:23JA: She is undeniably a force of nature.
-
6:23 - 6:25But the problem that I ran into
-
6:25 - 6:30is that I had chosen
a conceit for this series -
6:30 - 6:32that my soul had trouble with.
-
6:32 - 6:34Dolly sings a lot about the South.
-
6:34 - 6:36If you go through her discography,
-
6:36 - 6:38you will hear song after song
about Tennessee. -
6:38 - 6:41(Music) DP: (Singing, various songs)
Tennessee, Tennessee... -
6:41 - 6:42Tennessee homesick ...
-
6:43 - 6:48I've got those Tennessee homesick blues
runnin' through my head. -
6:49 - 6:50Tennessee.
-
6:50 - 6:53JA: "Tennessee Mountain Home,"
"Tennessee Mountain Memories." -
6:53 - 6:54Now I grew up in Tennessee,
-
6:54 - 6:56and I felt no nostalgia for that place.
-
6:56 - 6:59I was the scrawny Arab kid
-
7:00 - 7:03who came from the place
that invented suicide bombing. -
7:03 - 7:05I spent a lot of time in my room.
-
7:05 - 7:07When I left Nashville,
-
7:07 - 7:09I left.
-
7:09 - 7:10I remember being at Dollywood,
-
7:10 - 7:14standing in front of a replica,
replica of her Tennessee Mountain Home. -
7:14 - 7:16People all around me were crying.
-
7:16 - 7:18This is a set.
-
7:19 - 7:20Why are you crying?
-
7:20 - 7:22I couldn't understand
why they were so emotional, -
7:22 - 7:25especially given
my relationship to the South. -
7:25 - 7:28And I started to honestly have
panic attacks about this. -
7:28 - 7:30"Am I not the right person
for this project?" -
7:31 - 7:33But then ...
-
7:33 - 7:34twist of fate.
-
7:34 - 7:36We meet this guy, Bryan Seaver,
-
7:36 - 7:39Dolly's nephew and bodyguard.
-
7:39 - 7:42And on a whim, he drives
producer Shima Oliaee and I -
7:42 - 7:43out of Dollywood,
-
7:43 - 7:45round the back side of the mountains,
-
7:45 - 7:47up the mountains 20 minutes,
-
7:47 - 7:48down a narrow dirt road,
-
7:48 - 7:51through giant wooden gates
that look right out of "Game of Thrones," -
7:51 - 7:55and into the actual
Tennessee Mountain Home. -
7:57 - 7:58But the real place.
-
7:58 - 8:00Valhalla.
-
8:00 - 8:01The real Tennessee Mountain Home.
-
8:01 - 8:03And I'm going to score
this part with Wagner, -
8:03 - 8:05because you've got to understand,
-
8:05 - 8:06in Tennessee lore,
-
8:06 - 8:09this is like hallowed ground,
the Tennessee Mountain Home. -
8:09 - 8:12So I remember standing
there, on the grass, -
8:12 - 8:14next to the Pigeon River,
-
8:14 - 8:16butterflies doing loopty loops in the air,
-
8:16 - 8:18and I had my own moment of wonder.
-
8:19 - 8:22Dolly's Tennessee Mountain Home
-
8:22 - 8:26looks exactly like my dad's home
in the mountains of Lebanon. -
8:26 - 8:30Her house looks just like
the place that he left. -
8:30 - 8:34And that simple bit of layering
led me to have a conversation with him -
8:34 - 8:35that I'd never had before,
-
8:35 - 8:37about the pain he felt leaving his home.
-
8:37 - 8:39And how he hears that in Dolly's music.
-
8:39 - 8:43Then I had a conversation with Dolly
where she described her songs -
8:43 - 8:44as migration music.
-
8:44 - 8:46Even that classic song,
-
8:46 - 8:49"Tennessee Mountain Home,"
if you listen to it -- -
8:50 - 8:52(Dolly Parton "Tennessee Mountain Home")
-
8:52 - 8:56"Sittin' on the front porch
on a summer afternoon -
8:57 - 9:00In a straight-backed chair on two legs,
-
9:00 - 9:04leaned against the wall."
-
9:05 - 9:10It's about trying to capture a moment
that you know is already gone. -
9:10 - 9:13But if you can paint it, vividly,
-
9:13 - 9:16maybe you can freeze it in place,
almost like in resin, -
9:16 - 9:18trapped between past and present.
-
9:19 - 9:21That is the immigrant experience.
-
9:22 - 9:25And that simple thought
led me to a million conversations. -
9:25 - 9:29I started talking to musicologists
about country music as a whole. -
9:29 - 9:31This genre that I've always felt so
-
9:31 - 9:33having nothing to do
with where I came from -
9:33 - 9:36is actually made up of instruments
and musical styles -
9:36 - 9:38that came directly from the Middle East.
-
9:38 - 9:42In fact, there were trade routes
that ran from what is now Lebanon -
9:42 - 9:45right up into the mountains
of East Tennessee. -
9:45 - 9:49I can honestly say, standing there,
looking at her home, -
9:49 - 9:52was the first time I felt
like I'm a Tennessean. -
9:53 - 9:54That is honestly true.
-
9:55 - 9:56And this wasn't a one-time thing,
-
9:57 - 9:58I mean, over and over again,
-
9:58 - 10:02she would force me
beyond the simple categories -
10:02 - 10:03I had constructed for the world.
-
10:03 - 10:06I remember talking with her
about her seven-year partnership -
10:06 - 10:07with Porter Wagoner.
-
10:07 - 10:121967, she joins his band,
he is the biggest thing in country music, -
10:12 - 10:14she is a backup singer, a nobody.
-
10:14 - 10:17Within a short time, she gets huge,
-
10:17 - 10:18he gets jealous,
-
10:18 - 10:21he then sues her for three million dollars
-
10:21 - 10:22when she tries to leave.
-
10:22 - 10:25Now it would be really easy
to see Porter Wagoner -
10:25 - 10:28as, like, a type: classic,
patriarchal jackass, -
10:28 - 10:29trying to hold her back.
-
10:29 - 10:31But any time I would suggest that to her,
-
10:31 - 10:33like, come on.
-
10:33 - 10:35(Audio) This is a guy, I mean,
you see it in the videos too, -
10:36 - 10:37he's got his arm around you.
-
10:37 - 10:41There's a power thing happening, for sure.
-
10:41 - 10:44DP: Well, it's more complicated than that.
-
10:44 - 10:46I mean, just think about it.
-
10:46 - 10:47He had had this show for years,
-
10:47 - 10:50he didn't need me to have his hit show.
-
10:50 - 10:54He wasn't expecting me
to be all that I was, either. -
10:54 - 10:57I was a serious entertainer,
he didn't know that. -
10:57 - 11:01He didn't know how many dreams I had.
-
11:01 - 11:02JA: In effect, she kept telling me,
-
11:02 - 11:05"Don't bring your stupid way
of seeing the world into my story, -
11:05 - 11:07because that's not what it was.
-
11:07 - 11:10Yeah, there was power,
but that's not all there was. -
11:10 - 11:12You can't summarize this."
-
11:14 - 11:15Alright, just to zoom out.
-
11:15 - 11:16What do I make of this?
-
11:16 - 11:21Well, I think there's something in here
that's a clue, a way forward. -
11:21 - 11:22As journalists, we love difference.
-
11:22 - 11:24We love to fetishize difference.
-
11:24 - 11:26But increasingly, in this confusing world,
-
11:26 - 11:29we need to be the bridge
between those differences. -
11:29 - 11:31But how do you do that?
-
11:31 - 11:34I think for me, now, the answer is simple.
-
11:34 - 11:36You interrogate those differences,
-
11:36 - 11:39you hold them for as long as you can,
-
11:39 - 11:42until, like up on that mountain,
-
11:42 - 11:43something happens,
-
11:43 - 11:45something reveals itself.
-
11:46 - 11:48Story cannot end in difference.
-
11:48 - 11:50It's got to end in revelation.
-
11:50 - 11:53And coming back
from that trip on the mountain, -
11:53 - 11:56a friend of mine gave me a book
that gave this whole idea a name. -
11:57 - 11:59In psychotherapy,
there's this idea called the third, -
11:59 - 12:01which essentially goes like this.
-
12:01 - 12:05Typically, we think of ourselves
as these autonomous units. -
12:05 - 12:07I do something to you,
you do something to me. -
12:07 - 12:10But according to this theory,
when two people come together -
12:10 - 12:13and really commit to seeing each other,
-
12:13 - 12:15in that mutual act of recognition,
-
12:15 - 12:18they actually make something new.
-
12:18 - 12:20A new entity that is their relationship.
-
12:21 - 12:25You can think of Dolly's concerts
as sort of a cultural third space. -
12:25 - 12:28The way she sees all the different
parts of her audience, -
12:28 - 12:29the way they see her,
-
12:29 - 12:32creates the spiritual
architecture of that space. -
12:33 - 12:36And I think now that is my calling.
-
12:36 - 12:38That as a journalist,
-
12:38 - 12:40as a storyteller,
-
12:40 - 12:42as just an American,
-
12:42 - 12:45living in a country struggling to hold,
-
12:45 - 12:48that every story I tell
has got to find the third. -
12:49 - 12:52That place where the things
we hold as different -
12:52 - 12:55resolve themselves into something new.
-
12:56 - 12:57Thank you.
- Title:
- How Dolly Parton led me to an epiphany
- Speaker:
- Jad Abumrad
- Description:
-
How do you end a story? Host of "Radiolab" Jad Abumrad tells how his search for an answer led him home to the mountains of Tennessee, where he met a wise teacher: Dolly Parton.
- Video Language:
- English
- Team:
- closed TED
- Project:
- TEDTalks
- Duration:
- 13:07
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Erin Gregory edited English subtitles for How Dolly Parton led me to an epiphany | ||
Erin Gregory edited English subtitles for How Dolly Parton led me to an epiphany | ||
Erin Gregory edited English subtitles for How Dolly Parton led me to an epiphany | ||
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Erin Gregory
edit made to English transcript:
6:14
Ask me whatever you ask me,
and I'm going to you tell what I want to hear.
-->
6:14
Ask me whatever you ask me,
and I'm going to tell you what I want you to hear.