Return to Video

36C3 - Infrastructures in a horizontal farmers community

  • 0:00 - 0:21
    36C3 preproll music
  • 0:21 - 0:22
    Herald Angel: Welcome everybody for our
    next talk 'Infrastructures in a horizontal
  • 0:22 - 0:27
    farmers community'. I guess one thing that
    all of us have in common is, that we all
  • 0:27 - 0:32
    are in special communities. We want to
    build better communities. We want to build
  • 0:32 - 0:36
    better infrastructure. And we want to
    build better technology, be it in a little
  • 0:36 - 0:42
    hackerspace in Sweden or in a theater
    group in France or in an NGO in Germany.
  • 0:42 - 0:47
    That is something that unites us all. And
    our next speaker, Andrea, she is giving us
  • 0:47 - 0:52
    some insights into their farming community
    in Italy, because she has 15 years of
  • 0:52 - 0:57
    experience with that. So I think we can
    all learn quite a lot. And Andrea is a
  • 0:57 - 1:01
    self-taught web developer. She graduated
    in communication sciences. She is also a
  • 1:01 - 1:05
    cook and she is part of a group of radical
    farmers. I would say she's a little bit of
  • 1:05 - 1:09
    everything, a jack of all trades. So,
    she's the best person to give us some
  • 1:09 - 1:14
    insights. So, please welcome Andrea with a
    big, warm round of applause and enjoy this
  • 1:14 - 1:21
    talk. Thank you very much.
  • 1:21 - 1:28
    Andrea: Well, thanks to you too, everyone,
    to stay here. It will be difficult to fit
  • 1:28 - 1:35
    in a 30 minute to explain the experience
    and to explain the interaction between a
  • 1:35 - 1:42
    lot of different communities, not only
    these experiencing Bologna, but okay. I
  • 1:42 - 1:49
    will speak about Campi Aperti. Campi
    Aperti means open field in Italian. And I
  • 1:49 - 1:54
    come from Bologna. OK, Bologna, if you
    imagine that this is Italy, it's here,
  • 1:54 - 2:03
    Bologna. I'm speaking about the growing
    vegetable, growing organic food. This is a
  • 2:03 - 2:14
    community of a farmers. It's a community
    of people that reclaim the rights to grow
  • 2:14 - 2:20
    our food and decide how the territories,
    the land, the countryside is transformed.
  • 2:20 - 2:30
    And so it is direct action. There are
    there are some reclaims to change some
  • 2:30 - 2:38
    law. But we are not wait that these law in
    Italy are changed. But we do directly this
  • 2:38 - 2:44
    stuff. This stuff is a survival for
    farmers, because the problem is that there
  • 2:44 - 2:49
    exists only law in Italy that are for the
    transformed, the food, make pizza, bread,
  • 2:49 - 2:59
    beer and this stuff and only are made for
    industrial production. So, the production
  • 2:59 - 3:07
    of unmade, of the farmer is, that there
    are no law for these. You can't do sell.
  • 3:07 - 3:14
    You can't do direct sell. But this group
    of farmers do this is stuff. And so they
  • 3:14 - 3:23
    have a political action really, in the
    street, in the square. And then they must,
  • 3:23 - 3:31
    the more visible stuff that they do, is do
    these organic markets. But is not only
  • 3:31 - 3:40
    this. Is political stuff. And these food,
    their background and their roots in
  • 3:40 - 3:50
    radical anti capitalist group and from the
    global movement in the 90s. So, where?
  • 3:50 - 3:56
    Where are these stuff happen? Happen in
    places that are free. Because you can't
  • 3:56 - 4:00
    ask at the beginning. Fifteen years ago
    you can talk. But also now, probably is
  • 4:00 - 4:06
    more difficult. You can't ask the
    municipality to start that these kinds of
  • 4:06 - 4:14
    markets. And they found a good ground in
    squat in square in the street, in places
  • 4:14 - 4:22
    that are managed by human agreement, not
    the law. And so Campi Aperti was born in
  • 4:22 - 4:32
    2003 in XM24 in Bolognina. That is on a
    shared, is occupied, public shared space,
  • 4:32 - 4:38
    self-managed by our community. Is not a
    service, is a place where the needs of the
  • 4:38 - 4:47
    community and the answer to these needs,
    find an answer and a solution. This place
  • 4:47 - 5:00
    is under the threat of eviction and we
    support a lot this place. Really, really
  • 5:00 - 5:10
    important for our life. So I told you
    where and I want also told you how. Not
  • 5:10 - 5:20
    how, only how after. When. The time. The
    time, it's important stuff. The time, for
  • 5:20 - 5:30
    capitalism, is thinking in hours and
    money. But, and it's fast, but this, is
  • 5:30 - 5:38
    shaped on you, on an egocentric idea. But
    this is not the only way to think the
  • 5:38 - 5:49
    time. For farmers is really easy. Think of
    the time cyclical, not egocentric, not
  • 5:49 - 5:58
    human centred way. And so there are habits
    to plan the stuff and to take a seasonal
  • 5:58 - 6:06
    agreement or seasonal planning. And so,
    the first stuff to rethink our life and
  • 6:06 - 6:14
    our community is, take our time. Our time
    of to grow relationship and our time to
  • 6:14 - 6:23
    think how to do this stuff. And our time
    when we buy something. Our time to think
  • 6:23 - 6:31
    where it came from. The stuff that we buy
    and the stuff that we eat. In which how
  • 6:31 - 6:37
    are developed and where it comes from.
    Where from, from what the community and
  • 6:37 - 6:50
    from what territories. OK. This is a gift
    that you will find in the slide. If you go
  • 6:50 - 6:58
    to check after these talk, you can see
    also a video in Creative Commons for sure.
  • 6:58 - 7:07
    And but the now I have not the time to
    show our action in video. I want to
  • 7:07 - 7:12
    explain a bit the infrastructure. The
    infrastructure is based on the human
  • 7:12 - 7:22
    agreement and the group of Campi Aperti
    started with five people in an occupied
  • 7:22 - 7:30
    space, public space and they started with
    a small market. After and after they grew.
  • 7:30 - 7:38
    And now there are more than 150 farmers.
    And with thousands of people that come at
  • 7:38 - 7:48
    the market and are co-producer of the
    products. And so we manage ourself by
  • 7:48 - 7:57
    assemblies and we do this stuff for
    consensus method. So the topic are food
  • 7:57 - 8:05
    autonomy, be independent with the food.
    Safeguard the territories, practice
  • 8:05 - 8:12
    agroecology and we shared, we have a
    shared warranty. So the group of farmer
  • 8:12 - 8:23
    not to take, not upset, decentralize the
    warranty about organic food by the state,
  • 8:23 - 8:29
    but they practice our shared warranty.
    Means that everyone, everyone of the
  • 8:29 - 8:37
    producer at the market, take care of the
    product, also of the orders and and the
  • 8:37 - 8:42
    care of the relationship . But this also
    means, that if you break the trust, one
  • 8:42 - 8:48
    with the other, you go out from the
    community. And this looks like difficult
  • 8:48 - 8:53
    to decide, but is not so difficult,
    because when you are local, and you know
  • 8:53 - 9:01
    the products that you grow and the how are
    organic, it's easy to to decide this
  • 9:01 - 9:10
    stuff. Is a look like that, for explain
    some technical people, is like if you not
  • 9:10 - 9:20
    trust the certification authority, but you
    are based on a web of trust. And so we
  • 9:20 - 9:26
    include also in our relationship, in our
    work, the sense of the limit and the
  • 9:26 - 9:32
    mutualism. So we plan to not grow too much
    but to grow only locally. And we divided
  • 9:32 - 9:39
    the assembly. There are assembly for every
    market, that are 8 every month. There are
  • 9:39 - 9:45
    assembly globally all together, every two
    months. And the assembly every two months
  • 9:45 - 10:01
    locally for our valley, are based on
    formal consensus method. This means that
  • 10:01 - 10:07
    we trained us to stay in the consensus
    area. We know that the agreement are based
  • 10:07 - 10:14
    in balance between a relationship and
    knowledge. We come all from a different
  • 10:14 - 10:19
    knowledge, because we are specialized in
    different stuff and that we have to grow
  • 10:19 - 10:26
    together our relationship, so we can, we
    try to stay in this area of consensus
  • 10:26 - 10:31
    knowing that we are different knowledge,
    but I trust. We don't want to stay in
  • 10:31 - 10:37
    ananomity. We don't want stay always agree
    all together, because there are a lot of
  • 10:37 - 10:44
    risk in that area. You can, in this area,
    you grow the diversity. In that area, you
  • 10:44 - 10:51
    are doing echo chambers and you are doing,
    you can do easily mistake in the unanimity
  • 10:51 - 11:00
    place. In the other, you find the low
    trust and different knowledge. So you are
  • 11:00 - 11:06
    in dissent normally and you have of low
    relationship, so low trust. But a full
  • 11:06 - 11:10
    agreement of what do you want for the
    future? The only stuff that you can do is
  • 11:10 - 11:16
    take a technical agreement together. So
    write really specific law. But we don't
  • 11:16 - 11:22
    want law, so we want the agreement and the
    guideline. The other stuff are done by
  • 11:22 - 11:31
    trust, one with the other. So, told you
    that we use formal consensus method, means
  • 11:31 - 11:39
    that in these distributed meeting, we have
    shared agreements. We start with a base
  • 11:39 - 11:46
    ground that is that every assembly is
    reported. So at the beginning of every
  • 11:46 - 11:51
    assembly, we choose a rapporteur, or more
    than one, because sometimes there are
  • 11:51 - 12:00
    global assembly, that start at the morning
    and finish in the evening. And so, we have
  • 12:00 - 12:07
    a time, a keeper for the speaker. And we
    decide to put in our agreement that the
  • 12:07 - 12:15
    right to listen and to be listened and
    that no meta conversation of the topic,
  • 12:15 - 12:23
    only everyone talk speak for herself.
    Okay, we need that to communicate. And
  • 12:23 - 12:29
    when we started to think about the
    communication, we speak with another
  • 12:29 - 12:37
    community that know better this stuff
    about communication than us and we found,
  • 12:37 - 12:45
    and we know, because we share that same
    the same political idea, with hackmeeting.
  • 12:45 - 12:53
    Hackmeeting is a community in Italy that
    is anti fascist, anti racist and anti
  • 12:53 - 13:02
    sexist, and was born in the 90s also, that
    the community and every year they meet in
  • 13:02 - 13:09
    different space, occupied space in Italy.
    They are for the freedom in the
  • 13:09 - 13:16
    communication, and with a critical view
    about technologies. So, we ask asked and
  • 13:16 - 13:26
    we discover a lot of self managed server,
    and for first tools that we implemented in
  • 13:26 - 13:37
    the 2004, was our website.Yeah. And we
    started with a lot of mailing list. The
  • 13:37 - 13:42
    first tool was mailing list and after, to
    communicate outside in the group, we
  • 13:42 - 13:48
    started with this website hosted
    autistici/inventati. That is one of the
  • 13:48 - 14:01
    older self managed server in Italy near
    us, with a strong view about anonymity and
  • 14:01 - 14:08
    the privacy oriented for the user. The
    communication are really, really
  • 14:08 - 14:17
    important. In group that live in the
    countryside you live in different farm,
  • 14:17 - 14:23
    far from one from the other. And so
    happened, that to use the mailing list,
  • 14:23 - 14:28
    all people need the connectivity. So, what
    happened that if you based your
  • 14:28 - 14:34
    connectivity on a commercial companies and
    your are in countryside, you discovered
  • 14:34 - 14:41
    that you are told: No, you are still far
    from the city and we don't earn too much
  • 14:41 - 14:49
    enough to bring to you connectivity. And
    so, we started to explore how to resolve
  • 14:49 - 14:54
    this problem. And we discovered that
    exists yet a community that have thought
  • 14:54 - 15:01
    to this stuff and that yet existed a Pico
    peer (Peer to Peer) agreement. And in Italy, we
  • 15:01 - 15:13
    meet ninux, ninux community that are
    based, that shared us and teach us how set
  • 15:13 - 15:24
    mesh network. And so I show you a bit of
    photograph. Our infrastructure is a small
  • 15:24 - 15:34
    and grow really slowly, and is based, our
    hardware are 15 people that want stay
  • 15:34 - 15:38
    connected, one with the other, and
    understood that the broadcasting
  • 15:38 - 15:48
    connection is nice, is really lighter, use
    5Ghz point to point antenna, to do point
  • 15:48 - 16:03
    to point connection and so the cost to
    stay, to learn and to do maintain that
  • 16:03 - 16:10
    network is an effort that they can do. And
    we found also for people more technician
  • 16:10 - 16:19
    that help, is like help to install Linux,
    but here we install OpenWrt. And after
  • 16:19 - 16:25
    that people know how maintain and take
    care, they in freedom their PC. And in
  • 16:25 - 16:31
    this case, antenna. We use all super
    proprietary hardware that we change the
  • 16:31 - 16:36
    firmware and we use tp-link ubiquity but
    we are switching to an open hardware
  • 16:36 - 16:44
    project that is LibreRouter, and as
    software we use LibraMesh, libremesh.org.
  • 16:44 - 16:58
    That is a project, that is a bundle of
    configuration open over OpenWrt. And that
  • 16:58 - 17:08
    use a different protocol like babeld and
    batman adv. But yeah, the topic of them is
  • 17:08 - 17:13
    make easier this stuff for the user, and
    they do. So, we have a blog
  • 17:13 - 17:21
    antennine.noblogs.org. That where we take
    the documentation of this stuff. We think
  • 17:21 - 17:30
    a lot about technology. Also think, why we
    are adopt technology. And so we started to
  • 17:30 - 17:40
    deploy a feminist view about technologies.
    Means, that we thinks that every
  • 17:40 - 17:46
    technologies is an effort. When someone
    told to you, that this technology is
  • 17:46 - 17:54
    smarter, sometime is because is not the
    considering the entire cycle of life of
  • 17:54 - 18:03
    that technologies. And so looking a lot in
    the technologies that everyone this moment
  • 18:03 - 18:11
    is doing advertisement about technologies:
    hey use this, is easy. We think: ok no,
  • 18:11 - 18:16
    stop. Stop. Is better wait and think what
    do we are doing. So we think that it's
  • 18:16 - 18:23
    important not to do the things alone,
    because you became the point of failure of
  • 18:23 - 18:29
    your of your community. To be resistant
    you need to do this stuff with more
  • 18:29 - 18:37
    people, not start if you are alone, and
    mix proficient people with newbie.
  • 18:37 - 18:42
    Contemplated the possibility of making
    mistake and so, build the testing
  • 18:42 - 18:47
    environment before put the stuff in
    production. Document everything to explain
  • 18:47 - 18:53
    the choice that you took, and that give
    the time to yourself and to the other to
  • 18:53 - 19:01
    study, and not to be too much specialized.
    Specialized brings people too easily to go
  • 19:01 - 19:10
    to burnout. It's better, if you trust
    yourself in more than one topic and share
  • 19:10 - 19:15
    knowledge with the other. Not to go too
    much in deep in one topic, because you
  • 19:15 - 19:22
    lost the entire view, and why you are
    doing something. You are not pay for to do
  • 19:22 - 19:26
    this stuff for community, is a need for
    community and is a richness of for
  • 19:26 - 19:35
    everyone of your community, in our view,
    in our way that we do this stuff. So, we
  • 19:35 - 19:44
    start from our needs. We started to speak
    about our digital data in 2016. This is a
  • 19:44 - 19:51
    meeting of a Genuino Clandestino. That is
    the bigger network of self organized
  • 19:51 - 19:56
    farmers in Italy. And there are a lot of
    different small communities that do, that
  • 19:56 - 20:03
    to grow vegetable and do direct sell in
    shared public space. And we started to
  • 20:03 - 20:07
    speak about our digital data and we
    decided, that we don't want to put in
  • 20:07 - 20:15
    Google, Amazon, Facebook, Microsoft, Apple
    space. We are anti GAFAM. And because
  • 20:15 - 20:20
    we are against the big distribution of the
    food and also big distribution of the
  • 20:20 - 20:25
    data, we think that in this moment is
    really important to take care of our
  • 20:25 - 20:36
    intimacies and our data. So we decided to
    put in server and to run ourself these
  • 20:36 - 20:47
    services. And we spend a one hour, one
    year to find a virtual private server.
  • 20:47 - 20:55
    Someone that host our digital place that
    shared with us our policy, and we found in
  • 20:55 - 21:03
    France, in Toulouse, the tetaneutral.net.
    That is inside of a bigger network that is
  • 21:03 - 21:10
    federated france data network and are
    really important for us, because they, I
  • 21:10 - 21:13
    thinks that they do a good work, because
    of they are for the neutrality, for
  • 21:13 - 21:23
    freedom of choice to the internet and with
    budget based on donation of the community.
  • 21:23 - 21:29
    We've passed a lot of time to find, inside
    our community of farmers, sysadmin and we
  • 21:29 - 21:38
    found, and we started to use the Nextcloud
    as a free software to where host our data.
  • 21:38 - 21:45
    And we decide to start, we started in
    March of this year, and we decided to
  • 21:45 - 21:54
    start to use only for administrative work.
    So, only for 10 people of the group. And
  • 21:54 - 22:01
    after deciding if these are tool is OK for
    our needs or not. If is not we will see
  • 22:01 - 22:09
    and we are just in time to go back and not
    use. But at the moment, the stuff are
  • 22:09 - 22:20
    running good, and we are store in this
    cloud the cards about our farmers. Because
  • 22:20 - 22:27
    we make everyone to enter in Campi Aperti
    needs to be visited by another farmer, and
  • 22:27 - 22:36
    that to know the, how they grow vegetable
    and the how they do organic stuff. And so,
  • 22:36 - 22:45
    we write dossier of ourself, and it's why
    the website was not more enough. We need
  • 22:45 - 22:54
    private place where store this stuff, also
    to decentralize the task that we have to
  • 22:54 - 23:01
    do. To distribute the task. And so, after
    this one year of testing, we are planning
  • 23:01 - 23:10
    how to grow, okay. If all the stuff are
    going good, we decide how to grow. And so
  • 23:10 - 23:16
    again, we decide to not to do this stuff
    alone. We look around in a community near
  • 23:16 - 23:25
    to us and we decide again to adopt
    something that is yet to use the body
  • 23:25 - 23:27
    (???) of community that is anti-fascist,
    anti-racist and anti-sexist. That is
  • 23:27 - 23:39
    Autistici/Inventati. They change the
    infrastructure this year and they moved
  • 23:39 - 23:50
    container infrastructure to have divided
    the configuration, the specific
  • 23:50 - 23:58
    configuration, the configuration that you
    can share with other and the software. All
  • 23:58 - 24:10
    this free stuff are managed by
    minimalistic orchestrator container. And
  • 24:10 - 24:18
    that is called the FLOAT. And we find this
    solution interesting, also because we
  • 24:18 - 24:28
    started with the other possibility of a
    solution, and we saw that in this moment
  • 24:28 - 24:37
    there are huge software also open source,
    that can resolve this problem. But
  • 24:37 - 24:45
    developed and used by huge open source
    company that not really feed our needs. So, we
  • 24:45 - 24:51
    are interesting in this software, because
    give static service allocation, like some
  • 24:51 - 24:57
    of these feature looks like not real, are
    non feature for the needs of the
  • 24:57 - 25:05
    companies. But for us are, because we have
    our community, so we have different needs.
  • 25:05 - 25:12
    So, how its work, quickly. Because yeah,
    we are at the CCC, I have to show you
  • 25:12 - 25:17
    something of technical. So, we have a
    specific genetic configuration, that we
  • 25:17 - 25:24
    versioning with GIT. We use Ansibel to
    versioning our configuration and the
  • 25:24 - 25:33
    software, so the generic part, is builded
    by the continuous integration that we have
  • 25:33 - 25:38
    on our decision Autistici/Inventati. That
    is builded in a... we have a Docker
  • 25:38 - 25:45
    registry and build the Docker image. And
    so, FLOAT deployed, running our Ansible
  • 25:45 - 25:54
    playbook, deploy the different Docker
    image on the different machine. So, why
  • 25:54 - 26:00
    it's good for us? Because we can
    versioning all the stuff, so we can also
  • 26:00 - 26:07
    do mistake but go back and we can deploy
    on virtual machine, where we can do
  • 26:07 - 26:26
    testing and on the real production on the
    real machine. This is, I thinks why we
  • 26:26 - 26:33
    thinks to adopt. Also, because we want not
    use, we don't want to stay on a virtual
  • 26:33 - 26:40
    machine, we would like move on bare metal
    and we trust to the group, these
  • 26:40 - 26:50
    orchestrator is only 1000 line of Python
    code, and is written like, is Ansibl
  • 26:50 - 26:59
    plugin and we can use the double factor
    authentication, universal two factor
  • 26:59 - 27:04
    authentication. That is good for us,
    because if you have for the stuff that
  • 27:04 - 27:11
    your security is base, could be based on
    how to do a token. So you have a security
  • 27:11 - 27:19
    in something of local, that you have to
    keep. And in some integrated monitoring,
  • 27:19 - 27:27
    like Prometeus and Graphader (???). And
    this feature, or non- feature is, that the
  • 27:27 - 27:32
    services go down when something fail. And
    this is, for us, this is important. We are
  • 27:32 - 27:38
    not a company that have to stay 24 hour
    up. We are a community that they want to
  • 27:38 - 27:45
    know, if something goes wrong with your
    machine and if someone put physically the
  • 27:45 - 27:57
    hands on your machine. Yeah, this is, now
    is the time of the question. Slow please,
  • 27:57 - 28:03
    the question, because I don't speak really
    well English Andrea laughs you see now?
  • 28:03 - 28:09
    But also I don't understand really well.
    And these is the long list of thanks and
  • 28:09 - 28:15
    all the community that I speak about.
    There is also EclecticTechCarnival, that
  • 28:15 - 28:24
    is a feminist community, that pushed a lot
    to me to arrive here to explain this stuff
  • 28:24 - 28:31
    to you. And thanks.
  • 28:31 - 28:36
    applause
  • 28:36 - 28:41
    Herald Angel: Thank you very much for the
    great talk. It was very, very interesting.
  • 28:41 - 28:45
    We still have 10 minutes for questions and
    answers. If you have questions, just move
  • 28:45 - 28:51
    to the three microphones in the room, and
    then we're going to have you ask your
  • 28:51 - 28:55
    questions. So, we start with microphone
    number two. Very slow in English, please.
  • 28:55 - 28:59
    Andrea: Yes.
    Mic 2: Thank you very much for the talk. I
  • 28:59 - 29:04
    have a question. The customers, do they
    pay in advance for a year or do they pay
  • 29:04 - 29:12
    at the market?
    Andrea: Ok. In Bologna, in Campi Aperti
  • 29:12 - 29:19
    experience is direct sell in the market.
    So the co-producer, the consumer pay at
  • 29:19 - 29:26
    the moment. But we know that that is not
    the perfect model and there are other
  • 29:26 - 29:31
    other experiment the city, in which Campi
    Aperti and this group of farmer is
  • 29:31 - 29:43
    involved. And so, there is also Arvaia,
    that is another group that the customer
  • 29:43 - 29:52
    pay in advance. And have a place, and also
    work in fields, and take boxes every week.
  • 29:52 - 30:03
    And there is also another project, that is
    Camilla and is based on... you are
  • 30:03 - 30:13
    associated and you have to work three
    hours every month in a market. And there
  • 30:13 - 30:19
    is this market open for all the
    association, all the people associated to
  • 30:19 - 30:26
    these. So, it is a city that is
    experimented. But yes, for Campi Aperti,
  • 30:26 - 30:30
    you not pay in advance it. Only for, in
    other projects.
  • 30:30 - 30:34
    Mic2: Is it okay if I ask something else?
    Herald Angel: If it's... Well, I would
  • 30:34 - 30:37
    first take microphone number three. But if
    you just stay there, I feel like there
  • 30:37 - 30:41
    would be still time for another question.
    So, microphone number three, please.
  • 30:41 - 30:48
    Mic3: Yes. I have a question about
    consensus. You mentioned that some level
  • 30:48 - 30:54
    of disagreement is not only acceptable,
    but maybe good, because if everyone
  • 30:54 - 31:00
    agrees, then there is no discussion,
    development and less trust. But what level
  • 31:00 - 31:06
    of disagreement is acceptable? Have you
    tried different models, like how you
  • 31:06 - 31:13
    achieve this consensus?
    Andrea: Yeah, we think that disagreement
  • 31:13 - 31:22
    is important to not hide problems. So
    also, we put attention to not to say at
  • 31:22 - 31:29
    the end of a conversation we are all
    agree, but for example, if someone of more
  • 31:29 - 31:40
    doubt and we have a formal way of a
    consensus. So, to be sure that we are all
  • 31:40 - 31:48
    agree, we do an orientation, we call it,
    and that means that you can divide the
  • 31:48 - 32:02
    group in three position. Active consent,
    consensus with doubts but that you think
  • 32:02 - 32:08
    that trust is enough, so you are agree,
    but you will be not active to do this
  • 32:08 - 32:16
    stuff. And the active dissensus, that
    means, that the decision that are you
  • 32:16 - 32:24
    taking is against the principle and if you
    put yourself in that position, you have to
  • 32:24 - 32:32
    explain to all the others and you have to
    do again an orientation. But if you are
  • 32:32 - 32:40
    more than 20% of the people that stay in
    active dissent, you have to re-discuss
  • 32:40 - 32:47
    all. So, became block, blocked.
    Herald Angel: Great, thanks for the
  • 32:47 - 32:50
    explanation. That was very interesting.
    Microphone number two, again.
  • 32:50 - 32:56
    Mic2: Thank you for your talk. I wanted to
    ask whether you have any mechanism to help
  • 32:56 - 33:01
    people that want to become farmers,
    especially to acquire new land.
  • 33:01 - 33:08
    Andrea: Hmm. Existed a project and now is
    not the more active. We are sad, because
  • 33:08 - 33:17
    it's not more active and because this
    project started from people that had these
  • 33:17 - 33:24
    need. And after they found the land and
    say: ok, we have not more the time. And we
  • 33:24 - 33:37
    have, we not find again who put the time
    in that project. And so, there is not a
  • 33:37 - 33:47
    real... process in which we help people to
    became farmer. But, for example, the
  • 33:47 - 33:53
    mailing list is open. Everyone that
    participated to the market can be says can
  • 33:53 - 33:57
    join the mailing list and also the
    assembly and the meeting and so happen a
  • 33:57 - 34:05
    lot of time and that the people asked for
    space in countryside so find information.
  • 34:05 - 34:13
    And the other stuff, that really change,
    make the change is, that a lot of people
  • 34:13 - 34:21
    come in Campi Aperti asking us to do
    transformation, to transform only the food
  • 34:21 - 34:27
    and this fact is not acceptable in Campi
    Aperti. The people are not can only
  • 34:27 - 34:33
    transformate the food. We are, we do
    practice for be independent from
  • 34:33 - 34:44
    capitalism for our food. And so you can't
    ask only to transforme. So they... we ask
  • 34:44 - 34:53
    to these people to start a project to grow
    vegetables and became a farmer. And so...
  • 34:53 - 35:03
    or started an active collaboration with a
    group of farmer yet exist. And so in this
  • 35:03 - 35:07
    way started more people to live in
    countryside.
  • 35:07 - 35:11
    Herald Angel: Thank you very much. Next
    up, we have a question from the Internet.
  • 35:11 - 35:19
    Signal Angel: You seem to have gone really
    far in doing a lot of things yourself. Do
  • 35:19 - 35:23
    you still rely on a lot of mainstream
    technologies? Or did you re-implement
  • 35:23 - 35:26
    everything yourself?
    Andrea: Do you...?
  • 35:26 - 35:31
    Herald Angel: Is everything self-made? Or
    do you still rely on some mainstream
  • 35:31 - 35:36
    technologies? Is there something that you
    use, that is mainstream capitalist, that
  • 35:36 - 35:39
    everybody else uses too? Like, you
    mentioned that you don't use Google or
  • 35:39 - 35:43
    Facebook or something like that. Apart
    from that, is that something mainstream
  • 35:43 - 35:48
    that you still use that you rely on?
    Andrea: Yeah. We are not monopolistic.
  • 35:48 - 36:00
    Like, we have the basic communication
    independant infrastructure, but yes, some
  • 36:00 - 36:07
    of them are, we are not the direct running
    Autistici. We are based that on self-
  • 36:07 - 36:14
    managed servers. So, same community that
    the shared with us a political topic, but
  • 36:14 - 36:22
    in that way we are not running the
    service. We are not running the service.
  • 36:22 - 36:29
    To communicate that we use the Website and
    the mailing list, so we have our
  • 36:29 - 36:39
    independent communication, but there is
    not... we not avoid people of us that use
  • 36:39 - 36:47
    also commercial instrument or commercial
    such network. All this stuff is only that
  • 36:47 - 36:55
    we don't trust that too much, that way of
    communication will be really useful when
  • 36:55 - 36:59
    when we need. Or...
    Herald Angel: All right. Another question
  • 36:59 - 37:03
    from microphone number two, please.
    Mic2: Hi. Thank you for your presentation.
  • 37:03 - 37:10
    In your presentation, you mention dossier
    written by farmers about the other
  • 37:10 - 37:16
    farmers, and farmers visiting other
    farmers. I wanted to ask, these dossier,
  • 37:16 - 37:22
    what kind of information do they collect
    and how are they used? I mean, what's the
  • 37:22 - 37:28
    purpose of the dossier and what
    information do they collect?
  • 37:28 - 37:41
    Andrea: Okay. Is the protocol of shared
    warranty. And so, a person that want enter
  • 37:41 - 37:51
    in Campi Aperti from the website, can ask
    to be visit and starter to fill a form and
  • 37:51 - 38:02
    fill dossier, these cards. And after,
    these cards go to the people, assembly of
  • 38:02 - 38:11
    that valley, the valley where this farmer
    come from and decide when do the visit. So
  • 38:11 - 38:19
    this visit is reported to the next
    assembly. And who did the the visit say,
  • 38:19 - 38:29
    what this person wrote in the card is a
    true or not true. And so, also here you
  • 38:29 - 38:39
    have a, you have the weight of trust, of
    the whole much trust of the words of a
  • 38:39 - 38:49
    person that asked to enter, and we
    store this card, this dossier and we
  • 38:49 - 38:56
    print. We print and we put physically on
    the desk when people do the market.
  • 38:56 - 39:03
    Because it's really important that people
    that come to buy the stuff, know where and
  • 39:03 - 39:08
    if we want to go also to visit the
    producer. And also, because I told you
  • 39:08 - 39:17
    that the some of that organic stuff are
    organic, but not that with the
  • 39:17 - 39:22
    certification by the state. And also a lot
    of the stuff that are transformed are
  • 39:22 - 39:26
    inside of the campaign Genuino
    Clandestino. That means that are
  • 39:26 - 39:33
    transformed, handmade, but the out of the
    law. And so you need that, that people are
  • 39:33 - 39:37
    well-informed, who buy this stuff.
    Mic2: Ok, so...
  • 39:37 - 39:41
    Herald Angel: Sorry. Sorry. I'm very
    sorry. But we don't have time for a back
  • 39:41 - 39:45
    up questions. Also, I'm very sorry, I
    would have loved to have the person who
  • 39:45 - 39:48
    ask the first question also have like,
    asked the last question, but we ran out of
  • 39:48 - 39:52
    time. But I'm sure that you can still
    catch Andrea after the talk and ask
  • 39:52 - 39:56
    whatever questions were not answered. So,
    first of all, thanks for all of your very
  • 39:56 - 40:00
    interesting and clever questions and also
    thank you very much, Andrea, for the great
  • 40:00 - 40:04
    presentation. Please give another big,
    warm round of applause for Andrea. Thank
  • 40:04 - 40:06
    you very much.
    Andrea: Thanks, see you.
  • 40:06 - 40:07
    applause
  • 40:07 - 40:08
    postroll music
  • 40:08 - 40:35
    Subtitles created by c3subtitles.de
    in the year 2020. Join, and help us!
Title:
36C3 - Infrastructures in a horizontal farmers community
Description:

more » « less
Video Language:
English
Duration:
40:35

English subtitles

Revisions Compare revisions