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Format: Layer, Start, End, Style, Name, MarginL, MarginR, MarginV, Effect, Text
Dialogue: 0,0:00:00.00,0:00:19.06,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,{\i1}33C3 musique de préroulement{\i0}
Dialogue: 0,0:00:19.06,0:00:25.09,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Herald: Ok! Venons-en à la discussion... \NLa suivante est Andrea Jungaberle. Elle
Dialogue: 0,0:00:25.09,0:00:35.05,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,nous parle des drogues et de comment elles\Naffectent la psychiatrie. Quel mot dur !
Dialogue: 0,0:00:35.05,0:00:43.24,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Pourquoi tu ne le fais pas? Je sais \Nmaintenant. Et la question est, après la—
Dialogue: 0,0:00:43.24,0:00:46.60,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,comment dit-on "verbot" en français ? \NAndrea Jungaberle: Prohibition.
Dialogue: 0,0:00:46.60,0:00:50.48,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Herald: Après la prohibition dans les\Nannées 70. On n'a pas beaucoup réfléchi
Dialogue: 0,0:00:50.48,0:00:58.59,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,à comment ces drogues fonctionnent et \Npourraient améliorer la psychiatrie... Et
Dialogue: 0,0:00:58.59,0:01:04.11,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,maintenant tout le monde se demande,\Nest-ce le remède miracle? Je ne crois pas.
Dialogue: 0,0:01:04.11,0:01:07.80,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Mais plus d'informations sur ce sujet avec\NAndrea. Un accueil chaleureux, svp.
Dialogue: 0,0:01:07.80,0:01:14.11,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,{\i1}Applaudissements{\i0}
Dialogue: 0,0:01:14.11,0:01:19.55,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Andrea: Bonjour, tout le monde. Je suis\Nheureuse d'être ici et pouvoir vous parler
Dialogue: 0,0:01:19.55,0:01:23.47,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,d'un sujet qui me tient à cœur et qui est \Ntrès important pour beaucoup de personnes,
Dialogue: 0,0:01:23.47,0:01:28.66,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,aujourd'hui et demain. Donc, le sujet est\Nla médecine psychédélique, le piratage, la
Dialogue: 0,0:01:28.66,0:01:33.15,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,psychiatrie. Et juste pour rappeler la\Nchute, ce n'est pas un remède miracle et
Dialogue: 0,0:01:33.15,0:01:36.91,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,ça ne le sera jamais. Mais aussi il y a\Nbeaucoup de choses à savoir et à penser
Dialogue: 0,0:01:36.91,0:01:40.95,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,dans ce contexte. J'aimerais vous les\Nprésenter. Mais d'abord, quelques mots
Dialogue: 0,0:01:40.95,0:01:46.00,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,sur moi. Je suis docteur en médecine,\Nspécialisée dans l'urgence et les soins
Dialogue: 0,0:01:46.00,0:01:50.32,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,intensifs. Je travaille et vis à Berlin.\NJe suis aussi l'un des fondateurs de MIND,
Dialogue: 0,0:01:50.32,0:01:56.28,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,la Fondation Européenne pour la Science\NPsychédélique, et actuel directeur médical
Dialogue: 0,0:01:56.28,0:02:01.59,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Juste une phrase de plus. Voici notre \Néquipe de base. MIND est une association
Dialogue: 0,0:02:01.59,0:02:07.56,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,de membres de Science psychédélique. Nous\Navons 450 membres au niveau mondial et une
Dialogue: 0,0:02:07.56,0:02:13.25,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,équipe de 50 personnes. C'est un noyau de \Npersonnel rémunéré, nombreux volontaires
Dialogue: 0,0:02:13.25,0:02:17.04,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,très bons et très dédiés , et de grands\Ninternes de différentes disciplines, comme
Dialogue: 0,0:02:17.04,0:02:23.24,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,les neurosciences, la psychiatrie, la \Npsycho/pharmacologie, etc Nous travaillons
Dialogue: 0,0:02:23.24,0:02:27.63,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,pour établir la science psychédélique,\Ncomme une méthode, fondée sur des preuves
Dialogue: 0,0:02:27.63,0:02:34.49,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,et informer en Allemagne et autour en\NEurope. Ok, plongeons dans le vif du sujet
Dialogue: 0,0:02:34.49,0:02:42.23,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Les Psychédéliques. Que sont-ils ? Et bien\Nle terme vient des Grecs, Psychée et Délos
Dialogue: 0,0:02:42.23,0:02:46.91,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,que l'on peut traduire par "manifestation\Nde l'esprit par la pensée". Tant de gens
Dialogue: 0,0:02:46.91,0:02:52.54,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,parlaient des substances psychoactives \Ncomme ayant une certaine, capacité de
Dialogue: 0,0:02:52.54,0:02:57.63,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,transformer la perception de chacun, \Nl'introspection,les qualités sensorielles
Dialogue: 0,0:02:57.63,0:03:03.01,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,d'une manière très typique qui est parfois\Ndécrite comme onirique, mais pas toujours.
Dialogue: 0,0:03:03.01,0:03:07.26,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Les psychédéliques classiques, également\Nappelés hallucinogènes, terme qui me
Dialogue: 0,0:03:07.26,0:03:12.34,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,déplait car ces drogues ne provoquent pas \Nd'hallucinations. Ce qu'ils font, c'est
Dialogue: 0,0:03:12.34,0:03:17.96,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,induire de pseudo hallucinations; donc si\Non a prend une substance psychédélique,
Dialogue: 0,0:03:17.96,0:03:21.37,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,dans 99% des cas, on est conscient d'avoir\Npris une substance et que ce que l'on
Dialogue: 0,0:03:21.37,0:03:25.08,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,ressent est dû à cette substance. C'est\Ndonc non un hallucinogène, mais un pseudo
Dialogue: 0,0:03:25.08,0:03:30.94,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,hallucinogène. Mais ces substances, comme\Nles classiques- LSD, psilocybine ou DMT -
Dialogue: 0,0:03:30.94,0:03:37.34,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,fonctionnent de manière très spécifique et\Nagissent toutes sur le système
Dialogue: 0,0:03:37.34,0:03:41.51,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,sérotoninergique. La sérotonine est l'un \Ndes principaux neurotransmetteurs et il y
Dialogue: 0,0:03:41.51,0:03:47.03,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,a un récepteur, le 5-HT2A, qui est le plus\Npetit dénominateur commun à toutes ces
Dialogue: 0,0:03:47.03,0:03:51.39,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,substances, non qu'elles agissent toutes\Nuniquement sur celui-ci, elles affectent
Dialogue: 0,0:03:51.39,0:03:56.12,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,toute une pléthore de neuro-transmetteurs\Net de récepteurs. Mais c'est la clé où
Dialogue: 0,0:03:56.12,0:04:00.78,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,elles fonctionnent toutes. Il y a d'autres\Nsubstances qui sont classées comme
Dialogue: 0,0:04:00.78,0:04:04.93,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,plutôt psychédéliques,comme les \Nentactogènes -l'ecstasy ou MDMA par ex.-
Dialogue: 0,0:04:04.93,0:04:09.84,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,qui agisent aussi sur le système sérotoni-\Nnergique. Les dissociatifs -kétamine,...-
Dialogue: 0,0:04:09.84,0:04:14.08,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,agissent plus sur le récepteur NMDA; et\Nd'autres sont basiquement des produits
Dialogue: 0,0:04:14.08,0:04:20.12,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,chimiques aléatoires, comme l'Amanite \Ntue-mouche, la Datura ou la Salvia. Bon.
Dialogue: 0,0:04:20.12,0:04:24.08,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,C'est la seule diapositive où je vais vous\Ndéranger avec ce genre de science dure. Je
Dialogue: 0,0:04:24.08,0:04:29.05,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,pense qu'il est important d'être clair sur\Nce sujet car même si les psychédéliques
Dialogue: 0,0:04:29.05,0:04:34.17,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,sont un mème de la culture pop, personne\Nne sait rien à leur sujet, à dire vrai. La
Dialogue: 0,0:04:34.17,0:04:41.29,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,majorité les associe à des drogues ayant\Nla même dangerosité que la méthamphétamine
Dialogue: 0,0:04:41.29,0:04:45.95,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,ou les opioïdes. Pense qu'il existe une\Ndépendance avec les drogues psychédéliques
Dialogue: 0,0:04:45.95,0:04:51.39,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,qui, en fait, n'existe pas. Et c'est le pb\Nfondamental de la perception pour beaucoup
Dialogue: 0,0:04:51.39,0:04:57.30,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,de gens depuis très longtemps. Les choses\Nont un peu changé récemment. Les psyché-
Dialogue: 0,0:04:57.30,0:05:03.12,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,déliques sont devenus la norme. D'abord,\Nà cause d'un changement général de la
Dialogue: 0,0:05:03.12,0:05:09.51,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,perception des drogues, comme avec le\Ncannabis ou un changement des médications.
Dialogue: 0,0:05:09.51,0:05:13.44,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Aussi pk des gens, comme Michael Pollan,\Nqui est un auteur mainstream qui écrit sur
Dialogue: 0,0:05:13.44,0:05:19.02,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,la cuisine et la nutrition, s'est mis à \Nécrire sur les psychédéliques. Et un autre
Dialogue: 0,0:05:19.02,0:05:23.48,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,facteur qui a aidé les psychédéliques à sa\Nfaçon et leur a nuit d'une autre est toute
Dialogue: 0,0:05:23.48,0:05:28.87,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,cette lubie du microdosage que nous voyons\Ndans la scène tech ou développementale, et
Dialogue: 0,0:05:28.87,0:05:36.53,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,surtout dans la région de la Baie et à la \NSilicon Valley. Mais d'où viennent-ils ?
Dialogue: 0,0:05:36.53,0:05:43.00,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,from? In this talk, I am not going to\Nspeak about psychedelic, psychoactive
Dialogue: 0,0:05:43.00,0:05:48.16,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,substances in other cultural frameworks.\NThere are cultures like in the Amazonian
Dialogue: 0,0:05:48.16,0:05:54.26,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,basin or some Aztec people in Mexico\Nwho have been using psychoactive
Dialogue: 0,0:05:54.26,0:06:00.75,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,substances, psychedelics, in a very\Nritualized sense for millennia, perhaps,
Dialogue: 0,0:06:00.75,0:06:05.76,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,or at least centuries. But this is not us.\NSo let's talk about what happened here in
Dialogue: 0,0:06:05.76,0:06:12.51,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Europe or in the Western world, including\NAmerica. This guy up here, sorry, that's
Dialogue: 0,0:06:12.51,0:06:19.39,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,the wrong one. The pointer isn't strong\Nenough. We'll work like this. This nice
Dialogue: 0,0:06:19.39,0:06:26.82,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,guy up here is Albert Hofmann. In 1938, he\Nwas developing several substances that
Dialogue: 0,0:06:26.82,0:06:32.62,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,were supposed to work on atonia and in\Npostpartum women, but also on other
Dialogue: 0,0:06:32.62,0:06:36.78,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,problems like blood pressure and he, \Namong other things, developed the
Dialogue: 0,0:06:36.78,0:06:42.18,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,thing that later became LSD. But\Nback then, he didn't see any sense in
Dialogue: 0,0:06:42.18,0:06:46.29,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,pursuing it medically because it didn't\Nwork the way he wanted it to and he
Dialogue: 0,0:06:46.29,0:06:51.17,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,shelved it. And for some reason in ’43, he\Ntook it out the shelf again to retest it
Dialogue: 0,0:06:51.17,0:06:59.00,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,for other purposes, and accidently gave\Nhimself the first noted LSD trip. This
Dialogue: 0,0:06:59.00,0:07:03.25,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,happened not because he was a shitty\Nchemist, but because the amount that is
Dialogue: 0,0:07:03.25,0:07:09.02,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,needed to induce an effect is so low as it\Nhas never been noted before in any other
Dialogue: 0,0:07:09.02,0:07:14.89,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,substance. So 20 micrograms of LSD can\Nalready produce a notable change in
Dialogue: 0,0:07:14.89,0:07:20.36,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,perception. So when he came out of that\Nexperience, this first one he had, after
Dialogue: 0,0:07:20.36,0:07:25.61,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,accidentally dosing himself, he decided\Nto go for, well, a trial on himself and
Dialogue: 0,0:07:25.61,0:07:29.69,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,trying to be safe. He used what he thought\Nwas a very low dose of the substance he
Dialogue: 0,0:07:29.69,0:07:37.10,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,discovered, which turned out to be 250\Nmicrograms of LSD, which was his… I hear
Dialogue: 0,0:07:37.10,0:07:42.40,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,the laughter. It’s rather a high dose\Ntrip, especially for somebody who just
Dialogue: 0,0:07:42.40,0:07:48.27,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,didn't know what was expecting him out\Nthere in his own mind. And this is the
Dialogue: 0,0:07:48.27,0:07:52.29,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,famous bicycle day trip where he rode home\Non his bike thinking that the world was
Dialogue: 0,0:07:52.29,0:07:57.25,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,collapsing around him, basically. So even\Nthis wasn't a nice trip, the first one. So
Dialogue: 0,0:07:57.25,0:08:01.43,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,what happened next was that he reported to\Nhis superiors at Sandoz Chemical in Basel,
Dialogue: 0,0:08:01.43,0:08:06.40,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,and they had the idea of turning this\Ninto a substance for many doctors,
Dialogue: 0,0:08:06.40,0:08:13.00,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,psychiatrists, psychologists, to experience\Nwhat it would be like to be psychotic. So
Dialogue: 0,0:08:13.00,0:08:20.11,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,its first application of LSD was as a\Npsychotomimetic. And as a psychoto-
Dialogue: 0,0:08:20.11,0:08:24.02,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,mimetic, thousands of dosages were\Ndistributed worldwide from the
Dialogue: 0,0:08:24.02,0:08:30.21,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Czech Republic to Harvard University to\Neverywhere. And doctors tried it out. What
Dialogue: 0,0:08:30.21,0:08:36.02,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,happened then was that a small group of\Nyoung, ambitious psychologists around
Dialogue: 0,0:08:36.02,0:08:40.06,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Timothy Leary tried it out too, and\Nthought this is not just something for
Dialogue: 0,0:08:40.06,0:08:45.64,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,doctors. This is not just a psychoto-\Nmimetic and brought it out basically into,
Dialogue: 0,0:08:45.64,0:08:51.76,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,yeah, the real world. And people were\Nexperimenting with LSD quite a bit in the
Dialogue: 0,0:08:51.76,0:08:57.61,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,’60s before it was forbidden in ’71. Not\Nbecause it turned out to be so dangerous.
Dialogue: 0,0:08:57.61,0:09:02.80,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,They were not so many accidents. Not so\Nmany people had dire side effects. But
Dialogue: 0,0:09:02.80,0:09:07.71,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,because the political will to cope with\Nthe substance and its implications wasn't
Dialogue: 0,0:09:07.71,0:09:16.13,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,existent in the Nixon era. So. ’71,\Nunderground goes into subculture. But the
Dialogue: 0,0:09:16.13,0:09:20.74,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,genie was out of the bottle and it was not\Ngoing to go back in. And psychedelics, not
Dialogue: 0,0:09:20.74,0:09:28.39,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,only LSD, but also Psilocybin, later on\NMDMA. And these days, more than 500 new
Dialogue: 0,0:09:28.39,0:09:32.57,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,psychoactive substances that have been\Nbrought up on the black market are around
Dialogue: 0,0:09:32.57,0:09:38.60,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,us. And people use them. It's a societal\Nreality that our juridical system doesn't
Dialogue: 0,0:09:38.60,0:09:43.89,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,keep up with, to be fair. So it's been in\Nmany subcultural setting from people just
Dialogue: 0,0:09:43.89,0:09:49.24,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,going dancing and having a good time to\Nself-exploration to pseudo-chamanic or
Dialogue: 0,0:09:49.24,0:09:55.41,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,chamanic settings. And I think most people\Nwill at least know somebody who have
Dialogue: 0,0:09:55.41,0:10:01.64,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,experienced psychedelics at least once.\NAnd then something else changed. A few
Dialogue: 0,0:10:01.64,0:10:08.27,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,years ago, let’s say, 10-ish, 10 years ago,\Npsychedelics started coming back. There
Dialogue: 0,0:10:08.27,0:10:13.95,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,had been research, for example, at the\NUniversity of Zürich around psychedelics
Dialogue: 0,0:10:13.95,0:10:20.58,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,before that already. There had been trials\Nbefore. But the big comeback of substances
Dialogue: 0,0:10:20.58,0:10:29.23,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,like psilocybin, LSD, and MDMA as tools to\Naugment psychotherapy was within the last
Dialogue: 0,0:10:29.23,0:10:35.46,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,10 or 15 years. So these people up here\Nare some of the people worldwide working
Dialogue: 0,0:10:35.46,0:10:41.74,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,with these substances, trying to develop\Nthem into medications. So … not
Dialogue: 0,0:10:41.74,0:10:46.38,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,over-the-counter, but prescription\Nmedications to be applied within the
Dialogue: 0,0:10:46.38,0:10:50.51,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,setting of psychotherapy. So the idea is\Nnever that somebody can walk into a
Dialogue: 0,0:10:50.51,0:10:54.79,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,pharmacy saying, oh, I'm depressed, I want\Nto buy psilocybin to treat myself, but to
Dialogue: 0,0:10:54.79,0:10:59.71,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,have a structured therapeutical session in\Nwhich the effects can be contained and the
Dialogue: 0,0:10:59.71,0:11:06.06,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,benefits enhanced. So the ones that are\Nmost promising these days are psilocybin
Dialogue: 0,0:11:06.06,0:11:11.05,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,for depression, which is already heading\Nfor the third stage, third and final stage
Dialogue: 0,0:11:11.05,0:11:17.39,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,of approvement as medication within the USA\Nand consecutively hopefully in Europe. And
Dialogue: 0,0:11:17.39,0:11:23.28,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,MDMA, so what is used? What people want to\Nfind if they buy ecstasy, not that they
Dialogue: 0,0:11:23.28,0:11:27.22,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,always get it, but MDMA is the substance\Nthey're trying to get, for post-traumatic
Dialogue: 0,0:11:27.22,0:11:31.92,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,stress disorder (PTSD). In the U.S., even\Nthe Veterans Association has jumped on the
Dialogue: 0,0:11:31.92,0:11:37.80,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,bandwagon and has sponsored this research,\Nwhich is interesting at least. But isn't
Dialogue: 0,0:11:37.80,0:11:45.93,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,that harmful? Aren't these substances\Nvery dangerous? Well, not in the way you
Dialogue: 0,0:11:45.93,0:11:51.48,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,think and not as much as you might think.\NThis graphic up here is something that was
Dialogue: 0,0:11:51.48,0:11:56.95,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,put together by a group of 40 experts who\Ndiscussed what substances have what harm
Dialogue: 0,0:11:56.95,0:12:03.61,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,on the user and what harm on the people\Naround the users. So, for example, alcohol
Dialogue: 0,0:12:03.61,0:12:09.10,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,is harmful for the person, giving them a\Nliver disorder, making them addicted and
Dialogue: 0,0:12:09.10,0:12:14.22,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,so on, so on. But also because people get\Naggressive when they use it or drive
Dialogue: 0,0:12:14.22,0:12:18.53,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,dangerously, for example, when they're\Nintoxicated, it's dangerous to others. If
Dialogue: 0,0:12:18.53,0:12:24.25,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,you check out. I have to walk over here\Nnow. Sorry to the camera people. The
Dialogue: 0,0:12:24.25,0:12:27.80,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,substances we're talking about for\Ntreatment are not up there with the very
Dialogue: 0,0:12:27.80,0:12:32.01,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,dangerous ones. We have the shrooms down\Nhere, the LSD is there, ecstasy is there.
Dialogue: 0,0:12:32.01,0:12:39.25,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,So very low danger to the user and almost\Nno danger to other people. If you compare
Dialogue: 0,0:12:39.25,0:12:47.88,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,that to alcohol, heroin, tobacco, it's all\Nup there. And, to be quite fair, we’re all
Dialogue: 0,0:12:47.88,0:12:53.98,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,part of a giant field study anyway. Because\Nthese substances {\i1}are{\i0} being used. This is
Dialogue: 0,0:12:53.98,0:12:58.79,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,data from the 2017 Global Drug Survey,\Nwhich is a self-reporting study where
Dialogue: 0,0:12:58.79,0:13:04.63,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,people talk about their own drug use\Nand fill in forms online. This is not a
Dialogue: 0,0:13:04.63,0:13:09.49,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,statistically sound sample of the general\Npopulation because to fill out that trial,
Dialogue: 0,0:13:09.49,0:13:13.60,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,you have to have a certain interest. But\Nthe people that have filled this out—
Dialogue: 0,0:13:13.60,0:13:20.88,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,we're talking about a number of \Nover 115.000 worldwide—say that
Dialogue: 0,0:13:20.88,0:13:29.02,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,they have, in their lifetime, partially \Nused LSD. … were the numbers …? MDMA,
Dialogue: 0,0:13:29.02,0:13:37.05,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,mushrooms and LSD, so MDMA 35%, \Nmushrooms almost 25%, LSD over 22%.
Dialogue: 0,0:13:37.05,0:13:41.13,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,And if you look around you, of\Nhow many people do you know who
Dialogue: 0,0:13:41.13,0:13:45.66,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,ended up in an emergency department\Nor in a psychiatric ward due to _only_ using
Dialogue: 0,0:13:45.66,0:13:51.19,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,those substances? Actually, looking at\Nthis giant field study that the illegal
Dialogue: 0,0:13:51.19,0:13:56.43,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,market has provided us with, it seems to\Nbe rather safe because these people
Dialogue: 0,0:13:56.43,0:14:02.18,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,are not using clear dosages of a clean\Nsubstance and still there's hardly
Dialogue: 0,0:14:02.18,0:14:18.09,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,anything happening. OK. But what about\Nmicrodosing? Well. We don't know much
Dialogue: 0,0:14:18.09,0:14:25.33,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,about microdosing, in fact. There are no\Nscientifically randomized controlled
Dialogue: 0,0:14:25.33,0:14:31.62,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,studies, as to yet; the first ones are just\Nstarting. There are self-reporting studies
Dialogue: 0,0:14:31.62,0:14:37.78,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,where people have filled out online forms.\NAnd it seems to be that what people are on
Dialogue: 0,0:14:37.78,0:14:43.73,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,one hand trying to achieve is, yes,\Nenhancing creativity, getting better work
Dialogue: 0,0:14:43.73,0:14:52.30,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,performance. But a lot of them are trying\Nto treat, cure, enhance that latent or
Dialogue: 0,0:14:52.30,0:15:01.75,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,apparent depression, and the other thing\Nis: microdosing—which is defined mostly as
Dialogue: 0,0:15:01.75,0:15:09.12,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,using a very low, almost subliminal dose\Nof a psychoactive substance such as LSD—is
Dialogue: 0,0:15:09.12,0:15:13.74,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,being done by people with all sorts. There\Nare people microdosing MDMA and ibogaine,
Dialogue: 0,0:15:13.74,0:15:17.72,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,which is, if you look at the receptor\Nprofiles, just insane basically and
Dialogue: 0,0:15:17.72,0:15:24.77,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,frankly can't do what they hope it does.\NAnd when we took a look at people who
Dialogue: 0,0:15:24.77,0:15:31.07,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,microdose, we can't say how much of\Nthe effect they’re feeling is really from
Dialogue: 0,0:15:31.07,0:15:37.45,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,microdosing that substance or if we have a\Ntop-notch, first-grade placebo effect going
Dialogue: 0,0:15:37.45,0:15:43.16,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,on where people feel much better because\Nthey have taken this and believe in it.
Dialogue: 0,0:15:43.16,0:15:49.96,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Let's not turn down placebo. Placebo is\Nextremely valuable medically. It’s
Dialogue: 0,0:15:49.96,0:15:54.94,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,actually shown that placebo effect, for\Nexample, enhance the endogenous opioid
Dialogue: 0,0:15:54.94,0:16:00.29,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,production. So your body revs up towards\Nhealing, towards feeling better with the
Dialogue: 0,0:16:00.29,0:16:05.74,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,placebo effect. But this could also be\Ndone with a sugar pill. And there's one
Dialogue: 0,0:16:05.74,0:16:09.45,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,thing I just want to leave with you in\Nthis group. If anybody of you is
Dialogue: 0,0:16:09.45,0:16:16.62,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,microdosing and has preexisting heart\Ncondition: don't! Simply because some of
Dialogue: 0,0:16:16.62,0:16:20.56,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,the subreceptors, especially with LSD that\Nare being activated in prolonged micro
Dialogue: 0,0:16:20.56,0:16:28.18,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,dosing for a long time can be cardiotoxic\Nand possibly harm your heart. Just again,
Dialogue: 0,0:16:28.18,0:16:32.14,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,there's not clear data about this yet.\NJust to leave it with you, if you suffer
Dialogue: 0,0:16:32.14,0:16:37.70,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,from a heart condition: don’t!\NDepression. That keyword I had with the
Dialogue: 0,0:16:37.70,0:16:42.43,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,microdosing as well. But let's go\Ndeeper into this, because if we want to
Dialogue: 0,0:16:42.43,0:16:49.16,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,talk about how psychedelic medicine can\Nreally make a difference in psychiatry,
Dialogue: 0,0:16:49.16,0:16:56.84,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,depression is like, yeah, the first-line\Nthing to think and talk about and why is
Dialogue: 0,0:16:56.84,0:17:04.10,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,that? Depression is a very serious\Npsychiatric disorder. People who are
Dialogue: 0,0:17:04.10,0:17:09.05,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,severely depressed—and that's many people;\Nstatistically, in Germany, every 8th
Dialogue: 0,0:17:09.05,0:17:13.79,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,woman is likely to suffer from a severe\Ndepressive episode. At one point in their
Dialogue: 0,0:17:13.79,0:17:20.18,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,life or the other. People who are\Ndepressed lose social functioning. They
Dialogue: 0,0:17:20.18,0:17:24.90,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,have very decreased life expectancy\Npartially through suicide, partially
Dialogue: 0,0:17:24.90,0:17:28.79,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,because they don't manage to care for\Nthemselves. These people lose themselves
Dialogue: 0,0:17:28.79,0:17:35.99,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,and are being lost for others, too. And\Nthere is treatment for depression, yes,
Dialogue: 0,0:17:35.99,0:17:42.38,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,but in many cases it only has a limited\Ncapacity. And even though depression is a
Dialogue: 0,0:17:42.38,0:17:49.18,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,worldwide epidemic—with rates from \N3% of the population in China to
Dialogue: 0,0:17:49.18,0:17:54.21,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,22% of the population in Afghanistan\Nsuffering from it—there have not really
Dialogue: 0,0:17:54.21,0:17:59.81,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,been new forms of treatment for two, two\Nand a half decades‽ So the stuff we're
Dialogue: 0,0:17:59.81,0:18:05.16,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,working with is partially working, partly\Nnot: about one third of patients don't
Dialogue: 0,0:18:05.16,0:18:10.75,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,react to the medication at all, even\Nthough there's different types. And those
Dialogue: 0,0:18:10.75,0:18:16.67,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,who do usually have very low rates of\Nacceptance because of the side effects.
Dialogue: 0,0:18:16.67,0:18:21.13,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Because many people use antidepressants,\Nand the best combination is cognitive
Dialogue: 0,0:18:21.13,0:18:24.91,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,behavior therapy—so what is called in\NGerman “Verhaltenstherapie,” cognitive
Dialogue: 0,0:18:24.91,0:18:32.86,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,behavioral therapy—in conjunction with\Nantidepressants. That might work, but for
Dialogue: 0,0:18:32.86,0:18:38.14,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,some it doesn't. And those who take the\Nmedication don't feel well. It's not that
Dialogue: 0,0:18:38.14,0:18:42.17,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,they're back to normal. They're just less\Ndepressed. But usually they're like dimmed
Dialogue: 0,0:18:42.17,0:18:46.25,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,in on all sides. So they are still not\Ngetting happy. The libido is decreased.
Dialogue: 0,0:18:46.25,0:18:49.91,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Their activity levels are decreased.\NPeople are suffering quite a bit from the
Dialogue: 0,0:18:49.91,0:19:00.91,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,side effects and it's really not nice. So.\NI was just … just to tell you one
Dialogue: 0,0:19:00.91,0:19:05.55,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,little story. I told you I’m an\Nemergency medicine doctor. And just
Dialogue: 0,0:19:05.55,0:19:14.04,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,to illustrate how bad depression can get:\NA few weeks ago, I was being called out to
Dialogue: 0,0:19:14.04,0:19:20.38,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,an attempt of suicide. A woman had jumped\Nout of her window on the fourth floor. We
Dialogue: 0,0:19:20.38,0:19:27.67,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,found her lying in her yard and she was...\Ninjured, badly injured, but still alive,
Dialogue: 0,0:19:27.67,0:19:34.53,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,and we stabilized her and took her to\Nhospital, and when the nurse kind of
Dialogue: 0,0:19:34.53,0:19:40.27,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,pulled up her data in the emergency room,\Nshe went like, oh, no, not again, because
Dialogue: 0,0:19:40.27,0:19:46.57,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,this woman had jumped out the same window\Njust half a year before. That's how bad
Dialogue: 0,0:19:46.57,0:19:54.11,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,this disease can be. So how desperate\Npeople get and how terribly important it
Dialogue: 0,0:19:54.11,0:19:59.95,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,is for us not to look away, but try to\Nfind better new therapies. And this is, in
Dialogue: 0,0:19:59.95,0:20:04.07,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,my opinion, with psychedelic medicine …\NPsychedelic therapy can be a real game
Dialogue: 0,0:20:04.07,0:20:12.20,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,changer. The one therapeutic application\Nwe have the best data for is psychedelics
Dialogue: 0,0:20:12.20,0:20:17.45,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,for treatment-resistant depression. There\Nare several studies going on in the UK, in
Dialogue: 0,0:20:17.45,0:20:23.64,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,the States, and Switzerland, but also in\Nthe Czech Republic and so on, so on. And
Dialogue: 0,0:20:23.64,0:20:27.51,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,what they seem to be finding is that even\Nthough they're still working with small
Dialogue: 0,0:20:27.51,0:20:32.83,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,samples because you have to fan out; if\Nyou try to bring out a medication like
Dialogue: 0,0:20:32.83,0:20:37.18,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,that, you have to show first that it's\Nsafe with healthy people and then you
Dialogue: 0,0:20:37.18,0:20:41.02,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,start with a small sample of sick people\Nand then you enlarge it from there. And
Dialogue: 0,0:20:41.02,0:20:47.98,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,they’re now in this enlarging process …\Nthat's treating depression with psilocybin
Dialogue: 0,0:20:47.98,0:20:53.26,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,especially does not only decrease\Ndepression in those patients, but also
Dialogue: 0,0:20:53.26,0:20:58.79,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,does one great thing: it decreases\Nanxiety! Not only talking about state
Dialogue: 0,0:20:58.79,0:21:04.50,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,anxiety, so how anxious people are at this\Nvery moment in living their lives, but
Dialogue: 0,0:21:04.50,0:21:09.99,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,that trait anxiety. So how anxious people\Nare as a part of their personality, which
Dialogue: 0,0:21:09.99,0:21:16.93,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,is a good thing to gauge how likely people\Nare to relapse back into depression,
Dialogue: 0,0:21:16.93,0:21:20.50,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,people that are very anxious, very\Ninsecure about life, are far more likely
Dialogue: 0,0:21:20.50,0:21:29.27,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,to relapse. OK, so you see, there's a lot\Nhappening worldwide studying this, but
Dialogue: 0,0:21:29.27,0:21:37.58,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,this is Germany on that. A scientific\Ndesert. We're in the largest country;
Dialogue: 0,0:21:37.58,0:21:41.71,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,It’s also the scientifically perhaps most\Nimportant country when it comes to medical
Dialogue: 0,0:21:41.71,0:21:45.29,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,research in Europe. There’s zilch\Nhappening. There hasn't been a study on
Dialogue: 0,0:21:45.29,0:21:50.53,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,psychoactive compounds in this context,\Nforever, like 30 years, the last one on
Dialogue: 0,0:21:50.53,0:21:56.17,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,entactogens like 20 years ago. But\Nstudying psychedelic here hasn't happened.
Dialogue: 0,0:21:56.17,0:22:08.28,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,And we want to change that. Let’s …\N{\i1}applause{\i0}
Dialogue: 0,0:22:08.28,0:22:14.14,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,So we as the main foundation had, perhaps,\Nlet's call it groundbreaking, what a
Dialogue: 0,0:22:14.14,0:22:19.09,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,groundbreaking conference this September\Nin Berlin at the Charité buildings.
Dialogue: 0,0:22:19.09,0:22:23.77,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,We had 600 participants, over 50\Nspeakers from worldwide, everybody
Dialogue: 0,0:22:23.77,0:22:29.47,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,basically, almost everybody who's\Nimportant in this dialog scientifically
Dialogue: 0,0:22:29.47,0:22:33.99,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,was around. So from the pharmacology, the\Npsychiatrist, the psychologist, the
Dialogue: 0,0:22:33.99,0:22:41.58,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,therapist, but also philosophers talking\Nabout a culture of older sets of mind have
Dialogue: 0,0:22:41.58,0:22:46.05,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,been around. And we have been trying to\Nbring this to the German public and try to
Dialogue: 0,0:22:46.05,0:22:55.32,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,lay groundwork for doing new science in\NGermany. And what's to come next is this.
Dialogue: 0,0:22:55.32,0:23:01.26,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,With our P.I., so a principal investigator,\NGerhard Gründer, who is a
Dialogue: 0,0:23:01.26,0:23:09.22,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,new pharmacologist from the University of\NMannheim ZI. We are about to apply for the
Dialogue: 0,0:23:09.22,0:23:16.02,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,1st psilocybin depression study in Germany\Nthis next year. So in 2020, we're
Dialogue: 0,0:23:16.02,0:23:20.04,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,putting in the applications, we've already\Nput the first paperwork in, and what we
Dialogue: 0,0:23:20.04,0:23:26.36,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,want to do is do a double standard study,\Nboth at the ZI Mannheim and the
Dialogue: 0,0:23:26.36,0:23:30.19,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Charité Berlin. Those are the two most\Nrenowned psychiatric research facilities
Dialogue: 0,0:23:30.19,0:23:35.04,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,in Germany. And it's a collaboration from\Nthe ZI, Charité, and the MIND Foundation.
Dialogue: 0,0:23:35.04,0:23:40.80,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Each group contributing their knowledge,\Ntheir capabilities, and their strengths.
Dialogue: 0,0:23:40.80,0:23:47.21,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,And what we want to do is this. We\Nwant to do a double blind, randomized
Dialogue: 0,0:23:47.21,0:23:54.69,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,controlled phase IIa study. Big word.\Nthis basically means that … It’s a
Dialogue: 0,0:23:54.69,0:23:59.24,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,top-notch level, internationally acclaimed\Nstudy. This is how these studies need to be
Dialogue: 0,0:23:59.24,0:24:03.78,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,done to have any value. So it's double\Nblind, meaning that neither the patient
Dialogue: 0,0:24:03.78,0:24:09.69,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,nor the therapist know what this patient\Nis getting. It's randomized. So this gets
Dialogue: 0,0:24:09.69,0:24:14.65,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,assigned without anybody playing around\Nwith it. And phase II means that it's a
Dialogue: 0,0:24:14.65,0:24:20.84,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,safety and efficacy study, so not yet dose\Ntesting and not yet comparing dosages, but
Dialogue: 0,0:24:20.84,0:24:26.73,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,just trying to make sure it works. And we\Nare going to do that in a 144 participants
Dialogue: 0,0:24:26.73,0:24:32.78,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,sample in total, in two locations, which\Nis huge. This will be the second or third
Dialogue: 0,0:24:32.78,0:24:37.26,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,biggest sample worldwide doing this. And\Nthe first one in Germany, as we said and
Dialogue: 0,0:24:37.26,0:24:42.39,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,what we are going to test is 25\Nmilligrams of standardised GMP. So
Dialogue: 0,0:24:42.39,0:24:47.05,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Medical Grade Psilocybin versus two active\Nplacebos. One being a small dose of
Dialogue: 0,0:24:47.05,0:24:52.50,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,psilocybin, which used to be the standard\Nthing to do. But now talking about
Dialogue: 0,0:24:52.50,0:24:58.40,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,microdosing, what is if the small doses\Nalready does something? And testing it
Dialogue: 0,0:24:58.40,0:25:02.95,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,against another placebo that isn't\Npsilocybin, which is: there’s some physical
Dialogue: 0,0:25:02.95,0:25:10.62,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,reaction, but is not psychedelic in this\Nsense. So in this design, every patient
Dialogue: 0,0:25:10.62,0:25:15.69,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,will receive at least one—some two—high\Ndosages of psilocybin. So everybody who
Dialogue: 0,0:25:15.69,0:25:22.04,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,gets accepted will have his try. And the\Nstudy design consists of preparation
Dialogue: 0,0:25:22.04,0:25:27.15,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,sessions, dosing sessions where people\Nreceive either placebo or psilocybin and
Dialogue: 0,0:25:27.15,0:25:32.93,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,integration sessions. Integration is so\Nimportant and not only in a scientific
Dialogue: 0,0:25:32.93,0:25:36.83,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,study on this topic, but if people are\Nworking with psychedelics, experimenting
Dialogue: 0,0:25:36.83,0:25:41.85,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,with psychedelics themselves, integration\Nis the key to do something with the
Dialogue: 0,0:25:41.85,0:25:46.26,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,experience. Because if you don't work with\Nit actively, the experience is going to
Dialogue: 0,0:25:46.26,0:25:50.77,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,fade. And you might remember something\Nabout what you learned, but it will not
Dialogue: 0,0:25:50.77,0:25:56.88,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,have the impact on you, your life, and how\Nyou—yeah—benefit from what you've seen
Dialogue: 0,0:25:56.88,0:26:02.89,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,and learned in that way. Right. Just one\Nmore sentence. It's mixed funding, its
Dialogue: 0,0:26:02.89,0:26:07.01,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,funding and progress. So we have some\Npublic money coming in, but we're also
Dialogue: 0,0:26:07.01,0:26:12.67,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,looking for donations and investment just\Nat the side. And this is almost the end of
Dialogue: 0,0:26:12.67,0:26:18.61,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,my talk. What I want to say is the\Nfollowing: What we try at the moment
Dialogue: 0,0:26:18.61,0:26:25.07,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,is to establish safe and legal psychedelic\Ntherapies in Germany, Europe, and the
Dialogue: 0,0:26:25.07,0:26:30.25,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,world. This is going to take time. If\Nthings go well, we might be there in five
Dialogue: 0,0:26:30.25,0:26:35.34,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,to ten years—five if things go really\Nwell. And I know that it's very tempting
Dialogue: 0,0:26:35.34,0:26:40.49,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,for many people to say: “Well, I can \Njust go to somebody and have a
Dialogue: 0,0:26:40.49,0:26:44.52,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,psilocybin session. I can go to somebody,\Nhave an ayahuasca session.” And yes, you
Dialogue: 0,0:26:44.52,0:26:49.00,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,can. But be aware if you do that, because\Nyou're really suffering from psychiatric
Dialogue: 0,0:26:49.00,0:26:53.13,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,disease, if you have a mental illness, if\Nyou really are in distress. Be very
Dialogue: 0,0:26:53.13,0:26:57.34,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,careful with yourself, because the thing\Nis, you need somebody to really support
Dialogue: 0,0:26:57.34,0:27:01.18,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,you, really help you through somebody who\Nreally knows what they're dealing with,
Dialogue: 0,0:27:01.18,0:27:06.21,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,because otherwise you can do yourself more\Nharm than good. This picture down there
Dialogue: 0,0:27:06.21,0:27:11.92,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,with the ambulance is a real picture. \NRight. That's what I wanted to say.
Dialogue: 0,0:27:11.92,0:27:15.84,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Thank you very much for having me. If \Nyou're interested in what we're doing,
Dialogue: 0,0:27:15.84,0:27:23.74,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,check it out!\N{\i1}appplause{\i0}
Dialogue: 0,0:27:23.74,0:27:29.36,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Herald: Andrea, thank you very much.\NThat gives us plenty of time for some
Dialogue: 0,0:27:29.36,0:27:34.73,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,questions. People are lining up on the\Nmicrophones already. So we start with
Dialogue: 0,0:27:34.73,0:27:39.54,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,microphone number two, please.\NMic 1: Thank you for this amazing talk.
Dialogue: 0,0:27:39.54,0:27:43.51,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,That's really great. Just one question.\NWouldn't that be a problem for a double
Dialogue: 0,0:27:43.51,0:27:48.98,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,blind study if a person can surely tell if\Nthey're experiencing psychedelic effects?
Dialogue: 0,0:27:48.98,0:27:54.98,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Andrea: That is a problem. Yes, but this\Nis the way the authorities request the
Dialogue: 0,0:27:54.98,0:27:59.04,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,study to be done. And interestingly\Nenough, there have been cases where people
Dialogue: 0,0:27:59.04,0:28:07.63,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,couldn't tell. If people thought they were\Neither on a small dosage or on a high
Dialogue: 0,0:28:07.63,0:28:16.06,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,dosage, or even if they where on an\Ninactive placebo. Right. So the self…
Dialogue: 0,0:28:16.06,0:28:20.59,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Yeah, self-suggestive capabilities of\Npeople should not be underestimated
Dialogue: 0,0:28:20.59,0:28:23.76,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,either.\NHerald: Okay, then we're going to jump
Dialogue: 0,0:28:23.76,0:28:28.26,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,over to number six.\NMic 6: Thank you very much for the
Dialogue: 0,0:28:28.26,0:28:36.88,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,talk. I would like to hear your opinion on\Nthe fact that, uh, like in the last 150
Dialogue: 0,0:28:36.88,0:28:46.55,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,years, most drug agents were discovered\Nin Germany, and meanwhile, we have
Dialogue: 0,0:28:46.55,0:28:53.64,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,the pity of scientifically Germany\Nlying in Arizona.
Dialogue: 0,0:28:53.64,0:29:05.69,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,{\i1}laughter{\i0}\NAndrea: Right. Germany has two points that
Dialogue: 0,0:29:05.69,0:29:12.65,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,historically hold us back. One is the\Nforced human trials during the Nazi era
Dialogue: 0,0:29:12.65,0:29:19.35,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,where substances, techniques, were tested on\Nconcentration camp prisoners. And we have
Dialogue: 0,0:29:19.35,0:29:27.46,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,the Contergan scandal that harmed so many\Npeople and led to, in all of the world,
Dialogue: 0,0:29:27.46,0:29:34.69,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,the stricter rules we have now. That's two\Nreasons why Germany is so reluctant to
Dialogue: 0,0:29:34.69,0:29:41.66,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,expose itself in this kind of process. But\Nstill, it is a pity. And I think it is
Dialogue: 0,0:29:41.66,0:29:46.01,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,about time that the German not only\Ngovernment, but also the scientific
Dialogue: 0,0:29:46.01,0:29:53.16,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,establishment gets to understand that they\Nlose out and they are trading behind a
Dialogue: 0,0:29:53.16,0:29:57.95,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,development that has\Nstarted and will continue.
Dialogue: 0,0:29:57.95,0:30:01.92,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Herald: And now we have a question\Nfrom the Internet, I hear.
Dialogue: 0,0:30:01.92,0:30:07.12,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Signal Angel: Yes! For people\Nstruggling with depression, anxiety, or
Dialogue: 0,0:30:07.12,0:30:12.15,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,mental illnesses: What specific options\Nare there in Europe with regards to
Dialogue: 0,0:30:12.15,0:30:18.24,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,psychedelic-assisted therapy?\NAndrea: Well, one is that you can try to
Dialogue: 0,0:30:18.24,0:30:22.82,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,participate in the existing trial. So, for\Nexample, in London, there's Kings College
Dialogue: 0,0:30:22.82,0:30:28.35,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,and Imperial College, there's a group in\NBristol working, there's also therapy
Dialogue: 0,0:30:28.35,0:30:34.53,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,happening in Switzerland and so on. And\Nthere's also, if you happen to be lucky
Dialogue: 0,0:30:34.53,0:30:38.26,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,enough to live in Switzerland, there's the\Nso-called compassionate use where
Dialogue: 0,0:30:38.26,0:30:44.02,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,psychiatrists with special permits are\Nallowed to use LSD and MDMA as therapeutic
Dialogue: 0,0:30:44.02,0:30:49.13,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,agents on a case-to-case basis that they\Nhave to discuss with the authorities.
Dialogue: 0,0:30:49.13,0:30:54.08,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,So that's all we can say for now:\Nstudy participation or compassionate use.
Dialogue: 0,0:30:54.08,0:30:57.42,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,We just really hope that\Nthings will rev up and we'll be able
Dialogue: 0,0:30:57.42,0:31:02.05,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,to offer more in the future.\NHerald: And microphone number 4, please.
Dialogue: 0,0:31:02.05,0:31:05.07,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Mic 4: Yeah. Hello. Thank you\Nvery much for your talk.
Dialogue: 0,0:31:05.07,0:31:10.11,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,My question is more related to\Nthe history of the uses of psychedelics
Dialogue: 0,0:31:10.11,0:31:17.89,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,in the US and to the MAPS Association\Nfounded by Rick Doblin, but I was curious,
Dialogue: 0,0:31:17.89,0:31:25.51,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,how would you explain that MAPS is so\Nactively criticizing the experiments led
Dialogue: 0,0:31:25.51,0:31:35.51,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,in the 1950s and ’60s by the CIA, and yet\Nthey accept donations of several million
Dialogue: 0,0:31:35.51,0:31:42.01,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,dollars coming from the Mercer family, who\Nare among the largest shareholders of
Dialogue: 0,0:31:42.01,0:31:47.72,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Cambridge Analytica, Breitbart News, and\Nthey also accept, they accepted recently
Dialogue: 0,0:31:47.72,0:31:54.30,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,about three millions from members of Tea\NParty. Isn't it a bit of an irony here?
Dialogue: 0,0:31:54.30,0:32:03.43,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,{\i1}applause{\i0}\NAndrea: That is a very good question. The
Dialogue: 0,0:32:03.43,0:32:11.20,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,way I know Rick Doblin and many people\Nfrom MAPS personally, I know that they're
Dialogue: 0,0:32:11.20,0:32:16.86,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,pursuing an honest goal. What they’re\Ntrying to do is bring this into the world
Dialogue: 0,0:32:16.86,0:32:22.93,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,and they have been doing that since 1986.\NSo they've been on this for almost 35
Dialogue: 0,0:32:22.93,0:32:27.83,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,years. He's dedicated his life to doing\Nthat. I don't fully understand his
Dialogue: 0,0:32:27.83,0:32:32.74,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,motives. I don't have to, to be honest,\Nbecause I'm not speaking for him. I think
Dialogue: 0,0:32:32.74,0:32:39.98,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,there is a huge necessity for integrity\Nbecause if we don't—as people working
Dialogue: 0,0:32:39.98,0:32:46.44,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,with it scientifically—if we don't move\Nalong with the necessary integrity, we're
Dialogue: 0,0:32:46.44,0:32:52.07,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,opening the doors for other people to\Ndon't care at all. But on the other hand,
Dialogue: 0,0:32:52.07,0:32:57.15,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,finding the money, getting this done and a\Nlot … he was … Rick was criticized a lot,
Dialogue: 0,0:32:57.15,0:33:03.70,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,for example, for accepting veterans;\Nsnipers from Iraq into his therapy
Dialogue: 0,0:33:03.70,0:33:08.08,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,program. Like, okay, are you not getting\Npeople fit again to go out back to the
Dialogue: 0,0:33:08.08,0:33:15.58,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,battlefield? And I find this all very\Ndifficult because there is a thing that is
Dialogue: 0,0:33:15.58,0:33:20.69,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,called perpetrated PTSD. There is a thing\Nof people only realizing afterwards what
Dialogue: 0,0:33:20.69,0:33:26.81,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,they have done. And I would not … I\Nwould be very careful in judging people in
Dialogue: 0,0:33:26.81,0:33:32.78,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,distress. But you're very right. It's a\Nvery delicate topic. And I think we all
Dialogue: 0,0:33:32.78,0:33:36.90,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,have to be very aware that there are thin\Npaths we are threading in what we're
Dialogue: 0,0:33:36.90,0:33:41.23,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,doing there. When we accept money that\Ncomes from sources that don't follow
Dialogue: 0,0:33:41.23,0:33:45.24,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,ethical standards.\NHerald: Then we're going to switch over to
Dialogue: 0,0:33:45.24,0:33:49.73,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,microphone number five.\NMic 5: Hello, I guess you have a really
Dialogue: 0,0:33:49.73,0:33:55.73,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,nice answer to the following statement. So\NI hope you will share your answer:
Dialogue: 0,0:33:55.73,0:34:01.95,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Little Greta twittered today that the\Nhouse is on fire and just that. So
Dialogue: 0,0:34:01.95,0:34:07.78,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,actually that means an adequate reaction\Nwould be to jump out of the window. So you
Dialogue: 0,0:34:07.78,0:34:12.21,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,could argue that actually we should rescue\Nall the people that are really down, like
Dialogue: 0,0:34:12.21,0:34:16.97,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,down and out, because they cannot help us\Nanymore. But actually, we should get the
Dialogue: 0,0:34:16.97,0:34:22.21,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,people that are still happy to be a little\Ndepressed instead of all getting them
Dialogue: 0,0:34:22.21,0:34:30.57,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,happy. What do you say?\NAndrea: There's always two ways of dealing
Dialogue: 0,0:34:30.57,0:34:40.43,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,with a system: You can step out of it,\Nand you can try to change it from within.
Dialogue: 0,0:34:40.43,0:34:47.02,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,It is always very difficult to go from\Ncaring for the individual to things that
Dialogue: 0,0:34:47.02,0:34:53.89,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,are right for all. And me being a doctor,\Nfor example, I have simply decided to put
Dialogue: 0,0:34:53.89,0:34:59.17,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,the individual in the center of my\Nconcern, and I think others need to put
Dialogue: 0,0:34:59.17,0:35:03.79,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,the greater good in the center of their\Nconcern. I think it's inconsolable. We
Dialogue: 0,0:35:03.79,0:35:08.03,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,can't do both at the same time. So it's\Ngood to make your decision and do this
Dialogue: 0,0:35:08.03,0:35:12.10,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,what you do with all your heart.\NHerald: Then we're going to switch over to
Dialogue: 0,0:35:12.10,0:35:15.73,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,the Internet again.\NSignal Angel: Yes. And do you know of any
Dialogue: 0,0:35:15.73,0:35:21.29,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,studies or evidence corroborating the\Nother side, like triggering mental
Dialogue: 0,0:35:21.29,0:35:26.76,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,illnesses by using psychedelics, for\Nexample, if you have a family history of …?
Dialogue: 0,0:35:26.76,0:35:31.88,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Andrea: Well, doing a randomized,\Ncontrolled study with that would be
Dialogue: 0,0:35:31.88,0:35:38.33,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,unethical. So what we have is the\Nepidemiological and the anecdotal
Dialogue: 0,0:35:38.33,0:35:44.02,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,evidence that is found. So, yes,\Nif you have a predisposition for
Dialogue: 0,0:35:44.02,0:35:49.89,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,psychosis, for schizophrenia, for mental\Ninstability, there is a large chance of
Dialogue: 0,0:35:49.89,0:35:54.57,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,triggering that if you use psychedelics.\NBut on the other hand, many people try to
Dialogue: 0,0:35:54.57,0:35:58.92,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,self-medicate with substances, be it\Npsychedelics or cannabis, because they're
Dialogue: 0,0:35:58.92,0:36:04.47,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,feeling they're already on the edge of\Nsome instability. But the current paradigm
Dialogue: 0,0:36:04.47,0:36:09.47,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,for the studies is to exclude people\Nwhose direct family is affected by
Dialogue: 0,0:36:09.47,0:36:13.28,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,psychosis.\NHerald: Number two just disappeared, so
Dialogue: 0,0:36:13.28,0:36:18.72,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,we're gonna go straight over to four.\NMic 4: I would like to ask you whether you
Dialogue: 0,0:36:18.72,0:36:23.46,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,changed your mind about anything related\Nto psychedelics in last few years or if
Dialogue: 0,0:36:23.46,0:36:33.01,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,you have seen something in the\Nresearch that really surprised you?
Dialogue: 0,0:36:33.01,0:36:43.84,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Andrea: Let’s … Well, I am worried. In a\Nfew respects. Like, for example, the whole
Dialogue: 0,0:36:43.84,0:36:52.17,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,development around the 5-MeO scene, people\Nusing bufo alvarius toxins for very, very strong
Dialogue: 0,0:36:52.17,0:36:56.02,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,psychedelic experiences, sometimes risking\Ntheir live doing it. This whole scene
Dialogue: 0,0:36:56.02,0:37:01.30,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,kind of lifting from the ground and going\Nin a very strange direction, in my
Dialogue: 0,0:37:01.30,0:37:05.03,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,opinion. This is kind of worrying me\Nbecause I think people are not taking the
Dialogue: 0,0:37:05.03,0:37:11.55,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,care they should be taking of themselves\Nin what they are doing. But otherwise, I
Dialogue: 0,0:37:11.55,0:37:16.26,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,think scientific results we're seeing are\Nrather consistent. It's very important to
Dialogue: 0,0:37:16.26,0:37:21.01,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,know that these are not magic bullets and\Nnot expect too much. You can’t expect
Dialogue: 0,0:37:21.01,0:37:25.93,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,something to cure everything. And\Npsychedelics seem to be a good idea
Dialogue: 0,0:37:25.93,0:37:31.18,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,for people who are rigid, transfixed, not\Nable to transcend something. But people
Dialogue: 0,0:37:31.18,0:37:35.00,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,who are already like in a chaotic state\Nare very unlikely to benefit. And I think
Dialogue: 0,0:37:35.00,0:37:38.35,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,that's a very good basic rule. And\Nthis is something I see proven
Dialogue: 0,0:37:38.35,0:37:41.74,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,time and time again.\NHerald: Number five, please.
Dialogue: 0,0:37:41.74,0:37:46.94,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Mic 5: Hi, thanks. Regarding certain\Nsetting and how it can have such a huge
Dialogue: 0,0:37:46.94,0:37:52.94,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,influence on one's experience, can you\Ncomment on the setting of the new
Dialogue: 0,0:37:52.94,0:37:58.14,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,psilocybin study in the upcoming year?\NAndrea: Like all the studies that are
Dialogue: 0,0:37:58.14,0:38:03.03,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,being ta… being done, certain settings\Nare being taken into consideration. These
Dialogue: 0,0:38:03.03,0:38:09.65,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,people don't trip in a sterile white\Nhospital bed. They get to have their
Dialogue: 0,0:38:09.65,0:38:14.48,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,psychedelic experience in a warm,\Ncomfortable, organic, welcoming
Dialogue: 0,0:38:14.48,0:38:22.03,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,environment. For example, on a couch with\Na nice cushion, nice dim light, flowers,
Dialogue: 0,0:38:22.03,0:38:27.34,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,music is extremely important. There have\Nbeen released scientific works around what
Dialogue: 0,0:38:27.34,0:38:31.15,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,kind of music is beneficial for those.\NMendel Kaelen, for example, at Imperial
Dialogue: 0,0:38:31.15,0:38:36.16,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,College is a specialist in this kind of\Nmusic and is being taken very seriously.
Dialogue: 0,0:38:36.16,0:38:43.01,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Also, those questions of how much physical\Ncontact is beneficial, is allowed. What
Dialogue: 0,0:38:43.01,0:38:48.02,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,could harm the patient is discussed very\Nprecisely in all those groups I know,
Dialogue: 0,0:38:48.02,0:38:52.33,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,because this is so much more than just a\Npill. This is really about making sure
Dialogue: 0,0:38:52.33,0:38:58.70,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,that people have a safe experience where\Nthey can, yeah, come to healing inside
Dialogue: 0,0:38:58.70,0:39:01.06,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,themselves\NMic 5: Thank you.
Dialogue: 0,0:39:01.06,0:39:05.80,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Herald: So we have time for one more\Nquestion. Number one, please.
Dialogue: 0,0:39:05.80,0:39:09.77,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Mic 1: I don't know if I want to hear the\Nanswer, but do you think it would help
Dialogue: 0,0:39:09.77,0:39:16.75,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,your cause if you would stop\Ntake these drugs for fun?
Dialogue: 0,0:39:16.75,0:39:25.69,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Andrea: My answer to this is the\Nfollowing: Imagine there was a food
Dialogue: 0,0:39:25.69,0:39:33.02,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,thing, something that tasted nice; let’s\Nsay chocolate and there were people
Dialogue: 0,0:39:33.02,0:39:37.85,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,who could only survive if they got\Nchocolate. But because everybody else was
Dialogue: 0,0:39:37.85,0:39:41.69,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,doing it too, and it was somehow\Nnot okay, it would be forbidden for
Dialogue: 0,0:39:41.69,0:39:47.94,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,everybody. Then I would say, well if you\Nreplace chocolate with LSD, I think there
Dialogue: 0,0:39:47.94,0:39:53.26,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,are people there who really need it. And\Nwe have to be careful that recreational
Dialogue: 0,0:39:53.26,0:39:59.26,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,use and playing around with drugs doesn't\Nspoil their chance to something lifesaving
Dialogue: 0,0:39:59.26,0:40:03.71,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,because they need the chocolate. You might\Nget along without, but it's something we
Dialogue: 0,0:40:03.71,0:40:08.89,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,have to take into consideration. This\Ndoesn't mean it's wrong to have psychedelic
Dialogue: 0,0:40:08.89,0:40:13.33,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,experience for your own benefit, for your\Nown betterment, for your own fun. But just
Dialogue: 0,0:40:13.33,0:40:17.07,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,keep in mind, if you're hindering with\Nyour wanting to have a good time that
Dialogue: 0,0:40:17.07,0:40:22.79,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,somebody gets a life-saving therapy,\Nperhaps, then this is an ethical problem
Dialogue: 0,0:40:22.79,0:40:28.52,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,we are facing.\NHerald: Andrea, thank you so much.
Dialogue: 0,0:40:28.52,0:40:32.45,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,That's your applause.\N{\i1}applause{\i0}
Dialogue: 0,0:40:32.45,0:40:38.41,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,{\i1}36c3 rollout music{\i0}
Dialogue: 0,0:40:38.41,0:40:58.88,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,subtitles created by c3subtitles.de\Nin the year 2020. Join, and help us!